The lowest political ad in this campaign just aired

[Guest]

I just saw the latest Obama ad. It says that John McCain has not kept up to date and by his own admission, can't even use a computer or e-mail.

What it doesn't say is that as a result of injuries he sustained as a POW, John McCain can't comb his hair, tie his shoes or use a keyboard.

This from the candidate who said yesterday he was going to concentrate on the big issues.

I haven't said much about the ads in this campaign because I understand both sides sling garbage. This one is beyond the pale of decency and not becoming of a statesman. It is certainly not presidential.



Boston Globe, 2000

Well, I guess it depends on what you mean by "extraordinary." The reason he doesn't send email is that he can't use a keyboard because of the relentless beatings he received from the Viet Cong in service to our country. From the Boston Globe (March 4, 2000):

McCain gets emotional at the mention of military families needing food stamps or veterans lacking health care. The outrage comes from inside: McCain's severe war injuries prevent him from combing his hair, typing on a keyboard, or tying his shoes. Friends marvel at McCain's encyclopedic knowledge of sports. He's an avid fan - Ted Williams is his hero - but he can't raise his arm above his shoulder to throw a baseball

[Guest]

Yeah I saw this one. It was demeaning at best, painting him as some sort of idiot !!!

[Guest]

Bucco, it's well beyond demeaning. Try ruthless, cruel, vicious, unpresidential, grotesquely perverted, sick, and worse. Right out of Saul Alinsky's playbook, Rules for Radicals.

[Guest]

Did you hear about how Barack Obama wants to have sex education in kindergarten, and called Sarah Palin a pig? Did you hear about how Ms. Palin told Congress, “Thanks, but no thanks” when it wanted to buy Alaska a Bridge to Nowhere? These stories have two things in common: they’re all claims recently made by the McCain campaign — and they’re all out-and-out lies. Dishonesty is nothing new in politics. But I can’t think of any precedent, at least in America, for the blizzard of lies since the Republican convention. The Bush campaign’s lies in 2000 were artful — you needed some grasp of arithmetic to realize that you were being conned. This year, however, the McCain campaign keeps making assertions that anyone with an Internet connection can disprove in a minute, and repeating these assertions over and over again.
Take the case of the Bridge to Nowhere, which supposedly gives Ms. Palin credentials as a reformer. Well, when campaigning for governor, Ms. Palin didn’t say “no thanks” — she was all for the bridge, even though it had already become a national scandal, insisting that she would “not allow the spinmeisters to turn this project or any other into something that’s so negative.” Oh, and when she finally did decide to cancel the project, she didn’t righteously reject a handout from Washington: she accepted the handout, but spent it on something else. You see, long before she decided to cancel the bridge, Congress had told Alaska that it could keep the federal money originally earmarked for that project and use it elsewhere. So the whole story of Ms. Palin’s alleged heroic stand against wasteful spending is fiction. Or take the story of Mr. Obama’s alleged advocacy of kindergarten sex-ed. In reality, he supported legislation calling for “age and developmentally appropriate education”; in the case of young children, that would have meant guidance to help them avoid sexual predators. And then there’s the claim that Mr. Obama’s use of the ordinary metaphor “putting lipstick on a pig” was a sexist smear, and on and on. Why do the McCain people think they can get away with this stuff?
They’re probably counting on the prevalence of horse-race reporting, so that instead of the story being “McCain campaign lies,” it becomes “Obama on defensive in face of attacks.” Still, how upset should we be about the McCain campaign’s lies? I mean, politics ain’t beanbag, and all that.

One answer is that the muck being hurled by the McCain campaign is preventing a debate on real issues — on whether the country really wants, for example, to continue the economic policies of the last eight years.

But there’s another answer, which may be even more important: how a politician campaigns tells you a lot about how he or she would govern.

The Bush political team’s ruthless effectiveness and the heckuva job done by the Bush administration is living, breathing, bumbling, and, in the case of the emerging Interior Department scandal, coke-snorting and bed-hopping proof to the contrary.

I’m talking, instead, about the relationship between the character of a campaign and that of the administration that follows. Thus, the deceptive and dishonest 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign provided an all-too-revealing preview of things to come. In fact, my early suspicion that we were being misled about the threat from Iraq came from the way the political tactics being used to sell the war resembled the tactics that had earlier been used to sell the Bush tax cuts.

And now the team that hopes to form the next administration is running a campaign that makes Bush-Cheney 2000 look like something out of a civics class. What does that say about how that team would run the country?

What it says, I’d argue, is that the Obama campaign is wrong to suggest that a McCain-Palin administration would just be a continuation of Bush-Cheney. If the way John McCain and Sarah Palin are campaigning is any indication, it would be much, much worse.

By PAUL KRUGMAN

NY Times

[Guest]

Jim, I read your (Krugman's) post. What is YOUR point? Joe Krugman is a flaming liberal (he authored a piece called "Conscious of a Liberal") working for the most biased, unabashedly liberal rag in the country. He spews democratic talking points as if they had a modicum of journalistic integrity. He is not a journalist, he writes op-ed solely from the liberal democratic view. You could have done better to make your point.

What does junglejim think? I'd rather hear you than a paid surrogate for Obama.

p.s The only reason I'm spending so much time on the computer today is that it's cold and rainy at the Jersey shore. I'm tired of political television and a contractor kept me in all day. I'd rather be home in the Villages. Have a nice evening.

p.p.s. I just read a couple of your previous posts. A suggestion. Several of them appeared to be your words but when some of them sounded familiar, I checked them. They were authored by others but there was no attribution. You really should give attribution when you use someone else's words. Most would rather intereact with a real person, not a cut and paste off the computer. Please take this in the friendly,constructive context I intend. Perhaps it was an oversight in which case I apologize and stand corrected.

[Guest]

One would think after the whispering campaign used by Bush in 2000 against McCain...his campaign would reflect his earlier statements when he acknowledged the American people want a clean campaign.

However, every fact check organization has labeled the latest ad by McCain as totally false and taken from an earlier campaign for Senate against Obama.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/off_base_on_sex_ed.html

If you think that the Obama ad is the lowest thing you have seen then you haven't been in Colorado.

Perhaps John McCain has read the same book you accuse Obama have reading.

[Guest]

cologal

I live in CO, and I have no idea what you mean. Could you elaborate?

Let me guess , you think Obama ads are all truth and fact.

