Medical records held hostage!!!

[barbara2811]

My favorite physician relocated to a new facility. I went to Premier Medical and requested a copy of my medical records.... Can you believe Premier Medical ask that I pay 25.00 for records that I believe belong to me???

[spring_chicken]

I've had the same thing happen, but found that if a physician's office requests the records, it's free.

[barbara2811]

They are angry that my doctor left their organization.

[jnieman]

My favorite physician relocated to a new facility. I went to Premier Medical and requested a copy of my medical records.... Can you believe Premier Medical ask that I pay 25.00 for records that I believe belong to me???

My doctor in Ohio charged me $79 for my medical records to be faxed to my new doctor. I was outraged but nothing I could do about it.

[rhood]

Went to Premier last week for four year old records from dr gegaj. Had them in two minutes at no charge. The gal at the window just printed them out and gave them to me.

[Chi-Town]

My doctor in Ohio charged me $79 for my medical records to be faxed to my new doctor. I was outraged but nothing I could do about it.
Faxing medical records is labor intensive. Thankfully, electronic records are replacing forms.

[Jima64]

My doctor in Ohio charged me $79 for my medical records to be faxed to my new doctor. I was outraged but nothing I could do about it.

Maybe they knew you being out of the area and needed the records so they could charge you and you would pay it to get them.

[barbara2811]

Dr. Gegaj is my doctor. They did give me notes from my last visit but would have to pay for all of them. I had gone to Premier for 5 years. Just very disappointed in them. I'm a full time residence so it isn't like I was in another state.

[dbussone]

Faxing medical records is labor intensive. Thankfully, electronic records are replacing forms.


I hate the idea of electronic records. Just imagine all the hacks on federal sites like OPM...and when the fed grabs all electronic records we will all be hung out to dry.

[blueash]

456.057(10), Florida Statutes.
https://www.flrules.org/gateway/ruleno.asp?id=64B8-10.003&Section=0

When furnishing such copies, a physician may charge as follows:
For patients and governmental entities, the reasonable costs of reproducing copies of written or typed documents or reports shall be no more than $1 per page for the first 25 pages and 25 cents for each additional page. Rule 64B8-10.003, Florida Administrative Code.
For a workers' compensation case, a physician may only charge up to .50 per page for the records and the direct cost for x-rays, microfilm, or other non-paper records. Section 440.13(4)(b), Florida Statutes.
For other entities, the reasonable costs of reproducing copies of written or typed documents or reports shall not be more than $1.00 per page.
Reasonable costs of reproducing x-rays, and such other special kinds of records shall be the actual costs. Rule 64B8-10.003, Florida Administrative Code.

While a physician can condition the release of medical records upon payment of the copying costs, the release cannot be conditioned on payment of the physician's bill for services rendered. Upon the receipt of a written request, the physician must provide the patient with a copy of his medical records within a reasonable time, regardless of whether or not he has outstanding charges due on his account

**************

Just to be clear, the medical records absolutely do not belong to you the patient. They are created and controlled by the doctor or hospital. You have a right to a copy, at a cost. You have a right to make corrections to your record if you believe they are wrong, but they are not yours. You certainly may make your own notes at home after each medical visit about what happened. Those records would be yours.

[graciegirl]

Charged 25 dollars to take them. Said it was charge for copying and office help?

[NYGUY]

456.057(10), Florida Statutes.
https://www.flrules.org/gateway/ruleno.asp?id=64B8-10.003&Section=0

When furnishing such copies, a physician may charge as follows:
For patients and governmental entities, the reasonable costs of reproducing copies of written or typed documents or reports shall be no more than $1 per page for the first 25 pages and 25 cents for each additional page. Rule 64B8-10.003, Florida Administrative Code.
For a workers' compensation case, a physician may only charge up to .50 per page for the records and the direct cost for x-rays, microfilm, or other non-paper records. Section 440.13(4)(b), Florida Statutes.
For other entities, the reasonable costs of reproducing copies of written or typed documents or reports shall not be more than $1.00 per page.
Reasonable costs of reproducing x-rays, and such other special kinds of records shall be the actual costs. Rule 64B8-10.003, Florida Administrative Code.

