Harambe's Death.

[Taltarzac725]

Jane Goodall Responds to Harambe's Death: 'It Looked as Though the Gorilla Was Putting an Arm Around the Child' | People (http://pets.people.com/pets/2016/05/31/article/jane-goodall-responds-harambe-gorillas-death)

There does not seem to be easy answers in this tragedy. A very quick decision was needed and it is hard to determine if it was the right one in all the confusion about what the gorilla was going to do. Who really knows?

[HimandMe]

You are right no one. We are learning more and more now about animals and so much of our past learning is turning out to be partial. Yet, if a gorilla monkey saw her baby in a questionable situation with a grown man, she might have responded by using deathly force too. It's nature and reactions are swift. I place no blame but still felt so sorry for the animal who unknown to us might have done nothing harmful to the child. We don't know.
I just finished watching a video of a polar bear who came upon a dog team and actually played with the dogs. It was known some polar bears do this so the team driver stayed three days and caught it all on video to show people. The bear kept returning to play! We just don't know about animals but they are more than we currently think.

[manaboutown]

Ever see a cat play with a mouse before it kills it?

Because the parents were insufficiently attentive the child had time to climb over the fence and jump into the enclosure. The ape had the child for about ten minutes. At one point the ape had thrown the kid ten feet up in the air according to one witness.

We do need to help the apparently endangered gorilla population by stopping the poaching!

[njbchbum]

Does anyone who values the life of an animal over the life of a human being deserve to be a babysitter much less a parent?

Let he/she who has lost sight of their child for a second be the first to cast blame on this Mother or call her inattentive!

[Nucky]

Does anyone who values the life of an animal over the life of a human being deserve to be a babysitter much less a parent?

Let he/she who has lost sight of their child for a second be the first to cast blame on this Mother or call her inattentive!

Very wise njbchbum. Can you imagine if the animal killed the child. This is a no win second guess situation. A magnificent animal wasted like that is sad. It would be more sad if it was a child. The parents were at the zoo with the child, do you think they feel bad enough already without the media and others passing judgement on them? I'm going to guess it was an accident and they didn't tell the child to slip thru fall and play with the beast. So sorry for that family.

[KayakerNC]

Corwin says the lesson is for parents to treat zoos with the respect they deserve.

“Zoos aren’t your babysitter,” he said. “Take a break from the cell phone, the selfie stick and the texting. Connect with your children. Be responsible for your children. I don’t think this happened in seconds or minutes. I think this took time for this kid, this little boy to find himself in that situation. Ultimately it’s the gorilla that’s paid this price.”

Animal expert Jeff Corwin: 'zoos aren't your baby sitter' | FOX25 (http://www.myfoxboston.com/news/animal-expert-jeff-corwin-zoos-arent-your-baby-sitter/312006114)

[graciegirl]

I completely agree with every post so far, which leads me to believe that the adult homo sapiens that largely populate The Villages are wise and good and kind too.

[goodtimesintv]

Please watch this interview with Jack Hanna.

Other news channel video interviews have been clipped and do not include all the information contained in this one with Greta VanSusteren.

Jack Hanna: I agree with zoo's decision to take out gorilla | On Air Videos | Fox News (http://video.foxnews.com/v/4921442159001/jack-hanna-i-agree-with-zoos-decision-to-take-out-gorilla/?#sp=show-clips)

[CFrance]

Does anyone who values the life of an animal over the life of a human being deserve to be a babysitter much less a parent?

Let he/she who has lost sight of their child for a second be the first to cast blame on this Mother or call her inattentive!
I agree with you. The blame should be placed squarely on the zoo, as it was on the Pittsburgh zoo when a mother lost hold of her child, who fell into an exhibit of wild dogs and was killed. No exhibit of dangerous animals should have any ways to be penetrated by anyone of any size.

I also agree with a journalist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, that these endangered animals should be in preserves, not zoos. JMO

[Taltarzac725]

I agree with you. The blame should be placed squarely on the zoo, as it was on the Pittsburgh zoo when a mother lost hold of her child, who fell into an exhibit of wild dogs and was killed. No exhibit of dangerous animals should have any ways to be penetrated by anyone of any size.

I also agree with a journalist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, that these endangered animals should be in preserves, not zoos. JMO

Parents settle lawsuit against Pittsburgh zoo after mauling - NY Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/parents-settle-lawsuit-pittsburgh-zoo-mauling-article-1.1814515)

I forgot about that case.

