My friend's experience trying to buy a new home here

[villagerfrog]

I wanted to share my friend's story and see if others experienced the same thing. They were down last week for the sole purpose of finding and purchasing a home here. They looked at both owned and new and settled for a new home in Labelle. They were pre-approved for a mortgage through Chase. When it came to sign the paperwork, the Villages would not budge on the 30 day closing date. In addition (I looked at the contract also), if closing did not occur within 30 days (for any reason outside of the developer's control), then the discount on the home would be voided and they would have to pay the higher price. Chase wanted 45 days to ensure they could process the mortgage. So my friend went to Citizen's thinking that well, it's a developer owned entity, that must be the preferred way to go. He said that they were very professional but could not guarantee 30 days either for a mortgage. He said that there had been instances where either paperwork got delayed or something else (out of there control) by which they were not able to complete the processing.

So to make a long story short, they didn't buy.. they were concerned that if they could not get a mortgage within 30 days and if the discount was not continued, then they'd end up paying an additional $11k.

They went home disillusioned about their experience and have a bad taste about the Villages corporate entity. I tried to reassure them. We are on our second home now (all pre-owned) and had nothing but positive experiences in the buying / selling process. I guess that's the difference between dealing with an individual seller vs a corporation.

Anyhow, I'm just sharing.

[cquick]

it's interesting that The Villages Real Estate has a restriction on purchasing when they know the banks cannot fulfill the restriction. Seems to me that if they are really wanting to sell homes with the discount, they should work with the mortgage companies.

[jnieman]

I wanted to share my friend's story and see if others experienced the same thing. They were down last week for the sole purpose of finding and purchasing a home here. They looked at both owned and new and settled for a new home in Labelle. They were pre-approved for a mortgage through Chase. When it came to sign the paperwork, the Villages would not budge on the 30 day closing date. In addition (I looked at the contract also), if closing did not occur within 30 days (for any reason outside of the developer's control), then the discount on the home would be voided and they would have to pay the higher price. Chase wanted 45 days to ensure they could process the mortgage. So my friend went to Citizen's thinking that well, it's a developer owned entity, that must be the preferred way to go. He said that they were very professional but could not guarantee 30 days either for a mortgage. He said that there had been instances where either paperwork got delayed or something else (out of there control) by which they were not able to complete the processing.

So to make a long story short, they didn't buy.. they were concerned that if they could not get a mortgage within 30 days and if the discount was not continued, then they'd end up paying an additional $11k.

They went home disillusioned about their experience and have a bad taste about the Villages corporate entity. I tried to reassure them. We are on our second home now (all pre-owned) and had nothing but positive experiences in the buying / selling process. I guess that's the difference between dealing with an individual seller vs a corporation.

Anyhow, I'm just sharing.
It might help to get pre-approved for the loan before they begin the house hunting process. Banks have no problem with that. They pre-approve you and the loan is good for about 90 days. Not sure how long it take to close once you are pre-approved.

[manaboutown]

The developer no doubt has a marketing plan which necessarily incorporates certain restrictions. I am sorry to hear things did not work out for your friends.

[tomwed]

I'm not surprised. I wasn't here but I heard quite a few stories when houses were in demand that you would get a phone call from a salesman that said you have 45 minutes to decide if you want a house that you haven't seen.
If your friend bought into the dream he will do what they say. Tell him to buy a resale. He may feel like he has more control.

[villagerfrog]

They were pre-approved. Chase wanted 45 days for processing.

[jnieman]

I'm not surprised. I wasn't here but I heard quite a few stories when houses were in demand that you would get a phone call from a salesman that said you have 45 minutes to decide if you want a house that you haven't seen.
If your friend bought into the dream he will do what they say. Tell him to buy a resale. He may feel like he has more control.

That is how it was with us back in 2008. You found a house and they would put a one hour hold on it for you to decide. Then if you found another you liked better they would call and take the hold off the other one and put the hold on the new one. You were pretty much at their mercy with how it was handled. They decided how much up front money they needed and it was substantial. We closed with Citizens bank because they told us that if we went with another bank they may not meet the closing requirements and the deal might fall through. They strong-armed us into using Citizens.

[Sable99]

Mom and I didn't have any problems getting a loan with Citizens when we bought a new home in 2012. And, we got the discount. Our realtor did recommend that we get our loan through Citizens because they are able to get loans through quickly. Citizens bent over backwards to get everything done in a timely manner.

[buzzy]

Bought a spec house in 2011. Same 30 day closing period. Credit union could not do it. Citizens did.

[villagetinker]

We bought our house with a discount through Citizens under the 30 day requirement, however, that was 2 years ago. Recently, I went for a home equity loan, and Citizens Bank (I am a customer), Chase Bank (I am a customer), and one other bank (not a customer), all stated 45 days, and interest rates of over 5%. Then I tried Community Bank, WOW, 3.75% interest rate, and closed in right around 2 weeks, which allowed the construction of the addition to proceed on schedule.
My advice, have your friends call Community Bank and trust and see what they can do.
Hope this helps.

[villagerfrog]

Yep, he wanted to go with Citizens but they could not guarantee 30 days. The person provided several accounts of loans of which they did not finish in 30 days for various reasons. So, my friend went back to the sales office and asked what happened in those recent cases where Citizens could not satisfy 30 days. The salesperson said they made an exception and allowed the buyer to keep the discount. So he asks, "can you put that in my contract?". The salespersons says no, he is not authorized to do that. So that's what scared them. Unless you buy in cash, you do take some risk.

[outlaw]

Tell your friend he can buy pre owned, but tell him/her to focus on MLS listings, if possible. their sales contracts are negotiable regarding various terms and conditions, whereas, the developer's VLS listings have absolutely no flexibility regarding T&Cs. Some of VLS T&Cs are ridiculous. The developer's attitude is my way or the highway.

[manaboutown]

Yep, he wanted to go with Citizens but they could not guarantee 30 days. The person provided several accounts of loans of which they did not finish in 30 days for various reasons. So, my friend went back to the sales office and asked what happened in those recent cases where Citizens could not satisfy 30 days. The salesperson said they made an exception and allowed the buyer to keep the discount. So he asks, "can you put that in my contract?". The salespersons says no, he is not authorized to do that. So that's what scared them. Unless you buy in cash, you do take some risk.