While a physician can condition the release of medical records upon payment of the copying costs, the release cannot be conditioned on payment of the physician's bill for services rendered. Upon the receipt of a written request, the physician must provide the patient with a copy of his medical records within a reasonable time, regardless of whether or not he has outstanding charges due on his account

**************

Just to be clear, the medical records absolutely do not belong to you the patient. They are created and controlled by the doctor or hospital. You have a right to a copy, at a cost. You have a right to make corrections to your record if you believe they are wrong, but they are not yours. You certainly may make your own notes at home after each medical visit about what happened. Those records would be yours.

This all seems to cover paper records. Do you know what the "laws" are regarding transmission of electronic (digital) records?

[CFrance]

Faxing medical records is labor intensive. Thankfully, electronic records are replacing forms.
My doctor's office at University of Michigan put my records on a CD and gave them to me. Free of charge. Their mammography department sent me my x-rays, also free. This was all requested by me, not my doctor.

I wonder how long ago it was that someone was charged $79 and records were faxed. That seems a bit old-fashioned.

[hulahips]

Absolutely believe it. They all do that now

[golfing eagles]

Absolutely believe it. They all do that now

No, we ALL do not. New York state law allows us to charge 75 cents/page for copies. My partners and I have always thought this was crass, so we provide them free of charge

[golfing eagles]

I hate the idea of electronic records. Just imagine all the hacks on federal sites like OPM...and when the fed grabs all electronic records we will all be hung out to dry.

Consider this:
My practice has been using electronic records for 12 years. It can be "hacked", but you have to get through 2 firewalls with dual level 128 bit encryption then a series of software passwords, and this assumes you know the network architecture. This is about the same as hacking a bank
Prior to Nov 2003, when we had paper records, all you needed to "hack" them was a screwdriver and a crowbar. (And all you needed to destroy them was a match). So what do you think is more secure?

[rubicon]

Charging for medical records or records of any kind is SOP for many organizations. The big issue for me is the use of our social security numbers.

I had a procedure done in early 1990's and looked on to the computer screen
to see that my name, address, telephone number, dob, social security number, etc appeared. I asked the doctor why the medical community didn't simply assign a patient number to be used throughout that person's life?

[dbussone]

Consider this:

My practice has been using electronic records for 12 years. It can be "hacked", but you have to get through 2 firewalls with dual level 128 bit encryption then a series of software passwords, and this assumes you know the network architecture. This is about the same as hacking a bank

Prior to Nov 2003, when we had paper records, all you needed to "hack" them was a screwdriver and a crowbar. (And all you needed to destroy them was a match). So what do you think is more secure?


I appreciate the extent to which you have gone to protect your patient's information. Unfortunately I need all my fingers and toes to count the number of times hospitals have had problems since electronic records have been in general use.

[CFrance]

Absolutely believe it. They all do that now

No, we ALL do not. New York state law allows us to charge 75 cents/page for copies. My partners and I have always thought this was crass, so we provide them free of charge
Thank you. As I already stated above, we never paid a cent for medical records in Michigan, from Grand Rapids to Muskegon to Ann Arbor to down here.

[golfing eagles]

I appreciate the extent to which you have gone to protect your patient's information. Unfortunately I need all my fingers and toes to count the number of times hospitals have had problems since electronic records have been in general use.

Trust me, after 34 years practicing medicine, those "problems" were ten times greater with paper records. Just the legibility factor saves thousands of errors. Electronic prescribing eliminates the pharmacist's guess as to what is written on a Rx, physician order entry in hospitals eliminates errors by a unit secretary or nurse, discharge instructions are clearly printed, and office records a legible and easily sent to other physicians. In a lot of ways I also long for "the good old days" in medicine, but electronic records are one aspect that is a clear no-brainer

[Carla B]

My favorite physician relocated to a new facility. I went to Premier Medical and requested a copy of my medical records.... Can you believe Premier Medical ask that I pay 25.00 for records that I believe belong to me???

It's allowed in FL, just as Blueash said, up to $1 per page. You will pay a fee at TVRH if they make copies of your records there. Many doctor's offices charge, as well, as you found out.

