High-speed rail between Miami, West Palm Beach, Ft Lauderdale & Orlando

[Ecuadog]

"Brightline, the company that will eventually zip passengers from Miami to Orlando, showed off the first of its five train sets Wednesday in West Palm Beach.

It was a preview of what’s to come in the summer, when express trains begin their regularly scheduled run between Miami, Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach stations. Run by Florida East Coast Industries subsidiary All Aboard Florida, the company intends to add service to Orlando in 2018 along a planned new rail spur into the city’s airport."

Read more here: First Brightline train unveiled in West Palm Beach, ahead of its Miami-Orlando debut | Miami Herald (http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/broward/article125929989.html#storylink=cpy)

[Hancle704]

No Mention in article, will this be high speed rail service?

[Ecuadog]

No Mention in article, will this be high speed rail service?

It's a "higher-speed" rail service.

From WikiPedia/Brightline (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brightline)...

"To cover the distance between Orlando and Miami in the desired time of about three hours, Brightline trains will have to operate with an overall average speed of 80 miles per hour (129 km/h), which is similar to the overall average speed of the Acela Express operating on the Northeast Corridor between New York City and Washington, DC. By comparison, the approximate driving time for this distance is about four hours.

Train speeds may reach up to 79 miles per hour (127 km/h) between Miami and West Palm Beach, 110 miles per hour (177 km/h) between West Palm Beach and Cocoa, and 125 miles per hour (201 km/h) between Cocoa and the Orlando International Airport. In order to increase the speed limit from 79 miles per hour (127 km/h) to 110 miles per hour (177 km/h) between West Palm Beach and Cocoa, the existing track conditions will be brought up to meet required federal standards."


The Orlando station is supposed to be at the airport (MCO). I can see myself using it to get to Miami or Ft Lauderdale for a cruise.

[VILLAGERBB]

That's great news!

[jgm3279]

Yay!

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

When we were in England we took a high speed rail from Liverpool to London on a train that went 125 mile per hour.

We also took the Chunnel train from London to Paris. That train goes 200 mph.

Why don't we have rail service like that in this country. I'd bet a lot more people would use trains if they went that fast.

New York to Orlando is approximately 1100 miles. A 200mph train would get you here in 5-1/2 hours. Orlando to Miami would take a little over an hour.

[JoMar]

Rail has always suffered in this Country, too many grew up and are accostomend to the freedom the cars provide. Then there is the cost of building rails that can handle that speed, getting the rights of way and construction of the stations. Europe never did put a great highway system together and their size made rail easier to implement. They love their trains the way we love our cars. Examples of companies that have tried are MARTA and SEPTA...they serve very congested cities yet struggle for ridership. The Acela, high speed (relative) the runs the northeast corrider struggles for ridership. I would love to see it, but I'm not optomistic.

[fred53]

When we were in England we took a high speed rail from Liverpool to London on a train that went 125 mile per hour.

We also took the Chunnel train from London to Paris. That train goes 200 mph.

Why don't we have rail service like that in this country. I'd bet a lot more people would use trains if they went that fast.

New York to Orlando is approximately 1100 miles. A 200mph train would get you here in 5-1/2 hours. Orlando to Miami would take a little over an hour.

are subsidized by their respective governments. They also have very short distances to travel compared to the U.S. So if you don't mind your taxes being higher and going someplace based on train schedules then perhaps if the majority agree you'll get your wish.

Personally I'd prefer to see a lot more local trains.

[ColdNoMore]

Passenger train travel in this country basically became obsolete, with the advent of the Eisenhower Interstate System. Something European countries never pursued with vigor and instead put their resources behind high-speed rail travel.

Eisenhower championed the Interstate System for primarily national military defense, after seeing German troops in WWII moving so easily on their Autobahns.

Americans fell in love with their automobiles and the idea that they could jump in them at their house and pretty much go anywhere, at their own pace and schedule...meant fewer and fewer were taking trains.

