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View Full Version : Evans Prairie declining


TomW
08-06-2015, 11:20 PM
They do some things well but for the past year or so the service level has declined significantly while the food prices have jumped by quite a bit. I counted over 20 times when we were completely abandoned by the wait staff during the middle or later part of the meal. We live close to EP and eat there often. I've discussed this with management with detailed specifics on poor customer service but continue to be disappointed. A few years ago, we watched the decline of the Havana restaurant which was then our local CC and now I see the same thing happening at Evans Prairie. I encourage anyone with an interest in the quality of our local CC's to speak to the management when the food or service is excessively below standard.

jblum315
08-07-2015, 04:36 AM
I've had nothing but fine service at Evans Prairie

rubicon
08-07-2015, 04:59 AM
What is it about the restaurants in The Villages?????

RickeyD
08-07-2015, 05:47 AM
They do some things well but for the past year or so the service level has declined significantly while the food prices have jumped by quite a bit. I counted over 20 times when we were completely abandoned by the wait staff during the middle or later part of the meal. We live close to EP and eat there often. I've discussed this with management with detailed specifics on poor customer service but continue to be disappointed. A few years ago, we watched the decline of the Havana restaurant which was then our local CC and now I see the same thing happening at Evans Prairie. I encourage anyone with an interest in the quality of our local CC's to speak to the management when the food or service is excessively below standard.


Vote with your feet, that will send the most effective message to management. If they want to thrive, they will change. Complaining does nothing.

rjn5656
08-07-2015, 05:47 AM
I agree. Have been disapointed this summer with food and service at Evans Prairie and Bonifay, and service at Bell Glade.

graciegirl
08-07-2015, 06:26 AM
And the Cane Garden Stir fry hit the spot and it was ten bucks I think. The very tender and nicely spiced chicken was crispily fried separately with breading and placed on top of the noodles and veggies and some fresh Cilantro (?) was sprinkled on it.The water chestnuts added crunch and the service was just WONDERFUL. Our server brought sunglasses for daughter Helene who had forgotten hers. We sat outside and it was warm, but breezy.


I must say we could have eaten dog food and enjoyed it with these treasured friends of fifty years, but the food was good.

Jayhawk
08-07-2015, 06:47 AM
I counted over 20 times when we were completely abandoned by the wait staff during the middle or later part of the meal.

You needed a server "over 20 times" during a meal? No wonder they skipped out.

asianthree
08-07-2015, 06:49 AM
Our son ate with us at Evans Prairie who is also in the restaurant business. Have to be honest since day one I felt the food was OK nothing spectacular. But our son found the service to be less than adequate. It was the first time I have ever seen him only tip 15% on the nose. At restaurants that we have been with him I have seen him tip in upwards of 35% for excellent service. As he put it service can only improve mediocre food. Without good service one should not return. Even in a busy busy restaurant it only takes less than a minute for a server to stop ask a question and respond. Service is the whole reason why I go out to dinner. I can cook excellent food at home but I never have anybody stop by and fill up my water except me.

yabbadu
08-07-2015, 06:56 AM
I have also found the service disappointing at EP and thus I am going there less to the point of avoiding them altogether.

jnieman
08-07-2015, 07:15 AM
It doesn't take much to spoil a person's opinion of a restaurant and not want to go back. One bad experience stays in the back of our minds like, oh don't order the chicken, remember what happened last time. That is why restaurants need to be on top of their game all of the time.

This week we went to Gator's Dockside. Have been there about 10 times since they opened and have always had great food and great service. We ordered 10 wings and the early bird special for $8.99 shrimp platter and also ordered two drinks. Our bill with tip was $32.95. There was a photo of numerous beautiful shrimp displayed over a plate of fries. When the meal came I thought they had just brought the fries, then peeping out were 4 tiny battered shrimp. We asked the waitress if it was right and she said you don't get much with the early bird specials. These shrimp were the kind you get at Publix with 45-50 in a bag for $11.00. We sent it back and ordered a burger which was good. The manager came over and we told her about it. She said you get 5 shrimp. I said you realize how small the shrimp are, right and she said yes, it's the early bird. I would suggest not ordering this early bird special at Gator's Dockside unless you eat before you go. The service was great but it kind of ruined it for us to go back there because we felt ripped off.

