Golf course poachers

[marlinguy]

As long as "pool poachers" are being addressed, so should the golf course poachers be considered. You know, the ones that wait until the ambassadors leave then scoot out on the exec courses to keep from having to pay a few bucks, take the kids or hey, take the cart kids, have a blast. As long as the rest of us have to pay, so should they. At $8.00/hr, keep the ambassadors around. Just sayin'

[festusrules]

As long as "pool poachers" are being addressed, so should the golf course poachers be considered. You know, the ones that wait until the ambassadors leave then scoot out on the exec courses to keep from having to pay a few bucks, take the kids or hey, take the cart kids, have a blast. As long as the rest of us have to pay, so should they. At $8.00/hr, keep the ambassadors around. Just sayin'

Do you have any proof of this happening?

[VT2TV]

I asked 2 starters if they ever found non Villagers playing on the courses, and they said they have. They told me that was why they started extending their hours past whatever they used to be. I did not ask about whether they had Villagers who just did not pay their trail fees using the courses.

[marlinguy]

Proof as in have I personally "busted" the alleged perps???No, no more than the "pool watchers" have of their intruders. As you know, there are LOTS of golf courses, both exec and champ, that have cart x-ings along streets with access and when you see a cart with passengers that enter off of a street, not the starter shack, 30-40 minutes before dark, well, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck,,,,,,,

[gomoho]

Don't know if any of these things are really happening. I do know I am grateful I don't worry about it. Kids tearing up the golf course with carts would concern me. The rest of it not so much.

[JP]

I like to play golf after the starters leave because there is no pressure from people playing behind you and you can hit a couple of shots if you feel like it. It is not about not paying the cart fee. I find it more relaxing and fun.

[wholman66]

One personal situation, my wife and I had the last tee time of the day, the ambassador/starter told us we better get on the tee because there were people waiting to tee off after he left, and they were lined up!!

[buggyone]

One personal situation, my wife and I had the last tee time of the day, the ambassador/starter told us we better get on the tee because there were people waiting to tee off after he left, and they were lined up!!

Absolutely true. I know one neighborhood group of men who do this one day a week just so they will not get charged their one point. Sounds silly to me but each to their own. All of them play during normal hours too, and all pay their trail fees.

[marlinguy]

Never thought about it that way. I go for the premier so I would be good even after hours I guess, so would others. Never thought that playing "after hours" would be OK. Thanks for the new perspective, guess I will tee-up whenever I feel like it. Thanks again.

[Happinow]

We do the same in the summer time. It's not Uncommon for us to hit the course after we eat dinner. There are a few reasons for this.....it's not about the points, paying fees or anything like that. We find that there are fewer people on the course after hours and we can play at our leisure, the temperature is much cooler in the evening than playing throughout the day, and we get to watch the sunset while playing a game we love. Sometimes there are people who arrive after us and sometimes there are not. Often, even close to closing time, we can arrive at a course and get on. There's no waiting. The evenings in the summer are our preference to golf.

[DonH57]

We do the same in the summer time. It's not Uncommon for us to hit the course after we eat dinner. There are a few reasons for this.....it's not about the points, paying fees or anything like that. We find that there are fewer people on the course after hours and we can play at our leisure, the temperature is much cooler in the evening than playing throughout the day, and we get to watch the sunset while playing a game we love. Sometimes there are people who arrive after us and sometimes there are not. Often, even close to closing time, we can arrive at a course and get on. There's no waiting. The evenings in the summer are our preference to golf.

I usually do the same thing. Sometimes there is very people out on the course at that time of the day and then other days it's like a madhouse and everybody comes out. I would prefer the starters and ambassadors did stay on course till dark. The only trouble I've seen is by the time some people get to the 7th hole they lose their sense of urgency and could care less other people are waiting behind them.

[mulligan]

I usually do the same thing. Sometimes there is very people out on the course at that time of the day and then other days it's like a madhouse and everybody comes out. I would prefer the starters and ambassadors did stay on course till dark. The only trouble I've seen is by the time some people get to the 7th hole they lose their sense of urgency and could care less other people are waiting behind them.

The district won't pay for the extra hours

[keithwand]

Sounds like enough proof to me. Think I'll give Bonifay a try.

[Parker]

We do the same in the summer time. It's not Uncommon for us to hit the course after we eat dinner. There are a few reasons for this.....it's not about the points, paying fees or anything like that. We find that there are fewer people on the course after hours and we can play at our leisure, the temperature is much cooler in the evening than playing throughout the day, and we get to watch the sunset while playing a game we love. Sometimes there are people who arrive after us and sometimes there are not. Often, even close to closing time, we can arrive at a course and get on. There's no waiting. The evenings in the summer are our preference to golf.


