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View Full Version : Bye-Bye Obamacare, Hello An Avalanche of Medical Bankruptcies


wjboyer1
03-07-2017, 08:52 PM
As recently as 1981, only 8 percent of families filing for bankruptcy cited medical reasons. By 2010, when the Affordable Care Act was passed, medical bankruptcy was all-to-common. A 2009 study by Himmelstein et al, published in The American Journal of Medicine, revealed that 62.1% of all bankruptcies had a medical cause.Hospital bills were the largest single out-of-pocket expense for 48.0% of patients, prescription drugs for 18.6%, doctors’ bills for 15.1%, and premiums for 4.1%. The remainder cited expenses such as medical equipment and nursing homes. While hospital costs loomed largest for all diagnostic groups, for about one third of patients with pulmonary, cardiac, or psychiatric illnesses, prescription drugs were the largest expense.The New York Times and the Kaiser Family Foundation recently did a survey and found:

… roughly 20 percent of people under 65 with health insurance nonetheless reported having problems paying their medical bills over the last year. By comparison 53 percent of people without health insurance said the same.
A study last year by the Kaiser Family Foundation found that companies are shifting health care costs to their employees. Workers' share of health insurance premiums for their families rose 83 percent from 2005 to 2015, the survey shows. The amount employees had to pay for deductibles for individual insurance increased 255 percent from 2006 to 2015. The increases are far higher than growth in workers' wages.Medicare, like more and more health plans, leaves lot of expenses for patients to cover, says Drew Altman, CEO of the Kaiser Family Foundation.

"The public perception may be that, because Medicare is so popular, it is gold-plated Cadillac coverage," Altman says. "But people who are on Medicare know that those costs can really bite."

Altman says Obamacare has given nearly everyone in the U.S. access to health care. About 89 percent of people now have insurance in some form, according to the Department of Health and Human Services.

The financial vulnerabilities reflect the high cost of health care in the United States, the most expensive place in the world to get sick.66551

dirtbanker
03-07-2017, 09:02 PM
As recently as 1981, only 8 percent of families filing for bankruptcy cited medical reasons. By 2010, when the Affordable Care Act was passed, medical bankruptcy was all-to-common. A 2009 study by Himmelstein et al, published in The American Journal of Medicine, revealed that 62.1% of all bankruptcies had a medical cause.Hospital bills were the largest single out-of-pocket expense for 48.0% of patients, prescription drugs for 18.6%, doctors’ bills for 15.1%, and premiums for 4.1%. The remainder cited expenses such as medical equipment and nursing homes. While hospital costs loomed largest for all diagnostic groups, for about one third of patients with pulmonary, cardiac, or psychiatric illnesses, prescription drugs were the largest expense.The New York Times and the Kaiser Family Foundation recently did a survey and found:

… roughly 20 percent of people under 65 with health insurance nonetheless reported having problems paying their medical bills over the last year. By comparison 53 percent of people without health insurance said the same.
A study last year by the Kaiser Family Foundation found that companies are shifting health care costs to their employees. Workers' share of health insurance premiums for their families rose 83 percent from 2005 to 2015, the survey shows. The amount employees had to pay for deductibles for individual insurance increased 255 percent from 2006 to 2015. The increases are far higher than growth in workers' wages.Medicare, like more and more health plans, leaves lot of expenses for patients to cover, says Drew Altman, CEO of the Kaiser Family Foundation.

"The public perception may be that, because Medicare is so popular, it is gold-plated Cadillac coverage," Altman says. "But people who are on Medicare know that those costs can really bite."

Altman says Obamacare has given nearly everyone in the U.S. access to health care. About 89 percent of people now have insurance in some form, according to the Department of Health and Human Services.

The financial vulnerabilities reflect the high cost of health care in the United States, the most expensive place in the world to get sick.66551

Bye Bye Obammacare, Good riddance!! My healthcare went from $750 a month to $1300 a month...I don't want to provide healthcare for the lazy!!

affald
03-07-2017, 09:09 PM
Bye Bye Obammacare, Good riddance!! My healthcare went from $750 a month to $1300 a month...I don't want to provide healthcare for the lazy!!
Want free Medicaid.... work... build a wall. ... lol

wjboyer1
03-07-2017, 09:20 PM
Bye Bye Obammacare, Good riddance!! My healthcare went from $750 a month to $1300 a month...I don't want to provide healthcare for the lazy!!

looks like you will pay even more.....and laziness has nothing to do with it...we all get sick or injured

1. Sicker sign-ups

In Tennessee, marketplace enrollees were a lot less healthy than insurers expected when they set their original rates in 2013. Covering their claims costs insurers a lot — so much that companies like BlueCross BlueShield lost millions of dollars in the first few years of the exchange. Raising the price of insurance is part of balancing how much it costs to insure these individuals.

Many people who use the marketplace to find coverage were previously uninsured. Before the Affordable Care Act, insurers were able to deny coverage to people with pre-existing conditions, which means if they didn’t have insurance at work, they weren’t able to find coverage at all. For example, an independent contractor with diabetes, or a part-time retail worker with pulmonary disease, might be denied coverage before the ACA.

A lot of people in that situation went without health insurance for many years, and their current state of health is not good. Many of these people are very expensive to cover now that they can get health insurance on the exchange.

2. Inflation of medical claims

Health insurance is used to pay for medical claims. Doctors and other providers submit claims to your insurer every time they perform a service for you, whether it’s a check-up, MRI or surgery. As the cost of performing those services gets more expensive, insurance has to get more expensive to cover it.