Did your friends request the Villages agent to take it to a supervisor who may have been able to help? I doubt the developer would want to miss out on a sale financed through its bank unless there were backup offer(s) which could close within the 30 day period. It seems sad to me that it did not work out for them after the time and expense they put into it.

[JerryLBell]

The wife and I bought earlier this year through The Villages. We got our mortgage through Well Fargo, who bent over backwards to meet the 30 day date but just couldn't do it. We closed about a week later. We did NOT lose our discount but we did have to pay some sort of fee for each of those days we were late by. Afterwards, Wells Fargo sent us gift debit cards equaling the amount of the fines so it's not like we actually had to pay much of anything for the fines.

I'm not sure why buying through The Villages includes this absurd 30 day time, but it is a bit of a pain in the a**. If we'd found a resale home we'd like as well as the new one we bought AND if we'd gone through an "outside" realtor, I feel like we wouldn't have had this. Whatever. It's all behind us now. We just need to finish up our final year or two of our careers and retire down to TV!

[jnieman]

We bought our house with a discount through Citizens under the 30 day requirement, however, that was 2 years ago. Recently, I went for a home equity loan, and Citizens Bank (I am a customer), Chase Bank (I am a customer), and one other bank (not a customer), all stated 45 days, and interest rates of over 5%. Then I tried Community Bank, WOW, 3.75% interest rate, and closed in right around 2 weeks, which allowed the construction of the addition to proceed on schedule.
My advice, have your friends call Community Bank and trust and see what they can do.
Hope this helps.

Did you get a fixed rate on your home equity loan? We just got one with SunTrust and it took less than 2 weeks but it is adjustable rate. They did originally quote me a 30 day lead time but it processed very quickly. We will have the cash in our account in just about 2 1/2 weeks from the time we applied but do have to keep the account open for 3 years to avoid penalties. There were no closing costs. We are adding on a bird cage and enclosing the lanai.

[FIRSTAVEBANK]

I wanted to share my friend's story and see if others experienced the same thing. They were down last week for the sole purpose of finding and purchasing a home here. They looked at both owned and new and settled for a new home in Labelle. They were pre-approved for a mortgage through Chase. When it came to sign the paperwork, the Villages would not budge on the 30 day closing date. In addition (I looked at the contract also), if closing did not occur within 30 days (for any reason outside of the developer's control), then the discount on the home would be voided and they would have to pay the higher price. Chase wanted 45 days to ensure they could process the mortgage. So my friend went to Citizen's thinking that well, it's a developer owned entity, that must be the preferred way to go. He said that they were very professional but could not guarantee 30 days either for a mortgage. He said that there had been instances where either paperwork got delayed or something else (out of there control) by which they were not able to complete the processing.

So to make a long story short, they didn't buy.. they were concerned that if they could not get a mortgage within 30 days and if the discount was not continued, then they'd end up paying an additional $11k.

They went home disillusioned about their experience and have a bad taste about the Villages corporate entity. I tried to reassure them. We are on our second home now (all pre-owned) and had nothing but positive experiences in the buying / selling process. I guess that's the difference between dealing with an individual seller vs a corporation.

Anyhow, I'm just sharing.
Sorry to hear about the bad experience. We are very familiar with meeting the 30 day closing requirement. Please feel free to send along our contact information to your friends, we love making new neighbors! Scott Turner can be reached at 352-399-5899.

[graciegirl]

We had no problem, either time here, buying a new home. The developers don't negotiate and they don't take VA or FHA and there have been people here who have complained about that.


It's a new experience for many. But it is what it is. You can either fish, or cut bait.

[Buckeye Bob]

I believe the issue with the Villages on new homes has something to do with taxes and bond starting on a home that hasn't been sold. If the deal fell apart, the Villages has to start paying those items. On a pre-owned, someone is already paying those items so it's not an issue.

[twoplanekid]

Last year we worked with a local Ohio bank, knew the loan officer to obtain a fixed loan almost with in the 30 day time. Paperwork was sent to the wrong office, not our fault that resulted in the closing date being postponed by about a week. We were not assessed a penalty by the Villages. My brother went thought this same bank to meet the time constraints for the purchase of his house this year.

Because of the rush or something, our bank had to refund some of our closing costs as the result of a Fed audit. My brother was upset that he didn’t get a refund.

Sometimes it is the luck of the draw how things turn out.

[jblum315]

I refinanced my mortgage in January with Quicken Loan. It was quick and painless. The banks I called wouldn't touch it because the loan amount was too small, they said.

[TNLAKEPANDA]

We had a horrible experience with Citizen's Mortgage and so did my sister. Because of the Dodd - Frank bill getting a mortgage is a lot more difficult and takes longer. The Developer needs to advertise discount applies to Cash Buyers.

[rubicon]

As to buying in The Villages the market determines your experience.
When we first looked the Developer couldn't do enough. We backed away

We came back about a year later and (2006) and the Developer was telling people what they were going to pay and that they had no options take it or leave it. the prices by the way doubled by our second visit. I was so incensed that I listed everything I wanted in a home and if she could not deliver at my price then I would look elsewhere. Three weeks later she called and had a meeting of minds.

Business is business and I understand tough dealings and negotiations but this Developer leaves you with a very bad taste in your mouth .

[villagetinker]

Did you get a fixed rate on your home equity loan? We just got one with SunTrust and it took less than 2 weeks but it is adjustable rate. They did originally quote me a 30 day lead time but it processed very quickly. We will have the cash in our account in just about 2 1/2 weeks from the time we applied but do have to keep the account open for 3 years to avoid penalties. There were no closing costs. We are adding on a bird cage and enclosing the lanai.

Our terms were the same as yours, variable rate, 3 years to avoid closing costs, and interesting, we added a birdcage, but are not enclosing the lanai, the cat did not approve the enclosing of the lanai:a040:.