All Aboard Florida, now 'Brightline,' which is owned by the same hedge fund (Fortress) that owns the Florida East Coast Railway, believes there is an upscale market for a Miami to Orlando airport operation, but have never stated what the anticipated costs will be. Assuredly, it will be much more expensive than a family renting a car and driving on Florida's Turnpike between those two points...while adding only a little more time.

Right now, Brightline cannot find funding on the private bond market, after being rejected by the state and the feds, and the new track from the Titusville area to Orlando is still not funded...much less built.

So they've decided to start out running between Miami and West Palm using existing Florida East Coast trackage.

The only problem is, TriRail (which is actually owned by the state), already covers that same run at a reasonably low price.

But since Brightline has already purchased some equipment (locomotives & passenger cars), they need to do something and will try competing with TriRail.

Not surprisingly, Brightline is counting a lot on commercial property built in Miami & Ft. Lauderdale (and possibly other locations) to help defray train operating costs.

Another big issue are the communities along the Florida East Coast tracks, that are litigating/demonstrating about the number of additional trains (as many as 34) through their small communities.

I wish them luck, but can't see with all the obstacles they face...how it will ever succeed.

All Aboard Florida's plan for Miami-Orlando trains in jeopardy | Florida Bulldog (http://www.floridabulldog.org/2016/09/all-aboard-floridas-plans-for-passenger-train-service-from-miami-to-orlando-in-jeopardy/)


The need for taxpayer-subsidized bonds

AAF has said it can finance the project without government funding, yet also that it would be difficult if not impossible without the taxpayer-subsidized bonds.

AAF president Michael Reininger stated in a deposition that not approving the sale of the tax-exempt PABs “would certainly disrupt the current financing plan, make the project more expensive to complete and may delay its progress.”

In a letter to Paul Baumer of DOT’s Office of Infrastructure Finance and Innovation that emerged during discovery, Reininger went further, calling the funding a “linchpin for completing our project” and “a crucial factor in ensuring our project is financed and completed.”

According to The Bond Buyer.com, there is little interest in the market for high-risk, high-return bonds for a variety of reasons.

The owner of AAF’s parent company apparently cannot help. Court documents state that Fortress’ market capitalization has shrunk by nearly half in the past 14 months.

Likewise, Florida East Coast Investments, AAF’s parent company, has significant debt obligations coming due in three to four years, according to court documents.

While AAF appears to have no funding for Phase II, it does have equity in train stations, which it could sell, according to Ryan.

“You know, all along AAF has claimed that this is a private entity, but it is totally dependent on subsidies,” he said. “They should knock off this fiction. They have their hands in every government pocket they can find.”

[ColdNoMore]

On a related note, even Amtrak with owning their NEC (Northeast Corridor) that runs between Washington DC and Boston and has a massive population along the route...fights to stay solvent on even just this route.

And of course they need large subsidies for other routes, even when using other railroads trackage.

So while I would love to see a Miami to Orlando train route succeed...for the life of me I can't see how it could. :shrug:

[OpusX1]

While I would love to see this succeed they will be in competition with several bus lines that are pretty inexpensive. it looks like it may cut an hour off your travel time but at what cost. Right now you can get cruise connection for $100 PP round trip and it picks you up and drops you off in The Villages. I would pay a small premium depending on schedules as I love to ride on trains and these trains look really nice. Hope it works for all of us that love trains.

[JoMar]

On a related note, even Amtrak with owning their NEC (Northeast Corridor) that runs between Washington DC and Boston and has a massive population along the route...fights to stay solvent on even just this route.

And of course they need large subsidies for other routes, even when using other railroads trackage.

So while I would love to see a Miami to Orlando train route succeed...for the life of me I can't see how it could. :shrug:

Thanks for agreeing with my post......lol

[ColdNoMore]

Thanks for agreeing with my post......lol
LOL

I didn't see yours before writing mine...but always glad to please. :ho: