Originally Posted by Guest

We CANNOT afford to give EVERYONE healthcare equaling $1,000+ a month. We already borrow a $1 trillion a year...can we afford to borrow $2 trillion a year to pay for it? The total costs only go up as the population grows and ages.

The first thing we MUST do is stop trying to save EVERY baby born. Some should be let go. Allowed to naturally die. The ones who will cost many $ millions in their short difficult lives.

Growth in America has stopped with the changing demographics...as seen by the negligent GDP growth the last what....17 years? We haven't had really good growth since 2000. The impetus for growth...white people...are becoming the minority.

funny, they actually save and heal more people per capita at a lower cost in every other country with "socialized" medicine....I guess American lives cost more, but are worth less....

Why the U.S. pays more for health care than the rest of the world | PBS NewsHour

Originally Posted by Guest

Bully for you, Mr. Holier-Than-Thou, that you don't partake of the insurance (yes, it is insurance) you paid for all those years. By the way, Medicare A has a huge deductible every time you are hospitalized, so unless you have a no-deductible supplement, you will still be paying one way or the other. Like the private insurance you describe as being spread out, so is Medicare. Some use more, some use less, or not at all. My brother and his wife both died before they could use any of it of which they had paid. She was not yet 65 and he had just turned 65. Just like your private insurance that you are so proud of, their portion is being spread to those fortunate enough to still live. People die on a daily basis without ever collecting a penny of what they paid. That's why it is INSURANCE, just as your private one is. Hopefully, you will never lose that private insurance that you have, because if you do, you will have to prove insurability to get another or get a supplement to go with your original Medicare (that is surmising that you can even get any of the Medicare you so nobly rejected).

I think you are misunderstanding the comment.
I am simply stating that Medicare is a defective gov business venture. I did NOT "nobly" reject Medicare "B" and supplements. I did not need them. Why pay for something that is redundant. And NO I do not pay deductible. I pay a co-payment via my private insurance. Anyone that thinks that there is something wrong with a person making his own way instead of relying on someone else, has something inherently wrong with them.
You folks can try to convince yourselves (ignorantly) that socialized, gov run health care is great, but there is no proof of that. If you have never lived overseas in socialist countries, you will never understand how bad gov run medicine is. Besides, our country is way too large to sustain the cost of gov run health care. It is hardly functional in small countries. And anyone that tells you how great it is, is lying to you. The only folks that make out in socialist countries are the wealthy that can afford private insurance supplements. Canada, the UK, Germany, etc. all have private insurance supplements available to get the wealthy priority health care.

Originally Posted by Guest

funny, they actually save and heal more people per capita at a lower cost in every other country with "socialized" medicine....I guess American lives cost more, but are worth less....

Why the U.S. pays more for health care than the rest of the world | PBS NewsHour

Funny, EVERY successful country with socialized medicine...is a white country.

America isn't a white country any more...we are half and half...half white, half minority. There is not ONE successful black/brown majority country. We are on the cusp...the direction we move from here WILL determine the future of this country. Will we do what it takes to save America and make it great again? Or will we stand by and let it continue to become a minority majority? And eventually fail...becoming Mexico II.

Originally Posted by DillyDoo

Yes, they did take care of themselves, and no they were not fat nor did their lifestyle have anything to do with their deaths. What makes you so righteous that surely it was their fault they became ill and died? My brother was still employed when he died and caring for his sick wife who worked as long as she was able. So now you don't have to worry that any of your precious money was being wasted on them. They didn't have the privilege of using it, anyway.

Do you think that doing all the "right" things you claim you do is going to make you immortal? Boy, are you in for a very rude awakening! Proud and boastful, along with making judgements of people you know absolutely nothing about, only broadcasts your total ignorance and arrogance.

I did not intend to insult, but see how my words could lead you to believe I was trying to insult. Sorry for not being more clear.

I am not sure how my assumption of why 2 relatively young people (age 65) dying makes me "so righteous"?

The average age for demise is 78 in the US. When 2 people die at age 65, and it was not an fatal accident, then it is usually poor health. I listed the issues that are prevalent contributors to poor health.

