6 Million in 6 months

[Golfingnut]

Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.

[jebartle]

could not agree more



Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.

[PaPaLarry]

Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.
I think this country has been humane way before the Affordable care Act. Through my lifetime, I can not write down all the humane help we have given, from the United States of America! We Americans have always been Humane. Just my point of view.

[Nipper]

could not agree more

ditto

[Golfingnut]

I think this country has been humane way before the Affordable care Act. Through my lifetime, I can not write down all the humane help we have given, from the United States of America! We Americans have always been Humane. Just my point of view.

NOTE

From the OP.
WE HUMANS ARE SLOWLY BECOMING MORE HUMANE.

[Nipper]

NOTE

From the OP.
WE HUMANS ARE SLOWLY BECOMING MORE HUMANE.

Thank you Golfingnut.

[Irishmen]

April Fools! Good one think ing Obamacare has something to do with healthcare.

[Golfingnut]

April Fools! Good one think ing Obamacare has something to do with healthcare.

Boy Howdy!

[Golfingnut]

I would never use saving lives as a joke. The ACA is a wonderful thing for millions of our fellow Americans, especially the poor and the children.

[Irishmen]

6.56 million gets insurance cancelled. 6 million allegedly signed up. Traffic last couple days surged to check the opt box created last week to avoid the mandate. Nice work.

[rubicon]

Methinks some folks are in denial or perhaps there just in a trolling mood?

I got to get ready for golf now.

[Golfingnut]

6.56 million gets insurance cancelled. 6 million allegedly signed up. Traffic last couple days surged to check the opt box created last week to avoid the mandate. Nice work.

I am so sorry you think that is true.:sad:

[Whit53]

So agree Golfingnut.

[chuckster]

Know quite a few on minimum wage that can't afford and won't sign up..costs less to pay the "fine" that will be levied to "punish" those that didn't sign on the dotted line. All of you on medicare can rest easy...

[Golfingnut]

Know quite a few on minimum wage that can't afford and won't sign up..costs less to pay the "fine" that will be levied to "punish" those that didn't sign on the dotted line. All of you on medicare can rest easy...

Not true.:read:

[thekeithfan]

I would never use saving lives as a joke. The ACA is a wonderful thing for millions of our fellow Americans, especially the poor and the children.

Millions more than those have been dropped because of Obamacare. So because of ACA millions of Americans are now uninsured!

[Golfingnut]

Millions more than those have been dropped because of Obamacare. So because of ACA millions of Americans are now uninsured!

Sorry, not true.

[DianeM]

I'll be paying the fine thank you very much.

[thekeithfan]

April Fools! Good one think ing Obamacare has something to do with healthcare.

Exactly

[Irishmen]

Hey golfing nut.....How do feel about Veterans applications for assistance being shredded to "clear" the backlog. I guess it's OK to screw those who served with us right?

[2BNTV]

Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.

:agree:

Lou:

i just love the way you start something. that could be political, without taking it over the edge. :smiley:

"I've always depended on the kindness of strangers".

[dewilson58]

Yes, let's force Americans to buy health insurance (oh, that's right.....it is a Tax according to the US S.Court) or fine them if they CHOOSE not to purchase.

Sounds like a vampire needing fresh young blood.

For the people that like Obamacare.............have them pay for it (and for those who can not afford it).

[Bay Kid]

Virginia has had a plan in use for many years that take care of the all the poor children for free. We did this and didn't have to ruin health care for all the rest.

[graciegirl]

Lou. I know you are a kind and good person, but not everyone agrees with this controversial subject. You may believe with every fiber of your being that it is the right thing to do, but not everyone thinks this is the best answer.


Your feelings will be hurt.


And you will get angry at people who can't help believing the way they believe.


We are a bunch of stubborn old-er people who at our age aren't likely to change our minds. AND we all believe that we know what is right.


This subject is very inflammatory. I can't believe this thread is left to stand.

[Golfingnut]

:agree:

Lou:

i just love the way you start something. that could be political, without taking it over the edge. :smiley:

"I've always depended on the kindness of strangers".

Thank you. I tear up when I think about what this law does for so many.

I also tear up when I read the untrue spin on this wonderful law.

I commit here and now to apologize from the gazebo in the Square at Lake Sumter if this law turns out to be anything but helpful to the young and the poor of this great country. I also worry about the cost to all of us as individuals and the country as a whole. I sincerely believe this is the moral and financial approach to the medical care problems so many unfortunate poor and young people face every day.

[Irishmen]

true that Gracie. I'm for taking care of those who through no fault of their own get sick and need coverage. We already have this in place for those who seek it. Wealth redistribution is what Obamacare is all about. Tax credits not deductions is what this is all about.

[buggyone]

Hey golfing nut.....How do feel about Veterans applications for assistance being shredded to "clear" the backlog. I guess it's OK to screw those who served with us right?

Do I hear the mating sound of a vulpine creature? I doubt if vulpine creatures would have been in favor of Social Security or Medicare at their inception but now fight tooth and nail for every penny of their benefit.

[dewilson58]

Virginia has had a plan in use for many years that take care of the all the poor children for free. We did this and didn't have to ruin health care for all the rest.

:BigApplause::BigApplause:

[janmcn]

Most of the posters criticizing this law, probably prefer the single-payer socialized medicine, commonly known as Medicare. The majority does support the ACA in case anyone missed the big poll taken in 2012.

[DianeM]

This could get ugly real fast. You're either pro this plan or not. I personally do not support it. It's wrong to mandate what people do for health care. I chose to ignore the nonsense.

[Golfingnut]

Lou. I know you are a kind and good person, but not everyone agrees with this controversial subject. You may believe with every fiber of your being that it is the right thing to do, but not everyone thinks this is the best answer.


Your feelings will be hurt.


And you will get angry at people who can't help believing the way they believe.


We are a bunch of stubborn old-er people who at our age aren't likely to change our minds. AND we all believe that we know what is right.


This subject is very inflammatory. I can't believe this thread is left to stand.

No, I will not be hurt, the maximum hurt has been done to me already. Everything in my future will be positive. I will not get angry any more, I know it's not their fault, it's their misunderstanding. I will forgive them of their misunderstandings. I have said many times on this site that my Hero is Jesus Christ; therefore I will follow his teachings by both turning the other cheek and giving to the needy.

Love
Lou

[Irishmen]

Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.

Great Britain avg wait is 197 days for doctors appt, similar to Canada. Do this call your doctor here in the villages about your health concern and guess where they'll tell you to go because the schedule is booked: the emergency room.

[rockyisle]

And they said the same about Medicare years ago and the same for Plan D... I'm happy we finally have "something" on the books to help those who need health care. I hope in the coming years our nation will expand and streamline our healthcare programs so that everyone (not just us oldsters) have reasonable and affordable coverage.

[Irishmen]

And they said the same about Medicare years ago and the same for Plan D... I'm happy we finally have "something" on the books to help those who need health care. I hope in the coming years our nation will expand and streamline our healthcare programs so that everyone (not just us oldsters) have reasonable and affordable coverage.

We already have something on the books. Health clinics, Medicaid are all available now. Obamacare in the form of tax credits is redistribution from one individual to others.

[graciegirl]

Great Britain avg wait is 197 days for doctors appt, similar to Canada. Do this call your doctor here in the villages about your health concern and guess where they'll tell you to go because the schedule is booked: the emergency room.


Very long waits in Austria where income tax is fifty percent.


Friend in Netherlands was diagnosed with breast cancer and had to wait three months for surgery. Meanwhile the little cancer cells are growing, growing, growing and traveling, traveling, traveling.


Socialized medicine is not what we are used to. But I guess we will have to get used to it.


My husband worked long hours and stayed with a company through very difficult bosses so that we could have the excellent health benefits that Helene's life depended on. Everyone makes sacrifices to protect their loved ones. At least everyone used to. Now fathers don't even marry mothers and there are multiple parents who do not look out for the lives of many children brought into the world.


It is no shame to be poor, and many cannot help themselves out of it. But some can. Many of our immigrant parents and grandparents did. Those of us who can afford to care for those who cannot care for themselves have an ethical responsibility to share their wealth. However the welfare system is so abused that it is a mockery and an enabling agent for many who use illegal drugs to live comfortably and pay for their habit with welfare funds.


Now perhaps this thread will be closed.

[dewilson58]

This could get ugly real fast. You're either pro this plan or not. I personally do not support it. It's wrong to mandate what people do for health care. I chose to ignore the nonsense.

:thumbup:

[Madelaine Amee]

This is a "no win" thread. You are either for it or against it - nothing in between and it is becoming political real fast!

[Golfingnut]

Well, the 6 million that have it now is a giant leap for mankind for what the MAJORITY fasted for and won in 2010. The only thing left is whether it works or not. I am putting my belief on it working. Let's not fight, about it, let's all join in the hope that it does work.