In our case we wanted to start construction, and were lead to believe that the builders typically file a lien at the time the contract is signed, and if that were signed before the loan went through, chaos would ensue. By securing the loan first we avoided the chaos, also as it turns out our builder did not file a lien anyway.

[dewilson58]

The wife and I bought earlier this year through The Villages. We got our mortgage through Wells Fargo, who bent over backwards to meet the 30 day date but just couldn't do it. We closed about a week later. We did NOT lose our discount but we did have to pay some sort of fee for each of those days we were late by. Afterwards, Wells Fargo sent us gift debit cards equaling the amount of the fines so it's not like we actually had to pay much of anything for the fines.

I'm not sure why buying through The Villages includes this absurd 30 day time, but it is a bit of a pain in the a**. If we'd found a resale home we'd like as well as the new one we bought AND if we'd gone through an "outside" realtor, I feel like we wouldn't have had this. Whatever. It's all behind us now. We just need to finish up our final year or two of our careers and retire down to TV!

We did WFargo as well. They were able to meet the deadline. I got a set of knives. :a040:

[asianthree]

We used BOA on our first house in a TV. We closed 13 hours late. Not our fault, there was a computer issue at TV. We were charged $495 for closing late. Our bank picked up the tab. Citizens always closes in 30 days. That's why they want you to use the. Higher interest, more closing cost. I am surprised citizens said they could not close on time

[Barefoot]

Tell your friend he can buy pre owned, but tell him/her to focus on MLS listings, if possible. their sales contracts are negotiable regarding various terms and conditions, whereas, the developer's VLS listings have absolutely no flexibility regarding T&Cs. Some of VLS T&Cs are ridiculous. The developer's attitude is my way or the highway.
Our experience with buying a resale through VLS was much different than yours. When we purchased our current resale through The Villages, we added a clause that the offer was conditional on selling our CYV. We found the Sales Department at VLS very negotiable regarding T & Cs, and it was smooth sailing all the way.

[villagerfrog]

Thank you all for your replies. Mr. M (my friend) is contemplating what they will do next. I read through all the reviews. God bless you all for taking the time to share your experiences and thoughts. Mr. M and wife are going to think about things for awhile. They will be coming down again in December. Perhaps things will work out for their favor in the next visit. As I mentioned earlier, the concern they had was the clause that if they didn't close within the 30 days, they would lost the discount. They had no problem with the interest nor the $250 to change the closing date. I'm hoping that that sales department sees this and does a survey on other folks who were ready to "sign" but the 30 day restriction scared them away. Thanks much for your comments.

[rjm1cc]

They were pre-approved. Chase wanted 45 days for processing.

What does that mean? My guess is that your friends said this is what I earn, assets and debt I have etc and they said ok if what you said is all true you can have a loan of x. Now the bank needs the 45 days to verify. Remember the people the bank goes to may not respond quickly or their response may result in more paperwork.

[perrjojo]

No mortgage company can guarantee 30 day closing because of many factors. Perhaps your employer, bank or previous home loan does not respond in time. Perhaps you cannot provide your requested documents on time. A mortgage company is at the mercy of appraisers, underwriters etc. a good solid applicant can close in 30'days but a mortgage company doesn't know what may come up when you first apply. The developer ask for a 30 day close because time is money. He is paying interim financing interest on each home he builds. Some home loan processes can go on forever, costing the builder more money.

[dbussone]

The only way to complete a 30 day closing for certain is to do a cash closing.

[JCMSr]

When we purchased in April 2014 we were presented with a similar closing schedule and were told it would be best if we handled any financing through Citizens. Although we already had a long relationship with BOA we decided to give Citizens a shot at our business. Not only were their rates and closing costs much higher it turned out that they could not provide the relatively short term financing we needed. We therefore ended up going with BOA who completed the entire process in under two weeks. Since everything was complete we requested that the closing be moved up so that we could handle it in person in lieu of having to send the documents via the mail back to NC. The response to this request was to provide us with a $250 change order to cover administrative costs for changing the terms of the contract. I very politely (not) told them where they could put their change order and let them mail everything on the original closing date. Seems like they could have figured out that the savings in taxes, utilities and loan interest would have been incentive enough to allow the early closing but they would not waiver from their position. Our agent even offered to pay the fee out of his own pocket which I refused to allow.

[Fraugoofy]

Sorry to hear about your friend. We bought pre-owned twice, once in 2012 and on the exact same day in 2013 closed on the 2nd house. Used Citizens First both times, no issues whatsoever. First house bought from The Villages, second house from a For Sale By Owner. Found the entire process very simple both times. Both done from Wisconsin via snail mail. My suggestion? Eat the 11k. In a year your friend's house will be worth that plus some... there is nothing on Earth that compares to TV lifestyle and amenities. Nothing! Best of luck to your friend no matter what they decide.

[outlaw]

Our experience with buying a resale through VLS was much different than yours. When we purchased our current resale through The Villages, we added a clause that the offer was conditional on selling our CYV. We found the Sales Department at VLS very negotiable regarding T & Cs, and it was smooth sailing all the way.


You may not have noticed the kickout clause, or maybe when you bought they had not started using this clause. Although you had a signed sales contract, the house you were wanting to buy stays on the market, and if another offer comes in before you sell your other house, you are required to pony up thousands more in NON-refundable EMD, and held to your closing date or forfeit the EMD. Also, not one word of the sales contract could be changed.

[biker1]

On a resale, aren't you negotiating with the owner of current owner of the home and not sales department?

Our experience with buying a resale through VLS was much different than yours. When we purchased our current resale through The Villages, we added a clause that the offer was conditional on selling our CYV. We found the Sales Department at VLS very negotiable regarding T & Cs, and it was smooth sailing all the way.

[Packer Fan]

I refinanced my mortgage in January with Quicken Loan. It was quick and painless. The banks I called wouldn't touch it because the loan amount was too small, they said.

I would second Quicken loans. Bought a new house and the financing was over the holidays. It was tight but they got it done in the 30 days. The closer said if it was the mortgage company that was the problem they always gave a few day grace period on the 30 dayside long as you made every effort to close on time

There are no guarantees in life

[outlaw]

On a resale, aren't you negotiating with the owner of current owner of the home and not sales department?