OOOilovenbc... Benj

[Guest]

I just saw the latest Obama ad. It says that John McCain has not kept up to date and by his own admission, can't even use a computer or e-mail.

What it doesn't say is that as a result of injuries he sustained as a POW, John McCain can't comb his hair, tie his shoes or use a keyboard.

This from the candidate who said yesterday he was going to concentrate on the big issues.

I haven't said much about the ads in this campaign because I understand both sides sling garbage. This one is beyond the pale of decency and not becoming of a statesman. It is certainly not presidential.



Boston Globe, 2000

Well, I guess it depends on what you mean by "extraordinary." The reason he doesn't send email is that he can't use a keyboard because of the relentless beatings he received from the Viet Cong in service to our country. From the Boston Globe (March 4, 2000):

McCain gets emotional at the mention of military families needing food stamps or veterans lacking health care. The outrage comes from inside: McCain's severe war injuries prevent him from combing his hair, typing on a keyboard, or tying his shoes. Friends marvel at McCain's encyclopedic knowledge of sports. He's an avid fan - Ted Williams is his hero - but he can't raise his arm above his shoulder to throw a baseball


I admire the service of John McCain....however why is it that each time something negative hits John McCain the answer is "because he was in a North Vietnam prison."

If he is going to throw mud then some is going to land on him...

[Guest]

Politics has never been pretty. But it certainly has become an ugly pus oozing sore since Karl Rove hit the scene. He started with Bush and has carried on even today with John McCain. Even the Associated Press, usual very conservative, came out calling two of McCain's ads out and out lies. Are you Repubs living in a vacuum. Don't you know what's being said about the McCain ads? It's not just the left liberals saying it. Newsweek already commented that everything in the new Obama ad is true! It's that simple.

[Guest]

cologal

I live in CO, and I have no idea what you mean. Could you elaborate?

Let me guess , you think Obama ads are all truth and fact.

OOOilovenbc... Benj



Everytime an ad comes out I go to the various fact check websites to see what they say. Then at times I will email the 527 or the campaign for clarification. I was speaking about the broader campaign in this email.

The one in Colorado which states the US has more oil reserves than Saudi Arabia
The new Department of Peace ad with smoke coming out of the van.

This last McCain is totally untrue...I don't like negative ads at all on either side they turn me off. But what makes this ad lower than the McCain Paris Hilton ad? But I did like her UTube response.

I have repeatedly said I don't support Obama...you should have heard me when they called the house the other day...

But you know I might have to balance out your vote if its close. ;D

[Guest]

Conservatives take heart!!!!

The more the libs try to slander and disrespect Sarah Palin the more harm they are doing their cause.
White stay at home moms have moved to McCain/Palin some 20% since all the attacks on Palin.

McCain now leads in many polls over Obama since Palin was picked.

The libs are self destructing, the more unreasonable and unfair they get the more the American people are turning on them. Most people are fair and they realize that Palin is the most like us regular people, and they appreciate that. The dems are showing their true colors. Benj

[Guest]

cologal

Thats twice you have said what someone said here might make you vote for Obama, OH PLEASE like you were ever going to vote McCain/ Palin!!!

And as I said before I will be pleased to be sure to cancel out your guaranteed Obama vote. Guess at least your vote is not going to help Obama. I vote in every election even dog catcher.

have you seen OOOilovepaulkrugman???... Benj

[Guest]

Conservatives take heart!!!!

The more the libs try to slander and disrespect Sarah Palin the more harm they are doing their cause.
White stay at home moms have moved to McCain/Palin some 20% since all the attacks on Palin.

McCain now leads in many polls over Obama since Palin was picked.

The libs are self destructing, the more unreasonable and unfair they get the more the American people are turning on them. Most people are fair and they realize that Palin is the most like us regular people, and they appreciate that. The dems are showing their true colors. Benj


The more the libs try to slander and disrespect Sarah Palin the more harm they are doing their cause...

Exactly how are the libs trying to slander and disrespect Sarah Palin? Did you watch her speak and how she disrespected Obama service? Did you miss that line cause I didn't

[Guest]

chels

Only someone as far left as you could say with a straight face that the Associated Press and Newsweek are some sort of fair and balanced source.

OOOacornregisterme... Benj

[Guest]

cologal

That you don't get it kinda makes my point.


OOOpo... Benj

[Guest]

The Associated Press is not conservative. Not even close. Unfortunately, their articles are picked up by most of the countries newspapers, including the Daily Sun. Karl Rove is working for John McCain???

[Guest]

I think Krugman has a point. The only problem is he only points at one side. Both sides have made some pretty despicable and untrue statements. Both sides have slung enough mud to give every Californian a glorious mud bath. NO ONE is innocent in this campaign and that scares me. I'd give almost anything to have the mudslinging stop and let's hear what the candidates have to say about themselves, their agendas, their plans, their cabinets .... Heck, at this point I think I'd be happy hearing about their daily BMs if it meant I didn't have to hear another slam at the other side.

I do understand the concept of voting for the lesser evil -- I've done it. This campaign, however, is not about picking the lesser evil, it is about choosing a president from two men neither of whom deserve the honor.

[Guest]

cologal

Thats twice you have said what someone said here might make you vote for Obama, OH PLEASE like you were ever going to vote McCain/ Palin!!!

And as I said before I will be pleased to be sure to cancel out your guaranteed Obama vote. Guess at least your vote is not going to help Obama. I vote in every election even dog catcher.

have you seen OOOilovepaulkrugman???... Benj


have you seen OOOilovepaulkrugman???... No never heard of its

I take you at your word and I expect you to take me at mine. I am a White Catholic Women of a certain age and I supported Hillary Clinton. I voted for Regan. I am the type of voter McCain wants. I won't vote for Obama and I cannot vote for McCain...he is absolutely awful on women's issues. Its totally laughable that some Repubs think Palin would attract the Clinton votes...cause to coin a phrase Sarah Palin is no Hillary Clinton.

[Guest]

cologal

That you don't get it kinda makes my point.


OOOpo... Benj


Once again you are not watching....when someone in these threads made what I considered to be a sexist remark I totally called her on it. But the MSM and the Obama campaign have NOT attacked Palin...they have called her out on some of her statements....kinda like you might say "She was for the Bridge to Nowhere before she was against it." I will not speak to the liberal blogs they are no better than the conservative ones.

[Guest]

cologal

You say you wont vote for Obama (even tho twice you threaten to) and you cant vote for McCain. Then your thoughts are irrelevant on a political post.