[Polar Bear]

...In a lot of ways I also long for "the good old days" in medicine, but electronic records are one aspect that is a clear no-brainer

[emoji106]🏻

[dbussone]

Trust me, after 34 years practicing medicine, those "problems" were ten times greater with paper records. Just the legibility factor saves thousands of errors. Electronic prescribing eliminates the pharmacist's guess as to what is written on a Rx, physician order entry in hospitals eliminates errors by a unit secretary or nurse, discharge instructions are clearly printed, and office records a legible and easily sent to other physicians. In a lot of ways I also long for "the good old days" in medicine, but electronic records are one aspect that is a clear no-brainer


After 40 years of running hospitals and hospital systems I can agree on the benefits you note. However, the loss of medical information has increased dramatically with the figuration and storage of data. I can recall several years ago when a transcription company using workers in Pakistan was held hostage for payment when the workers started posting patient records on the Internet. And every smart device that connects to your medical record system or a hospital's is subject to theft and abuse with patient data retained on that device. Copy/scanning machines now have their own hard drives. When the lease is up a new one is rolled into the facility and the old one is rolled out- chock full of data. Believe me i have seen it all and then some.

[Chi-Town]

If you want to see something scary try to gain access to a medical records department and see firsthand the horrors of forms management. God bless the department head and the assistants. I woud go nuts. Electronic medical records is the future, thank goodness.

[dbussone]

If you want to see something scary try to gain access to a medical records department and see firsthand the horrors of forms management. God bless the department head and the assistants. I woud go nuts. Electronic medical records is the future, thank goodness.


Don't get me wrong. I am a fan of EMR systems. What I dislike intensely is the lack of attention paid to every aspect of security. Part of Obamacare involves the establishment of regional EMR data warehouses. All hospitals and physicians will be required to transmit patient information to these centers, and it is underway now. All the regional centers will be connected and the data accessible to many folks at CMS and other agencies. If the Chinese can hack into the Pentagon how secure do you think your personal information will be in another government repository.

[rosygail]

Copy charges are the norm for transfer of records. I have 5 doctors records to transfer when I moved to TV. Each one had some sort of charge. I was not surprised...it costs money to have someone make the copies or send the faxes!

[blueash]

Don't get me wrong. I am a fan of EMR systems. What I dislike intensely is the lack of attention paid to every aspect of security. Part of Obamacare involves the establishment of regional EMR data warehouses. All hospitals and physicians will be required to transmit patient information to these centers, and it is underway now. All the regional centers will be connected and the data accessible to many folks at CMS and other agencies. If the Chinese can hack into the Pentagon how secure do you think your personal information will be in another government repository.

Off topic, and I know you know better. The ACA data collection is REQUIRED to have been stripped of patient identification data. It is collected as bulk data and the information cannot be identified by patient. Meaningful use criteria are analyzed by the EMR so see if the practice is practice is providing the services being measured as reflections of quality care, asking about abuse, providing immunizations, doing vital signs, recording allergies. This data is collected by the practices EMR. Insurance companies are also reporting data on utilization of services etc. None of the data reported have your name or your SSN or anything similar. So, no, the ACA is not collecting "your personal information" in the way you have suggested. It is more like the census gives an idea of what numbers and categories of persons live in an area but without names.

[golfing eagles]

Off topic, and I know you know better. The ACA data collection is REQUIRED to have been stripped of patient identification data. It is collected as bulk data and the information cannot be identified by patient. Meaningful use criteria are analyzed by the EMR so see if the practice is practice is providing the services being measured as reflections of quality care, asking about abuse, providing immunizations, doing vital signs, recording allergies. This data is collected by the practices EMR. Insurance companies are also reporting data on utilization of services etc. None of the data reported have your name or your SSN or anything similar. So, no, the ACA is not collecting "your personal information" in the way you have suggested. It is more like the census gives an idea of what numbers and categories of persons live in an area but without names.

You are correct in that meaningful use data, PQRI, and most ACO data is batched reporting. However, the clearinghouses ("warehouses") referred to pass along all transmitted data---this includes personal medical records and even every electronically transmitted prescriptions. Now whether this data is retained or not (a la NSA), is unclear, but db is correct in stating that security needs to me a major concern. Of course, Chinese hackers are far more interested in the Pentagon than they are in anyone's bunions.

[Xcuse]

Blueash, thanks for your informative posts.