[CraigC]

Most of the posters criticizing this law, probably prefer the single-payer socialized medicine, commonly known as Medicare. The majority does support the ACA in case anyone missed the big poll taken in 2012.

I'm not sure if this post is made in jest. Quoting a 2012 poll on ACA just goes to show how illiterate the average American really is. They don't read and most don't even listen to news on television. As usual, they don't know much of anything about anything until it hurts them personally. As the current polling shows, it now is beginning to hurt. March 6, 2014 Gallup polling shows the number of Americans disapproving to be 55% and 40% approving. In a way watching this disaster unfold has been quite comical. Listening to the excuses reminds me of the days of Baghdad Bob.

Number of Americans Saying ACA Has Hurt Them Inches Up (http://www.gallup.com/poll/167756/number-americans-saying-aca-hurt-inches.aspx)

[DianeM]

Well, the 6 million that have it now is a giant leap for mankind for what the MAJORITY fasted for and won in 2010. The only thing left is whether it works or not. I am putting my belief on it working. Let's not fight, about it, let's all join in the hope that it does work.

Sorry but I hope it will be a total failure that needs to be rescinded

[Irishmen]

This is a "no win" thread. You are either for it or against it - nothing in between and it is becoming political real fast!

This too is a myth. I like portions of the act. Polls indicate others feel like me. I don't like the act for the real reason it was created, too hold group of people hostage and as avenue for wealth redistribution through tax credits.
Let's keep preexisting conditions portion but open the market to be able to cross state lines.
And political it is. California applicants receive by law voter registration. Funny how the box is premarked Democrat.

[quirky3]

Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.

Completely agree!:BigApplause:

[dewilson58]

This too is a myth. I like portions of the act. Polls indicate others feel like me. I don't like the act for the real reason it was created, too hold group of people hostage and as avenue for wealth redistribution through tax credits.
Let's keep preexisting conditions portion but open the market to be able to cross state lines.

Bingo!

[nitehawk]

Get use to it Obama Care is here to stay ---- Thank you

[dewilson58]

I'm not sure if this post is made in jest. Quoting a 2012 poll on ACA just goes to show how illiterate the average American really is. They don't read and most don't even listen to news on television. As usual, they don't know much of anything about anything until it hurts them personally. As the current polling shows, it now is beginning to hurt. March 6, 2014 Gallup polling shows the number of Americans disapproving to be 55% and 40% approving. In a way watching this disaster unfold has been quite comical. Listening to the excuses reminds me of the days of Baghdad Bob.

Number of Americans Saying ACA Has Hurt Them Inches Up (http://www.gallup.com/poll/167756/number-americans-saying-aca-hurt-inches.aspx)

50% of Americans pay zero income taxes......I would bet 100% of the 40% are in that boat.......okay, a couple % of the 40% might.

[Golfingnut]

I am passionate about healthcare for all for the love of my fellow man. If I have to give up a little to help someone else a lot. I'm in. Praise Jesus for the Sermon on the Mount. If I am wrong, then to me that means I have more heart than brains. HUMMMMMM, that's OK with me also.

[nitehawk]

:BigApplause:I am passionate about healthcare for all for the love of my fellow man. If I have to give up a little to help someone else a lot. I'm in. Praise Jesus for the Sermon on the Mount. If I am wrong, then to me that means I have more heart than brains. HUMMMMMM, that's OK with me also.

:BigApplause:

[DianeM]

I find these postings offensive. Where is a Moderator when you need one. Jesus had nothing to do with the ACA.

[Abby10]

As a healthcare worker on the front lines, I need to weigh in here with a couple of real life examples. Sorry in advance that this will be lengthy.

Scenario #1 - I'm in the ER with my husband as he is writhing in pain from a kidney stone. Because there is only a curtain dividing us from the next patient I can hear the entire conversation as a young man tells the nurse that he is unemployed and just got insurance through ACA so he figured he would come to the ER to get some things "checked out". One was a problem that he had been having with his finger for months and the other was a bulge in his lower abdominal area which he wanted to get looked at as he thought it might be a hernia. Obviously, neither of these was worthy of an ER visit. I think you will be seeing much more of this, not less. Too many people are just ignorant of the need to have a primary care doctor or just too lazy to get one, therefore I see the ER problem as one that will continue and probably get worse.

Scenario #2 - My brother just contracted a rare form of cancer and has been receiving treatment at a cancer center. He has been relaying to me heartwrenching stories about other patients there who have lost their health insurance because it has been deemed by the ACA as "unacceptable insurance". Here they are in the middle of chemotherapy treatments having to scramble to get new insurance. Doesn't seem very compassionate to me!

In the state which I currently reside, residents who are poor are able to apply for both federal help through Medicaid and state health insurance programs which are excellent in what they provide, including complete coverage for children. As far as our young people are concerned (26 & up), the reason most of them need government intervention for healthcare is because THEY DON'T HAVE JOBS!! Let's fix the real problem here people! I know some young entrepreneurs who have their own businesses that have switched from the insurance they previously had (because it was deemed unacceptable) to an ACA plan and are very upset because the cost is so much more. I might add that they were previously HUGE ACA supporters.

So, in the words of the late, great Paul Harvey........"and now you know the rest of the story".

Golfingnut, I truly hope for the sake of this great country that what you say and believe comes true, but what I have seen so far in my practice and experience is not proving to be the case thus far.

[billethkid]

For those that it really help, the truly uninsured or un-insure able, that is great.

That group is not what is represented by the 6 million number being advertised........and we won't know what the real number for that needy, intended group is until the numbers by category are officially released.
Way to controversial to reach ANY conclusions at this stage.

I am afraid this is just another case of the old adage that figures don't lie but liars figure.......only time will tell

[janmcn]

I'm not sure if this post is made in jest. Quoting a 2012 poll on ACA just goes to show how illiterate the average American really is. They don't read and most don't even listen to news on television. As usual, they don't know much of anything about anything until it hurts them personally. As the current polling shows, it now is beginning to hurt. March 6, 2014 Gallup polling shows the number of Americans disapproving to be 55% and 40% approving. In a way watching this disaster unfold has been quite comical. Listening to the excuses reminds me of the days of Baghdad Bob.

Number of Americans Saying ACA Has Hurt Them Inches Up (http://www.gallup.com/poll/167756/number-americans-saying-aca-hurt-inches.aspx)


The poll I was mentioning was called the election where the choice was clear; repeal the Affordable Care Act or keep it. The results were overwhelmingly in favor of keeping it. The majority rules in our democratic form of government.

[jebartle]

You have a way of making the truth so easy to understand!


Do I hear the mating sound of a vulpine creature? I doubt if vulpine creatures would have been in favor of Social Security or Medicare at their inception but now fight tooth and nail for every penny of their benefit.

[Irishmen]

The poll I was mentioning was called the election where the choice was clear; repeal the Affordable Care Act or keep it. The results were overwhelmingly in favor of keeping it. The majority rules in our democratic form of government.

Now that we know what's in it after it passes and after all the lies and deception you darn right majority gonna rule.

[tippyclubb]

For us The AFFORADABLE Care act is anything but that. Our health insurance through work has gone up $5,000 a year in the last 2 years. I have been on the Obama market place to check out prices and if you do not qualify for the subsidy rates are extremely expensive. Deductibles ranging from 12-20 thousand dollars and this is affordable?

That's all I can say about this. My blood pressure is rising.

[dewilson58]

For us The AFFORADABLE Care act is anything but that. Our health insurance through work has gone up $5,000 a year in the last 2 years. I have been on the Obama market place to check out prices and if you do not qualify for the subsidy rates are extremely expensive. Deductibles ranging from 12-20 thousand dollars and this is affordable?

That's all I can say about this. My blood pressure is rising.


Yep Yep Yep.

Did the 5pm town square whistle blow yet??

[billethkid]

there are very many folks who are touting what a good deal the ACA is and I would venture to say of those here on this forum or friends or family....not one are currently affected by the act.

SO? Well as the effects of the act are fully implemented....assuming the rules don't continue to move around or slide out in time or what ever....as the full impact of implementation , now 2015 and beyond (maybe!) and your health care availability and your health care costs escalate and you cannot go to the doctors you want and your coverages change as a result of rising costs and your doctor no longer takes your insurance.......until some or all of these hit home there is nothing personally invested or experienced. However when that does happen there will be a very different tune.....and I am sure by then it will be called something else.

To each his own....I am just very happy I am in the 90% who were and continue to be happy with what we have and had prior to ACA.....at least until we are affected as well.....and we will be!

[chachacha]

i don't believe the federal govt has the constitutional right to force citizens to purchase anything....they only got this passed by calling it a TAX! if you don't care that your rights are being eroded by big govt, by all means celebrate the humanity! but humanity has been cared for by churches and charity for generations, with the best medical care in the world, without the intrusion of taxes and fees and wealth distribution.

