I don't like marketing that is arguing.


I do like my old Yamaha. Bought her used almost nine years ago and she keeps gettin' me where I'm goin'.


Sweetie bought....and then sold an electric cart. Didn't get him where he was going, one too many times. We now have gas. Both of us.


Stop.

Sure, https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...ar-golf-carts-

It needs to stay in sun according to volt meter which is included in each install.

Come to the squares when the dates are set and take a look.

:bigbow:

What is the cost please? Warranty?

Cost $550

Warranty 25 years on the panel one year all else.

see here please

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...-carts-187134/

I worked up the numbers in a previous thread. Here is a summary.

I will use energy units (watts-hours) since they make the most sense.

- A new, fully charged 8 x 6-volt battery pack can hold approximately 12000 watt-hours of energy.

- A 260 watt solar panel on a golf cart roof will deliver, on average across the year, 1000 watt-hours of energy per day if the cart is outside all day (and not under a tree). This is according to NREL (National Renewable Energy Lab in Colorado, I taught some classes there) and takes into account our latitude and climatic conditions.

- Therefore, a 50% discharged battery pack would take about 6 days to recharge if left outside all day and not driven (6 days times 1000 watt-hours per day equals 6000 watt-hours or 50% of the capacity). Estimations for smaller capacity battery packs and different percentages of discharge are easy.

- A 1000 watt-hours of energy costs about 13 cents from SECO. Therefore, you can save a maximum of 13 cents per day with the solar panel on the roof of the golf cart or about $47 per year. If the cart is not outside all day and/or if you don't actually consume 1000 watt-hours of energy (approximately 6 miles of driving) then the cost saving will be less.

-An electric golf cart consumes approximately 150-200 watt-hours per mile. It depends on your driving style and where you are going. The reason many people see 60+ miles of range with their golf cart is because 60 miles times 150-200 watt-hours per mile is about the capacity of many battery packs (12000 watt-hours for a 8x6-volt pack). Of course, you are always better off not fully discharging your battery pack.

- In terms of extending the range of the golf cart, if the cart is outside all day then the range can be extended about 6 miles. In other words, energy will flow into the battery pack from the solar panel and will also flow out of the battery pack to power the motor and the battery pack will discharge more slowly than without the solar panel. 6 miles times 150-200 watt-hours per mile equates to the 1000 watt-hours per day of energy you can obtain from the solar panel if the golf cart is left outside all day.

- In terms of extending the life of the battery pack by keeping it in a higher state of charge, accurate estimations are difficult. However, you can make some observations. If you aren't driving many miles per day (say 6 miles per day) and you are always plugging in at night then your battery pack will always be nearly fully charged. The impact from a solar panel is likely to be minimal. If you are driving a lot of miles per day and discharging the pack deeply then the low amount of energy from a solar panel (1000 watt-hours per day) is likely to be a relatively small percentage of the power discharged and probably won't have much impact either. Regardless, running a controlled experiment is difficult and would take several years.

50 mpg with my Yamaha. Never left me.

Thanks, Tucillo. I'll stick with my Yamaha Gas Cart. Maybe 10 years from now when Im ready to trade it in/sell it, electric technology will improve.

tuccillo

Your finding do not agree with ours, your opinion is not based on actual use or measured results they merely hypothetical.

Unlike as we have in real time testing and use over the last few years.

You are welcome to see the cart when they are at the squares.

To debate your numbers here is pointless, especially when you have no idea what the panel output voltage is nor how the controller was engineered.


.

Jimbo, with all due respect, I'm not a fan of leaving my cart outside for the time it requires to charge. One of the requirements for the home I bought was a golf cart garage for that very reason. I'm very interested in green energy, and like to think I have an open mind about it. I've take a number of steps to reduce energy usage in my house. I wish you luck in your solar cart project.

The energy that can be obtained from a 260 watt panel (1000 watt-hours per day) is directly from NREL and is not hypothetical. The watt-hours per mile is based on direct measurements by a poster on this forum and reported ranges by several posters.

The output voltage only has meaning when the amperage is specified. That is why I used energy units. Watts (power) = Volts x Amps. Energy is watts integrated over time or watt-hours.