The prices of goods always rise as the economy grows, and health care is no exception. In fact, health care costs generally rise much faster than inflation. Specifically, health insurance costs in 2015 rose nearly 5 percent, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, while the economy as a whole grew just 2.4 percent.

3. Consumers are still learning

So why are health care costs rising so fast? That’s a tough question to answer succinctly. One reason is that patients are still learning how to act like consumers. Some people do not use healthcare responsibly or cost-effectively, and this raises prices for the whole system. These are people who go to the emergency room for non-emergencies, or people who do not receive preventive care in a timely manner.

The uninsured rate has an impact on this, too. Many people who do not have insurance cannot afford to manage their conditions, like asthma or diabetes. They might not visit the doctor for check-ups or be able to afford to buy their insulin. Then they wind up in the ER in a diabetic coma, which costs a lot more to treat. These are just individual examples, but they happen every day, and it adds up.

All of this culminates in pricey premiums for consumers. Without drastic change to how people use insurance and health care, prices are likely to keep rising.

- See more at: Three reasons for rising health insurance premiums (http://www.bernardhealth.com/woofstreetjournal/three-reasons-for-rising-premiums#sthash.wnP19q53.dpuf)

Cedwards38
03-07-2017, 09:59 PM
More info about the actual cost to citizens of the proposed GOP replacement for the Affordable Care Act:

Analysis: GOP plan to cost Obamacare enrollees $1,542 more a year - Vox (http://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/3/7/14843632/aca-republican-health-care-plan-premiums-cost-price)

Cedwards38
03-07-2017, 10:08 PM
Bye Bye Obammacare, Good riddance!! My healthcare went from $750 a month to $1300 a month...I don't want to provide healthcare for the lazy!!

Here's a little nugget from the Bible for all you good Christian right wingers to ponder:

Matthew 25:35-40English Standard Version (ESV)

"35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? 39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,[a] you did it to me.’"

Need more? Here are some more:

What Does the Bible Say About Helping Those In Need? (https://www.openbible.info/topics/helping_those_in_need)

No, I don't expect this to change your mind about helping each other, because your money and your political party are far more important to you than Christianity or humanity.

Don Baldwin
03-07-2017, 10:49 PM
Here's a little nugget from the Bible for all you good Christian right wingers to ponder:

Matthew 25:35-40English Standard Version (ESV)

"35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? 39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,[a] you did it to me.’"

Need more? Here are some more:

What Does the Bible Say About Helping Those In Need? (https://www.openbible.info/topics/helping_those_in_need)

No, I don't expect this to change your mind about helping each other, because your money and your political party are far more important to you than Christianity or humanity.

Of course you take it out of context. It's NOT saying you HAVE to support the perpetually poor. The fakers who are ripping you off. An entire "race" who can never, anywhere get with the program...and support themselves. HALF the country gets something from the government, HALF the black population collects some form of welfare. It's too much, it's unsustainable.

wjboyer1
03-08-2017, 12:15 AM
Of course you take it out of context. It's NOT saying you HAVE to support the perpetually poor. The fakers who are ripping you off. An entire "race" who can never, anywhere get with the program...and support themselves. HALF the country gets something from the government, HALF the black population collects some form of welfare. It's too much, it's unsustainable.

Everyone benefits from the government in some way....it cannot be segregated as you put it....but the "fakers" are but a small minority of those in need. Most of those "fakers" are wealthy business owners that bilk the government for $millions, and you complain about a few people who may, from time to time, get something with which you don't agree, and say that they are the problem. Most welfare recipients are children, then the elderly, and then the disabled. You are willing to sacrifice them for what? Evidently YOUR Christianity is different from mine, because mine says that you should love one another, not put a price tag on them.

Reiver
03-08-2017, 02:53 AM
I have one of those cool, Cadillac health insurance plans as a result of working for the State of NY.
My heart attack and stent 5 years ago was paid by insurance ($20,000).
Since then, I've paid that amount back in premiums...
I suppose I would be bankrupt if I didn't have that insurance.

Don Baldwin
03-08-2017, 06:45 AM
I have one of those cool, Cadillac health insurance plans as a result of working for the State of NY.
My heart attack and stent 5 years ago was paid by insurance ($20,000).
Since then, I've paid that amount back in premiums...
I suppose I would be bankrupt if I didn't have that insurance.

Many/most people will use close to $1 million worth of healthcare in their lives...the majority at the end...the last year of their life. To "pay" for $1 million...you would have to pay over $1000 a month EVERY month for 80 years.

Healthcare simply costs TOO MUCH. We CAN'T afford it as it stands now.

ColdNoMore
03-08-2017, 06:59 AM
Not for a minute do I believe it will, but if the Republican's plan results in just as many American citizens being covered and slows the rise of healthcare costs that have been rising for three decades now...then I'm all for it.

What I predict will happen though, is that premiums will actually increase at a greater rate than they have, given that preexisting conditions still have to be covered...but there is now no mandate that everyone has to participate to offset the higher risk pools.

How can they not? :oops:

I also predict that the bigger mess this creates compared to the ACA, will come back to haunt the Repub's...since they now own it. :D

It should be interesting to watch. :popcorn:

ColdNoMore
03-08-2017, 07:04 AM
I have one of those cool, Cadillac health insurance plans as a result of working for the State of NY.
My heart attack and stent 5 years ago was paid by insurance ($20,000).
Since then, I've paid that amount back in premiums...
I suppose I would be bankrupt if I didn't have that insurance.