[dewilson58]

i don't believe the federal govt has the constitutional right to force citizens to purchase anything....they only got this passed by calling it a TAX! if you don't care that your rights are being eroded by big govt, by all means celebrate the humanity! but humanity has been cared for by churches and charity for generations, with the best medical care in the world, without the intrusion of taxes and fees and wealth distribution.

Nicely said.

Not sure why anyone would celebrate 6 million in 6 months when it is mandatory.

:throwtomatoes::throwtomatoes::throwtomatoes:

[jebartle]

There will always be that element that will take advantage of the system BUT for those that could not get insurance because of a pre-existing condition we should show empathy...I've never understood the attitude of "hooray for me and to hell with you"....I can only hope that ACT will be the answer to their prayers..When it comes to our healthcare, no one should be turned away!

[ilovetv]

It's a nice idea, but not when it kills jobs and the premise this nation was founded on: Self-Employed, Sole Proprietor, Business Owner.

Watch this and tell us how these results are helping people to stay in the workforce and earning enough to pay the taxes, SS and medicare taxes to pay for everything being hot-wired in by the glad-handing clowns in Washington:

Small business employees react to life changes necessitated by Affordable Care Act | Health - WTAE Home (http://www.wtae.com/health/small-business-employees-react-to-life-changes-necessitated-by-affordable-care-act/24184630)

[Abby10]

...BUT for those that could not get insurance because of a pre-existing condition we should show empathy...

For this reason in particular, and maybe a few others, healthcare insurance did indeed need reform. I do not want my previous post to reflect that I did not see problems with our former system. However, the MAJOR overhaul that was done was unnecessary and probably hurt more people than it helped.

I also agree with chachacha's statement - " but humanity has been cared for by churches and charity for generations" - because this is true compassion, people helping people, not government "helping" people. I have seen this at work firsthand - not only does this supply people with their basic needs but gives them a "hand-up" so to speak to help themselves. We do no one any good by continuing to give "hand-outs" without also giving the tools to build themselves up. IMO, people are better at doing this than an impersonal government.

[TNLAKEPANDA]

For the money being spent on the program they could have paid all the bills for the uninsured many times over. Just more Govt waste. Not political just fact.

[Chi-Town]

Every year for last ten years my retiree medical insurance escalated to the point it had doubled and then some. The company does not participate as far as deferring any cost; you pay from dollar one. As expensive as it got there was no choice because of a pre-existing condition. I recently went on Medicare which was a huge savings, but my wife needed to stay on the retiree policy. Beginning in 2014 the ACA did away with the pre-existing condition clause, and even though she did not qualify for any subsidies we were now able to shop around. Bottom line is that we were able to save $300.00 per month going from Cigna to Blue Cross. Same doctors, same co-pay, and less of a deductible.

[2BNTV]

Thank you. I tear up when I think about what this law does for so many.

I also tear up when I read the untrue spin on this wonderful law.

I commit here and now to apologize from the gazebo in the Square at Lake Sumter if this law turns out to be anything but helpful to the young and the poor of this great country. I also worry about the cost to all of us as individuals and the country as a whole. I sincerely believe this is the moral and financial approach to the medical care problems so many unfortunate poor and young people face every day.

FWIW - A law to accomplish healthcare, was first proposed back, (60 plus years ago), when Harry Truman was the president. I'm sure there are many situations, that need refining, to get ACA, to work perfect. IMHO

Whew! - I'm glad I got this in, before this thread is closed. Hint. :D

[billethkid]

Every year for last ten years my retiree medical insurance escalated to the point it had doubled and then some. The company does not participate as far as deferring any cost; you pay from dollar one. As expensive as it got there was no choice because of a pre-existing condition. I recently went on Medicare which was a huge savings, but my wife needed to stay on the retiree policy. Beginning in 2014 the ACA did away with the pre-existing condition clause, and even though she did not qualify for any subsidies we were now able to shop around. Bottom line is that we were able to save $300.00 per month going from Cigna to Blue Cross. Same doctors, same co-pay, and less of a deductible.

A great example of where ACA has indeed been beneficial. And I, like many others have no problem with any actions that result in those NEEDING it like pr existing conditions, uninsureable for what ever reason or can't afford it, etc.

What is objectionable was and is the changing of what was working, yes with problem areas-but working just fine. To address those in need the current ACA has upset programs many of us were completely happy to have.

This upsetting of the entire health care industry, as I have stated in prior posts, will only result in lessor and much more expensive care. And many of us who will elect to attempt to keep the same level and quality of care will continue to pay more to see to it we get what we have had all our lives.

Enjoy the health care you have now as it is the best and lowest cost you will have for the rest of your life.

[mixsonci]

i don't believe the federal govt has the constitutional right to force citizens to purchase anything....they only got this passed by calling it a TAX! if you don't care that your rights are being eroded by big govt, by all means celebrate the humanity! but humanity has been cared for by churches and charity for generations, with the best medical care in the world, without the intrusion of taxes and fees and wealth distribution.

Didn't we break away from Great Britain because of too many and too high taxes? How about we form the "Country" of Florida - Just a thought Right now i am personally not effected by ACA so I really can't judge, but it doesn't seem fair just because one can afford insurance they should be penalized. My son's insurance went way up for each member of his family, he's a hard worker but has 5 kids and his wife to pay for now, plus whoever else can't pay for their own. Not fair.

[Golfingnut]

FWIW - A law to accomplish healthcare, was first proposed back, (60 plus years ago), when Harry Truman was the president. I'm sure there are many situations, that need refining, to get ACA, to work perfect. IMHO

Whew! - I'm glad I got this in, before this thread is closed. Hint. :D

And I agree, that it needs to be refined, but appealed,,,,,,,NONSENSE!!!!!!

[KeepingItReal]

April Fools! Good one think ing Obamacare has something to do with healthcare.

:BigApplause: :BigApplause:

[ilovetv]

In the first place.....

Who buys their other important insurance policies without a state-licensed and state-regulated agent to advise them on which particular policy gives them the coverages they need, at the most affordable cost?

I've never (and WOULD never) bought our homeowners', auto, flood, life, golf cart, RV, nor any other insurance policy of that importance without an agent who is monitored for the legality of his practices by the state insurance commission.

I don't think any of us has ever gone online to buy insurance with the help of unlicensed, unregulated, recently employed "navigators" on whom criminal background checking was not done.

Going to a website that is usually fouled up, and that had no method of premium payment included for at least the first two months, is senseless.

It's not the concept or goal that is bad. It is the method.

[Golfingnut]

Now that it is law...... Now that it is effect for 6 million Americans...... Now that appeal would be horrible......

Let's put our heads together and make it work for everyone without kicking these 6 million Americans to the curb.

PLEASE.......

[Irishmen]

Website updated back page form states as long as you enroll through the Obomacare website, you can't be cancelled for one year by insurance companies due to non payment reasons related to hardship clause based on honor system. It's renewable every year at enrollment. Basically it says you are a victim of hardship if your are breathing. Is this what they mean when they say the bill has to pass to see what's in it? Only suckers will be sending in payments for health care.....

[skyguy79]

I find these postings offensive. Where is a Moderator when you need one. Jesus had nothing to do with the ACA.If a post offends someone, they should, in line with forum policy complain to the moderator by using the red triangle instead of using a broad paint brush on all posters. That's what the red triangle on each post is there for.

Most of the posters criticizing this law, probably prefer the single-payer socialized medicine, commonly known as Medicare. The majority does support the ACA in case anyone missed the big poll taken in 2012.It's quite convenient to project one's beliefs and present a limited point of view by using a poll that's a couple of years old. Let's present more current polls or data that project the whole picture both long term and current regardless of whichever view they wind up projecting or supporting and not a view that's used to promote a personal point of view . You'll find the kind of polls I'm speaking of in the two following sites giving polling data:

Health Tracking Poll: Exploring the Public’s Views on the Affordable Care Act (ACA) | The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation (http://kff.org/interactive/health-tracking-poll-exploring-the-publics-views-on-the-affordable-care-act-aca/)

RealClearPolitics - Election Other - Public Approval of Health Care Law (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/obama_and_democrats_health_care_plan-1130.html)

As for myself, I would pay a penalty before I would signup for a plan that in my opinion:


...gave designers a need to conceal details from lawmakers and the public in general in order to get acceptance by voters.
...resorted to a mandate, a tactic normally considered to be extortion, in order to attempt making enrollment a success.
...continued to conceal negative elements to those signing up until after they signed up. i.e my son was fit to be tied to find out that the deductible on the policy he got from CA's ACA setup (Covered CA) was concealed from him beforehand. It was $4000, an outrageous amount for anybody let alone people that were supposed to allegedly be helped because they couldn't afford to get insurance in the first place. I also have reason to believe that there are even higher deductibles, but didn't see actual figures to say how much higher.