Only on price and a few things like "as is", etc. The sales contract (form) is pretty much non-negotiable, unlike with a MLS contract, where you can attach an addendum and change almost anything the seller agrees to.

[NYGUY]

When we purchased in April 2014 we were presented with a similar closing schedule and were told it would be best if we handled any financing through Citizens. Although we already had a long relationship with BOA we decided to give Citizens a shot at our business. Not only were their rates and closing costs much higher it turned out that they could not provide the relatively short term financing we needed. We therefore ended up going with BOA who completed the entire process in under two weeks. Since everything was complete we requested that the closing be moved up so that we could handle it in person in lieu of having to send the documents via the mail back to NC. The response to this request was to provide us with a $250 change order to cover administrative costs for changing the terms of the contract. I very politely (not) told them where they could put their change order and let them mail everything on the original closing date. Seems like they could have figured out that the savings in taxes, utilities and loan interest would have been incentive enough to allow the early closing but they would not waiver from their position. Our agent even offered to pay the fee out of his own pocket which I refused to allow.

We also used Bank of America after being told we should use Citizens if we expected to meet the 30 day requirement. B of A was ready in 21 days, The Villages was not!!

[biker1]

That is very strange indeed. Who is calling the shots here, the buyer and seller or the middle men processing the paperwork (i.e. the sales people)?

Only on price and a few things like "as is", etc. The sales contract (form) is pretty much non-negotiable, unlike with a MLS contract, where you can attach an addendum and change almost anything the seller agrees to.

[graciegirl]

That is very strange indeed. Who is calling the shots here, the buyer and seller or the middle men processing the paperwork (i.e. the sales people)?



Who is calling the shots? On a new home, the developer.


When people are lined up to buy your product you don't have to negotiate with people.


MLS is not allowed to sell a new home here. There are no changes of any kind to the contract on a new home. Period and Amen. Once you absorb that information, your life get's simpler.


AND realtors who aren't allowed to sell new homes post on this forum in many ways. Many are not fans of the developer. Need I say more?

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

I wanted to share my friend's story and see if others experienced the same thing. They were down last week for the sole purpose of finding and purchasing a home here. They looked at both owned and new and settled for a new home in Labelle. They were pre-approved for a mortgage through Chase. When it came to sign the paperwork, the Villages would not budge on the 30 day closing date. In addition (I looked at the contract also), if closing did not occur within 30 days (for any reason outside of the developer's control), then the discount on the home would be voided and they would have to pay the higher price. Chase wanted 45 days to ensure they could process the mortgage. So my friend went to Citizen's thinking that well, it's a developer owned entity, that must be the preferred way to go. He said that they were very professional but could not guarantee 30 days either for a mortgage. He said that there had been instances where either paperwork got delayed or something else (out of there control) by which they were not able to complete the processing.

So to make a long story short, they didn't buy.. they were concerned that if they could not get a mortgage within 30 days and if the discount was not continued, then they'd end up paying an additional $11k.

They went home disillusioned about their experience and have a bad taste about the Villages corporate entity. I tried to reassure them. We are on our second home now (all pre-owned) and had nothing but positive experiences in the buying / selling process. I guess that's the difference between dealing with an individual seller vs a corporation.

Anyhow, I'm just sharing.

I went through the same thing and I didn't find out until after I had signed an agreement. In my case there was a $250 per day fine if I couldn't close within 30 days. This is unheard of in real estate sales.

Another thing I found out after I had signed papers is that there is no loan contingency. If you are turned down for the loan, The Villages keeps your
10% deposit.

My sister is a very successful real estate broker up north and was flabbergasted when I told her of these two conditions.

I guess that they are in a position of strength and are able to sell thousands of homes in spite of these outrageous conditions.

I went through Quicken Loans and did everything online. I explained about the $250 per day fine for not closing on time and they were great in expediting everything. We had the loan approved after 25 days and there were a few issues. I would highly recommend Quicken Loans. They made every thing easy. Their communication was incredible and it was all done online.

After this experience, I would not buy another new home from The Villages unless I could pay cash. If I move again, it will be into a pre-owned home.

[graciegirl]

I went through the same thing and I didn't find out until after I had signed an agreement. In my case there was a $250 per day fine if I couldn't close within 30 days. This is unheard of in real estate sales.

Another thing I found out after I had signed papers is that there is no loan contingency. If you are turned down for the loan, The Villages keeps your
10% deposit.

My sister is a very successful real estate broker up north and was flabbergasted when I told her of these two conditions.

I guess that they are in a position of strength and are able to sell thousands of homes in spite of these outrageous conditions.

I went through Quicken Loans and did everything online. I explained about the $250 per day fine for not closing on time and they were great in expediting everything. We had the loan approved after 25 days and there were a few issues. I would highly recommend Quicken Loans. They made every thing easy. Their communication was incredible and it was all done online.

After this experience, I would not buy another new home from The Villages unless I could pay cash. If I move again, it will be into a pre-owned home.



The $250 charge is for anyone, not just you. Time is money. The VA and FHA would slow down the closing process. Real Estate is not a baby game.


When they are building, once you sign off on the way you want your house built, they charge $250 if you try to change the contract. It is obvious to me that benefits the developer.


The bottom line is, that if you don't want to buy a new home here the way they do business, step aside, there are ten in line behind you.


You have to be a grown up in business. I have never witnessed anyone who worked for The Villages not be polite or civil of friendly or well mannered. They just don't have to change things for anyone, so they don't.


I love living in such a beautiful and sought after place.

[FIRSTAVEBANK]

Wow, I'm sorry your friend had such a bad experience. We here at First Avenue National Bank are all too familiar with the frustration some face but we have solutions for your friend. We are often approached after these frustrating experiences and are able to overcome those frustrations. We work closely with the title companies in the area and since all decisions are made in house, 30 day closings are no problem. If you need advice, please contact our mortgage expert, Scott Turner at 352-399-5899. I guarantee you and your friend will be impressed!