Happinow
08-07-2015, 07:24 AM
I agree. Have been disapointed this summer with food and service at Evans Prairie and Bonifay, and service at Bell Glade.

Went to Belle Glade this past week. Was very disappointed in the service as we also felt abandoned by our server. However, the food was good.

Happinow
08-07-2015, 07:30 AM
It doesn't take much to spoil a person's opinion of a restaurant and not want to go back. One bad experience stays in the back of our minds like, oh don't order the chicken, remember what happened last time. That is why restaurants need to be on top of their game all of the time.

This week we went to Gator's Dockside. Have been there about 10 times since they opened and have always had great food and great service. We ordered 10 wings and the early bird special for $8.99 shrimp platter and also ordered two drinks. Our bill with tip was $32.95. There was a photo of numerous beautiful shrimp displayed over a plate of fries. When the meal came I thought they had just brought the fries, then peeping out were 4 tiny battered shrimp. We asked the waitress if it was right and she said you don't get much with the early bird specials. These shrimp were the kind you get at Publix with 45-50 in a bag for $11.00. We sent it back and ordered a burger which was good. The manager came over and we told her about it. She said you get 5 shrimp. I said you realize how small the shrimp are, right and she said yes, it's the early bird. I would suggest not ordering this early bird special at Gator's Dockside unless you eat before you go. The service was great but it kind of ruined it for us to go back there because we felt ripped off.

We are frequent diners at Gators in Brownwood (Gators Dockside?) and last week we sat at the bar and ordered the boneless chicken tenders which we get frequently. Usually there are 6 good size chicken fingers on the plate, however this time they were small. I always feel I get my money's worth so I let the bartender know that the chicken fingers weren't up to standard. She agreed and within minutes we had a whole other order of chicken fingers. We keep going back because the food is good as is the service!!

jnieman
08-07-2015, 07:35 AM
We are frequent diners at Gators in Brownwood (Gators Dockside?) and last week we sat at the bar and ordered the boneless chicken tenders which we get frequently. Usually there are 6 good size chicken fingers on the plate, however this time they were small. I always feel I get my money's worth so I let the bartender know that the chicken fingers weren't up to standard. She agreed and within minutes we had a whole other order of chicken fingers. We keep going back because the food is good as is the service!!

That's what they should have done with the shrimp is offer to get us more shrimp and keep a customer. I will probably go back but will definitely question the waitress before ordering any specials.

rustyp
08-07-2015, 07:43 AM
I agree. Have been disapointed this summer with food and service at Evans Prairie and Bonifay, and service at Bell Glade.

Is this not the same fellow who owns all three restaurants? Oh yes and Orange Blossom too. Say no more.

ScorpioSquared
08-07-2015, 08:20 AM
We've been to Belle Glade a few times earlier this year, service was always good as was the food. The mahi mahi sandwich is delicious and reasonably priced.

Villager Joyce
08-07-2015, 08:29 AM
We went to Bonifay lsat week. Food was great. I was still eating--fork in hand when the waitress Reached for and had her hand on My plate as she asked if I was Finished. I said to go ahead and take it, otherwise I would finish eating my dinner. She took it. They weren't busy and we were only there an hour. We thought she must be going off shift. No excuse. (My apologies for posting my bonifay experience on an EP thread.)

Phanatic Luvr
08-07-2015, 09:06 AM
You needed a server "over 20 times" during a meal? No wonder they skipped out.

Jayhawk, I think maybe you misunderstood what the OP was saying. I read it as, he/she frequents EP ALOT and over 20 separate visits, the server was nowhere to be found during the meal.

ukbill70
08-07-2015, 10:13 AM
And the Cane Garden Stir fry hit the spot and it was ten bucks I think. The very tender and nicely spiced chicken was crispily fried separately with breading and placed on top of the noodles and veggies and some fresh Cilantro (?) was sprinkled on it.The water chestnuts added crunch and the service was just WONDERFUL. Our server brought sunglasses for daughter Helene who had forgotten hers. We sat outside and it was warm, but breezy.


I must say we could have eaten dog food and enjoyed it with these treasured friends of fifty years, but the food was good.

As far as Villages restaurants go I believe Cane Gardens takes a lot to beat, good food at reasonable prices. It's where we always take our visitors and so far no complaints .

REDCART
08-07-2015, 10:33 AM
As long as others have commented about Belle Glade, Bonifay, etc I'll add that we've been to Belle Glade a half dozen times since January, and we've noticed an overall decline in service over time. Our impression is that training, oversight and standards are completely missing in BG. Compare that with the much nicer dining experience at Hemmingway, Lopez and Carrabbas. Now they're doing something right! And I suspect it all boils down to an active manager with high standards and a training program. Yes, I too apologize for going off topic (Evans Prairie).

newguyintv
08-07-2015, 01:59 PM
They do some things well but for the past year or so the service level has declined significantly while the food prices have jumped by quite a bit. I counted over 20 times when we were completely abandoned by the wait staff during the middle or later part of the meal. We live close to EP and eat there often. I've discussed this with management with detailed specifics on poor customer service but continue to be disappointed. A few years ago, we watched the decline of the Havana restaurant which was then our local CC and now I see the same thing happening at Evans Prairie. I encourage anyone with an interest in the quality of our local CC's to speak to the management when the food or service is excessively below standard.

They and all their other Restaurants were in decline from the day they opened!

rjn5656
08-07-2015, 02:34 PM
I sent a nice note to belle glade management about the decline in service. Never heard back from them.

Jusglenn
08-07-2015, 03:14 PM
Today I took my brother in law, my daughter and my two nieces to EP... it was wonderful... food was good, beer was cold, service was really good... just saying... !!

Villager Joyce
08-07-2015, 03:52 PM
Today I took my brother in law, my daughter and my two nieces to EP... it was wonderful... food was good, beer was cold, service was really good... just saying... !!

I'm happy. Evans is my go to place. I did wonder if the decline is because the manager is on medical leave.

golf2140
08-07-2015, 05:03 PM
We had a group of 20 at Bonifay, great service great food, cold beer. Folks on this forum want to pay $9.00 for a full course meal. Give the restaurants a break, they need to pay overhead, rent, salaries etc.

Barefoot
08-07-2015, 09:59 PM
You needed a server "over 20 times" during a meal? No wonder they skipped out. :icon_wink: I was wondering about the same thing. Presumably it's more than one meal!
For us, if a server stops by once during a meal to say "How's it going", that's enough.

Chatbrat
08-08-2015, 05:08 AM
Its pretty hard for servers & bar-persons to be up beat, when the snow birds are gone- they are basically making subsistence living during the off season. Also the cheap people who barely tip & eat & drink low price specials don't help things, either

Jima64
08-08-2015, 08:01 AM
Its pretty hard for servers & bar-persons to be up beat, when the snow birds are gone- they are basically making subsistence living during the off season. Also the cheap people who barely tip & eat & drink low price specials don't help things, either

Are the specials to lure the customer in or to fit the budget of the retired folks? Never understood this concept of cheap prices that won't sustain quality service and food.

Annie01
08-08-2015, 09:59 AM
And the Cane Garden Stir fry hit the spot and it was ten bucks I think. The very tender and nicely spiced chicken was crispily fried separately with breading and placed on top of the noodles and veggies and some fresh Cilantro (?) was sprinkled on it.The water chestnuts added crunch and the service was just WONDERFUL. Our server brought sunglasses for daughter Helene who had forgotten hers. We sat outside and it was warm, but breezy.


I must say we could have eaten dog food and enjoyed it with these treasured friends of fifty years, but the food was good.

AND THE LOBSTER ROL.L....YUMMY !!!!! on a creasant roll with fruit...wowwwwwwww

CFrance
08-08-2015, 10:34 AM
You needed a server "over 20 times" during a meal? No wonder they skipped out.
Are you intentionally misunderstanding?

kcrazorbackfan
08-08-2015, 01:46 PM
It doesn't take much to spoil a person's opinion of a restaurant and not want to go back. One bad experience stays in the back of our minds like, oh don't order the chicken, remember what happened last time. That is why restaurants need to be on top of their game all of the time.

