Charter School Teacher:Student Ratio to Improve

[TheVillageChicken]

There will be 140 less students at the Charter School next school year. (http://alturl.com/ggizj)

[jflynn1]

Is this supposed to be a good thing ?

[TheVillageChicken]

Is this supposed to be a good thing ?

I am pretty sure that would depend upon whom you ask. If you are asking me, I have no dog in the fight....just reporting on something that might be of interest to others.

[graciegirl]

Is this supposed to be a good thing ?


It could be. I don't know what the chicken meant yet. Why are they getting the boot, chicken? I have no school age children but think The Charter Schools have been an excellent thing for the children whose parents work for The Villages.

[graciegirl]

There is an article in The Daily Commercial, but you have to read it carefully.

The gist of it is that the state will enforce class size.

And my guess? The school will probably not be expanded...as the developer appears to be phasing down in building.

The article focuses on the fact that the Charter School only takes kids whose parents are employed by The Villages. Not just employed IN The Villages. I find the title inflammatory. But that is me.

This is quoted from the article.

"It’s a wonderful testimony to our teachers and faculty that so many folks want to send their kids to our school,” Principal Randy McDaniel wrote in an email. “However, just like other Florida schools we are restricted by the law limiting class sizes and our facilities have reached that capacity.”

I think the rest of that article is hype, but that is my opinion.

I don't get The Daily Commercial, because I am satisfied with The Sun and the online news. Some people get the Orlando Sentinel or the Commercial perhaps in part because the editorial page of the Sun bothers them.

Disclaimer. I don't work in any way for The Villages or anybody. I love it here. I think it wise that we all try to quell rumors, and correct misinformation for no other reason but to protect our investment. But I sincerely love this place, JUST THE WAY IT IS.

[TheVillageChicken]

It could be. I don't know what the chicken meant yet. Why are they getting the boot, chicken? I have no school age children but think The Charter Schools have been an excellent thing for the children whose parents work for The Villages.

They are getting the boot because their parents do not work for an employer who leases space directly from The Villages, but rather are sub-letting the property. The subject evokes no emotion from me...I just thought it was interesting.

[Laurie2]

Thread title spin......

Aw, c'mon. Of course they will cut teaching jobs, too.

Am I correct in assuming that just like other charter schools, they can run like a business but still get a chunk of the taxpayers' money that comes at the expense of local public school funding? If like other places, it is by head-count or ADM. If so, that will go back to the local schools. But, hey, I bet collecting rent is a lot more profitable.

If education were the true priority, an addition could be built and more teachers hired.

This is one aspect of TV that has always bothered me. The control the charter school wields over families' lives makes me sad. The kids are at the mercy of business decisions. Sacrificial lambs.

And now I must get out of here and refuse to engage with those who will come after me and try to make me dance in a conga line around the developer. I tried to keep my mouth shut. But education of our young people is close to my heart.

You-Will-Never-Guess-What-I-Did Laurie

PS: I like many things about how TV runs -- but this......at what point........

[graciegirl]

Thread title spin......

Aw, c'mon. Of course they will cut teaching jobs, too.

Am I correct in assuming that just like other charter schools, they can run like a business but still get a chunk of the taxpayers' money that comes at the expense of local public school funding? If so, that will go back to the local schools. But, hey, I bet collecting rent is a lot more profitable.

If education were the true priority, an addition could be built and more teachers hired.

This is one aspect of TV that has always bothered me. The control the charter school wields over families' lives makes me sad. The kids are at the mercy of business decisions. Sacrificial lambs.

And now I must get out of here and refuse to engage with those who will come after me and try to make me dance in a conga line around the developer. I tried to keep my mouth shut. But education of our young people is close to my heart.

You-Will-Never-Guess-What-I-Did Laurie

PS: I like many things about how TV runs -- but this......at what point........


Sometimes money walks and money talks. In this case the Charter school is better, for whatever reason. Florida schools aren't as good as the ones I am used to for sure. . But no matter the reason, this Charter School is doing a good job. But I doubt for long at the same size. When construction stops, many students will have to leave.

Many villagers volunteer at the local schools and support the backpack programs and do what can be done to help public education, and I think it really helps...

Education is near and dear to my heart to. I try to look at it with an open mind.

[redwitch]

They've been downsizing students for a couple of years now, starting with the high school. It really is a shame for those kids who have attended for years and now have to go to a new school, make new friends, etc. One summer's notice to the parents is awfully hard on them, as well. For some, it will mean changing companies. For others, moving. I'm sure more than parent will be moving and changing jobs to get their kids into a desirable school. It really stinks for these parents and kids.

I can understand wanting to keep classroom size down, but I can't quite understand not adding new classrooms and teachers. I know many schools have satellite classrooms that are trailers and pre-fabs. I find it hard to believe that these level four businesses do not somehow aid the infra-structure of TV. I really do believe there should be a way to accommodate these children.

[janmcn]

They are getting the boot because their parents do not work for an employer who leases space directly from The Villages, but rather are sub-letting the property. The subject evokes no emotion from me...I just thought it was interesting.


This change doesn't bode well for attracting young professionals with young families to this area to work, such as doctors, dentists, lawyers, etc. Why would any young family take a look at the local schools and decide to relocate to this area?

[dbussone]

I am perplexed regarding the issue here. I certainly can feel for the affected parents and students. However, in FL it is the responsibility of the counties to provide public education. Think of the children who received superior educations in the past because the developer cared enough to build these facilities. He wasn't obligated to then, nor is he obligated to add space now. And still a significant number of students will benefit from his largess in the future. If i were the parent of a child in the Charter school I would be sending letters of thanks. The attitude of "I'm owed something" is one I've never understood.

[gerryann]

I am perplexed regarding the issue here. I certainly can feel for the affected parents and students. However, in FL it is the responsibility of the counties to provide public education. Think of the children who received superior educations in the past because the developer cared enough to build these facilities. He wasn't obligated to then, nor is he obligated to add space now. And still a significant number of students will benefit from his largess in the future. If i were the parent of a child in the Charter school I would be sending letters of thanks. The attitude of "I'm owed something" is one I've never understood.

I get what you're saying.....but, how hard for kids who have attended the school for say 5/6 years and now they are told they can no longer stay there? They are leaving their friends, everything they've known, etc. Shouldnt the kids be grandfathered in?

[sunnyatlast]

Thread title spin......

Aw, c'mon. Of course they will cut teaching jobs, too.

Am I correct in assuming that just like other charter schools, they can run like a business but still get a chunk of the taxpayers' money that comes at the expense of local public school funding? If like other places, it is by head-count or ADM. If so, that will go back to the local schools. But, hey, I bet collecting rent is a lot more profitable.

If education were the true priority, an addition could be built and more teachers hired.

This is one aspect of TV that has always bothered me. The control the charter school wields over families' lives makes me sad. The kids are at the mercy of business decisions. Sacrificial lambs.

And now I must get out of here and refuse to engage with those who will come after me and try to make me dance in a conga line around the developer. I tried to keep my mouth shut. But education of our young people is close to my heart.

You-Will-Never-Guess-What-I-Did Laurie

PS: I like many things about how TV runs -- but this......at what point........

It takes reading more than one article over time to know that the charter schools expanded hugely to accommodate the growth, by building and opening the huge Middle School campus whose length faces highway 466. At that time I remember reading they were building to accommodate 6 or 8 sections of each grade, compared to previously having 3-4, and the new campus included facilities for performing arts, music, etc.

I've read articles in the last couple of years stating that the growth was skyrocketing even with that expansion, and therefore the qualifying rules would start to rule out employees' children where the parent is working for (for example) an employer who is not leasing from or subcontracting for The Villages.

And about the too simplistic statement, "If education were the true priority, an addition could be built and more teachers hired"……

….If one looks at the Job Opportunities online for the charter schools, you now see this list of job openings due to the growth, and up until 2 weeks ago, this page had DOUBLE the number of new teacher and paraprofessional staff openings. Obviously they have hired for some of those positions, and these still remain.

Not everything can be summarized and accused by one article in the Leesburg paper, which has its own readers' bias, too.

The Villages Charter Schools - Central Office (http://www.tvcs.org/centralOffice/jobOpportunities/jobOpportunities.asp)

[xNYer]

I am perplexed regarding the issue here. I certainly can feel for the affected parents and students. However, in FL it is the responsibility of the counties to provide public education. Think of the children who received superior educations in the past because the developer cared enough to build these facilities. He wasn't obligated to then, nor is he obligated to add space now. And still a significant number of students will benefit from his largess in the future. If i were the parent of a child in the Charter school I would be sending letters of thanks. The attitude of "I'm owed something" is one I've never understood.

The building of the Charter School enables the developer to more easily recruit and retain workers. It is an added benefit to those employed here, and can be a source of control of the workforce, including wages and working conditions. If one leaves the workforce, they have to withdraw their children from the school.
There are two employment organized charter schools in Florida, they had to be legislatively approved.
It certainly was a business decision and not purely done for the benefit of those who attend the school.

[sunnyatlast]

**ALSO SEE the history of the charter schools' growth in this history that shows enrollment growth reaching 3,000 after the opening of the new middle school campus/expansion in 2013:

The Villages Charter Schools - Central Office (http://www.thevillagescharterschool.org/centralOffice/history.asp)

Recent growth:

2012-2013

VCS sets record opening day enrollment of 2,459 students in K-12 and 232 in PK-3 & PK-4 to start the 2012-2013 school year.
VCS was awarded full district accreditation (K-12) from the Southern Association of Colleges & Schools (SACS)
VCS begins construction of the latest expansion (Phase VII).
The Villages High School is awarded "Early College" site status by SACS and partners with Lake-Sumter State College to offer a full Associates of Arts (AA) degree.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________________________

2013-2014

VCS completes construction of the latest expansion (Phase VII) with a ribbon cutting & open house on July 25, 2013.
VCS sets record opening day enrollment of 2,660 students in K-12 and 243 in PK-3 & PK-4 to start the 2013-2014 school year.
VHS Class of 2014 sets record of 143 graduates.
VCS earns our 12th "A" in a row!
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________________________

2014-2015

VCS sets record opening day enrollment of 2,962 students in K-12 and 258 in PK-3 & PK-4 to start the 2014-2015 school year.

