Purpose of street easement

[kittygilchrist]

A previous thread, now closed, left questions for me about streetside easements for homeowners in TV.
(Please stick to facts rather than opinions or squabbles)
The questions are:

What is the distance of the easement (if that is the right term) from the street?
What is the purpose of the easement?
Does an easement mean that the homeowner no longer owns that property?
Does the use of the easement for purposes other than its stated purpose violate the homeowners right to own private property?


I would like to know once and for all the answers to these questions. If you answer, please cite your sources or credentials as an expert.

[skip0358]

If you look on your survey your can see the easements marked. They are usually done for utility runs, side walks, sewers, water lines, street lighting etc. They are not part of your property. At least that was the situation I ran into in New York.

[kittygilchrist]

The question is what is the purpose of the easement in TV and facts about whether the easement remains the property of the homeowner. I don't mean to be mean, but only facts, and evidence of the sort that would hold up in court, please.

[kittygilchrist]

The info below is in VCCD FAQs on community standards.
Relevant to this discussion as the site plan, not the survey, is the evidentiary document for set back and easements:


How will I know if I can add a room or a birdcage or extend a room to my home?
You will need to obtain a Site Plan which shows your Building Setback Line and any special easements you have on your property.

Why does a Site Plan need to be included with an ARC application?
The Site Plan shows your property lines, Building Setback Lines (BSL), and any special easements your property may have. Any modifications or additions need to be shown on the Site Plan and included with the application. The BSL refers to the distance from the front, back, or side of a lot beyond which construction or improvements may not extend.

Where Do I Get A Site Plan For My Property?
Site plans are obtainable at your County building department:

Town of Lady Lake Building Department
409 Fennel Boulevard
Lady Lake, FL 32159
352-751-1511

Lake County Building Department
315 West Main Street
Tavares, FL 32778
352-343-9653

Marion County Building Department
2710 E. Silver Springs Boulevard
Ocala, FL 34470
352-438-2400

The Villages Sumter County Service Center
7375 Powell Road
Wildwood, Florida 34785
352-689-4460

[kittygilchrist]

Setback as I interpret the document below, is the buildable part of the lot. In TV, I was told by Steve Mansfield (as an example of setback) that the patio walls being built in new sections by his company must be within the setback.

setback legal definition of setback. setback synonyms by the Free Online Law Dictionary. (http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/setback)

From the above site searching for "easement"....this definition....

easement n. the right to use the real property of another for a specific purpose. The easement is itself a real property interest, but legal title to the underlying land is retained by the original owner for all other purposes. Typical easements are for access to another property, (redundantly often stated "access and egress," since entry and exit are over the same path), for utility or sewer lines both under and above ground, use of spring water, entry to make repairs on a fence or slide area, drive cattle across, and other uses. Easements can be created by a deed to be recorded just like any real property interest.

[Warren Kiefer]

the question is what is the purpose of the easement in tv and facts about whether the easement remains the property of the homeowner. I don't mean to be mean, but only facts, and evidence of the sort that would hold up in court, please.

the set backs are not the homeowners property and are much greater distance than most homeowners realize. The homeowner cannoy build any permant type structures within the set back. Shrubs and other non permanent items are permitted but it must be understood that within the easement limits anything required to maintain drainage, utilities, etc is possible without the homeowners permission. I believe my set back distance is 32 feet from the edge of the street.

[BogeyBoy]

the set backs are not the homeowners property and are much greater distance than most homeowners realize. The homeowner cannoy build any permant type structures within the set back. Shrubs and other non permanent items are permitted but it must be understood that within the easement limits anything required to maintain drainage, utilities, etc is possible without the homeowners permission. I believe my set back distance is 32 feet from the edge of the street.

I disagree. A setback is the distance your building must be from the edge of your lot, but it is still your property. If both you and your neighbor built right to the edge of your property your homes would touch each other. Setbacks are established to prevent this from happening.

BTW, we are getting off topic - "street easement".

[Bogie Shooter]

Is Steve Mansfield an attorney?

[kittygilchrist]

Is Steve Mansfield an attorney?

I cited Steve as an expert in landscaping. You may choose not to consider him an expert. Here is his business site should you wish to ask more about his credentials in the field.

About Mansfield Landscaping | Mansfield Landscaping, LLC | Lake, Sumter, Marion, Orange, Osceola, Seminole County, FL (http://www.mansfieldlandscapingllc.com/company/about.html)

[kittygilchrist]

the set backs are not the homeowners property and are much greater distance than most homeowners realize. The homeowner cannoy build any permant type structures within the set back. Shrubs and other non permanent items are permitted but it must be understood that within the easement limits anything required to maintain drainage, utilities, etc is possible without the homeowners permission. I believe my set back distance is 32 feet from the edge of the street.

Warren, if I understand what you are saying, only my house is my property. I built house on virtually every inch within setback on this very expensive lot. What is the source of what you are stating?

[Taltarzac725]

FE108/FE108: Handbook of Florida Fence and Property Law: Easements and Rights of Way (http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/fe108)

This is an interesting publication on easements in Florida.

[SantaClaus]

A setback limits what the homeowner can do on his property, an easement grants another rights to some specific use of the homeowner's property. In either case, the property belongs to the homeowner, and he is responsible for the maintenance and safety of those portions of his property (excluding items added under easement rights). So, I am responsible for maintaining the grass between the sidewalk and the street (it is my property), but even though the sidewalk is on my property, I am not responsible for maintaining the sidewalk.

[Taltarzac725]

The Villages Regulations - EARTHSCAPES UNLIMITED Inc The Villages Landscaping (http://thevillageslandscape.webs.com/thevillagesregulations.htm)

This website has some useful information.

[kittygilchrist]

Definitions previously given with citations:

setback-the area withing property lines on which building is permitted
easement-a legally granted right to a specific entity for a specific purpose within the land owned by the property owner.

Here is the VCDD description of the specific entity and specific purpose for which easement to my property is granted. section 3:

http://www.districtgov.org/images/DeedRestiction/sumter/District%209/S9-210.pdf

an easement, by the way, does not give any rights to the person who has an easement to restrict what I do on my propery, unless it materially interferes with their right to perform the specific purpose they are allowed to achieve.

just for the purpose of clarity, an easement does not convey any right to anybody outside the property owner except as explicitly stated in the easement.

If anyone disagrees, please support your statements with documentation. I am sincerely trying to learn what I can and cannot do on my little piece of paradise.

[rayschic]

Easements are covered in your deed restrictions.
See page 4
http://www.districtgov.org/images/DeedRestiction/sumter/District%208/S8-167.pdf

This is an example. When you look at YOUR deed restrictions, the amount of easement may be different, depending on if you have a CYV, ranch, designer, etc.

Here's the deed restrictions for a CYV, much more restrictions on side easements.

http://www.districtgov.org/images/DeedRestiction/sumter/District%202/S2-207%20Escandido.pdf

[kstew43]

setbacks........suck....

we were already to sign on the dotted line for a new home in lake deaton, a great at ease on the corner of hillsboro and viola that backed up to court yards, would of been perfect....

Huge lot, we thought about adding a pool or at the very least a large hot tub, advancing the screen about 6 feet, and all the other things you imagine when buying a new home.

BUT WAIT....:22yikes:

Got the plot from the sales agent. You can't use that land and it was about 20 feet from the road. You have to MAINTAIN it, water and mowing, but you CAN NOT use it for a hot tub or such. All that land and I can only extend the bird cage 3 feet. GEEZE......

Thats a set back......be careful when you see that huge yard.....its really not yours:cryin2:

[e-flyer]

We have a large corner lot as well. It has a 13' easement, and a 20' setback beyond it, so in essence we have 33' of land that can only be used for grass, plants, or trees (no building within that area). My grip is that other corner lots in our Village have different setbacks, and those folks have patios or birdcages much closer to the road, so it doesn't seem to be equal for all.

[kstew43]

my thoughts exactly........ ....... I believe in due diligence.....especially when making a large $ purchase....

[njbchbum]

If you look on your survey your can see the easements marked. They are usually done for utility runs, side walks, sewers, water lines, street lighting etc. They are not part of your property. At least that was the situation I ran into in New York.

We own property in NJ, Maine and the villages and we have easements on each of those properties...that land IS part of our property in each of those states...we must maintain it AND pay taxes on it! In NJ where there is a 'public sidewalk' within the easement area we even are required to maintain that sidewalk - including snow removal and normal repair!

Here in the villages our deed restrictions state:
"4. EASEMENTS AND RIGHTS-OF-WAY:
4.1 Easements and rights-of-way in favor of the Developer reserved for the construction, installation and maintenance of utilities such as electric light lines, drains, water supply lines, telephone and telegraph lines or the like necessary or desirable for public health and welfare. Such easements and rights-of-way shall be confined to a 5 foot width along the rear and dividing lines of every building plot and along every street, road or highway fronting on said Lot."

We are responsible to maintain that land and pay taxes on it; therefore, we own it - it is part of our property. We have agreed to the 5' easement 'in favor of the developer' and only for the developer. Easements are granted to a specific party for a specific purpose. The 5' easement along our street-side property and other boundaries is for the developer and is for the stated purpose. No one else has any interest in that strip/right to use that strip other than the developer.

[downeaster]

A previous thread, now closed, left questions for me about streetside easements for homeowners in TV.
Does an easement mean that the homeowner no longer owns that property?

[QUOTE=SantaClaus;876177]A setback limits what the homeowner can do on his property, an easement grants another rights to some specific use of the homeowner's property. In either case, the property belongs to the homeowner, and he is responsible for the maintenance and safety of those portions of his property (excluding items added under easement rights). So, I am responsible for maintaining the grass between the sidewalk and the street (it is my property), but even though the sidewalk is on my property, I am not responsible for maintaining the sidewalk.

Is it your property or the County's property (right of way)?

