[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

Well, let's see - I'm glad you know what goes on behind closed doors. It is sad you feel competed to insinuate something but not say, but since you won't, lets look at the FACTS starting with a little history.

Automobiles were invented in the 1700's - mostly steam-powered. ONLY the rich could afford them. Almost 200 years later (1885) Karl Benz invented the gasoline-powered automobile. Only the rich could afford them. Then, 23 years later, in 1908 Ford invented the Model T, only the middle class could afford them, but it launched the era of the ICE-powered automobile.

Electric automobiles were developed in 1800, and only the rich could afford them. They were very expensive and not very "good". When ICE became available, in 1908, electric cars pretty much fell out of favor because it was not able to complete on cost and range.

The point of my little history lesson is, that we have been here before. From Benz's (eventually became Mercedes Benz) invention in 1885 to Ford making it affordable in 1908 took about 23 years.

Tesla began in 2003 (about 20 years ago) and EVERYONE laughed. NO one believed it was possible for a small startup with no experience to make an automobile that could compete with the "big boys", much less an EV. The idea that an EV could be successful was at best a joke. Now, 19 years later Tesla has revolutionized the manufacturing process, has revolutionized the battery industry, and can not make them fast enough - they are currently back-ordered by almost a year. There IS demand.

Telsa just opened its GIGA factory in Texas which is a revolutionary factory unlike any other auto manufacturer in the world. It won't be the last. When Ford "invented" mass production with his factory, he became part of launching the industrial revolution. Musk is in some ways having the same impact today.

At this point, almost every auto manufacturer in the world has announced it will be selling EVs soon. Many already do, with some of those costing as little as $15,000 and less, witness Atomic Car, which is street legal and has a "usable" local range, but not so great for long-distance trips. There are a plethora of new models coming from China, Korea, Japan, and other countries that are CHEAP. Not so great quality, not so great range, not so great features, but very very affordable for running back and forth to work and the grocery store and taking the kids to school. VERY affordable to the middle and even in some cases the lower class. All of these alternatives in just 19 years.

To help speed the adoption, Tesla makes its innovative design available to any company that wants to compete with them.

Henry Ford was by far one of the most imperative inventors of the Industrial Revolution. His primary invention, the automobile, changed life as we know it. It enabled people to go wherever they wanted whenever they wanted. The automobile modernizes the transportation industry entirely.

There was MAJOR resistance to ICE automobiles, but eventually, they won. We are in the same situation now, We are on the onramp. EVs are here. supply and diversity will follow shortly as all the world's manufacturers jump on board. NO ONE IS forcing anyone or any company. There are incentives to make the change, but no force.

I won't bother correcting many of your statements, like having to pay to dispose of batteries. NO, they are recycled. not buried. And Musk again with Tesla is leading the way in innovation in designing batteries that are easier to manufacture and recycle.

Electric cars are here. There are affordable EVs for everyone already. That affordable alternative will not compete on specs with ICE cars, but in many cases, the EV is significantly less expensive to own and operate for LOCAL applications. Maybe those local applications will change the design of cities (ICE enabled suburbs, EV may bring back down towns?)

Some say the EV is not affordable, but every single time I have seen that statement, they then leap into 1000-mile journeys across the country. But, 1000-mile trips make up an extremely small percentage of the use cases for automobiles. So, tell me how does it make financial sense for a person to own a land yacht (Ford Expedition) to drive back and forth daily to work, school and shopping? I see, it seems, half of the cars in the Publix parking lot are SUVs. I expect MOST of those SUVs drove less than 5 miles to get to the store. Seriously? That is affordable? Maybe to you, but lower middle class and poor Americans would LOVE an EV they could afford - Atomic Car and the like are extremely enticing alternatives to ICE for everyday use. Plug it in every night, never pay for gas again, and reduce maintenance and operational cost.

One more thing that is important to point out. A LOT of people have shorted Tesla for a long time. Those people stand to (and have) lost billions of dollars. Many of those people spend a significant amount of money financing misinformation campaigns about EVs in hopes they can make the Tesla stock crash and hence clean up on the short positions. Be very careful where you get your FACTS.


Ignoring the political tint, "People don’t realize the expense of owning an electric vehicle. Now our president is pushing electric farm equipment to the market in 2023. Can you imagine how much food prices will go up?"

Actually, people DO realize the expense of owning an EV. Ask any Tesla owner, they are thrilled and gush about how INEXPENSIVE it is for Total Cost of Ownership.

John Deere is "electrifying" its product line. I expect they are doing it to make money, not because someone forced them to.

Police departments are buying Teslas and reporting they are less expensive for the department to buy and operate. So, they are ordering more.

I expect you IMAGINED how much food prices will go up. I expect the corporate offices are more interested in the bottom line than they are in what kind of technology is in their tractors. And they are interested in EVs.

The Trucking industry is literally drooling to get EV Tractors in their fleets. Combine EV tractor with Full Self Driving and the cost to the trucking companies drops massively. Sadly, that will cost almost 4 million truck driver jobs directly. But, it will not be the first time an entire job market is destroyed by an advance in technology. It is called "progress" it comes with a cost.

We could all still be driving horse-drawn wagons and wagon wheels would still be a major industry.

[WOW! I think I just set a new record for post length - even for my insanely long rambling posts...!]

Yet you ignore that the electric grid cannot support all of these new EVs. Yes, in time, maybe they will, but that is DECADES in the future, if ever at all...

CA is currently having so much trouble supplying electricity that they have recommended that people NOT charge their vehicles at night, during peak electric usage...

Yes, technology moves faster today than in ye olden days, but so what? Past performance does not predict future earnings...

You think farmers are chomping at the bit to go electric? No, it'll be mandated.

And using the Atomic car as an example of affordable EVs is a joke. It's usage is so limited as to be useless for families, or if you dare venture near a highway...

They are like the "Smart Car" that was supposed to take the country by storm. How many of those do you see on a regular basis? For urban living DINKs, they have a limited appeal, but elsewhere? They're a toy...

You complain about someone "imagining" price increases due to EV trucking, yet your entire post (save the history lesson, which is informative, but not apropos to today) is nothing but YOUR imagination, speculating what MAY happen in the future...