[Boomer]

aj, As I look back over your posts, I see that socializing Z with other dogs seems to be a top goal. Although it sounds like you are definitely making progress, I feel like I have to throw in my opinion here..........

Not every dog wants to be around other dogs. For instance, my ball-playing friend I wrote about earlier refuses to get along with other dogs. He is a sweetheart who likes people a lot.

AND he has even learned to know his place where the cat of the house is concerned. (The cat uses psy-ops to get to the sweet big old dog who is more than 10 times the size of that cat. The cat curls up in the dog's bed sometimes and pretends not to see the dog looking longingly at his big pillow. But the meanest thing is when the cat "accidentally" lies down on THE BALL and looks ever so innocent while the dog looks like he is going to cry and sometimes does.)

BUT when it comes to other dogs, that big sweetie can get downright rude. He barks and growls and, worst of all, strains at the leash. (I hate to think about what names he is calling the other dog.) I think he would probably fight if he could get away. He is not my dog, but if I am at his house, I will not take him for a walk because I think he could pull my arm out of the socket if he saw another dog and decided to start something.

He lives in a town where dogs get to be a part of events like Halloween costume contests and where some restaurants have a patio section where dogs are welcome. But (sigh) no matter how much his owner tries to explain the fun he would have if he would just learn to be polite to other dogs, he does not care.

He was a pound puppy so he has been with his family forever but he quite simply does not like other dogs. That is who he is. He plays and cuddles and is really quite wonderful with people but he will never be a bon vivant when it comes to being out and about with other dogs. Besides, I bet he thinks it is undignified to wear a Halloween costume, even if he could dress up like his favorite ball player.

His family feels like it is their responsibility not to push it. He is about 65 pounds and though he is a sweetie, he is big enough and strong enough to do some damage if he had the chance. (The cat thing though is hilarious. That cat has some serious attitude and is quite a manipulator.)

Nature/Nurture -- No matter what -- my ball-playing friend is never going to want to be around other dogs. The best his family can do has been to make him behave in a somewhat tolerant manner when out for walks, on a leash, held by someone much stronger than I am. Not every dog wants to go to a dog park.

[ajbrown]

Originally Posted by JSR22

A lot of dogs that are not interested in retrieving like tugging. There are good tug toys at Pet Smart.

Z does enjoy tugging. We do that on occasion. Tugging is also a good way to teach her to drop, so we have fun tugging and she gets to learn that I say when the game ends...

She is such a good dog... so many positive things...

[CFrance]

Originally Posted by ajbrown

Caly was a lab, she had no papers to prove it,but she was...

She loved to chase balls and swim. What was funny is when we first had her she would not jump in our above ground pool (in Massachusetts). We took her down to a lake and let her wade in to get her ball. After a few times her ball drifted away and she walked out and to her surprise she was swimming. That was that, we brought her back home and she would jump in the pool.

She could also get out of the pool on her own. I used to enjoy sitting on the deck watching her play by herself. She would take a tennis ball and drop it in the pool, the current would take it around and when it got towards the other side she would jump in, get the ball and climb back out and do it all over again ...

I was fortunate in life that I could spend a lot of time on Martha's Vineyard (thank you Dad). I would take Caly down to the beach in Oak Bluffs and throw balls into the ocean. The fun part was she could carry two tennis balls. I would throw one out, when she got that one and started to head back I would throw the second one 30 feet or so to the left. Off she would go and get that one and then come in. People would stop and watch and they got a kick out of it...

You should have seen her in the surf of 'South Beach, MV', holding on to her ball as waves threw her all over the place.

It has been six months since Caly was put down. Just typing this post causes my eyes to well up... this slide show puts me over the edge

Caly Memories Slideshow by ajbrown2007 | Photobucket

Aww... great slideshow.

I still have guilt feelings over dragging our golden away from his Lake Michigan dog beach. Amazing to watch four-foot waves smack him silly as he went out after a ball. He didn't care; all about the ball. Both our goldens would/will walk beside us carrying their leash (we don't allow that in TV) and would carry their ball to the beach. Must be a retriever thing to have something in their mouths.

Z must have something that would be "her thing." The trick is discovering it. Hopefully you will soon.

[jebartle]

Our dog Moses, also has issues with dogs, but only when there is a fence between them. When we go to the small dog section, he smells a few butts, BUT if for any reason a LARGE DOG appears on other side of fence, he turns into Napolean. Also is VERY possessive of HIS golf cart. I'm constantly on guard, and I might be the problem, because dogs sense anxiety. I'm learning from your post aj, keep up the good work.

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by ajbrown

Caly Memories Slideshow by ajbrown2007 | Photobucket

Our beloved Portuguese Water Dog unexpectedly crossed the Rainbow Bridge six months ago at the age of 9.
It's still so painful for me, I can't look at pictures of her.
Well done AJ Brown -- a beautiful memorial to Caly.

[OCsun]

AJ Brown, Your slideshow was awesome! I made a book of pictures when my dog Ginger died. It was so painful at first I could not even look at the book when it arrived.
Thanks for sharing!

