New health insurance

[Happinow]

I must preface my post with "I have no dog in this fight". My husband and I have Golden Rule Health Insurance through United Health Care as we are not old enough for Medicare yet. We signed up for this 3 years ago when we first moved here. I did research on the Internet and through recommendations from people on this forum this is what we chose. Over the past 2 years, either our deductible would go up or our premiums would go up. We now have a 10,000 deductible, which in essence means catastrophic health insurance coverage only. This insurance covers next to nothing that we use when trying to stay healthy. Just this week, we received a notice that the premiums were once again going to increase by another 100.00 per month. Feeling fed up with paying an astronomical amount of money for nothing, I went on line to research health insurance. I gave a very brief amount of information on line and the next day I received 6 phone calls from insurance people. So I decided to take the bait and schedule a few people to come and tell us what insurance may be Better for us. We are so glad we did! A very nice young man, Marlon, came to our home and gave us the run down on USHealth Ins. This is NOT part of the ACA. He was very thorough and not pushy at all. The benefits of this coverage far outweighs our coverage with Golden Rule. We have decided to switch to USHealth. For all of you out there who are tired of paying for nothing, please do yourself a favor and call Marlon for an appointment to hear about this insurance. As I said, I didn't know about this insurance before and did not know Marlon. We were just lucky to have him educate us on this insurance and so glad we did! Please PM me If you would like more information or here is his number.....813-215-3006

[Happinow]

It seemed that I just posted this thread just under 2 hours ago and then the threads were consolidated. I think this could be very helpful and important information and I would like people to see it. Adorable Health insurance for those of us under 65 is hard to find. I hope this helps at least one person.

[FMF Doc]

It seemed that I just posted this thread just under 2 hours ago and then the threads were consolidated. I think this could be very helpful and important information and I would like people to see it. Adorable Health insurance for those of us under 65 is hard to find. I hope this helps at least one person.

I have two friends looking. Thanks for the info.

George

[shcisamax]

Excellent post Happinow.
Only one question...I was hoping for affordable health insurance..but I guess adorable health insurance is close. :)

[kbace6]

Excellent post Happinow.
Only one question...I was hoping for affordable health insurance..but I guess adorable health insurance is close. :)

:a20:

[Happinow]

Excellent post Happinow.
Only one question...I was hoping for affordable health insurance..but I guess adorable health insurance is close. :)

Lol....the silly auto correct!! I knew someone would pick up on that. At least it's good for a laugh....

[blueash]

When the OP stated that the insurance in not part of the ACA I looked up the company. This company's policies are not in compliance with the minimum coverage to count as being health insurance, in other words what has been labelled "junk" insurance. If you have this policy you must indicate on your taxes that you do not have health insurance and will be subject to the penalty for being non-insured. Read the policy very carefully, understand what it does not cover, what happens in an expensive or prolonged illness and why the premium is low. You are getting a cheaper cost for a reason.

[outlaw]

When the OP stated that the insurance in not part of the ACA I looked up the company. This company's policies are not in compliance with the minimum coverage to count as being health insurance, in other words what has been labelled "junk" insurance. If you have this policy you must indicate on your taxes that you do not have health insurance and will be subject to the penalty for being non-insured. Read the policy very carefully, understand what it does not cover, what happens in an expensive or prolonged illness and why the premium is low. You are getting a cheaper cost for a reason.

Or you could just ignore it...it could be the premium is low because she doesn't have coverage she doesn't feel she needs.

[Happinow]

With all due respect, with the ACA you are paying for coverage that we as retirees don't need. This new coverage doesn't include maternity or mental health. Just an example of what we currently pay for with Golden Rule. As far as a penalty....the penalty is so low for not having a policy that is compliant with the ACA that even if we had to pay that we are still so far ahead of the game. USHealth, for us, is a much better coverage for our needs. Everyone's needs are different. I wouldn't poo poo it until you've spoken to a representative and obtained all of the facts. Health insurance is a personal choice and it is what will work for us. I simply wanted to reach out to those who didn't qualify for Medicare yet because health insurance for us is extremely expensive and I found a better plan for less money. I can't answer all questions because I'm not an expert, however, someone representing this insurance can. You have to make your own choices, but for us it was head and shoulders better than what we currently have.

[njbchbum]

Happinow - Have you researched how many doctors/specialists/hospitals in the area of the Villages accepts your new coverage?