In numerous "dog poop" threads there are those who say it is county property and the home owner has no right to stop them using it for their dog's pit stop. The opposing opinion is that it is the property owner's property and they have granted rights to utilities,etc. to use it.

See question #3 in OP's post in above edited quote.

[manaboutown]

A previous thread, now closed, left questions for me about streetside easements for homeowners in TV.
(Please stick to facts rather than opinions or squabbles)
The questions are:

What is the distance of the easement (if that is the right term) from the street?
What is the purpose of the easement?
Does an easement mean that the homeowner no longer owns that property?
Does the use of the easement for purposes other than its stated purpose violate the homeowners right to own private property?


I would like to know once and for all the answers to these questions. If you answer, please cite your sources or credentials as an expert.

Kitty, please check Wikipedia which comprehensively explains various types of easements.
Easement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easement)

Setbacks are another matter. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Setback_(land_use)

[perrjojo]

[quote=kittygilchrist;876126]A previous thread, now closed, left questions for me about streetside easements for homeowners in TV.
Does an easement mean that the homeowner no longer owns that property?



Is it your property or the County's property (right of way)?

In numerous "dog poop" threads there are those who say it is county property and the home owner has no right to stop them using it for their dog's pit stop. The opposing opinion is that it is the property owner's property and they have granted rights to utilities,etc. to use it.

See question #3 in OP's post in above edited quote.

It is YOUR PROPERTY but set backs and easement determine what you may do on that portion of your property. An example would be a utility easement...you plant shrubs on it...the utility needs to do repairs in that area...they have no obligation to replace your shrubs if they get destroyed. NO, that does not mean the general public has permission to enter that portion of your property, only those with the easement rights. Every home I have owned has setbacks and easements.

[jimbo2012]

Generally the setbacks are 10-13.5 feet front/back 5' on sides.

you must plant with an additional 2' set back with the above numbers, the 2' is the location of trunk or base of the plant, if it overhangs your neighbor later on they can cut off any overhanging branches as they wish.

Not to be confused with the building lot lines within it.

There are a few ways around some of the build lot lines, U can exceed the building lot lines by 2' in an overhang, but not at the base.

you can also put a slab in a bit bigger by 2', lastly a 4' x4' landing can exceed the build lot lines where a door is like exiting from your lanai.

I used an architect, submitted all to ARC. very straight forward.

Those of you that don't get ARC approval for planting are subject to having it removed.

Worse yet I see patio's and block walls built illegally, if a complaint is filed they will be required to rip it out.

So do it with approvals, if hiring any landscaper ask them to give you the ARC approval before any work is done or money is paid.

[Bruiser1]

The info below is in VCCD FAQs on community standards.
Relevant to this discussion as the site plan, not the survey, is the evidentiary document for set back and easements:


How will I know if I can add a room or a birdcage or extend a room to my home?
You will need to obtain a Site Plan which shows your Building Setback Line and any special easements you have on your property.

Why does a Site Plan need to be included with an ARC application?
The Site Plan shows your property lines, Building Setback Lines (BSL), and any special easements your property may have. Any modifications or additions need to be shown on the Site Plan and included with the application. The BSL refers to the distance from the front, back, or side of a lot beyond which construction or improvements may not extend.

Where Do I Get A Site Plan For My Property?
Site plans are obtainable at your County building department:

Town of Lady Lake Building Department
409 Fennel Boulevard
Lady Lake, FL 32159
352-751-1511

Lake County Building Department
315 West Main Street
Tavares, FL 32778
352-343-9653

Marion County Building Department
2710 E. Silver Springs Boulevard
Ocala, FL 34470
352-438-2400

The Villages Sumter County Service Center
7375 Powell Road
Wildwood, Florida 34785
352-689-4460


on your site plan you will see you property corners. The road right of way goes from the center of the road to your property corners on the front of your property. All though you maintain it (lawn care etc) it is for the purpose of roadway.

when the land is developed easements are granted to allow for utility and other purposes. Therefore the right to access that property for those purposes remains on the property (regardless if the property has changed hands )

[Carl in Tampa]

This is really simple once you get your plat map and purchase papers in hand.

The concepts are pretty much universal; only the local application of some rules may vary.

1. Property line - All of the property within these lines are yours.
2. Setback line - By purchase agreement, you cannot build a structure between the property line and the setback line. There may be other restrictions in your particular contract. The line may not be drawn on the plat map, but will be described in the settlement papers.
3. Easement line - A line on your property, usually in the back yard, which encompasses an area between the line and your property line which grants access to utility companies so that equipment may be maintained. The general public has no access. Your easement, combined with the easement of the person owning the property behind you, usually provides enough space for a service truck to be driven into the area.

SO, look at your plat map and closing papers to see where these lines are on your property. There is no generic answer.

Attached is a sketch of the concept. Note the inclusion of the portion of the front yard that is not on your property but which you are required by contract to maintain.

.

[Carl in Tampa]

... locked up in prison or a highrise in New York City?

Now, that's redundant.

:1rotfl: :1rotfl: :1rotfl:

[villagetinker]

To all the above, this is a very interesting thread, and I had or experienced most if not all of the questions, and to make matters more confusing, I got 2-3 DIFFERENT sets of answers depending on who I talked to. So here is what I did, I went to the ARC committee, and spoke to the 'head reviewer' and he explained what I could and could not do. I also pointed out with pictures where I thought there were transgressions, and it turns out the installations (mainly gardens and trees) were fine, once you understand the rules.

To make matters worse, my house has a road front and rear, so my restrictions are significantly different than those that have a house to the rear, which are different if there is a golf course to the rear.........

Good luck with your quest, but in my humble opinion, get a copy of your plot plan, and go to the ARC office and tell them what you would like to do, then go to your builder/landscaper, etc. to get detailed plans for approval.

[kstew43]

in our case we just assumed, large yard ect....in the looking stages, but when it came to money, I wanted a plot before I signed on the dotted line and once we saw the plot, we said, this is not the one..

my mother always said "theres an ass for every seat" and someone will not care how much the water bill will be for grass I can't even use and how much extra the lawn company will charge for the bigger lot.....and scoop that house right up

in my humble opinion, the hype for the villages is very motivating, and not thats it not wonderful and all, and I can't wait till I find the right lot and retire, its just that some people look at it with rose colored glasses and don't see the reality of it all until its to late. If you wait till you close and see the official plot from the city, you waited to late.

Get everything before you sign the paperwork, call insurance companys, check the county tax records for your homeowners taxes. Due Diligence is very important. Get it in writing, don't rely on your salesperson, they sell you and move on. verbal won't stand up in court. and don't beleive the salesman when he says hurry, the home won't be here tommorrow,.....heard that lots....please......, if it sells before you buy it was fate and meant to be.

[Warren Kiefer]

I disagree. A setback is the distance your building must be from the edge of your lot, but it is still your property. If both you and your neighbor built right to the edge of your property your homes would touch each other. Setbacks are established to prevent this from happening.

BTW, we are getting off topic - "street easement".

You are trying to make the words "set back" a legal term. They are not. In my comment I clearly used the legal term "easement".. The original post spoke of street side easements and had nothing to do with the distances between homes. Any requirement that a certain distance must be maintained between structures of any kind is commonly called a set back.:BigApplause:

[kittygilchrist]

You are trying to make the words "set back" a legal term. They are not. In my comment I clearly used the legal term "easement".. The original post spoke of street side easements and had nothing to do with the distances between homes. Any requirement that a certain distance must be maintained between structures of any kind is commonly called a set back.:BigApplause:

I learned the word setback and used the definition from an online legal dictionary. I know little about this and have carefully relied on the anchor of resources. Setback as I get it, means the entire perimeter of buildable property, setback from street, rear and sides.

If as you say, the term is only a commonly used term and one with no legal meaning, for me it has no relevance to the discussion. I don't care what is commonly used or as I said in the OP, about opinions.

If I am missing something in reading your posts, maybe somebody can fill in the gaps. it seems to me that your use of terms has no connection with legal definitions. correct me, anybody? with resources?

[kittygilchrist]

To all the above, this is a very interesting thread, and I had or experienced most if not all of the questions, and to make matters more confusing, I got 2-3 DIFFERENT sets of answers depending on who I talked to. So here is what I did, I went to the ARC committee, and spoke to the 'head reviewer' and he explained what I could and could not do. I also pointed out with pictures where I thought there were transgressions, and it turns out the installations (mainly gardens and trees) were fine, once you understand the rules.

To make matters worse, my house has a road front and rear, so my restrictions are significantly different than those that have a house to the rear, which are different if there is a golf course to the rear.........

Good luck with your quest, but in my humble opinion, get a copy of your plot plan, and go to the ARC office and tell them what you would like to do, then go to your builder/landscaper, etc. to get detailed plans for approval.

Thank you. that is wise, experienced, horses' mouth advice. You've been there and done that. thanks.

[kittygilchrist]

This is really simple once you get your plat map and purchase papers in hand.

The concepts are pretty much universal; only the local application of some rules may vary.

1. Property line - All of the property within these lines are yours.
2. Setback line - By purchase agreement, you cannot build a structure between the property line and the setback line. There may be other restrictions in your particular contract. The line may not be drawn on the plat map, but will be described in the settlement papers.
3. Easement line - A line on your property, usually in the back yard, which encompasses an area between the line and your property line which grants access to utility companies so that equipment may be maintained. The general public has no access. Your easement, combined with the easement of the person owning the property behind you, usually provides enough space for a service truck to be driven into the area.

SO, look at your plat map and closing papers to see where these lines are on your property. There is no generic answer.

Attached is a sketch of the concept. Note the inclusion of the portion of the front yard that is not on your property but which you are required by contract to maintain.

