Adult children in The Villages

[advp007]

Recent commentary about this has brought a question to mind. What happens when the senior citizen parents pass? What, if any, restrictions are there to the ownership of the house? Can the kids move in? Are they required to sell the house? Are other senior communities different in this respect?

If the heirs have no restriction as to ownership and residence it seems that in time the senior citizen community will disappear.

[justjim]

I think most of the time the house is sold by the heirs to another 55 or older person and the money split among the children.

[Sandtrap328]

Thought provoking question, to say the least. I am under the impression that up to 20 percent of the homes could be owned by under age 55 people. I have no idea if this is somehow monitored but I doubt it.

[redwitch]

Technically, a 5 YO could own the home, but could only live in it 30 days a year until age 19. Most adult children who inherit here quickly sell the house. A few keep it for vacation, rental purposes. A very, very few actually move into the homes. There are some issues worth worrying about. I don't think this remaining anything but a very active retirement community is one of them.

[Warren Kiefer]

i think most of the time the house is sold by the heirs to another 55 or older person and the money split among the children.

adult children can live in the villages with no restrictions.

[Taltarzac725]

adult children can live in the villages with no restrictions.

Now I am 56 but we moved here from Palm Harbor in 2005. I was 46 when we moved here around June 20, 2005. Not sure of the date. The only thing that seems different from my parents is the color of my Villages ID card. Mine's blue: there's are green. http://www.districtgov.org/departments/Community-Service/Residency%20requirements%20for%20non-owners%201.15.2015.pdf

I have no idea what happens when my parents' pass if that happens before I do. The will determines that.

[Topspinmo]

I don't think there any control over resales. Anybody over 19 could buy? There is no census taken on who living in nor does one check. Any 19 year old or older could live here of grandma inheritance if they don't have kids. With 55 thousand house I bet some kids are sneaking in?

[Bavarian]

Our Sales Rep said at the time there was no restrictions on resales, especially with young outside Realtors, said don't worry, no young people would want to move here. Can IO sell you a bridge I own?

My parents bougt in the '70s a Condo in Germany to use for long vacations. All people their age. The owners are dying out or moving to Nursing homes. Now these were small one bedroom one Bath apartments. But one family with kids bought two and made one big one. Now kids on bikes leaving main door locks open, not so good.

[Bonny]

A couple in our neighborhood both passed away. The kids come once in awhile, but they rent it out most of the time.

[graciegirl]

I don't think there any control over resales. Anybody over 19 could buy? There is no census taken on who living in nor does one check. Any 19 year old or older could live here of grandma inheritance if they don't have kids. With 55 thousand house I bet some kids are sneaking in?





Yes they do keep track. Our senior citizen community is underal federal housing guidelines. It is the people whose names are on the deed that count. You had to have a picture ID to get any permanent ID. It is a DEED restriction not a HOA rule. So the 80/20 thing is goin' on. But we know what group causes the most headaches.

But lots can get around this by being Lonnnnnnng time guests.

I can't see how any can think that the younger people are anywhere near 20per cent yet.

[Challenger]

Yes they do keep track. Our senior citizen community is underal federal housing guidelines. It is the people whose names are on the deed that count. You had to have a picture ID to get any permanent ID. It is a DEED restriction not a HOA rule. So the 80/20 thing is goin' on. But we know what group causes the most headaches.

But lots can get around this by being Lonnnnnnng time guests.

I can't see how any can think that the younger people are anywhere near 20per cent yet.

Actually, my understanding, is that quota has nothing to do with the number of people in TV. I believe the restriction is that the number of homes with 1 or more occupants, age 55 and over must be no less than 80 % of the total dwellings.

Now that I have made a firm statement of fact, maybe I better check again:coolsmiley:

[OldManTime]

adult children can live in the villages with no restrictions.

Until they are arrested for drunkeness, drugs, and jailed for hopefully a long time. Grandparents & Parents wake up, take the blinders off, its called "Tough Love"

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Now I am 56 but we moved here from Palm Harbor in 2005. I was 46 when we moved here around June 20, 2005. Not sure of the date. The only thing that seems different from my parents is the color of my Villages ID card. Mine's blue: there's are green. http://www.districtgov.org/departments/Community-Service/Residency%20requirements%20for%20non-owners%201.15.2015.pdf

I have no idea what happens when my parents' pass if that happens before I do. The will determines that.

The blue card indicates that they name is on the deed.

Eighty percent of the homes in any 55 and older community must be occupied by at least one person over the age of 55.