[Abby10]

Thank you, Happinow, for your post. There are many of us out there in the same boat that need this type of information. We are still in PA and the insurance system, as you know, is different from state to state. We're looking forward to moving to The Villages full-time in the next year or 2, but affordable healthcare options is a big concern for us. Thanks for starting this discussion and being willing to share the specifics of your journey!

[sunnyatlast]

When the OP stated that the insurance in not part of the ACA I looked up the company. This company's policies are not in compliance with the minimum coverage to count as being health insurance, in other words what has been labelled "junk" insurance. If you have this policy you must indicate on your taxes that you do not have health insurance and will be subject to the penalty for being non-insured. Read the policy very carefully, understand what it does not cover, what happens in an expensive or prolonged illness and why the premium is low. You are getting a cheaper cost for a reason.

Many would call it "junk" to force us 60-year-olds to buy coverage for maternity and birth control pills that cost $12/mo. at Target.

[billybye]

The ACA helped allow my wife to retire a few years earlier than she could have done without it. The cost for ACA was less than 1/2 of what COBRA would have cost, which runs out in 18 months. We are not rich, so I guess that helps. If we were better off financially, I guess it would have cost more.
We were told by an insurance agent that ACA would cost more than COBRA would. He was so ignorant, he would not even run the numbers, I will not name him, but he sells a lot of insurance in The Villages.
We went online and found it easy to sign up and get a good policy. It doesn't cost anything to check out and a lot of people may get a surprise.

[rubicon]

I simply just shudder when dealing with the health insurance market

[Paper1]

Thank you for starting this thread. My wife and I are 62 and 63 and currently paying $1200. a month for coverage with a $7200. deductable while Healthcare stocks are soaring and CEO pay is obscene . The cost of health care is the problem. When it cost $600. for a cortizone shot we have a problem. Now I'll get off my soap box and do a little research on your insurance supplier. Thank you again.

[Happinow]

Before putting the pen to paper, I have called my health care providers, Colony Health Care and Palm Ridge Dental and they do bill our insurance. So we are covered. With our insurance there is no copay and no deductible so no worries there. There are things USHealth doesn't cover but no health insurance covers everything, but this insurance covers what is important to us. We had some questions today about our plan and called Marlon and he returned our call in a very timely fashion. My mind is at ease and I feel better about my health insurance. 😀😀😀

[tumbleweed]

According to A.M. Best, the long-standing rating organization for insurance companies, USHealth Group and the related companies market "ACA exempt supplemental" health insurance. The following is copy from a recent Best report which may help interested parties in making their health insurance decision.

"FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
OLDWICK - APRIL 22, 2015
A.M. Best has upgraded the issuer credit ratings to "bb+" from "bb" and affirmed the financial strength rating of B (Fair) of the subsidiaries of USHEALTH Group, Inc.: Freedom Life Insurance Company of America (Freedom Life) and National Foundation Life Insurance Company (NFL) (referred to collectively as USHEALTH Group). The outlook for all ratings has been revised to positive from stable. All companies are domiciled in Fort Worth, TX.
The rating upgrades reflect USHEALTH Group's diversified revenue growth in Affordable Care Act (ACA) exempt supplemental health lines of business, strong operating results and improved capitalization. The company has successfully identified and reached the underserved segment of this market. USHEALTH Group remains focused on further expanding its ancillary product offerings, developing captive distribution in new geographies and maintaining long-term customer relationships as a means of increasing its scale and brand recognition in the marketplace. In addition, during 2014 and in the first quarter of 2015, the holding company significantly improved its financial flexibility through debt refinancing on more favorable terms and accelerated debt repayment. Additionally, the outlook revision to positive reflects A.M. Best's opinion that the USHEALTH Group is positioned for future profitable growth and enhanced financial flexibility.
Partially offsetting these positive rating factors is the challenge to maintain the growth in supplemental medical products. Additionally, future revenue expansion is tied to USHEALTH Group's ability to grow its captive agency force, which A.M. Best views as a significant competitive advantage. Moreover, the debt at USHEALTH Group, Inc., although substantially reduced, is still supported by operating company dividends, which may hamper capital and surplus growth at Freedom Life and NFL.
A.M. Best believes that future positive rating actions for USHEALTH Group may result from organic earnings growth, further reduction in leverage throughout the organization, continued strong operating results and growth of risk-adjusted capitalization at each of the subsidiaries. Future negative rating actions could occur due to weakened operating performance, increased financial leverage or deterioration of risk-adjusted capitalization levels."