.
Carl, that looks exactly like what my research indicated. thanks,
Kitty

[livsea2]

As a retired utility engineer I can say this about utility easments which are included on all deeds for at least the last fifty years in all PUD (Planned unit developments) such as the Villages. Every lot, with extremely rare exceptions, have a ten foot utility easement on all four propery lines in. There are also "extra" easements on some key lots within the development. I happen to have an "extra" five foot extention to my easement on the west side of my lot.
Technically speaking you cannot plant, place, nor improve in any way on tis land that yes you own. HOWEVER, in almost 40 years experience in sevral states I can tell you no one will ever stop you nor make you remove any plant, statues, tree, or even a driveway you would place in said easement. But the caveat is the utility, should they need to utilize the easment or right of way, they are not responsible for the repair or replacement of anything damaged that lies within the easement. Alos if there is damage to any utility equipment or property by say a tree planted in the easement, the property owner is responsible to pay a damage claim and I have seen some astronomical bills in my career....usually paid by homeowners insurance.

[kittygilchrist]

As a retired utility engineer I can say this about utility easments which are included on all deeds for at least the last fifty years in all PUD (Planned unit developments) such as the Villages. Every lot, with extremely rare exceptions, have a ten foot utility easement on all four propery lines in. There are also "extra" easements on some key lots within the development. I happen to have an "extra" five foot extention to my easement on the west side of my lot.
Technically speaking you cannot plant, place, nor improve in any way on tis land that yes you own. HOWEVER, in almost 40 years experience in sevral states I can tell you no one will ever stop you nor make you remove any plant, statues, tree, or even a driveway you would place in said easement. But the caveat is the utility, should they need to utilize the easment or right of way, they are not responsible for the repair or replacement of anything damaged that lies within the easement. Alos if there is damage to any utility equipment or property by say a tree planted in the easement, the property owner is responsible to pay a damage claim and I have seen some astronomical bills in my career....usually paid by homeowners insurance.
valuable, info from an expert. thanks.

[kittygilchrist]

As a retired utility engineer I can say this about utility easments which are included on all deeds for at least the last fifty years in all PUD (Planned unit developments) such as the Villages. Every lot, with extremely rare exceptions, have a ten foot utility easement on all four propery lines in. There are also "extra" easements on some key lots within the development. I happen to have an "extra" five foot extention to my easement on the west side of my lot.
Technically speaking you cannot plant, place, nor improve in any way on tis land that yes you own. HOWEVER, in almost 40 years experience in sevral states I can tell you no one will ever stop you nor make you remove any plant, statues, tree, or even a driveway you would place in said easement. But the caveat is the utility, should they need to utilize the easment or right of way, they are not responsible for the repair or replacement of anything damaged that lies within the easement. Alos if there is damage to any utility equipment or property by say a tree planted in the easement, the property owner is responsible to pay a damage claim and I have seen some astronomical bills in my career....usually paid by homeowners insurance.

previous totv threads indicate that many people think an easement gives the public rights to the property, specifically for toileting dogs. Does the streetside easement extend to allowing public access, regardless of the purpose of the person or pet?

[downeaster]

It has been suggested "look at your plat". So, I looked at my plat as well as the plat of my area on the County GIS site.
On my plat it clearly shows a "Special Easement" on my rear property line and utility boxes are shown in that easement.
It also shows a "Building Set Back Line" around my property. This indicates to me I can not build beyond that line.
In the front it shows the extent of my property line and it does not extend to the street. My property line is about 13' from the street line. It is not marked as an easement so I assume that 13' is part of the County's 50' right of way as it is not marked as an easement.
The County plat shows the right of way as being 13' in on the grassed area in front of my property. It does not identify the "Special Easement" in the rear.
Neither plat shows any line denoting the 2 foot line beyond which there can be no trees planted. I do not plan to plant any trees whether or not there is such rule so it is a mute point.
There has been a lot of misinformation in this thread. My post is not to correct any erroneous info but to explain my interpretation of the information contained on my plats. Do your own research via the ARC and County codes before making any changes including planting (or removing) trees.

[Carl in Tampa]

previous totv threads indicate that many people think an easement gives the public rights to the property, specifically for toileting dogs. Does the streetside easement extend to allowing public access, regardless of the purpose of the person or pet?

Kitty, the public has no right of access to any utilities easement on your property here in TV.

What does give the public the right to walk on a portion of "your" front yard is that it is not yours.

Again, look at your plat map and you will see that your property line does not extend to the street.

Depending upon what stage of development a tract of land has reached, the property between your property line and the street may belong to the Developer, the CDD or the County. In most cases in Florida there is no CDD, so when the Developer is ready to terminate his involvement, the property is turned over the the County in which the property is located.

No matter which of these entities owns the property, it is not yours to order people to stay off of.

--------------------

Please understand that when your front property line does not extend to the edge of the street, that area between your property line and the street is not an easement on your property.

Look at your plat map. I'm confident you will find that your front property line does not extend to the street edge.

[Carl in Tampa]

It has been suggested "look at your plat". So, I looked at my plat as well as the plat of my area on the County GIS site.
On my plat it clearly shows a "Special Easement" on my rear property line and utility boxes are shown in that easement.
It also shows a "Building Set Back Line" around my property. This indicates to me I can not build beyond that line.
In the front it shows the extent of my property line and it does not extend to the street. My property line is about 13' from the street line. It is not marked as an easement so I assume that 13' is part of the County's 50' right of way as it is not marked as an easement.
The County plat shows the right of way as being 13' in on the grassed area in front of my property. It does not identify the "Special Easement" in the rear.
Neither plat shows any line denoting the 2 foot line beyond which there can be no trees planted. I do not plan to plant any trees whether or not there is such rule so it is a mute point.
There has been a lot of misinformation in this thread. My post is not to correct any erroneous info but to explain my interpretation of the information contained on my plats. Do your own research via the ARC and County codes before making any changes including planting (or removing) trees.

:mademyday: :agree: :a040:

I agree. "Look at your plat map" is the answer.

.

[perrjojo]

Kitty, I am sincerely wondering about the intent of your post. Do you want to do something on your property that some entity has said cannot be done? Is someone "trespassing" on your property? If we knew the intent of your question it might be easier to give an answer. I really don't think the answer is here on TOTV. The answer will come from whatever authority can address your specific delimea.

[kittygilchrist]

Kitty, I am sincerely wondering about the intent of your post. Do you want to do something on your property that some entity has said cannot be done? Is someone "trespassing" on your property? If we knew the intent of your question it might be easier to give an answer. I really don't think the answer is here on TOTV. The answer will come from whatever authority can address your specific delimea.

Perrjojo, I don't know what is and isn't my property, after all this, I'm more confused than ever. I want to plan a landscape, if possible with a stacked wall, and to xeriscape, extending plant cultivation or hardscape over as much of what's now turf as possible.
The more I learn the less I know what trespassing is, and yes, people come on property I maintain in the front and rear a dozen times a day, up to 15 feet into the yard, all of whom are there for their own personal purposes, not vendors, and not enacting purposes of an easement.

[perrjojo]

Perrjojo, I don't know what is and isn't my property, after all this, I'm more confused than ever. I want to plan a landscape, if possible with a stacked wall, and to xeriscape, extending plant cultivation or hardscape over as much of what's now turf as possible.
The more I learn the less I know what trespassing is, and yes, people come on property I maintain in the front and rear a dozen times a day, up to 15 feet into the yard, all of whom are there for their own personal purposes, not vendors, and not enacting purposes of an easement.
What is and is not your property is pretty much the same as anywhere you have lived. For landscaping, submit your plan to ARC and there will be no question as to whether or not it is permissible. As far as your back yard goes, no one should be there unless they are prividgeled to do so by any easement you have on your property.... Same goes for front yard but of course there will be neighbors who may walk on your grass. It is up to you whether or not you want to make an issue of it. Again, I would contact the ARC for any concerns you may have. On this venue you will only get opinions not the facts of how it works here in TV.

[perrjojo]

Kitty, btw, we live in a CYV and the easements really get crazy. Half of my side yard and driveway actually belong to my neighbor but I am entitleted to use it and must maintain it. On the other side, half of my neighbors yard is within my fenced wall and their drive way is on my property. It's all a little weird and new to me but seems to work out. Just get the facts for your specific plot of land.

[kittygilchrist]

Kitty, the public has no right of access to any utilities easement on your property here in TV.

What does give the public the right to walk on a portion of "your" front yard is that it is not yours.

Again, look at your plat map and you will see that your property line does not extend to the street.

Depending upon what stage of development a tract of land has reached, the property between your property line and the street may belong to the Developer, the CDD or the County. In most cases in Florida there is no CDD, so when the Developer is ready to terminate his involvement, the property is turned over the the County in which the property is located.

No matter which of these entities owns the property, it is not yours to order people to stay off of.

--------------------

Please understand that when your front property line does not extend to the edge of the street, that area between your property line and the street is not an easement on your property.

Look at your plat map. I'm confident you will find that your front property line does not extend to the street edge.


Is this my plat map?

edited to remove map for privacy...got what I needed to know. thanks Carl.

[Carl in Tampa]

What is and is not your property is pretty much the same as anywhere you have lived. For landscaping, submit your plan to ARC and there will be no question as to whether or not it is permissible. As far as your back yard goes, no one should be there unless they are prividgeled to do so by any easement you have on your property.... Same goes for front yard but of course there will be neighbors who may walk on your grass. It is up to you whether or not you want to make an issue of it. Again, I would contact the ARC for any concerns you may have. On this venue you will only get opinions not the facts of how it works here in TV.

Kudos to perrjojo for cutting through to the purpose of Kitty's inquiry.

The advice given is correct. Contact the ARC to find out what you may do with your landscape. In many places, and surely here, a certain percentage of your front lawn must be in sod. Hardscaping, xeriscaping and succulent-scaping doesn't appear to be the way to go in most residential neighborhoods.

One minor quibble with the post above. People are permitted to walk in that portion of "your" front yard that is between your property line and the street. It isn't yours!

And for thousands of us who live with our house backing up to a street it is likely that the same goes for our back yards. Again, check your personal plat map.

.

[Carl in Tampa]

Is this my plat map?

