Duke Energy Golf Cart Path

[dewilson58]

It was pretty easy to find out the facts.

The no trespassing signs mean no trespassing on the property, period. NOT.......stay off the grass and stay on the path.

Anyone can call customer service and find out the facts. There was an internal Duke Energy email for the customer service personnel in case people started calling into customer service.

My call was answered within one minute, the lady knew what I was talking about and clarified the postings on the property.



Per the internal email, there have been discussions to transfer the ownership a portion of the property (more or less the path) in order to transfer the liability........but the receiving parties have not been willing.

[Allegiance]

You should have offered to be the receiving party. ;)


There goes fight club rules.

[outlaw]

It was pretty easy to find out the facts.

The no trespassing signs mean no trespassing on the property, period. NOT.......stay off the grass and stay on the path.

Anyone can call customer service and find out the facts. There was an internal Duke Energy email for the customer service personnel in case people started calling into customer service.

My call was answered within one minute, the lady knew what I was talking about and clarified the postings on the property.



Per the internal email, there have been discussions to transfer the ownership a portion of the property (more or less the path) in order to transfer the liability........but the receiving parties have not been willing.

That's pretty generous of Duke. Good PR!

[Steve9930]

What is the point here?

[Nucky]

It was pretty easy to find out the facts.

The no trespassing signs mean no trespassing on the property, period. NOT.......stay off the grass and stay on the path.

Anyone can call customer service and find out the facts. There was an internal Duke Energy email for the customer service personnel in case people started calling into customer service.

My call was answered within one minute, the lady knew what I was talking about and clarified the postings on the property.



Per the internal email, there have been discussions to transfer the ownership a portion of the property (more or less the path) in order to transfer the liability........but the receiving parties have not been willing.

With all due respect, and I do respect you dewilson58. If I owned property that was being used as a cut through for years and decided to not allow this practice anymore I would post signs, put a article in the newspaper and most of all take down the 12 MPH speed limit signs next to the no trespassing signs. Before your conversation with Duke it would be perfectly obvious that the signs were placed to make you think to not go over the fence into the retention pond (fenced in) or the electrical grid behind the bushes (fenced in). There was a invasion of Golf Carts when I took a spin over there to check this out. They could block this off in about an hour with several barriers. I will respect their wishes. Thanks for the investigation. :grumpy:

[Allegiance]

With all due respect, and I do respect you dewilson58. If I owned property that was being used as a cut through for years and decided to not allow this practice anymore I would post signs, put a article in the newspaper and most of all take down the 12 MPH speed limit signs next to the no trespassing signs. Before your conversation with Duke it would be perfectly obvious that the signs were placed to make you think to not go over the fence into the retention pond (fenced in) or the electrical grid behind the bushes (fenced in). There was a invasion of Golf Carts when I took a spin over there to check this out. They could block this off in about an hour with several barriers. I will respect their wishes. Thanks for the investigation. :grumpy:
Maybe they mean negative 12 miles per hour.

[Topspinmo]

What is the point here?

The point is? Clarification. Thank you "duke" for letting golf carts pass through property. Now one DA will probably screw it up for the rest of us. Not me will probably never go that way in golf cart.

[dewilson58]

With all due respect, and I do respect you dewilson58. If I owned property that was being used as a cut through for years and decided to not allow this practice anymore I would post signs, put a article in the newspaper and most of all take down the 12 MPH speed limit signs next to the no trespassing signs. Before your conversation with Duke it would be perfectly obvious that the signs were placed to make you think to not go over the fence into the retention pond (fenced in) or the electrical grid behind the bushes (fenced in). There was a invasion of Golf Carts when I took a spin over there to check this out. They could block this off in about an hour with several barriers. I will respect their wishes. Thanks for the investigation. :grumpy:


:thumbup:

The Duke Lady did say, they might be having some "town meetings" to meet with people to discuss and explain. Time will tell.

:highfive:

[Barefoot]

Thanks to dewilson for contacting Duke for clarification.

[Nucky]

I will put them on cross examination tomorrow as I have to call Duke on another issue. Feel like Clark Kent, your mild mannered reporter.

[TheVillageChicken]

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4640/388/320/Chicken%20licken.jpg

[rubicon]

Interesting the various interpretations for a NO TRESPASSING SIGN. I thought the American thinking was no meant no . How naive of me

and the beat goes on....................................

[dewilson58]

I did suggest to the Duke Lady............maybe you should have put at least one sign in the middle of the cart path, with red flashing lights, with a couple American Flags.

She did :1rotfl:

[Fred R]

OK, so what is the penalty for using the path????

[JoelJohnson]

So Duke went the cheap route of putting up a sign or two ...hummm?

[Rickg]

No trespassing means no trespassing. I think Duke energy has protected themselves somewhat. Will they prosecute those who violate, that's yet to be seen

[Harry Gilbert]

OK, so what is the penalty for using the path????


Appears to be a first class misdemeanor unless your in possession of a weapon then it would be a felony

Florida state statue

Statutes & Constitution
:View Statutes
:

Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0800-0899/0810/Sections/0810.09.html)

[Steve9930]

If people keep bringing this up this path is going to be closed permanently. Leave this alone and everything will be fine. Keep bringing this up and some one is going to ruin it. I have no idea why people keep flogging this horse. There is no need to clarify anything. At this point in time everyone is just turning a blind eye but keep sticking the nest and it will be closed. Stop calling Duke Energy !!!! Go play some golf.....That's what you came here to do in the first place.

[dewilson58]

If people keep bringing this up this path is going to be closed permanently. Leave this alone and everything will be fine. Keep bringing this up and some one is going to ruin it. I have no idea why people keep flogging this horse. There is no need to clarify anything. At this point in time everyone is just turning a blind eye but keep sticking the nest and it will be closed. Stop calling Duke Energy !!!! Go play some golf.....That's what you came here to do in the first place.

:1rotfl:

[Rapscallion St Croix]

If people keep bringing this up this path is going to be closed permanently. Leave this alone and everything will be fine. Keep bringing this up and some one is going to ruin it. I have no idea why people keep flogging this horse. There is no need to clarify anything. At this point in time everyone is just turning a blind eye but keep sticking the nest and it will be closed. Stop calling Duke Energy !!!! Go play some golf.....That's what you came here to do in the first place.

Said one with skin in the game to those without.

[Steve9930]

Said one with skin in the game to those without.

I'm already looking at alternatives as I don't believe people know when not to kick the sleeping dog. I like being able to get to Lowes, Aldi's, Cracker Barrel, and the Doctors offices via Golf Cart. This almost came to a head with Duke about 2 years ago but the dog went back to sleep. When they did all the improvements although a definite improvement, I was afraid it might wake the Dog. Now it appears people are shaking the Duke tree again. Duke will be put into a corner and will have no choice but to act. This would be a big negative blow not only to Stonecrest and Spruce Creek but all the people in the Historic part of the Villages that work or shop at Walmart. Never good to wake the dog.....

[Nucky]

So I took care of my Billing issue with the nice lady at Duke Energy and then asked about the no trespassing issue. She had not heard about it nor received any memo. The beat goes on. I'm not poking the nest. This is part of our routine and we want to do the rite thing. Go to the path and reference my previous post and tell me it has no merit. They don't want you in the power grid or the retention pond or on the path at over 12 MPH. They are not restricting use of the path or they could block it instantly.

[dewilson58]

So I took care of my Billing issue with the nice lady at Duke Energy and then asked about the no trespassing issue. She had not heard about it nor received any memo. The beat goes on. I'm not poking the nest. This is part of our routine and we want to do the rite thing. Go to the path and reference my previous post and tell me it has no merit. They don't want you in the power grid or the retention pond or on the path at over 12 MPH. They are not restricting use of the path or they could block it instantly.

Thank you Clark. ;-)

If you or anyone else is interested in talking to people with the internal memo, here is the information:

Thank you for contacting Duke Energy Florida.

We apologize; we feel your concern regarding the Golf Cart Path access in The Villages would be best handled over the telephone.

Please contact Builder Services from 7:00 am to 6:00 pm Monday through Friday toll free at 866-372-4663 for immediate assistance. .

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.

Best Regards,
Anita G.
Customer Care Specialist
Duke Energy Florida

:ho:

[Steve9930]

So I took care of my Billing issue with the nice lady at Duke Energy and then asked about the no trespassing issue. She had not heard about it nor received any memo. The beat goes on. I'm not poking the nest. This is part of our routine and we want to do the rite thing. Go to the path and reference my previous post and tell me it has no merit. They don't want you in the power grid or the retention pond or on the path at over 12 MPH. They are not restricting use of the path or they could block it instantly.

Since I have not been back since late June I don't know if there are any new signs but there are two 7 foot chain link fences. One around the substation and the other around the Walmart storm pond. I think the fences are self explanatory. Also why would anyone want to enter a high voltage substation area unless you have a death wish. This whole controversy started a few years ago when someone damaged their cart on the path and attempted to get Duke to pay the damages. Soon after a fence was constructed to obstruct the path. After a lot of deliberation between parties trying to get a resolution were done. The end result was no one was going to take the on the liability. So the whole ordeal quietly faded into the wood work and that is where it should stay. Every time some one brings this up with Duke there is a risk the legal department dogs will wake and there is a good chance this time the fence will stay. Out of sight out of mind. I know you are curious about the the right way of handling this and that can be celebrated in these days but when it comes to this path please do not wake legal dogs.

[WhoDat]

I think the next step is a tolll booth. About $.25 per trip should help them cover any future liability costs.

[Nucky]

I think the next step is a tolll booth. About $.25 per trip should help them cover any future liability costs.

Ah Ha! Entrepreneurial thinking. I just called the number and no one knew anything about it. It's over for me & Mrs Nucky. Boo-Hoo! :(

[villagetinker]

According to the Marion County GIS system it appears that this is Duke property, and Walmart owns the property on 3 sides of the Duke substation. The path appears to be entirely on the Duke land.

Sorry I cannot paste in a copy of the plots.

[rubicon]

If people keep bringing this up this path is going to be closed permanently. Leave this alone and everything will be fine. Keep bringing this up and some one is going to ruin it. I have no idea why people keep flogging this horse. There is no need to clarify anything. At this point in time everyone is just turning a blind eye but keep sticking the nest and it will be closed. Stop calling Duke Energy !!!! Go play some golf.....That's what you came here to do in the first place.

Steve in all due respect I think when it comes to Duke Energy the cat's out o the bag

[dewilson58]

What a small world...............I had a cat, its name was Duke and it had tons of energy.

What are the odds??

[rubicon]

Since I have not been back since late June I don't know if there are any new signs but there are two 7 foot chain link fences. One around the substation and the other around the Walmart storm pond. I think the fences are self explanatory. Also why would anyone want to enter a high voltage substation area unless you have a death wish. This whole controversy started a few years ago when someone damaged their cart on the path and attempted to get Duke to pay the damages. Soon after a fence was constructed to obstruct the path. After a lot of deliberation between parties trying to get a resolution were done. The end result was no one was going to take the on the liability. So the whole ordeal quietly faded into the wood work and that is where it should stay. Every time some one brings this up with Duke there is a risk the legal department dogs will wake and there is a good chance this time the fence will stay. Out of sight out of mind. I know you are curious about the the right way of handling this and that can be celebrated in these days but when it comes to this path please do not wake legal dogs.