.

[dbussone]

I get what you're saying.....but, how hard for kids who have attended the school for say 5/6 years and now they are told they can no longer stay there? They are leaving their friends, everything they've known, etc. Shouldnt the kids be grandfathered in?

That would be nice, but they can't be grandfathered if the school is exceeding class size permitted by the State.

[sunnyatlast]

The building of the Charter School enables the developer to more easily recruit and retain workers. It is an added benefit to those employed here, and can be a source of control of the workforce, including wages and working conditions. If one leaves the workforce, they have to withdraw their children from the school.
There are two employment organized charter schools in Florida, they had to be legislatively approved.
It certainly was a business decision and not purely done for the benefit of those who attend the school.

That is correct. And it is also correct that the schools benefit all of us residents, when we need access to excellent, MOTIVATED:

primary care doctors,
specialists,
lawyers,
dentists,
nurses,
mechanical engineers,
architects,
civil engineers,
HVAC contractors,
auto/truck mechanics,
home and commercial builders,
medical technicians,
paralegals,
title-company workers,
ethical and knowledgeable real estate brokers/agents, etc. etc. etc…..

….who have school-aged children.

Thank goodness the developers have the sense to think past next week.

[TheVillageChicken]

Do you suppose any star athletes got the letter?

[sunnyatlast]

Do you suppose any star athletes got the letter?

They'd have legal recourse if they got one and their parent is working for employers who meet the qualifying criteria for next year.

[dbussone]

The building of the Charter School enables the developer to more easily recruit and retain workers. It is an added benefit to those employed here, and can be a source of control of the workforce, including wages and working conditions. If one leaves the workforce, they have to withdraw their children from the school.
There are two employment organized charter schools in Florida, they had to be legislatively approved.
It certainly was a business decision and not purely done for the benefit of those who attend the school.

I understand and agree completely. The main thrust of my comments was to note that,no matter how desirable the Charter school is, they are still operating under state rules when it comes to class size.

[rubicon]

The building of the Charter School enables the developer to more easily recruit and retain workers. It is an added benefit to those employed here, and can be a source of control of the workforce, including wages and working conditions. If one leaves the workforce, they have to withdraw their children from the school.
There are two employment organized charter schools in Florida, they had to be legislatively approved.
It certainly was a business decision and not purely done for the benefit of those who attend the school.

xNYer:

you are essentially correct.

[TheVillageChicken]

They'd have legal recourse if they got one and their parent is working for employers who meet the qualifying criteria for next year.

Let me rephrase the question. I wonder if any star athletes who didn't meet the eligibility requirements were in some way accommodated and allowed to stay.

Why would that thought occur to me? (http://www.gainesville.com/article/20130906/ARTICLES/130909712)

[Indydealmaker]

I get what you're saying.....but, how hard for kids who have attended the school for say 5/6 years and now they are told they can no longer stay there? They are leaving their friends, everything they've known, etc. Shouldnt the kids be grandfathered in?

This is no different than what occurs every day all around the country. Parents lose jobs, move, transfer, take promotions, etc. Kids are often uprooted. Life goes on and on and on.

[Bogie Shooter]

This change doesn't bode well for attracting young professionals with young families to this area to work, such as doctors, dentists, lawyers, etc. Why would any young family take a look at the local schools and decide to relocate to this area?

Maybe because of its educational record?

[Bogie Shooter]

I get what you're saying.....but, how hard for kids who have attended the school for say 5/6 years and now they are told they can no longer stay there? They are leaving their friends, everything they've known, etc. Shouldnt the kids be grandfathered in?

Kids leaving a school system is nothing new. Remember the Corporate world when we were transferred all over and ..............the family followed?

[janmcn]

Maybe because of its educational record?

The school's educational record means nothing to those not allowed to attend, unless they work for The Villages.

[Jim 9922]

That is correct. And it is also correct that the schools benefit all of us residents, when we need access to excellent, ---------
Thank goodness the developers have the sense to think past next week.

And to think ahead and past all the TOTV "experts".

[Vladimir]

Let me first say that I substitute at the Charter School. Its a first rate school compared to the other Florida schools and concerned parents know a good thing when they see it - there is a waiting list to get in. Unfortunately the class sizes are just too big now to accommodate everyone. The kids know its a privilege and not a right to attend this school and the Developer did not have to build it but he did. There are strict rules for behavior and learning and the kids do not run the school and if you do not get with the program then you are kicked out.
There is no comparison between the Charter School and the Florida public schools with regard to the resources, programs, facilities, teachers, administration, and parents that care. Maybe if the rest of Florida could create this type of school then there would be room for kids to attend a good school and get an education.

[blueash]

Let me first say that I substitute at the Charter School. Its a first rate school compared to the other Florida schools and concerned parents know a good thing when they see it - there is a waiting list to get in. Unfortunately the class sizes are just too big now to accommodate everyone. The kids know its a privilege and not a right to attend this school and the Developer did not have to build it but he did. There are strict rules for behavior and learning and the kids do not run the school and if you do not get with the program then you are kicked out.
There is no comparison between the Charter School and the Florida public schools with regard to the resources, programs, facilities, teachers, administration, and parents that care. Maybe if the rest of Florida could create this type of school then there would be room for kids to attend a good school and get an education.

Do you understand that the true public schools don't get to refuse children whose parents don't volunteer at the school, or can't drive them to school. Public schools can't kick out kids who do not get with the program. Public schools take all kids, learning disabled kids, autistic kids, poor kids, rich kids, and have to make do with resources that are provided by the state or the local taxpayers no matter how inadequate. So don't equate the results of a selective school with that of a true public school. When you can cherry pick the kids who can go to your school you'll have a good outcome.

[DougB]

Do you understand that the true public schools don't get to refuse children whose parents don't volunteer at the school, or can't drive them to school. Public schools can't kick out kids who do not get with the program. Public schools take all kids, learning disabled kids, autistic kids, poor kids, rich kids, and have to make do with resources that are provided by the state or the local taxpayers no matter how inadequate. So don't equate the results of a selective school with that of a true public school. When you can cherry pick the kids who can go to your school you'll have a good outcome.

And some may be happy to know there is no comparison between the teachers at The Village Charter school and our local public schools. Each has it's share of excellent and some not so excellent.

[dbussone]

Let me first say that I substitute at the Charter School. Its a first rate school compared to the other Florida schools and concerned parents know a good thing when they see it - there is a waiting list to get in. Unfortunately the class sizes are just too big now to accommodate everyone. The kids know its a privilege and not a right to attend this school and the Developer did not have to build it but he did. There are strict rules for behavior and learning and the kids do not run the school and if you do not get with the program then you are kicked out.
There is no comparison between the Charter School and the Florida public schools with regard to the resources, programs, facilities, teachers, administration, and parents that care. Maybe if the rest of Florida could create this type of school then there would be room for kids to attend a good school and get an education.


Thank you for teaching at the Charter School. You make a difference in the lives of those students.

[sunnyatlast]

Do you understand that the true public schools don't get to refuse children whose parents don't volunteer at the school, or can't drive them to school. Public schools can't kick out kids who do not get with the program. Public schools take all kids, learning disabled kids, autistic kids, poor kids, rich kids, and have to make do with resources that are provided by the state or the local taxpayers no matter how inadequate. So don't equate the results of a selective school with that of a true public school. When you can cherry pick the kids who can go to your school you'll have a good outcome.

The kids are not "cherry picked". It's a matter of parental "choice".

Their parents choose the school they believe is best for their kids and family, and they go to work in TV to achieve that goal.

Some parents choose the regular public schools assigned to them in their district, and others decide to send them to parochial, independent, or public charter school.

Kids are always affected by their parents' choices. In any school--public, parochial, independent or charter--there will always be kids at a huge advantage......or disadvantage....because of their parents' choices in parenting, and efforts or lack of effort to change what is not resulting well for their kids.

[JoMar]

Kids leaving a school system is nothing new. Remember the Corporate world when we were transferred all over and ..............the family followed?

Not the same thing......the parent made the decision to take the transfer and any hardship on the kids was the result of the parents decision. This is a political issue, the State setting the rules and the Developer setting the rules. Why should it matter if the parent rents space from someone other than TV if the business supports TV. If you are going to change the rules do it going forward, don't penalize the kids. And a question, if all those parents found a job that had the building rented from TV, there kids would be eligible....how would the Charter School handle the class size? This is one of those things that remind me of 3 day old fish.

[jbdlfan]

The kids are not "cherry picked". It's a matter of parental "choice".

Their parents choose the school they believe is best for their kids and family, and they go to work in TV to achieve that goal.

Some parents choose the regular public schools assigned to them in their district, and others decide to send them to parochial, independent, or public charter school.

Kids are always affected by their parents' choices. In any school--public, parochial, independent or charter--there will always be kids at a huge advantage......or disadvantage....because of their parents' choices in parenting, and efforts or lack of effort to change what is not resulting well for their kids.

Sorry, but you are completely WRONG on the idea of cherry picking. We receive students on regular basis that are no longer wanted at the TVCS. That goes a long way to higher school ratings as well as how they are grouped. But hey, what do I know.....