[janmcn]

If a post offends someone, they should, in line with forum policy complain to the moderator by using the red triangle instead of using a broad paint brush on all posters. That's what the red triangle on each post is there for.

It's quite convenient to project one's beliefs and present a limited point of view by using a poll that's a couple of years old. Let's present more current polls or data that project the whole picture both long term and current regardless of whichever view they wind up projecting or supporting and not a view that's used to promote a personal point of view . You'll find the kind of polls I'm speaking of in the two following sites giving polling data:

Health Tracking Poll: Exploring the Public’s Views on the Affordable Care Act (ACA) | The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation (http://kff.org/interactive/health-tracking-poll-exploring-the-publics-views-on-the-affordable-care-act-aca/)

RealClearPolitics - Election Other - Public Approval of Health Care Law (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/obama_and_democrats_health_care_plan-1130.html)

As for myself, I would pay a penalty before I would signup for a plan that in my opinion:


...gave designers a need to conceal details from lawmakers and the public in general in order to get acceptance by voters.
...resorted to a mandate, a tactic normally considered to be extortion, in order to attempt making enrollment a success.
...continued to conceal negative elements to those signing up until after they signed up. i.e my son was fit to be tied to find out that the deductible on the policy he got from CA's ACA setup (Covered CA) was concealed from him beforehand. It was $4000, an outrageous amount for anybody let alone people that were supposed to allegedly be helped because they couldn't afford to get insurance in the first place. I also have reason to believe that there are even higher deductibles, but didn't see actual figures to say how much higher.




Again, the poll I was speaking of was the 2012 election where the choice between repealing the ACA and keeping it could not have been clearer, and the voters spoke loud and clear that they did not want it repealed.

[Bucco]

I am going to be careful with my comments on this issue, as avoiding politics when discussing this healthcare law is very difficult as it IS a political program put into law via a political process.

Any law of this scope, that has only the support of one single party AND requires two other things to have it passed. One, the pay off of certain states with pork (See LA as one clear example) and secondly has to suspend and change the traditional vote counting in the senate to have it passed is suspect to begin with.

Secondly, any law of this scope that began with maneuvers that can be described with other words, but will leave it at maneuvers, that mislead not only the public but the congress of the USA. I am speaking of the untruth told to the american public about public hearings. They did not happen, and IN FACT clearly 90% of all discussions were held in secret. The promise to incorporate other proposals already in play (yes, there were a few...maybe 20 or so....other healthcare proposals that had been put forward) and then not only to ignore those proposals but to ignore those who put them forward

This kind of law with a shadowy, secretive birth had failure written all over it.

While much of the bill is great and that is ALL the designers of the bill speak of, it is going to cost this country so much money we simply cannot afford it. REMEMBER....the bill, since it is been pushed out and out, will not really come due for a few years. The tax bill in a couple years will shock all of us.

This bill has so many things that are wonderful. When the president at the time introduced a proposal to discuss health care in 2007, he was mocked by the congress....now, his proposal was not the same at all except it had most of the same goals

As what is really going to happen to this country as this bill matures, the american public have become very suspect.....and as time goes on it will be even worse.

Insuring those with pre existing conditions....allowing children to stay on their parents health policy, etc.......ALL proposed in the past....ALL agreed by everyone to be a part of any health legislation. What was missing was any discussion, public OR private with anyone but the health insurance industries.

Those who speak as if this law is black and white...if you oppose this, you are a bad person opposed to items I mentioned....NOT THE CASE.....I cannot think of anyone opposed to any of that at all.......it is how we get there that was the question and do you not wonder what might have been had there been discussion on this bill ?

The financial implications of this bill will haunt your children and grandchildren for years....it is already haunting those who have lost their health insurance or worse.

Ill designed.....poorly planned...politically planned....I doubt if this can be scrapped and start over. I know the authors are already doing the dance of asking for suggestions to fix it.....they sure should have done that when they promised they would and did not....might have been a different landscape.

A great thought has been made into a political football and did not need to be that way. I, for one, will never forget the birth of this and the dishonesty and manipulation done in the name of caring.

[Parker]

I don't see why this thread should be closed. What is wrong with having opposing views about anything? POLITE discussion is a good and healthy thing. Those who are 'offended' (what a tedious overwrought word) are free to find many other threads more to their liking, leaving people who like to debate ideas free to do so. To each his own.

[Abby10]

...continued to conceal negative elements to those signing up until after they signed up. i.e my son was fit to be tied to find out that the deductible on the policy he got from CA's ACA setup (Covered CA) was concealed from him beforehand. It was $4000, an outrageous amount for anybody let alone people that were supposed to allegedly be helped because they couldn't afford to get insurance in the first place. I also have reason to believe that there are even higher deductibles, but didn't see actual figures to say how much higher.
[/LIST]

Skyguy, you make a very good point here. This is one of the biggest problems I see with this system. Many of the enrollees (like the entrepreneurs that I mentioned in an earlier post) are younger men and women. They signed onto ACA thinking that they will get a better deal and instead end up with these astronomical deductibles. Actually, most that I have spoken to said they are more like $6000 and up. Therefore, because they are relatively healthy, they pay premiums every month, but derive no benefit from it because more than likely they will never utilize services beyond their deductible. They would have been better off to keep their former plan, if only it was allowed. NOW, for those with pre-existing conditions like Chi-Town mentioned in a previous post, ACA was certainly a positive and I am happy for those people who have benefited from that. But that could have been achieved without hurting so many others in the process.

[Bucco]

Now that it is law...... Now that it is effect for 6 million Americans...... Now that appeal would be horrible......

Let's put our heads together and make it work for everyone without kicking these 6 million Americans to the curb.

PLEASE.......

Can you explain why that was not done in the beginning ? Can you explain why that is important at this date but was not then ? Can you explain the secrecy of the drafting of this legislation ? Can you explain, when votes needed to be "bought" there was not thought put into maybe "fixing" it then ? Can you explain why the voting rules in the senate needed to be changed to have it passed and that did not turn on a lightbulb to have it fixed then ?

Can you explain the many untruths told to get this bill passed ? Can you explain the attitude of "goodness" projected about this bill when the untruths and distortions were used to get it passed ?

Can you explain why proposals put forth prior to this to not "kick 6 million americans to the curb" were ignored in ANY of the discussions even though they addressed that.....going back to the prior administration ?

[graciegirl]

Again, the poll I was speaking of was the 2012 election where the choice between repealing the ACA and keeping it could not have been clearer, and the voters spoke loud and clear that they did not want it repealed.



It appears from this recent Pew Poll that a good many people have changed their minds since then.


USA TODAY/Pew poll: Health care law faces difficult future (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/09/16/usa-today-pew-poll-health-care-law-opposition/2817169/)

[buggyone]

i don't believe the federal govt has the constitutional right to force citizens to purchase anything....they only got this passed by calling it a TAX! if you don't care that your rights are being eroded by big govt, by all means celebrate the humanity! but humanity has been cared for by churches and charity for generations, with the best medical care in the world, without the intrusion of taxes and fees and wealth distribution.

The case went before the US Supreme Court and the Chief Justice (a GW Bush appointee) decided the personal mandate was a tax and therefore was constitutional.:boom:

[DONKEY10]

Yeah so we change the whole system for 6 million people. It is destined to fail the affordable care act.

[janmcn]

It appears from this recent Pew Poll that a good many people have changed their minds since then.


USA TODAY/Pew poll: Health care law faces difficult future (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/09/16/usa-today-pew-poll-health-care-law-opposition/2817169/)


Too bad there are no do overs in our election laws. The train has left the station. The next opportunity won't come until November 2016.

BTW: The White House just announced enrollments hit 7.041 million before midnight last night, and that doesn't count people enrolled yesterday on state exchanges.

[Bucco]

Yeah so we change the whole system for 6 million people. It is destined to fail the affordable care act.


I think the "system" needed to be changed. I think that EVERYONE in Washington thought the system needed to be changed.

BUT...to call a secretive, manipulative, politically backed only, law to pass in the name of being "humanatarian" is simply in humane. This bill will occupy and tie us up for so many years...decades. And we knew it...we knew exactly what we did..yet we did it. That is not humane. THAT is politics

[Irishmen]

Again, the poll I was speaking of was the 2012 election where the choice between repealing the ACA and keeping it could not have been clearer, and the voters spoke loud and clear that they did not want it repealed.

The voters were lied to time and time again. The bill has been unilaterally changed with exemptions and extensions to certain select groups favorable to PBO.

[Bucco]

Too bad there are no do overs in our election laws. The train has left the station. The next opportunity won't come until November 2016.