In law those facilities are referred to as " an attractive nuisance". I would refer to the guys who drank too much and when they returned to our insureds motel chided one to saw off the lock on the grate on a below ground electric generator and descended to the electric unit where he was immediately electrocuted.

and the beat goes on............

[TVMayor]

What a small world...............I had a cat, its name was Duke and it had tons of energy.

What are the odds??
I remember your cat. He was a pussy. He let other cats trespass in his territory.

[Steve9930]

Steve in all due respect I think when it comes to Duke Energy the cat's out o the bag

What I know about the subject neither Walmart or Duke wants the liability. The Stonecrest POA in the beginning got the two sides together and then backed away to let them hash it out. There used to be updates on the negotiations from our POA. What happened to open this can of worms again? It went cold for a long time. Then there was a group that did a lot of volunteer work to improve the path. Did this bring this to forefront again? They moved the improvements as close to the Walmart fence as possible. The reason I thought was that Duke did not want people that close to the substation. If the Duke legal department believes some how they legally now have the liability by defacto they will close that path. I would have expected an internal memo that indicated anyone discussing this made it perfectly clear that people that used the path were trespassing. I've been involved with things like this in the past and as long as no one says something wrong, people just turn a blind eye. Once they believe it legally becomes a problem then Duke will have no recourse but to act on it. This is why I indicated do not talk to Duke and ask questions about the path because if some one gives out the wrong info its over. If I were Duke I would put a sign that indicates this is Duke Property and the path can be used at your own risk. Does not totally exonerate them from liability but gives them an argument should some one take them to court over the an incident. Guess I'll just have to see what's up when I get back down South. Not happy with any of this. Is there a new No Trespassing Sign put up by Duke that indicates no trespassing violators will be prosecuted? If so then you use that path and would be subject to arrest if they also informed the local law enforcement they want it up held. Closing this path has no positives associated with it.

[Allegiance]

Said one with skin in the game to those without.
Those with skin in the game should be silent to protect their own interests, those that have no interest need to ask yourselves, with all the things to do in the villages why do I read and comment on something for which I have no interest/skin?

I get it, first rule of Fight Club, right? - YouTube (https://youtu.be/l6R-t8n3Erg)

[ColdNoMore]

I'm already looking at alternatives as I don't believe people know when not to kick the sleeping dog. I like being able to get to Lowes, Aldi's, Cracker Barrel, and the Doctors offices via Golf Cart. This almost came to a head with Duke about 2 years ago but the dog went back to sleep. When they did all the improvements although a definite improvement, I was afraid it might wake the Dog. Now it appears people are shaking the Duke tree again. Duke will be put into a corner and will have no choice but to act. This would be a big negative blow not only to Stonecrest and Spruce Creek but all the people in the Historic part of the Villages that work or shop at Walmart. Never good to wake the dog.....

That's exactly what I said in the other thread about the trail a week ago, when someone mentioned calling Duke Energy about it. :thumbup:

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/1274123-post121.html


I would advise against that.

The only thing 'they' can tell you (if 'they' are smart)...is that the signs speak for themselves.

I think the smarter course of action would be for those who use it, to continue to do so, keep quiet and wait until such time (if it happens) until access is physically blocked...or folks start getting tickets.

Sleeping dogs and all that.

That's my $.02 on it.

[circletrack]

Thank you Clark. ;-)

If you or anyone else is interested in talking to people with the internal memo, here is the information:

Thank you for contacting Duke Energy Florida.

We apologize; we feel your concern regarding the Golf Cart Path access in The Villages would be best handled over the telephone.

Please contact Builder Services from 7:00 am to 6:00 pm Monday through Friday toll free at 866-372-4663 for immediate assistance. .

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.

Best Regards,
Anita G.
Customer Care Specialist
Duke Energy Florida

:ho:

Seems like they want to avoid a written statement floating around.

[dewilson58]

Seems like they want to avoid a written statement floating around.



Yep. Corporate America. We will have to let it play out. They don't want carts on their property, but they have to figure out how to accomplish that objective.

[Steve9930]

That's exactly what I said in the other thread about the trail a week ago, when someone mentioned calling Duke Energy about it. :thumbup:

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/1274123-post121.html

Looks like they did not listen well........

[Barefoot]

If the Duke legal department believes some how they legally now have the liability by defacto they will close that path. Once they believe it legally becomes a problem then Duke will have no recourse but to act on it. This is why I indicated do not talk to Duke.
Good advice, but it seems people will continue to poke the sleeping giant.

[Allegiance]

Good advice, but it seems people will continue to poke the sleeping giant.
Stupid is as stupid does, Mrs. Blue... - YouTube (https://youtu.be/cJe6-afGz0Q)

[rubicon]

What I know about the subject neither Walmart or Duke wants the liability. The Stonecrest POA in the beginning got the two sides together and then backed away to let them hash it out. There used to be updates on the negotiations from our POA. What happened to open this can of worms again? It went cold for a long time. Then there was a group that did a lot of volunteer work to improve the path. Did this bring this to forefront again? They moved the improvements as close to the Walmart fence as possible. The reason I thought was that Duke did not want people that close to the substation. If the Duke legal department believes some how they legally now have the liability by defacto they will close that path. I would have expected an internal memo that indicated anyone discussing this made it perfectly clear that people that used the path were trespassing. I've been involved with things like this in the past and as long as no one says something wrong, people just turn a blind eye. Once they believe it legally becomes a problem then Duke will have no recourse but to act on it. This is why I indicated do not talk to Duke and ask questions about the path because if some one gives out the wrong info its over. If I were Duke I would put a sign that indicates this is Duke Property and the path can be used at your own risk. Does not totally exonerate them from liability but gives them an argument should some one take them to court over the an incident. Guess I'll just have to see what's up when I get back down South. Not happy with any of this. Is there a new No Trespassing Sign put up by Duke that indicates no trespassing violators will be prosecuted? If so then you use that path and would be subject to arrest if they also informed the local law enforcement they want it up held. Closing this path has no positives associated with it.

Steve Duke is exposed no matter what scenario you paint because an attorney, any attorney will go after Duke energy no matter what and draw them into a lawsuit. why because they are a big target (lots of $$$$$ to be had). Duke has some defense if they put up a fence but if they remain neutral or quiet on the subject a plaintiff attorney will argue that they have no claim of trespassing etc because they were lax in expressing their policies of protection against this attractive nuisance called a substation. Can't one envision the plaintiff attorney's argument now....Ladies and gentlemen of the jury this monolith of greed owning an instrument of death had the arrogance..... Bear in mind the requirements are greater burden in the case of attractive nuisance because well its an attraction

So from Duke's point of view this is both a public relations nightmare and a potential liability issue they need to effectively manage. If I was on their Board the decision would be an easy one and the implementation post haste. I wish I could say it ain't so but thems the facts

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

No trespassing means no trespassing. I think Duke energy has protected themselves somewhat. Will they prosecute those who violate, that's yet to be seen

I doubt that anyone will be prosecuted. My thought is that Duke is simply protecting themselves against lawsuits resulting from someone being injured on their property while not creating a public relations nightmare for themselves.
Golf carts are still using the path every day. I'm sure that they are aware of this and have not taken measures to stop the traffic. Otherwise, they would have put up b arriers in order to prevent people from using the path.

[graciegirl]

Steve Duke is exposed no matter what scenario you paint because an attorney, any attorney will go after Duke energy no matter what and draw them into a lawsuit. why because they are a big target (lots of $$$$$ to be had). Duke has some defense if they put up a fence but if they remain neutral or quiet on the subject a plaintiff attorney will argue that they have no claim of trespassing etc because they were lax in expressing their policies of protection against this attractive nuisance called a substation. Can't one envision the plaintiff attorney's argument now....Ladies and gentlemen of the jury this monolith of greed owning an instrument of death had the arrogance..... Bear in mind the requirements are greater burden in the case of attractive nuisance because well its an attraction

So from Duke's point of view this is both a public relations nightmare and a potential liability issue they need to effectively manage. If I was on their Board the decision would be an easy one and the implementation post haste. I wish I could say it ain't so but thems the facts

And well presented too.

I have learned so many things from your posts over time and I think it was you who used the term "red herring" and if I remember it right, I looked it up and it was about diverting the issue to another, or trumping up a portion of an argument.

Many have said that it is a huge issue that many cannot drive cars and closing that path would severely limit their ability to work and get to the doctor. I have great sympathy for that argument, but again refer to Billethekids constant argument that the needs of the majority are usually addressed for many good reasons. I wonder just how many would truly and honestly fit into the category of not being able to get to work or to the doctor if they explored all options. Moving? Learning to drive? Having two cars? Using a cab? Asking a friend or their church for help? Carefully managing their money?

I think it is convenient for many. There is the golf cart bridge that can take them to other doctors, other grocery stores. Of course I am talking about residents of The Villages as I type.

I think I will stop there. Haven't yet had my coffee.

I read many posts on this forum and continue to learn from the wisdom of others.

[Nucky]

Good advice, but it seems people will continue to poke the sleeping giant.

Stupid is as stupid does, Mrs. Blue... - YouTube (https://youtu.be/cJe6-afGz0Q)

So I suppose the smart thing would be to use the path until someone gets charged with trespassing. Not the way I choose to operate. The Sleeping Giant's message is not Crystally Clear and neither are the posters on this thread. We are off the path for now awaiting further developments. Stupid would be not trying to find the answer to something that I have a question about.

[Steve9930]

Steve Duke is exposed no matter what scenario you paint because an attorney, any attorney will go after Duke energy no matter what and draw them into a lawsuit. why because they are a big target (lots of $$$$$ to be had). Duke has some defense if they put up a fence but if they remain neutral or quiet on the subject a plaintiff attorney will argue that they have no claim of trespassing etc because they were lax in expressing their policies of protection against this attractive nuisance called a substation. Can't one envision the plaintiff attorney's argument now....Ladies and gentlemen of the jury this monolith of greed owning an instrument of death had the arrogance..... Bear in mind the requirements are greater burden in the case of attractive nuisance because well its an attraction

So from Duke's point of view this is both a public relations nightmare and a potential liability issue they need to effectively manage. If I was on their Board the decision would be an easy one and the implementation post haste. I wish I could say it ain't so but thems the facts

Yes, I totally understand legally what would happen if they were drawn into a lawsuit. Deep pockets are always a target. I worked on their end. But here is what makes me scream. Everything was great with crossing there. Not one problem. Now it was not the greatest route but it was a route. A few years ago someone started this because they had some damage to their cart and thought Duke should pay. That woke the beast. Now here you are trespassing, you damage your cart while you are trespassing, and believe its the owners fault and should pay for your damages, Really? I thought this was settled and faded back into the wood work. I'd like to know who and why they woke the beast up? If the path is closed it will definitely be an inconvenience to a lot of people. Yep, I understand their dilemma very well. Just lucky Mr. Brown is not a corporation or there would be no path at all.

[Allegiance]

So I suppose the smart thing would be to use the path until someone gets charged with trespassing. Not the way I choose to operate. The Sleeping Giant's message is not Crystally Clear and neither are the posters on this thread. We are off the path for now awaiting further developments. Stupid would be not trying to find the answer to something that I have a question about.
You are certainly a "Law and Order" type person and I commend you.

