Another shooting at Fort Hood.

[graciegirl]

This is so awful to hear.

[BarryRX]

Thoughts and prayers to them. Let's now wait for some facts before we start seeing a lot of wild posts.

[pooh]

Prayers are offered.

[buggyone]

Soldier shooting other soldiers. The news said the shooter had the rank of Specialist. That meant he was in the Army at least one year.

Maybe an idea the military could start doing is to have a brief psych evaluation on each soldier on a yearly basis or at least upon returning from an overseas tour or combat tour. Who knows, it might catch a few that have serious problems?

Anyhow, this is a terrible thing to happen.

[ilovetv]

The commander general speaking to press now says the shooter was in the process of being diagnosed with PTSD but had not been diagnosed yet and was in treatment for various psychiatric conditions. An earlier report said he'd just been transferred to Ft Hood in Feb and they started checking his background deeper now.

Our army friends talk about how painfully slow moving the bureaucracy is.

[Golfingnut]

The latest update.

Fort Hood Shooting: Iraq Vet With Mental Health Issues Kills 3, Himself; 16 Hurt | NBC 5 Dallas-Fort Worth (http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Active-Shooter-Reported-at-Fort-Hood-253636461.html)

[Golfingnut]

Soldier shooting other soldiers. The news said the shooter had the rank of Specialist. That meant he was in the Army at least one year.

Maybe an idea the military could start doing is to have a brief psych evaluation on each soldier on a yearly basis or at least upon returning from an overseas tour or combat tour. Who knows, it might catch a few that have serious problems?

Anyhow, this is a terrible thing to happen.

What came to mind was a specialist at 34 is very old for that low rank. Normal for an army man at 34 years old would be a Senior NCO. Could be he came in late, or has had other issues going on.

[Taltarzac725]

The commander general speaking to press now says the shooter was in the process of being diagnosed with PTSD but had not been diagnosed yet and was in treatment for various psychiatric conditions. An earlier report said he'd just been transferred to Ft Hood in Feb and they started checking his background deeper now.

Our army friends talk about how painfully slow moving the bureaucracy is.

Not sure that will stop any of these militarily based shootings as there are many returning from combat who would turn up under tests as having some kind of mental health problems. Turning to violence is a big step from being mentally ill in some way. What this country really needs is some education about the mentally ill and just how many people get depressed, suffer from some kind of anxiety, are dependent on pills in some way, etc. Research the National Alliance on Mental Illness. https://www.nami.org/ http://www.nami.org/factsheets/mentalillness_factsheet.pdf

I have suffered from depression on and off for decades and would never do any thing violent to anyone unless I were in a self-defense situation and I would probably be rechecking my actions in such a predicament from so many angles that I might be too slow to act. On a lighter note, I have an acquaintance who heard a noise in her house, picked up her loaded pistol from the nightstand, and shot her vacuum cleaner, which had moved a little bit because she had not put it away properly. One less vacuum cleaner in the Villages. And I hope also one less hot headed gun fanatic.

Also remember that the military has a history of covering up misdeeds by the powerful by making the victims look like they are mentally ill. This seems to be a very common tactic among totalitarian organizations where too much power is concentrated in too few hands. They probably need some kind of ombudsman in the military who can address problems of the abuse of labels of mental illness, interpersonal rage, and other things that might pop up which would require an independent investigator not in any chain of command. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsman

There does seem to be an ombudsman in the US Navy-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsmen_in_the_United_States#United_States_Navy

This movie might also be of interest-- http://www.nami.org/Template_itstime.cfm?Section=Frankie_and_Alice http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/04/01/what-the-hell-happened-to-halle-berry-s-frankie-alice.html

[buggyone]

We could go round and round and never come up with answers.

The soldier bought the gun recently in Texas. He was undergoing mental issues. What kind of background check was done so he could buy the gun?

Obviously, his wife should be thinking she is lucky to be alive as these killers usually start at home, kill others, and then themself.

[graciegirl]

He had transferred at some point from the Puerto Rican National Guard. That was the reason I heard given for his high age and low rank. He served in war theatre. Got a personal gun. Carried it onto base illegally. He was in the process of having his mental illness diagnosed.. Awful outcome. Innocent folks of all kinds harmed.

[Golfingnut]

The first illegal action was crossing the front gate line of the military base with a weapon. Up to that point he did no wrong. Sad.

[buggyone]

The first illegal action was crossing the front gate line of the military base with a weapon. Up to that point he did no wrong. Sad.

I don't know what the questions are on an application to buy a pistol in Texas (or anywhere) are. I thought there would be some question about having a mental disorder. If he lied about that, that would have been the first illegal action.

Anyhow, this is not a political issue nor a gun control issue by any means. Obviously, the Army did not think the soldier was enough of a danger to himself or anyone else that they did not keep him confined.

We had a couple of guys in my company when I was in the Army that were just put on jobs like mowing the grass, mopping the barracks, cleaning the area, etc. while they were awaiting discharges on "not being fit for the Army" discharges. They were not mentally ill but had visited the psychiatrists who deemed their personalities not compatible with the ways of the Army.

"In the Army, such discharges are handled under the provisions of Army Regulation 635-200, Active Duty Enlisted Administrative Separations. Chapter 5, paragraph 13 governs the separation of personnel medically diagnosed with a personality disorder."