[biker1]

Calm down. We were referring to used home sales.

Who is calling the shots? On a new home, the developer.


When people are lined up to buy your product you don't have to negotiate with people.


MLS is not allowed to sell a new home here. There are no changes of any kind to the contract on a new home. Period and Amen. Once you absorb that information, your life get's simpler.


AND realtors who aren't allowed to sell new homes post on this forum in many ways. Many are not fans of the developer. Need I say more?

[daveersk]

We closed in 2013 on a new house in Charlotte; our contract had the same stipulations as noted in thread.

It was a bit of a time crunch, but with a little perseverance and drive on my part and luck we closed only two days late.

The Villages closing department did not hit us with any additional money for closing a bit late.

We did the whole deal via FedEx mail, fax and phone calls.

If you want the house, you have to push through all the paper work.

We are so happy we bought the house, and someday soon we will be full-time Villagers!!!

[rexxfan]

Yup, even so, our cash closing took 3 weeks.
--
bc

[asianthree]

The only way to complete a 30 day closing for certain is to do a cash closing.

We closed house #1 in 31 days. House #2 in 30 days and house # 3 in 30 days. Not cash deal

[dbussone]

We closed house #1 in 31 days. House #2 in 30 days and house # 3 in 30 days. Not cash deal


That, asianthree, is called a triple play! Well done and congratulations.

[Barefoot]

We closed house #1 in 31 days. House #2 in 30 days and house # 3 in 30 days. Not cash deal
Three houses in how many years? How interesting.
Wow, that must be some kind of a record!

[jswintberg]

We just recently used BOA (US Trust) and they bent over backwards to meet all needs. Their rate was .25 lower than Citizens and the fees were less. Citizens also has a debt to income ratio and required me to take an $8,000/month IRA distribution to meet the ratio since we do not have any income at this moment. BOA has no such requirement. We ducked the scare tactics to use Citizens and are grateful to BOA.

[goodtimesintv]

We just recently used BOA (US Trust) and they bent over backwards to meet all needs. Their rate was .25 lower than Citizens and the fees were less. Citizens also has a debt to income ratio and required me to take an $8,000/month IRA distribution to meet the ratio since we do not have any income at this moment. BOA has no such requirement. We ducked the scare tactics to use Citizens and are grateful to BOA.

A thinking consumer would applaud Citizens for having a debt-to-income ratio to meet!

WE taxpayers have to pay for the $20 billion in bailout money that Bank of America finagled and got, because of their mortgage lending to unqualified buyers!

"The U.S. government early Friday morning agreed to invest $20 billion in Bank of America, and to protect the bank against up to $118 billion in potential losses from bank assets related to risky mortgage loans."

Bank of America getting extra $20B in bailout funds - ABC News (http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=6661052)

We used Citizens to buy two homes here, and we'll use them again. They are invested in this community's future housing market and won't be going with tin cup in hand to Congress for a taxpayer bailout. They make sure they lend to people who can repay.

:ohdear:

[justjim]

No mortgage company can guarantee 30 day closing because of many factors. Perhaps your employer, bank or previous home loan does not respond in time. Perhaps you cannot provide your requested documents on time. A mortgage company is at the mercy of appraisers, underwriters etc. a good solid applicant can close in 30'days but a mortgage company doesn't know what may come up when you first apply. The developer ask for a 30 day close because time is money. He is paying interim financing interest on each home he builds. Some home loan processes can go on forever, costing the builder more money.

Great post. You hit the nail right on the head. Prior to the new regulations that Government imposed in 2012, a 30 day close on a pre-approved client was no problem. Now it can be done but it could be a problem for the reasons posted.

Iam surprised that the Developer let a sale get away for a mere 15 days difference in closing. Indeed, sales must be very good.

[biker1]

I believe BoA paid back its TARP loan.

A thinking consumer would applaud Citizens for having a debt-to-income ratio to meet!

WE taxpayers have to pay for the $20 billion in bailout money that Bank of America finagled and got, because of their mortgage lending to unqualified buyers!

"The U.S. government early Friday morning agreed to invest $20 billion in Bank of America, and to protect the bank against up to $118 billion in potential losses from bank assets related to risky mortgage loans."

Bank of America getting extra $20B in bailout funds - ABC News (http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=6661052)

We used Citizens to buy two homes here, and we'll use them again. They are invested in this community's future housing market and won't be going with tin cup in hand to Congress for a taxpayer bailout. They make sure they lend to people who can repay.

:ohdear:

[jmac1031]

Great post. You hit the nail right on the head. Prior to the new regulations that Government imposed in 2012, a 30 day close on a pre-approved client was no problem. Now it can be done but it could be a problem for the reasons posted.

Iam surprised that the Developer let a sale get away for a mere 15 days difference in closing. Indeed, sales must be very good.

If folks thought this situation was messed up, wait until Dodd-Frank real estate lending changes go into effect in the next month. They were originally scheduled to be in effect in August but because of all of the compliance issues for the banks, it had to be postponed. The training class I went to shared that unless you are paying cash 30 day closings,you will not be possibles because of disclosures and verifications no mater who you are. If there was a holiday in the contract period you needed to add a week. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out.

[Biker Dog]

If folks thought this situation was messed up, wait until Dodd-Frank real estate lending changes go into effect in the next month. They were originally scheduled to be in effect in August but because of all of the compliance issues for the banks, it had to be postponed. The training class I went to shared that unless you are paying cash 30 day closings,you will not be possibles because of disclosures and verifications no mater who you are. If there was a holiday in the contract period you needed to add a week. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out.

TOTALLY AGREE:shrug: Retired Mortgage Broker

[birdawg]

Pay Cash, then you don't have to deal with the banks, or deadlines.

[biker1]

At the risk of stating the obvious, not everyone can do that.

Pay Cash, then you don't have to deal with the banks, or deadlines.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

On a resale, aren't you negotiating with the owner of current owner of the home and not sales department?

Yes, but if the house is listed with Properties of The Villages, you negotiate through the sales department.