Those interested should be aware that they most likely will be subject to penalties for not having ACA qualifying coverage and also should note that Best's only assigns a B "Fair" credit rating. Financial strength- or lack of it- can be a factor in claims evaluation and payment practices. I have no dog in this fight, either, but suggest due diligence in health insurance matters.

[CathyandSteveG]

Thank you very much for this information. I am 60...my husband is 62....we presently have our home on the market and plan to retire and move to the villages as soon as our home sells.

One of the great unknowns for us will be the cost of health insurance. Quite frankly...we are scared to death. We have been trying to figure out the best company to go with and the type of coverage to get.

[RickeyD]

It seemed that I just posted this thread just under 2 hours ago and then the threads were consolidated. I think this could be very helpful and important information and I would like people to see it. Adorable Health insurance for those of us under 65 is hard to find. I hope this helps at least one person.


...

[gomoho]

I can tell you if you are under 65 and not eligible for Medicare and have enough cash on hand to live off of and can show no income or low income like social security only you can make out quite well with Obamacare. They do not look at your assests - only your income. No, I am not doing this I am on medicare, but have friends that were able to take advantage of this exact situation. And no it is not fraud - all questions the government thought necessary to ask were answered honestly. They just never thought to include assests in their questions. And we wonder why this country is in trouble!

[Abby10]

I don't think this country is in trouble because they don't ask the right questions. I don't think it's in trouble at all. Now, WWII, that's trouble, the twin towers falling, that's trouble. American business sending our jobs overseas , that's trouble. Having real people buying health coverage over a government website, not trouble at all.

I think the point that gomoho is making is that our country is headed into deep financial trouble because of the exact scenario that she presents. She is correct that assets are not taken into consideration, so a lot of people who are early retirees are eligible. Many people in there 50's and early 60's who have lost their jobs prematurely due to downsizing, the changing economy, etc, are now eligible for insurance through the ACA with a subsidy. The problem is that it is beginning to put such a huge strain on the funding available for this program that it most likely will not be able to sustain itself. The better solution would have been an effort to keep people employed, thereby obtaining their insurance through their employer until medicare kicks in. I will stop here as I don't wish this to get political. This is a very important conversation and one that I would like to see continue with the sharing of ideas and experiences. Thanks again to the OP for starting this thread.

[RickeyD]

I think the point that gomoho is making is that our country is headed into deep financial trouble because of the exact scenario that she presents. She is correct that assets are not taken into consideration, so a lot of people who are early retirees are eligible. Many people in there 50's and early 60's who have lost their jobs prematurely due to downsizing, the changing economy, etc, are now eligible for insurance through the ACA with a subsidy. The problem is that it is beginning to put such a huge strain on the funding available for this program that it most likely will not be able to sustain itself. The better solution would have been an effort to keep people employed, thereby obtaining their insurance through their employer until medicare kicks in. I will stop here as I don't wish this to get political. This is a very important conversation and one that I would like to see continue with the sharing of ideas and experiences. Thanks again to the OP for starting this thread.


Well, I do have a dog in this fight. Wife and myself will be retiring early and will need the ACA to bridge us over to Medicare. The ACA makes this possible. I know what I'm about to say will **** many people off for a variety of reasons, but here goes.. I've never taken a handout from any person or government entity, I served in the USN as was my duty. I feel that with all the malingerers taking handouts I'll stick my hand out just this one time. Hell, I could be dead in five years, I just want to retire a little bit earlier.

[Abby10]

Well, I do have a dog in this fight. Wife and myself will be retiring early and will need the ACA to bridge us over to Medicare. The ACA makes this possible. I know what I'm about to say will **** many people off for a variety of reasons, but here goes.. I've never taken a handout from any person or government entity, I served in the USN as was my duty. I feel that with all the malingerers taking handouts I'll stick my hand out just this one time. Hell, I could be dead in five years, I just want to retire a little bit earlier.