[gerryann]

Not the same thing......the parent made the decision to take the transfer and any hardship on the kids was the result of the parents decision. This is a political issue, the State setting the rules and the Developer setting the rules. Why should it matter if the parent rents space from someone other than TV if the business supports TV. If you are going to change the rules do it going forward, don't penalize the kids. And a question, if all those parents found a job that had the building rented from TV, there kids would be eligible....how would the Charter School handle the class size? This is one of those things that remind me of 3 day old fish.

I agree. Good post.

[jbdlfan]

Let me first say that I substitute at the Charter School. Its a first rate school compared to the other Florida schools and concerned parents know a good thing when they see it - there is a waiting list to get in. Unfortunately the class sizes are just too big now to accommodate everyone. The kids know its a privilege and not a right to attend this school and the Developer did not have to build it but he did. There are strict rules for behavior and learning and the kids do not run the school and if you do not get with the program then you are kicked out.
There is no comparison between the Charter School and the Florida public schools with regard to the resources, programs, facilities, teachers, administration, and parents that care. Maybe if the rest of Florida could create this type of school then there would be room for kids to attend a good school and get an education.

Um... Vlad. You might want to get around a bit more. As a sub, there is absolutely no way you are qualified to make such a statement. Unless, you have subbed in Every public school in Florida. I'll take my teachers, my programs and my administrators over their's ANY day of the week.
And by the way Vlad, my child graduated from TVCS. Ask yourself, what is the average years of experience and highest level of education the teachers have at TVCS. But you sub there, so you must already know....
Good school, yes. The best, not even close.
I say this with utmost respect.

[DougB]

The kids are not "cherry picked". It's a matter of parental "choice". .......

From TVCS own web site:
The Villages Charter School has established high standards for academic achievement, student behavior, attendance, and parent involvement. A strong partnership with our parents allows this to succeed. Currently most grade levels are at (or very close to) maximum student enrollment capacity. Since VCS is a school of choice it may not be perfectly suited for all students. For example, due to our small size we cannot offer the entire range of Exceptional Student Education (ESE) services. Also, students and/or parents that fail to comply with expectations may be placed on performance contracts, ultimately leading to a loss of eligibility status

[sunnyatlast]

So let me see if I have this straight.

People state above that the regular public schools are better, and have better teachers.

Meanwhile, there is a waiting list to get into TV Charter schools at capacity with 3,000 students, with room for 500 more having been added in 2012.

And parents, who are now becoming disqualified by their employers not meeting qualification criteria, are exceedingly upset that their children have to go back to those regular public schools y'all say are far better than TV Charter Schools.

Does this mean that teacher-posters on TOTV and the state know better than parents which school is best for their child, and the state should therefore force the children into the "better" regular public schools that the parents have gone great lengths to avoid??

Sounds tyrannical to me.

[DougB]

If you are referring to any of my posts, please re-read them. I never claimed any school was better than the other. I only stated facts. Both TVCS and the local public schools have excellent as well as not so excellent teachers. And from TVCS website, if students do not have regular attendance, good grades, parent involvement, and have discipline issues, they lose their eligibility.

[sunnyatlast]

If you are referring to any of my posts, please re-read them. I never claimed any school was better than the other. I only stated facts. Both TVCS and the local public schools have excellent as well as not so excellent teachers. And from TVCS website, if students do not have regular attendance, good grades, parent involvement, and have discipline issues, they lose their eligibility.

What's wrong with holding students and parents to standards of regular attendance, good grades, parent involvement, and conduct??

It seems to me that parents choosing TV Charter Schools WANT the public schools to uphold such standards because those are the bedrock of a coherent, non-chaotic education which are apparently missing in their regular public schools. And if those standards were upheld in all the public schools, with alternative safety net education for students who flunk out, schools would be more effective and students would be more able to learn.

[DougB]

What's wrong with holding students and parents to standards of regular attendance, good grades, parent involvement, and conduct??

It seems to me that parents choosing TV Charter Schools WANT the public schools to uphold such standards because those are the bedrock of a coherent, non-chaotic education which are apparently missing in their regular public schools. And if those standards were upheld in all the public schools, with alternative safety net education for students who flunk out, schools would be more effective and students would be more able to learn.

I also never said there was anything wrong with it. Just pointing out it is what it is. If you want public schools to be able to do the same, have a plan to educate everyone, can get the budget passed, run for governor, I'll vote for you.

[blueash]

What's wrong with holding students and parents to standards of regular attendance, good grades, parent involvement, and conduct??

It seems to me that parents choosing TV Charter Schools WANT the public schools to uphold such standards because those are the bedrock of a coherent, non-chaotic education which are apparently missing in their regular public schools. And if those standards were upheld in all the public schools, with alternative safety net education for students who flunk out, schools would be more effective and students would be more able to learn.

No one wants to send their child to a struggling school. No one is saying that VCS doesn't have good teachers and good outcome data. But your suggestion that parents go to VCS because they want PUBLIC schools to have certain standards is highly misleading. They are avoiding the real public schools and going to a charter school which is really a private school. Parents are paying for this private school in the form of a lower salary at their job. Do you see the signs when the villages wants to rent land? Put your business here and you will attract an employee who 1. values education and 2. is willing to take less money to get their kid into a private school. Double win for the business.