Same for hubby, for the same reasons. And for those who think this may be some kind of cheating, he has asked several times at the closing starter shacks and has been willing to pay, but they wave him off and tell him to go right ahead. So apparently, it is all fine.

[wholman66]

As long as resident pays their golf cart trail fee, like the rest of us, or one walks, I don't have an issue regarding when they play. Those who wait until after the starter shack is closed to avoid paying the trail fee, or a greens fee, is where I have an issue, it is not fair to the rest of us who pay! I live on a golf course and hear and see it almost every day.

[mulligan]

Sounds like enough proof to me. Think I'll give Bonifay a try.

Doesn't work on championship courses. The ambassadors are around later, and will ask for your ID. You will be charged for after hours play the next time you check in at a championship course.

[justjim]

The trail fee is only about 40 cents a day (quick head figure)---- can't imagine someone that wants to play golf being so "cheap" that they would fudge on paying their fees that all residents must pay. Outsiders---different story.

I don't know that it's a serious issue or problem. If it was, I think the District would keep the golf staff there until dark.

[VT2TV]

The trail fee is only about 40 cents a day (quick head figure)---- can't imagine someone that wants to play golf being so "cheap" that they would fudge on paying their fees that all residents must pay. Outsiders---different story.

I don't know that it's a serious issue or problem. If it was, I think the District would keep the golf staff there until dark.


First of all..not directed specifically justjim
Some people ----NOT all, will do whatever they think they can get by with. I know that at least some of the starters are aware of the proplems, but as long as we don't say anything to anyone, nothing will change.

As far as being a serious problem or issue, who decides that?? I personally consider anyone who does not pay for the priviledges is one too many. Others on here don't seem to have a problem with outsiders using the things that we pay for. But once it gets started, and it HAS started, it will not just go away. So today, maybe 50 people who should not be using our pools, or our golf courses, or pickleball courts, or even the water classes are "stealing" from you and me by using our facilities. So nothing is done, and in a couple of months, it is 100 or so people who are not paying to be there. By now, some of the areas are starting to get crowded, but people thing maybe it is because of visitors or snow birds. Nothing gets said, and now the number is 300 because word has gotten around that no one from the Villages will make you leave. New residents move in, snow birds are here, visitors in for the holidays. Things are really crowded now, so a lot of the actual Villagers just stop going to the pools, pickleball courts, etc. because it is so crowded. And it winds up that most of the people enjoying the fruits of our amenities aren't even from the Villages, and they aren't paying anything. Just giving examples.

Now I know a ton of people will disagree with me, but all of this is what happened to the squares IMO. I have a lot of friends, and have talked to a lot of other Villagers who no longer go to the squares except for sometimes in the summers or whenever they have out of town company. We used to go all the time, but it just got so crowded, hard to find a seat, or even difficult to find a place to put our own chairs. Most people go less and less frequent because of the crowds after they have been here for a couple of years.

[redwitch]

Reality is that have always been some who snuck onto our golf courses, pools, etc. probably from at least the time TV crossed 441. Has the number really increased? From what I've heard and observed in the past 9 nine years, I don't think so. It really has seemed to stay about the same (or maybe these freeloaders spread themselves throughout TV so as not to be so obvious?).

As to not going to the squares, etc. because of crowding, I think for many it is simply that it is a BTDT type of thing. Most that have lived here over three years seem to no longer want to go to the squares -- they've found friends, etc. to do things with at each others' homes or to go off campus or whatever. Like most playgrounds, they get old after awhile.

[DonH57]

We have usually always been carded when using a sports pool and neighborhood pool as well as rec cent ers for club functions. I have usually always been carded at the starter shacks as well. I'm grateful they check me to make sure I 'm a resident.

[jimmy D]

always COMES back to the money or lets take the kids

[marlinguy]

Just as a reminder as I often forget myself, The TDC, (Tourist Development Committee of Sumter County) funds the entertainment at the squares. Sumter County tax $$$! Frankly, if I were a Sumter County resident living in places like Bushnell, etc I would be incensed that I was paying for Rocky and the Rollers, Uncle Bob's Rock Shop, Scooter etc to perform for US here. So, unless we Villagers want to take over the funding for the entertainment, those "outsiders" should have as much fun as we do watching the performers.