Rickey - I agree with all that you say and apologize if I came off in anyway that I was attacking you and/or your decisions. My post was just an attempt to explain what I think gomoho may have meant by "trouble". Truth be told, my husband and I are currently on insurance through the ACA, although not necessarily by choice. We both lost our jobs within 1 year of each other because of cutbacks, and our biggest expense was healthcare. Luckily, over the years we lived frugally enough to be in a position to pay for our living expenses otherwise, but we struggled to continue paying our healthcare premium. We are just one of many examples of people who are able to get subsidies (although we did not even know that when we applied for insurance) because we currently have so little income and assets are not considered. Our plan was not to retire so young, but who would have thought that times would change so drastically. Ironically we are both in the healthcare field and in many areas they are doing with less workers. To top it off there is a LOT of ageism going on. Unfortunately, experience and dedication are not valued in the workplace anymore and jobs (at least full-time ones with benefits) are scarce. So, I speak from direct experience, although I am not entirely comfortable with the choice we had to make. I do not see how it will sustain itself as it currently operates and welcome other ideas and/or avenues for the future as we have quite a few more years until Medicare. It is not easy being in your 50's these days - I'm just thankful that we were not foolish with our money during the years that we were able to work and save.

And by the the way, Rickey, I just want to say thank you for your service. I greatly admire those who serve and have served. Best wishes for your early retirement - I hope all goes well for you. I will warn you though, be prepared to call the marketplace every month if you are one of the "lucky ones" that has to prove income early on in the process. And thanks for the reminder that I need to call them first thing tomorrow morning - they have lost my paperwork 3 times now and threaten to cut me off every other month or so. I just love having to deal with the feds :yuck:! Believe me, I'm still looking for affordable alternatives - that's why I want to keep this thread alive.

[CathyandSteveG]

I am wondering how many of you seem to qualify for ACA....the income cutoff seems fairly low so it appears that people with an average or better income will not qualify.

Any help you can give is appreciated.

[Abby10]

I am wondering how many of you seem to qualify for ACA....the income cutoff seems fairly low so it appears that people with an average or better income will not qualify.

Any help you can give is appreciated.

Income cutoff is $62,000 or less per year. Depending on where you live, I guess, and one's lifestyle, that's not necessarily low.

[Irishmen]

Not part of the ACA. Really. All health insurance is tied into the ACA. Remember the ACA is a tax. You are being taxed and money used to pay for other people's policy who are subsidized. Thanks Obama for the 10k deductible.

[CathyandSteveG]

Well, i wonder if that figure of $62,000 would include social security, or pension????
We are 60 and 62 and hope to retire very soon...but we will have no health insurance....so we are investigating possibilities.

[RickeyD]

Rickey - I agree with all that you say and apologize if I came off in anyway that I was attacking you and/or your decisions. My post was just an attempt to explain what I think gomoho may have meant by "trouble". Truth be told, my husband and I are currently on insurance through the ACA, although not necessarily by choice. We both lost our jobs within 1 year of each other because of cutbacks, and our biggest expense was healthcare. Luckily, over the years we lived frugally enough to be in a position to pay for our living expenses otherwise, but we struggled to continue paying our healthcare premium. We are just one of many examples of people who are able to get subsidies (although we did not even know that when we applied for insurance) because we currently have so little income and assets are not considered. Our plan was not to retire so young, but who would have thought that times would change so drastically. Ironically we are both in the healthcare field and in many areas they are doing with less workers. To top it off there is a LOT of ageism going on. Unfortunately, experience and dedication are not valued in the workplace anymore and jobs (at least full-time ones with benefits) are scarce. So, I speak from direct experience, although I am not entirely comfortable with the choice we had to make. I do not see how it will sustain itself as it currently operates and welcome other ideas and/or avenues for the future as we have quite a few more years until Medicare. It is not easy being in your 50's these days - I'm just thankful that we were not foolish with our money during the years that we were able to work and save.



And by the the way, Rickey, I just want to say thank you for your service. I greatly admire those who serve and have served. Best wishes for your early retirement - I hope all goes well for you. I will warn you though, be prepared to call the marketplace every month if you are one of the "lucky ones" that has to prove income early on in the process. And thanks for the reminder that I need to call them first thing tomorrow morning - they have lost my paperwork 3 times now and threaten to cut me off every other month or so. I just love having to deal with the feds :yuck:! Believe me, I'm still looking for affordable alternatives - that's why I want to keep this thread alive.


When you say you have to prove income, what exactly does that mean ?