[rubicon]

Yes, I totally understand legally what would happen if they were drawn into a lawsuit. Deep pockets are always a target. I worked on their end. But here is what makes me scream. Everything was great with crossing there. Not one problem. Now it was not the greatest route but it was a route. A few years ago someone started this because they had some damage to their cart and thought Duke should pay. That woke the beast. Now here you are trespassing, you damage your cart while you are trespassing, and believe its the owners fault and should pay for your damages, Really? I thought this was settled and faded back into the wood work. I'd like to know who and why they woke the beast up? If the path is closed it will definitely be an inconvenience to a lot of people. Yep, I understand their dilemma very well. Just lucky Mr. Brown is not a corporation or there would be no path at all.

Steve: In a matter of speaking and offered with due respect "out of the mouth of babe's . The damaged cart claim is new information to me and information I believed was lurking in the background. I strongly suspected someone, somehow, made Duke Energy nervous.

I do have empathy for those residents both from Stonecrest and TV caught up in this fiasco but I also understand business and Duke would be wise to protect themselves

[Steve9930]

Steve: In a matter of speaking and offered with due respect "out of the mouth of babe's . The damaged cart claim is new information to me and information I believed was lurking in the background. I strongly suspected someone, somehow, made Duke Energy nervous.

I do have empathy for those residents both from Stonecrest and TV caught up in this fiasco but I also understand business and Duke would be wise to protect themselves

The cart claim a few years back is what started this saga. That is why the fence went up the first time. I suspect that this path will eventually close. There are some people in Stonecrest who cannot drive for various reasons. These are the people who will be inconvenienced the most. Luckily they will still have access to Walmart. You can do just about anything around the house with access to Walmart. I on the other hand was looking for an excuse to buy one of the new Elios Automobiles. Now I may have one.

[Rollie]

I also heard about the cart owner wanting a settlement from Duke.

When the path was being improved I asked one of the workers if they had permission to make the improvements, and he stated he did.

Rollie

[Bogie Shooter]

If they had permission to improve the path, why now the sign. Something is missing.

[dewilson58]

I also heard about the cart owner wanting a settlement from Duke.

When the path was being improved I asked one of the workers if they had permission to make the improvements, and he stated he did.

Rollie

The Duke Energy memo which was read to me, stated the improvements were unauthorized. FWIW

[rubicon]

The cart claim a few years back is what started this saga. That is why the fence went up the first time. I suspect that this path will eventually close. There are some people in Stonecrest who cannot drive for various reasons. These are the people who will be inconvenienced the most. Luckily they will still have access to Walmart. You can do just about anything around the house with access to Walmart. I on the other hand was looking for an excuse to buy one of the new Elios Automobiles. Now I may have one.

Steve: IMHO if for health reasons a person's driver's license was revoked, taken away by a family member, etc it would seem to me that the cause for such action would also apply to a golf cart , especially a golf cart that could travel the streets.

Some may recall wherein a guy from Oxford took to running his golf cart on the multi-modal paths because his license was revoked due to sight issues. He ran down a pedestrian on the multi-modal path. there have been other accidents here attributed to health-related issues. I was at Aldi's this AM and noticed the constant cart traffic exiting the cart path behind the store. So apparently cart drivers in that area are not hampered?

The Viilages was specifically built for cart access accommodations. Each of us chose with an understanding of life's trade offs. I take no satisfaction in saying that or of people's potential remorse, especially at this late stage in our lives. It is simply stated as a fact. In that same vein people can choose again. It is not uncommon for residents here to buy more than once in The Villages.

I wish you the best.

Personal Best Regards:

[Steve9930]

The Duke Energy memo which was read to me, stated the improvements were unauthorized. FWIW

So its the improvements that gave Duke Heart burn? What is written on the new signs exactly?

[Villageswimmer]

The Duke Energy memo which was read to me, stated the improvements were unauthorized. FWIW

Sounds like the "permission" didn't come from Duke.

[Steve9930]

Steve: IMHO if for health reasons a person's driver's license was revoked, taken away by a family member, etc it would seem to me that the cause for such action would also apply to a golf cart , especially a golf cart that could travel the streets.

Some may recall wherein a guy from Oxford took to running his golf cart on the multi-modal paths because his license was revoked due to sight issues. He ran down a pedestrian on the multi-modal path. there have been other accidents here attributed to health-related issues. I was at Aldi's this AM and noticed the constant cart traffic exiting the cart path behind the store. So apparently cart drivers in that area are not hampered?

The Viilages was specifically built for cart access accommodations. Each of us chose with an understanding of life's trade offs. I take no satisfaction in saying that or of people's potential remorse, especially at this late stage in our lives. It is simply stated as a fact. In that same vein people can choose again. It is not uncommon for residents here to buy more than once in The Villages.

I wish you the best.

Personal Best Regards:

I'm having a problem following your point?

[Rollie]

Any new updates?

[Rapscallion St Croix]

Steve: IMHO if for health reasons a person's driver's license was revoked, taken away by a family member, etc it would seem to me that the cause for such action would also apply to a golf cart , especially a golf cart that could travel the streets.

Some may recall wherein a guy from Oxford took to running his golf cart on the multi-modal paths because his license was revoked due to sight issues. He ran down a pedestrian on the multi-modal path. there have been other accidents here attributed to health-related issues. I was at Aldi's this AM and noticed the constant cart traffic exiting the cart path behind the store. So apparently cart drivers in that area are not hampered?

The Viilages was specifically built for cart access accommodations. Each of us chose with an understanding of life's trade offs. I take no satisfaction in saying that or of people's potential remorse, especially at this late stage in our lives. It is simply stated as a fact. In that same vein people can choose again. It is not uncommon for residents here to buy more than once in The Villages.

I wish you the best.

Personal Best Regards:

Although one does not need a DL to drive a golf cart, one whose license has been revoked is not allowed to drive anything with a motor/engine.

[Riccckkk]

Are many people still using this path?

[dewilson58]

Yes. Shhhhhhhh

[ColdNoMore]

Although one does not need a DL to drive a golf cart, one whose license has been revoked is not allowed to drive anything with a motor/engine.

Do you have some type of proof/link/statute saying that?

[John_W]

Originally Posted by Rapscallion St Croix
Although one does not need a DL to drive a golf cart, one whose license has been revoked is not allowed to drive anything with a motor/engine.

Do you have some type of proof/link/statute saying that?

I can't help with the statue, but if you're a regular reader of the Sun like I am. At least once a month a golf cart driver, usually in the SS area, is arrested for driving a golf cart on a suspended or revoked driver's license. Usually they are in their 30's or 40's and are living with their parent or parents.

[ColdNoMore]

I can't help with the statue, but if you're a regular reader of the Sun like I am. At least once a month a golf cart driver, usually in the SS area, is arrested for driving a golf cart on a suspended or revoked driver's license. Usually they are in their 30's or 40's and are living with their parent or parents.

I can see it if it is a cart path on the side of a road or even in a neighborhood while driving down the street, but the statement read (or at least I took it to mean) that it would apply even on the MMP's.

That was my primary question.

[John_W]

I can see it if it is a cart path on the side of a road or even in a neighborhood while driving down the street, but the statement read (or at least I took it to mean) that it would apply even on the MMP's.

That was my primary question.

The word in TV is, on MMP the police will and can ticket for DUI but not speeding. They will even give out a DUI for sitting in your cart at the square with the engine off but drinking a beer. That doesn't answer your question, but to get to and from the MMP in the historic district wouldn't the driver have to navigate on the city streets for a some distance. So going to and from from path he would be under police jurisdiction regarding suspended license laws.

[dewilson58]

Although one does not need a DL to drive a golf cart, one whose license has been revoked is not allowed to drive anything with a motor/engine.

Wow............not even my riding lawn mower in my yard??? Quite a reaching statement......I say BS.

[Harry Gilbert]

Florida revoked license statue

Statutes & Constitution
:View Statutes
:

Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0300-0399/0322/Sections/0322.34.html)

Florida definition of a motor vehicle

Statutes & Constitution
:View Statutes
:

Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0320/Sections/0320.01.html)

Taken from florida legislature definitions

(77) STREET OR HIGHWAY.—

(b) The entire width between the boundary lines of any privately owned way or place used for vehicular travel by the owner and those having express or implied permission from the owner, but not by other persons, or any limited access road owned or controlled by a special district, whenever, by written agreement entered into under s. 316.006(2)(b) or (3)(b), a county or municipality exercises traffic control jurisdiction over said way or place;


(26) GOLF CART.—A motor vehicle designed and manufactured for operation on a golf course for sporting or recreational purposes.

[kstew43]

Are many people still using this path?

when we made the long trip to Walmart from Fernandina last week......there were so many carts going to and from.

Everyone just past each other on the makeshift dirt road that doesn't add up to more than 2 football fields..IMHO in length, manuvering around some holes and making there way.

[Rollie]

Are people still using this path? Anyone been arrested?

[Allegiance]

Using it as usual. An additional 12mph sign was added exactly half way through that path.

[chuckinca]

I believe the 12 MPH sign(s) have been installed by the roadway builders - not Duke.

(with all the pot holes and ruts it would be hard to go any faster)(but it is still a major improvement over what was there before the roadway builders did their thing)

.

[Nucky]

The signs were never meant to discourage golf carts. The sign on the left is telling you to not go behind the fence into the 50 billion jiggawatt electrical contraption and the sign on the right is so if you get tempted to climb the fence to walk in the retention basin that you would not do it because both would be considered trespassing. The 12 MPH signs are yellow and bright and shiney and are there to advise everyone to not speed. A whole lot of nothing for nothing. There are several bags hung from telephone poles for trash so we may be good neighbors. Oh I almost forgot about the young fellow who cut me off, beat me back to the entrance gate to Country Club Hills and forgot his pass card and wanted to use mine....not a chance. He did use the one of a person behind us by trying to race several inches from the back of her cart....he almost made it...thankfully he didn't hit the nice lady but I'm sure he did $1000 worth of damage to his cart and mangled the gate. It clearly says one cart at a time. Boy was he heated. Free entertainment.

[rustyp]

The signs were never meant to discourage golf carts. The sign on the left is telling you to not go behind the fence into the 50 billion jiggawatt electrical contraption and the sign on the right is so if you get tempted to climb the fence to walk in the retention basin that you would not do it because both would be considered trespassing. The 12 MPH signs are yellow and bright and shiney and are there to advise everyone to not speed. A whole lot of nothing for nothing. There are several bags hung from telephone poles for trash so we may be good neighbors. Oh I almost forgot about the young fellow who cut me off, beat me back to the entrance gate to Country Club Hills and forgot his pass card and wanted to use mine....not a chance. He did use the one of a person behind us by trying to race several inches from the back of her cart....he almost made it...thankfully he didn't hit the nice lady but I'm sure he did $1000 worth of damage to his cart and mangled the gate. It clearly says one cart at a time. Boy was he heated. Free entertainment.

FYI - one needs the pass card to exit from The Villages. If someone asks you to let them in coming from Lowes path they knew they had forgot their card before exiting.

[rubicon]

I can see it if it is a cart path on the side of a road or even in a neighborhood while driving down the street, but the statement read (or at least I took it to mean) that it would apply even on the MMP's.