That $20,00 actually sounds very cheap (by a factor of 3 or 4)...given what you had done. :shrug:

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 07:08 AM
looks like you will pay even more.....and laziness has nothing to do with it...we all get sick or injured

1. Sicker sign-ups

Blah, blah, blah

2. Inflation of medical claims

blah, blah, blah

3. Consumers are still learning

blah, blah, blah

- See more at: Three reasons for rising health insurance premiums (http://www.bernardhealth.com/woofstreetjournal/three-reasons-for-rising-premiums#sthash.wnP19q53.dpuf)

I am 53 years old, healthy (no prescriptions, no doctor visits, no health issues), I go for preventive testing every 3 years (at a local hospital and pay out of pocket for testing of PSA, cholesterol, etc), I have had health insurance since I was 18.

Does it sound like I am the type of person that does not understand what drives prices in the health insurance market? My premiums went from $750 a month to $1300 since Obammacare was enacted. Of course my premiums had gone up from when I was 18 over the years but never had it gone up 80% in 3 years!!

I am not the only one that has this complaint, I have had many conversations with people that have experienced a similar rise in premiums and none were happy about that.

You must be a person that never had healthcare, you must be paying less than me for healthcare due to Obammacare??

dave harris
03-08-2017, 07:13 AM
Many/most people will use close to $1 million worth of healthcare in their lives...the majority at the end...the last year of their life. To "pay" for $1 million...you would have to pay over $1000 a month EVERY month for 80 years.

Healthcare simply costs TOO MUCH. We CAN'T afford it as it stands now.

Your answwer is let them die, maybe if it was someone you loved it would be different.

Cedwards38
03-08-2017, 07:13 AM
Of course you take it out of context. It's NOT saying you HAVE to support the perpetually poor. The fakers who are ripping you off. An entire "race" who can never, anywhere get with the program...and support themselves. HALF the country gets something from the government, HALF the black population collects some form of welfare. It's too much, it's unsustainable.

OK, then you enlighten me and tell me about what you think is the Biblical context. Show me where the Bible says anything about not helping the "perpetually poor" or "fakers who are ripping you off." Point out to me in your context where the Bible says that we don't need to help the poor and sick of a particular "race" as you suggest. The Bible says we should help the poor and sick to be Christian, and your imagined and made up "context" does not exist. You don't get to twist the teachings of Jesus into something that fits your distorted political philosophy.

dave harris
03-08-2017, 07:20 AM
I am 53 years old, healthy (no prescriptions, no doctor visits, no health issues), I go for preventive testing every 3 years (at a local hospital and pay out of pocket for testing of PSA, cholesterol, etc), I have had health insurance since I was 18.

Does it sound like I am the type of person that does not understand what drives prices in the health insurance market? My premiums went from $750 a month to $1300 since Obammacare was enacted. Of course my premiums had gone up from when I was 18 over the years but never had it gone up 80% in 3 years!!

I am not the only one that has this complaint, I have had many conversations with people that have experienced a similar rise in premiums and none were happy about that.

You must be a person that never had healthcare, you must be paying less than me for healthcare due to Obammacare??

I have had car insurance all my life, without a chargeable accident, never have I said, wow I'm being charged so much with no return. Also, maybe you weren't paying enough in healthcare to begin with, maybe your insurer is ripping you off, have you shopped? I'm on medicare A and B and D with supplemental so I do not know your situation, enlighten me.

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 07:20 AM
Here's a little nugget from the Bible for all you good Christian right wingers to ponder:

Matthew 25:35-40English Standard Version (ESV)

Blah, blah, blah

No, I don't expect this to change your mind about helping each other, because your money and your political party are far more important to you than Christianity or humanity.

You quoted my post, in which I expressed my healthcare premiums going up 80% in 3 years, with a bible verse intending to be a slap in my face??

I am Agnostic. Now don't go thinking that I worship the devil, because I don't believe in him either. My money is my money, I don't feel I owe it to Gods or lazy helpless bums. I need my money to continue to pay my way thru life without burdening others.

If your money is not as important why don't you stop taking tax deductions (that extra money you pay in taxes could be given to welfare recipients)? You are a typical liberal that wants to be generous with other peoples money.

dave harris
03-08-2017, 07:22 AM
OK, then you enlighten me and tell me about what you think is the Biblical context. Show me where the Bible says anything about not helping the "perpetually poor" or "fakers who are ripping you off." Point out to me in your context where the Bible says that we don't need to help the poor and sick of a particular "race" as you suggest. The Bible says we should help the poor and sick to be Christian, and your imagined and made up "context" does not exist. You don't get to twist the teachings of Jesus into something that fits your distorted political philosophy.

You have to realize your dealing with fake Christians, they go to church on Sunday and when they leave, they leave the bible behind.

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 07:26 AM
Everyone benefits from the government in some way....it cannot be segregated as you put it....but the "fakers" are but a small minority of those in need. Most of those "fakers" are wealthy business owners that bilk the government for $millions, and you complain about a few people who may, from time to time, get something with which you don't agree, and say that they are the problem. Most welfare recipients are children, then the elderly, and then the disabled. You are willing to sacrifice them for what? Evidently YOUR Christianity is different from mine, because mine says that you should love one another, not put a price tag on them.