People under the age of 55 are allowed to own properties. 100% of the homes could theoretically be owned by people under the age of 55 as long as they are occupied by at least one person over the age of 55. It is possible, though highly unlikely that as many as 80% of the residents could be under age 55 and still be in compliance.

The check is the Villages ID card. Even when resales are done through non-Villages agencies, they occupants must apply for an ID card.

The 20% rule was created in order to allow some room for spouses and heirs left behind when an owner passes.

My wife is much younger than I am and it's very likely that I pass on before she reaches 55. She will be allowed to stay because of that rule.

The 80% rule is actually a federal law defining over 55 communities. It allows them certain variances with regard to schools and other IRS regulations. It also circumvents age discrimination laws.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Yes they do keep track. Our senior citizen community is underal federal housing guidelines. It is the people whose names are on the deed that count. You had to have a picture ID to get any permanent ID. It is a DEED restriction not a HOA rule. So the 80/20 thing is goin' on. But we know what group causes the most headaches.

But lots can get around this by being Lonnnnnnng time guests.

I can't see how any can think that the younger people are anywhere near 20per cent yet.

I don't think that that's correct Gracie. It has nothing to do with the names on the deed. Anyone can own a home here. The law is about occupancy. I know of a real estate agent that owns several homes and rents them to people over the age of 55.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

adult children can live in the villages with no restrictions.

True as long as they are over 18.

[PammyJ]

Until they are arrested for drunkeness, drugs, and jailed for hopefully a long time. Grandparents & Parents wake up, take the blinders off, its called "Tough Love"

Ok then what do we do with the variety of over 55 who are arrested for the same thing? Plenty to go around in that age range!

[NavyNJ]

Recent commentary about this has brought a question to mind. What happens when the senior citizen parents pass? What, if any, restrictions are there to the ownership of the house? Can the kids move in? Are they required to sell the house? Are other senior communities different in this respect?

If the heirs have no restriction as to ownership and residence it seems that in time the senior citizen community will disappear.

Believe you're mixing issues a bit with this. There never has been, or by law, can be, a restriction on who may "purchase" a property within TV (or anywhere else for that matter). (Btw, I'm leaving places like NYC with their Condo Boards out of this discussion to keep it simple) Persons of any age may purchase a home in TV, and many children do just that for their parents or grandparents. The issue that you probably are wanting to focus on is who is actually "living" in the homes within TV. That's a whole other issue and one that, as recent discussions in CDD4 have shown, is becoming more an more problematic within TV as the demographics change.

Basically, so long as there is at least one (1) resident in the home 55+, the remaining residents only need to meet the minimum age guidelines of at least 19 yrs old.

So, to answer your scenarios above, if an adult owner passes, and the home is left to the kids, yes, they can move in if they choose, so long as at least one of them is 55+. If they choose not to move in, or are too young to become a permanent resident of TV, they can sell the property, rent it, or maintain it vacant so long as they keep up the appearance.

That's about as complicated as it might get, under normal circumstances. There will always be the outlier situation, for sure, but those options cover the majority of cases I would think. As for other 55+ communities around the country, I have no idea. Hope that helps a little.....it can certainly get muddy!!

[rubicon]

The difference in the color of the villages ID card (green vis a vis blue) is based on what names our on the deed for those living here. So if a residents adult child lives with them and is on their deed they get a green ID and if they are not o the deed they are issued a blue ID card.

What children do with their inheritance depends on their circumstances. My kids tell me that thy will sell the house....that's today we don't know what tomorrow has in store for us.

[Warren Kiefer]

I don't think that that's correct Gracie. It has nothing to do with the names on the deed. Anyone can own a home here. The law is about occupancy. I know of a real estate agent that owns several homes and rents them to people over the age of 55.

A person, yes even a child can be the owner of a residence here in the Villages. There is a rule that one must be 19 to be a permanent resident. Please note the difference, owner at any age, resident at least 19.

[DougB]

.........

Basically, so long as there is at least one (1) resident in the home 55+, the remaining residents only need to meet the minimum age guidelines of at least 19 yrs old.

So, to answer your scenarios above, if an adult owner passes, and the home is left to the kids, yes, they can move in if they choose, so long as at least one of them is 55+. If they choose not to move in, or are too young to become a permanent resident of TV, they can sell the property, rent it, or maintain it vacant so long as they keep up the appearance.......

If the owner passes away, and the home is left to the kids, they can move in if they choose, so long as they are older than 19. None of them have to be 55+.

[PammyJ]

Ok then what do we do with the variety of over 55 who are arrested for the same thing? Plenty to go around in that age range!