That is a plat map of the type I've been discussing. If you look closely you will see a 15 foot area between the front of your property and the street edge. This is not your property although you are required to maintain it.

People can walk on it without your permission.

As far as plantings go, check with the ARC about what landscaping you may do.

Good luck.

.

[kittygilchrist]

That is a plat map of the type I've been discussing. If you look closely you will see a 15 foot area between the front of your property and the street edge. This is not your property although you are required to maintain it.

People can walk on it without your permission.

As far as plantings go, check with the ARC about what landscaping you may do.

Good luck.

.

Carl, finally, we're getting somewhere.
Personally, I resent having the right to stand 15 feet up in people's yards where they do not own but have to maintain while my dog destroys their turf with urine. That's just wrong.
thanks to all for the feedback...and if there is more bring it on.

I will be checking with arc before my landscaping project, which has shrunk considerably based on info gotten here.

by the way, people are landscaping all over this area well into the 15 foot not your property but maintain it zone.

[gustavo]

Carl, finally, we're getting somewhere.
...by the way, people are landscaping all over this area well into the 15 foot not your property but maintain it zone.

You can landscape but if they decide to widen the road, it will disappear.

[8notes]

Kudos to perrjojo for cutting through to the purpose of Kitty's inquiry.

The advice given is correct. Contact the ARC to find out what you may do with your landscape. In many places, and surely here, a certain percentage of your front lawn must be in sod. Hardscaping, xeriscaping and succulent-scaping doesn't appear to be the way to go in most residential neighborhoods.

One minor quibble with the post above. People are permitted to walk in that portion of "your" front yard that is between your property line and the street. It isn't yours!

And for thousands of us who live with our house backing up to a street it is likely that the same goes for our back yards. Again, check your personal plat map.

.

Carl, I'm not sure the requirement about a certain percentage of lawn being in sod, is in effect any more. In 2008 Florida legislature enacted the Florida Water Bill, which allows homeowners to convert their lawns to Florida friendly landscaping, and supersedes any homeowner association rules. The state is encouraging homeowners to change from sod to options such as xeriscaping, as it will cut watering costs and be friendlier to the environment. New Florida landscaping law supersedes homeowner association rules | members.jacksonville.com (http://jacksonville.com/community/shorelines/2010-01-30/story/new_florida_landscaping_law_supersedes_homeowner_a ssociation__0)

[kittygilchrist]

Carl, I'm not sure the requirement about a certain percentage of lawn being in sod, is in effect any more. In 2008 Florida legislature enacted the Florida Water Bill, which allows homeowners to convert their lawns to Florida friendly landscaping, and supersedes any homeowner association rules. The state is encouraging homeowners to change from sod to options such as xeriscaping, as it will cut watering costs and be friendlier to the environment. New Florida landscaping law supersedes homeowner association rules | members.jacksonville.com (http://jacksonville.com/community/shorelines/2010-01-30/story/new_florida_landscaping_law_supersedes_homeowner_a ssociation__0)

My deed restriction in section 2.7 says such landscaping is encouraged, but if visible from golf course (rear of my house) and street, must be approved. I had forgotten about the change in law. Damn the torpedoes, I'm back on track.

[8notes]

Keep us posted on how you make out, and pictures please!

[kittygilchrist]

Keep us posted on how you make out, and pictures please!

8 notes, you make me want to be the poster child for xeriscaping.
video
WaterMatters Multimedia (http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/video/multimedia/index.php?yuurl=htTJcBhgtVE)

[Carl in Tampa]

Carl, I'm not sure the requirement about a certain percentage of lawn being in sod, is in effect any more. In 2008 Florida legislature enacted the Florida Water Bill, which allows homeowners to convert their lawns to Florida friendly landscaping, and supersedes any homeowner association rules. The state is encouraging homeowners to change from sod to options such as xeriscaping, as it will cut watering costs and be friendlier to the environment. New Florida landscaping law supersedes homeowner association rules | members.jacksonville.com (http://jacksonville.com/community/shorelines/2010-01-30/story/new_florida_landscaping_law_supersedes_homeowner_a ssociation__0)

I'm glad to hear it. Prior to that time I had more than one letter to the editor of the Tampa Tribune published in which I advocated a state law forbidding HOAs from requiring a sod lawn.

Due to being busy with the lingering illness and subsequent loss of my wife during the time frame that you mention, I was unaware of the law change,

Actually, I was on thin ice with my Tampa HOA due to the fact that I had expanded my "flower beds" to the point that only about 60% of my lawn was sod. Some of the Native Florida xeriscape plants that I used looked very much like weeds to my neighbors.

I would be interested in the experience that anyone has in working with the ARB on the question of xeriscaping. Being on the end of a cul-de-sac with no one behind us, we have an enormous back lawn. I'd love to xeriscape some of it to cut down on need for watering the lawn.

[jimbo2012]

Carl, I'm not sure the requirement about a certain percentage of lawn being in sod, is in effect any more. In 2008 Florida legislature enacted the Florida Water Bill, which allows homeowners to convert their lawns to Florida friendly landscaping, and supersedes any homeowner association rules. The state is encouraging homeowners to change from sod to options such as xeriscaping, as it will cut watering costs and be friendlier to the environment. New Florida landscaping law supersedes homeowner association rules | members.jacksonville.com (http://jacksonville.com/community/shorelines/2010-01-30/story/new_florida_landscaping_law_supersedes_homeowner_a ssociation__0)

Just so you know TV says they do not abide by state law, been there done that............and I pushed the issue.

They don't care it will not be permitted.

[Indydealmaker]

Just so you know TV says they do not abide by state law, been there done that............and I pushed the issue.

They don't care it will not be permitted.

Might have something to do with the fact that the sodded area restrictions here are part of the Deed Restrictions and not just a simple "rule" by a HOA.

Our deed restrictions in Bonita require 51% of the lawn area to be sodded if it is in sight of the roadway.

[mickey100]

The law is the law. The legislation is designed, from what I read, to supersede covenants, which are deed restrictions. If it was me, and I wanted to take out sod and put in more xeriscaping, I'd write a letter or send an email to my legislator to see if The Villages is within its rights in prohibiting such an action. They would either answer you directly or point you in the right direction to the proper State agency who could inform you of your rights and how best to proceed. It looks like the law is fairly new, and there is not a lot of legal precedent, so maybe The Villages is feeling its way along, as are other communities throughout the state.

[blueash]

Florida Community Association Journal (http://www.flcaj.com/content.cfm?articleID=856)

I post this as it claims that xeriscaping is not Florida Friendly landscaping and has a great number of references as to what landscape provisions and goals are being regulated. Here is the law:

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0373/Sections/0373.185.html)

“Florida-friendly landscaping” means quality landscapes that conserve water, protect the environment, are adaptable to local conditions, and are drought tolerant. The principles of such landscaping include planting the right plant in the right place, efficient watering, appropriate fertilization, mulching, attraction of wildlife, responsible management of yard pests, recycling yard waste, reduction of stormwater runoff, and waterfront protection. Additional components include practices such as landscape planning and design, soil analysis, the appropriate use of solid waste compost, minimizing the use of irrigation, and proper maintenance."

[kittygilchrist]

Just so you know TV says they do not abide by state law, been there done that............and I pushed the issue.

They don't care it will not be permitted.

suggest you contact Lloyd Singleton for advice. If your plan meets UF standards, you may find him to be an advocate with powers that be:
Sumter County Extension Office ? Solutions for Your Life - UF Institute of Food and Agricultural Sciences (http://sumter.ifas.ufl.edu/about_us.shtml)

[Indydealmaker]

Far superceding Federal or State Laws is the law of Perception is Reality...If it looks like a weed, it IS a weed.

Also don't forget in The Villages (at least south of 466) irrigation water is supplied by storm water runoff that ends up in drainage lagoons and cycles back to your yard nurturing green plants that feast on CO2.

[Jayhawk]

I will never understand people who spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to buy into a community, only to push the envelope at every turn to try and circumvent the rules, regulations, and policies of the same community.

I guess for some, if there is nothing to complain about, life just isn't challenging.

[Lovey2]

previous totv threads indicate that many people think an easement gives the public rights to the property, specifically for toileting dogs. Does the streetside easement extend to allowing public access, regardless of the purpose of the person or pet?

Kitty, I was told this by a neighbor in "The Responsible Dog Owners" club. They told me the front of my lawn is NOT mine and they can walk and toilet their dogs there. I have let it go, because my sign that asks them "please keep dogs off grass" seems to be working. If and when it becomes an issue, I'll certainly revisit this. For now, they seem to be respectful of our wishes, and I appreciate their consideration.

[birdawg]

Kitty, I was told this by a neighbor in "The Responsible Dog Owners" club. They told me the front of my lawn is NOT mine and they can walk and toilet their dogs there. I have let it go, because my sign that asks them "please keep dogs off grass" seems to be working. If and when it becomes an issue, I'll certainly revisit this. For now, they seem to be respectful of our wishes, and I appreciate their consideration.

If they told me that I would be parking my golf cart on their lawn and driving my car across their lawn

[TheVillageChicken]

I must live in the only neighborhood without an easement/right of way along the front of my property.

Here are copies of the wording in all the deed restriction docs for every neighborhood in Marion County except mine (the bigger picture) and the wording in mine (smaller pic.) Mine omits the 10 foot along the street.

[Indydealmaker]

Kitty, I was told this by a neighbor in "The Responsible Dog Owners" club. They told me the front of my lawn is NOT mine and they can walk and toilet their dogs there. I have let it go, because my sign that asks them "please keep dogs off grass" seems to be working. If and when it becomes an issue, I'll certainly revisit this. For now, they seem to be respectful of our wishes, and I appreciate their consideration.

They are wrong an easement is for specific purposes only. It does not mean that the property is not yours. An easement sits on top of private property.

[Carl in Tampa]

I must live in the only neighborhood without an easement/right of way along the front of my property.