And you missed that part in the villages list of things we don't accept.

For example, due to our small size we cannot offer the entire range of Exceptional Student Education (ESE) services

Would you care to compare the size of VCS to the other Sumter Co schools to see if that statement about their "small size" is accurate?
Sumter County, FL Public Schools | PublicSchoolReview.com (http://www.publicschoolreview.com/county_schools/stateid/FL/county/12119)
Or they just don't want the cost and the responsibility and the potential real educational challenge of ESE kids. You do recognize that a good teacher with a classroom of only educationally advantaged well behaved kids at VCS is going to get a better set of test scores than a great teacher at South Sumter with disadvantaged kids, behavior issues, LD, ADHD poorly controlled and others mixed into her classroom.

I'd be interested, if anyone knows, what businesses have been cut from the approved lists

[TheVillageChicken]

I believe they are dropping Cat IV (http://www.thevillagescharterschool.org/centralOffice/enrollment.asp)

[joldnol]

Sometimes money walks and money talks. In this case the Charter school is better, for whatever reason. Florida schools aren't as good as the ones I am used to for sure. . But no matter the reason, this Charter School is doing a good job. But I doubt for long at the same size. When construction stops, many students will have to leave.

Many villagers volunteer at the local schools and support the backpack programs and do what can be done to help public education, and I think it really helps...

Education is near and dear to my heart to. I try to look at it with an open mind.

It is because they have been starved for the past 17 years. A current presidential candidate and former governor has made it a 17 year quest to dismantle public ed and has made no secret of it. When the voters of Fla twice passed amendments to limit class sizes he said "I have devious plans to eliminate it". The Charter School push has everything to do with profit and very little to do with children. Educations share of the general fund from the state has shrunk for decades thanks in part to the lottery. Florida teachers are at the bottom of the barrel for salaries. The trend is to continue to bleed public schools by turning more money over to charters and vouchers.

[blueash]

I believe they are dropping Cat IV (http://www.thevillagescharterschool.org/centralOffice/enrollment.asp)

Yes Chicken, I got that from the original newspaper article. What I didn't get was what specific businesses that impacted. I have no way of knowing which businesses are say Cat III vs Cat IV

Category III - Business Partners who lease directly from a Villages Company or that own a permanent business site purchased directly from The Villages and from which they operate their business within The Villages.

Category IV - Business Partners that lease a permanent business site from a non-Villages entity or that purchased a permanent business site from a non-Villages entity, from which they operate their business within The Villages.

What category is Burger King or IHOP or Bank of America or Cody's or the hospital. It will be interesting to see if level of service decreases once the involved businesses can no longer attract employees using the Charter school as a recruitment incentive. That's why I asked which businesses are being dropped.

[redwitch]

I know that the restaurants on 466 such as Red Lobster, Olive Garden, etc. we're dropped last year. I think this will impact the banks, stores in the Publix shopping center and shops on 466. Stores, shops and banks on 441 either lost TVCS services a long time ago or never had them. Not sure of the impact to Pinellas, Colony or the new strip mall by Brownwood, but I'd guess they'd be impacted as well. I don't think it will impact the shops and restaurants at the squares.

I do know that several small contractors would sign a lease agreement with a store located in the squares. The agreement would be for a nominal monthly fee and no true usage of space. It was done solely to get employees' kids into the charter schools. Obviously, these folks are now eliminated.

[billethkid]

The schools were not meant to be an incentive for professionals to locate here.
I thought they were an incentive to work in TV owned/leased/supported/allowed properties.

[janmcn]

The schools were not meant to be an incentive for professionals to locate here.
I thought they were an incentive to work in TV owned/leased/supported/allowed properties.


It sounds like the developer has some vacant commercial space he'd like to rent. If I understand the new rule correctly, if you rent space from TV your child can attend the charter school, but if you rent space from another person you are persona non grata.

Also, it sounds like these rules are reviewed every year, according to the article. Just wondering if parents are told the rules can be changed anytime.

Any young professional with young children who moved to this area and possibly bought their own building, now finds out that the charter school is not an option, must be livid. There probably won't be a big influx of young families into this area given the school choices.

[sunnyatlast]

It sounds like the developer…..

Any young professional with young children who moved to this area and possibly bought their own building, now finds out that the charter school is not an option, must be livid. There probably won't be a big influx of young families into this area given the school choices.

Interesting, since we were told right off the bat by a teacher or two that the public schools here were, and are, far better than TV Charter Schools, and that the regular schools' teachers are far better than TVCS' teachers.

And yet, accusations are made that students, who don't qualify according to qualifying rules AND state-mandated CAPACITY of TVCS, are being "deprived" by not attending TV Charter Schools.