This week we went to Gator's Dockside. Have been there about 10 times since they opened and have always had great food and great service. We ordered 10 wings and the early bird special for $8.99 shrimp platter and also ordered two drinks. Our bill with tip was $32.95. There was a photo of numerous beautiful shrimp displayed over a plate of fries. When the meal came I thought they had just brought the fries, then peeping out were 4 tiny battered shrimp. We asked the waitress if it was right and she said you don't get much with the early bird specials. These shrimp were the kind you get at Publix with 45-50 in a bag for $11.00. We sent it back and ordered a burger which was good. The manager came over and we told her about it. She said you get 5 shrimp. I said you realize how small the shrimp are, right and she said yes, it's the early bird. I would suggest not ordering this early bird special at Gator's Dockside unless you eat before you go. The service was great but it kind of ruined it for us to go back there because we felt ripped off.

You sure don't. We went to Sonny's last week to split a rack of Pitmaster's Championship ribs for $13.99; the plate was brought out and there was 6 ribs. I asked the server if this was right and was told yes. Asked for the manager and was told the same thing. Told them 6 ribs is not a rack and to take the ribs back and to bring me the bill for two teas and two side salads.

dbussone
08-08-2015, 03:30 PM
You sure don't. We went to Sonny's last week to split a rack of Pitmaster's Championship ribs for $13.99; the plate was brought out and there was 6 ribs. I asked the server if this was right and was told yes. Asked for the manager and was told the same thing. Told them 6 ribs is not a rack and to take the ribs back and to bring me the bill for two teas and two side salads.


That's not even a half rack for goodness sakes. At least Oakwood gives you a full rack to split.

jnieman
08-08-2015, 03:34 PM
That really isn't even a half rack. If you had gone to Oakwood you would have had plenty of food to split.

Shimpy
08-08-2015, 03:38 PM
Its pretty hard for servers & bar-persons to be up beat, when the snow birds are gone- they are basically making subsistence living during the off season. Also the cheap people who barely tip & eat & drink low price specials don't help things, either

Maybe they should have a welfare donation jar up front. I always tip at least 20% unless the service is very bad but don't call me cheap because I don't care to order high end dinners that are usually high in fat which I can't eat. Also don't assume snow birds are all high tippers. Back when I moved to Florida in the 50's the big hotels and restaurants closed for the summer and the wait staff had NO income.

Walt.
08-08-2015, 06:14 PM
You sure don't. We went to Sonny's last week to split a rack of Pitmaster's Championship ribs for $13.99; the plate was brought out and there was 6 ribs. I asked the server if this was right and was told yes. Asked for the manager and was told the same thing. Told them 6 ribs is not a rack and to take the ribs back and to bring me the bill for two teas and two side salads.

If everybody would do that instead of "we'll take it this time... but order something else next time" things would change fast enough.
For years this forum was loaded with people complaining about how crappy the Havana was. Then they would turn around and say how hard the work is... those people need the jobs... we have to support the restaurants (no matter how lousy)... sometimes they got a half-way decent meal (with bad service). They would give them "one more chance"... again and again...
There was no reason to change. Everybody kept going there. Express your displeasure and tell them you will try again in six months... if they're still open. Three or four of those would get their attention.

lambchop285
08-08-2015, 08:10 PM
It doesn't take much to spoil a person's opinion of a restaurant and not want to go back. One bad experience stays in the back of our minds like, oh don't order the chicken, remember what happened last time. That is why restaurants need to be on top of their game all of the time.

This week we went to Gator's Dockside. Have been there about 10 times since they opened and have always had great food and great service. We ordered 10 wings and the early bird special for $8.99 shrimp platter and also ordered two drinks. Our bill with tip was $32.95. There was a photo of numerous beautiful shrimp displayed over a plate of fries. When the meal came I thought they had just brought the fries, then peeping out were 4 tiny battered shrimp. We asked the waitress if it was right and she said you don't get much with the early bird specials. These shrimp were the kind you get at Publix with 45-50 in a bag for $11.00. We sent it back and ordered a burger which was good. The manager came over and we told her about it. She said you get 5 shrimp. I said you realize how small the shrimp are, right and she said yes, it's the early bird. I would suggest not ordering this early bird special at Gator's Dockside unless you eat before you go. The service was great but it kind of ruined it for us to go back there because we felt ripped off.
If u only give a restaurant a try "once" shame on you.... go to NYC and give a restaurant a try once.... see how far it gets you...

manaboutown
08-08-2015, 08:40 PM
And the Cane Garden Stir fry hit the spot and it was ten bucks I think. The very tender and nicely spiced chicken was crispily fried separately with breading and placed on top of the noodles and veggies and some fresh Cilantro (?) was sprinkled on it.The water chestnuts added crunch and the service was just WONDERFUL. Our server brought sunglasses for daughter Helene who had forgotten hers. We sat outside and it was warm, but breezy.