Why don't you explain how I have benefited and need to pay 80% more for health insurance...

dave harris
03-08-2017, 07:26 AM
You quoted my post, in which I expressed my healthcare premiums going up 80% in 3 years, with a bible verse intending to be a slap in my face??

I am Agnostic. Now don't go thinking that I worship the devil, because I don't believe in him either. My money is my money, I don't feel I owe it to Gods or lazy helpless bums. I need my money to continue to pay my way thru life without burdening others.

If your money is not as important why don't you stop taking tax deductions (that extra money you pay in taxes could be given to welfare recipients)? You are a typical liberal that wants to be generous with other peoples money.

The minute you need the government you will come crawling, just like all the others who speak like you.

dave harris
03-08-2017, 07:27 AM
Why don't you explain how I have benefited and need to pay 80% more for health insurance...

Maybe you weren't paying enough to begin with.

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 07:34 AM
I have had car insurance all my life, without a chargeable accident, never have I said, wow I'm being charged so much with no return. Also, maybe you weren't paying enough in healthcare to begin with, maybe your insurer is ripping you off, have you shopped? I'm on medicare A and B and D with supplemental so I do not know your situation, enlighten me.

Did your car insurance go up 80% in 3 years??

Of course I have shopped!!

Did you read the first line of my post that you quoted? I said I was 53 years old, that is too young to be on medicare (I believe that is age 65)...you are getting more than you pay for, you are on the other side of the fence.

I don't believe anyone can enlighten you...

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 07:44 AM
Maybe you weren't paying enough to begin with.

The insurance company had been giving me an 80% discount and realized their mistake just when Obammacare was enacted...I said I was healthy, I said I had health insurance since I was 18, I said I have spoken to others that had the same issue...And your thought is I was not paying enough to begin with??

Really?

I have accused you of being dumber than a box of rocks...I stand by that accusation. You are an annoying idiot that can not read and comprehend. Now everyone (including myself) makes mistakes on here from time to time, but you are one mistake after another. It is a wonder an idiot like you lived to be old enough to enroll in medicare.

Paper1
03-08-2017, 07:48 AM
Many/most people will use close to $1 million worth of healthcare in their lives...the majority at the end...the last year of their life. To "pay" for $1 million...you would have to pay over $1000 a month EVERY month for 80 years.

Healthcare simply costs TOO MUCH. We CAN'T afford it as it stands now.

Thank you, that fact seems to be lost on this group of posters. The person who paid $20,000 in premiums in 5 years for his NY retirees insurance is a lot better off than he thinks. My wife and I paid well over $20,000 in 2 years. Our premiums cut in half when I went on Medicare this month so our costs dropped significantly. That said healthcare cost did not drop so who is making up the difference? Regardless if we "paid into Medicare and social security all our lives" both programs are out of money and out of control regardless of what our elected leaders say about trust funds. Although the for profit medical industry we allowed to grow out of control has given us the most advanced care in world it also only works if someone else is paying, like government for instance.

Don Baldwin
03-08-2017, 07:49 AM
Not for a minute do I believe it will, but if the Republican's plan results in just as many American citizens being covered and slows the rise of healthcare costs that have been rising for three decades now...then I'm all for it.

What I predict will happen though, is that premiums will actually increase at a greater rate than they have, given that preexisting conditions still have to be covered...but there is now no mandate that everyone has to participate to offset the higher risk pools.

How can they not? :oops:

I also predict that the bigger mess this creates compared to the ACA, will come back to haunt the Repub's...since they now own it. :D

It should be interesting to watch. :popcorn:

Premiums MUST go up...to cover the ever increasing cost of healthcare. $1 million spread out over 80 years...is over $1000 a month.

I am 53 years old, healthy (no prescriptions, no doctor visits, no health issues), I go for preventive testing every 3 years (at a local hospital and pay out of pocket for testing of PSA, cholesterol, etc), I have had health insurance since I was 18.

Does it sound like I am the type of person that does not understand what drives prices in the health insurance market? My premiums went from $750 a month to $1300 since Obammacare was enacted. Of course my premiums had gone up from when I was 18 over the years but never had it gone up 80% in 3 years!!

I am not the only one that has this complaint, I have had many conversations with people that have experienced a similar rise in premiums and none were happy about that.

You must be a person that never had healthcare, you must be paying less than me for healthcare due to Obammacare??

You've been paying too little and they're increasing premiums to cover the current costs. Over $1000 EVERY month for 80 years equals $1 million, an average amount of healthcare costs in a lifetime.

Your answwer is let them die, maybe if it was someone you loved it would be different.

It's inevitable. You CANNOT spend a $ million per person. Especially when they're elderly and all you're getting is a few extra months. It's has to stop...it will stop.

You'll know it's coming when they start showing, getting us accustomed to...end of life alternatives...in movies and TV. Euthanasia. The religious are the ones who are against it. But I think we will see it. Healthcare is simply TOO EXPENSIVE to treat everyone.

OK, then you enlighten me and tell me about what you think is the Biblical context. Show me where the Bible says anything about not helping the "perpetually poor" or "fakers who are ripping you off." Point out to me in your context where the Bible says that we don't need to help the poor and sick of a particular "race" as you suggest. The Bible says we should help the poor and sick to be Christian, and your imagined and made up "context" does not exist. You don't get to twist the teachings of Jesus into something that fits your distorted political philosophy.