Today, a certain online news source is reporting a 70,76.and 50 year old were arrested with charges from drugs to choking someone. I am tired of people saying it is all adult children and are writing letters to the developer to restrict them from living here.

[graciegirl]

Today, a certain online news source is reporting a 70,76.and 50 year old were arrested with charges from drugs to choking someone. I am tired of people saying it is all adult children and are writing letters to the developer to restrict them from living here.



I think it foolish to try to change the rules. And of course it isn't all adult children.

What annoys me is that it is SO wonderful that everyone wants to live here and I so want it to continue to be the adult, over 55 community, peopled by the ago group I enjoy a lot right now. Grown up people with a very alive attitude and a lot of accrued wisdom. I love being surrounded by similar age people,(fifties or better) finished with the business of running the world and allowed to go out and play. It is like a college campus for seniors. Now if I could only get Sweetie to stop working...............

[Topspinmo]

Ok then what do we do with the variety of over 55 who are arrested for the same thing? Plenty to go around in that age range!


They get arrested like all law breakers should. Just being drunk not against the law. It's when you break the law being drunk.

[graciegirl]

Actually, my understanding, is that quota has nothing to do with the number of people in TV. I believe the restriction is that the number of homes with 1 or more occupants, age 55 and over must be no less than 80 % of the total dwellings.

Now that I have made a firm statement of fact, maybe I better check again:coolsmiley:



That is what I have always heard. Do I worry about it? No. All the adult children that I know personally are delightful and a huge addition to this place.

[graciegirl]

I don't think that that's correct Gracie. It has nothing to do with the names on the deed. Anyone can own a home here. The law is about occupancy. I know of a real estate agent that owns several homes and rents them to people over the age of 55.



You are right.

[NavyNJ]

If the owner passes away, and the home is left to the kids, they can move in if they choose, so long as they are older than 19. None of them have to be 55+.

In reality, you may be right. However, it's not an automatic I don't think. I can't conjure up a set of conditions where the Developer would disallow kids under 55 to move in and live there, but it would have to be requested by the kids, and approved by the Developer for it to happen.

Here's the language in (most of, I think) the Deed Restrictions:
"The Developer or its designee in its sole discretion shall have the right to establish hardship exceptions to permit individuals between the ages of nineteen (19) and fifty-five (55) to permanently reside in a Home even though there is not a permanent resident in the Home who is fifty-five (55) years of age or older, providing that said exceptions shall not be permitted in situations where the granting of a hardship exception would result in less than 80% of the Homesites in the Subdivision having less than one resident fifty-five (55) years of age or older....."

Again, chances of that happening might be nil, but it's not an automatic.

[wdonze]

We sold our home in TV last fall using a Villages agent. The couple that purchased our home were both in their forties and became permanent residents, but did not have any children. I made multiple phone calls to various departments in the Villages, but no one could tell me who, if anyone, was keeping track of residents' ages. I was concerned that I could be culpable for knowingly selling to buyers under 55, but was told I was not. The best that I could determine was that the only hard and fast rule was no children under 19. It would be interesting if the Feds said to the Villages "Prove that you are compliant with the 80/20 resident rule".

[sunnyatlast]

We sold our home in TV last fall using a Villages agent. The couple that purchased our home were both in their forties and became permanent residents, but did not have any children. I made multiple phone calls to various departments in the Villages, but no one could tell me who, if anyone, was keeping track of residents' ages. I was concerned that I could be culpable for knowingly selling to buyers under 55, but was told I was not. The best that I could determine was that the only hard and fast rule was no children under 19. It would be interesting if the Feds said to the Villages "Prove that you are compliant with the 80/20 resident rule".

Google is your friend when you want to see the facts in the law, linked below with key excerpts.

And The Villages does keep track of residents' age, because all Dates of Birth are recorded in the database from which our ID Cards are printed and issued.

Also, I remember at closing (when purchasing a resale home) having to sign a document stating that at least one of us was over 55 and that we did not have children under age 19 who would be living in the home with us.


Questions and Answers Concerning the Final Rule Implementing
the Housing for Older Persons Act of 1995 (HOPA)

(Excerpts)

Question 14
What does the ratio or percentage of 80/20 portion of housing mean?

Answer
HOPA requires that at least 80 percent of the occupied units must be occupied by at least one person 55 or older. The remaining 20 percent of the units may be occupied by persons under 55, and the community/facility may still qualify for the exemption.....

Question 15
Is it lawful to advertise or market the 20 percent portion of the units not required to be occupied by at least one person 55 years of age or older to prospective tenants/purchasers under age 55 and to families with children?