I would have to see a lot more information about safety practices at the Cincinnati zoo's gorilla enclosure before finding the zoo negligent.

As to endangered animals and their habitats that seems to depend a lot on what habitat and what animals are involved. Many animals that are no longer with us were killed off because of man or from radical changes in their habitats. A new habitat might be needed for some endangered animals. And with some animals, a zoo is a lot safer than a place were men and women are hunting these animals sometimes to extinction.

[goodtimesintv]

I agree with you. The blame should be placed squarely on the zoo, as it was on the Pittsburgh zoo when a mother lost hold of her child, who fell into an exhibit of wild dogs and was killed. No exhibit of dangerous animals should have any ways to be penetrated by anyone of any size.

I also agree with a journalist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, that these endangered animals should be in preserves, not zoos. JMO

Please see the video I posted above. Jack Hanna addresses many facets of the blame game going on, as well as how the Columbus and Cincinnati zoos (and the 220+ zoos in the U.S.) produce millions of dollars for the preservation of these gorillas and other endangered species in the wild.

He also discusses how they build, monitor and check the zoo enclosures so they'll be as safe as possible while still allowing viewing.

There are many grey areas in this whole national controversy.

[manaboutown]

The child did not just slip and fall through a hole in the fence. He had been badgering his parents to "go swimming with the gorillas". He climbed over the fence and jumped. Having been repeatedly forewarned of his likely intention, they should have been watching him closely. Duh!

To me the irony is that the mother is employed as a day care worker. I, for one, am relieved she does not work where my grandchildren go.

[CFrance]

Everybody knows what size a toddler is and what they can slip through. Let any parent who has NEVER lost track/control of his or her child stand up and yell--be honest. I still say shame on the zoo.

[manaboutown]

Everybody knows what size a toddler is and what they can slip through. Let any parent who has NEVER lost track/control of his or her child stand up and yell--be honest. I still say shame on the zoo.

Over the years millions of toddlers had safely visited that gorilla compound with their parents. The enclosure had to be idiot proof since none of the millions of children visitors in the past had ever "slipped through". BTW, this kid did not "slip through" - he scaled the fence and jumped into the gorilla pit.

The parents' behavior could merit a Darwin Award.

The zoo could hold the parents liable for the costs the zoo incurred due to their parental negligence.

[CFrance]

Over the years millions of toddlers had safely visited that gorilla compound with their parents. The enclosure had to be idiot proof since none of the millions of children visitors in the past had ever "slipped through". BTW, this kid did not "slip through" - he scaled the fence and jumped into the gorilla pit.

The parents' behavior could merit a Darwin Award.

The zoo could hold the parents liable for the costs the zoo incurred due to their parental negligence.
And why would a fence be scaleable by a toddler?

[Bonnevie]

Parents settle lawsuit against Pittsburgh zoo after mauling - NY Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/parents-settle-lawsuit-pittsburgh-zoo-mauling-article-1.1814515)

I forgot about that case.

I would have to see a lot more information about safety practices at the Cincinnati zoo's gorilla enclosure before finding the zoo negligent.

As to endangered animals and their habitats that seems to depend a lot on what habitat and what animals are involved. Many animals that are no longer with us were killed off because of man or from radical changes in their habitats. A new habitat might be needed for some endangered animals. And with some animals, a zoo is a lot safer than a place were men and women are hunting these animals sometimes to extinction.

in that case as per the article, the mother stood the child up on the top of the rail so he could see better and he pulled away from her grasp and fell in. But the zoo settled. Who stands a 2 year old child on top of a railing??? the railing is there for a reason. just as the fence is there for a reason. the zoos assume reasonable people who take responsibility will be there--
of course the gorilla had to be put down but it's just a shame.

[CFrance]

in that case as per the article, the mother stood the child up on the top of the rail so he could see better and he pulled away from her grasp and fell in. But the zoo settled. Who stands a 2 year old child on top of a railing??? the railing is there for a reason. just as the fence is there for a reason. the zoos assume reasonable people who take responsibility will be there--
of course the gorilla had to be put down but it's just a shame.
And who puts a railing between people and killer animals that is low enough to even stand someone on? I can think of a number of other things that could happen to put someone over that railing, not just a mother holding a child too high.

[Nucky]

It was an accident, not an on purpose. The person who decided to have the outcome where the child survived is to be applauded. Not an easy thing to do.

[graciegirl]

I hate what happened. I have read so many stories about the great apes, always loved anything about Jane Goodall and as I have said before, I think that our animal companions become more important to our lives as we age and we have the time and patience to interact with them more.