Here are copies of the wording in all the deed restriction docs for every neighborhood in Marion County except mine (the bigger picture) and the wording in mine (smaller pic.) Mine omits the 10 foot along the street.

No, it's just that a lot of people fail to understand that they are using the wrong term when they speak of easements along the front of their property affecting whether or not people can walk on their lawn.

Easements are generally along the rear and sides of property.

The reason that there is a "public" area in the front yard is because the property line does not extend to the edge of the street. The homeowners do not own this portion of the lawn although they are required to maintain it.

I've said it over and over --- look at your plat map.

It's not easements that let people walk on your front lawn. It's the fact that some of the area nearest the street is not yours.

[Indydealmaker]

No, it's just that a lot of people fail to understand that they are using the wrong term when they speak of easements along the front of their property affecting whether or not people can walk on their lawn.

Easements are generally along the rear and sides of property.

The reason that there is a "public" area in the front yard is because the property line does not extend to the edge of the street. The homeowners do not own this portion of the lawn although they are required to maintain it.

I've said it over and over --- look at your plat map.

It's not easements that let people walk on your front lawn. It's the fact that some of the area nearest the street is not yours.

Carl, I am now confused. My deed restrictions call for a ten foot "easement" along the front line. This easement belongs to the developer.

My site plan appears to show the lot ending 13 feet short of the street.

Who DOES own that thirteen feet? The county? It is not logical that the developer owns it. Why would he need an easement over his own property?

I don't think that the CDD can legally own it without maintaining it and there is no allowance for that in the deed.

There is something missing in this equation. According to the site plan, a good chunk of my driveway in on property that I do not own. I am beginning to have some cracks. I wonder who I should call to get those fixed?

[kittygilchrist]

Steven, my plan shows 15 feet from street to lot, and the front easement in deed restriction is 10 feet. If you get any answers, share.

[dewilson58]

This has been a long painful thread.

:loco::loco::loco:

[kittygilchrist]

This has been a long painful thread.

:loco::loco::loco:

Hey, we're trying to get to the bottom of what we thought we owned and don't.
This is important stuff. Stay awake!:p

[dewilson58]

Hey, we're trying to get to the bottom of what we thought we owned and don't.
This is important stuff. Stay awake!:p

Yes Mama. I'll get a cup of coffee.

:pray:

[kittygilchrist]

Just so you know TV says they do not abide by state law, been there done that............and I pushed the issue.

They don't care it will not be permitted.

JimBOB, exactly what does your deed restriction say about landscaping?
section 2.7 in mine says to keep the same quantity of plants, but it's ok to use more drought resistant plants than in the original landscaping. ONLY IF you plant that water conserving stuff in visual sight from golf course or street do you need approval. I think this is legalese for the new law. Nothing there about percentage of turf.

I can't find anywhere that in general terms it says go to the ARC with your landscaping plan.

Section 2.18 says you need developer approval IF you are planting something that may affect adjacent property owners. Whether to ask first calls for reasonable man judgment, I'd say.

?????

[kittygilchrist]

If they told me that I would be parking my golf cart on their lawn and driving my car across their lawn

Hey, I just learned I don't own 15 feet in front of my house. You could park a mack truck out there. Really, what are the property rights for that area???

[Carl in Tampa]

Carl, I am now confused. My deed restrictions call for a ten foot "easement" along the front line. This easement belongs to the developer.

My site plan appears to show the lot ending 13 feet short of the street.

Who DOES own that thirteen feet? The county? It is not logical that the developer owns it. Why would he need an easement over his own property?

I don't think that the CDD can legally own it without maintaining it and there is no allowance for that in the deed.

There is something missing in this equation. According to the site plan, a good chunk of my driveway in on property that I do not own. I am beginning to have some cracks. I wonder who I should call to get those fixed?

There may be, but need not be, an easement along the front of a piece of property. Easements are usually, but not necessarily, along the back of the property. There are also usually easements along the edge of the property abutting the neighbors property, which will also have an easement. All these easements are to facilitate getting gas, water, electricity, cable service, etc. into your house.

The utility easements are not available to the public for their use.

There may be an easement along the front of your property, but this is not the justification for the public walking on "your" lawn.

The fact is (as you note) that your front property line does not extend to the edge of the street. When a developer plats a new development, he retains ownership of the area from the front property line to the street (and the street) so that he may put in utilities before the utility companies become involved. Then, because at some point the developer wants to withdraw, he conveys ownership of that property to the County.

If, in your case the easement is in the front it may be that it was impractical to put the easement in the back. An example of this would be houses that back directly on a multi-modal path along Buena Vista. You will see houses that have birdcages built right up to the wooden fence that is probably the property line. There is no space for a back easement on those lots.

As I often say.........check your individual plat map.

The part that seems to trouble most people is that they are responsible for properly maintaining the strip of property from their front property line to the street and they cannot charge people with trespassing if they walk on it.

I can't answer your question about imperfections in your driveway that is not on your property. It may be that maintaining your driveway is in the same category as maintaining your lawn---you have to do it even though it is not on your property. See what your documents say.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, down in Tampa my front sidewalk suffered major upheaval from oak tree roots and the County came in and repaired the sidewalk because my property line ended on the house side of the sidewalk.

But, my only point, reaching back to my first entry in this discussion is that property lines do not extend to the edge of the street. The area from the property line to the street (usually 10 or 15 feet) is available to the public. Not because it is an easement, but because it does not belong to the property owner.

-----------

Incidentally, when the developer proffers the property, including the paved roads, to the county, the county is not obligated to accept the offer. The offered property must be up to county standards for the county to accept ownership.

My church in Tampa offered the county several hundred yards of paved roadway to be a connector between a dead end street and a major highway. The offer was initially refused because the very expensive and ornate street lights we had installed were too close to the road. We had to remove them all before the roadway was accepted.

[Carl in Tampa]

If they told me that I would be parking my golf cart on their lawn and driving my car across their lawn

Please reconsider your response.

Renting a well-fed and well-watered horse for an afternoon stroll on their lawn might be more satisfying.

[kittygilchrist]

Guys, should I send this to VCDD?



My plat map indicates I do not own 15 plus feet from street to lot. TV has a 10 foot easement.

If I could learn on whose property the easement rests, I would be appreciative.
What rights and responsibilities do I have with regard to that rather large section of frontage?

Example of rights questions:
Right to install driveway pavers in the appropriate driveway area, but 15 feet of which is not my property?
Rights of other persons to inhabit that area who are there without permission of property owner?
Rights of other persons to park on the turf or driveway that does not belong to property owner?
Right to landscape or hardscape within the 15 foot area?

[Warren Kiefer]

Warren, if I understand what you are saying, only my house is my property. I built house on virtually every inch within setback on this very expensive lot. What is the source of what you are stating?

My home is also on the exact easement line (from the street). Actually it is the house eave that is on the line. I have a plan site that shows the easement lines and the location of my home. I was also invbolved in a issue regarding a neighbor who asked the ARC for a one foot exemption for a pool enclosure wall. My source is my location plans. I assumed that every person building a home in the Villages has such a plan.

[Carl in Tampa]

Hey, I just learned I don't own 15 feet in front of my house. You could park a mac truck out there. Really, what are the property rights for that area???


Now THERE is a question that might profitably be addressed to the VCDD.

It wouldn't help to ask the Sheriff because the response will be "It's a Civil matter, not Criminal." (I used to give this answer a lot.)

[Warren Kiefer]

I must live in the only neighborhood without an easement/right of way along the front of my property.

Here are copies of the wording in all the deed restriction docs for every neighborhood in Marion County except mine (the bigger picture) and the wording in mine (smaller pic.) Mine omits the 10 foot along the street.

It appears you are right. But keep in mind Right Of Ways are independent of easements. I think it safe to say that every stret and road has a ROW distance.

[Warren Kiefer]

A setback limits what the homeowner can do on his property, an easement grants another rights to some specific use of the homeowner's property. In either case, the property belongs to the homeowner, and he is responsible for the maintenance and safety of those portions of his property (excluding items added under easement rights). So, I am responsible for maintaining the grass between the sidewalk and the street (it is my property), but even though the sidewalk is on my property, I am not responsible for maintaining the sidewalk.

How much do you think it costs you to irrigate these areas, including the right of way which you DO NOT own.

[Warren Kiefer]

Definitions previously given with citations:

setback-the area withing property lines on which building is permitted
easement-a legally granted right to a specific entity for a specific purpose within the land owned by the property owner.

Here is the VCDD description of the specific entity and specific purpose for which easement to my property is granted. section 3:

http://www.districtgov.org/images/DeedRestiction/sumter/District%209/S9-210.pdf

an easement, by the way, does not give any rights to the person who has an easement to restrict what I do on my propery, unless it materially interferes with their right to perform the specific purpose they are allowed to achieve.

just for the purpose of clarity, an easement does not convey any right to anybody outside the property owner except as explicitly stated in the easement.

If anyone disagrees, please support your statements with documentation. I am sincerely trying to learn what I can and cannot do on my little piece of paradise.

The easement actually does restrict what the property owner is allowed to do. The property owner cannot erect any permanent structures within the easement limits.

[Bonanza]

I will never understand people who spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to buy into a community, only to push the envelope at every turn to try and circumvent the rules, regulations, and policies of the same community.

I guess for some, if there is nothing to complain about, life just isn't challenging.

Rules, regulatons, by-laws, or whatever else you want to call them, are all written before one house is ever built within a community. They are usually taken from a compilation of other HOA documents and there are specific attorneys who often write them. Our documents are much more involved because the developer rules here and it is either his way or the highway.

However, having been in real estate for 30 years and been involved with many associations, I have never known an assocation that did not make changes to their documents, as the years went by. The proper word is "updating" and all documents need to have this done periodically.

It is not unusual for a homeowner to question or want to make a change that is not within the docs because, frankly, many of the rules are archaic and some never even made sense when they were created. Many times the rules simply have to do with the creator's ego.