No I don't believe taking care of yourself makes you immortal, but not taking care of yourself does increase the chance of health issues significantly. I truly believe "when its your day, its your day"...take that Chinese woman that survived a plane crash only to be run over by a firetruck responding to the crash...

None of your post addresses my health insurance costs and how it is unfair that I should have to pay such a high rate (when I am taking care of myself), just so some lazy POS can get theirs for free and smoke themselves to heart and cancer illness which end up costing us to provide more care...

Possibly a rule that would be a start at addressing it: If they want free health care they can't smoke, can't eat themselves fat, can't do illegal drugs???

Originally Posted by Guest

I did not intend to insult, but see how my words could lead you to believe I was trying to insult. Sorry for not being more clear.

I am not sure how my assumption of why 2 relatively young people (age 65) dying makes me "so righteous"?

The average age for demise is 78 in the US. When 2 people die at age 65, and it was not an fatal accident, then it is usually poor health. I listed the issues that are prevalent contributors to poor health.

No I don't believe taking care of yourself makes you immortal, but not taking care of yourself does increase the chance of health issues significantly. I truly believe "when its your day, its your day"...take that Chinese woman that survived a plane crash only to be run over by a firetruck responding to the crash...

None of your post addresses my health insurance costs and how it is unfair that I should have to pay such a high rate (when I am taking care of myself), just so some lazy POS can get theirs for free and smoke themselves to heart and cancer illness which end up costing us to provide more care...

Possibly a rule that would be a start at addressing it: If they want free health care they can't smoke, can't eat themselves fat, can't do illegal drugs???

Are you kidding? Morbid Obesity is a protected class now...under the ADA. Yes...stuffing your face until you're helpless is a disability entitling you to special perks not given to those with self control.

Before you liberals reply with your...they can't help it...it's glandular...there were NO morbidly obese liberated from the German camps...those RUNNING it maybe...but none of the inmates. You MUST eat a certain amount each day to keep weight on. Fat people lie...they cheat.

Originally Posted by Guest

Are you kidding? Morbid Obesity is a protected class now...under the ADA. Yes...stuffing your face until you're helpless is a disability entitling you to special perks not given to those with self control.

Before you liberals reply with your...they can't help it...it's glandular...there were NO morbidly obese liberated from the German camps...those RUNNING it maybe...but none of the inmates. You MUST eat a certain amount each day to keep weight on. Fat people lie...they cheat.

Not exactly true! There are people that eat anything and as much as they want and still can't put on weight. Genetics plays a great role. That is a fact. Some meds to treat other illnesses, such as cancer and arthritis cause weight gain no matter what.

There are those which you describe. I will give you that. But you cannot put everyone in the same basket.

There are people who get cancer and never smoked a day in their life. I worked with a guy that died at the ripe old age of 29 who never smoked. He served his country in Vietnam and that may have been his factor. There are babies/children who are stricken with cancer.

And, just so you know, I am not a liberal so don't even go there.

Well the people that do not take care of themselves are needing more health care...and the people that do take care of themselves have to pay for those that smoke and eat themselves sick. Fvck that!

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Originally Posted by Guest

I did not intend to insult, but see how my words could lead you to believe I was trying to insult. Sorry for not being more clear.

I am not sure how my assumption of why 2 relatively young people (age 65) dying makes me "so righteous"?

The average age for demise is 78 in the US. When 2 people die at age 65, and it was not an fatal accident, then it is usually poor health. I listed the issues that are prevalent contributors to poor health.

No I don't believe taking care of yourself makes you immortal, but not taking care of yourself does increase the chance of health issues significantly. I truly believe "when its your day, its your day"...take that Chinese woman that survived a plane crash only to be run over by a firetruck responding to the crash...

None of your post addresses my health insurance costs and how it is unfair that I should have to pay such a high rate (when I am taking care of myself), just so some lazy POS can get theirs for free and smoke themselves to heart and cancer illness which end up costing us to provide more care...