However, if we must choose between the safety of a human child and a much loved Gorilla, our instinct and common sense tells us there is no choice.

Someone said that for 38 years no terrible thing like this has happened at the Cincinnati Zoo. There are those against such displays and they have their views. I am glad that I have been able to see many animals up close as a child and adult that otherwise I would have missed.

I have no problem with people loving their animals like children, in fact it is a beautiful quality and good for lonely people everywhere, but they aren't human children when the choice must be made.

When I looked into Harambe's face and read the title that he had been shot, I was very sad. Some people must always look to cast blame. Some things, awful things, are bound to happen. Who wouldn't have chosen this rather than waiting for a tranquilizer dart and it's unpredictable outcome if it were your beloved grandchild? Husband? wife? Mother?

[manaboutown]

I have just read that the father has a criminal past including drug trafficking for which he was imprisoned in 2006. The parents need to be investigated. They could possibly be found both criminally and civilly liable.

[Bonnevie]

And who puts a railing between people and killer animals that is low enough to even stand someone on? I can think of a number of other things that could happen to put someone over that railing, not just a mother holding a child too high.

the mother had to lift the child up to place him on top of the 4ft railing. so a two year old child is now standing on top of a 4ft railing...but it's like anything...things are built thinking they will provide adequate protection because millions of people have come to the zoo without problems, but then the person who lacks common sense changes that and so now the bar has to be raised. google the picture of the railing and imagine putting your 2 year old on top of it....

[KayakerNC]

I have just read that the father has a criminal past including drug trafficking for which he was imprisoned in 2006. The parents need to be investigated. They could possibly be found both criminally and civilly liable.
"Racism has found its way into the Cincinnati Zoo saga"
KING: Racism has found its way into the Cincinnati Zoo saga - NY Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/king-racism-found-cincinnati-zoo-saga-article-1.2655860)

[manaboutown]

From what I have read the father's criminal history includes burglary, firearms offenses, drug trafficking, criminal trespass, disorderly conduct and kidnaping. He obviously is not a model citizen!

[CFrance]

the mother had to lift the child up to place him on top of the 4ft railing. so a two year old child is now standing on top of a 4ft railing...but it's like anything...things are built thinking they will provide adequate protection because millions of people have come to the zoo without problems, but then the person who lacks common sense changes that and so now the bar has to be raised. google the picture of the railing and imagine putting your 2 year old on top of it....
Like I said, it doesn't have to just be a mother being stupid of losing control of a child. A four-foot railing (Pgh zoo) could be easily circumvented by a bunch of tumbling middle schoolers or teenagers. It just doesn't make sense to have something that hazardous breachable by any method, whether by accident, stupidity, or on purpose. Stuff happens.

[CFrance]

From what I have read the father's criminal history includes burglary, firearms offenses, drug trafficking, criminal trespass, disorderly conduct and kidnaping. He obviously is not a model citizen!
What the heck does that have to do with it?

[Taltarzac725]

From what I have read the father's criminal history includes burglary, firearms offenses, drug trafficking, criminal trespass, disorderly conduct and kidnaping. He obviously is not a model citizen!

That seems irrelevant to the issue.

[manaboutown]

That seems irrelevant to the issue.

It relates to parental character or lack thereof, how the child is being raised, supervised (or not), the role model the father is providing and so on. After repeatedly badgering his parents to "swim with the gorillas" the child was sufficiently unattended to do what he did with a terrible result for all involved.

[manaboutown]

"Racism has found its way into the Cincinnati Zoo saga"
KING: Racism has found its way into the Cincinnati Zoo saga - NY Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/king-racism-found-cincinnati-zoo-saga-article-1.2655860)

The only evidence of racism I noted was that before it was known the child was black the BLM hate group and others were accusing the zoo of "white privilege" for shooting a black gorilla to save a white child. Some of their groundless vicious tweets are posted in this. Liberals Scream Racism for Gorilla Being Shot Over "White Kid", Then This Picture Surfaces... (http://www.youngcons.com/liberals-claim-shooting-of-gorilla-to-save-boy-about-white-privilege-turns-out-parents-and-child-are-black/)

[Nucky]

What the heck does that have to do with it?

Bingo. Good people here with different points of view. I tend to side with not considering the dads past. He had his family at a zoo not the neighborhood bar. It was an accident with the child. What would be said if the animal killed the child? What they did once the accident happened was the only way to proceed.