[Irishmen]

If you served in the military, is not the VA your healthcare provider?

[Abby10]

Well, i wonder if that figure of $62,000 would include social security, or pension????
We are 60 and 62 and hope to retire very soon...but we will have no health insurance....so we are investigating possibilities.

Yes. Basically, Cathy and Steve, it boils down to what your adjusted gross income is on your yearly tax return - line 37, to be exact. The subsidy is tiered depending on your adjusted gross income, but it must be $62,000 or less to be eligible for any subsidy. You can still buy insurance through the marketplace above that income, but it will not be subsidized - you pay full premium. That's what we were initially considering because buying insurance through the marketplace would have been cheaper than Cobra or going it on our own. Good luck with your search.......let's keep sharing info and knowledge!

[Abby10]

When you say you have to prove income, what exactly does that mean ?

So initially you fill out the application form and once it is entered into their database, they apparently have some kind of lottery system where they pick a certain percentage of applicants who must prove that what they said on their app is true. Basically, it seems like it should be a pretty easy process - they send you the info as to what they want for proof and you mail it in. Examples would be a copy of your tax statement showing adjusted gross income, paycheck stub, SS statement or whatever. The problem is they will not allow you to send it registered mail with return receipt - only regular mail, so there is no way to know if they got it or not. So far I have sent mine in 3 times and am still waiting to hear if they got it. The other method is by scanning and sending via their website. The only problem with that has been that I can't remember my password and they keep saying they will send it to me via email - never happened. It's the ineptness of the system that will kill ya! Every time I go to the PO with my letter to mail they just shake their head - apparently I'm not the first "victim" with this problem. Thank goodness we had a wonderful agent at the beginning who came right to our house and filed the app for us - at least we didn't have to deal with that headache!

[CathyandSteveG]

Yes. Basically, Cathy and Steve, it boils down to what your adjusted gross income is on your yearly tax return - line 37, to be exact. The subsidy is tiered depending on your adjusted gross income, but it must be $62,000 or less to be eligible for any subsidy. You can still buy insurance through the marketplace above that income, but it will not be subsidized - you pay full premium. That's what we were initially considering because buying insurance through the marketplace would have been cheaper than Cobra or going it on our own. Good luck with your search.......let's keep sharing info and knowledge!

thank you Abby! Steve is continuing to search. We are having trouble finding an insurance at a discount...and of course...since we have not retired yet...we are guestimating what our income will be.

But thinking we have to pay $7000 deductible and $1300 a month is really frightening! Granted...when Steve turns 65...that will decrease...he will get medicare...and then i will be 62 and can draw social security...but the next 2 years is a bit scary!

[Abby10]

thank you Abby! Steve is continuing to search. We are having trouble finding an insurance at a discount...and of course...since we have not retired yet...we are guestimating what our income will be.

But thinking we have to pay $7000 deductible and $1300 a month is really frightening! Granted...when Steve turns 65...that will decrease...he will get medicare...and then i will be 62 and can draw social security...but the next 2 years is a bit scary!

I hear ya! We are in the same boat trying to figure out the best thing to do for the next few years.......so many variables to consider. If you find something good, come back on and share with the rest of us! :wave:

[CathyandSteveG]

will do!

[blueash]

Yes. Basically, Cathy and Steve, it boils down to what your adjusted gross income is on your yearly tax return - line 37, to be exact. The subsidy is tiered depending on your adjusted gross income, but it must be $62,000 or less to be eligible for any subsidy. You can still buy insurance through the marketplace above that income, but it will not be subsidized - you pay full premium. That's what we were initially considering because buying insurance through the marketplace would have been cheaper than Cobra or going it on our own. Good luck with your search.......let's keep sharing info and knowledge!

Abby, not exactly true. Your eligibility is based on your household income, not your "taxable adjusted gross income" Line 37 does not include items that must be reported in determining eligibility. Simplest example is tax-free income. Social security income is included in the calculation. All family member's income must be reported not just the person applying for coverage. Thus if there is a person 65 on Medicare and a spouse 62 applying via the ACA, and a 30 year old living in the home who is your dependent , the income of all 3 persons must be reported. It does not matter if you file taxes jointly or not.
This is all household income.
Here are two sites that will give a better explanation
https://www.healthcare.gov/income-and-household-information/income/

http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/pdf/2013/MAGI_summary13.pdf

[TNLAKEPANDA]

A $10,000 deductible before ACA Was unheard of. Basically the insurance company is at minimal if any risk at all.

