Janet Tutt states at meeting no has ever been denied insurance in the Villages

[CSwofford147@comcast.net]

At October 21, 2015 Welcome Wednesday meeting District Manger Janet Tutt stated on the record that no one had ever been denied property insurance ie comprehensive sinkhole insurance based on the location of the property. That would mean having home rated using the Sinkhole index of 0 to 800 with 800 most impacted by proximity to sinkhole activity. I received a letter denying me insurance based solely on the location of my home. I would like to know any other Villagers experiences concerning this statement that no one has ever been denied insurance based on the location of there home.

[justjim]

OP, I don't know what Village you live in but I would suggest you contact the neighbors in your Village to see if they also were denied coverage.

[villagetinker]

I know there are insurance agencies that do not offer this coverage. Check with AAA, we used the local office on 441 very close to Spanish Springs. Coverage was no problem, and there was a sinkhole(s) less than 1 block (maybe 300 feet) from our house. So IMHO, it might just be the company you are dealing with.
Hope this helps.

[Topspinmo]

One company I was getting estimate from didn't have sinkhole insurance, went somewhere else that did. IMO She maybe right, just if you can afford the rate or whether it's worth the paper it writing on?? Insurance one of the biggest legalized Racketeering there is. The lobbyists really pay good to get laws passed in there favor.

[graciegirl]

OP I am confused as to what your point is.


Do you want to buy sinkhole insurance? Do you sell sinkhole insurance? Do you have a new idea about sinkhole insurance? I notice that this isn't the first time that you have discussed sinkholes and insurance.

[Bogie Shooter]

At October 21, 2015 Welcome Wednesday meeting District Manger Janet Tutt stated on the record that no one had ever been denied property insurance ie comprehensive sinkhole insurance based on the location of the property. That would mean having home rated using the Sinkhole index of 0 to 800 with 800 most impacted by proximity to sinkhole activity. I received a letter denying me insurance based solely on the location of my home. I would like to know any other Villagers experiences concerning this statement that no one has ever been denied insurance based on the location of there home.

If you doubt her statement, why not give her a call or send her an email?

[golf2140]

If you doubt her statement, why not give her a call or send her an email?

A voice of reason !!!!!!!:bigbow:

[Kazmi]

I would assume that she meant you should be able to find sink hole coverage. Any insurance company can offer or deny whatever coverage they want but you will be able to find an insurance company that offers the coverage that you are looking for.

Good suggestion though - contact her if you need further clarification on her statement.

[bimmertl]

It's an absurd statement on it's face. She couldn't possibly know such a fact considering the number of homes in TV.

If she said "to my knowledge" nobody has been denied insurance great. But if she actually said what the OP stated it's ridiculous.

The OP makes it clear the statement isn't factual based upon personal experience.

[tuccillo]

Sinkhole insurance might be misunderstood by many people. Home owner policies cover catastrophic sinkhole damage (i.e. your house is no longer inhabitable). The optional "other" sinkhole insurance is for sinkhole damage that does not render your house uninhabitable and typically has a high deductible (10% of the home value), although State Farm has a policy where the normal deductible applies. As with all insurance, you make a decision as to whether you can financially handle the relatively rare event of a sinkhole (self insure). With the exception of auto liability insurance and home owners insurance if you have a mortgage, nobody is forcing you to buy insurance.

One company I was getting estimate from didn't have sinkhole insurance, went somewhere else that did. IMO She maybe right, just if you can afford the rate or whether it's worth the paper it writing on?? Insurance one of the biggest legalized Racketeering there is. The lobbyists really pay good to get laws passed in there favor.

[rubicon]

At October 21, 2015 Welcome Wednesday meeting District Manger Janet Tutt stated on the record that no one had ever been denied property insurance ie comprehensive sinkhole insurance based on the location of the property. That would mean having home rated using the Sinkhole index of 0 to 800 with 800 most impacted by proximity to sinkhole activity. I received a letter denying me insurance based solely on the location of my home. I would like to know any other Villagers experiences concerning this statement that no one has ever been denied insurance based on the location of there home.

The OP said Tutt referred to property insurance ie comprehensive sinkhole insurance which appears entirely different from catastrophic sinkhole. So I am not certain of what coverage Tutt was referencing?

The problem arising over sinkhole insurance began in the Tampa area because policyholders were claiming sinkhole damage to get around an exclusion pertaining to cracking, etc that results from the normal settling of homes. And many of those homeowners who did collect never repaired their homes.

These racketeer insurance companies trying to be prudent and responsible spenders of funds had no choice and in an attempt to eliminating both legitimate disputes and specious claims being made by some homeowners had to further define their policies to ensure that sinkhole was a sinkhole because it was a better solution and the coverage was sinkhole and not settling and cracking coverage. Some companies refused to write the coverage, some wrote only catastrophic coverage and some wrote a comprehensive coverage provided you had your property inspected and paid additional premium.

Now if we could get the government to be as aggressive concerning fraud and abuse of government programs perhaps our tax obligation could be lowered

As what Tutt's intentions and message ... it appears she is passing along a message from the Villages Of Lake Sumter Inc that the home lots in TV are very viable and safe. However, my friend is a retired insurance agent who sold all lines of insurance mentioned to me that he could no get any type of sinkhole coverage when he moved from one home to a second here in The Village. I am not certain if he resolved that problem but it is a question on my mind now. I believe I'll e-mail him

[graciegirl]

I am skeptical.

[graciegirl]

OP. Please come back on and further explain your concerns and what you wish would happen.

Is it perhaps this?

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/500-hundred-dollars-times-50-000-homes-25-million-dollars-112673/?highlight=swofford

[twoplanekid]

On our new house in the Villages, I was able to get both kinds of sink hole insurance coverage at a reasonable cost. On the renewal taking place this December, I again quizzed the agent to confirm the coverage as the new policy was dropping the increased replacement cost coverage which I subsequently ask them to add back to the policy. You do have to closely read the policy which is easier said than done.

[CSwofford147@comcast.net]

If people were told who were buying resale's in the villages that they could not insure there homes against all perils would they buy there homes. Why does the villages give people sinkhole insurance on new home sales but not on resale's. Why does the District Manger Janet Tutt talk about golf cart safety and golf cart insurance and never mention CSST which has caused fires here and fires and explosion and deaths, class action law suits all over the country. CSST and Sinkhole insurance our just as important as Golf cart safety and Golf cart insurance. Is it not convenient to talk about these very real issues or it is because Janet Tutt works for the developer and not the Villagers if Janet Tutt has a problrm talking about these impediment to home sales I would be happy to meet her at the next welcome Wednesday meeting if she is really concerned about the Villagers she should have no problem discussing this. I have nothing to hide does she. This subject needs to be talked about and I think Janet Tutt should be the one to talk about.

[CSwofford147@comcast.net]

I replied

[CSwofford147@comcast.net]

There are thousands and thousands of people who have tried to get insurance but received this result but Janet Tutt does not think that this is important. You get insurance if you buy a new home but not a resale after 2011. driving your golf cart is far more important than insuring your home. If Janet Tutt is right and every one in the Villages home is properly insured then have her prove it. If she is concerned about the safety and welfare of the villagers them help them with this problem.

[CSwofford147@comcast.net]

The Villages Fire Marshall said at the Welcome Wednesday 10/22/2015 meeting there is no problems or safety concerns with CSST. Follow the National Association of Fire Protection link and Google CSST and Lighting and class action lawsuits Read the National Fire Protection Association report and link it is more than possible that there are some problems

"Kathleen
FW: This is a concern sent to be discussed by the Sumter County Comissioners Almand"
<K ... <span>
Sent By:Sent By Kathleen Almand On:Jan 01124/15 1 :31 aI/I + Add to



T o:To cswofford 147,-i!,comcast.ncL
•.....•.
Message


Address
Book
7443. Validation of installation methods for CSST gas piping Full Report Fire Protection Research