[bagboy]

I think the bottom line is in this case, if the buyer (s) mentioned by the OP really want to be here, they could contact Citizens Mortgage and get pre-approved for their mortgage. Then enter into a purchase agreement on a new or pre-owned home through The Villages, and the job will get done. In most if not all cases any delay will be on the developer and/or their subsidiaries, and any late penalty will be waived.
I do understand the buyer (s) have already done this once with their own mortgage lender, and to some this may be fair or unfair. But the reality is, the best way to buy a home and become a villager other than paying cash, is what I stated above. It will be worth the effort in my humble opinion.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Who is calling the shots? On a new home, the developer.


When people are lined up to buy your product you don't have to negotiate with people.


MLS is not allowed to sell a new home here. There are no changes of any kind to the contract on a new home. Period and Amen. Once you absorb that information, your life get's simpler.


AND realtors who aren't allowed to sell new homes post on this forum in many ways. Many are not fans of the developer. Need I say more?

You are right in most cases, Gracie. However, there are outside realtors buying up manufactured homes in the historic district, removing them and replacing them new homes. So there are actually a small number of new homes for sale that you won't find on the Properties of The Villages website.

I'm not sure that this is allowed in other areas, but it is going on up here.

[The Buckeyes]

Had the same restrictions in 2013 and was surprised the amount of hoops I had to jump thru that I had not done when building a house a decade earlier. I went thru Merrill Lynch both times and used stock as collateral to secure the loan. Although the ML office I deal with is in Illinois...their home loan div. is in Jacksonville. The person in Jacksonville seemed very unconcerned about the 30 days, so much so that I contacted Illinois about this situation. They asked for the person's name I was dealing with and said they would get involved. I ended the conversation by politely stating that if the money wasn't there on the close date they had 2 options....1. Pay all fees, penalties and loss of discounts I may incur or 2. Have me pull all my stock out of there business. The money was there on my closing date at 11:00 am. I must say I have a great relationship with Merrill Lynch but, as previously stated, I believe this Dodd-Frank bill has many unintended consequences and still doesn't address the main concern of Fannie and Freddie.

[goodtimesintv]

I believe BoA payed back its TARP loan.

"48 percent of the banks that have repaid the CPP used money they'd gotten from other federal programs, according to the GAO report. Those programs include the Community Development Capital Initiative -- another TARP program -- and the Small Business Lending Fund, a program designed to encourage lending to small businesses."

Banks Repaid Fed Bailout With Other Fed Money: Government Report (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/09/bank-tarp_n_1335006.html)

[Shadow8IA]

We just recently used BOA (US Trust) and they bent over backwards to meet all needs. Their rate was .25 lower than Citizens and the fees were less. Citizens also has a debt to income ratio and required me to take an $8,000/month IRA distribution to meet the ratio since we do not have any income at this moment. BOA has no such requirement. We ducked the scare tactics to use Citizens and are grateful to BOA.

We had the same debt to ratio problem even though we were preapproved months earlier. We did the IRA withdrawal but were told we could cancel it after one month which made no sense that it was required. We probably should have switched banks but Citizens Mortgage assured us that no one else would be able to close in a month and by then we were about 2 1/2 weeks from closing.

[biker1]

As far as I can tell BoA doesn't owe any money. If you know otherwise please provide the information. I have no love of BofA but do wish to know their current status. Thanks.

"48 percent of the banks that have repaid the CPP used money they'd gotten from other federal programs, according to the GAO report. Those programs include the Community Development Capital Initiative -- another TARP program -- and the Small Business Lending Fund, a program designed to encourage lending to small businesses."

Banks Repaid Fed Bailout With Other Fed Money: Government Report (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/09/bank-tarp_n_1335006.html)

[goodtimesintv]

"48 percent of the banks that have repaid the CPP used money they'd gotten from other federal programs, according to the GAO report. Those programs include the Community Development Capital Initiative -- another TARP program -- and the Small Business Lending Fund, a program designed to encourage lending to small businesses."

Banks Repaid Fed Bailout With Other Fed Money: Government Report (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/09/bank-tarp_n_1335006.html)

As far as I can tell BoA doesn't owe any money. If you know otherwise please provide the information. I have no love of BofA but do wish to know their current status. Thanks.

On this Bailout Tracker site of all the bailout recipients repaying their debts or not, it is unclear what Bank of America repaid or not because of these three statements and other important and complex data:

"Recipients of aid through TARP�s housing programs (such as mortgage servicers and state housing orgs) received subsidies that were never intended to be repaid, so we don�t mark those as losses.."

"Bank of America:
Received other federal aid. Click to see details."

"Note: Subsidies are listed separately from the investment programs. So, for instance, Bank of America is listed twice � both as a mortgage servicer and as a bank."

And then there is this:
"Companies that failed to repay the government and resulted in a loss are shaded red. You can see a list of those investments here. "

There are over 121 of those companies shaded in red at this page, and their outstanding debt to the government/taxpayers totals tens of billions of dollars.

SEE:
https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list

I'm no expert obviously. But I think we can safely conclude shoddy mortgage lending practices still go on with these monster banks and mortgage lenders, especially when knowing some do not bother with debt-to-income ratio checking.

[biker1]

Thanks for the research. If you come across more information please post. I believe it is important that we know the status of these organizations that are "too big to fail". Thanks.

On this Bailout Tracker site of all the bailout recipients repaying their debts or not, it is unclear what Bank of America repaid or not because of these three statements and other important and complex data:

"Recipients of aid through TARP�s housing programs (such as mortgage servicers and state housing orgs) received subsidies that were never intended to be repaid, so we don�t mark those as losses.."

"Bank of America:
Received other federal aid. Click to see details."

"Note: Subsidies are listed separately from the investment programs. So, for instance, Bank of America is listed twice � both as a mortgage servicer and as a bank."

And then there is this:
"Companies that failed to repay the government and resulted in a loss are shaded red. You can see a list of those investments here. "

There are over 121 of those companies shaded in red at this page, and their outstanding debt to the government/taxpayers totals tens of billions of dollars.