Well first off...the "Bible" is basically the Jewish Torah with the "New Testament" which is basically...all PAUL...thrown in to pretty much contradict everything in the "original" OT Bible.

It's ALL fiction. The OT based on older stories. The NT a creation of Paul who is the REAL founder of "Christianity". There is NO evidence that the "Jesus of the NT" ever existed let alone did all the "miracles" he's accredited with doing. PAUL wrote most of the stories about Jesus and the parables. The "books" supposedly written by John, Luke, Mark, etc...are anonymous often rewritten and changed. What you are reading has been changed and shuffled around to no end. Entire "books" of the NT were taken out. Words changed...things left out...things added. It's all FAKE. Done by "church scholars" who wanted to ensure they'd get their 10% cut...their tithings...you are being fooled.

The Jews weren't fooled by Paul. There is NOTHING in either religion that PROVES Jesus (as seen in the Bible) EVER existed. Flavius Josephus? He NEVER met Jesus, he wrote DECADES later that he'd "heard of a Christ". NOBODY contemporary to Jesus writes of him. There are no Roman records of him or the trial/crucifixion. There is NOTHING but YOUR "records"...church records. And they are...ALL...VERY...post Jesus.

I was simply making a point that your Bible does not specifically mention being "nice" to blacks or fakers. Back then...not many knew blacks existed...they weren't "discovered" until much later. Some Arabs had found them, enslaved them, maybe the Egyptians too...who REALLY knows because there is so much disinformation out there.

All I DO know is what they do to a school when they show up in numbers...what they do to a neighborhood...a town...a city...a COUNTRY. They DESTROY them all and they'll end up destroying here too if they're allowed to keep breeding like they are.

Disagree? Lets hear of their great contributions to civilization.

They are NOT us...but we're stuck with them.

dave harris
03-08-2017, 08:03 AM
"Conservative backlash threatens to sink new GOP health bill"

The repub's can't get their ducks in a row. LOL

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/gop-bill-unlikely-settle-passionate-082555224.html

Don Baldwin
03-08-2017, 08:08 AM
You quoted my post, in which I expressed my healthcare premiums going up 80% in 3 years, with a bible verse intending to be a slap in my face??

I am Agnostic. Now don't go thinking that I worship the devil, because I don't believe in him either. My money is my money, I don't feel I owe it to Gods or lazy helpless bums. I need my money to continue to pay my way thru life without burdening others.

If your money is not as important why don't you stop taking tax deductions (that extra money you pay in taxes could be given to welfare recipients)? You are a typical liberal that wants to be generous with other peoples money.

Why DOES "God" need money? I mean really...supposedly KNOWS EVERYTHING past present and future. All powerful, created the entire universe.

So WHY does he need money?

So some bugs sitting on a lonely rock can "spread the word"?

The minute you need the government you will come crawling, just like all the others who speak like you.

Human nature...like people will turn to religion when times get tough.

Did your car insurance go up 80% in 3 years??

Of course I have shopped!!

Did you read the first line of my post that you quoted? I said I was 53 years old, that is too young to be on medicare (I believe that is age 65)...you are getting more than you pay for, you are on the other side of the fence.

I don't believe anyone can enlighten you...

I WOULD if they suddenly HAD to insure 50 million people who didn't have it before. At 1/12th the actual cost to insure them. Obamacare SHOULD be charging $1000 a month. It charges $1000 a YEAR.

Thank you, that fact seems to be lost on this group of posters. The person who paid $20,000 in premiums in 5 years for his NY retirees insurance is a lot better off than he thinks. My wife and I paid well over $20,000 in 2 years. Our premiums cut in half when I went on Medicare this month so our costs dropped significantly. That said healthcare cost did not drop so who is making up the difference? Regardless if we "paid into Medicare and social security all our lives" both programs are out of money and out of control regardless of what our elected leaders say about trust funds. Although the for profit medical industry we allowed to grow out of control has given us the most advanced care in world it also only works if someone else is paying, like government for instance.

LOTS of things get lost on them...

Medical costs are increasing almost exponentially...premiums must too to keep up.

They are lost to the fact that Hispanics are taking over too. THEIR populations are growing almost exponentially...they'll be the majority and change the country completely in another 30 years.

Like I said...lots gets lost on them...age...dementia I guess.

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 09:30 AM
"Conservative backlash threatens to sink new GOP health bill"

The repub's can't get their ducks in a row. LOL

Conservative backlash threatens to sink new GOP health bill - Yahoo Finance (https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/gop-bill-unlikely-settle-passionate-082555224.html)

LOL? Why is that funny to you??

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

dillywho
03-08-2017, 12:12 PM
Much of the healthcare costs can be attributed to those who run out and get a lawyer the minute they are not restored to perfect health. I know doctors who have given up their practice because they REFUSED to pass along the outrageous costs incurred by them for malpractice insurance. They chose instead to stay with the career they loved by going into research. How do I know this? They were MY doctors, that's how. Our primary doctor had to drop several of his patients because he was making too many referrals to specialists when it was out of the range of his expertise. That is exactly WHY I will never again participate in an HMO system. When we retired, we had no choice in order to keep our company insurance there.

My husband suffered a stroke following surgery 15 years ago. One lady here in TV asked me why he cannot carry on a conversation. (It is called Expressive Aphasia.) When I told her the reason, her first words were "I bet you guys are fixed for life after that lawsuit!". My words to her were, "What lawsuit? He knew the risk going in and was willing to take it. It was not the doctor's fault! It happens and that is why the possibilities of what could happen were explained beforehand."