Answer
Yes. However, the marketing must be done in a way that identifies the facility/community as housing intended for older persons. Advertising and marketing must not be inconsistent with the intent......

Question 17
If a housing facility or community meets the requirements of HOPA but permits up to 20 percent of the units to be occupied by families with children, may the facility/community impose different terms and conditions of residency on those families with children who reside there?

Answer
Yes. If a housing community/facility qualifies under HOPA as housing for older persons, the community/facility is exempt from the Act's prohibition against discrimination on the basis of familial status. The housing community/facility may restrict families with children from benefits of the community, or otherwise treat family households differently than senior households, as long as those actions do not violate any other state or local law. However, the community/facility is not exempt from the provisions of the Act that prohibit discrimination against any resident or potential resident on the basis of race, color, religion, national origin, sex, or disability.....

http://www.hud.gov/offices/fheo/library/hopa95.pdf

[asianthree]

Our home was sold to a 29 year old and 32 year old. Sold thru the villages. We had no say. We were hoping someone was going to love the home like we did. But no

[Wavy Chips]

I completely understand the whole 80/20 equation, but I thought I heard that this was computed on a village by village basis rather than TV as a whole. Can anyone clarify that?

[Bonny]

We moved here from Michigan. We built a house here in 2000 in Santiago. I was 48 and hubby was 49. Our 19 year old daughter moved here with us. A year later she married and bought a house outside of the Villages. In 2005, my step son moved in with us. He was with us for 6 months and got a place of his own outside of the Villages. He started working for the Villages Real Estate about 6 months after he moved here. He still works for the Villages.
No questions and no problems what so ever.

[Fred R]

Four pages of answers and still no definitive answer to the question.

[Villager Joyce]

Four pages of answers and still no definitive answer to the question.

A number of people expressed their opinions. Since none were definitive enough, why don't you go to the sales office and a real estate attorney's office and find out the answer. Please be sure and post the information you found out.

[Barefoot]

Recent commentary about this has brought a question to mind. What happens when the senior citizen parents pass? What, if any, restrictions are there to the ownership of the house? Can the kids move in? Are they required to sell the house?
If the owner passes away, and the home is left to the kids, they can move in if they choose, so long as they are older than 19. None of them have to be 55+.. Four pages of answers and still no definitive answer to the question.
I thought the question had been answered.

[Packer Fan]

I am 52. When I bought in January directly from the Villages. I asked about this, and they said it was not a problem - the villages was currently at 8.9% of homes not having someone at least 55. I asked how they knew that and was told it was based on the ID cards.....

[rubicon]

Google is your friend when you want to see the facts in the law, linked below with key excerpts.

And The Villages does keep track of residents' age, because all Dates of Birth are recorded in the database from which our ID Cards are printed and issued.

Also, I remember at closing (when purchasing a resale home) having to sign a document stating that at least one of us was over 55 and that we did not have children under age 19 who would be living in the home with us.


Questions and Answers Concerning the Final Rule Implementing
the Housing for Older Persons Act of 1995 (HOPA)

(Excerpts)

Question 14
What does the ratio or percentage of 80/20 portion of housing mean?

Answer
HOPA requires that at least 80 percent of the occupied units must be occupied by at least one person 55 or older. The remaining 20 percent of the units may be occupied by persons under 55, and the community/facility may still qualify for the exemption.....

Question 15
Is it lawful to advertise or market the 20 percent portion of the units not required to be occupied by at least one person 55 years of age or older to prospective tenants/purchasers under age 55 and to families with children?

Answer
Yes. However, the marketing must be done in a way that identifies the facility/community as housing intended for older persons. Advertising and marketing must not be inconsistent with the intent......

Question 17
If a housing facility or community meets the requirements of HOPA but permits up to 20 percent of the units to be occupied by families with children, may the facility/community impose different terms and conditions of residency on those families with children who reside there?

Answer
Yes. If a housing community/facility qualifies under HOPA as housing for older persons, the community/facility is exempt from the Act's prohibition against discrimination on the basis of familial status. The housing community/facility may restrict families with children from benefits of the community, or otherwise treat family households differently than senior households, as long as those actions do not violate any other state or local law. However, the community/facility is not exempt from the provisions of the Act that prohibit discrimination against any resident or potential resident on the basis of race, color, religion, national origin, sex, or disability.....

http://www.hud.gov/offices/fheo/library/hopa95.pdf

Hi sunnyatlast: great information thank you. However while we know the district records DOB's we don't know what they are doing with them, It is easy for a district employee to throw out a number to a resident when the resident inquires of the 80/20% stats. I watched people in corporations do it all the time which I found to be incredible irresponsible and morally wrong

[kstew43]

I was 43, him 41. No problem at all selling us the house back in 2007. I don't think they would turn anyone away if you got the money.