Thanks

[mulligan]

They do !! And the funding does NOT come from property tax money, it comes from tourist tax money (short term rental tax). I would say there are probably more short term rentals in TV than in Bushnell.

[quirky3]

Maybe the term should be "Golf Course Crashers" rather than "Golf Course Poachers".

The latter might be people that come on the course after hours, then hunt and kill the wildlife. Poor armadillos!

[rubicon]

First of all..not directed specifically justjim
Some people ----NOT all, will do whatever they think they can get by with. I know that at least some of the starters are aware of the proplems, but as long as we don't say anything to anyone, nothing will change.

As far as being a serious problem or issue, who decides that?? I personally consider anyone who does not pay for the priviledges is one too many. Others on here don't seem to have a problem with outsiders using the things that we pay for. But once it gets started, and it HAS started, it will not just go away. So today, maybe 50 people who should not be using our pools, or our golf courses, or pickleball courts, or even the water classes are "stealing" from you and me by using our facilities. So nothing is done, and in a couple of months, it is 100 or so people who are not paying to be there. By now, some of the areas are starting to get crowded, but people thing maybe it is because of visitors or snow birds. Nothing gets said, and now the number is 300 because word has gotten around that no one from the Villages will make you leave. New residents move in, snow birds are here, visitors in for the holidays. Things are really crowded now, so a lot of the actual Villagers just stop going to the pools, pickleball courts, etc. because it is so crowded. And it winds up that most of the people enjoying the fruits of our amenities aren't even from the Villages, and they aren't paying anything. Just giving examples.

Now I know a ton of people will disagree with me, but all of this is what happened to the squares IMO. I have a lot of friends, and have talked to a lot of other Villagers who no longer go to the squares except for sometimes in the summers or whenever they have out of town company. We used to go all the time, but it just got so crowded, hard to find a seat, or even difficult to find a place to put our own chairs. Most people go less and less frequent because of the crowds after they have been here for a couple of years.

VT2TV: spot on. It is sad that residents just seem to blink and deflate on so many issues here, issues that will negatively affect their investment

[Golfingnut]

VT2TV: spot on. It is sad that residents just seem to blink and deflate on so many issues here, issues that will negatively affect their investment

Yes, if it is a law, a rule or regulation statement, then ENFORCE IT or take it off the table. Rules not enforced give the ENTITLED the OK, while the rest of us follow the rules and miss out on these things. The ENTITLED should not have this unfair advantage.

[VT2TV]

Just as a reminder as I often forget myself, The TDC, (Tourist Development Committee of Sumter County) funds the entertainment at the squares. Sumter County tax $$$! Frankly, if I were a Sumter County resident living in places like Bushnell, etc I would be incensed that I was paying for Rocky and the Rollers, Uncle Bob's Rock Shop, Scooter etc to perform for US here. So, unless we Villagers want to take over the funding for the entertainment, those "outsiders" should have as much fun as we do watching the performers.

Thanks

They do !! And the funding does NOT come from property tax money, it comes from tourist tax money (short term rental tax). I would say there are probably more short term rentals in TV than in Bushnell.





Actually, I never mentioned that I think that non-villagers should stay away from the squares, just that it seems more and more that the people who attent the functions are not from TV. I would just as soon they stop having the functions at the squares in the evening, but can agree that some people seem to enjoy them. And if the funding is also provided by other areas , maybe it shouldn't be held here, but in a more neutral area.
But, I still contend that there is a significant number (and no, I don't have numbers) of people from outside the Villages who are using areas in TV that are not entitled to use, ie: the pools, golf courses after the starters leave, and even water classes. I have seen huge groups of people get out of vans and play shuffleball or bocce ball-people from middle aged adults to young kids-no grandparenty types around. And just with some human nature, if some one "gets by" with doing something, they tell others, and soon it multiplies. And so many thing have changed in the past 5 years-things that never seemed to be problems before, some how have become problems. Life changes and I doubt there is anyone who won't agree that people feel much more "entitled" to whatever they want whether they pay for it or not. Again, I know that there are those who won't agree, and will continue to deny that TV has changed, and we all need to be pro-active to try to keep it the same wonderful place we moved too.

[kidshelleen51]

I think it's wonderful that the grandparents take visiting kids out for a little golf and I really appreciate the fact they do it after hours when the course is not busy. I much prefer them to some of these privileged residents that need 3 hours top play 9 and never raked a sand trap in their life. And I "sneak" onto the courses all the time in the evenings as it's a great way to get a little practice in. Many of us so called poachers have paid our trail fees, bet you never thought of that. I am continually amazed at the small but vocal minority that act like old curmudgeons instead of enjoying the blessings they have here in the Villages. I understand the issues with outsiders in the pools but ranting about a little extra play on the exec courses is much ado about nothing.