I think your reference of people "pushing the envelope" to "curcumvent the rules" is a little exaggerated. Homeowners just want to make some changes to make their property reflect their taste, even though it may not be good taste in someone else's eyes. That's why we have the ARC.

[8notes]

Florida Community Association Journal (http://www.flcaj.com/content.cfm?articleID=856)

I post this as it claims that xeriscaping is not Florida Friendly landscaping and has a great number of references as to what landscape provisions and goals are being regulated. Here is the law:

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0373/Sections/0373.185.html)

“Florida-friendly landscaping” means quality landscapes that conserve water, protect the environment, are adaptable to local conditions, and are drought tolerant. The principles of such landscaping include planting the right plant in the right place, efficient watering, appropriate fertilization, mulching, attraction of wildlife, responsible management of yard pests, recycling yard waste, reduction of stormwater runoff, and waterfront protection. Additional components include practices such as landscape planning and design, soil analysis, the appropriate use of solid waste compost, minimizing the use of irrigation, and proper maintenance."

blueash, this was a great post, thank you for the links. I was reading the first link from the Florida Community Association Journal, and it appeared the homeowner's association involved formed a team of experts - legal as well as horticultural, and came up with guidelines for homeowners: "Using suggestions from the horticulturalist and irrigation designer and the Nine Principles of Florida-Friendly LandscapingTM, the team designed several lawn templates for owners to choose from for Florida-friendly landscaping using turf and using no turf."

They also revised their guidelines to fall in line with the new Florida state law.

Interesting.

[Jayhawk]

Rules, regulatons, by-laws, or whatever else you want to call them, are all written before one house is ever built within a community. They are usually taken from a compilation of other HOA documents and there are specific attorneys who often write them. Our documents are much more involved because the developer rules here and it is either his way or the highway.

However, having been in real estate for 30 years and been involved with many associations, I have never known an assocation that did not make changes to their documents, as the years went by. The proper word is "updating" and all documents need to have this done periodically.

It is not unusual for a homeowner to question or want to make a change that is not within the docs because, frankly, many of the rules are archaic and some never even made sense when they were created. Many times the rules simply have to do with the creator's ego.

I think your reference of people "pushing the envelope" to "curcumvent the rules" is a little exaggerated. Homeowners just want to make some changes to make their property reflect their taste, even though it may not be good taste in someone else's eyes. That's why we have the ARC.


No disagreement with what you wrote. But following procedure to make changes to reflect personal taste is not at all what I was referring to. That is EXACTLY what everyone should do. That is NOT what many of the posts in this thread are calling for. And yes, if you take the time to re-read, you will see some that specifically state they have or will push the envelope.

As for me, I knew this was a community with detailed and specific guidelines. It's why I bought, and it's why I remain. Trust me, if I didn't like it I would move.

As it applies to the dog issue, there are literally dozens of wildlife species in Florida that inhabit and poop in our yards (List of mammals of Florida - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mammals_of_Florida)). They are not all here in TV obviously, but some are. No one picks it up and I have yet to read a complaint about it. What I do see is 99% of the pet owners DO pick up after their pets. Those few that don't should be called out, no question.

I guess having lived in other large, relatively affluent communities and never having heard or read complaints about people who DO curb their pets (though certainly I did about those who failed to), this aggravation at those who do seems strange to me.

But it's another beautiful day in The Villages. Think I'll go play golf :a040:

[Lovey2]

If they told me that I would be parking my golf cart on their lawn and driving my car across their lawn

Hahaha!! Let's just say I have some ideas percolating should it become an issue. Like where I'll empty my litter box. :1rotfl: This thread has been very interesting tho. Apparently the woman I spoke with was right in some respects. I'm glad Kitty asked the question...we've all learned a lot here I think. I think I'm on one of the smallest lots in TV, so I'm not even sure I own my front door, at this point!!

[kittygilchrist]

Hahaha!! Let's just say I have some ideas percolating should it become an issue. Like where I'll empty my litter box. :1rotfl: This thread has been very interesting tho. Apparently the woman I spoke with was right in some respects. I'm glad Kitty asked the question...we've all learned a lot here I think. I think I'm on one of the smallest lots in TV, so I'm not even sure I own my front door, at this point!!

If we all have equal rights to the areas between homeowner lot and street, it solves parking problems for parties. People who come to parties can all parallel park on neighbors' driveways and turf. (This is a ridiculous idea, I know)...I think we should respect and stay off each others property that we don't own, period.

[Lovey2]

If we all have equal rights to the areas between homeowner lot and street, it solves parking problems for parties. People who come to parties can all parallel park on neighbors' driveways and turf. (This is a ridiculous idea, I know)...I think we should respect and stay off each others property that we don't own, period.

Wish we had a "like" button on here.... :)

[kittygilchrist]

Synopsis of thread:
-there is an area between street and house not owned by homeowner. in my case, 15 feet. (as Carl says, look at your site plan or plat)
-none of us who've posted so far know who owns that area or what rights pertain for the public or the homeowner.
-developer has an easement on 4 sides of most homesites, in my case, 10' on street side.
-easement legally means developer may access and utilize that area as needed in future for utilities, etc. easement does not convey rights to the public.

Questions we can't answer:

-who does own the 15 feet in front of my lot?
-does the public have rights as if they owned that area since I do not own it?
-what rights and responsibilities do I have for that area?

example of implications: I do not own the 15 feet of my driveway nearest to the street. Do both the public and i have equal rights to utilize the driveway between my garage and the street? (this question is posed only to get to the bottom of property rights, as a hypothetical)...

-subtopic...one poster says some dog owners claim rights of access and toileting dogs on the areas of turf not owned by homeowner. I'm against it, because my dog's urine is a weapon of mass destruction.
-subtopic...Fl has new law incorporated (apparently) into new Village deed restrictions to encourage Florida Friendly Landscapes promulgated by UF.

[TheVillageChicken]

thread synopsis:
-there is an area between street and house not owned by homeowner. in my case, 15 feet. (as Carl says, look at your site plan or plat)
-none of us who've posted so far know who owns that area or what rights pertain for the public or the homeowner.
-developer has an easement on 4 sides of most homesites, in my case, 10' on street side.
-easement legally means developer may access and utilize that area as needed in future for utilities, etc. easement does not convey rights to the public.
-questions remain:
who does own the 15 feet in front of my lot?
does the public have rights as if they owned that area since I do not own it?
what rights and responsibilities do I have to that area?
example of implications: I do not own the 15 feet of my driveway nearest to the street. Do both the public and i have equal rights to the space between my garage and the street?
-subtopic...one poster says some dog owners claim rights of access and toileting dogs on the areas of turf not owned by homeowner. I'm against it, but my dog's urine is lethal.

As far as the dog poop goes, both Marion and Lake County have ordinances that address this.

Lake:

It is a violation of this section for the owner of any animal to fail to exercise sufficient care and control of his or her animal and the animal commits any of the following acts:

Deposits solid excreta on public or private property other than the property of the owner or person in custody of the animal, without the authorization or consent of the property owner, unless the animal owner or person in custody of the animal immediately removes and properly disposes of the excrement.

Marion:

an owner shall prevent a domestic animal from becoming a nuisance. The department of animal services may impound a domestic animal creating a nuisance. A nuisance includes but is not limited to:

A domestic animal that defecates on public or private property other than the owner's property.

Sumter does not address the issue in its County Code, so if you live there, poop away.

[Warren Kiefer]

Synopsis of thread:
-there is an area between street and house not owned by homeowner. in my case, 15 feet. (as Carl says, look at your site plan or plat)
-none of us who've posted so far know who owns that area or what rights pertain for the public or the homeowner.
-developer has an easement on 4 sides of most homesites, in my case, 10' on street side.
-easement legally means developer may access and utilize that area as needed in future for utilities, etc. easement does not convey rights to the public.

Questions we can't answer:

-who does own the 15 feet in front of my lot?
-does the public have rights as if they owned that area since I do not own it?
-what rights and responsibilities do I have for that area?

example of implications: I do not own the 15 feet of my driveway nearest to the street. Do both the public and i have equal rights to utilize the driveway between my garage and the street? (this question is posed only to get to the bottom of property rights, as a hypothetical)...

-subtopic...one poster says some dog owners claim rights of access and toileting dogs on the areas of turf not owned by homeowner. I'm against it, because my dog's urine is a weapon of mass destruction.
-subtopic...Fl has new law incorporated (apparently) into new Village deed restrictions to encourage Florida Friendly Landscapes promulgated by UF.

That frontage area is a Right of Way, in our case either is or will be owned by the County in which you live. There are areas like this along State highways and of course is the property of that State. The public DOES NOT have any particular rights to this ROW. Property owners do have access and egess across the ROW to their property. Recently the big issue with the wall on the orginal side, the ROW played a role. To get back and forth people wre using the ROW property. It wasn't long before the State of Florida stepped into the fray and stopped the golf carts from driving down the ROW....

[kittygilchrist]

That frontage area is a Right of Way, in our case either is or will be owned by the County in which you live. There are areas like this along State highways and of course is the property of that State. The public DOES NOT have any particular rights to this ROW. Property owners do have access and egess across the ROW to their property. Recently the big issue with the wall on the orginal side, the ROW played a role. To get back and forth people wre using the ROW property. It wasn't long before the State of Florida stepped into the fray and stopped the golf carts from driving down the ROW....

Warren, I would be grateful to have a resource supporting what you have said.
:)

[Indydealmaker]

There may be, but need not be, an easement along the front of a piece of property. Easements are usually, but not necessarily, along the back of the property. There are also usually easements along the edge of the property abutting the neighbors property, which will also have an easement. All these easements are to facilitate getting gas, water, electricity, cable service, etc. into your house.

The utility easements are not available to the public for their use.

There may be an easement along the front of your property, but this is not the justification for the public walking on "your" lawn.