SEE:
https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list

I'm no expert obviously. But I think we can safely conclude shoddy mortgage lending practices still go on with these monster banks and mortgage lenders, especially when knowing some do not bother with debt-to-income ratio checking.

[Roaddog53]

Reading this thread still is amazing. We too have bought two homes in TV. The first built, 2012, second TV spec home new. Both times they talk about and was in fact in the contract for the 30 day and missing costs $250. We laughed and said keep your home. They also kept saying the "take it or leave it" on the home we built with options. Their way or no way. After the third take it statement, we got up and walked out. They asked where were we going and we said we are "leaving it" as you said. They than bent over backwards and changed designers to finish it. Citizens was awful in rates and closing costs, and their attitude, and the threats of $250. We went to BBT and they actually made it easily in time on both. The second home Justin called and thought we were closing in 15-20 days and they were ready.

[Roaddog53]

An interesting fact is TV NEW home sales are DOWN nearly 10% since April throug their own admission in the weekly flyer. PRE-OWNED homes are UP 2% for the same timeframe for a total TV market down 8%. The breakdown is 52% new sold and 48% pre-owned. Add in realty sales and pre-owned sales far outstrip new homes. Obviously pre-owned is selling and where are they going? Yes some are are their second home, but many are leaving. An outside community from TV said last month, five Villagers bought there. Yessss you can read into it it is summer and sales are down or all kinds of other reasons. Bottom line, new homes are much lower in price now. They can sell 185-300k homes ok, but the higher ones take much longer and not as many. If you don't golf for into lots of cliubs there ARE Other alternatives. Better value for the price, lower taxes, etc. each has to do their own homework.
Perhaps the baby boomer gen is ending.. Perhaps the next gen does not have the retirement funds, who knows. Maybe people are tired of the take it or leave it attitudes. I have always said when ANY COMPANY treats THE customer with arrogance (by the way, we are the customer) because they are too busy, they have awaiting list, or poor statements of "hurry and buy! we will be built out in 2 years and than there won't be any homes" since 2008, we won't build no more patio villas, That company is not focused on who their market is. It will some day catch up with that business. Maybe it is now.

[JoMar]

An interesting fact is TV NEW home sales are DOWN nearly 10% since April throug their own admission in the weekly flyer. PRE-OWNED homes are UP 2% for the same timeframe for a total TV market down 8%. The breakdown is 52% new sold and 48% pre-owned. Add in realty sales and pre-owned sales far outstrip new homes. Obviously pre-owned is selling and where are they going? Yes some are are their second home, but many are leaving. An outside community from TV said last month, five Villagers bought there. Yessss you can read into it it is summer and sales are down or all kinds of other reasons. Bottom line, new homes are much lower in price now. They can sell 185-300k homes ok, but the higher ones take much longer and not as many. If you don't golf for into lots of cliubs there ARE Other alternatives. Better value for the price, lower taxes, etc. each has to do their own homework.
Perhaps the baby boomer gen is ending.. Perhaps the next gen does not have the retirement funds, who knows. Maybe people are tired of the take it or leave it attitudes. I have always said when ANY COMPANY treats THE customer with arrogance (by the way, we are the customer) because they are too busy, they have awaiting list, or poor statements of "hurry and buy! we will be built out in 2 years and than there won't be any homes" since 2008, we won't build no more patio villas, That company is not focused on who their market is. It will some day catch up with that business. Maybe it is now.

So we can assume you don't live here? If you don't then you have no skin in the game here or an understanding of this place and your posts are useless. If you do live here then we can assume you made a terrible mistake or are realizing you made a mistake and will move to one of those "better value" places. People live where they live for personal reasons and they move from where they live for personal reasons. I know a few families that left because they missed their family's and one because they had serious health issues. I'm sure others have left because the lifestyle didn't suit them or the cost exceeded their means. Comparing this place to ANY COMPANY is silly since this is the only product available here. In fact, it's the only product of it's type and scope and size and integration that can support over 100K people. We all make our own choices, I ask that you respect that and try not to make assumptions that suit your agenda.

[HimandMe]

So we can assume you don't live here? If you don't then you have no skin in the game here or an understanding of this place and your posts are useless. If you do live here then we can assume you made a terrible mistake or are realizing you made a mistake and will move to one of those "better value" places. People live where they live for personal reasons and they move from where they live for personal reasons. I know a few families that left because they missed their family's and one because they had serious health issues. I'm sure others have left because the lifestyle didn't suit them or the cost exceeded their means. Comparing this place to ANY COMPANY is silly since this is the only product available here. In fact, it's the only product of it's type and scope and size and integration that can support over 100K people. We all make our own choices, I ask that you respect that and try not to make assumptions that suit your agenda.

Agreed...and the better value is here...there is no place like it. Sure arrogance offends us in any form and it would be better without it but pluses outweigh the minuses...

[graciegirl]

Agreed...and the better value is here...there is no place like it. Sure arrogance offends us in any form and it would be better without it but pluses outweigh the minuses...


I didn't sense any arrogance. No one was arrogant. They don't have to negotiate so they don't.


I was more amused than aggravated.

[bagboy]

So we can assume you don't live here? If you don't then you have no skin in the game here or an understanding of this place and your posts are useless. If you do live here then we can assume you made a terrible mistake or are realizing you made a mistake and will move to one of those "better value" places. People live where they live for personal reasons and they move from where they live for personal reasons. I know a few families that left because they missed their family's and one because they had serious health issues. I'm sure others have left because the lifestyle didn't suit them or the cost exceeded their means. Comparing this place to ANY COMPANY is silly since this is the only product available here. In fact, it's the only product of it's type and scope and size and integration that can support over 100K people. We all make our own choices, I ask that you respect that and try not to make assumptions that suit your agenda.

Very much agree!!

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

The $250 charge is for anyone, not just you. Time is money. The VA and FHA would slow down the closing process. Real Estate is not a baby game

Yes Gracie, the $250 per fine is for everyone that buys a new house in The Villages and cannot get a loan within 30 days. I don't think that I implied otherwise.