BTW: The White House just announced enrollments hit 7.041 million before midnight last night, and that doesn't count people enrolled yesterday on state exchanges.

And the attitude expressed here is HOW this bill got passed. We will get the votes....we won and you are not involved in this conversation as the door closes on discussion.

I suppose some think this is good for our country...I don't but that is just my opinion.

[shcisamax]

Skyguy, you make a very good point here. This is one of the biggest problems I see with this system. Many of the enrollees (like the entrepreneurs that I mentioned in an earlier post) are younger men and women. They signed onto ACA thinking that they will get a better deal and instead end up with these astronomical deductibles. Actually, most that I have spoken to said they are more like $6000 and up. Therefore, because they are relatively healthy, they pay premiums every month, but derive no benefit from it because more than likely they will never utilize services beyond their deductible. They would have been better off to keep their former plan, if only it was allowed. NOW, for those with pre-existing conditions like Chi-Town mentioned in a previous post, ACA was certainly a positive and I am happy for those people who have benefited from that. But that could have been achieved without hurting so many others in the process.

I was going to refrain from this thread but i have to weigh in in support of the above. My young adult children both lost their very affordable insurance because it didn't have "sufficient" pharmaceutical coverage and to enroll in ACA it would double their premium and double their deductible. We ended up with more expensive insurance which will work for a year while we come up with a new plan based upon where ACA is then.
I agree there is a need to cover those who are not able to obtain coverage but the ACA plan is simply not well thought out. I also agree that if the only way you could get the votes to pass a law is to lie to the American people and undoubtedly many in the congress, something is terribly wrong.

[Irishmen]

Too bad there are no do overs in our election laws. The train has left the station. The next opportunity won't come until November 2016.

BTW: The White House just announced enrollments hit 7.041 million before midnight last night, and that doesn't count people enrolled yesterday on state exchanges.

Most who "enrolled" we're checking the opt box out but still considered in this number.

[dewilson58]

It's a nice idea, but not when it kills jobs and the premise this nation was founded on: Self-Employed, Sole Proprietor, Business Owner.

Watch this and tell us how these results are helping people to stay in the workforce and earning enough to pay the taxes, SS and medicare taxes to pay for everything being hot-wired in by the glad-handing clowns in Washington:

Small business employees react to life changes necessitated by Affordable Care Act | Health - WTAE Home (http://www.wtae.com/health/small-business-employees-react-to-life-changes-necessitated-by-affordable-care-act/24184630)


Happening all over the country (outside the bubble). My employees experienced this, my children have experienced this and they are stuck with $17,000,000,000,000 national debt.

[Indydealmaker]

:April Fools! Good one think ing Obamacare has something to do with healthcare.
:1rotfl

[Indydealmaker]

I am one of those that got my insurance cancelled not once, but twice. Now it is costing 57% more than before I found coverage that will meet the ACA standards. The policy is NOT superior to my old coverage. In fact I will pay up to 15 times more for 7 of my drugs.

The concept behind the Affordable Care Act was the only good part.

The execution was abominable.

The economics were infeasable.

The fact that it was passed by a congress that did not read it is irrational and reeks of malfeasance.

Theoretically, the best part of the ACA was the pre-existing condition portion. However, the only insureds that can take advantage of that are the poor who will not have to pay anyway or the wealthy that can afford the thousands per year in premiums.

More people will end up UNINSURED after the smoke clears than were uninsured before ACA. Many middle income people may be able to keep some coverage, but they will see a reduced standard of life in order to be able to pay the premiums.

At the end of the day, if you had been working hard to make a good living, you will suffer under the ACA.

Like I said, the Concept of Affordable Health Care is a Wonderful thing! However, taking that Affordable Health Care from one family and giving it to another is a SERIOUSLY FLAWED process.

[mixsonci]

I am one of those that got my insurance cancelled not once, but twice.

The concept behind the Affordable Care Act was the only good part.

The execution was abominable.

The economics were infeasable.

The fact that it was passed by a congress that did not read it is irrational and reeks of malfeasance.

Theoretically, the best part of the ACA was the pre-existing condition portion. However, the only insureds that can take advantage of that are the poor who will not have to pay anyway or the wealthy that can afford the thousands per year in premiums.

More people will end up UNINSURED after the smoke clears than were uninsured before ACA. Many middle income people may be able to keep some coverage, but they will see a reduced standard of life in order to be able to pay the premiums.

At the end of the day, if you had been working hard to make a good living, you will suffer under the ACA.

Like I said, the Concept of Affordable Health Care is a Wonderful thing! However, taking that Affordable Health Care from one family and giving it to another is a SERIOUSLY FLAWED process.

Well said, agree totally:BigApplause:

[Abby10]

I am one of those that got my insurance cancelled not once, but twice. Now it is costing 57% more than before I found coverage that will meet the ACA standards. The policy is NOT superior to my old coverage. In fact I will pay up to 15 times more for 7 of my drugs.

The concept behind the Affordable Care Act was the only good part.

The execution was abominable.

The economics were infeasable.

The fact that it was passed by a congress that did not read it is irrational and reeks of malfeasance.

Theoretically, the best part of the ACA was the pre-existing condition portion. However, the only insureds that can take advantage of that are the poor who will not have to pay anyway or the wealthy that can afford the thousands per year in premiums.

More people will end up UNINSURED after the smoke clears than were uninsured before ACA. Many middle income people may be able to keep some coverage, but they will see a reduced standard of life in order to be able to pay the premiums.

At the end of the day, if you had been working hard to make a good living, you will suffer under the ACA.

Like I said, the Concept of Affordable Health Care is a Wonderful thing! However, taking that Affordable Health Care from one family and giving it to another is a SERIOUSLY FLAWED process.

Great post! Clear, concise and to the point. I too agree totally!

[Shimpy]

BTW: The White House just announced enrollments hit 7.041 million before midnight last night, and that doesn't count people enrolled yesterday on state exchanges.

Does anyone actually believe what the White House says? That's the same White House that told us we could keep our doctor and insurance. None of those enrolled counts until they pay a premium and those number who have actually paid are kept top secret. Only one reason for that.

[skyguy79]

Again, the poll I was speaking of was the 2012 election where the choice between repealing the ACA and keeping it could not have been clearer, and the voters spoke loud and clear that they did not want it repealed.I was well aware that you used an old obsolete poll, but it would be helpful to the reader if you provided a link to that poll so they can see for themselves what you're trying to say. Anyway, I do thank you for reinforcing what I was saying! :ho:

[shcisamax]

I am one of those that got my insurance cancelled not once, but twice. Now it is costing 57% more than before I found coverage that will meet the ACA standards. The policy is NOT superior to my old coverage. In fact I will pay up to 15 times more for 7 of my drugs.

The concept behind the Affordable Care Act was the only good part.

The execution was abominable.

The economics were infeasable.

The fact that it was passed by a congress that did not read it is irrational and reeks of malfeasance.

Theoretically, the best part of the ACA was the pre-existing condition portion. However, the only insureds that can take advantage of that are the poor who will not have to pay anyway or the wealthy that can afford the thousands per year in premiums.

More people will end up UNINSURED after the smoke clears than were uninsured before ACA. Many middle income people may be able to keep some coverage, but they will see a reduced standard of life in order to be able to pay the premiums.

At the end of the day, if you had been working hard to make a good living, you will suffer under the ACA.

Like I said, the Concept of Affordable Health Care is a Wonderful thing! However, taking that Affordable Health Care from one family and giving it to another is a SERIOUSLY FLAWED process.


Absolutely in total agreement.:BigApplause:

[billethkid]

but like the majority of Americans, I want to know exactly what the 7 million is.
How many that never had insurance.
How many that had their insurance cancelled and are now applying......these do not count you know!
How many are what age?
How many of the applicants are paid?

I don't think some acknowledge that even if an application is accepted and the applicant says OK BUT does not pay, it is not a valid claim.

If you put an item on Amazon in or any other website and do not check out and pay for it.....it is not a sale......even though it remains in the shopping basket.

Let's keep it real simple.........If you need 7 million people with red hats and you get 7 million people but only one million have red hats....the 7 million does not count.

[Golfingnut]

Does anyone actually believe what the White House says? That's the same White House that told us we could keep our doctor and insurance. None of those enrolled counts until they pay a premium and those number who have actually paid are kept top secret. Only one reason for that.

Yes sir, I do.

[golf2140]

What was the true costs. The web site, the folks who had their hours cut at work. With all the money the govn spent they could have paid the insurance for 7.1 million and had a lot of chnage left over.

[Golfingnut]

but like the majority of Americans, I want to know exactly what the 7 million is.
How many that never had insurance.
How many that had their insurance cancelled and are now applying......these do not count you know!
How many are what age?
How many of the applicants are paid?

I don't think some acknowledge that even if an application is accepted and the applicant says OK BUT does not pay, it is not a valid claim.