I must say we could have eaten dog food and enjoyed it with these treasured friends of fifty years, but the food was good.

Well, GG, I hope the cilantro did not come from here! Cilantro and Other Foods to Avoid This Week (http://time.com/3988849/cilantro-and-3-more-foods-to-avoid-this-week/)

The reality is the restaurants within the The Villages have a "captive" clientele and for the most part compete only with other restaurants within TV.

graciegirl
08-09-2015, 08:10 AM
Well, GG, I hope the cilantro did not come from here! Cilantro and Other Foods to Avoid This Week (http://time.com/3988849/cilantro-and-3-more-foods-to-avoid-this-week/)

The reality is the restaurants within the The Villages have a "captive" clientele and for the most part compete only with other restaurants within TV.



We're still kickin'. The cilantro didn't do us in.;)


I enjoy making simple meals for the three of us so don't feel the lack of quality as much as some do because we only eat out once or twice a week generally. We have our favorites and our favorite things. Brisket sandwich and cabbage soup at Toojays, Burgers at Arnold Palmer. Catfish at the Lighthouse. Ribs at Oakwood. Swiss Mushroom Pizza at Mallory. Many things at Glenview, Many things at Cane Garden. Many things at Carrabas. Spaghetti with meat sauce at Stavros. Fish Tacos at Orange Blossom Garden. Chicken livers with cream sauce and onions at Toojays. Beef on Weck at McCalls, Salad bar at Ruby Tuesdays. AND KFC original. But...we DON'T eat it there. lol. OH and breakfast for dinner at Bob Evans.


Maybe not gourmet, but adequate. Actually quite yummy.

Challenger
08-09-2015, 08:51 AM
They do some things well but for the past year or so the service level has declined significantly while the food prices have jumped by quite a bit. I counted over 20 times when we were completely abandoned by the wait staff during the middle or later part of the meal. We live close to EP and eat there often. I've discussed this with management with detailed specifics on poor customer service but continue to be disappointed. A few years ago, we watched the decline of the Havana restaurant which was then our local CC and now I see the same thing happening at Evans Prairie. I encourage anyone with an interest in the quality of our local CC's to speak to the management when the food or service is excessively below standard.

I won't eat in the dinning room at Evans, Bonifay, because the noise level is so high, that it is very difficult to hear when people speak in normal conversational terms. There seems to have been no attention to noise mitigation in the newer CCs. When there are crowdded conditions , my guess is that the decibel level is at unhealthy levels.

Does anyone else see this as a problem?

golfer72
08-09-2015, 09:00 AM
Nobody beats the bar service at Mallory!

Boomer
08-09-2015, 09:52 AM
When I see the common typo that says dinning room instead of dining room, I smile and think, "Ain't it the truth, all too often."

I don't think there is such a word as dinning but the word din, as we all know, is defined as a loud, unpleasant, and prolonged noise.

Therefore, dinning room is a good name for what too many of our CCs and other restaurants refer to as a dining room.

There is an app for that, of course. I have one called Sound Meter.

I admit to wondering if restaurants are designed to be noisy so they can turn the tables faster. Some have all the ambiance of a junior high school cafeteria.

fred53
08-09-2015, 10:26 AM
And the Cane Garden Stir fry hit the spot and it was ten bucks I think. The very tender and nicely spiced chicken was crispily fried separately with breading and placed on top of the noodles and veggies and some fresh Cilantro (?) was sprinkled on it.The water chestnuts added crunch and the service was just WONDERFUL. Our server brought sunglasses for daughter Helene who had forgotten hers. We sat outside and it was warm, but breezy.


I must say we could have eaten dog food and enjoyed it with these treasured friends of fifty years, but the food was good.

a discussion on Evans Prairie is known as trying to hijack a post...

Challenger
08-09-2015, 10:45 AM
When I see the common typo that says dinning room instead of dining room, I smile and think, "Ain't it the truth, all too often."

I don't think there is such a word as dinning but the word din, as we all know, is defined as a loud, unpleasant, and prolonged noise.

Therefore, dinning room is a good name for what too many of our CCs and other restaurants refer to as a dining room.