Like I said, this along with the no loan contingency is unheard of elsewhere in real estate. The only fine of this type outside The Villages is against a builder who does not finish the project in time.

My sister tells me that she has people fail to qualify for a loan all the time. They get their deposit back and the property goes back on the market. This is standard operating procedure for real estate all over this country. The sale is always contingent upon the buyer being able to procure a loan.

What really bothered me was that I wasn't made aware of these conditions until after I had signed the agreement. Had I known I never would have signed the paperwork and would have looked for a pre-owned home.

I am very thankful that Quicken Loans was so co-operative and helpful in getting everything done on time. And like I said, unless I could pay cash, I would not buy another new home from The Villages.

[outlaw]

Yes Gracie, the $250 per fine is for everyone that buys a new house in The Villages and cannot get a loan within 30 days. I don't think that I implied otherwise.

Like I said, this along with the no loan contingency is unheard of elsewhere in real estate. The only fine of this type outside The Villages is against a builder who does not finish the project in time.

My sister tells me that she has people fail to qualify for a loan all the time. They get their deposit back and the property goes back on the market. This is standard operating procedure for real estate all over this country. The sale is always contingent upon the buyer being able to procure a loan.

What really bothered me was that I wasn't made aware of these conditions until after I had signed the agreement. Had I known I never would have signed the paperwork and would have looked for a pre-owned home.

I am very thankful that Quicken Loans was so co-operative and helpful in getting everything done on time. And like I said, unless I could pay cash, I would not buy another new home from The Villages.

Are you saying you didn't read the contract before you signed it?

[mgcsooner]

Many things have changed my friends. One of my sons works in this field and has spent on occasion telling me horrid examples of people you'd think would qualify for a mortgage in two seconds and can't. The entire experience has drastically changed since the banking failures, all the bad loans, etc. I mean people making 250-400K a year, trying to buy or even refinance a house. Self employed? You are high risk. You have perfect credit, but your spouse may not. How many of your kids have you co-signed loans for? Have a lien filed against your property? If you deal in a mostly cash business, don't bother.

Some of you will have ZERO problems, not that your credit is any better, just that it is less complicated to verify, it just all depends.

So back to the OP and solving your problem--perhaps. I don't know the time frames for sure, but TV did offer a better deal for those that wanted TO BUILD and they get a discount as well. The downside is you are on the hook for more if you back (I believe), but on the other hand you have longer to arrange your financing. I thought it was 60 days.

Oddly for most people moving to TV it seams this is not a big issue they told us when we moved here more than a year ago, I thing it was something like 60-70% did not finance their homes. I thought about that, but the rates were so low, it seemed like money could be put to better use elsewhere. In my case I used my credit union. They too would not guarantee it. I talked to a supervisor just to see what the "long poles in the tent" were going to be closing the deal, since I was also pre-approved. It was simply completing the appraisal! I went with the "risk". The appraisal was completed a within ten days. I also compared at the end of the deal the actual close cost savings VS citizens, and believe it or not it was something like $3-400. I would have gone with Citizens for that, except for the 0.025% in mortgage loans rate. Even there, at the time they were very competetive.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Are you saying you didn't read the contract before you signed it?

Yes, like most people in these types of transactions, I trust the people that are handing me the papers and telling me what they are and what I am signing.

Did you read every word of every document when you bought your house? Maybe you did, but that would make you a very rare bird. The contract signing would take hours and hours if everyone did and the closing might have to be held over the period of several days.

But I assume that a few people do.

[graciegirl]

Yes, like most people in these types of transactions, I trust the people that are handing me the papers and telling me what they are and what I am signing.

Did you read every word of every document when you bought your house? Maybe you did, but that would make you a very rare bird. The contract signing would take hours and hours if everyone did and the closing might have to be held over the period of several days.

But I assume that a few people do.


I had read about this on this forum many times and heard it from people who are our friends who lived here. We didn't have a loan, but knew that if we changed the contract on the new house we had commissioned to build , that each change would cost us $250. The process runs like a machine.


No. It isn't like your sisters real estate experience or any of ours either and many of us have bought/built many times. This is the fastest growing area in the United States and one if not the most sought after retirement community in the world.


NO one sells this many homes in a month. ANYWHERE. Just another unbelievable until you witness experience for people.

[Dynsol]

I wanted to share my friend's story and see if others experienced the same thing. They were down last week for the sole purpose of finding and purchasing a home here. They looked at both owned and new and settled for a new home in Labelle. They were pre-approved for a mortgage through Chase. When it came to sign the paperwork, the Villages would not budge on the 30 day closing date. In addition (I looked at the contract also), if closing did not occur within 30 days (for any reason outside of the developer's control), then the discount on the home would be voided and they would have to pay the higher price. Chase wanted 45 days to ensure they could process the mortgage. So my friend went to Citizen's thinking that well, it's a developer owned entity, that must be the preferred way to go. He said that they were very professional but could not guarantee 30 days either for a mortgage. He said that there had been instances where either paperwork got delayed or something else (out of there control) by which they were not able to complete the processing.








So to make a long story short, they didn't buy.. they were concerned that if they could not get a mortgage within 30 days and if the discount was not continued, then they'd end up paying an additional $11k.

They went home disillusioned about their experience and have a bad taste about the Villages corporate entity. I tried to reassure them. We are on our second home now (all pre-owned) and had nothing but positive experiences in the buying / selling process. I guess that's the difference between dealing with an individual seller vs a corporation.

Anyhow, I'm just sharing.


When we arrived I compared other finance options vs. The bank offers here and found them comparable so rather than going thru the hassle of a possible extra expense I used their system and it worked out great. I have never looked back and Citizens bank has handled everything great.

[Bavarian]

Maybe not getting the money in time and losing the house was a sign from above that one should not have bought the house.

I do not like this constant chant of "didn't you read the contract?" No one has time to read a long cong contract in the seconds you are given to read it.

Same with all the Deed Restrictions. Now, where we moved from a couple of years ago, Maryland, the HOA rules have to be given to the buyer in advance and they have the right to terminate the purchase contract, get all their money back if they object to anything.

People do not learn all the rules until they break one.