That was my primary question.

The cart paths on roads are called diamond lanes. And if you drive enough of them you will determine that some car drivers can't resist but breach the white solid lines that divide the cart lane from the right car lane. This is especially true along Rio Grande, Delmar, etc.

A man killed in a traffic accident while driving a golf cart on Morse made a left turn from the diamond lane and was in a collision with a vehicle. This guy had a heart attack. I do not recall that the papers every reported if he died because of the accident or the heart attack.

The guy who had severe sight problems and was from Oxford was traveling on a multi-modal path and hit a pedestrian. As a result of this accident I contacted Community Watch and discussed the suggestion that The Village ought to issue village ID tags at the same time they issued ID cards . They told me back then that it was being discussed. Apparently someone felt it unnecessary or its still in discussion. I still believe it is a sound idea and one that is not that expensive and has many enforcement and identification benefits.

Clearly if a person has a medical condition such that driving a vehicle creates an increased hazard, the same as such causes as speed and the greatest in mind cause for accident " driver inattention" In fact health may be a greater cause for concern.

I had the unfortunate task of taking the car keys away from my mother when she developed Alzheimer's and what lessen the guilt for me is the thought that I was saving lives and /or suffering from injuries

Posters here obsess over carts that exceed 19mph even a mile mph or so but never give mention to the issue of a driver's mental and health situation which is of greater concern especially given The Village demographics .

So again I question the position of some who claim that one of the reasons they moved to TV is because if they pull their driver's license they can still travel in their cart. Perhaps? but then perhaps not? and along those lines remember the arguments given for seat belts

All of this brings us back to the liability created by carts trespassing on Duke energy's private property

[Nucky]

FYI - one needs the pass card to exit from The Villages. If someone asks you to let them in coming from Lowes path they knew they had forgot their card before exiting.

I'm aware of this but I think you have to take each situation and measure the person making the request, I did and they didn't get access. I showed up once to exit thru that gate and realized I forgot my card. Did I just exit and hope for the best on the return trip....no I went back home and got my card..lesson learned. One cart one card, no exception unless I know them or am married to her.

[rustyp]

I'm aware of this but I think you have to take each situation and measure the person making the request, I did and they didn't get access. I showed up once to exit thru that gate and realized I forgot my card. Did I just exit and hope for the best on the return trip....no I went back home and got my card..lesson learned. One cart one card, no exception unless I know them or am married to her.

Exactly - how were you going to get out without the card?

[JoMar]

The cart paths on roads are called diamond lanes. And if you drive enough of them you will determine that some car drivers can't resist but breach the white solid lines that divide the cart lane from the right car lane. This is especially true along Rio Grande, Delmar, etc.

A man killed in a traffic accident while driving a golf cart on Morse made a left turn from the diamond lane and was in a collision with a vehicle. This guy had a heart attack. I do not recall that the papers every reported if he died because of the accident or the heart attack.

The guy who had severe sight problems and was from Oxford was traveling on a multi-modal path and hit a pedestrian. As a result of this accident I contacted Community Watch and discussed the suggestion that The Village ought to issue village ID tags at the same time they issued ID cards . They told me back then that it was being discussed. Apparently someone felt it unnecessary or its still in discussion. I still believe it is a sound idea and one that is not that expensive and has many enforcement and identification benefits.

Clearly if a person has a medical condition such that driving a vehicle creates an increased hazard, the same as such causes as speed and the greatest in mind cause for accident " driver inattention" In fact health may be a greater cause for concern.

I had the unfortunate task of taking the car keys away from my mother when she developed Alzheimer's and what lessen the guilt for me is the thought that I was saving lives and /or suffering from injuries

Posters here obsess over carts that exceed 19mph even a mile mph or so but never give mention to the issue of a driver's mental and health situation which is of greater concern especially given The Village demographics .

So again I question the position of some who claim that one of the reasons they moved to TV is because if they pull their driver's license they can still travel in their cart. Perhaps? but then perhaps not? and along those lines remember the arguments given for seat belts

All of this brings us back to the liability created by carts trespassing on Duke energy's private property

:agree:

[dewilson58]

Enjoy it while you can.

Be safe, be careful.

It's private property.

:popcorn:

[circletrack]

I'm aware of this but I think you have to take each situation and measure the person making the request, I did and they didn't get access. I showed up once to exit thru that gate and realized I forgot my card. Did I just exit and hope for the best on the return trip....no I went back home and got my card..lesson learned. One cart one card, no exception unless I know them or am married to her.

I think they were supporting your decision.

[Nucky]

Exactly - how were you going to get out without the card?

Since I was on the inside and don't look threatening anymore I considered momentarily asking for a favor from the next Villager, the next one who came thru didn't look like a likely candidate. I went home and did it the correct way.

[daddys55]

Why not leave well enough alone, keep pushing the envelope and you are going to screw it up for all

[graciegirl]

When is a Property Owner Liable for a Trespasser's Injuries? - AllLaw.com (http://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/personal-injury/when-property-owner-liable-trespassers-injuries.html#)

[Rollie]

Just back from a summer in Wisconsin. Drove the path yesterday with no problems.

Rollie

[crash]

JoMar love your quote.

[graciegirl]

The golf cart accident and death on 441/27 is very sad and troubling.

[Barefoot]

Enjoy it while you can. Be safe, be careful.
It's private property.
Well said.

[chuckinca]

The golf cart accident and death on 441/27 is very sad and troubling.

Yes it is but not related to this topic.

.

[leftyf]

I just came acroos the path and Duke Energy has placed handouts at each end of the path. It says that Duke Energy will no longer accept liability for this path. They are willing to transfer ownership of this property to another party. If no party takes it, Duke will be forced to close it. The letter is a lot longer than this, I just reduced it because I don't like to type that much. If you want a copy, hop on your cart and drive over. To make matters worse, some idiot has put 4 empty gas cans where the litter bag is.

[graciegirl]

Yes it is but not related to this topic.

.

Didn't someone from Stonecrest say that with a street legal cart they can cross over 441/27 and that it is legal to do it at certain points? I think it is still dangerous and that is what people might do when this path closes.

[graciegirl]

I just came acroos the path and Duke Energy has placed handouts at each end of the path. It says that Duke Energy will no longer accept liability for this path. They are willing to transfer ownership of this property to another party. If no party takes it, Duke will be forced to close it. The letter is a lot longer than this, I just reduced it because I don't like to type that much. If you want a copy, hop on your cart and drive over. To make matters worse, some idiot has put 4 empty gas cans where the litter bag is.

Bump

[dewilson58]

I just came acroos the path and Duke Energy has placed handouts at each end of the path. It says that Duke Energy will no longer accept liability for this path. They are willing to transfer ownership of this property to another party. If no party takes it, Duke will be forced to close it. The letter is a lot longer than this, I just reduced it because I don't like to type that much. If you want a copy, hop on your cart and drive over. To make matters worse, some idiot has put 4 empty gas cans where the litter bag is.

That's what I heard from Duke directly.....Willing to transfer, prior talks have fallen apart and if no transfer, will have to close.

[Allegiance]

They probably got scared by all our resident lawyers.

Hello Morse family, help!!!!

[Allegiance]

Didn't someone from Stonecrest say that with a street legal cart they can cross over 441/27 and that it is legal to do it at certain points? I think it is still dangerous and that is what people might do when this path closes.
That is not an option, that one crossover is a non Village enclosed community.

[rubicon]

If duke deems this pathway to be a nuisance and liability magnet why would anyone want to own it? No thank you

[Steve9930]

Didn't someone from Stonecrest say that with a street legal cart they can cross over 441/27 and that it is legal to do it at certain points? I think it is still dangerous and that is what people might do when this path closes.

You can cross 27/441 with a street legal Cart (LSV). However I don't think there is a way to get past the point to enter further down stream.

[Steve9930]

I just came acroos the path and Duke Energy has placed handouts at each end of the path. It says that Duke Energy will no longer accept liability for this path. They are willing to transfer ownership of this property to another party. If no party takes it, Duke will be forced to close it. The letter is a lot longer than this, I just reduced it because I don't like to type that much. If you want a copy, hop on your cart and drive over. To make matters worse, some idiot has put 4 empty gas cans where the litter bag is.

Just got back South so I went to check out the path. Got the hand out and noticed Duke will even transfer the property to another owner for free. That shows you just how unwilling they are to take on the responsibility. My prediction is the path will be closed starting January of next year.

[outlaw]

When are we going to be able to drive our golf carts to Orlando? I need to go to Costco.

[NoMoSno]

Maybe if the path had never been improved, without permission, it would be business as usual?

[Steve9930]

Maybe if the path had never been improved, without permission, it would be business as usual?

What's funny is it was far more unsafe before the upgrades.

[Allegiance]

It was never "unsafe" you just had to go a little slower, maybe making it safer then

[Rollie]

Maybe Stonecrest will take the property and put up a gate.

Rollie

[Barefoot]

Maybe Stonecrest will take the property and put up a gate. Yikes, what an idea, that would really be turning the tables! :eek:

[villagetinker]

Maybe someone will take it off Duke Energy's hands and make it a TOLL golf cart path, to cover the liability issue. :22yikes::22yikes: :a20: :a20: :a20:

[rubicon]

Maybe someone will take it off Duke Energy's hands and make it a TOLL golf cart path, to cover the liability issue. :22yikes::22yikes: :a20: :a20: :a20:

That would mean a gate..and as Lou Costello said "gate" and slowly he turned and step by step.......

[Steve9930]

Yikes, what an idea, that would really be turning the tables! :eek:

Hmmmmm, I believe I see a leverage trade in the making. Can you say Paradise Gate? Pay backs are H---!:laugh:

[graciegirl]

I think those who would be affected by the path closing need to make some plans.

If they cannot drive, then perhaps they will have to move to be close to the things they need and so they can get to them in a golf cart. Moving does seem daunting but it is easier here in The Villages because we have less things and the cost of movers is much less here. And it is easier to sell a home here.

It looks like the path closing is something that is very possible.

[villagetinker]

On a more serious note, it would be nice if Walmart would reach the agreement with Duke. Per what I saw on county records, Walmart already owns the property on 3 sides of the Duke substation, so this would just widen the land by the detention basin (which Walmart owns). Maybe all affected should call, text, or write Walmart. I have no issues in the outcome of this, as I live south of 466a, but I would like to see an out come that would keep the path open.

[Mleeja]

Maybe someone will take it off Duke Energy's hands and make it a TOLL golf cart path, to cover the liability issue. :22yikes::22yikes: :a20: :a20: :a20:

Good idea! The Florida Turnpike Authoity could operate then we could use our Sun Pass! :2excited::beer3:

[Allegiance]

Hopefully the Morse family and POA / HOA will get involved.

[TVMayor]

Hopefully the Morse family and POA / HOA will get involved.
Remember when the Developer put up the wall blocking access to the path? Why would the Morse family get involved?

[Allegiance]

Remember when the Developer put up the wall blocking access to the path? Why would the Morse family get involved?
To help villagers get to Walmart. The gate already keeps out most Stonecrest erst.

Don't the historic homeowners have any say in how their CCD money is spent? Maybe that is a stupid question.