Party trumps person. If you cant vote for either , Vote for party. Party is important because as we have seen, The party in power controls the committees who get the leadership of same therefore the business of the committee. The party in power gets to decide what gets voted on in congress and the senate. Look how well thats worked with Reed and Pelosi. People complain about the deficit, but the house of representatives is the only govt agency that can spend money, thats going well huh?
If you cant find a way to support one party or another, or a candidate or another, close your eyes and take a leap of faith, but be heard. Benj

[Guest]

I agree. Sarah Palin is no Hillary Clinton. Thank goodness. One Hillary is more than enough.

[Guest]

cologal

You say you wont vote for Obama (even tho twice you threaten to) and you cant vote for McCain. Then your thoughts are irrelevant on a political post.

Party trumps person. If you cant vote for either , Vote for party. Party is important because as we have seen, The party in power controls the committees who get the leadership of same therefore the business of the committee. The party in power gets to decide what gets voted on in congress and the senate. Look how well thats worked with Reed and Pelosi. People complain about the deficit, but the house of representatives is the only govt agency that can spend money, thats going well huh?
If you cant find a way to support one party or another, or a candidate or another, close your eyes and take a leap of faith, but be heard. Benj


Really threaten to....Someone suggested that would give me a reason and I responded maybe I would be a reason to cancel you out....and the last one had a smiley with a big grin. No treat intended just having fun.

If I had a party then .....but right now I don't. And it saddens me.

You mention Reid and Pelosi...but when Bush didn't veto one spending bill the Repub's sent up...in fact he didn't veto anything until the Dem's got in. You and we all have to look at what has happened over the past 8 years. Its not a pretty picture.

I may regret this but when I get in the booth my intent is not to vote for President but many years ago as I reached for the lever something happened and I pulled one that I had never pulled before or since. Could happen again....one never knows.

[Guest]

I agree. Sarah Palin is no Hillary Clinton. Thank goodness. One Hillary is more than enough.


Funny but..... ::)

[Guest]

Cologal

There is one thing we agree on Sara Palin is no Hillary Clinton.


You know why???

They ran out of PANT SUITS!!!

Benj

[Guest]

Cologal

There is one thing we agree on Sara Palin is no Hillary Clinton.


You know why???

They ran out of PANT SUITS!!!

Benj


;D

[Guest]

Sally Jo, yes Karl Rove is now formally advising John McCain. "That's Not Change, It's More of the Same!" :yikes:

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/8911.html

[Guest]

colo

Maybe GW didn't veto anything until the dems got in because he liked what the gop sent up.
And please like we dont know where your vote is.

Show of hands, all who think Cologal is voting for Obama,ok all those who think Cologal is voting McCain, ok the Obama hands win. Benj

[Guest]

Benj, your answers don't even make any sense. If Bush liked what the GOP sent up, that makes him even more of a moron. Are you being coached by Sarah Palin? 1rnfl

[Guest]

Well chels is back,

I'm thinking if anyone is a moron it's someone who believes Politico, newsweek and Associated press are the arbiters of truth.

You made it to your second sentence before namecalling, your slipping!!!

OOOihatesarah... Benj

[Guest]

Wow, I must be slipping! You're right! OK, who do you think is unbiased?

Hannerty- Limbaugh - O'Reillly? The Real Three Stooges!

Did you miss me Benj?

Ooooicantstandmccain . . . ;D

[Guest]

Chels

come on get on your game. That was two sentences again.

I did miss you though I love it when you point out to the otherwise fair and reasonable people on totv just how the libs are hateful and arrogent. It gives them another reason to vote republican. The namecalling is turning people against the dems whether you can see it or not.


OOOishouldhavepickedhillary... Benj

[Guest]

I asked for no comments on 9-11, many agreed, except a few.........You couldn't respect the day enough to refrain? Back and forth back and forth. Same rhetoric and bull!!! Such disregard, Shameful in my eyes!!! Go Figure! (modified to protect the innocent!)

[Guest]

rockinronda,

You are a liar. I never turned my computer on on 9/11. I made no posts on 9/11. this is a bald face lie and if you have any moral character you will admit it and apologize to me.
If not that will tell what kind of person you are. Benj

[Guest]

colo

Maybe GW didn't veto anything until the dems got in because he liked what the gop sent up.
And please like we dont know where your vote is.

Show of hands, all who think Cologal is voting for Obama,ok all those who think Cologal is voting McCain, ok the Obama hands win. Benj





And thats why we have the budget deficit we have today.....

I have openly tried to explain my postion...nothing hidden but you show me no respect.

:dontknow: :dontknow: :dontknow:

[Guest]

rockinronda

This is the second lie in just a few days.
One that I posted on 9/11 and the other that McCain said he wanted the war in Iraq to go on for 100 years. Are you a trainee of chels??
if anyone shows disregard and should be shameful it is you.

Do you have enough stomach to apologize???

Benj

[Guest]

ahem, Benj. If I remember correctly you owe me an apology. You said in a post that I said I didn't want the truth. You said you'd get back to me because you had to go out and show houses. I'm waitingggggggggg . . . . . . . . . ;D

[Guest]

Of course I have enough stomach. I was mistaken. I apologize benj, it was others, Not You! ...... I should have looked again. I was wrong. I am sorry. Every one who did post may have not seen the suggestion. Calm down and please accept my apology. I may get my facts wrong and am not perfect. I am just tired of the back and forth fighting and argueing. I am sorry, but I will not post without rechecking what I am about to say first!!! I am wrong and will admit when I am wrong. SORRY!

[Guest]

Chels

You make it so easy.

The next day I posted your exact quoat where you said the truth didnt matter to you for all to see. You can look it up .

so easy.


OOOmaybeishouldwearapantsiut... Benj

[Guest]

Thank you rockinronda,apology accepted. Sorry I got worked up, but I thought your suggestion was brilliant and never even turned my MAC on that day so as not to get caught up in political.

Thanks Benj

[Guest]

Benj, wow talk about spinning! http://www.millan.net/minimations/smileys/dizzyworld.gif (http://www.millan.net)

That was a part of a part of a part of a back and forth communication. We were talking about book banning by Sarah Palin. I never said I didn't care about the truth. I said that in that particular instance I didn't care if it was true or not. She has so many other negatives against her, this is just a drop in the bucket. I wouldn't vote for McCain with or without Palin.

Why aren't you discussing her revealing interview with Charles Gibson? Talk about watching someone squirm! And I'm not talking about Charles Gibson!