The fact is (as you note) that your front property line does not extend to the edge of the street. When a developer plats a new development, he retains ownership of the area from the front property line to the street (and the street) so that he may put in utilities before the utility companies become involved. Then, because at some point the developer wants to withdraw, he conveys ownership of that property to the County.

If, in your case the easement is in the front it may be that it was impractical to put the easement in the back. An example of this would be houses that back directly on a multi-modal path along Buena Vista. You will see houses that have birdcages built right up to the wooden fence that is probably the property line. There is no space for a back easement on those lots.

As I often say.........check your individual plat map.

The part that seems to trouble most people is that they are responsible for properly maintaining the strip of property from their front property line to the street and they cannot charge people with trespassing if they walk on it.

I can't answer your question about imperfections in your driveway that is not on your property. It may be that maintaining your driveway is in the same category as maintaining your lawn---you have to do it even though it is not on your property. See what your documents say.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, down in Tampa my front sidewalk suffered major upheaval from oak tree roots and the County came in and repaired the sidewalk because my property line ended on the house side of the sidewalk.

But, my only point, reaching back to my first entry in this discussion is that property lines do not extend to the edge of the street. The area from the property line to the street (usually 10 or 15 feet) is available to the public. Not because it is an easement, but because it does not belong to the property owner.

-----------

Incidentally, when the developer proffers the property, including the paved roads, to the county, the county is not obligated to accept the offer. The offered property must be up to county standards for the county to accept ownership.

My church in Tampa offered the county several hundred yards of paved roadway to be a connector between a dead end street and a major highway. The offer was initially refused because the very expensive and ornate street lights we had installed were too close to the road. We had to remove them all before the roadway was accepted.

Carl,
My site plan shows an easement on the front, the back and a special easement down one side. I am surrounded!

[Indydealmaker]

Rules, regulatons, by-laws, or whatever else you want to call them, are all written before one house is ever built within a community. They are usually taken from a compilation of other HOA documents and there are specific attorneys who often write them. Our documents are much more involved because the developer rules here and it is either his way or the highway.

However, having been in real estate for 30 years and been involved with many associations, I have never known an assocation that did not make changes to their documents, as the years went by. The proper word is "updating" and all documents need to have this done periodically.

It is not unusual for a homeowner to question or want to make a change that is not within the docs because, frankly, many of the rules are archaic and some never even made sense when they were created. Many times the rules simply have to do with the creator's ego.

I think your reference of people "pushing the envelope" to "curcumvent the rules" is a little exaggerated. Homeowners just want to make some changes to make their property reflect their taste, even though it may not be good taste in someone else's eyes. That's why we have the ARC.

Any provisions included as a deed restriction can only be changed by the originator of the deed prior to its first transfer. Apparently, state law can supercede that. However, I believe that is a slippery slope. Homeowners often make an investment decision relying on the deed restrictions as a primary factor in their purchase. When the state forces a change in deed restrictions, it is very much like exercising eminent domain.

[kittygilchrist]

Any provisions included as a deed restriction can only be changed by the originator of the deed prior to its first transfer. Apparently, state law can supercede that. However, I believe that is a slippery slope. Homeowners often make an investment decision relying on the deed restrictions as a primary factor in their purchase. When the state forces a change in deed restrictions, it is very much like exercising eminent domain.

Oh there you go, thinking again and pushing our noodle buttons.Maybe the new law is grandfather thing? sigh...can somebody look it up?


Nevermind, I looked it up..my mother raised a monster. She sold encyclopedias. No grandfathering....law says adopt new ordinances or amend existing ones.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0373/Sections/0373.185.html

(2) Each water management district shall design and implement an incentive program to encourage all local governments within its district to adopt new ordinances or amend existing ordinances to require Florida-friendly landscaping for development permitted after the effective date of the new ordinance or amendment. Each district shall assist the local governments within its jurisdiction by providing a model Florida-friendly landscaping ordinance and other technical assistance. Each district may develop its own model or use a model contained in the “Florida-Friendly Landscape Guidance Models for Ordinances, Covenants, and Restrictions” manual developed by the department.

[TheVillageChicken]

Let's say someone exercises their right to enter the section which the property owner is responsible for but does not own. Let's say they get injured. Who do they sue?

[mickey100]

Oh there you go, thinking again and pushing our noodle buttons.Maybe the new law is grandfather thing? sigh...can somebody look it up?


Nevermind, I looked it up..my mother raised a monster. She sold encyclopedias. No grandfathering....law says adopt new ordinances or amend existing ones.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0373/Sections/0373.185.html)

(2) Each water management district shall design and implement an incentive program to encourage all local governments within its district to adopt new ordinances or amend existing ordinances to require Florida-friendly landscaping for development permitted after the effective date of the new ordinance or amendment. Each district shall assist the local governments within its jurisdiction by providing a model Florida-friendly landscaping ordinance and other technical assistance. Each district may develop its own model or use a model contained in the “Florida-Friendly Landscape Guidance Models for Ordinances, Covenants, and Restrictions” manual developed by the department.

I contacted a legislator and was told the Department of Environmental Protection Welcome | Florida Department of Environmental Protection (DEP) (http://www.dep.state.fl.us) has a 52 page booklet that outlines all the do's and don'ts on the subject. I'd contact them to get the facts.

[kittygilchrist]

I contacted a legislator and was told the Department of Environmental Protection Welcome | Florida Department of Environmental Protection (DEP) (http://www.dep.state.fl.us) has a 52 page booklet that outlines all the do's and don'ts on the subject. I'd contact them to get the facts.

In my opinion, that would be a step backwards and toward generalities from what has been carefully crafted on the back of DEP guidelines and given us in the simple and understandable Nine Florida Friendly Landscape Practices.

[Carl in Tampa]

Oh there you go, thinking again and pushing our noodle buttons.Maybe the new law is grandfather thing? sigh...can somebody look it up?


Nevermind, I looked it up..my mother raised a monster. She sold encyclopedias. No grandfathering....law says adopt new ordinances or amend existing ones.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0373/Sections/0373.185.html)

(2) Each water management district shall design and implement an incentive program to encourage all local governments within its district to adopt new ordinances or amend existing ordinances to require Florida-friendly landscaping for development permitted after the effective date of the new ordinance or amendment. Each district shall assist the local governments within its jurisdiction by providing a model Florida-friendly landscaping ordinance and other technical assistance. Each district may develop its own model or use a model contained in the “Florida-Friendly Landscape Guidance Models for Ordinances, Covenants, and Restrictions” manual developed by the department.

You hit on the law, but that is not the section I would quote.

Your original intent was to learn what you can do about landscaping your lawn.

The pertinent section, it seems to me, is:

(b) A deed restriction or covenant may not prohibit or be enforced so as to prohibit any property owner from implementing Florida-friendly landscaping on his or her land or create any requirement or limitation in conflict with any provision of part II of this chapter or a water shortage order, other order, consumptive use permit, or rule adopted or issued pursuant to part II of this chapter.
(c) A local government ordinance may not prohibit or be enforced so as to prohibit any property owner from implementing Florida-friendly landscaping on his or her land.

Let's go back to your original intent. You wanted to know what you could do with regard to landscaping your lawn.

It seems to me that you might want to work up a proposal of what you want to do to landscape your yard, using "Florida-friendly landscaping" principles; submit it to the ARB and let them know up front that you know that the law allows you to do Florida-friendly landscaping.

There's lots of information on the Internet about what plants to use in Florida-friendly landscaping. There are also a lot of photos of what others have done at https://www.google.com/search?q=florida+friendly+landscaping&rlz=1C1GGGE_enUS571US571&es_sm=93&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=kn9yU5PpB5C3yASDgoKoBQ&ved=0CEsQsAQ&biw=800&bih=499

[Carl in Tampa]

To Kitty and everyone else interested in Florida-friendly landscaping. (FFL)

Years ago I was appointed by the governor to a term on the Southwest Florida Management District (Swiftmud) and as was pointed out by Kitty, Swiftmud was mandated by law to encourage FFL.

I decided it was a worthwhile initiative so I installed a lot of Florida-friendly landscape plants at my house at that time, and reduced how much I watered the lawn.

To me, one of the best documents being offered by Swiftmud is the brochure found here http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/publications/files/fynplantguide-web.pdf

It is incredibly detailed and is just one of many documents on the Swiftmud list of free publications relating to FFL. Free water conservation publications and materials (http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/publications/subject/landscaping)

My favorite of the nine principles of FFL is Number 5.

Numbers 2, 4 and 8 brought me to the point that I hardly had to water the lawn at all.

A word of caution might be in order. Although the ARB cannot foreclose the use of FFL plants, they might still have a voice in the aesthetic application of the various plants. One shouldn't assume that they could just run over the ARB. Careful and artistic planning would be in order.

[Indydealmaker]

Let's say someone exercises their right to enter the section which the property owner is responsible for but does not own. Let's say they get injured. Who do they sue?

Provided that the resident/owner of the home is required to maintain that strip; and provided they are negligent in doing so in such a manner that constituted a hazard; both the home owner and the statutory owner of the land would get sued, probably along with the Developer and God, Putin and Obama.

[downeaster]

Original post was "Purpose of Street Easement". It has morphed into "Florida Friendly Landscape".

Both are valid subjects for serious discussion. It may be worthwhile to spin off FFL into a dedicated thread.

[Carl in Tampa]

Original post was "Purpose of Street Easement". It has morphed into "Florida Friendly Landscape".

Both are valid subjects for serious discussion. It may be worthwhile to spin off FFL into a dedicated thread.

It morphed as a natural progression when a poster asked Kitty for the motivation behind her original post and she replied that it was because she was wondering what standing she had for landscaping the area of the front lawn that was not technically hers. It was her desire to do landscaping that was "xeriscape and hardscape."

The wandering off subject has more to do with the preoccupation with dogs toileting on the lawn near the street.

[kittygilchrist]

Original post was "Purpose of Street Easement". It has morphed into "Florida Friendly Landscape".

Both are valid subjects for serious discussion. It may be worthwhile to spin off FFL into a dedicated thread.