Validation of installation methods for CSST gas piping (http://www.nfpa.org/research/fire-protection-research-foundation/projects-reports-and-proceedings/hazardous-materials/gases/validation-of-installation-methods-for-csst-gas-piping)


Mr_ Swofford, thank you for your email. Please feel free to share our report with those who you think
may benefit from the information. It can be found on line at this location.
Kathleen H. Almand, P.E.
Vice President, Research, National Fire Protection Association
Executive Director, Fire Protection Research Foundation
617-984-7282
from: Peterson, Eric

[rubicon]

If people were told who were buying resale's in the villages that they could not insure there homes against all perils would they buy there homes. Why does the villages give people sinkhole insurance on new home sales but not on resale's. Why does the District Manger Janet Tutt talk about golf cart safety and golf cart insurance and never mention CSST which has caused fires here and fires and explosion and deaths, class action law suits all over the country. CSST and Sinkhole insurance our just as important as Golf cart safety and Golf cart insurance. Is it not convenient to talk about these very real issues or it is because Janet Tutt works for the developer and not the Villagers if Janet Tutt has a problrm talking about these impediment to home sales I would be happy to meet her at the next welcome Wednesday meeting if she is really concerned about the Villagers she should have no problem discussing this. I have nothing to hide does she. This subject needs to be talked about and I think Janet Tutt should be the one to talk about.

Dear OP: The Villages is a special place for many residents and especially to folks who have worked hard all their lives and now want just a few years of peace and quiet. They fought the hard fights, sacrificed, bit their tongues more often then they wish to admit and now are tired of the fight and just want to relax and play.

And so while I agree with what you say, the proposal you suggest and the proposals the POA have made in the past in connection with anything problematic having to do with The Villages is like chasing a critter down a rabbit hole. The Villages personnel promote and will only tolerate happy talk (political correct). Their marketing technique is to promote a shan-gri-la and anyone doing business with The Villages, including the Daily Sun must fall in line.

[golfing eagles]

Let's see if we can dispel some fear with some facts:

According to USA Today, quoting a Univ. of FL professor who has studied sinkholes his whole career, there have been 3 deaths from sinkholes in the last 40 years. One was the man in Tampa in his bedroom---the body was never recovered. The other two were swallowed up while drilling wells. If we assume no one in TV is going to be drilling a well, that leaves 1 death in 40 years. The average population of FL over the last 40 years is approx. 14 million, so your odds of death by sinkhole is 1 in 560 million per year or 1 in 14 million over a 40 year span. Compare this with the odds of the following causes of death:

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--YMXCw0Xd--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18uzs80jqyy7agif.gif

Now for economic damages and insurance:
According to the FL insurers, there were 24,000 claims totaling 1.4 billion in damages in the 5 years 2006-2010. However, according to the FL state geologic survey, there have been 3500 sinkholes in FL since 1954 = about 60 per year, which would be 300 in 5 years. Anyone think there may be some fraudulent claims??? The average claim was about $56,000.

FL has about 9 million housing units, 3 million are multi-unit dwellings and 6 million are single family homes. If we go high and assume each home is on a 1/2 acre lot, that's 3 million acres of property. FL's area is 45.6 million acres, so 1/15 is property with a single family home on it. So of the 60 sinkholes per year, we can expect 4 to be on such lots. Therefore the odds of a sinkhole on YOUR property is about 4/6 million or 1 in 1.5 million/year. Let's go further and assume 100% of those sinkholes cause sub-catastrophic damage to your home totaling $200,000 (minus 10% deductible). It looks like the insurance costs about $1,500/year, so your odds adjusted ROI is $1.80. If you like these odds, please come to my (illegal) casino I plan on opening. Yet people are clamoring to get this insurance. What I don't understand is why insurers are reluctant to offer it. After all, if they can collect $1,500/year from 6 million individual homes = 9 billion/year they can pay out all the claims including fraudulent claims of 300 million/year and make a fortune! Now, I have found a few internal inconsistencies in my analysis, which I suspect is due to under reporting of sinkholes , especially in unpopulated areas, to the Geologic survey. So make it TEN TIMES as many and your ROI on the insurance of $1,500/year is now $18. I do realize that odds don't matter if you are the unlucky victim, but the same odds do not support the degree of fear that is being posted on ToTV