I suppose they figured we would be 55 eventually.

[CathyandSteveG]

All this time...( since 2012) I thought one person in the household had to be 55. I had absolutely no idea that 20% of the village population could be younger.

You learn something new everyday.

[DougB]

Hi sunnyatlast: great information thank you. However while we know the district records DOB's we don't know what they are doing with them, It is easy for a district employee to throw out a number to a resident when the resident inquires of the 80/20% stats. I watched people in corporations do it all the time which I found to be incredible irresponsible and morally wrong

A little inaccuracy sometimes saves tons of explanation.

[spring_chicken]

Our home was sold to a 29 year old and 32 year old. Sold thru the villages. We had no say. We were hoping someone was going to love the home like we did. But no

How do you know they don't love the home? Their age dictates how much they love a home?
There are a lot of bitter old folks around here.

[Bonny]

Our home was sold to a 29 year old and 32 year old. Sold thru the villages. We had no say. We were hoping someone was going to love the home like we did. But no
Why would you think they wouldn't love the home ? Didn't you have a home you loved when you were that age ? We bought a house in our mid 20's and "loved" it !

[downeaster]

All this time...( since 2012) I thought one person in the household had to be 55. I had absolutely no idea that 20% of the village population could be younger.

You learn something new everyday.

Actually more than 20% could be under 55 as long as one occupant of the residences are 55 or older. Example. Mom, age 50, Dad, age 55 and three twenty something children move in. 80% of the occupants are under 55 but because the other 20% is over 55 it does not adversely effect the 80/20 rule.

I don't think we have a problem. I have been here nearly 14 years and know and have met a lot of people. I personally know of only one residence without an occupant 55 or older.

[Villager Joyce]

There are a lot of bitter old folks around here.

And a lot of people with chips on their shoulders looking for an excuse.

[dewilson58]

My Bride says I act like a 12 year old....................How does that fit into the rules???

[graciegirl]

Recent commentary about this has brought a question to mind. What happens when the senior citizen parents pass? What, if any, restrictions are there to the ownership of the house? Can the kids move in? Are they required to sell the house? Are other senior communities different in this respect?

If the heirs have no restriction as to ownership and residence it seems that in time the senior citizen community will disappear.



They can live here if they do NOT have children under the age of 19 and it does not change the balance of 80/20.


And they act nice. (I just threw that in)

[Bonny]

My Bride says I act like a 12 year old....................How does that fit into the rules???
Oh, oh, now we gotta look that up in the rule book !! :22yikes:

[Skybo]

Hi sunnyatlast: great information thank you. However while we know the district records DOB's we don't know what they are doing with them, It is easy for a district employee to throw out a number to a resident when the resident inquires of the 80/20% stats. I watched people in corporations do it all the time which I found to be incredible irresponsible and morally wrong

Rubicon, the important thing to remember is that the 80% MINIMUM rule is Federal law. There are paperwork requirements and audits to ensure that Age-Restricted communities are in compliance. To not comply, or to falsify records would result in the community losing their age-restricted status, and possible indictments.

Now, everyone can believe what they want, devise their own theories on the percentages, "assume" that there is a blind eye turned towards the percentages when it comes to resales, etc. But ask yourself this...do you really believe that the Morses and their multitudes of attorneys are so stupid that they would risk losing the Federal age-restricted status of TV, and lose all of their core buyers, and be prepared to pay out the multi-billion dollar class action suit the would be brought against them by current residents?

[Fred R]

A number of people expressed their opinions. Since none were definitive enough, why don't you go to the sales office and a real estate attorney's office and find out the answer. Please be sure and post the information you found out.

I would consider doing that if it wasn't such a long drive for me at this time. Maybe in late July

[Villager Joyce]

I would consider doing that if it wasn't such a long drive for me at this time. Maybe in late July

I keep forgetting everyone on here doesn't live here. I don't know if we will have the answer yet, do let us know what you find out. :)

[Barefoot]

Four pages of answers and still no definitive answer to the question.
I would consider doing that if it wasn't such a long drive for me at this time. Maybe in late July

The Villages Sales Office @ 1-800-346-4556.

[asianthree]

How do you know they don't love the home? Their age dictates how much they love a home?
There are a lot of bitter old folks around here.

Because they live in Maine, never going to live there. Just bought for investment. Wow and thanks for thinking I am bitter. Didn't realize I had met you, and I don't find 59 old. But thanks for your lovely comments.