[Mrs. Robinson]

Your slideshow is a walk through Caly's wonderful life as part of your family.
From viewing those photos, there is no doubt that "Z" is receiving the best of everything you can offer.
She is so fortunate to have you!

Every dog is a challenge one way or the other. We recently adopted a deaf pup, as you know.
It is MUCH more of a challenge than imaginable, but like you, we are also learning although our situations are very different.

Please continue your posts. It's encouraging for everyone to hear about your progress.

[ColdNoMore]

Originally Posted by Mrs. Robinson

Please continue your posts. It's encouraging for everyone to hear about your progress.

I totally agree!

While current situation and pain of losing our last family members (beagles) has precluded getting more, reading AJ's trials and tribulations...brings back many great memories.

Please keep it up.

[ajbrown]

Been pretty slow around here...

As stated, Z appears to be aggressive to other dogs. She postures and then lunges. All she has ever been taught is to leave it when this happens. This makes sense and Z is pretty good at that with an observant handler. If that is the way it must be forever, so be it, but we are not giving up on her. IMO, she does not need to leave it, but rather adapt and relax around it. Cesar would do this in a 30 minute show or take Z back to the ranch, for us we will take our time, we are no dog whisperers.

One issue I have is that I do not know that many dogs.

We go and pick up a friend’s dog and bring her over to our place. She is a lab rescue, about eight years old, not as good as Z on a leash and also exhibits behavior (albeit minor) when meeting dogs that elevates the other dogs aggression. Z had on her muzzle and we met outside. They had gotten within 6 feet when the visiting dog gave a bark, to which Z made a very aggressive lunge. It could not get to the other dog as I had her on a leash, but it was clear, there was not going to be any meeting today.

I reacted late, I should have seen this coming and missed it. A part of me wanted to see what would happen. No harm and no foul, no yelling or anger, we are training. I simply put Z next to me and we stood there until she sat on her own. After that we headed out for a walk around the neighborhood, giving space between dogs, moving in the same direction. When walking the dogs have a purpose. We did not push it too much the first time and after we were done we gave the girls some water on the front lawn and had them hang out within 8 or 10 feet apart.

Two days later, we bring our friend’s old lab back for another ‘session’. Today I have no aspiration for a meet, I am interested in a desensitization process; slow and easy. Just in case our girl Z gets the muzzle put on. Is Hannibal a good name for a dog? Today was walk only trying to challenge the girls slowly.

We head down the street in our little pack, from left to right, visiting dog, wife, Z and me. I am allowing Z to get very close to my wife and I am very focused on Z’s eyes. She is treating this as any heel session and working to simply walk, I see no tension. At this point we decide to raise the ante. I have Z fall back in behind the other dog, allowing her to get as close as she is comfortable.

We continue switching positions, now Z is directly in front of the other dog. I slow Z down, so now the other dog is right on her butt.

We end the walk with Z quartering the other dog, directly behind my wife with Z's head at the other dog's hip. She was perfectly capable of striking the other dog from this position. Nothing happens...

It is becoming clear that the dogs have no issue if moving in the same direction. At least today...

We finished the day with water and sitting in front yard. The older dog is tired, and would simply lay down with her head up. If the other dog moved, I would wait until she laid down and then bring Z near her, approaching from behind. With both dogs facing the same direction, I would have Z stand within 5 or so feet of the other dog.

I would keep her there until she would lie down and relax. Then she could have a small cookie.

It is unclear if any progress was made today...

We make plans to do this two to three times a week. Then we find out the other dog may have cancer, she is scheduled to have a tumor removed and biopsied.

Without our test dog, we have other plans, including trips back to the dog park and the SPCA for more exposure.

Will have to see what happens...

[Nipper]

Originally Posted by suesiegel

You mentioned that show Dog Whisperer with Cesar. I'm sure you are aware that the show is edited. If, nothing else the people are all aware of the camera and the dog sees strange people in the house. To use your tale, the husband does not even get a beer. Like those woodworking shows the projects that you see in 1/2 an hour take a week or more. The star just comes in for the camera after someone else has set up the machine etc.

A second hand dog is like a second hand car there are going to be defects some you may not be able to correct.



ENJOY THE DOG. Aside-perhaps too late since you have posted this BUT since your wife wanted the dog you should at least get the fishing rod or???????? that you wanted

No, a "second hand dog" is not like a second hand car. Dogs sometimes lose their homes through no fault of their own. Imagine a child who loses his home and goes into foster care. It takes a lot of patience and love. You do not foster to do a test drive of the child --- nor a dog
. How hideous. You foster because you want to help a dog and ready it for a forever home. I hope this is not the forever home for this dog. She deserves better.

[ajbrown]

We had an idea to start bring Z back to the SPCA. Last Friday my wife did just that, here is what happened in her words.