A controller can maximize the charging of the battery pack but the absolute energy from the panel is limited by the panel technology, the size of the panel, it's orientation to the sun, the latitude, hours of exposure, and the climatic conditions. On average, you won't see more than 1000 watt-hours per day from the panel and probably a lot less unless you leave the cart outside all day. I ignored the inefficiencies in the controller - the energy to the battery pack will probably be 5% less due to inefficiencies in the controller.

Feel free to post your own numbers.

I certainly hope battery technology and costs get better with time. Advances have been slow. It is hard to compete with gasoline in terms of it's "energy density". A gallon of gasoline weight about 6 pounds and will provide about 50 miles of range. It takes about 500 pounds of flooded lead-acid batteries to give you the same range. The gas in my 5+ gallon tank weighs about 30 pounds and provides 250 miles before needing to fill up. Lithium-ion are much better but the cost remains high.

Hybrid anyone ?

So your entire calculation is based on ONE posters wattage usage.
And that's not hypothetical?

Nope 99.2%



I have a lot more testing completed than that, on three different carts.


What ever I state you will disagree, so no point.

You don't even have an electric cart.

One poster posted actual power measurements from a kill-a-watt meter. Several others have posted obtained driving ranges with their cart, from which energy per mile is easily obtained. The energy usage for an electric is in the range of 150-200 watt-hours per mile.

99.2 % vs. 95 % doesn't change the conclusions. The difference is essentially in the noise range.

I am stating the actual numbers and you are the one who states they are wrong without posting any of your own numbers. I understand why you are reluctant to do so. The numbers are not very compelling.

The numbers are what the numbers are regardless of what cart I own. I am a scientist and deal with this sort of energy analysis every day at work.

Probably not - it would not be cheap ;-)

What cart to buy?
 

Even the Volt knew it had to go hybrid, despite the initial grand plan. Right now and for the foreseeable future, fossil fuels are the only answer. IMHO
With an area the size of Manhattan Island one would be fuelish not to go with internal combustion.

Yes. And virtually all goods move via diesel: trains, planes (OK, jet fuel), trucks, and container ships. That is not going to change in my lifetime. When you need to move a lot of mass you need the kind of "energy density" that only fossil fuels can deliver. I think we will continue to see progress with electric and hybrid cars but it will be slow progress, and you still need to generate electricity with mostly fossil fuels.

What cart to buy?
 

Although, all NYC Manhattan buses run on natural gas. Still diesel, still fossil but much cleaner. No reason why a Yami engine can't do the same thing.

I wish Honda would get into the gas cart business. They are fundamentally an engine maker and I suspect they could engineer a golf cart that could exceed the 50 mpg I currently get. The market, however, is a bit crowded.

What cart to buy?
 

The number one outboard engine is Yamaha. Then Mercury, Evinrude. I do like Honda, but I think that all the makers just aren't trying hard enough with the cart engines. Trying to keep costs down I suppose. Let's face it, they sound like a lawnmower and smell worse. Also, putting FI on a cart engine is just lipstick on a pig. Big waste of engineering.

The introduction of fuel injection was an improvement but it was an incremental improvement. I suspect the manufacturers are more driven to continue with their proven, bullet-proof designs as fleet sales to golf courses (where they live a hard life) are the main business. Our cart doesn't have a smell and is quiet at cruising speed. It is a bit louder during acceleration.

We'll be looking to get a cart when we move to our house in The Villages next year. I would love to get a quiet, non-smelly electric cart. However, every time I've visited The Villages it seems like 90% or more of the carts I see are gas and 90% or more of them are Yamahas. It makes me think that the majority of folks have bought gas carts (and Yamaha carts) for a reason. For resale value alone, I feel I really have to give Yamaha gas carts are serious look. Since I'm not big on working with gas engines (or electric motors and batteries for that matter - I'm a software guy, not a hardware guy), I'll probably get a new cart with a warranty and take advantage of the improvements made on newer carts, including the "less smelly, better mileage" newer gas carts.