FFL does merit a dedicated thread, indeed.

[EnglishJW]

To me, one of the best documents being offered by Swiftmud is the brochure found here http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/publications/files/fynplantguide-web.pdf

It is incredibly detailed and is just one of many documents on the Swiftmud list of free publications relating to FFL. Free water conservation publications and materials (http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/publications/subject/landscaping)

Thanks Carl but the link wasn't working for me. I hope this one does: Florida-Friendly Landscaping (http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/yards/)

I went back and tried your original post again and it did work - sorry.

[kittygilchrist]

Thanks Karl but the link wasn't working for me. I hope this one does: Florida-Friendly Landscaping (http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/yards/)

That is one fabulous book!! I have a hard copy. Starts with how to plan a landscape then has oodles of plant pictures with info on specifics of what the plant needs, how big it gets, etc.

[perrjojo]

I think this whole thread has been convoluted and made far more complicated than necessary. It has added to confusion. Just submit a plan to arc and see what happens. Check with arc and cdd if you feel you have trespassing problems. As the ATT add says...it's not complicated.

[kittygilchrist]

at least my name is simple, perrjojo! the thread was indeed convoluted and it evolved and educated me far better than I imagined as the OP; however there was a master plan from the start to get that education, however sidestepping the original topic may seem, with a minimum of misinformation and the predictable fallout re: some things that got discussed. I appreciate your contributions. I think the plan worked nicely.

As to your comments about submitting a plan to ARC, I'm not one to submit a plan without research. I'm still gathering data.

[tigger_kitty]

We have a Villages installed water line pipe that is leaking into the street. We were told that the water line access runs under can run under driveway to the valve box. (easement)

We and many others have paid Thousands of Dollars to try and improve our homes and neighborhood with decorative coatings to our driveways. All "The Villages" is "required" to do is restore it back to grey cement, not match the rest of the driveway, thus negating our investment.

Just wanted to inform all of you people who have waterfalls on easements or decorative driveways what can easily happen. Be prepared!

I am furious. Any advice?

[buggyone]

We have a Villages installed water line pipe that is leaking into the street. We were told that the water line access runs under can run under driveway to the valve box. (easement)

We and many others have paid Thousands of Dollars to try and improve our homes and neighborhood with decorative coatings to our driveways. All "The Villages" is "required" to do is restore it back to grey cement, not match the rest of the driveway, thus negating our investment.

Just wanted to inform all of you people who have waterfalls on easements or decorative driveways what can easily happen. Be prepared!

I am furious. Any advice?

Check with your homeowner's insurance to see if it possibly might be covered - but it most likely is not covered. Try anyhow and you might luck out.

Other than that, you had improvement done over an easement. The Villages is entirely in the right.

[kittygilchrist]

We have a Villages installed water line pipe that is leaking into the street. We were told that the water line access runs under can run under driveway to the valve box. (easement)

We and many others have paid Thousands of Dollars to try and improve our homes and neighborhood with decorative coatings to our driveways. All "The Villages" is "required" to do is restore it back to grey cement, not match the rest of the driveway, thus negating our investment.

Just wanted to inform all of you people who have waterfalls on easements or decorative driveways what can easily happen. Be prepared!

I am furious. Any advice?

Thanks to you for a nugget of wisdom.

[Polar Bear]

...you had improvement done over an easement. The Villages is entirely in the right.

I feel bad for you, but buggyone is correct.

[tigger_kitty]

How many feet is the front easement?

[Polar Bear]

How many feet is the front easement?

You should check your plat to be certain.

[tigger_kitty]

It shows 3', but the VCCD guy is saying it is 13'

[tigger_kitty]

The plot plan shows 3' but the restriction paper says 10'. HELP????

[denise adams]

OK, first my credentials. I bought right of way easements for GTE in Michigan. We bought easements to build our facilities (telephone lines) on privately owned property. Easements within TV are exactly as one post said, for the placement, maintenance, and repair of utilities (gas, water, sewer, power, etc).
The power company, gas, and other non-Village owned utilities must get permission to use TV easements. Almost everyone in most every State has a utility easement at least in the front of their home and may have one all the way around the home. Nothing permanent can be placed on that easement which is typically 5 feet from the property line between houses and may extend as much as 32 feet from the center of the road (not the edge) in front of the home.
And no, easements (once recorded) are not going to go away. Once the easement is obtained its a permanent access for the person/organization who obtained it.

[downeaster]

How many feet is the front easement?

The front of your house faces a right-of-way.
Easements are usually in the rear of your house. You own the easement but the utilities can access it and use it. If you were to build something permanent in an easement they can remove it.
The right-of way in front of your house is not owned by you. It usually extends in 13' from the curb.
See kittygilchrist's post (#39) at
https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/florida-trespass-law-118625/index4.html
It is the best explanation I have read on this subject.

[Warren Kiefer]

the question is what is the purpose of the easement in tv and facts about whether the easement remains the property of the homeowner. I don't mean to be mean, but only facts, and evidence of the sort that would hold up in court, please.

an easement as we have in the villages is not complicated.. The easement dimensions are not all the same, you would have to review the layout for your particular lot. The purpose is simple, it gives utilities the right to enter the easement area to install and/or maintain the utilities located within that easement. The only downside is, if the property owner has perhaps done extensive landscaping work within the easement ans a utility problem develops, that landscaping is subject to being destroyed without compensation to the property owner. You cannot receive and evidence from this forum that would hold up in court. That information can only be gleened from data that is part of your legal explanations contained in your purchase of the property agreement.

[kittygilchrist]

Oh dear, I am sorry for your trouble.
The street side of your property will have a right of way which belongs to the county. That is the part that is likely the longer distance. But that is not a utility easement. That is for the county to be able to expand the roadway.

On my property, the street side right-of-way it is 13 feet. Of that 13 feet, 10 feet is also a utility easement. The utility easement is available to the villages to repair or expand utilities as needed.

Unfortunately, many of us buy property with the assumption that we own everything that has grass on it, not realizing that we are required to maintain property which does not actually belong to us.

From my research, I've concluded that you do not own the property on which there is a right-of-way, you do own the property on which there is an easement with the exception of that on which there is also a right-of-way. Nevertheless, where there's a utility easement, The entity who have easement which is upon your property, has the right to make repairs and amendments as needed to accomplish their purpose of providing utilities to the whole community.

Your situation is a good reminder of the possibilities that exist for right-of-way and easement issues to affect the homeowner. Many of us choose to upgrade and enhance our properties, not realizing that situations such as yours could arise.

[tigger_kitty]

They violated their own right away/easement by building the driveway then!!!

[mgcsooner]

To the OP, I think the explanation you are getting is probably from a real estate agent re a preowned home. I'd also enlist a Village Sales agent as they are better versed on this, at least as it applies to the villages. I know becasue we just bought in the same area and had many similar questions. I'm not pushing them versus the other though.

Anyway, as far as the utility easements, these are civil (city) agreements for franchised utilities to utilize. You cannot put any vertical structures on them, although you can put landscaping on them. Living in four other states it has always meant they (the utilities) have a right to dig up the area to repair and in some cases install new services, such as fibre optic cables. I have NEVER seen where they do not repair the area to its prior state. They would probably not want to repair landscaping but instead drill under to avoid it. While they are not obligated to repair extensive landscaping, it't really rare that they would leave it damaged. Individuals can also grant other individuals legal easements, but there is no guarantee it will be grandfathered onto future property owners. Easements can also be vacated, even in unusual cases utility easements. One property I almost bought (we had a penning survey) found the corner of the house had been built by the original builder upon a utility easement. In such a case getting the city to vacate it was a simple matter, although I must say, we decided again buying that house.

Setbacks are more HOA/PUD etc restrictions that govern site building requirements for given lots for the purpose of maintaining homeowner value. In most cases they are defined in the covenants for the development, that guarantees they will be maintained for present and future buyers. Your HOA or in this case the ARC committee will go after you for violations as they would damage the property values of both you and your neighbors if they were not enforced.

Disclosure, I am not a real estate attorney, or attorney of any kind. This should not be thought of as any type of legal opinion. :)

[Polar Bear]

I suggest you figure out for certain the basic information you need. Right-of-way and easements over and adjacent to your property will be shown one of two places, possibly both...1) your plat; 2) a separate instrument that would be recorded in the county clerk's office.

You must have this information to know for certain your situation. These documents will include the layout (exact dimensions, etc.) of the right-of-way and easements and describe what is allowed in these areas. In almost no cases will the property owner be allowed to put anything in the easements, even though he owns the property "under" the easement. The right-of-way is not owned by the adjacent property owner, so of course the adjacent property owner can build nothing there.

[drdodge]

set back lines on your plot plan show where you can locate a bldg you cannot build a structure or any part of a structure any closer to your property line than the setback lines, a utility easement gives other people the right to work on your property or cross it to repair electric lines or whatever the easement is allowed for example when you buy a villa an easement is given by you for your neighbors driveway to cross your property to enter his garage and you have an easement to cross the other persons property to get to your garage look at someones villa deed and read the covenments thay pertain to that certain property









gbhor

[perrjojo]

When we lived in Georgia we had a big electrical box on our property. I planted a forsythia bush to obscure it. Every 3 years the electric company came and chopped the bush down and painted the box. Thankfully it grew back rapidldy but I quickly learned that the electric company tolerated my bush until they needed access to repaint the box. They never asked me, they never warned me....they just chopped it back to a stub. It was within their rights yo do so.

[kittygilchrist]

They violated their own right away/easement by building the driveway then!!!

:agree:
Yes, they put a permanent surface across utilities. Good thing you did not have pavers.
Possibly the three foot line you see on the survey extends past easement to right of way, which in my case are 10 and13 feet.

[buggyone]

Let the forum know of the outcome of the situation. It will be interesting to see what transpires.

[tigger_kitty]

Oh, I think it is done and DONE. The VCCD guy was firm!