If you put an item on Amazon in or any other website and do not check out and pay for it.....it is not a sale......even though it remains in the shopping basket.

Let's keep it real simple.........If you need 7 million people with red hats and you get 7 million people but only one million have red hats....the 7 million does not count.

All your concerns will be addressed in the next few months. You will love this program when it is fully implemented.

[Bucco]

but like the majority of Americans, I want to know exactly what the 7 million is.
How many that never had insurance.
How many that had their insurance cancelled and are now applying......these do not count you know!
How many are what age?
How many of the applicants are paid?

I don't think some acknowledge that even if an application is accepted and the applicant says OK BUT does not pay, it is not a valid claim.

If you put an item on Amazon in or any other website and do not check out and pay for it.....it is not a sale......even though it remains in the shopping basket.

Let's keep it real simple.........If you need 7 million people with red hats and you get 7 million people but only one million have red hats....the 7 million does not count.

Some developing information.....from a RAND study

....."just 23 per cent of new enrollees had no insurance before signing up"

....."just 53 per cent have paid their first month's premiums."

"If those numbers hold, the actual net gain of paid policies among Americans who lacked medical insurance in the pre-Obamacare days would be just 858,298."

White House says 7 MILLION Obamacare enrollments, but study shows 858,000 | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2594309/President-plans-victory-lap-strong-Obamacare-enrollment-Sebelius-faces-unpopular-law-blank-stare-tough-questions-remain-whos-signing-up.html)

You pretty much have to search to find TRUTH here.

This has been political from the get go and continues.....Harry Reid dismissed as "taking a narrow view of the law" when confronted with the fact that the majority of the cancer centers in he USA are NOT covered by the new law. Amazing what is done in the name of your party, whichever one !

[Golfingnut]

There would be a better view of this program if the TOTV members were the beneficiaries of this program as opposed to older retirees that already have medical coverage. We are set, they are in need of help. I see it as our responsibility to help our younger population.

[janmcn]

I was well aware that you used an old obsolete poll, but it would be helpful to the reader if you provided a link to that poll so they can see for themselves what you're trying to say. Anyway, I do thank you for reinforcing what I was saying! :ho:


For the third time, the poll I was speaking of was the election results of the November 2012 election when the president won in a landslide victory. This is the only poll that counts.

[graciegirl]

;;;;

[Golfingnut]

;;;;

I am sorry they did not act on your order to close this thread, but it appears there is a lot of interest and a lot of honest debate, so maybe they know best how to manage their web site.

[Golfingnut]

I thank everyone for their opinions and civil manner in this thread.

Love
The golfingnut.

[Xavier]

Thank you America for the Affordable Care Act.

I can visualize the mother being able to take her child to her doctor on a scheduled appointment. This WILL speed up the time spent in emergency rooms for true emergencies.

This humanitarian act took less than 6 months. We humans are slowly becoming more Humane.

Golfingnut, we all should love others as much! My fear that some of the Boomers slipped right into the "Me" Generation and some of the pre-Boomers forgot just how hard life can be. The "Love" Generation had the right idea.

Oh, by the way, I'm one of the first Boomers. One of my classmates died 17 years ago at the age of 50. Her death came about because she didn't have Insurance and she couldn't afford to go to a hospital. She was a high school cheerleader who grew up in an upper middle class family. She was intelligent, pretty, and was loved and a friend to all. We all could have found ourselves in a similar situation. Would you feel the same way about ACA if your child needed the help? No one is saying it's perfect, but I haven't heard of any other plans brought to the table that are better. It needs to be tweaked, but instead they'll try, for the 53rd time, to repeal it. It's done - let's make it better.

Xavier

[Golfingnut]

Golfingnut, we all should love others as much! My fear that some of the Boomers slipped right into the "Me" Generation and some of the pre-Boomers forgot just how hard life can be. The "Love" Generation had the right idea.

Oh, by the way, I'm one of the first Boomers. One of my classmates died 17 years ago at the age of 50. Her death came about because she didn't have Insurance and she couldn't afford to go to a hospital. She was a high school cheerleader who grew up in an upper middle class family. She was intelligent, pretty, and was loved and a friend to all. We all could have found ourselves in a similar situation. Would you feel the same way about ACA if your child needed the help? No one is saying it's perfect, but I haven't heard of any other plans brought to the table that are better. It needs to be tweaked, but instead they'll try, for the 53rd time, to repeal it. It's done - let's make it better.

Xavier

You just made me tear up for the fifth time today, and I thank you for it. The fact that others put lives of their fellow man above all else inspires me to stay the course. Thank you very much for an inspiring post Xavier.

I turned 50 years old 16 years ago. I get it.

[Abby10]

Golfingnut - I will soon be able to give you some first hand experience with all of this. Right now, I pay my employer for full coverage for insurance for my husband and myself. This is not just about the younger generation. There are many of us in the 50+ range who are being forced into either part-time positions or early retirement due to cut backs and lack of jobs - and I am talking about healthcare jobs, where receiving a package to retire is unheard of for most of us. Therefore, many of us are struggling to find affordable healthcare if there is such a thing. Since I hope to leave my place of employment within the next year to move to TV, I will be looking into what my options are for coverage. i will be happy to share with you my findings. If being on ACA really is the most affordable option, I will be surprised, but at least I will know from first hand experience one way or the other.

[Golfingnut]

Golfingnut - I will soon be able to give you some first hand experience with all of this. Right now, I pay my employer for full coverage for insurance for my husband and myself. This is not just about the younger generation. There are many of us in the 50+ range who are being forced into either part-time positions or early retirement due to cut backs and lack of jobs - and I am talking about healthcare jobs, where receiving a package to retire is unheard of for most of us. Therefore, many of us are struggling to find affordable healthcare if there is such a thing. Since I hope to leave my place of employment within the next year to move to TV, I will be looking into what my options are for coverage. i will be happy to share with you my findings. If being on ACA really is the most affordable option, I will be surprised, but at least I will know from first hand experience one way or the other.

I very much hope you have a good transition. I am in the best possible position with wonderful health insurance. I have one child also with spouse insurance coverage. I have a second child that has a pre existing from an incident of cancer 14 years ago, that prior to AHC could not buy any coverage, that now has a peak at life without fear of every wakening hour.

[Golfingnut]

7.1 million Americans have signed up. Wow, how wonderful is that?

[Parker]

No one knows if it is wonderful. No one really knows anything yet. It is hard to be optimistic about a government program that is based on a shell game of unknown facts and statistics shrouded in secrecy and presented in doubletalk.

[gomoho]

7.1 million Americans have signed up. Wow, how wonderful is that?

Well it could be very wonderful if someone would tell us how many of those supposed 7.1 mil bought on the exchange cause they got dropped by their insurance, signed up for "free" benefits which you and I will pay for, were the young which will bear the burden of all this, and have most important paid their premium.

I'm afraid what you and so many others in support of Obamacare fail to realize is that there isn't anyone that wants to deny health insurance to the young, the old, pre-existing, new born, old born whatever - we just are not comfortable with the way this is being done - the government demanding we do something or else. That is lost in the argument and it's sad 'cause we all want the same thing just have differences in how to accomplish that which gets us nowhere, but the mess we are in now.

[Bucco]

Last word, because as much as I read what others post, some just do not care about any facts.

To those who say there were no alternatives...that is NOT TRUE. There were at least 20 or more and the previous president attempted to open the conversation but was laughed at.

ALL of the proposals and the Presidents opening included all of the principles of the new law. That includes pre existing conditions...that includes allowing children to stay on policies of parents...that includes going after those uninsured.

THUS..what you folks are saying is either out of allegiance to something or somebody because it has absolutely no basis in fact or truth.

To those who subscribe to what a poster said....whomever wins can do what they want (I know they did not use those words, but said ...hey we won...we do what we want).....IF that is the mind set of even a small amount of americans.......if that is what drives you...if you do not care about the lies that are involved in this and continue.....if you do not care about any of this...so be it.

Pat yourself on the back....call yourself humane and those who had other ways to do this but were never asked bad people.....but you are living in a dream world.

MANY...MANY proposals were there......MUCH MUCH discussion on health care costs, pre existing conditions, etc.....

ALL of it shut down....change the rules of votiing..payoff senators for votes and country be damned. That seems to the the thrust.

AND NOW....come one, lets get together and fix it...lets ridicule anyone who does not agree with the methods....a sad commentary on my country that I fought for...very very sad

[Xavier]

Well it could be very wonderful if someone would tell us how many of those supposed 7.1 mil bought on the exchange cause they got dropped by their insurance, signed up for "free" benefits which you and I will pay for, were the young which will bear the burden of all this, and have most important paid their premium.