[Guest]

Her religious rightiousness scares me. Fundamentalists are so close to CULTS. Like Jehovahs, only worse?? Can't listen to music, chew gum, etc.. Yet she hunts and kills animals? She keeps talking about God wanted this war??? God this, God that....How crazy is this? What happened to seperation of church and state? Religion has caused too many wars. Your thoughts on this?

[Guest]

Polls are done by phone calls to land line phones?! Right? Cell phones predominate for all the young. Guess the polls don't think they are voting? I hear they are. That should make the polls a bit off? Right?

[Guest]

The origins of "Dirty politics" is as elusive as a bag of smoke.
It has been there forever. It gets more focus in this day and age per the 24/7 polarized media magnifiers that have absolutely no homage to truth...only parroting the most recent smear or more importantly being first (whether right or wrong, true or not).

:joke: "dirty" politics.....quoting Pamela Anderson's :joke: views of Palin...a classic media ploy reaching for anything, anybody that promotes their cause...talk about considering the source.....the media as stated previously.....certainly does not. I guess the seedier side of humanity needs to be persuaded too and she won the nod :barf: :barf:

BTK

[Guest]

This all started over an advertisement meant to give the impression that a person who was able to fly jet aircraft in combat is now some relic who just can't keep up with the kids.

If there ever was blatant age discrimination, as well as discrimination against the physically handicapped - THIS IS IT.

I think of persons like Max Cleland, Daniel Inouye, Franklin Roosevelt - all Democrats - and what their opinon of this advertisement would have been.

Every disabled veteran was effectively insulted by this advertisement, for to have two persons - Sen. Obama and Sen. Biden - who have never served in the military and been "inconvenienced" let alone disabled, approve such an insult to those who have does not say much of them as people and men.

[Guest]

Sorry SteveZ, but the spins you're starting to put on things have starting to sound like crap. Would you like to address in a bipartisan way, if possible, the venomous, completely false ads put out by the McCain camp. I know that your postings, at times, at least make the attempt to look at both sides, this posting on this ad does not.

There are brilliant people much more "disabled" than John McCain, even quadriplegics, in many careers, professors etc., that with special equipmentuse the computer.

I'm sorry, there's no way McCain can't use or learn modern technology. He just "doesn't get it."


***And guess what! I bet you that Franklin Roosevelt would have learned to use the computer!

BTK, are you quoting "Pamela Anderson"!!!!!

[Guest]

I asked for no comments on 9-11, many agreed, except a few.........You couldn't respect the day enough to refrain? Back and forth back and forth. Same rhetoric and bull!!! Such disregard, Shameful in my eyes!!! Go Figure! (modified to protect the innocent!)


Unless you had someone's name in here before the modification...I don't think you owed an apology.....however I will warn you...if Bucco sees this you will suffer the wrath! I was called very arrogant and I am sure a few other words...just not in writing... :redface:

Benj's wrath seems a little less and just demanded an apology...which makes me think a name was posted here...anyway...be a ware.....we are being watched....and me be pounced on.....


:cop: :cop: :cop:

;D

[Guest]

McCain has been asked point blank what type of computer he used, he answered that he was computer illiterate. He never stated he was physically unable to use a keyboard, which for many people is merely putting a finger on a key utilizing the "hunt and peck" method of typing.

Now, suddenly, he is physically unable to use a keyboard? Give us all a break!! Perhaps we can get Stephen Hawking to weigh in on how to use a keyboard and give McCain some lessons.

What a crock!

Spare all of us your phony indignation!

And Steve Z., how did Karl Rove et al treat Max Cleland last time he ran for the senate. Where was your indignation then?

[Guest]

Sorry SteveZ, but the spins you're starting to put on things have starting to sound like crap. Would you like to address in a bipartisan way, if possible, the venomous, completely false ads put out by the McCain camp. I know that your postings, at times, at least make the attempt to look at both sides, this posting on this ad does not.

There are brilliant people much more "disabled" than John McCain, even quadriplegics, in many careers, professors etc., that with special equipmentuse the computer.

I'm sorry, there's no way McCain can't use or learn modern technology. He just "doesn't get it."


***And guess what! I bet you that Franklin Roosevelt would have learned to use the computer!

BTK, are you quoting "Pamela Anderson"!!!!!

There are several things I and many others used to be able to do prior to military service that others take for granted as being "easy" and "simple." That does not mean the mind has turned to cabbage, nor does that mean not having the physical dexterity of years ago make me and many others ready for the scrap heap. That also doesn't mean that we should be dismissed because we haven't followed your rules of conduct as to what we should do, learn, adapt to, or better yet disappear to make way for the young, vigorous, dymanic and charismatic.

I would venture to say that you are not a member of the demographic consisting of military veterans with varying levels of disability. You can postulate until the end of time about how such an advertisement is fine and dandy, since you are still defending everything that comes out of the Obama/Biden camp as the Third Testament.

THIS WAS INSULTING and all the excuses why and justifications you can conjure doesn't change that fact. I don't know who edits the Obama/Biden advertisements, but it sure wasn't a disabled veteran. This advertisement reminds me so much of the 1960's and the actions and attitude of the flower children and draft-dodgers whose attempt at self-worth was through denigration of everyone else.

You so offhandedly state "I'm sorry, there's no way McCain can't use or learn modern technology. He just "doesn't get it." Yet you have no idea as to why he doesn't use or why he may not want to be bothered with a prothstetic aid, or if he even has a need. You have no idea as to what he has endured physically for the past 30+ years, yet since he hasn't done what you think you would have done in similar circumstances (pray that you never have to!), he must be inferior. You in your quest to portray Sen. McCain as someone who should be put out on an ice flow don't seem interested as to why - it's just so easy to condemn and slam instead.

There was a time the Democratic Party stood for caring of the individual, especially if there were "special needs" of any kind. If the Obama/Biden believes that "winning" means trashing the physical diabilities of others, especially disabled veteran, or portraying those disabilities in such a manner as to insinuate that Sen. McCain is some kind of dunce one step short of being committed because of physical limitations, then the Party has really gone to the weasels.

Sen. Obama speaks ever so kindly about caring for veterans, and then has the gall to demonstrate such caring by insults for what is still endured by many veterans years after wearing the uniform. Such hypocracy! Such two-faced action make me question all the more whether what is said by the Obama/Biden campaign is being done to "win at any cost" and what will happen afterwards bears no resemblance to what was promised during the campaign.