[justjim]

Duke Energy is doing the right thing especially for their customers who use a golf cart for their only means of transportation. I have no dog in this fight as I too live south of 466a and will likely never use this path, but come on folks it's a serious issue for those residents and let's show a little compassion for the residents dilemma. Not all of us have the same resources or even health to just up and move to another location to shop, go to doctors or even get groceries.

This path is very important to some and Duke Energy is attempting to work something out for these residents and customers (good for Duke Energy) who have used this path for years. BTY the other no name news has an article about the path today.

[graciegirl]

///

[Bogie Shooter]

To help villagers get to Walmart. The gate already keeps out most Stonecrest erst.

Don't the historic homeowners have any say in how their CCD money is spent? Maybe that is a stupid question.

The Developer doesn't help this villager get to WalMart.

[outlaw]

I have a long cart drive to Walmart. Do you think the developer would consider building a Walmart closer to me?

[Allegiance]

I have a long cart drive to Walmart. Do you think the developer would consider building a Walmart closer to me?
Yes, he is a benevolent ruler

[ColdNoMore]

snip<... but come on folks it's a serious issue for those residents and let's show a little compassion for the residents dilemma.

Not all of us have the same resources or even health to just up and move to another location to shop, go to doctors or even get groceries....>snip

My thoughts exactly.

Some people. :ohdear:



For those facing and dealing with this issue...good luck. :thumbup:

[graciegirl]

We all will have to make changes eventually when we can no longer drive. None of us are getting younger. We are all in charge of our own lives.

The developer is not our mother.

[xlhig]

What I know about the subject neither Walmart or Duke wants the liability. The Stonecrest POA in the beginning got the two sides together and then backed away to let them hash it out. There used to be updates on the negotiations from our POA. What happened to open this can of worms again? It went cold for a long time. Then there was a group that did a lot of volunteer work to improve the path. Did this bring this to forefront again? They moved the improvements as close to the Walmart fence as possible. The reason I thought was that Duke did not want people that close to the substation. If the Duke legal department believes some how they legally now have the liability by defacto they will close that path. I would have expected an internal memo that indicated anyone discussing this made it perfectly clear that people that used the path were trespassing. I've been involved with things like this in the past and as long as no one says something wrong, people just turn a blind eye. Once they believe it legally becomes a problem then Duke will have no recourse but to act on it. This is why I indicated do not talk to Duke and ask questions about the path because if some one gives out the wrong info its over. If I were Duke I would put a sign that indicates this is Duke Property and the path can be used at your own risk. Does not totally exonerate them from liability but gives them an argument should some one take them to court over the an incident. Guess I'll just have to see what's up when I get back down South. Not happy with any of this. Is there a new No Trespassing Sign put up by Duke that indicates no trespassing violators will be prosecuted? If so then you use that path and would be subject to arrest if they also informed the local law enforcement they want it up held. Closing this path has no positives associated with it.

I must be missing something. Those that spruced up the path were mostly comprised of Stonecresters, from what I've read. What benefit does this path provide them since they cannot get past the wall? Can someone shed some light on that?

[Nucky]

I do truly believe that The Lord Created Amazon just in case this path does close. It will not close. No way Jose.

[Mleeja]

I must be missing something. Those that spruced up the path were mostly comprised of Stonecresters, from what I've read. What benefit does this path provide them since they cannot get past the wall? Can someone shed some light on that?

"The Wall" which is actually a gate, only keeps non-residents out of The Villages. These paths are well beyond The Villages proper.

[Allegiance]

I must be missing something. Those that spruced up the path were mostly comprised of Stonecresters, from what I've read. What benefit does this path provide them since they cannot get past the wall? Can someone shed some light on that?
This duke path keeps villagers from Walmart etc and keeps Stonecresters from Lowes etc.

Everyone wants it kept open, but Duke does not want responsibility.

[Nucky]

Hocus Pocus Dominocus, this epic dilemma will resolve itself like magic!

[Barefoot]

I have a long cart drive to Walmart. Do you think the developer would consider building a Walmart closer to me?Sure, no worries. You deserve a closer Walmart.
The Developer personally reads every annual survey and grants wishes.
Just look at the huge Cosco being built on CR 466A. :evil6:

[Nucky]

Sure, no worries. You deserve a closer Walmart.
The Developer personally reads every annual survey and grants wishes.
Just look at the huge Cosco being built on CR 466A. :evil6:

I know this is off base but what is the big deal with Costco? Isn't it just a Sam's Club?

[ColdNoMore]

I know this is off base but what is the big deal with Costco? Isn't it just a Sam's Club?

Read this thread for a clarification between the two. :D


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/rumors-trader-joe-s-costco-206663/?highlight=costco

[Nucky]

Read this thread for a clarification between the two. :D


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/rumors-trader-joe-s-costco-206663/?highlight=costco

Berry Berry Interesting! Thank's for the assist. Back on the subject now.

We went over on Sunday. If you got 50 cents a cart coming and going I'll bet you would get about $500 for the day. It was a Golf Cart MadHouse.

[Shadow8IA]

The signs were never meant to discourage golf carts. The sign on the left is telling you to not go behind the fence into the 50 billion jiggawatt electrical contraption and the sign on the right is so if you get tempted to climb the fence to walk in the retention basin that you would not do it because both would be considered trespassing. The 12 MPH signs are yellow and bright and shiney and are there to advise everyone to not speed. A whole lot of nothing for nothing. There are several bags hung from telephone poles for trash so we may be good neighbors. Oh I almost forgot about the young fellow who cut me off, beat me back to the entrance gate to Country Club Hills and forgot his pass card and wanted to use mine....not a chance. He did use the one of a person behind us by trying to race several inches from the back of her cart....he almost made it...thankfully he didn't hit the nice lady but I'm sure he did $1000 worth of damage to his cart and mangled the gate. It clearly says one cart at a time. Boy was he heated. Free entertainment.

How can you forget your pass when you need it to leave? Sounds like he was trying to sneak in???

[graciegirl]

I know this is off base but what is the big deal with Costco? Isn't it just a Sam's Club?

Apparently Costco pays their employees more money. We belonged to both in Cincy and couldn't discern any difference. TOO much lettuce both places. Unusual and great seasonal offerings both places. Enormous jars of pickles both places. Good deals on electronics both places. Nice looking and uncomfortable upholstered furniture both places.

A lot of folks don't like Walmart. I like Walmart. I also don't promote minimum wage at McDonalds. I am satisfied with how much a quarter pounder costs now.

Not deep or altruistic Gracie.

[outlaw]

My money is on the path closing if Duke can't find an "owner" for the liability. I don't know why a group of path users don't step up and offer to take over ownership of this property from Duke.

[leftyf]

Actually, I think the county should take it over.

[outlaw]

Actually, I think the county should take it over.

Why burden the taxpayers so a few people can drive their golf carts to Walmart? If the county assumes responsibility, the same group will be demanding improvements; paving, widening, covered rest stop..... Let the users pick up the property, since they want to use it.

[leftyf]

Why burden the taxpayers so a few people can drive their golf carts to Walmart? If the county assumes responsibility, the same group will be demanding improvements; paving, widening, covered rest stop..... Let the users pick up the property, since they want to use it.

Some of the users can't even take care of their own trash.

[rubicon]

We have shopped both Costco and Sam's club and found Sam offers better deals. We also shopped trader Joe's
Trader Joe's operates on the principal of exclusivity meaning everything is over priced. We periodically drive to Gainsville to shop and stop by trader Joe's for a few items. I happen to like their carrot juice. We like these small trips away from TV. We really like the feel and view of the Wesley Chapel area.

I wonder if Wesley Chapel residents are having similar problems with duke energy and their cartpath?

I wonder what people did to get to the store before they owned a cart? I wonder how much shopping you can do with a cart? I wonder how you keep meat from over heating while shopping with your cart I wonder if some residents are house bound because they forgot to charge up/fuel up their golf carts?

I wonder if this thread will ever end? Probably not until the duke energy cart path is either sold or closed. but then a new thread will begin about who bought the Duke energy cart path and how it affected the flow of traffic. Or if closed what other cart paths may have been cleared to circumvent the now closed duke energy cart path.. and now we find that Water Oak residents take great leaps of faith by making dangerous crossings to get to The Villages in their golf carts. I really do suspect that some day soon we will experience a drone carrying a golf cart onto the public square and find that the owners of the golf cart reside in Orlando ....and the beat goes on...I'm just funning:D

[Steve9930]

To help villagers get to Walmart. The gate already keeps out most Stonecrest erst.

Don't the historic homeowners have any say in how their CCD money is spent? Maybe that is a stupid question.

This has nothing to do with the CCD money. This is private property where people have been trespassing. Just like the Villagers did not want people trespassing on the Village Paths. Looks like the shoe is on another foot this time.

[Steve9930]

I must be missing something. Those that spruced up the path were mostly comprised of Stonecresters, from what I've read. What benefit does this path provide them since they cannot get past the wall? Can someone shed some light on that?

Let's see: Bells, Lowes, Cracker barrel, Doctors Offices, Several Restaurants, access to the Hospital, access to the Villages via Street Legal Cart. Could never understand all the hoopla about the gate when all you needed was a street legal cart to access the villages. I'd much rather get in the cart if I have to go to Lowes. However if the path is closed Stonecrest will most likely have a another route using a new gate.

[Cajulian]

Let's see: Bells, Lowes, Cracker barrel, Doctors Offices, Several Restaurants, access to the Hospital, access to the Villages via Street Legal Cart. Could never understand all the hoopla about the gate when all you needed was a street legal cart to access the villages. I'd much rather get in the cart if I have to go to Lowes. However if the path is closed Stonecrest will most likely have a another route using a new gate.

Steve, interesting post on possibly using another gate to get Aldi's and the other locations if they close off the short path between Walmart and Aldi's.

I know the two Stonecrest gates on each side of Walmart. But where might there be a possible gate setup for Stonecrest to bypass the Duke portion of the path.

Is there a spot in Stonecrest further down for a gate.

I think Stonecrest should take over the path and put up gates at each end. Then negotiate a reciprocal deal with the Villages for their use to get to Walmart and Stonecrest use at Paradise.

Only fair. I saw your earlier comment "Payback is Hell".

[rubicon]

Let's see: Bells, Lowes, Cracker barrel, Doctors Offices, Several Restaurants, access to the Hospital, access to the Villages via Street Legal Cart. Could never understand all the hoopla about the gate when all you needed was a street legal cart to access the villages. I'd much rather get in the cart if I have to go to Lowes. However if the path is closed Stonecrest will most likely have a another route using a new gate.

See my prediction in post 131 is spot on concerning alternate paths and the duke energy pathway hasn't even been sold or closed. And now we also have water oaks to contend with

[Allegiance]

See my prediction in post 131 is spot on concerning alternate paths and the duke energy pathway hasn't even been sold or closed. And now we also have water oaks to contend with
Is water oaks Golf cart accessible?

[graciegirl]

Is water oaks Golf cart accessible?

Water Oaks. I think I saw a resident on Wesh2 News last night who hit a starter in the face with a golf club. Where is Water Oaks exactly?

[Allegiance]

south of sams Club same side of 441

[njbchbum]

snipped
I think Stonecrest should take over the path and put up gates at each end. Then negotiate a reciprocal deal with the Villages for their use to get to Walmart and Stonecrest use at Paradise.