I'm afraid what you and so many others in support of Obamacare fail to realize is that there isn't anyone that wants to deny health insurance to the young, the old, pre-existing, new born, old born whatever - we just are not comfortable with the way this is being done - the government demanding we do something or else. That is lost in the argument and it's sad 'cause we all want the same thing just have differences in how to accomplish that which gets us nowhere, but the mess we are in now.

Cool, could you give me a listing of all of the alternative options. Thanks.

Xavier

[Bucco]

Cool, could you give me a listing of all of the alternative options. Thanks.

Xavier

You can begin with this Polit fact link....and recall this is before the President was even a candidate....all laughed out....congress would not allow a discussion

Republicans have proposed many solutions to control health care costs and improve quality, Ron Johnson says | PolitiFact (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2013/nov/26/ron-johnson/johnson-said-republicans-have-proposed-dozens-solu/)

All of these are presented in a general sense.....just to disprove those of you who say nobody but you cares...

Health care reforms proposed during the Obama administration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_reforms_proposed_during_the_Obama_admi nistration)

Seriously? The Republicans Have No Health Plan? - Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2013/08/28/seriously-the-republicans-have-no-health-plan/)

"George W. Bush found the solution to America's health-care crisis seven years ago. Too bad nobody listened."

Read more: Bushcare - Edward Lazear - POLITICO Magazine (http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/02/george-w-bush-healthcare-plan-2007-103635.html#ixzz2xg0WBeG6)

There are many more with more detail but doubt anyone reads this....the myth beats the truth evidently !

[Golfingnut]

Now, it's time to tweak AHC to make it even better. It is time to work toward a health plan for all that is affordable and sustainable. And again, thanks to all that will help make health care for all our brothers and sisters a reality.

Lou

[DianeM]

There would be a better view of this program if the TOTV members were the beneficiaries of this program as opposed to older retirees that already have medical coverage. We are set, they are in need of help. I see it as our responsibility to help our younger population.

Well guess what ????? Not everyone here is 65. I'm not so don't qualify for Medicare. The insurance I had was cancelled because it didn't fit the new parameters. So now I have nothing because hell will freeze before I apply for Obamacare. They can fine me. If I'm sick I will handle the bill myself or die - whatever comes first.

[Bucco]

Now, it's time to tweak AHC to make it even better. It is time to work toward a health plan for all that is affordable and sustainable. And again, thanks to all that will help make health care for all our brothers and sisters a reality.

Lou

This should have been done in 2010, openly and honestly but it wasnt. It is a bill founded on fraud and lies.

And some folks are more enthralled with myths rather than truths.

[Golfingnut]

This should have been done in 2010, openly and honestly but it wasnt. It is a bill founded on fraud and lies.

And some folks are more enthralled with myths rather than truths.

You may be right, but don't throw out the baby with the bath water. Let's get down to the business of making this flawed program work for all. It has wonderful implications and will prove to be one of the best things done in our lifetime.

[Bucco]

"So what would the ideal alternative to Obamacare look like? It should provide cost-effective care and the quality treatment that Americans deserve. Effective reform should discourage over-insurance that results from the subsidy of so-called Cadillac plans that pay for basic, inexpensive and predictable procedures and have patient co-payments that are too low. Reform should encourage consumers to use America’s scarce health resources efficiently by inducing them to get tests and treatments that are justified instead of those that are selected because they are almost free to the decision-makers. Finally, reform should make health insurance available to the vast majority of Americans, some of whom cannot afford insurance without help.

The Bush 2007 plan achieves these goals"


Read more: Bushcare - Edward Lazear - POLITICO Magazine (http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/02/george-w-bush-healthcare-plan-2007-103635.html#ixzz2xg3l3qeE)

Not saying this is a great plan....do not know, but tired of the "bleeding hearts" calling anyone who disagrees with the dishonestly and blatant political nature of this bill...a bill ONLY PASSED with manipulation.....someone who does not care.

To me, that speaks to the character of those making the charge. Fix it ? Why ? How can you "fix it" now ?

[Golfingnut]

Well guess what ????? Not everyone here is 65. I'm not so don't qualify for Medicare. The insurance I had was cancelled because it didn't fit the new parameters. So now I have nothing because hell will freeze before I apply for Obamacare. They can fine me. If I'm sick I will handle the bill myself or die - whatever comes first.

Sorry you feel that way. I wish you the best.

Lou

[Bucco]

You may be right, but don't throw out the baby with the bath water. Let's get down to the business of making this flawed program work for all. It has wonderful implications and will prove to be one of the best things done in our lifetime.

It is too late.....why cannot you see it. If this is not overturned and a complete discussion of all the issues without moving in the direction this takes us...in the open as promised, with all parties involved as promised. What you are saying will cause more grief than already exists now......for more people......yeah, someone will need to fix it eventually.......but I am just tired of all this rhetoric based on politics....this is a health bill for the USA, not one party......rich, poor, black, white, hispanic, jew, catholic...whatever ALL are being touched by this bill and I suggest when all the tentacles that exist hit the IRS, and after all the votes that this was after are counted, this will rank as one of the largest financial disaster ever enacted, unless....YES, at unless some one fixes it.

But, tell you what.....I would not be too fast to even try just listening to the rhetoric.....as the poster who said whomever wins can do....hey, you didnt want us then.....you changed the rules and paid off senators...YOU fix it

[Golfingnut]

"So what would the ideal alternative to Obamacare look like? It should provide cost-effective care and the quality treatment that Americans deserve. Effective reform should discourage over-insurance that results from the subsidy of so-called Cadillac plans that pay for basic, inexpensive and predictable procedures and have patient co-payments that are too low. Reform should encourage consumers to use America’s scarce health resources efficiently by inducing them to get tests and treatments that are justified instead of those that are selected because they are almost free to the decision-makers. Finally, reform should make health insurance available to the vast majority of Americans, some of whom cannot afford insurance without help.

The Bush 2007 plan achieves these goals"


Read more: Bushcare - Edward Lazear - POLITICO Magazine (http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/02/george-w-bush-healthcare-plan-2007-103635.html#ixzz2xg3l3qeE)

Not saying this is a great plan....do not know, but tired of the "bleeding hearts" calling anyone who disagrees with the dishonestly and blatant political nature of this bill...a bill ONLY PASSED with manipulation.....someone who does not care.

To me, that speaks to the character of those making the charge. Fix it ? Why ? How can you "fix it" now ?


I respectfully disagree. The AHC has been a winner from its beginning and went into LAW because of its honest statement for the need of healthcare for all and not just the few.

[DianeM]

Sorry you feel that way. I wish you the best.

Lou

platitudes are neither requested nor appreciated.

[DianeM]

I respectfully disagree. The AHC has been a winner from its beginning and went into LAW because of its honest statement for the need of healthcare for all and not just the few.

Bad laws are made to be changed or ignored or broken

[Golfingnut]

Bad laws are made to be changed or ignored or broken

Boy Howdy, I am sorry you feel that way.

[gomoho]

I respectfully disagree. The AHC has been a winner from its beginning and went into LAW because of its honest statement for the need of healthcare for all and not just the few.

If this is the end all be all why are there so many exceptions to the mandate and changes along the way. You said a winner from the beginning - that doesn't synch with all the changes and extensions.

[philnpat]

Everyone...REMEMBER it IS April Fools Day!

[billethkid]

Bad laws are made to be changed or ignored or broken


How 100% true as evidenced by the 33 changes made with the"pen".....and the waivers and the exemptions and the privleged...and for those who don't like the direction the wind is blowing today. It has been since passed changed and ignored acknowledging it started out broken.

[Golfingnut]

Please be calm and look at this as a way to improve the lives of the 40 Million people on the lower rung of the income ladder. They need health care as much as we in Upper levels of income do. This is not asking for everyone to live in a place like the villages and have our income, but rather it is about giving a struggling mother the opportunity to have a family doctor to care for her children when their suffering. Many of the folks that will benefit from this LAW have never seen a dream Village like we live in nor been in a luxury home like we take for granted. Give them the avenue to have the peace of mind that their basic health care needs are within their reach.

[Bucco]

I respectfully disagree. The AHC has been a winner from its beginning and went into LAW because of its honest statement for the need of healthcare for all and not just the few.

So you support the actions taken to get this bill passed as FACTUALLY outlined here....

This is the last sentence of the write up on HOW this was manipulated and shoved at us...

"To quote Democrat Rep. Alcee Hastings of the House Rules Committee during the bill process: “We’re making up the rules as we go along.”

http://www.crawfordbroadcasting.com/Vecchio_Archives/How%20Obamacare%20Became%20Law.pdf

And if you really want to get chills up your spine with your pride in this, read a bit about Mr Hastings and his impeachments, ethics committees and such.

Makes you so proud of the "honesty" involved and you recall all those public hearings promised by the President a few times....oh, wait..he promised but did not do it.