That Sen. McCain you are ready to write off as a doddering old fool jsut recently sculpted and fought for the best shot at comprehensive immigration reform in the last three decades. There is no body of law more complicated than the U.S. immigration laws (including the tax codes). Add to that the campaign finance reforms, and several other complicated pieces of legislation. Where are the examples of what the super-smart Democratic candidate has authored in his time in Congress - when he has bothered to be there rather than on the campaign circuit?

If the Obama/Biden campaign believes such an advertisement will swing the youth vote by insinuating disabled veterans as inferior, what will they do to all of us older, disabled types after the election?

[Guest]

What a crock!

Spare all of us your phony indignation!

And Steve Z., how did Karl Rove et al treat Max Cleland last time he ran for the senate. Where was your indignation then?

You can call it "phony" all you want. I consider it an insult.

Max Cleland is a hero of mine. Add to that list Fred Franks, Daniel Inouye and a host of others who survived the worst and gave back more than most.

The treatment and attitude towards disabled veterans as anything other than honorable - no matter which political party or is involved - should be, in my book, a concern. Wrong is wrong, no matter who does it, as the end does not justify the means.

If this is all about "my party has to win not matter what and no matter how they do it," then we are all the losers.

[Guest]

A few years ago I saw McCain at a book signing in Denver. Hundreds of people were in line and McCain signed all their books. No doubt, on his book tours he signed thousands of books. So he can use a pen but can't somehow type on a keyboard due to his disability. Get real!

Here's a link to a book signing photo of McCain at a signing. I'm sure those playing the disability card will come up with some more nonsense explaining that somehow you can use a pen but still can't use a keyboard.

http://www.dreamstime.com/john-mccain-book-signing-image4244810

Yes, Max Cleland is a hero. Tell that to Karl Rove and the Bush crowd!

[Guest]

Steve, thank you for sparing me the effort of responding to those who will never understand. I'm sure their getting tired of my long of wind posts anyway. You articulated your response brilliantly. Thank you for your service to our country.

[Guest]

SteveZ, there's nothing in the ad that talks or even eludes to "veterans". That's your interpretation. It's clear from this post that Republicans don't like to get pushed back, they just like to push. Well, I for one, hope Senator Obama does more and more of these ads. :bigthumbsup:

[Guest]

Chelsea, my reference to Anderson was the media being so very hard up and dumb to quote her dislike for Palin....now isn't she a motivating force!
There isn't anything I can think of or imagine that is worth quoting from her....she is the antithesis of anything anybody (except porn related individuals) would be interested in.

Jump shift subjects:

There is no correlation to anything based on whether one wants to know how to use a computer or not. There are many who simply prefer not to partake. It certainly isn't a criteria that helps define one candidate or another.
Just a partisan anecdotal exercise.

Both parties are heavily into slime based, school yard tactic, tit for tat campaigns.
They are all spending time comparing what he or the other guy (or gal) said last and how much "badder" it was than the last one.
All it amounts to is trying to convince the gullible and naive, which out house smells better (or worse). A waste of time and gray matter.

BTK

BTK

[Guest]

SteveZ, there's nothing in the ad that talks or even eludes to "veterans". That's your interpretation. It's clear from this post that Republicans don't like to get pushed back, they just like to push. Well, I for one, hope Senator Obama does more and more of these ads. :bigthumbsup:

Then you miss the point completely.

This isn't a Republican or Democrat issue.

I'm as computer-illiterate as most people I know my age. I can type, and that makes handling email and word processing (although I sure get sick of each year having to figure out "upgraded" programs) reasonable. I don't play games with computers, can't handle ExCel or any of the spreadsheet programs, and the project manager software is too cumbersome to be worth anything to me. However, many of my colleagues ten-thirty years younger whiz through this stuff. Yet, these computer-literate types are the ones who are lost when the batteries die and can't count to 21 without being arrested for indecent exposure.

Does that make me a fossil ready for the tar pit? As long as the brain still works, they always end up coming to me (and others like me) for the answers to problems that with all of their computer-literacy they still can't answer.

So, if the goal of the Obama/Biden campaign is to pander to the youth by saying those of us who are of "the Villages" age are incompetent, then Obama/Biden don't need my vote or my money. This former Democrat now again an Independent has learned a lot of the character of the Democratic ticket by its latest message.

As far as "not saying veteran," that's weasel-wording. The message was clear that the man, Sen. McCain, should have been put to pasture, and we all know the man, his history and his situation and how he got there.

Now, I'm only one vote, but it is mine and I try to spend it on people of character, dignity and principle. The O/B campaign sure isn't showing any of those characteristics. They just show total intolerance and bigotry.

That's my opinion. I really don't care if Obama followers find this as heresy. Please tell your candidate he has really shown his true colors, and may he and Hanoi Jane be very happy with each other.

And one last thing - there used to be a time when being a Democrat meant being able to think for yourself, caring about your fellow man, and trying to emulate a principled life in spite of others. This campaign makes it look like the party philosophy is now "It's what the DNC says that counts, and one shall not question the DNC's position in the slightest."

[Guest]

Stevz

It appears you have somewhat of a different view than before. When you initially mounted your soap box, this ad was a direct attack on a disabled veteran who is physically unable to use a computer, even though he can sign thousands of books without problem, hike the Grand Canyon and has never said he is physically unable to use a computer, or I guess eat with a knife and fork which would also make sense based upon your definition of the physical limitations he doesn't have. You even went so far as to allege that perhaps McCain doesn't use a computer as he might need a prosthetic aid, talk about a stretch. Discrimination against the physically handicapped, (your words) what a bunch of crap!

Now it's all about McCain being old and pandering to the youth? Then you throw in the references to the draft dodgers and flower children and Hanoi Jane. Steveo, your problem is you are stuck in the 60's! That stuff is 40 years ago, get over it! You are the personification of Walter Sobchak from "The Big Lebowski"!

[Guest]

Now just wait a minute. We can't really evaluate the full implications of computer literacy until we get a report of Obama's ability.

Ya see, until one looks at both sides of an issue, how can one possibly grind on about how the deficiency matters.

However before taking on the task of spending the time on the research, please ask yourself.....DOES THIS REALLY MATTER, in the overall? Really?
I would have thought issues of substance would be a priority. And please if you are inclined to respond with this is an indicator of whatever.....save the keystrokes.