Only fair. I saw your earlier comment "Payback is Hell".

Surely hope your post was tongue in cheek! If not - here's food for thought:

Is it not fact that the Villages' Paradise gate is part of the overall intent to deny people other than Villagers golf cart access to the community? Negotiating with Stoecrest wold set precedent to negotiate with Fruitland Park and Wildwood - would it not? If the Developer had no qualms about installing 'the wall' - what makes anyone think there is an oppty to negotiate access?

[Steve9930]

Steve, interesting post on possibly using another gate to get Aldi's and the other locations if they close off the short path between Walmart and Aldi's.

I know the two Stonecrest gates on each side of Walmart. But where might there be a possible gate setup for Stonecrest to bypass the Duke portion of the path.

Is there a spot in Stonecrest further down for a gate.

I think Stonecrest should take over the path and put up gates at each end. Then negotiate a reciprocal deal with the Villages for their use to get to Walmart and Stonecrest use at Paradise.

Only fair. I saw your earlier comment "Payback is Hell".

Stonecrest is right next to the parking lot for the Doctor's Offices. Would just have to open a gate there. That would make 3 gates.

[Steve9930]

Surely hope your post was tongue in cheek! If not - here's food for thought:

Is it not fact that the Villages' Paradise gate is part of the overall intent to deny people other than Villagers golf cart access to the community? Negotiating with Stoecrest wold set precedent to negotiate with Fruitland Park and Wildwood - would it not? If the Developer had no qualms about installing 'the wall' - what makes anyone think there is an oppty to negotiate access?

I believe the original wall was nothing more then the developer playing politics with Fruitland Park since they had requested access. However the Paradise gate did little to stop traffic from either Stonecrest or now Spruce Creek. All one needs is a street legal golf cart. So I never understood all the Hoop La and from what I read the gate is broken often and that is a real expense not counting the normal expense of service. Now myself I did not buy a street legal cart since the ride by cart is not as pleasant as the ride by auto. In most cases I'm going farther then Spanish Springs. However not having access to the Business there on the East side of 441 just North of Paradise gate would be a bummer.

[Cajulian]

Surely hope your post was tongue in cheek! If not - here's food for thought:

Is it not fact that the Villages' Paradise gate is part of the overall intent to deny people other than Villagers golf cart access to the community? Negotiating with Stoecrest wold set precedent to negotiate with Fruitland Park and Wildwood - would it not? If the Developer had no qualms about installing 'the wall' - what makes anyone think there is an oppty to negotiate access?

I never said that it was an absolute option to negotiate a reciprocal agreement. Wishful thanking to solve both communities travel problems.

However, the statement stands that "Payback is Hell". If someone takes over that small stretch of property, they have the same right as the Paradise gate owners. They will also have the right to decide who they want to let thru.

[Steve9930]

I never said that it was an absolute option to negotiate a reciprocal agreement. Wishful thanking to solve both communities travel problems.

However, the statement stands that "Payback is Hell". If someone takes over that small stretch of property, they have the same right as the Paradise gate owners. They will also have the right to decide who they want to let thru.

Another that may apply, "What goes around comes around". KARMA can be a real B.......! I just may take them up on the free offer, this could be a heap of fun. I'm retired, I could stand guard and check ID's.......:pepper2:

[chuckinca]

I never said that it was an absolute option to negotiate a reciprocal agreement. Wishful thanking to solve both communities travel problems.

However, the statement stands that "Payback is Hell". If someone takes over that small stretch of property, they have the same right as the Paradise gate owners. They will also have the right to decide who they want to let thru.


I doubt many Stonecrest residents would approve buying the path so villagers could get to Wally World. As noted above, a Stonecrest gate to the medical offices is a possibility and would offset the closure of the Duke Energy Gate for Stonecrest.

.

[NotGolfer]

That Walmart doesn't need to be accessed by villagers (except the historical side) as they have the one on 466 and soon the neighborhood one off from 466a. Both of those are golf-cart accessible.

[JoMar]

That Walmart doesn't need to be accessed by villagers (except the historical side) as they have the one on 466 and soon the neighborhood one off from 466a. Both of those are golf-cart accessible.

The one off 466A is a market and pharmacy only.

[perrjojo]

All of the above is interesting but here is my thought....it is Duke Energy property. It is NOT the Duke Energy cart path. Those who use it as a cart path are trespassers. It doesn't matter why they want to/need to use it. They are trespassing. These people have taken it upon themselves to make it a cart path without authorization or permission. I hope it can be resolved to the best interest of all, but in the meantime...trespasser beware. This is not your property.

[Fredman]

All of the above is interesting but here is my thought....it is Duke Energy property. It is NOT the Duke Energy cart path. Those who use it as a cart path are trespassers. It doesn't matter why they want to/need to use it. They are trespassing. These people have taken it upon themselves to make it a cart path without authorization or permission. I hope it can be resolved to the best interest of all, but in the meantime...trespasser beware. This is not your property.

Good summation of a situation that will linger on until Duke blocks the path

[dewilson58]

All of the above is interesting but here is my thought....it is Duke Energy property. It is NOT the Duke Energy cart path. Those who use it as a cart path are trespassers. It doesn't matter why they want to/need to use it. They are trespassing. These people have taken it upon themselves to make it a cart path without authorization or permission. I hope it can be resolved to the best interest of all, but in the meantime...trespasser beware. This is not your property.

Yepper, but some just don't care about facts.

[Challenger]

All of the above is interesting but here is my thought....it is Duke Energy property. It is NOT the Duke Energy cart path. Those who use it as a cart path are trespassers. It doesn't matter why they want to/need to use it. They are trespassing. These people have taken it upon themselves to make it a cart path without authorization or permission. I hope it can be resolved to the best interest of all, but in the meantime...trespasser beware. This is not your property.

Facts just muddle the works - lets have more hearsay and conspiracy theories. Am I thinking of the of a "cart path" or the political situation?

[rubicon]

Steve and Cajulian: Let's begin with basics. All this discussion hasn't been created by village residents continuing breaches into Stonecrest, Water Oaks, etc. No we have this problem because like Stonecrest the theme was why pay more for the village lifestyle when you can have more with less and still have the village lifestyle.

Second Lets envision a map of The Villages and divide it into two parts both colored. The commercial district is green and the private residential district is red.

Green belongs ( owns, rents, etc) to the Developer and comprises his commercial interests which are open to the public. Green means go and all non-residents are welcomed.

The Red District belongs to residents who purchased a home at a premium, paid a bond and pay a monthly amenity fee which supports amenities such as rec centers, executive golf courses, multi-modal paths, etc.
Residents of Stonecrest ,etc had an equal opportunity to make such a purchase but chose otherwise. It would seem that breaching the red zone is the persistent goal of some residents of Stonecrest, Water Oaks, Spruce Creek, Oxford, etc.

Please don't get mad at us if we object and desire borders because we have and continue to pay our dues. The Villages is expanding at a rapid pace and we do not need additional traffic on our MMP, etc.

Fair is fair



Personal Best Regards:

[Allegiance]

Can water oak residents drive their regular non lsv to the villages? Curious.

[CFrance]

Steve and Cajulian: Let's begin with basics. All this discussion hasn't been created by village residents continuing breaches into Stonecrest, Water Oaks, etc. No we have this problem because like Stonecrest the theme was why pay more for the village lifestyle when you can have more with less and still have the village lifestyle.

Second Lets envision a map of The Villages and divide it into two parts both colored. The commercial district is green and the private residential district is red.

Green belongs ( owns, rents, etc) to the Developer and comprises his commercial interests which are open to the public. Green means go and all non-residents are welcomed.

The Red District belongs to residents who purchased a home at a premium, paid a bond and pay a monthly amenity fee which supports amenities such as rec centers, executive golf courses, multi-modal paths, etc.
Residents of Stonecrest ,etc had an equal opportunity to make such a purchase but chose otherwise. It would seem that breaching the red zone is the persistent goal of some residents of Stonecrest, Water Oaks, Spruce Creek, Oxford, etc.

Please don't get mad at us if we object and desire borders because we have and continue to pay our dues. The Villages is expanding at a rapid pace and we do not need additional traffic on our MMP, etc.

Fair is fair



Personal Best Regards:
Makes sense to me.

[outlaw]

I never said that it was an absolute option to negotiate a reciprocal agreement. Wishful thanking to solve both communities travel problems.

However, the statement stands that "Payback is Hell". If someone takes over that small stretch of property, they have the same right as the Paradise gate owners. They will also have the right to decide who they want to let thru.

Not necessarily. It depends on the conditions of the sale. Duke may require the new owner to continue access to all.

[Steve9930]

All of the above is interesting but here is my thought....it is Duke Energy property. It is NOT the Duke Energy cart path. Those who use it as a cart path are trespassers. It doesn't matter why they want to/need to use it. They are trespassing. These people have taken it upon themselves to make it a cart path without authorization or permission. I hope it can be resolved to the best interest of all, but in the meantime...trespasser beware. This is not your property.

Spot on!

[Steve9930]

Not necessarily. It depends on the conditions of the sale. Duke may require the new owner to continue access to all.


My money is on the path being closed.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Can water oak residents drive their regular non lsv to the villages? Curious.

Yes, but they don't have access to rec centers, pools, golf courses and other amenities.

The streets are public streets. The golf cart paths are owned by The Villages and are limited to Villages residents.

[Villageswimmer]

My money is on the path being closed.


Agree. I see this as a PR move by Duke to soften the blow. It's sad that our society has become so litigious.

[Allegiance]

Yes, but they don't have access to rec centers, pools, golf courses and other amenities.

The streets are public streets. The golf cart paths are owned by The Villages and are limited to Villages residents.
Can you tell me how they access the villages by regular Golf cart? I would love to get to home Depot and sams via cart.

[dewilson58]

So I took care of my Billing issue with the nice lady at Duke Energy and then asked about the no trespassing issue. She had not heard about it nor received any memo. The beat goes on. I'm not poking the nest. This is part of our routine and we want to do the rite thing. Go to the path and reference my previous post and tell me it has no merit. They don't want you in the power grid or the retention pond or on the path at over 12 MPH. They are not restricting use of the path or they could block it instantly.

Next time you go.................see if she has been informed.

[justjim]

If the path remains open, those living outside The Villages (Stonecrest, Spruce Creek South, Water Oaks, and others, still won't have the same full lifestyle as Villagers. By that I mean, access to recreation centers, executive golf, hundreds of clubs, traveling in your golf cart to Squares, supermarkets, restaurants, etc. etc. However, if the path is closed, some Villagers will be impacted from using the path to get to their desired locations via golf cart outside the Villages. Of Course, they can use their car or if they don't have one they can travel with a friend or call a taxi. Obviously, residents of The Villages can still use the 27/441 golf cart bridge to travel anywhere within The Villages.

When you think about this situation logically, isn't that what we bought into when we purchased a home in The Villages. We have no legal right to drive our golf carts outside of the boundaries of The Villages unless it's legal to do so. The gate (instead of a wall) on paradise lane was put up to allow Villagers to travel in their golf cart where they had been allowed to travel (for many years) but this required traveling outside the boundaries of The Villages and on private property.