[looneycat]

At October 21, 2015 Welcome Wednesday meeting District Manger Janet Tutt stated on the record that no one had ever been denied property insurance ie comprehensive sinkhole insurance based on the location of the property. That would mean having home rated using the Sinkhole index of 0 to 800 with 800 most impacted by proximity to sinkhole activity. I received a letter denying me insurance based solely on the location of my home. I would like to know any other Villagers experiences concerning this statement that no one has ever been denied insurance based on the location of there home.

were you denied regular coverage or sinkhole insurance?

[looneycat]

There are thousands and thousands of people who have tried to get insurance but received this result but Janet Tutt does not think that this is important. You get insurance if you buy a new home but not a resale after 2011. driving your golf cart is far more important than insuring your home. If Janet Tutt is right and every one in the Villages home is properly insured then have her prove it. If she is concerned about the safety and welfare of the villagers them help them with this problem.

that is specific sinkhole insurance not catastrophic coverage and acceptance is always based on proximity to reported past sinkholes. this kind of insurance is pretty much denied in all of the villages and the surrounding area. tutt isn't your mommy, handle your own problems instead of dishing blame, because blaming someone else means you're not doing anything to help your situation.

[tuccillo]

The cost is about $150/year, not $1500/year.



Let's see if we can dispel some fear with some facts:

According to USA Today, quoting a Univ. of FL professor who has studied sinkholes his whole career, there have been 3 deaths from sinkholes in the last 40 years. One was the man in Tampa in his bedroom---the body was never recovered. The other two were swallowed up while drilling wells. If we assume no one in TV is going to be drilling a well, that leaves 1 death in 40 years. The average population of FL over the last 40 years is approx. 14 million, so your odds of death by sinkhole is 1 in 560 million per year or 1 in 14 million over a 40 year span. Compare this with the odds of the following causes of death:

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--YMXCw0Xd--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18uzs80jqyy7agif.gif

Now for economic damages and insurance:
According to the FL insurers, there were 24,000 claims totaling 1.4 billion in damages in the 5 years 2006-2010. However, according to the FL state geologic survey, there have been 3500 sinkholes in FL since 1954 = about 60 per year, which would be 300 in 5 years. Anyone think there may be some fraudulent claims??? The average claim was about $56,000.

FL has about 9 million housing units, 3 million are multi-unit dwellings and 6 million are single family homes. If we go high and assume each home is on a 1/2 acre lot, that's 3 million acres of property. FL's area is 45.6 million acres, so 1/15 is property with a single family home on it. So of the 60 sinkholes per year, we can expect 4 to be on such lots. Therefore the odds of a sinkhole on YOUR property is about 4/6 million or 1 in 1.5 million/year. Let's go further and assume 100% of those sinkholes cause sub-catastrophic damage to your home totaling $200,000 (minus 10% deductible). It looks like the insurance costs about $1,500/year, so your odds adjusted ROI is $1.80. If you like these odds, please come to my (illegal) casino I plan on opening. Yet people are clamoring to get this insurance. What I don't understand is why insurers are reluctant to offer it. After all, if they can collect $1,500/year from 6 million individual homes = 9 billion/year they can pay out all the claims including fraudulent claims of 300 million/year and make a fortune! Now, I have found a few internal inconsistencies in my analysis, which I suspect is due to under reporting of sinkholes , especially in unpopulated areas, to the Geologic survey. So make it TEN TIMES as many and your ROI on the insurance of $1,500/year is now $18. I do realize that odds don't matter if you are the unlucky victim, but the same odds do not support the degree of fear that is being posted on ToTV

[golfing eagles]

The cost is about $150/year, not $1500/year.