Am I ever glad I can do email!!!!!!!! :joke:

BTK

[Guest]

Stevz

It appears you have somewhat of a different view than before. When you initially mounted your soap box, this ad was a direct attack on a disabled veteran who is physically unable to use a computer, even though he can sign thousands of books without problem, hike the Grand Canyon and has never said he is physically unable to use a computer, or I guess eat with a knife and fork which would also make sense based upon your definition of the physical limitations he doesn't have. You even went so far as to allege that perhaps McCain doesn't use a computer as he might need a prosthetic aid, talk about a stretch. Discrimination against the physically handicapped, (your words) what a bunch of crap!

Now it's all about McCain being old and pandering to the youth? Then you throw in the references to the draft dodgers and flower children and Hanoi Jane. Steveo, your problem is you are stuck in the 60's! That stuff is 40 years ago, get over it! You are the personification of Walter Sobchak from "The Big Lebowski"!



If it's "soap-boxing" because I don't follow the O/B campaign like some pied piper is leading the way, and you don't like anyone disagreeing with how your favorite candidate conducts business, that is your problem, not mine.

Many times poeple on this board use the approach of personal attacks on the writer as their rebuttal, and you apparently are not different. That's again is your problem, not mine.

Yes, the ad was anti- disabled veteran and age discriminatory to me. Again, that is my interpretation and if you don't agree with that, you have that right. However, I do not have to agree with you, either (my right) and if that someone could actually see things differently than as a cheerleader for your candidate, again, that is your problem, not mine.

So, continue the personal attacks, snide remarks, and whatever turns you on. I try to give all of teh candidates the benefit of the doubt - even your candidate when the religious junk was being spread because that was unprincipled - but I guess the glass doesn't allow viewing in but one direction.

Yes, I may be "stuck in the '60s," but it is better than being blind in the 00's....

[Guest]

Then you miss the point completely.

This isn't a Republican or Democrat issue.

I'm as computer-illiterate as most people I know my age. I can type, and that makes handling email and word processing (although I sure get sick of each year having to figure out "upgraded" programs) reasonable. I don't play games with computers, can't handle ExCel or any of the spreadsheet programs, and the project manager software is too cumbersome to be worth anything to me. However, many of my colleagues ten-thirty years younger whiz through this stuff. Yet, these computer-literate types are the ones who are lost when the batteries die and can't count to 21 without being arrested for indecent exposure.

Does that make me a fossil ready for the tar pit? As long as the brain still works, they always end up coming to me (and others like me) for the answers to problems that with all of their computer-literacy they still can't answer.

So, if the goal of the Obama/Biden campaign is to pander to the youth by saying those of us who are of "the Villages" age are incompetent, then Obama/Biden don't need my vote or my money. This former Democrat now again an Independent has learned a lot of the character of the Democratic ticket by its latest message.

As far as "not saying veteran," that's weasel-wording. The message was clear that the man, Sen. McCain, should have been put to pasture, and we all know the man, his history and his situation and how he got there.

Now, I'm only one vote, but it is mine and I try to spend it on people of character, dignity and principle. The O/B campaign sure isn't showing any of those characteristics. They just show total intolerance and bigotry.

That's my opinion. I really don't care if Obama followers find this as heresy. Please tell your candidate he has really shown his true colors, and may he and Hanoi Jane be very happy with each other.

And one last thing - there used to be a time when being a Democrat meant being able to think for yourself, caring about your fellow man, and trying to emulate a principled life in spite of others. This campaign makes it look like the party philosophy is now "It's what the DNC says that counts, and one shall not question the DNC's position in the slightest."



That's weasle-wording! HA! Want to debate the lipstick on a pig ad from McCain! Please.

[Guest]

That's weasle-wording! HA! Want to debate the lipstick on a pig ad from McCain! Please.

Where I grew up, two wrongs did not make a right. Have not seen that ad, but if the purpose was discriminatory in any way, then both sides are into slop and have given up on discussing issues, but have turned the campaign into an innuendo war.

We all have our hot-button issues - mine are obvious. My disgust goes towards all four candidates, but not in equal proportion. They are the ones on the ballot, not anyone posting to this board (unless one of you is a candidate posting under a pen-name). So, when these boards get into name-calling and snide remarks made to each other, that does not say much for our abilities as adults to communicate.

BTW - If any political lemming wants to take verbal pot-shots at me for not kissing your favorite candidate's ring (Rep or Dem) - have a ball. It just goes to demonstrate how weak your position is when that's the best you got! Sticks and stones..... I've heard worse from a lot better and much tougher.

[Guest]

SteveZ, my entire career was in advertising and public relations -- as a writer. The essence of this "computer" ad was to show just how out of touch with today's world, McCain is. And, guess what. In my opinion, he is. And yes, it is targeted to the younger voters. So again, to dissect this ad: it's geared to the younger voter, and to show how out of touch with today's world that John McCain is. This ad does the job superbly.

It has NOTHING to do with disabled veterans! NOTHING! And as far as disabled people using computers and keeping up, do you know who Professor Stephen Hawkings was?

http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm63/chelsea24_photos/180px-Stephen_Hawking_050506.jpg

The computer system attached to his wheelchair is operated by Hawking via an infra-red 'blink switch' clipped onto his glasses. By scrunching his right cheek up, he is able to talk, compose speeches and research papers, browse the World Wide Web, and write e-mails. The system also uses radio transmission to provide control over doors in his home and office. His computer was created by an American engineer. He once joked that his computer "had an American accent".

Nice try!

[Guest]

Chelsea! That was brilliant...I was going to bring up Christopher Reeve...he was able to use a computer as well....and there are many others. I don't understand what the big issue is.....I am sorry if the man is not able to use his hands to type....I am sure he has the funds to find a way to use a computer should he want to....

I guess that is the question....does he want to? Should he need to? Probably not....but at least be educated enough to be able to speak about it....to sound like he knows about it...

Similar to his question about condoms...he asked if President Bush thought condoms helped protect people from aides!! WHAT! That makes no sense to me.

I don't think it is an AGE related thing either! I know many seniors (75+) that know all about computers and the topics of today. McCain is not....nothing to do with age!!

The president needs to be aware and educated about the issues of TODAY....not just about war...about EVERYTHING!

Neither McCain or Palin is well enough versed in anything....IMHO!

[Guest]

Neither McCain or Palin is well enough versed in anything....IMHO!
__________________________________________________ _________

Quite an opinion about a long term United States Senator and a Governor....ANYTHING...wow !