The main add-ons I'm looking for in a cart are 3-point seat belts and side lighting. I talked to a salesman and he mentioned the lighting as an option and I didn't really see the point. That night I was sitting on a bench outside a store in one of the town squares and notice that the carts without side lighting kind of disappeared as they went by. Those with lighting were hard to miss. And if I drive at night, I really do want my cart to be hard to miss, visually.

The wife is moderately interested in a more enclosed cart. I've seen sliding and hinged doors and have wondered if these would be insanely hot in the summer as we'll be full-timers, not snowbirds. Does anybody have any advice on cart enclosures? Are they wonderful in the winter and unbearable in the summer or are they wonderful year-round or are they kind of useless (since most people don't seem to bother with them)?

There was a time when gas was probably necessary and many of those carts are still out there. People also did less shopping off the reservation so The Villages golf carts got the bulk of the business and they sold Yamaha. If you spend time south of 466A you will find a bunch of electrics of all makes. I have an electric that I purchased off site and wanted to have something checked. I took it to The Villages Golf Carts and they advised they service everything and they took care of my concerns. I do not subscribe to the theory that one type of cart is better than another, only that your personal requirements will dictate what you buy. Everyone here has a bias and will try and convince you that their position is the right choice. There are plenty of resources available to provide un-biased information....got to love the internet.

On the subject of enclosures I am not a fan of solid enclosures. I enjoy having an open cart and enjoying the fresh air. The solid enclosures take a lot of that away and the amount of time you will need them in a year is minimal, yet they are there all the time. The sunbrella gives you you both options and yes, it does mean you might have to take 5 minutes to roll them up when you don't need them. I would suggest getting the sunbrella and if you it doesn't work then you can add solids. If you put on solids first and then find you want to change it's both harder and more expensive to go that route.

Thanks for the well-stated and well-thought-out opinion on enclosures! What you say makes a lot of sense to me!

Glad you asked. I'm also interested in hearing opinions from folks about the enclosed carts, I believe they are call Curtis Cab Doors. They seem to add a bit of security also ease of use when unexpected weather hits, possibly warmer inside during cooler times with the doors closed. Altough I'm sure air circulations may be a problem.

Well one big advantage is the drivers knee isn't hanging out in the traffic lane just waiting for a car to clip it.

It's amazing how many guys drive like that:shrug:.

There are those who like gas carts and those who like electric. It is kinda like how we vote and how we feel about religion; no one is going to change our minds. We have gas carts and we have solar panels on our roof to heat our pool. I like what is proven to work well.

I have lived in the Villages for 11 years and have owned 4 golf carts, both gas and electric. Presently I have an electric Parcar which I have had for a couple of years. Distance is never a problem but the most distance I have put is 25 miles. As far as enclosures I have had both a Curtis Cab and a MEE enclosure. However right now I have an interesting enclosure that I purchased with my cart. It is a sliding canvas enclosure that is attached to the front of the cart with velcro. It works great and is certainly easy to open or close. I don't think anyone else has this type of enclosure. I would not have a cart without an enclosure of some type. Another advantage of this type of enclosure is that it's not very heavy.

John

You mention lack of fresh air with a solid enclosure. Does that mean even with the doors open?

Completely agree!

That is what those with solid enclosures tell me. I have a friend that has two carts, one sunbrella equipped and one curtis cab equipped. He uses the curtis only when there is a chance of foul weather. I play golf with a guy that also has a curtis and he has made it clear that they next cart will not have an enclosure. As with everything, it really is personal preference but I see no advantage to solids.

We have had our 2010 Star Cart for 6 years. Still on the original set of 8 6v batteries; we are just now realizing a noticeable decrease in range, so expect to replace the batteries next Fall. Our cart will easily go 20 mph, only very slight slow-down on up-slopes. We are definitely fans of Electric, and IMHO a Star will get you the most cart for the money.

Have you considered Lithium and or solar with lead acid

Not ready yet to make that kind of investment. I have a battery minder, purchased 3 yrs ago. Got 6 yrs out of first battery set. With Battery Minder starting with new batteries next Fall, I should get at least 6 or 7 years out of those. By that time, hopefully, the price of the new technology will have fallen significantly. Or by then, maybe we'll get a new cart... Or maybe by then I won't need a cart anymore......(sigh)