In summary, we as Villagers have no right to travel outside of The Villages in a golf cart unless it's legal to do so and those living outside The Villages have no right to travel inside The Villages in a golf cart unless it's legal to do so. It's should be noted that a Street Legal Cart might get you to a lot of places that a regular cart will not allow you to legally travel. However, monitoring these activities, will at best, be a challenge. I wonder if it is even worth the time and effort to do so? Fore!

[Bogie Shooter]

The post 161 removes the emotion and sums the thread up, quite well. Thanks

[biker1]

Strictly speaking, the golf cart paths (aka the Multi Modal Paths) are owned by the CDDs (although it is possible that not all of the paths have as yet been turned over to the CDDs by the Developer). When you use the term "The Villages", I assume you mean the Developer.

Yes, but they don't have access to rec centers, pools, golf courses and other amenities.

The streets are public streets. The golf cart paths are owned by The Villages and are limited to Villages residents.

[MikeyBoo54]

Steve and Cajulian: Let's begin with basics. All this discussion hasn't been created by village residents continuing breaches into Stonecrest, Water Oaks, etc. No we have this problem because like Stonecrest the theme was why pay more for the village lifestyle when you can have more with less and still have the village lifestyle.

Second Lets envision a map of The Villages and divide it into two parts both colored. The commercial district is green and the private residential district is red.

Green belongs ( owns, rents, etc) to the Developer and comprises his commercial interests which are open to the public. Green means go and all non-residents are welcomed.

The Red District belongs to residents who purchased a home at a premium, paid a bond and pay a monthly amenity fee which supports amenities such as rec centers, executive golf courses, multi-modal paths, etc.
Residents of Stonecrest ,etc had an equal opportunity to make such a purchase but chose otherwise. It would seem that breaching the red zone is the persistent goal of some residents of Stonecrest, Water Oaks, Spruce Creek, Oxford, etc.

Please don't get mad at us if we object and desire borders because we have and continue to pay our dues. The Villages is expanding at a rapid pace and we do not need additional traffic on our MMP, etc.

Fair is fair



Personal Best Regards:

:bowdown:

Nicely said!

Thanks Rubicon

[Cajulian]

Stonecrest is right next to the parking lot for the Doctor's Offices. Would just have to open a gate there. That would make 3 gates.

Thanks Steve. I didn't know that. Still not quite sure what street that would be to get over there within Stonecrest. Guess I will drive around and look.

[Cajulian]

All of the above is interesting but here is my thought....it is Duke Energy property. It is NOT the Duke Energy cart path. Those who use it as a cart path are trespassers. It doesn't matter why they want to/need to use it. They are trespassing. These people have taken it upon themselves to make it a cart path without authorization or permission. I hope it can be resolved to the best interest of all, but in the meantime...trespasser beware. This is not your property.

This path has been in use now for at least 16 years with no concerns from Duke until recently. Whatever caused their current concerns will eventually be resolved by either transfer of the property or a shut down.

Interesting how many people want to put their two cents in on this discussion, when they have no vested interest or need to use this path.

[Steve9930]

The 160th post removes the emotion and sums the thread up, quite well. Thanks
Duke Energy has summed it up in writing. If the path is not taken over by another party or an enchrochment agreement is not signed, the path will be closed. That is the official word from Duke, no emotion, just their official statement..

[Steve9930]

Thanks Steve. I didn't know that. Still not quite sure what street that would be to get over there within Stonecrest. Guess I will drive around and look.

Up in the Woods Area. We'll have to see if the path closes. I have already made a suggestion to Roger. If the path closes I'm sure their will be much interest.

[dewilson58]

This path has been in use now for at least 16 years with no concerns from Duke until recently. Whatever caused their current concerns will eventually be resolved by either transfer of the property or a shut down.

Interesting how many people want to put their two cents in on this discussion, when they have no vested interest or need to use this path.

Soooooooooo, the only people allowed to post are the trespassing criminals.

:1rotfl:


:1rotfl:


:1rotfl:


:clap2:

[Cajulian]

Steve and Cajulian: Let's begin with basics. All this discussion hasn't been created by village residents continuing breaches into Stonecrest, Water Oaks, etc. No we have this problem because like Stonecrest the theme was why pay more for the village lifestyle when you can have more with less and still have the village lifestyle.

Second Lets envision a map of The Villages and divide it into two parts both colored. The commercial district is green and the private residential district is red.

Green belongs ( owns, rents, etc) to the Developer and comprises his commercial interests which are open to the public. Green means go and all non-residents are welcomed.

The Red District belongs to residents who purchased a home at a premium, paid a bond and pay a monthly amenity fee which supports amenities such as rec centers, executive golf courses, multi-modal paths, etc.
Residents of Stonecrest ,etc had an equal opportunity to make such a purchase but chose otherwise. It would seem that breaching the red zone is the persistent goal of some residents of Stonecrest, Water Oaks, Spruce Creek, Oxford, etc.

Please don't get mad at us if we object and desire borders because we have and continue to pay our dues. The Villages is expanding at a rapid pace and we do not need additional traffic on our MMP, etc.

Fair is fair



Wow Rubicon! That's sounds pretty absurd. The Stonecrest and Del Webb communities have their own Rec Centers, Swimming Pools, golf courses, clubs, fitness centers that are equally as nice. What ever makes you think that anyone else outside your Red Zone wants to use your facilities? That is paranoid thinking.

The Villages public facilities are available to everyone. That is great for insiders and outsiders. Retail businesses need all the help they can get.

This topic is about the use of the Duke Cart path for Villagers, Stonecrest, and Spruce Creek. The Villages Lifestyle is not the topic here.

[NoMoSno]

I heard Cosco and Trader Joe's are building just north of Stonecrest :coolsmiley::gc:

[Nucky]

Soooooooooo, the only people allowed to post are the trespassing criminals.

:1rotfl:


:1rotfl:


:1rotfl:


:clap2:

I thought SHHHHHHHHHH was the order of the day on this issue. This discussion is just getting started on a much more serious note. Lemme know the outcome. My bet is no interruption and a big hub bub about nuttin. Think I'll make it onto Cop's for Trespassing? Bad Boy Bad Boy Whatcha Gonna Do? What a bunch of B.S. over Zippity Do Da!

[Steve9930]

Wow Rubicon! That's sounds pretty absurd. The Stonecrest and Del Webb communities have their own Rec Centers, Swimming Pools, golf courses, clubs, fitness centers that are equally as nice. What ever makes you think that anyone else outside your Red Zone wants to use your facilities? That is paranoid thinking.

The Villages public facilities are available to everyone. That is great for insiders and outsiders. Retail businesses need all the help they can get.

This topic is about the use of the Duke Cart path for Villagers, Stonecrest, and Spruce Creek. The Villages Lifestyle is not the topic here.

Thanks for this post. There is nothing that I access in the villages that the village residents pay for in their monthly dues nor would I care to. Nor do any of my Stonecrest neighbors. The commercial properties have been constructed to make money for the developer. As the head count rises it sometimes gets to the point that just getting a bite to eat becomes a long adventure. Just what is the village life style?

[ColdNoMore]

This path has been in use now for at least 16 years with no concerns from Duke until recently. Whatever caused their current concerns will eventually be resolved by either transfer of the property or a shut down.

Interesting how many people want to put their two cents in on this discussion, when they have no vested interest or need to use this path.

Excellent point.

While I am one of those that don't use that path/trail and have no vested interest, as a decent and caring human being I would like to see those who do need it...be able to keep using it.

Some of the comments here that in essence are saying (paraphrasing).. "we are the true Villagers and would rather see other Villagers lose their use of it, rather than have an 'outsider' use 'our' paths/MMP's"...seems pretty cold-hearted and selfish to me. :(

I mean really, other than a few more carts that would be impossible to distinguish from the hordes already here...what difference does it really make? :ohdear:

But hey, that's just my opinion and observation. :shrug:

Here's hoping that a viable solution is put in place and those who now use it...will be able to continue to do so. :thumbup:

[Steve9930]

Excellent point.

Here's hoping that a viable solution is put in place and those who now use it...will be able to continue to do so. :thumbup:

Me too.

[Steve9930]

I heard Cosco and Trader Joe's are building just north of Stonecrest :coolsmiley::gc:

One side of me says, yippy yippy, the other sides says wonderful more traffic!

[Bogie Shooter]

Thanks for this post. There is nothing that I access in the villages that the village residents pay for in their monthly dues nor would I care to. Nor do any of my Stonecrest neighbors. The commercial properties have been constructed to make money for the developer. As the head count rises it sometimes gets to the point that just getting a bite to eat becomes a long adventure. Just what is the village life style?

Attracting developments such as Stonecrest.:ho:

[Mleeja]

Thanks for this post. There is nothing that I access in the villages that the village residents pay for in their monthly dues nor would I care to. Nor do any of my Stonecrest neighbors. The commercial properties have been constructed to make money for the developer. As the head count rises it sometimes gets to the point that just getting a bite to eat becomes a long adventure. Just what is the village life style?

As a Villager, I welcome folks from outside The Villages to drive their cars into The Villages to shop and dine or pay the green fees to play the championship golf courses. It keeps the commercial areas healthy and benefits everyone.

What I see as the concern is when the non Villages visitors drive their carts on the Villages owned facilities i.e. the multi-modal paths. Adding congestion to already crowed and dangerous paths.

[Barefoot]

My money is on the path being closed.

My bet is no interruption and a big hub bub about nuttin.

Unfortunately for retired seniors that rely on the path, I think Steve is right.
But wait, is that a white knight I see riding up?

[ColdNoMore]

But wait, is that a white knight I see riding up?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWcASV2sey0

[Carl in Tampa]

If people keep bringing this up this path is going to be closed permanently. Leave this alone and everything will be fine. Keep bringing this up and some one is going to ruin it. I have no idea why people keep flogging this horse. There is no need to clarify anything. At this point in time everyone is just turning a blind eye but keep sticking the nest and it will be closed. Stop calling Duke Energy !!!! Go play some golf.....That's what you came here to do in the first place.

I just came acroos the path and Duke Energy has placed handouts at each end of the path. It says that Duke Energy will no longer accept liability for this path. They are willing to transfer ownership of this property to another party. If no party takes it, Duke will be forced to close it. The letter is a lot longer than this, I just reduced it because I don't like to type that much. If you want a copy, hop on your cart and drive over. To make matters worse, some idiot has put 4 empty gas cans where the litter bag is.

I must commend Steve9930 for remarkable restraint. I suspect that if I had made his post then my reply to the post of leftyf would have been "I told you so."

I agree with Steve9930 that it was a great mistake to continue to bring this issue up, and particularly to continue to bring it up to Duke Energy. The rational thing would have been for those who use the path to continue to use it until Duke took some affirmative action to close the path.

This is simple. If Duke Energy wanted to close the path, it could be accomplished in a couple of hours by bringing some earth moving equipment and plowing great trenches across the property.

The rational thing to do would have been to not poke the sleeping giant. This is a case where it was easier to get forgiveness than permission.

:gc:

[rubicon]

Wow Rubicon! That's sounds pretty absurd. The Stonecrest and Del Webb communities have their own Rec Centers, Swimming Pools, golf courses, clubs, fitness centers that are equally as nice. What ever makes you think that anyone else outside your Red Zone wants to use your facilities? That is paranoid thinking.