[Guest]

SteveZ, my entire career was in advertising and public relations -- as a writer. The essence of this "computer" ad was to show just how out of touch with today's world, McCain is. And, guess what. In my opinion, he is. And yes, it is targeted to the younger voters. So again, to dissect this ad: it's geared to the younger voter, and to show how out of touch with today's world that John McCain is. This ad does the job superbly.

It has NOTHING to do with disabled veterans! NOTHING! And as far as disabled people using computers and keeping up, do you know who Professor Stephen Hawkings was?
...
Nice try!
I am familiar with Dr. Hawking and his work - especially his change of position regarding the "big bang" theory. The sign of a true genius is to recognize when you are wrong (which he did) and go from there.

I'm also familiar with the fact that people will adapt as they believe they have to (not as others think they should) in order to meet their personal goals.

Trying to compare Dr. Hawking's adaptive choices to Sen. McCain or any other person with any type of disability by insinuating Sen. McCain is "behind the times" for not embracing computers as a personal extension of himself is elitist, as it shows an attitude of If you don't do things MY way, then you are inferior to MY kind. if computer literacy is so important, Steve Jobs and Bill Gates would be the Byte Party candidates.

If you think Sen. McCain is not sufficiently "educated" in the subjects you deem important, that is your opinion and you are entitled to it. To me (my opinon) he has well demonstrated being "educated" in these topics which I consider critical - geo-political affairs, immigration reform, campaign reform, life, tolerance towards others, national security, and energy.

Just because you interpret the advertisement as "...NOTHING to do with disabled veterans! NOTHING!" does not change my interpretation or how I feel about it. It is offensive to me. As a voter who is being targeted by advertisements to choose between Sen. Obama versus Sen. McCain (believing that the indoctrinated only view the advertisements as cheerleading!), it accomplished the reverse. As an advertising and public relations specialist, were there ever any product/service advertisements or commercials that you can remember which "blew it," causing potential customers to reject the product or service? This was one of them. It happens. So for the O/B campaign, it is time to mitigate the damage (which may not have affected you, but did me). No mitigation effort shows that the O/B campaign could care less who it offends along the way (trading my vote for one or more "younger" ones).

Sen. Obama's campaign prior to the selection of Sen. Biden as a running mate definitely targeted the youth vote with the insinuation that the over-60 population made this country a mess for his and younger generations, and that the over-60 generations were out-of-touch (whatever that is!). It remains the same since the convention. That's the change he sells. You may agree with that change - I don't.

[Guest]

SteveZ, again, I think you're myopic as far as veterans are concerned. I think you see slams to veterans in many things that have nothing to do with them. And don't come back with "you're putting veterans down" I'm NOT!

Of course, you are entitled to your opinion in this country, as are many radical groups and cults. BTW, was out the other evening and some people I was with are starting to view the RNC as cult-like. Way to far to the right and lock-step.

As far as the economy goes, I'd bet on Steve Jobs or Bill Gates before McCain any day of the week. IMHO. :MOJE_whot:

Again, that ad has nothing to do with veterans or disabled people.

[Guest]

SteveZ, again, I think you're myopic ....
You may be right (excuse me, correct). We all probably are on certain matters. And no matter how many times you try to verbally beat me into submission, I apparently see that advertisement more wholistically than you, and it being a creative marketing error.

I know you don't "put veterans down." No good American does, and I place you that category for having the passion of your convictions, even if they mimic the Obama rhetoric (despite it requiring cult-like acceptance, wanting to initiate leftist policies and making illusory promises akin to Oz and Camelot)[LOL]

And on economic issues I too would take Steve Jobs and Bill Gates over Senators Obama and Biden as well....

[Guest]

You're going in for blogs now Bucco! You slammed me for doing that! Guess it never is a two way street.

It's all the same. He's out of touch and you'll never see that. But, when you vote for McCain, remember to put some cash away for a very rainy day.
__________________________________________________ ___________-----

Fact is:

You posted a video that was edited and used it for your purpose

Wherever I found the CORRECT video that is what is important......

FACT IS YOU ARE POSTING EDITED VIDEOS and then call names of those who oppose you for doing whatever.....YOU are the one posting edited videos.

As to you blog comment, I only wanted you to see the CORRECT VIDEO, not the EDITED ONE YOU POSTED AS FACT !

[Guest]

You're going in for blogs now Bucco! You slammed me for doing that! Guess it never is a two way street.

It's all the same. He's out of touch and you'll never see that. But, when you vote for McCain, remember to put some cash away for a very rainy day.
__________________________________________________ _____________________--

Lets see....
\
CHELSEA posted an edited video and called it factually to make whatever point she wanted to make.

I posted the entire vidoe so you can see the actual FACTS and got the video quickly I admit but from the LA Times which makes no difference at all.....

Fact is...

Mr Cafferty had the same video I just posted and chose to completely edit it and change the meaning and you posted it as fact...and you call other posters shallow !!!!

[Guest]

Fact is CHELSEA..you posted an edited video cut off to make a point..it was not factual...

[Guest]

Fact is CHELSEA...you posted a video that was cut and edited to make a point.

I simply found the ACTUAL FACTUAL video and posted it.

Journalism at its absolute worst cutting a video AT A COMMA not even the end of a sentence !

[Guest]

BTW, was out the other evening and some people I was with are starting to view the RNC as cult-like. Way to far to the right and lock-step.
__________________________________________________ _________________---

Whoa...if we are going to use our friends as validation for any political thought, I have some stories for you that you would not like, but my friends are probably not as smart nor as important as yours, thus will not quote them !

[Guest]

Neither McCain or Palin is well enough versed in anything....IMHO!
__________________________________________________ _________

Quite an opinion about a long term United States Senator and a Governor....ANYTHING...wow !

Your RIGHT Bucco...they are well versed in our Armed Forces...atleast McCain is...however while I RESPECT him for his service MANY years ago...I want the WAR to END now...he does not want to do that...

As for what Palin knows...well she knows that her God has tasked us all to WAR...

again not where I want to be!

I am sure they both know more than this...but I have not heard much other than agreeing with Bush....if that is what they know...and even Palin doesn't really know that much....then I don't want them!

I want change...no more Bush...hence no McCain!! He has agreed with Bush 95% of the time...

I have agreed with Bush 0% of the time! Time for CHANGE!