Friday morning I took Z to the Humane Society to see if I could get her “acquainted” with different dogs without any aggressive behavior. I put the muzzle on Z because I didn’t want anyone getting hurt if things did not go well. We first walked with a small, calm dog which she basically ignored. Then came a little beagle who was a very happy little dog. We walk and then sat them together; but Z gave a little bark and so we had them walk together and then went for a third dog.

She is a large pitbull who is not yet a year old but, a sweetheart if there ever was one. She was energetic and wanting to play. So we walk around and they seemed ok, Z barked but only once so we decided they might want to play so we brought them into a paddock and let the pitbull run free and I left the leash on Z and let her go. And to my surprise Z happily started to play and run around with the pitbull. The pitbull was very submissive, laying down in front of Z and then when they were playing, even jumped on top of Z without any signs of aggression from Z. The pitbull was faster and Z soon slowed but they both laid down afterwards. It was a great to see Z being happy and playing with another dog. I will try again hopefully next week.

[Mrs. Robinson]

Originally Posted by ajbrown

We had an idea to start bring Z back to the SPCA. Last Friday my wife did just that, here is what happened in her words.

Friday morning I took Z to the Humane Society to see if I could get her “acquainted” with different dogs without any aggressive behavior. I put the muzzle on Z because I didn’t want anyone getting hurt if things did not go well. We first walked with a small, calm dog which she basically ignored. Then came a little beagle who was a very happy little dog. We walk and then sat them together; but Z gave a little bark and so we had them walk together and then went for a third dog.

She is a large pitbull who is not yet a year old but, a sweetheart if there ever was one. She was energetic and wanting to play. So we walk around and they seemed ok, Z barked but only once so we decided they might want to play so we brought them into a paddock and let the pitbull run free and I left the leash on Z and let her go. And to my surprise Z happily started to play and run around with the pitbull. The pitbull was very submissive, laying down in front of Z and then when they were playing, even jumped on top of Z without any signs of aggression from Z. The pitbull was faster and Z soon slowed but they both laid down afterwards. It was a great to see Z being happy and playing with another dog. I will try again hopefully next week.

It's so nice to hear some good news. What an improvement! It sounds like all your hard work is paying off, slowly, bur surely.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by ajbrown

We had an idea to start bring Z back to the SPCA. Last Friday my wife did just that, here is what happened in her words.

Friday morning I took Z to the Humane Society to see if I could get her “acquainted” with different dogs without any aggressive behavior. I put the muzzle on Z because I didn’t want anyone getting hurt if things did not go well. We first walked with a small, calm dog which she basically ignored. Then came a little beagle who was a very happy little dog. We walk and then sat them together; but Z gave a little bark and so we had them walk together and then went for a third dog.

She is a large pitbull who is not yet a year old but, a sweetheart if there ever was one. She was energetic and wanting to play. So we walk around and they seemed ok, Z barked but only once so we decided they might want to play so we brought them into a paddock and let the pitbull run free and I left the leash on Z and let her go. And to my surprise Z happily started to play and run around with the pitbull. The pitbull was very submissive, laying down in front of Z and then when they were playing, even jumped on top of Z without any signs of aggression from Z. The pitbull was faster and Z soon slowed but they both laid down afterwards. It was a great to see Z being happy and playing with another dog. I will try again hopefully next week.

All Dogs - Humane Society/SPCA of Sumter County, Inc.

Nice story. Also hope it will get some people to look at these pooches.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by ajbrown

We had an idea to start bring Z back to the SPCA. Last Friday my wife did just that, here is what happened in her words.

Friday morning I took Z to the Humane Society to see if I could get her “acquainted” with different dogs without any aggressive behavior. I put the muzzle on Z because I didn’t want anyone getting hurt if things did not go well. We first walked with a small, calm dog which she basically ignored. Then came a little beagle who was a very happy little dog. We walk and then sat them together; but Z gave a little bark and so we had them walk together and then went for a third dog.

She is a large pitbull who is not yet a year old but, a sweetheart if there ever was one. She was energetic and wanting to play. So we walk around and they seemed ok, Z barked but only once so we decided they might want to play so we brought them into a paddock and let the pitbull run free and I left the leash on Z and let her go. And to my surprise Z happily started to play and run around with the pitbull. The pitbull was very submissive, laying down in front of Z and then when they were playing, even jumped on top of Z without any signs of aggression from Z. The pitbull was faster and Z soon slowed but they both laid down afterwards. It was a great to see Z being happy and playing with another dog. I will try again hopefully next week.

All Dogs - Humane Society/SPCA of Sumter County, Inc.

Nice story. Also hope it will get some people to look at these pooches.

[ajbrown]

Pretty sure we are not doing any hard work . 'Improvement' is a hard thing to measure, so I cannot say that yet.

We no longer 'pen' her at night. She has free run of the house. It has become 'pretty' clear she will not eat the cat. She will come right up to it sniffing. If the cat moves, Z jumps backwards with a bark. Clearly the cat rules that relationship.

I still do not have the 'courage' to throw her into the dog park. I keep going, but have yet to see the 'right mix of dogs' there.

We have two human guests visiting us today through Monday, will be good for her to have some new pack members.