The Villages public facilities are available to everyone. That is great for insiders and outsiders. Retail businesses need all the help they can get.

This topic is about the use of the Duke Cart path for Villagers, Stonecrest, and Spruce Creek. The Villages Lifestyle is not the topic here.

Cajulian: Absurd! I have pretty good recall and when all of this first started Stonecrest residents complained about the fact that they could no longer travel the MMP for their joy rides.

As for use of facilities again my recollection points to many a thread speaking to the issue of non-residents sneaking in to pools, rec centers and executive courses with or without the assist of some village residents. In fact ambassadors had to chase more than one non-resident off the executive courses which they entered by climbing over a fence.

Because I'm paranoid doesn't mean non-resident are not sneaking in:D No my red zone analogy is on solid ground Interesting enough for me is that it is not the act that bothers me its the hypocrisy of it all. and like all bad situations if you don't nip it in the bud it will grow out of control. A village without borders is no village at all

Personal Best Regards:

[Allegiance]

Cajulian: Absurd! I have pretty good recall and when all of this first started Stonecrest residents complained about the fact that they could no longer travel the MMP for their joy rides.

As for use of facilities again my recollection points to many a thread speaking to the issue of non-residents sneaking in to pools, rec centers and executive courses with or without the assist of some village residents. In fact ambassadors had to chase more than one non-resident off the executive courses which they entered by climbing over a fence.

Because I'm paranoid doesn't mean non-resident are not sneaking in:D No my red zone analogy is on solid ground Interesting enough for me is that it is not the act that bothers me its the hypocrisy of it all. and like all bad situations if you don't nip it in the bud it will grow out of control. A village without borders is no village at all

Personal Best Regards:
Build that wall.

But not on the Duke path. ;)

[outlaw]

The big mistake was the group that took it upon themselves to "upgrade" the path without the owners permission. IMO, this was an underhanded attempt to claim access via prescriptive easement or implied dedication. Most likely, one of the users concocted this plan, similar to the attempt to force TV to open access through the historic villages based on medical access necessities, and even trying to get national organizations and US representatives involved. Duke recognized this immediately, and thus, the letter of impending closure.

[Steve9930]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWcASV2sey0

Cute, Always liked a sense of humor, thanks.

[Bogie Shooter]

If the path remains open, those living outside The Villages (Stonecrest, Spruce Creek South, Water Oaks, and others, still won't have the same full lifestyle as Villagers. By that I mean, access to recreation centers, executive golf, hundreds of clubs, traveling in your golf cart to Squares, supermarkets, restaurants, etc. etc. However, if the path is closed, some Villagers will be impacted from using the path to get to their desired locations via golf cart outside the Villages. Of Course, they can use their car or if they don't have one they can travel with a friend or call a taxi. Obviously, residents of The Villages can still use the 27/441 golf cart bridge to travel anywhere within The Villages.

When you think about this situation logically, isn't that what we bought into when we purchased a home in The Villages. We have no legal right to drive our golf carts outside of the boundaries of The Villages unless it's legal to do so. The gate (instead of a wall) on paradise lane was put up to allow Villagers to travel in their golf cart where they had been allowed to travel (for many years) but this required traveling outside the boundaries of The Villages and on private property.

In summary, we as Villagers have no right to travel outside of The Villages in a golf cart unless it's legal to do so and those living outside The Villages have no right to travel inside The Villages in a golf cart unless it's legal to do so. It's should be noted that a Street Legal Cart might get you to a lot of places that a regular cart will not allow you to legally travel. However, monitoring these activities, will at best, be a challenge. I wonder if it is even worth the time and effort to do so? Fore!

Worth posting again.

[Steve9930]

Build that wall.

But not on the Duke path. ;)

Some people just see bad guys everywhere. Like I said before Paradise Gate did nothing but add expense to the villages. The traffic continues via Golf Cart for those that wish to do so. If you need help with the wall let me know I'll help and we can make it about 30 feet high.........:wave:

[Steve9930]

The big mistake was the group that took it upon themselves to "upgrade" the path without the owners permission. IMO, this was an underhanded attempt to claim access via prescriptive easement or implied dedication. Most likely, one of the users concocted this plan, similar to the attempt to force TV to open access through the historic villages based on medical access necessities, and even trying to get national organizations and US representatives involved. Duke recognized this immediately, and thus, the letter of impending closure.

How does that saying go:"The road to hell is paved with good intentions." We will just have to see how this plays out. Never know someone may take responsibility. If not I'm sure for the next 10 years there will be threads and threads of complaints. Keeps the Talk of the Villages in business selling advertising.

[Steve9930]

I must commend Steve9930 for remarkable restraint. I suspect that if I had made his post then my reply to the post of leftyf would have been "I told you so."

I agree with Steve9930 that it was a great mistake to continue to bring this issue up, and particularly to continue to bring it up to Duke Energy. The rational thing would have been for those who use the path to continue to use it until Duke took some affirmative action to close the path.

This is simple. If Duke Energy wanted to close the path, it could be accomplished in a couple of hours by bringing some earth moving equipment and plowing great trenches across the property.

The rational thing to do would have been to not poke the sleeping giant. This is a case where it was easier to get forgiveness than permission.

:gc:

Carl, I'm afraid its too late. When I heard about the improvements to the path my first reaction was "Oh Boy".
I believe that before the path was improved Duke was under the impression the traffic was minimal. However after learning about the improvements, I can hear the comment now", "We have a problem. With the increased traffic there is going to be an incident and we will be libel". That's all it takes to wake up the legal staff. Everyone will just have to sit back and see what happens now. I believe that Duke also sees this as a PR Nightmare. You get these when you ignore the obvious. Duke should have closed the path years ago to avoid what they have now.. We will just have to wait and see. Sometimes if you just sit back and be quiet the legal staff goes back to sleep. For me I see some white light in this. I was looking at the Elio. If the path closes I'll have and argument with the CEO of the family to buy one when they become available.

[TVMayor]

Yes, but they don't have access to rec centers, pools, golf courses and other amenities.

The streets are public streets. The golf cart paths are owned by The Villages and are limited to Villages residents.

If a person brings a golf cart on a trailer to TV, unloads it behind the Rialto Theater and drives around The Villages for the day, they can not drive on the golf cart paths???? What if they rent a cart???

[dewilson58]

If a person brings a golf cart on a trailer to TV, unloads it behind the Rialto Theater and drives around The Villages for the day, they can not drive on the golf cart paths???? What if they rent a cart???

Of course..........they can walk and ride bikes on the paths too.

Not his point.

[Steve9930]

If a person brings a golf cart on a trailer to TV, unloads it behind the Rialto Theater and drives around The Villages for the day, they can not drive on the golf cart paths???? What if they rent a cart???

The Doc needs a dose of reality. Hey Doc, they rent carts everyday to non-villagers, there are LSV carts on those paths everyday and they are not villagers. I have rented a cart and taken guess visiting on a days journey through the villages. There is no way to keep outsiders off the paths because they are not secured. Now percentage wise of villagers versus non-villagers is very very very small but it is going on daily.

[dewilson58]

The Doc needs a dose of reality. Hey Doc, they rent carts everyday to non-villagers, there are LSV carts on those paths everyday and they are not villagers. I have rented a cart and taken guess visiting on a days journey through the villages. There is no way to keep outsiders off the paths because they are not secured. Now percentage wise of villagers versus non-villagers is very very very small but it is going on daily.

Refer to post 191.


:loco:

[Barefoot]

If a person brings a golf cart on a trailer to TV, unloads it behind the Rialto Theater and drives around The Villages for the day, they can not drive on the golf cart paths???? What if they rent a cart??? Many prospective purchasers rent carts to look around. Of course they are allowed on the MM trails.
As you know, the paths aren't being monitored so it's entirely possibly for non-Villagers to use them.

[Cajulian]

Excellent point.

While I am one of those that don't use that path/trail and have no vested interest, as a decent and caring human being I would like to see those who do need it...be able to keep using it.

Some of the comments here that in essence are saying (paraphrasing).. "we are the true Villagers and would rather see other Villagers lose their use of it, rather than have an 'outsider' use 'our' paths/MMP's"...seems pretty cold-hearted and selfish to me. :(

I mean really, other than a few more carts that would be impossible to distinguish from the hordes already here...what difference does it really make? :ohdear:

But hey, that's just my opinion and observation. :shrug:

Here's hoping that a viable solution is put in place and those who now use it...will be able to continue to do so. :thumbup:

I like your compassion. Thank you.

[rubicon]

If a person brings a golf cart on a trailer to TV, unloads it behind the Rialto Theater and drives around The Villages for the day, they can not drive on the golf cart paths???? What if they rent a cart???

Nice try but... The defining issue is that the cart didn't sneak across the border. Of course if someone is that desperate to ride the MMP's well...........

[Rollie]

I heard that Walmart and Duke had final talks on Friday. I have not heard the outcome.

Rollie

[Riccckkk]

I heard that Walmart and Duke had final talks on Friday. I have not heard the outcome.

Rollie
I was talking to an assistant Walmart manager the Duke sent a letter to Walmart and stated they (Duke) had no intention of closing the path unless there is another issue from some one using the path.

[dewilson58]

I was told by a Target cashier, Target is buying the Duke property and closing the path down.

:popcorn:

[ColdNoMore]

I have a friend, whose cousins brother said that Duke Energy was going to set up booths along the path...and rent them out for use as a flea market.

[rubicon]

I was told by a Target cashier, Target is buying the Duke property and closing the path down.

:popcorn:

Target can't afford to buy the cart path

[DonH57]

A friend of a friend of mine said that Duke is selling the property to his sister's mother who manages SECO to place toll gates there. At least that's what he said. Oh. wait. That's a shooting range going in next month.

[dbussone]

I have a friend, whose cousins brother said that Duke Energy was going to set up booths along the path...and rent them out for use as a flea market.



I purchased it from Duke and will be setting up a toll path. However, I will accept SunPass. I also plan to install an HOV lane that will have a variable toll depending upon the time of day and the period most likely to prove inconvenient to individuals. You can pay me now, or pay me later. But, either way, you WILL pay.

[Nucky]

I purchased it from Duke and will be setting up a toll path. However, I will accept SunPass. I also plan to install an HOV lane that will have a variable toll depending upon the time of day and the period most likely to prove inconvenient to individuals. You can pay me now, or pay me later. But, either way, you WILL pay.

My wife heard about this from her sister in law's nephew, he works for the Geek Squad and will be installing the toll booths.:cus:

[dewilson58]

Toll booths, or Toll booze ????

[dbussone]

Toll booths, or Toll booze ????



I guess it Depends on who is on duty in the toll both at the time.


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[dewilson58]

I guess it Depends on who is on duty in the toll both at the time.


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Can I have the 4pm to 6pm shift??

:wine:

[dbussone]

Can I have the 4pm to 6pm shift??

:wine:



Absolutely!


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[DonH57]

Oh Goody. Toll booze! Yeah!

[leftyf]

:bigbow::bigbow::bigbow::bigbow::bigbow:I have a friend, whose cousins brother said that Duke Energy was going to set up booths along the path...and rent them out for use as a flea market.