[Bogie Shooter]

Just as a reminder as I often forget myself, The TDC, (Tourist Development Committee of Sumter County) funds the entertainment at the squares. Sumter County tax $$$! Frankly, if I were a Sumter County resident living in places like Bushnell, etc I would be incensed that I was paying for Rocky and the Rollers, Uncle Bob's Rock Shop, Scooter etc to perform for US here. So, unless we Villagers want to take over the funding for the entertainment, those "outsiders" should have as much fun as we do watching the performers.

Thanks

How does this relate to golf courses?

[Bogie Shooter]

Actually, I never mentioned that I think that non-villagers should stay away from the squares, just that it seems more and more that the people who attent the functions are not from TV. I would just as soon they stop having the functions at the squares in the evening, but can agree that some people seem to enjoy them. And if the funding is also provided by other areas , maybe it shouldn't be held here, but in a more neutral area.
But, I still contend that there is a significant number (and no, I don't have numbers) of people from outside the Villages who are using areas in TV that are not entitled to use, ie: the pools, golf courses after the starters leave, and even water classes. I have seen huge groups of people get out of vans and play shuffleball or bocce ball-people from middle aged adults to young kids-no grandparenty types around. And just with some human nature, if some one "gets by" with doing something, they tell others, and soon it multiplies. And so many thing have changed in the past 5 years-things that never seemed to be problems before, some how have become problems. Life changes and I doubt there is anyone who won't agree that people feel much more "entitled" to whatever they want whether they pay for it or not. Again, I know that there are those who won't agree, and will continue to deny that TV has changed, and we all need to be pro-active to try to keep it the same wonderful place we moved too.

Since you saw this..................to who's attention did you bring it to? You had a chance to stop it.................did you?
That's how you can be pro-active.

[annmarie]

We like to do that too! as you say it is cooler in the late afternoon, we pay our trail fees and also play during regular hours and look for late tee times for that reason. Not to avoid points.

[VT2TV]

Since you saw this..................to who's attention did you bring it to? You had a chance to stop it.................did you?
That's how you can be pro-active.


I have tried on more than 1 occasion to "stop things" to the point my friends just watch to see what will happen. I am always polite and non confrontational. I saw a golf cart full of 4 teens going the wrong way on the golf cart paths at dusk one day when we were exiting the course. They passed several carts with no one doing anything other than move aside so the kids could get by. I moved right in front of them and would not let them pass. I told them they has no reason to go onto the course at that time, it was dangerous with no lights, and they had no business there. I went up to 2 people walking around a large pond at Sweetgum. Golfers were also just ignoring them. I told them that they could be hit by golf balls and be hurt. They said they had permission to be there. I did not believe them, but turns out-after checking-they were "gator rangers" looking for large alligators. I went looking at the square to find anyone to deal with a very dangerous situation-needless to say that I found no one who had the authority to do anything. But the particular time, I was driving by the rec center on my way somewhere, and did not turn around. I have no problem with reporting incidents that look unusual to me. I am willing to do whatever I can to keep TV the wonderful place it can be. Not enough people are-and that is not directed at any specific people-it is just unfortunately the way it is. My problem is finding someone/anyone who has the title or authority to actually do anything about these situations.

[Barefoot]

Actually, I never mentioned that I think that non-villagers should stay away from the squares, just that it seems more and more that the people who attent the functions are not from TV. I would just as soon they stop having the functions at the squares in the evening, but can agree that some people seem to enjoy them. And if the funding is also provided by other areas , maybe it shouldn't be held here, but in a more neutral area.

I'm confused by your post. Are you aware that all three Town Squares are open to the public? The Squares entertainment is not funded by our amenities. TV residents do not own the Squares..

[VT2TV]

I'm confused by your post. Are you aware that all three Town Squares are open to the public? The Squares entertainment is not funded by our amenities. TV residents do not own the Squares..


Of course I am aware that the squares are open to the public. I never said that I thought people should not attend the squares, just that a lot of Villagers no longer went to the squares after they had lived here for a year or so, except for certain occasions. Someone brought up that since some of the funding came from around the region, and not just TV, he would be upset at the entertainment being just here at the Villages if he lived in another area. I suggested in that case maybe it would be more fair to all to have it in a more neutral area. The only areas I have problems with non -villagers using are our pools, golf courses, rec centers, pathways, etc.