[billybye]

The ACA will ask you to estimate your net taxable family income and then send any proof of what you will earn or a letter explaining how you came up with estimate. Any mistake in estimating will wash out with following year's tax return. Net worth is not a consideration.
Anyone who does not at least check it out is probably missing out on a good policy that the government actually helps you pay for.
Some people who just hate Obama won't check it out for that reason. That is just ignorant.
The ACA allowed my wife to retire a few years earlier than she could without it.

[Abby10]

Abby, not exactly true. Your eligibility is based on your household income, not your "taxable adjusted gross income" Line 37 does not include items that must be reported in determining eligibility. Simplest example is tax-free income. Social security income is included in the calculation. All family member's income must be reported not just the person applying for coverage. Thus if there is a person 65 on Medicare and a spouse 62 applying via the ACA, and a 30 year old living in the home who is your dependent , the income of all 3 persons must be reported. It does not matter if you file taxes jointly or not.
This is all household income.
Here are two sites that will give a better explanation
https://www.healthcare.gov/income-and-household-information/income/

http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/pdf/2013/MAGI_summary13.pdf

Thank you, blueash, for the links. Our agent must have simplified the process for us by telling us that we could use the adjusted gross income figure because it does work in our case - married, filing jointly, no one else living in the household, and none of the other items on the list pertain to us. But I can see how each case would be different when you take into consideration what they call MAGI. Good information! Thanks again, as I would not want to mislead anyone.

[RickeyD]

This is the Everything you wanted to know about the ACA but we're afraid to ask post. Good information with knowledgable and experienced posters !

[sunnyatlast]

A $10,000 deductible before ACA Was unheard of. Basically the insurance company is at minimal if any risk at all.

Patients are more at risk with these forced high deductibles, because the responsible newly insureds are now are not going to the doctor (if they could get one with their new insurance card but no dr. that can take more patients) nor to the ER when sick or in need of preventative care, because they do not have the cash up front to pay these bills while raising a family on a $60,000 household income and are trying to pay insurance premiums of $1100/month.

It also puts the hospitals and providers at more risk of uncollectible debt and insolvency, because more people now have a $5,000 - $12,000 deductible they don't have the money to pay when they absolutely HAVE TO go to the ER for a true emergency when they've not yet met their deductible.... to get some use out of the $1100/month premiums they're trying to pay!

Unpaid and uncollectible debt was a problem before the ACA changes, and now the high deductibles many insured people have are causing even more unpaid bills/uncollectible debt to hospitals and providers:

2011 - On average, uninsured families can pay only about 12% of their hospital bills in full.

Families with incomes above 400% of the poverty level, or about $88,000 a year for a family of four, pay about 37% of their hospital bills in full, according to the Department of Health and Human Services study.


Patients going without care because of high deductibles:

Example excerpt:
"Surgeon Paul Ruggieri of Fall River, Mass., says his patients with high-deductible plans often blanch at the out-of-pocket cost to electively treat two common ailments he sees regularly — gallstones and hernias — until they become potentially dangerous and costly emergencies.

If the procedures are done electively, patients are required to pay half of the cost upfront; a hernia repair done laparoscopically would cost about $4,000 at a surgery center. That's often about the amount of some patients' deductibles, so they would have to pay the full bill out-of-pocket. If the procedure is done at a hospital, even laparoscopically, it can cost as much as $17,000. If patients delay and are rushed to the emergency room for the procedure, the hospital would charge at least two to three times the amount of the surgery, Ruggieri says. It would also mean a two- to three-day hospital stay vs. two hours for the elective procedure, and much longer at-home recuperation.

Jan. 1, 2015 Dilemma over deductibles: Costs crippling middle class (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/01/01/middle-class-workers-struggle-to-pay-for-care-despite-insurance/19841235/)

Up to $49 billion unpaid by uninsured for hospitalizations - USATODAY.com (http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/washington/2011-05-09-uninsured-unpaid-hospital-bills_n.htm)

.

[gomoho]

However - apparently the deductibles work differently if you have subsidies. Not sure how but my friends are simply paying a co=pay whenever they go to the doc - not just for the things that are mandated free.