Medicine is not what it was in the horse and buggy days. Like any other business, yes it is a business, there are many other expenses besides just his/her fees and malpractice insurance. Doctors of old did not have to deal with that. They did not have office staff, cleaning services, nurses, supplies, equipment, outright office purchase or lease, expensive medical school, etc. The list goes on. Why should doctors and hospitals, etc. not bring in enough to meet those expenses? Think of all the ones that get the care and never pay a penny because they won't, not can't. Yet, the hospitals cannot turn them away because of it. Thank the deadbeats in your blame, too. Too many won't even pay their doctor bills because they don't want to give up their lifestyle. And I am not talking about food and medicine, but the latest electronic gadgets, nice car, etc.

Insurance, especially Medicare, will pay only so much. If they get billed for the exact cost, then they will still only approve a portion and then pay a portion of that approval. Unless the charges are well above, then doctors and hospitals cannot even recover the actual cost. I know of no business, public or private, that can sustain by operating at a loss year after year.

Many complain about the Morses. Why should they invest all the money, take all the risks, and then just say, "Come and get it....no charge because we have wealth."? There are plenty here that think that very thing. Would you do it if it was your business? Didn't think so.

dave harris
03-08-2017, 12:23 PM
did your car insurance go up 80% in 3 years??

Of course i have shopped!!

Did you read the first line of my post that you quoted? I said i was 53 years old, that is too young to be on medicare (i believe that is age 65)...you are getting more than you pay for, you are on the other side of the fence.

I don't believe anyone can enlighten you...

try

dave harris
03-08-2017, 12:25 PM
The insurance company had been giving me an 80% discount and realized their mistake just when Obammacare was enacted...I said I was healthy, I said I had health insurance since I was 18, I said I have spoken to others that had the same issue...And your thought is I was not paying enough to begin with??

Really?

I have accused you of being dumber than a box of rocks...I stand by that accusation. You are an annoying idiot that can not read and comprehend. Now everyone (including myself) makes mistakes on here from time to time, but you are one mistake after another. It is a wonder an idiot like you lived to be old enough to enroll in medicare.

Now tell me how you really feel.

dave harris
03-08-2017, 12:29 PM
LOL? Why is that funny to you??

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Where did I say funny? Just like trump make things up.

Reiver
03-08-2017, 04:06 PM
Perhaps folks shouldn't have a "right" to $1 million of other people's money.
Besides which, the ACA never addressed the cost of healthcare. Only who was going to pay for it, and billions of dollars for crap like new streetlights.

Don Baldwin
03-08-2017, 09:18 PM
Perhaps folks shouldn't have a "right" to $1 million of other people's money.
Besides which, the ACA never addressed the cost of healthcare. Only who was going to pay for it, and billions of dollars for crap like new streetlights.

You mean the streetlights that those same minority poor people stole the copper wire from?

stealing copper from street lights - Google Search (https://www.google.com/search?q=stealing+copper+from+street+lights&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8)

cologal
03-08-2017, 09:26 PM
I just wonder why a Healthcare bill has tax breaks for the rich hidden in it?

Don Baldwin
03-08-2017, 09:31 PM
I just wonder why a Healthcare bill has tax breaks for the rich hidden in it?

Because they wrote it? Or more accurately...had someone write it for them...the people who WORK for them...our lawmakers...our Congressmen.

dirtbanker
03-08-2017, 09:43 PM
Where did I say funny? Just like trump make things up.
Hey window licker, LOL stands for Laugh Out Loud. People LAUGH OUT LOUD to things they consider FUNNY.

Why do you think a delay in the new Healthcare program is funny??


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wjboyer1
03-09-2017, 12:45 AM
AARP, a group that advocates for senior citizens and other older Americans, shares her concern. The organization sent a letter to Congress yesterday saying the proposed bill would "dramatically increase health care costs for Americans aged 50-64."

Many seniors could face a significant increase in health care premiums, since insurance companies will be allowed to charge seniors five times as much as for younger people for a comparable plan. Under the current Affordable Care Act (ACA), insurers are limited to charging three times as much. The tax credits proposed in the AHCA, which would be dispensed mainly on the basis of age and income, would be smaller for older Americans compared with under the ACA, making insurance even more expensive for them.

"Taken together, premiums for older adults could increase by as much as $3,600 for a 55-year-old earning $25,000 a year, $7,000 for a 64-year-old earning $25,000 a year and up to $8,400 for a 64-year-old earning $15,000 a year," AARP said in its letter. The group said a typical senior seeking insurance on a state exchange has an annual income under $25,000.

Dr Winston O Boogie jr
03-09-2017, 07:37 AM
Here's a little nugget from the Bible for all you good Christian right wingers to ponder:

Matthew 25:35-40English Standard Version (ESV)

"35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? 39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,[a] you did it to me.’"

Need more? Here are some more:

What Does the Bible Say About Helping Those In Need? (https://www.openbible.info/topics/helping_those_in_need)

No, I don't expect this to change your mind about helping each other, because your money and your political party are far more important to you than Christianity or humanity.

The Bible also says that if you don't work you don't eat.

There's a big difference between helping people who are temporarily in a bind and work hard to get out of it, or those who are permanently disabled or elderly and supporting a large percentage of the population who are just too lazy or under educated or irresponsible.

