Socialism is government ownership and control of the means of production. Of course, ownership, by definition, means you have the right to the income produced by that thing.

This ownership also implies the rights to the output of the resources.

When you really look at the socialist arm that the government has already reached out with in our country and the things you both mentioned and other controls like delivery of first class mail, the selling of some drugs, schools, Amtrak, laws governing wages, rent control...is it more efficient? Of course it isn't.

But it is much more than economics. It is about individual freedoms and choices. If you can't understand that read The Road to Serfdom by
F.A. Hayek. That is, IMHO, why I stand up against socialism. I'm not afraid of socialism. I am opposed to socialism for myself and my family.

Of course most liberals I know believe you can combine individual freedoms with the best of socialism. Yet socialism is the greatest threat to freedom. Hayek says, "...while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and seritude."

The great political thinker de Tocqueville said democracy stands in an irreconcilable conflict with socialism. "Democracy attaches all possible value on each man, while socialism makes each man a mere agent, a mere number...."

Not just because socialism doesn't work for the economy; but because I believe in freedom of choice for individuals.