There is an app for that, of course. I have one called Sound Meter.

I admit to wondering if restaurants are designed to be noisy so they can turn the tables faster. Some have all the ambiance of a junior high school cafeteria.

Of course I meant "dinning room"---Wish my fingers weren't so fat!!!!

Boomer
08-09-2015, 11:11 AM
Of course I meant "dinning room"---Wish my fingers weren't so fat!!!!

Thank you for smiling with me, Challenger, I sure understand about fat fingers, and when my fingers don't sabotage me, autocorrect does.

If you get an app that measures decibels, you will be appalled at the level of noise comparisons in many of our local "dinning rooms."

dotti105
08-09-2015, 05:03 PM
We view Evans Prairie CC out our Lanai windows. But haven't eaten there in several months. I must admit, we haven't been to Belle Glade lately either.

My gripe is that the menus are so similar, and mediocre. The Ahi Tuna at Belle Glade was excellent, and the Pork shank at Evans Prairie is excellent, but most of the menu at both places sounds like cafeteria food to me. Many of the entrees sound very similar and look very similar.

For some reason Bonifay, which has basically the same menu, doesn't bother me so much. It is much more casual and with the Beach theme, so I end up ordering their salads which are quite good.

I guess I just expected too much, thinking that each CC would have it's own atmosphere and menu. Certainly not the case off of Pinellas.

A group from our neighborhood went to Hemingway's at Havana last week and the food, service and atmosphere were excellent. I know that was not the case a year or so ago, so maybe there is hope for Evans Prairie and Belle Glade. But Man, they gotta lot of work to do to provide better service and a menu that is not so very dull.

simpkinp
08-09-2015, 08:29 PM
Hemingway's at Havana has changed because the owner of Lopez CC took it over. Notice they changed the name to distance themselves from the horrible reputation of the old Havana CC. It has a different menu from Lopez with few similarities, like a couple of soups. Their specialty is fish from Honolulu Fish Company. The food is very good. The four Country Clubs under discussion are owned by the same person, management is spotty because he can't be everywhere. Bonifay was better when it was the only one he owned. Now they have similar menus at all four so there is no differentiation. It's like having one restaurant in four places. Sad. I like the different character of the clubs above 466A.

DeanFL
08-09-2015, 09:16 PM
To Belle Glade for dinner tonight at 6pm - expecting a crowd but, not.

Been there about 6 times at BG since it opened, and I had the Lobster Pie 4 of those times. 3 of the 4 were fantastic, the odd ball was a bit gummy. So tonight I was tempted to try it once again. Until the (new I believe) menu was opened and I saw the price is now $17.95. Was $13.95 all the other times. Was going to question our server but didn't want to cause a fuss or seem "thrifty". Even though the LP is excellent (3 out of 4...) for $18...not really... So I chose a nice chicken dish. Nice time tho and the service was excellent as in the past for us there.

Bottom line - it appears the costs to dine out at some TV Country Clubs is a-rising...and it's not even High season yet.

gap2415
08-10-2015, 08:30 PM
Our favorite so far is the Thai Restaurant at LSL, anything with curry!

Having a list of your favorite food at each restaurant is helpful. Sometimes you don't like a particular place because you ordered a plate they don't do well while other items on the menu are great. We would love to hear what you do enjoy and where.

It seems though consistency is a problem and if there is no one checking the quality on the plates as they leave the kitchen there will be problems. I'm speaking of better restaurants not fast quick meals.

Sage327
08-10-2015, 09:38 PM
They do some things well but for the past year or so the service level has declined significantly while the food prices have jumped by quite a bit. I counted over 20 times when we were completely abandoned by the wait staff during the middle or later part of the meal. We live close to EP and eat there often. I've discussed this with management with detailed specifics on poor customer service but continue to be disappointed. A few years ago, we watched the decline of the Havana restaurant which was then our local CC and now I see the same thing happening at Evans Prairie. I encourage anyone with an interest in the quality of our local CC's to speak to the management when the food or service is excessively below standard.

We went to German night at Hacienda a couple of weeks ago and the pork was dry like shoe leather. I told the waitress and all she did was offer a dessert. Usually the pork is very tender. Also went to a Italian a Restaurant that usually gets good reviews on this site and the chicken Parmesan was inedible. Again another dessert was offered. What is going on? Are the chefs on vacation?