Don Baldwin
03-09-2017, 07:39 AM
AARP, a group that advocates for senior citizens and other older Americans, shares her concern. The organization sent a letter to Congress yesterday saying the proposed bill would "dramatically increase health care costs for Americans aged 50-64."

Many seniors could face a significant increase in health care premiums, since insurance companies will be allowed to charge seniors five times as much as for younger people for a comparable plan. Under the current Affordable Care Act (ACA), insurers are limited to charging three times as much. The tax credits proposed in the AHCA, which would be dispensed mainly on the basis of age and income, would be smaller for older Americans compared with under the ACA, making insurance even more expensive for them.

"Taken together, premiums for older adults could increase by as much as $3,600 for a 55-year-old earning $25,000 a year, $7,000 for a 64-year-old earning $25,000 a year and up to $8,400 for a 64-year-old earning $15,000 a year," AARP said in its letter. The group said a typical senior seeking insurance on a state exchange has an annual income under $25,000.

How much has the cost of healthcare gone up? The cost of an operation is higher now...an office visit costs more. EVERY part of healthcare costs more now than when we started making insurance payments. People use an average of $1 million in healthcare costs in a lifetime. That's 80 years, 960 monthly payments, of over $1000.

You could buy a car with very low payments in the 1960s...you can't get a NEW car today for that same payment because cars cost more today. Same with health insurance...the cost of healthcare has skyrocketed, the premiums must too.

Obamacare, subsidizing 50 million poor people, IS causing YOUR premiums to go up even more. You're getting the normal price inflation PLUS picking up a $ multi-billion albatross around your neck. We decided to support them...now we're stuck with ever increasing costs.

Should we all provide healthcare for everyone with NO responsibility on their part? They can be obese and slovenly, participate in dangerous activities...and WE pay 100% of their healthcare? The POOR, living on foodstamps and subsidized housing...ISN'T paying a cent for healthcare...we are.

It comes down to cost...CAN society afford to cover everyone, many for free, when it costs over $1000 a month per person?

Don Baldwin
03-09-2017, 07:41 AM
The Bible also says that if you don't work you don't eat.

There's a big difference between helping people who are temporarily in a bind and work hard to get out of it, or those who are permanently disabled or elderly and supporting a large percentage of the population who are just too lazy or under educated or irresponsible.

Or the REAL reason...another species. INCAPABLE of thriving in a modern society.

WHY are THEY...ALWAYS...at the very bottom socially? Financially? Intellectually?

Because they are NOT us...

Paper1
03-09-2017, 08:51 AM
How much has the cost of healthcare gone up? The cost of an operation is higher now...an office visit costs more. EVERY part of healthcare costs more now than when we started making insurance payments. People use an average of $1 million in healthcare costs in a lifetime. That's 80 years, 960 monthly payments, of over $1000.

You could buy a car with very low payments in the 1960s...you can't get a NEW car today for that same payment because cars cost more today. Same with health insurance...the cost of healthcare has skyrocketed, the premiums must too.

Obamacare, subsidizing 50 million poor people, IS causing YOUR premiums to go up even more. You're getting the normal price inflation PLUS picking up a $ multi-billion albatross around your neck. We decided to support them...now we're stuck with ever increasing costs.

Should we all provide healthcare for everyone with NO responsibility on their part? They can be obese and slovenly, participate in dangerous activities...and WE pay 100% of their healthcare? The POOR, living on foodstamps and subsidized housing...ISN'T paying a cent for healthcare...we are.

It comes down to cost...CAN society afford to cover everyone, many for free, when it costs over $1000 a month per person?
Although a little blunt I believe you have captured the problem quite well. Now for the forum, how do we constructively address it.

autumnspring
03-09-2017, 01:48 PM
Bye Bye Obammacare, Good riddance!! My healthcare went from $750 a month to $1300 a month...I don't want to provide healthcare for the lazy!!

The problem cannot be solved because we want care but want someone else to pay for it.

There is so much information out there but it always comes from someone with a vested interest.

We refuse to deny medical care to anyone whether they are a citizen or not, whether they have insurance or not, whether they can prove the ability to pay or not. You only need insurance if you have assets to protect. Thus, if you have nothing no atty will go after you because even if he/she wins there is nothing to collect.

Our system is simply crazy. I was covered by AETNA when we first moved to the villages. The cost for two of us was 12,000 per year for two years till we could get onto medicare. I had considered self insuring it but..............
I spent four days in the villages hospital. The bill was 50,000. Aetna paid the bill in full at 20,000. If, I did not have insurance it would have cost me 50.000. As it was insurance the bill was paid for 20,000.
If, they would have billed me the 20,000 that AETNA would pay them, self insuring would be a viable option. Like any other business, those who pay also pay for those who do not pay-THEFT OF SERVICE.

With either insurance or the government paying for 80% of the medical care in the US-there is no reason to consider cost or other alternative, less expensive, alternatives.

I've read that lawsuits add 30% to the cost of medical care. We've done nothing to reduce this. Most people think the doctor, the hospital etc have deep pockets. If, a person is injured, even if they caused the injury themselves a jury will likely give them a huge reward. The atty and the accused know this so they will usually settle rather than go though a trial. Those awards are added into the high cost we pay for medical care.

The answer?????????????????????
For lawsuits-perhaps, a blind review by other doctors would work? Preventing huge awards because the injured party was young, personable, or reminded a juror of themselves or a family member.