I have no independent knowledge of the premium. A poster on a different sinkhole thread stated he paid $1560, and his friend who had it for a few years paid $1280. Perhaps the premium varies by location

[tuccillo]

That is what I pay. Sounds like someone is confusing total home owner's policy cost with the optional sinkhole rider.




I have no independent knowledge of the premium. A poster on a different sinkhole thread stated he paid $1560, and his friend who had it for a few years paid $1280. Perhaps the premium varies by location

[golfing eagles]

That is what I pay. Sounds like someone is confusing total home owner's policy cost with the optional sinkhole rider.

Could be likely

[rubicon]

Let's see if we can dispel some fear with some facts:

According to USA Today, quoting a Univ. of FL professor who has studied sinkholes his whole career, there have been 3 deaths from sinkholes in the last 40 years. One was the man in Tampa in his bedroom---the body was never recovered. The other two were swallowed up while drilling wells. If we assume no one in TV is going to be drilling a well, that leaves 1 death in 40 years. The average population of FL over the last 40 years is approx. 14 million, so your odds of death by sinkhole is 1 in 560 million per year or 1 in 14 million over a 40 year span. Compare this with the odds of the following causes of death:

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--YMXCw0Xd--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18uzs80jqyy7agif.gif

Now for economic damages and insurance:
According to the FL insurers, there were 24,000 claims totaling 1.4 billion in damages in the 5 years 2006-2010. However, according to the FL state geologic survey, there have been 3500 sinkholes in FL since 1954 = about 60 per year, which would be 300 in 5 years. Anyone think there may be some fraudulent claims??? The average claim was about $56,000.

FL has about 9 million housing units, 3 million are multi-unit dwellings and 6 million are single family homes. If we go high and assume each home is on a 1/2 acre lot, that's 3 million acres of property. FL's area is 45.6 million acres, so 1/15 is property with a single family home on it. So of the 60 sinkholes per year, we can expect 4 to be on such lots. Therefore the odds of a sinkhole on YOUR property is about 4/6 million or 1 in 1.5 million/year. Let's go further and assume 100% of those sinkholes cause sub-catastrophic damage to your home totaling $200,000 (minus 10% deductible). It looks like the insurance costs about $1,500/year, so your odds adjusted ROI is $1.80. If you like these odds, please come to my (illegal) casino I plan on opening. Yet people are clamoring to get this insurance. What I don't understand is why insurers are reluctant to offer it. After all, if they can collect $1,500/year from 6 million individual homes = 9 billion/year they can pay out all the claims including fraudulent claims of 300 million/year and make a fortune! Now, I have found a few internal inconsistencies in my analysis, which I suspect is due to under reporting of sinkholes , especially in unpopulated areas, to the Geologic survey. So make it TEN TIMES as many and your ROI on the insurance of $1,500/year is now $18. I do realize that odds don't matter if you are the unlucky victim, but the same odds do not support the degree of fear that is being posted on ToTV

golfing eagles I made mention of this in post #11. You follow up with some statistics that point to why the insurance companies got aggressive concerning this coverage and I can't blame them. The OP is doing battle with TV and he should understand that TV is protective of product. what I am not certain of is if his concern involves only his property or if he is selling sinkhole product, perhaps other property coverages and he and Janet Tutt had a difference of opinion??????????????????

[tuccillo]

The rider is inexpensive but it does have a 10% deductible (10% of the house value). Catastrophic sinkhole damage (your home is condemned) is, of course, covered by your home owner's policy with whatever deductible you have chosen. The sinkhole rider covers sinkhole remediation where your home is still inhabitable.


Could be likely

[golfing eagles]

golfing eagles I made mention of this in post #11. You follow up with some statistics that point to why the insurance companies got aggressive concerning this coverage and I can't blame them. The OP is doing battle with TV and he should understand that TV is protective of product. what I am not certain of is if his concern involves only his property or if he is selling sinkhole product, perhaps other property coverages and he and Janet Tutt had a difference of opinion??????????????????