[TheVillageChicken]

Interesting, since we were told right off the bat by a teacher or two that the public schools here were, and are, far better than TV Charter Schools, and that the regular schools' teachers are far better than TVCS' teachers.

And yet, accusations are made that students, who don't qualify according to qualifying rules AND state-mandated CAPACITY of TVCS, are being "deprived" by not attending TV Charter Schools.

The statistics don't agree with those teachers. The Florida Department of Education gives Wildwood High School a "D" while The Villages High School gets an "A" from the same body.

[DougB]

It is because they have been starved for the past 17 years. A current presidential candidate and former governor has made it a 17 year quest to dismantle public ed and has made no secret of it. When the voters of Fla twice passed amendments to limit class sizes he said "I have devious plans to eliminate it". The Charter School push has everything to do with profit and very little to do with children. Educations share of the general fund from the state has shrunk for decades thanks in part to the lottery. Florida teachers are at the bottom of the barrel for salaries. The trend is to continue to bleed public schools by turning more money over to charters and vouchers.

TVCS is operated as a not-for-profit corporation.

[DougB]

Interesting, since we were told right off the bat by a teacher or two that the public schools here were, and are, far better than TV Charter Schools, and that the regular schools' teachers are far better than TVCS' teachers.

And yet, accusations are made that students, who don't qualify according to qualifying rules AND state-mandated CAPACITY of TVCS, are being "deprived" by not attending TV Charter Schools.

Students who don't qualify according to rules and class size reduction to attend TVCS are not deprived of anything. They are just ineligible to attend. It may surprise you that many high performing public schools are also as you say "depriving" out of area students from attending due to class size reduction. TVCS is not unique in that way. They have to do what needs to be done or be fined by the state.

[sunnyatlast]

Students who don't qualify according to rules and class size reduction to attend TVCS are not deprived of anything. They are just ineligible to attend. It may surprise you that many high performing public schools are also as you say "depriving" out of area students from attending due to class size reduction. TVCS is not unique in that way. They have to do what needs to be done or be fined by the state.

I know. See the quoted post I was responding to in post #49 and what I highlighted in it.

[sunnyatlast]

From The Villages Charter Schools "Charter School in the Workplace" page:

"The public charter school/private corporation partnership that we have forged has proved beneficial to both. In these times of limited funds, public school accountability and quality coupled with corporate buy-in is a win-win situation. Tax dollars are being supplemented with private commitment and investment and the likelihood of success becomes eminent. And, because of the quality education that we offer to our students, The Villages has been able to attract and retain a higher caliber of employee resulting in a highly efficient workforce and reducing company costs. This benefit to employment is one that we would certainly recommend to other large corporations…"


Here are the State of Florida
Financial Statements and
Independent Auditors' Report on
THE VILLAGES CHARTER SCHOOL, INC.

(A CHARTER SCHOOL AND COMPONENT UNIT OF THE SUMTER COUNTY DISTRICT SCHOOL BOARD) THE VILLAGES, FLORIDA

http://www.myflorida.com/audgen/pages/chschools_efile%20rpts/2014%20the%20villages%20charter%20school.pdf

[blueash]

Interesting, since we were told right off the bat by a teacher or two that the public schools here were, and are, far better than TV Charter Schools, and that the regular schools' teachers are far better than TVCS' teachers.

And yet, accusations are made that students, who don't qualify according to qualifying rules AND state-mandated CAPACITY of TVCS, are being "deprived" by not attending TV Charter Schools.

This is the second posting by you claiming that some person, a teacher, made a statement that the public schools here were and are far better than TV Charter Schools. I have read every single post and no where does that statement occur. The only one even close is this sentence

"Good school, yes. The best, not even close"

which is very clearly in reference to every school in the state of Florida, not local schools. There, unless I missed it, is nothing to support your claim of what others have said.
TVCS elementary is #162 in Florida
TVCS middle school is #86
TVCS high school is #40

and most of the schools ranked higher than ours have more students per class than TVCS so I'm not sure where the filled classroom argument applies.
Best Middle Schools in Florida - FL School Rankings (http://www.schooldigger.com/go/FL/schoolrank.aspx?level=2)

So perhaps the characterization of good but not the best is accurate?

[Northwoods]

I believe The Villages realized that in order to attract a talented workforce, they needed to offer people with K - 12 school-age children a quality education. Like it or not... it's smart business. My daughter, a healthcare professional with 2 small children, recently moved to the area. She is willing to take a lower-paying job in order to improve her odds of keeping her children in the VCS. She is more than willing to do that, because she wants the best education for her children.
Although some people on this post have said that the VCS is good but not great... I believe that compared to the schools in this area, the VCS by far has the best rating.
Businesses in TV use eligibility to the VCS as a incentive for employment. It's is an incentive for people to move to the area and work for The Villages or their partners. Again... a very smart business move by The Villages.