Possibly a rule that would be a start at addressing it: If they want free health care they can't smoke, can't eat themselves fat, can't do illegal drugs???

I do agree with portions of your post but you left out some: tattoos from head to toe, piercings all over, high-dollar sneakers, etc. There are those who do not do any preventive care, either.

As I have said, many people get cancer that has nothing to do with lifestyle or smoking. Many illnesses stem from genetics, including cancer and heart disease. Not all maladies are avoidable. Some people have poor health in spite of all they do. It's called life and luck of the draw.

My sister-in-law had lymphoma at a very young age. That was just the start of her battle with cancer. She and a group of others got together to get some of the laws changed, specifically not being discriminated against for employment because of previous cancer. Remember, people are encouraged to "catch it early so it can be cured and you can go on to lead a normal life". As they fought for, "What is 'normal' about not being able to get a job because you have had cancer?" That has been changed and employers can no longer ask.

My brother died because of complications from surgery. He was attempting to be proactive. So was my husband when he had his stroke following surgery that would give him a chance of avoiding a stroke. They were both attempting to be proactive. Bad things just happen to good people.

As you say, it is not fair that you have to pay such a high rate for those who are not proactive or have none. It has always worked that way and always will. That's exactly what Obamacare does. That just added more to the already strained rolls and punishes those who do buy insurance instead of the other stuff.

By the way, I do apologize for going off on you. That was not fair or nice.

Originally Posted by Guest

I think you are misunderstanding the comment.
I am simply stating that Medicare is a defective gov business venture. I did NOT "nobly" reject Medicare "B" and supplements. I did not need them. Why pay for something that is redundant. And NO I do not pay deductible. I pay a co-payment via my private insurance. Anyone that thinks that there is something wrong with a person making his own way instead of relying on someone else, has something inherently wrong with them.
You folks can try to convince yourselves (ignorantly) that socialized, gov run health care is great, but there is no proof of that. If you have never lived overseas in socialist countries, you will never understand how bad gov run medicine is. Besides, our country is way too large to sustain the cost of gov run health care. It is hardly functional in small countries. And anyone that tells you how great it is, is lying to you. The only folks that make out in socialist countries are the wealthy that can afford private insurance supplements. Canada, the UK, Germany, etc. all have private insurance supplements available to get the wealthy priority health care.

Yes, Medicare does have many problems that are caused by the fact that the government runs it. The concept was excellent until they decided to use it for everything but that for which it was intended. Until then, the interest it generated would have sustained it above and beyond. How would you feel if your private insurance used your monies for everything but insurance and then told you "sorry, we're just about out of money so we need to increase your premiums and cut your benefits"? We often hear about the waste and fraud in Medicare, but the Medicare program itself is the worst offender.

As long as you remain in excellent health, you can change insurance companies. See what happens if you don't remain so and want to change.

The doctors get the blame for having you return time after time for something that could be taken care of at one visit. Nope, not so with Medicare. Medicare will not pay for more than one procedure at a time. Example: If you have two skin cancers that need to be removed, that cannot be done at one time because they will only pay for one. Their explanation: "This procedure was performed at the same time as procedure A." Tell me that this is not wasteful to say nothing of being harder on the patient! Grrr! Not only does it waste Medicare dollars, but also supplemental insurance dollars, which in turn will make supplement premiums rise. Why not just do like private insurance and have a set payment for each procedure which includes one for routine and one for complicated (such as requiring grafting)? There again, doctors cannot just charge you what Medicare will pay because whatever they charge, Medicare will only approve a percentage and then pay 80% of that approval. That's the same thing as your employer saying that he will pay you a salary of say $500 a week, but then will only approve $350 a week and then pay you 80% of that and you could either get the other 20% from some other source or pay him the difference. If you told him that you would take $280 a week then he would only approve 80% of that. Would you go for that? Then why expect doctors to do it? That's why they are able in some instances to charge you less for no insurance or Medicare or procedures not covered by either. (My math may be a little off, but you get the picture.)

One of the points I was trying to make is: You have private insurance, but do you collect on that private insurance or do you just simply say, "Nope, I think I won't. I'll pay for it, but I won't use it." Not everyone has the means to be so selective. We could not afford private insurance even if we wanted it, so we continue to pay our Medicare premiums, deductibles, and co-pays. BTW, go to Mayo. I did and they do not accept Medicare or insurance. They will file for you, and you receive the checks from your Medicare and insurance, and then pay them. Whatever the difference is, you pay that out of your pocket....they do not write-off like those who accept Medicare/Insurance do. Costly, but great care.

Originally Posted by Guest

Not exactly true! There are people that eat anything and as much as they want and still can't put on weight. Genetics plays a great role. That is a fact. Some meds to treat other illnesses, such as cancer and arthritis cause weight gain no matter what.

There are those which you describe. I will give you that. But you cannot put everyone in the same basket.

There are people who get cancer and never smoked a day in their life. I worked with a guy that died at the ripe old age of 29 who never smoked. He served his country in Vietnam and that may have been his factor. There are babies/children who are stricken with cancer.

And, just so you know, I am not a liberal so don't even go there.

Did I mention skinny people who can eat anything and NOT get fat? Did I?

No...I made a FACTUAL statement that ALL people need a certain minimum calorie intake to keep weight on. That NOBODY on a starvation diet...meaning REDUCED caloric intake...STAYS FAT...nobody.

I CAN put EVERYBODY in that basket. Eat 100 calories a day without cheating and tell me how long you stay your current weight.

You're an idiot...I WILL go there.

Originally Posted by Guest

Did I mention skinny people who can eat anything and NOT get fat? Did I?

No...I made a FACTUAL statement that ALL people need a certain minimum calorie intake to keep weight on. That NOBODY on a starvation diet...meaning REDUCED caloric intake...STAYS FAT...nobody.

I CAN put EVERYBODY in that basket. Eat 100 calories a day without cheating and tell me how long you stay your current weight.

You're an idiot...I WILL go there.

Typical.

Anyone who disagrees with you, offers another fact, or you run out of anything else to say, is an idiot. BTW, you go on that daily 100 calorie diet, lose weight, and see what damage that will do to your body; but yes, you will lose weight and most likely your life in the process or be severely damaged for what's left of it.

But, I am the one who is an idiot.

Originally Posted by Guest

Typical.

Anyone who disagrees with you, offers another fact, or you run out of anything else to say, is an idiot. BTW, you go on that daily 100 calorie diet, lose weight, and see what damage that will do to your body; but yes, you will lose weight and most likely your life in the process or be severely damaged for what's left of it.

But, I am the one who is an idiot.

Sorry dilly...not worth my trouble. You offered nothing. You agree and don't even realize it.

Originally Posted by Guest

"If you have a pre-existing condition, Obamacare currently protects you from being turned down for insurance on the basis of that condition. Republicans want to take that away because insuring sick people just eats too much profit, and healthcare is a privilege, not a right anyway."

You CANNOT cover people with $ multi-thousand a month in healthcare costs for LESS than what they cost. You SHOULDN'T force a company to insure ANYONE at a loss.

Let me explain it in a way you may understand and relate to...

You're at Publix shopping...you fill up your cart and get in line to pay. By coincidence...there's a lady in front of you with the SAME stuff in her cart! She gets rung up...She pays $53. It's your turn...your bill comes to $106. You're livid! WHY is your bill so much higher? The cashier informs you that the first lady was "poor" and that is all she could afford for food...you're rich and you must subsidize her by paying your share and hers.

THAT is what insurance for preexisting conditions does too...they "use" $5,000 a month in services, only pay $1,000 in insurance premiums, and WE get to cover the rest with higher premiums. ALL those raises to insurance premiums you've been hearing about...that is to cover the poor who cost more than they pay.