[Golfingnut]

I don't know what the questions are on an application to buy a pistol in Texas (or anywhere) are. I thought there would be some question about having a mental disorder. If he lied about that, that would have been the first illegal action.

Anyhow, this is not a political issue nor a gun control issue by any means. Obviously, the Army did not think the soldier was enough of a danger to himself or anyone else that they did not keep him confined.

We had a couple of guys in my company when I was in the Army that were just put on jobs like mowing the grass, mopping the barracks, cleaning the area, etc. while they were awaiting discharges on "not being fit for the Army" discharges. They were not mentally ill but had visited the psychiatrists who deemed their personalities not compatible with the ways of the Army.

"In the Army, such discharges are handled under the provisions of Army Regulation 635-200, Active Duty Enlisted Administrative Separations. Chapter 5, paragraph 13 governs the separation of personnel medically diagnosed with a personality disorder."

Texas gun law is very tight. You have to have a drivers license to buy a pistol.

[Carl in Tampa]

Texas gun law is very tight. You have to have a drivers license to buy a pistol.

Actually, you don't even need a driver's license. You just need a state issued identification card that shows you are a Texas resident.

This is true of many states, including Florida, because of FEDERAL restrictions on purchasing firearms outside of your state of residence, or in some cases contiguous states. Florida permits purchase of rifles and shotguns in contiguous states.

It isn't just an issue of Texas law. Firearms purchases are regulated by FEDERAL law.

ATF Form 4473 is the document to be filled out. The buyer is asked at question 11. f. if he has ever been adjudicated mentally defective OR committed to a mental institution.

Apparently the Ft. Hood shooter had not been, so he could answer in the negative to the question.

----------------------------

As a matter of interest there are currently 37 states that mandate that the authorities "shall issue" a concealed weapons permit to any citizen of their state who applies and passes a police background check. You could add to this the state of Vermont where anyone, state resident or not, can carry a concealed weapon without a permit.

There are two "may issue" states where the authorities may exercise some judgement in whether or not they will give an applicant a license.

There are three "no issue" states where there are no provisions for issuing concealed weapons licenses.

There are some states which are unrestricted and simultaneously unrestricted, and "shall issue." They do not require licenses within their states but will issue licenses so their citizens can benefit from reciprocity agreements with other states.

Many states, including Florida, issue concealed carry licenses to residents of other states. However, not all reciprocity states give reciprocity to holders of Florida licenses who are not Florida residents.

Firearms law is quite complex.

[ilovetv]

I've heard from various news reports that the medical installation where the shooter went is not guarded with armed MPs or security guards. It seems quite basic to have some armed military police protection in those areas.

And as for the soldiers on the base to have to turn in their weapons while on base, I don't see the logic in that. ALL are well-trained in weapon safety and the judgement as to when/how to use one.

Can policemen imagine turning in their weapons when they enter their police departments? Can Secret Service officers imagine turning in their weapons when they enter the White House? Why would soldiers in their workplace be expected to be unarmed, as if nobody would attack there?

[senior citizen]

The Secretary of the Army John McHugh relayed the fact that Lopez had been given many drugs for his depression and anxiety and was on Ambien. Has anyone ever heard of the "Ambien defense"?
Keep scrolling down on this hyperlink to read about the "Ambien Zombie Phenomenon."

Not making excuses for his murderous rampage, however, not everyone tolerates psychotropic drugs very well and it appears he was on quite a cocktail of them.

Since everyone's brain chemistry is unique onto them, experimenting with all of these various prescribed psychotropic drugs as given to an already disturbed person, can quite possibly make them even worse.


http://weeksmd.com/2010/12/the-ambien-defense-getting-away-with-murder/ (http://weeksmd.com/2010/12/the-ambien-defense-getting-away-with-murder/)

The Ambien Defense. Getting away with murder......
"A variety of abnormal thinking and behavior changes have been reported to occur in association with the use of sedative/hypnotics. Some of these changes may be characterized by decreased inhibition (e.g., aggressiveness and extroversion that seemed out of character), similar to effects produced by alcohol and other CNS depressants.

Visual and auditory hallucinations have been reported as well as behavioral changes such as bizarre behavior, agitation, and depersonalization. Amnesia, anxiety and other neuro-psychiatric symptoms may occur unpredictably."
Recently, a federal prosecutor was persuaded that Ambien played a role in a nationally known case involving a man who tore off his shirt and loudly threatened to kill himself and others on a flight from North Carolina to London.

Because the prosecutor did the work to consider, and eventually accept, that the behavior had occurred because of Ambien, and in an unconscious state, British businessman Sean Joyce served five days in jail instead of up to twenty years. ( Joyce had also drank two glasses of wine with the Ambien, which violates its indications). But not all prosecutors warm up to "psychological" defenses – valid or not. Rather, they view a sleepwalking defense as more like the notorious "twinkie" defense – a defendant’s ploy to evade responsibility.

http://pharmawatchcanada.wordpress.com/2012/08/08/the-elephant-in-the-room-rampage-shootings-bizarre-violence-and-prescription-drugs/ (http://pharmawatchcanada.wordpress.com/2012/08/08/the-elephant-in-the-room-rampage-shootings-bizarre-violence-and-prescription-drugs/)

The Elephant in the Room: Rampage, Shootings, Bizarre violence and prescription drugs.

The latest.........

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/fort-hood-tragedy-article-1.1745022 (http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/fort-hood-tragedy-article-1.1745022)
The Fort Hood Tragedy