It is dishonest to use the word "honest" in the same sentence as this bill

[Bucco]

Please be calm and look at this as a way to improve the lives of the 40 Million people on the lower rung of the income ladder. They need health care as much as we in Upper levels of income do. This is not asking for everyone to live in a place like the villages and have our income, but rather it is about giving a struggling mother the opportunity to have a family doctor to care for her children when their suffering. Many of the folks that will benefit from this LAW have never seen a dream Village like we live in nor been in a luxury home like we take for granted. Give them the avenue to have the peace of mind that their basic health care needs are within their reach.

You talk as if everyone wants these folks to lose health care....WHERE did you get that idea....ALL of the bills ignored for this addressed the issue you keep bringing up.

Nobody has ever said what you keep talking about. This bill is a financial mess and was done for politics....if that makes you proud instead of a well thought out and discussed legislation, then so be it..not something I want to be happening in my country

[Golfingnut]

You talk as if everyone wants these folks to lose health care....WHERE did you get that idea....ALL of the bills ignored for this addressed the issue you keep bringing up.

Nobody has ever said what you keep talking about. This bill is a financial mess and was done for politics....if that makes you proud instead of a well thought out and discussed legislation, then so be it..not something I want to be happening in my country

I see needed changes and now is the time to start work on them. This is law...... Now like so many other laws of the land, let's modify it to make it better.
I am so proud of what is being accomplished for so many by this law. One or two years from today, this law will be talked about as one of the best laws ever passed.

[billethkid]

one example to contemplate that I heard directly from an insurance company executive. The subject of pre-existing conditions.

The insurance companies are accepting these people now when they would not have in the past. And, for now, there is no major increase in premiums.

Many of us who have provided insurance for employees over the years learned and know that as claim cost go up premiums are soon to follow. This has been, among others, one of the driving issues of increasing costs that over the years have all but eliminate "company" provided health care is nearly extinct.

Back to the current. As those with pre existing conditions health care costs....new costs to the provider on top of what they were already experiencing....start to accumulate these new costs will result in much higher premiums as the incidence rate as well as the per individual claims paid rate is now burdened on top of current operating costs.

These costs will initially be passed on to the insured or they will be offset by some government subsidy to either the patient or the provider. And this money will come from where? You guessed it.

As a result of this "new" cost balloon being inflated every day and the delays it will take to get compensated there will be many insurance companies that will just get out of the business.

And of course this all plays to the single payer scheme that was overwhelmingly rejected by our lawmakers even during the railroading of the ACA.

The above is just one example of a ticking bomb being hidden in the workings of this law.....and health care industry leaders know it and their hands are tied.....until the balloon bursts.

One example. Responsible people do not have to be a benefactor of bad legislation to be convinced ...it ain't that bad....and those who allude to now "knowing" what is in the bill now that it has been passed are just kidding themselves.

Time will most certainly be the test. And there is no doubt the currently unknown costs of implementation will become an overwhelming burden for this country and it's citizens......including those who believe otherwise.

[Bucco]

I see needed changes and now is the time to start work on them. This is law...... Now like so many other laws of the land, let's modify it to make it better.
I am so proud of what is being accomplished for so many by this law. One or two years from today, this law will be talked about as one of the best laws ever passed.

Please tell me how you can be PROUD of these dishonest actions that have been and continued to be used for politics ONLY ?????? I honestly want to know what you are PROUD of......to me, it is ...well, lets leave the adjective for later, but I aint proud of this bill. You wait a few years while congress is all tied up dealing with the financial bind of this bill. You thought we had a deficit problem ? This pretty much sews it up.

Again, there are and have been alternatives to do what you say, but as of now, all folks get is ridiculed for even bringing them up. Could have been avoided, should have been avoided.

[Golfingnut]

I think the insurance industry will say anything true or false to protect the large profits. Facts shoe this AHC will bring costs down for the majority.

[Bucco]

I think the insurance industry will say anything true or false to protect the large profits. Facts shoe this AHC will bring costs down for the majority.

Again that is not true if you wish to check !!!

[Bucco]

A note to THE VILLAGER 2 who posts both here and on another site.

If you care to use phrases like this to describe any of us who oppose this bill.....

"Very sad bunch of radicals that believe anyone that needs help is lazy."

Be a man and do it HERE and not under cover.

[Golfingnut]

Please tell me how you can be PROUD of these dishonest actions that have been and continued to be used for politics ONLY ?????? I honestly want to know what you are PROUD of......to me, it is ...well, lets leave the adjective for later, but I aint proud of this bill. You wait a few years while congress is all tied up dealing with the financial bind of this bill. You thought we had a deficit problem ? This pretty much sews it up.

Again, there are and have been alternatives to do what you say, but as of now, all folks get is ridiculed for even bringing them up. Could have been avoided, should have been avoided.

I have been here the whole time and just do not see the actions of those responsible for this bill being anything but FOR THE GOOD OF THE PEOPLE. Granted it will not improve the wealth of the ins companies and will cost me and you a few premium dollars, but that will be dwarfed by the benefit of so many in need of medical help.

[billethkid]

I think the insurance industry will say anything true or false to protect the large profits. Facts shoe this AHC will bring costs down for the majority.
time will tell and I anxiously wait for the facts to come out. I am always interested in observing historical firsts!

[Bucco]

I have been here the whole time and just do not see the actions of those responsible for this bill being anything but FOR THE GOOD OF THE PEOPLE. Granted it will not improve the wealth of the ins companies and will cost me and you a few premium dollars, but that will be dwarfed by the benefit of so many in need of medical help.

You do realize that TWO states did not want this bill and only voted for it after they were called in, spoke to in private, and given money to the state ?

You do realize that this bill only passed with manipulation of the rules to get it passed ?

You do realize as much as folks make fun, the last vote to repeal it had 39 Dems vote to repeal ?

NOBODY, and you just do not get it....NOBODY want anyone to get hurt, but they will simply because of the way and reason for this bill. If it makes you feel good that is was done for those folks, fine....it is not backed up by any facts.

[DianeM]

Boy Howdy, I am sorry you feel that way.

Well I reckon I'm quite sorry for your feelings too.

[Golfingnut]

Wife says if I want dinner, eat now or it will be thrown out. I hear your arguments, but I feel you are mistaken and you will see the benefits of this wonderful law in due time. I see this as big as any improvement to our country in my lifetime. Have a good evening, I will comment further in the morning. And thanks to everyone for being so kind and civil with your opinions.

[buggyone]

From what I read, it sounds as though some posters are against the mandate for insurance companies to provide health insurance to those with pre-existing conditions. That certainly is COLD. Just imagine if one of those with a pre-existing condition were you, your spouse, or your family. Would it safe to say you would still be against the coverage for pre-existing conditions?

Remember, also, that it was a Republican appointee (Chief Justice Roberts) who declared the individual mandate to be constitutional.

Golfingnuts is right when he says this law will be one of the major triumphs in Presidential history - like Social Security and Medicare. Without both of those, our society would be far worse off. How many of you would be as comfortable as you are without Social Security or Medicare?

I have also heard the fear factor brought up that physicians will become scarce due to Obamacare because they cannot make a profit anymore. It is a known fact that there is currently a record number of students applying for medical school across the USA. Some of the old timers are retiring but there is a fresh crop with new skills ready to take their places.

[Bucco]

From what I read, it sounds as though some posters are against the mandate for insurance companies to provide health insurance to those with pre-existing conditions. That certainly is COLD. Just imagine if one of those with a pre-existing condition were you, your spouse, or your family. Would it safe to say you would still be against the coverage for pre-existing conditions?

Remember, also, that it was a Republican appointee (Chief Justice Roberts) who declared the individual mandate to be constitutional.

Golfingnuts is right when he says this law will be one of the major triumphs in Presidential history - like Social Security and Medicare. Without both of those, our society would be far worse off. How many of you would be as comfortable as you are without Social Security or Medicare?

I have also heard the fear factor brought up that physicians will become scarce due to Obamacare because they cannot make a profit anymore. It is a known fact that there is currently a record number of students applying for medical school across the USA. Some of the old timers are retiring but there is a fresh crop with new skills ready to take their places.

Could you copy and paste the poster who expressed this... "some posters are against the mandate for insurance companies to provide health insurance to those with pre-existing conditions."

I have never seen anyone against that, nor even heard that point debated by anyone on a national scale. Fact is the proposals dismissed before this law all addressed that fact and everyone seems to be on the same page, so just to stay up on it...please allow where that came from. Thanks

I also have not heard the scare of physicians thing for the last year or so. The problem seems to be losing the physician that you want.

So if you could tell me the source of your post, I would really appreciate it.

Thanks again

[TOTV Team]

We've wanted to let views be expressed and there have been over 100 replies so this has been accomplished but this is naturally crossing over into politics and as such we need to close the thread.