1. As far as your example. We do not deny healthcare to anyone. It is far too simplistic to think. Hey they don't pay for it so we should not provide it.
You go out to eat, hire a gardener etc-they have Tuberculosis-good chance you will catch it.
2. Healthcare is expensive. So YOUR KID-just to make it personal-he is healthy why pay for insurance. He is walking across the street and gets hit by a car. Would you want someone who thinks like you, and I sometimes do as well, to say, I see he does not have any insurance OR PROOF THAT HE CAN PAY. so take him to the garbage dump alive or dead.
3. RE: preexisting condition.
You as you live in the villages are over 55. You do not heal as well as you did at one time. PREEXISTING CONDITION YOU ARE OVER 55.
Back to reality-there are genetic tests that will predict what you will get in your life-IS THAT NOT A PREEXISTING CONDITION?
4. RE: OUR MEDICAL SYSTEM
It is a mess for many reasons but simply, it is tied to attorneys some deserve the title of ambulance chasers.
I've read that American Healthcare costs twice what other industrialized nations pay. I've read that lawsuits and fear of lawsuits adds 30-40% to our medical costs.
Cost of drugs. We all complain but we expect, we demand no consequences of drug use. The doctor that prevented the LEGAL use of thalidomide in the US, just recently passed away. Yes, ther were some severely deformed babies in the US due to the use of Thalidomide but in every case the mother got the drug illegally.

I've read that 80% of all medical care is paid for by either the government or by insurance. As it is there is no incentive for the patient to even think about the cost.

We demand equal care for all whether they pay for it or not.
We tell the doctor what he can charge so there is no financial motivation to be better-to take more time to do a better job.

On religious grounds we have outlawed euthanasia. Argue if you wish but it is based on religious grounds. We will euthanize an animal but not a human Step back and THINK. Today, a terminally ill person is taken off food and water and allowed to slowly pass to death. Or, often, the doctor orders enough,PAIN KILLERS, to kill the patient.

NO SHORTAGE OF TOUGH QUESTIONS-NO EASY ANSWERS ESPECIALLY IF YOU NEED OR WANT TO HAVE LAW APPLY TO ALL.

Originally Posted by Guest

I did not intend to insult, but see how my words could lead you to believe I was trying to insult. Sorry for not being more clear.

I am not sure how my assumption of why 2 relatively young people (age 65) dying makes me "so righteous"?

The average age for demise is 78 in the US. When 2 people die at age 65, and it was not an fatal accident, then it is usually poor health. I listed the issues that are prevalent contributors to poor health.

No I don't believe taking care of yourself makes you immortal, but not taking care of yourself does increase the chance of health issues significantly. I truly believe "when its your day, its your day"...take that Chinese woman that survived a plane crash only to be run over by a firetruck responding to the crash...

None of your post addresses my health insurance costs and how it is unfair that I should have to pay such a high rate (when I am taking care of myself), just so some lazy POS can get theirs for free and smoke themselves to heart and cancer illness which end up costing us to provide more care...

Possibly a rule that would be a start at addressing it: If they want free health care they can't smoke, can't eat themselves fat, can't do illegal drugs???

First you are mixing up AVERAGES with specific people-Chinese person hit by a rescue vehicle.

RE: your health insurance cost.
If, you are paying private health isnsurance it is because you CHOSE to quit working before age 65 when you could, would, be covered by medicare. Medicare is, even for you,
subsidized by others.

RE: Your view about paying for others.
You list smoking, you list fat. I assume you do not smoke and are not fat. HUM you do not mention drinking-you must do that and think it is not evil. AND THEN THE OBVIOUS-YOUR HATE TOWARD OTHERS IS KILLING YOU.

Originally Posted by Guest

Sorry dilly...not worth my trouble. You offered nothing. You agree and don't even realize it.

I neither agreed with you nor did I not offer anything. I will try again.

IF someone goes on your 100 calorie a day diet, you are right they WILL lose weight. They also risk losing their LIFE (which in all probability would make you happy). IF they survive such a diet, they WILL have severe damage to their bodies. That, medically, is a FACT. This in turn, WILL require extensive care for what is left of their lives. This somewhat mimics the Texaco slogan, "Pay me now, or pay me later" in terms of YOU having to pick up the tab. You are either going to get stuck because people are fat or you are going to get stuck if they follow your advice and drop that weight by going to your extremes and doing far greater damage than just excess weight.