[sunnyatlast]

This is the second posting by you claiming that some person, a teacher, made a statement that the public schools here were and are far better than TV Charter Schools. I have read every single post and no where does that statement occur. The only one even close is this sentence

"Good school, yes. The best, not even close"

which is very clearly in reference to every school in the state of Florida, not local schools. There, unless I missed it, is nothing to support your claim of what others have said.
TVCS elementary is #162 in Florida
TVCS middle school is #86
TVCS high school is #40

and most of the schools ranked higher than ours have more students per class than TVCS so I'm not sure where the filled classroom argument applies.
Best Middle Schools in Florida - FL School Rankings (http://www.schooldigger.com/go/FL/schoolrank.aspx?level=2)

So perhaps the characterization of good but not the best is accurate?

No. I was referring to the comments made by this poster, as quoted below. I know what I see in the two highlighted sentences.

Um... Vlad. You might want to get around a bit more. As a sub, there is absolutely no way you are qualified to make such a statement. Unless, you have subbed in Every public school in Florida. I'll take my teachers, my programs and my administrators over their's ANY day of the week.
And by the way Vlad, my child graduated from TVCS. Ask yourself, what is the average years of experience and highest level of education the teachers have at TVCS.…..

[jbdlfan]

No. I was referring to the comments made by this poster, as quoted below. I know what I see in the two highlighted sentences.



Yep. And I stand by them. If you look at the Washington Post article listing the America's most challenging high schools, which is what I as a parent would be most interested in, you will find that TVCS didn't come close to being near the top. BHS in Marion County, along with six other schools, finished higher on the list. If I'm sending my kid to school to become competitive for a college scholarship, then I want the most challenging curriculum. I want my child to get the most rigorous education possible to be ready for the challenges of college. As I have said in the past, TVCS AP program is limited.
And I ask again, what is the average level of experience and level of education found at TVCS? It is economics, teachers with less experience demand less pay. They pay the prevailing rate based on local district contracts. Facts are stubborn things.
As for my teachers, staff and administration, I will definitely take mine any day. Sorry, I see what they do EVERY day and see the students they work with. I also know their level of expertise and I know the history of TVCS and MANY teachers that work there or have worked there in the past. Unlike many on this forum that get all their information from reading the DS, we lived it. Oh, and by the way, we had a child graduate from TVCS and have many friends and family that had students there also. Some of those friends, as with us, would have chosen a different direction if we had known then what we know now.

[GaryW]

This kinda sounds like a "My School is better than your School" deal.
My daughter started at the TVCS when she was knee high to a grasshoper.. graduated 2 years ago,,, Scored High on every test possible,,, Same with the one I have in the TVHS now.

Why argue or beat a dog down.

TVCS is a great school. Are there other schools better,, You bet, Are there other schools worse,, YOU BET!!!!! Like saying Stanford is better than Harvard, Depends on what you are looking for. You can pick a bad apple from any where. Just sayin :MOJE_whot:

[joldnol]

TVCS is operated as a not-for-profit corporation.

It is an exception

[jbdlfan]

This kinda sounds like a "My School is better than your School" deal.
My daughter started at the TVCS when she was knee high to a grasshoper.. graduated 2 years ago,,, Scored High on every test possible,,, Same with the one I have in the TVHS now.

Why argue or beat a dog down.

TVCS is a great school. Are there other schools better,, You bet, Are there other schools worse,, YOU BET!!!!! Like saying Stanford is better than Harvard, Depends on what you are looking for. You can pick a bad apple from any where. Just sayin :MOJE_whot:

You are 100% correct. The only reason for my insertion in this discussion was when one chose to disparage ALL other public schools. Very unfair assertion.

[Vladimir]

Um... Vlad. You might want to get around a bit more. As a sub, there is absolutely no way you are qualified to make such a statement. Unless, you have subbed in Every public school in Florida. I'll take my teachers, my programs and my administrators over their's ANY day of the week.
And by the way Vlad, my child graduated from TVCS. Ask yourself, what is the average years of experience and highest level of education the teachers have at TVCS. But you sub there, so you must already know....
Good school, yes. The best, not even close.
I say this with utmost respect.

Um...I do get around more than you know, even out of state. Sounds like your argument is public vs. charter/private school education. There are many good public schools but they are located in the more affluent areas where parents are knowledgeable and involved and financial resources are available. Unfortunately there are not that many good schools located in the state of Florida. As someone said, parents make choices but we are not as qualified as you with your teachers, your programs and your administrators - you can send your child to Wildwood or Fruitland Park schools but my choice was not to raise my kids in the Florida school system.

[DougB]

Um...I do get around more than you know, even out of state. Sounds like your argument is public vs. charter/private school education. There are many good public schools but they are located in the more affluent areas where parents are knowledgeable and involved and financial resources are available. Unfortunately there are not that many good schools located in the state of Florida. As someone said, parents make choices but we are not as qualified as you with your teachers, your programs and your administrators - you can send your child to Wildwood or Fruitland Park schools but my choice was not to raise my kids in the Florida school system.

If you are going to continue subbing in the Florida school system, you really should be more professional with your comments.