[dbussone]

Off topic, and I know you know better. The ACA data collection is REQUIRED to have been stripped of patient identification data. It is collected as bulk data and the information cannot be identified by patient. Meaningful use criteria are analyzed by the EMR so see if the practice is practice is providing the services being measured as reflections of quality care, asking about abuse, providing immunizations, doing vital signs, recording allergies. This data is collected by the practices EMR. Insurance companies are also reporting data on utilization of services etc. None of the data reported have your name or your SSN or anything similar. So, no, the ACA is not collecting "your personal information" in the way you have suggested. It is more like the census gives an idea of what numbers and categories of persons live in an area but without names.


That is going to change soon. One of the thrusts behind the regional centers is to permit the availability of one's complete medical record from one facility to another. So if you live in TV and go to an ER in Virginia, your record can be accessed by the Virginia providers.

[GeoGeo]

I couldn't get my medical records from a doctor's office when I lived in another state. They told me that the records did not belong to me. They said the records belonged to the doctor's office. I don't remember what I had to do, but I had to stir the pot, so to speak. They had taken x-rays of me and were treating me. I got those x-rays and when I showed them to another doctor, he said I didn't have what they said I had.

[golfing eagles]

I couldn't get my medical records from a doctor's office when I lived in another state. They told me that the records did not belong to me. They said the records belonged to the doctor's office. I don't remember what I had to do, but I had to stir the pot, so to speak. They had taken x-rays of me and were treating me. I got those x-rays and when I showed them to another doctor, he said I didn't have what they said I had.

They are correct, the records DO NOT belong to you, they belong to the doctor. The doctor is also legally responsible for keeping them for 7 years or transferring them to a new doctor or the patient. They CANNOT withhold the information and you are legally entitled to copies, usually for a copy fee set by law. As far as the x-ray findings go, it is not unusual to have differing opinions. But I very much doubt the original doctor interpreted the x rays wrong, KNEW he was wrong, and then INTENTIONALLY withheld the records. Sounds more like an uninformed or uncooperative staff member.

[applesoffh]

456.057(10), Florida Statutes.
https://www.flrules.org/gateway/ruleno.asp?id=64B8-10.003&Section=0

When furnishing such copies, a physician may charge as follows:
For patients and governmental entities, the reasonable costs of reproducing copies of written or typed documents or reports shall be no more than $1 per page for the first 25 pages and 25 cents for each additional page. Rule 64B8-10.003, Florida Administrative Code.
For a workers' compensation case, a physician may only charge up to .50 per page for the records and the direct cost for x-rays, microfilm, or other non-paper records. Section 440.13(4)(b), Florida Statutes.
For other entities, the reasonable costs of reproducing copies of written or typed documents or reports shall not be more than $1.00 per page.
Reasonable costs of reproducing x-rays, and such other special kinds of records shall be the actual costs. Rule 64B8-10.003, Florida Administrative Code.

While a physician can condition the release of medical records upon payment of the copying costs, the release cannot be conditioned on payment of the physician's bill for services rendered. Upon the receipt of a written request, the physician must provide the patient with a copy of his medical records within a reasonable time, regardless of whether or not he has outstanding charges due on his account

**************

Just to be clear, the medical records absolutely do not belong to you the patient. They are created and controlled by the doctor or hospital. You have a right to a copy, at a cost. You have a right to make corrections to your record if you believe they are wrong, but they are not yours. You certainly may make your own notes at home after each medical visit about what happened. Those records would be yours.

Good to know! Thanks for doing the research and posting your results. Very helpful, if I should ever need this.

[applesoffh]

No, we ALL do not. New York state law allows us to charge 75 cents/page for copies. My partners and I have always thought this was crass, so we provide them free of charge

When I moved here from NYC, I obtained records from all the doctors for both my husband and myself, including mammograms. None of the doctors' offices charged me anything, and I was shocked! I was prepared to pay, but it never became necesssary.

[dbussone]

Good to know! Thanks for doing the research and posting your results. Very helpful, if I should ever need this.


Thank you Blueash. That is good to know.

[sbondar]

Yes, had to pay 15 for mine and 25 for my husbands after they told us don't come back anymore after we complained about a procedure!!!