Beats me. Did he try only one insurer, get denied, and is now touting how wrong Janet Tutt was? Is he planning to sell sinkhole insurance? Maybe he will be kind enough to clarify just what his point is.

[Mleeja]

It seems to me the OP's anger is misplaced.. The Villages or Janet Tutt does not sell insurance or set policy on coverage. His issue is with the insurance companies.

[Bogie Shooter]

If people were told who were buying resale's in the villages that they could not insure there homes against all perils would they buy there homes. Why does the villages give people sinkhole insurance on new home sales but not on resale's. Why does the District Manger Janet Tutt talk about golf cart safety and golf cart insurance and never mention CSST which has caused fires here and fires and explosion and deaths, class action law suits all over the country. CSST and Sinkhole insurance our just as important as Golf cart safety and Golf cart insurance. Is it not convenient to talk about these very real issues or it is because Janet Tutt works for the developer and not the Villagers if Janet Tutt has a problrm talking about these impediment to home sales I would be happy to meet her at the next welcome Wednesday meeting if she is really concerned about the Villagers she should have no problem discussing this. I have nothing to hide does she. This subject needs to be talked about and I think Janet Tutt should be the one to talk about.
So, go talk to her!

[Bogie Shooter]

There are thousands and thousands of people who have tried to get insurance but received this result but Janet Tutt does not think that this is important. You get insurance if you buy a new home but not a resale after 2011. driving your golf cart is far more important than insuring your home. If Janet Tutt is right and every one in the Villages home is properly insured then have her prove it. If she is concerned about the safety and welfare of the villagers them help them with this problem.

Why are you slamming Janet Tutt?

[perrjojo]

I would think buying a resale would be contingent on getting financing...getting financing is contingent on getting insurance. Yes, you may pay a higher premium but that is not the fault of the developer.it is just a fact of life. No one in our neighborhood has been denied insurance on a resale. I think there is a lot of misinformation on this thread. Almost anyone can get insurance on anything, anywhere, but the premiums reflect the risk....higher risk..higher premiums.

[KEVIN & JOSIE]

Just can't get sinkhole insurance.

[rubicon]

It seems to me the OP's anger is misplaced.. The Villages or Janet Tutt does not sell insurance or set policy on coverage. His issue is with the insurance companies.

The OP is bothered and is taking issue with Janet Tutt's claim that sinkhole insurance is available . What we really don't know is if his objection is personally or proprietary based?

[tuccillo]

Since apparently only the OP was present to hear Janet T's comments, we don't really know exactly what she said. Perhaps she was referring to the fact that all new homes are able to get the optional non-catastrophic sink hole insurance or perhaps she was referring to all home can get home owner's insurance (that does, by default, cover catastrophic sink hole damage). It is well known that resales probably won't be able to get optional non-catastrophic sink hole coverage. I suspect she did not say that all homes, new and resales, can get the optional non-catastrophic sink hole coverage. Regardless, it is what it is.

The OP is bothered and is taking issue with Janet Tutt's claim that sinkhole insurance is available . What we really don't know is if his objection is personally or proprietary based?

[asianthree]

I do not understand why a new house can get sinkhole insurance and yet the next owner can't on the same house. Just like the warranty on the heating and cooling system does not transfer.

[outlaw]

The best deal for insurance in Florida is earthquake insurance. It's only $50. Unfortunately, the sinkhole insurance fraud is what eventually caused sinkhole coverage to evaporate. It is similar to what happened with hurricane insurance in Florida. Not too many years ago, deductibles for hurricane wind damage was the same as your overall deductible for any claim. Then many, many people started waiting to replace their very old and leaking roofs until AFTER a hurricane came through. Lo and behold! My roof was damaged by the hurricane! After a few fraudulent seasons of hurricane claims, the insurance companies changed the hurricane caused damage deductible to 3 or 5% of your coverage amount. That really changed the hurricane claims for new roofs.