[Guest]

From Karl Rove on Fox News
McCain has gone, in some of his ads, similarly gone one step too far in sort of attributing to Obama things that are, you know, beyond the 100% truth test.
When Karl Rove has doubts, you must be really low and dirty!
Then, in trying to make lemons out of lemonade, the architect of President Bush's two successful White House runs said the reason McCain doesn't use e-mail is because of his prisoner-of-war injuries. What?

This is a creative excuse not even McCain has offered. Instead, the senator from Arizona has indicated using e-mails or the Internet was something he just hadn't gotten around to.

Here's a large excerpt from a July 18, 2008 story from the Telegraph, a British newspaper:

...In facing Barack Obama, an opponent who is 25 years his junior and has made powerful use of the internet in his campaign, he is battling against claims he is stuck in the past.

The former US Navy pilot, who spent more than five years as a prisoner of war after his jet was shot down over Vietnam, did himself no favours when asked by "The New York Times" which websites he looks at.

"Brooke and Mark show me Drudge, obviously, everybody watches, for better or for worse, Drudge," he said, referring to his aides Brooke Buchanan and Mark Salter, who direct him to the Drudge Report website.

He added: "Sometimes I look at Politico. Sometimes RealPolitics, sometimes," an apparent reference to the website RealClearPolitics.com.

At this point, Miss Buchanan and Mr McCain's wife Cindy interjected that he also read his daughter Meghan's blog.

"Excuse me, Meghan's blog," Mr McCain said, before remarking that he also read blogs by Adam Nagourney and Michael Cooper, the reporters interviewing him.

"And we also look at the blogs from Michael [Cooper] and from you [Mr Nagourney] that may not be in the newspaper, that are just part of your blog."

When asked if he went online himself, the Arizona senator responded: "They go on for me. I am learning to get online myself, and I will have that down fairly soon, getting on myself.

"I don't expect to be a great communicator, I don't expect to set up my own blog, but I am becoming computer literate to the point where I can get the information that I need - including going to my daughter's blog first, before anything else."

After Mr McCain conceded that he did not use a BlackBerry or email, Mr Salter butted in to say: "He uses a BlackBerry, just ours." Mr McCain said: "I use the Blackberry, but I don't e-mail, I've never felt the particular need to e-mail.

"I read e-mails all the time, but the communications that I have with my friends and staff are oral and done with my cell phone. I have the luxury of being in contact with them literally all the time. We now have a phone on the plane that is usable on the plane, so I just never really felt a need to do it.

"But I do - could I just say, really - I understand the impact of blogs on American politics today and political campaigns. I understand that.

"And I understand that something appears on one blog, can ricochet all around and get into the evening news, the front page of The New York Times. So, I do pay attention to the blogs. And I am not in any way unappreciative of the impact that they have on entire campaigns and world opinion."

Mr Obama always carries his BlackBerry with him and is often seen on his campaign plane tapping out emails. The internet has been central to his candidacy, allowing him to establish a network of grassroots activists and attract small donations.
Again, no mention of war injuries making it difficult for McCain to use computer technology.

You people are quoting Karl Rove! Is this limbo? How low can you go?

[Guest]

Wow, I must be slipping! You're right! OK, who do you think is unbiased?

Hannerty- Limbaugh - O'Reillly? The Real Three Stooges!

Did you miss me Benj?

Ooooicantstandmccain . . . ;D
__________________________________________________ __________

Or Randi Rhodes of Air America, that bastian of the left, who said that Sen McCain was very well treated in North Vietnam and that Gov Palin cant be trusted with teen age boys...is this one of your heros as she speaks for the radical left ?

Or could it be the DNC who purposely cuts out the beginning and ending of quotes to give us the 100 year war crap and now how Sen McCain says the economy is in good shape....yeah...

They for sure are the good guys !

[Guest]

Bucco, just in case you're interested in facts, please watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OV37QSDN14&feature=related

And don't bother to come back with "oh that reporter Cafferty is biased.

I've heard that song before.

Thanks, for no thanks, Charleeeeeeeeeeee.

[Guest]

I have known people who use the "Columbus method" to type. Many people type using only their two pointer fingers. Many people use just the pointer finger of their dominant hand. I don't think not being computer literate has anything to do with war injuries. I don't believe McCain labels himself as "disabled" in any way. IMO, you sell him short by laying his lack of computer skills on his war injuries. I think more of him than that.

[Guest]

I have known people who use the "Columbus method" to type. Many people type using only their two pointer fingers. Many people use just the pointer finger of their dominant hand. I don't think not being computer literate has anything to do with war injuries. I don't believe McCain labels himself as "disabled" in any way. IMO, you sell him short by laying his lack of computer skills on his war injuries. I think more of him than that.

Now this is a post I can respect. I don't like McCain, that's clear. But I agree with you CMJ. It appears his own people are selling him short if they think that ad is a slam about being disabled. It's simply NOT!

[Guest]

1. Mr Cafferty IS NOT A REPORTER....never was actually. He is a commentator

2. Below is the FULL statement by Sen McCain...seems Mr Cafferty cut out a few words and sentences as with the 100 year war

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/09/with-tremors-co.html

And just to add a bit more..he did not say the economy was strong...he said the fundamentals were strong and much more which Mr Cafferty chose to cut out !

[Guest]

You're going in for blogs now Bucco! You slammed me for doing that! Guess it never is a two way street.

It's all the same. He's out of touch and you'll never see that. But, when you vote for McCain, remember to put some cash away for a very rainy day.

http://www.millan.net/minimations/smileys/umbrellasmilef.gif (http://www.millan.net)

[Guest]

...But, when you vote for McCain, remember to put some cash away for a very rainy day.


As I add up the price tag for the new/upgraded programs being dangled in front of various special interest groups under the Democratic Party banner, I won't have that opportunity - they'll take the cash away from me long before I ever see it!

[Guest]

Not to be condescending (sweetie is a term I use all the time.)

The Republicans are taking it away from you NOW! We still have 4 more months in the Bush-Leagues, let's not make it 4 more years! :cus:

[Guest]

Not to be condescending (sweetie is a term I use all the time.)

The Republicans are taking it away from you NOW! We still have 4 more months in the Bush-Leagues, let's not make it 4 more years! :cus:

Ma'am (an old-fashioned indicator of respect, age immaterial),

As the promises of O/B campaign are quite similar to those of the 1990 and 1994 campaigns of Bill Clinton, each time brought with it TAX HIKES.

So, "it" will always be taken from me now. The question is, who will take more in the near future?