For those that are irresponsible and do not have the ability to pay, WE WON'T BUT PERHAPS WE SHOULD SIMPLY DENY CARE.

Don Baldwin
03-09-2017, 02:32 PM
The problem cannot be solved because we want care but want someone else to pay for it.

There is so much information out there but it always comes from someone with a vested interest.

We refuse to deny medical care to anyone whether they are a citizen or not, whether they have insurance or not, whether they can prove the ability to pay or not. You only need insurance if you have assets to protect. Thus, if you have nothing no atty will go after you because even if he/she wins there is nothing to collect.

Our system is simply crazy. I was covered by AETNA when we first moved to the villages. The cost for two of us was 12,000 per year for two years till we could get onto medicare. I had considered self insuring it but..............
I spent four days in the villages hospital. The bill was 50,000. Aetna paid the bill in full at 20,000. If, I did not have insurance it would have cost me 50.000. As it was insurance the bill was paid for 20,000.
If, they would have billed me the 20,000 that AETNA would pay them, self insuring would be a viable option. Like any other business, those who pay also pay for those who do not pay-THEFT OF SERVICE.

With either insurance or the government paying for 80% of the medical care in the US-there is no reason to consider cost or other alternative, less expensive, alternatives.

I've read that lawsuits add 30% to the cost of medical care. We've done nothing to reduce this. Most people think the doctor, the hospital etc have deep pockets. If, a person is injured, even if they caused the injury themselves a jury will likely give them a huge reward. The atty and the accused know this so they will usually settle rather than go though a trial. Those awards are added into the high cost we pay for medical care.

The answer?????????????????????
For lawsuits-perhaps, a blind review by other doctors would work? Preventing huge awards because the injured party was young, personable, or reminded a juror of themselves or a family member.

For those that are irresponsible and do not have the ability to pay, WE WON'T BUT PERHAPS WE SHOULD SIMPLY DENY CARE.

Sue...we've disagreed in the past..but you're spot on.

Now...how are you going to break the news to the minorities? Half of them will receive no care. Medicaid goes away.

It MUST be done. We can't afford to give EVERYONE $10,000 a year in "free" healthcare insurance.

dillywho
03-09-2017, 02:40 PM
Sue...we've disagreed in the past..but you're spot on.

Now...how are you going to break the news to the minorities? Half of them will receive no care. Medicaid goes away.

It MUST be done. We can't afford to give EVERYONE $10,000 a year in "free" healthcare insurance.

But that is exactly what Obamacare expects us to do.

Much complaining and gnashing of teeth occurs about the long waits at ER's across the country. When I asked them at TVRH why they could not just send the actual non-emergency patients via the shuttle or tell them to go over to The Villages Urgent Care, they said that it is because they have to treat patients regardless of whether they pay; they cannot be refused treatment at the ER. Urgent Care facilities can and do.

ColdNoMore
03-09-2017, 05:21 PM
I've read that lawsuits add 30% to the cost of medical care. We've done nothing to reduce this. Most people think the doctor, the hospital etc have deep pockets. If, a person is injured, even if they caused the injury themselves a jury will likely give them a huge reward. The atty and the accused know this so they will usually settle rather than go though a trial. Those awards are added into the high cost we pay for medical care.


AHA, I think I've found the reason you are almost always wrong.

You need different reading sources (either that, or like Chump...you just like to lie purposely). :oops:

Medical Malpractice: Myths and Realities - True Cost of Health Care (http://truecostofhealthcare.net/malpractice/)


In fact, the total amount spent in the US for medical malpractice (including the amount spent by hospitals as well as legal costs) was estimated to be about $10 billion in 2010.

We can assume it’s less than that now. But even if it’s the same amount, $10 billion is only about 1/3rd of one percent of the $3 trillion total spent on health care in the US in 2013. That’s hardly a huge factor.

You probably read this and being not-too-bright, math challenged and a right-wing extremist....thought that it meant 30% instead of .33% . :ohdear:


And on the 'defensive medicine' side...

That brings us to the subject of defensive medicine. As I’ve shown, the direct cost of medical malpractice is a negligible fraction of overall health care costs in the US. Many have countered that fact by saying that doctors are so terrified of being sued they’ll often order batteries of unnecessary tests on patients and make unnecessary referrals in order to avoid lawsuits. It’s these unnecessary tests that drive up our health care costs, not the direct cost of medical malpractice.

This is an interesting argument, and one that’s hard to prove either way.

After all, what do we really mean when we say a test was unnecessary and why do doctors order such tests? It’s safe to say that no doctor has ever been sued simply for not ordering a test that a patient wanted. Doctors can get sued for not ordering tests that would have detected a real problem, but that’s because that really is malpractice.


I encourage you to read the whole article so as to try and educate yourself...and quit passing on lies. :thumbup:

PS...no charge for the education. :D


Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:

ColdNoMore
03-09-2017, 05:54 PM
But that is exactly what Obamacare expects us to do.

Much complaining and gnashing of teeth occurs about the long waits at ER's across the country. When I asked them at TVRH why they could not just send the actual non-emergency patients via the shuttle or tell them to go over to The Villages Urgent Care, they said that it is because they have to treat patients regardless of whether they pay; they cannot be refused treatment at the ER. Urgent Care facilities can and do.

Not always true...in regards to 'non-emergency' situations.

It might be their company policy, but like so many who believe that by law an ER has to treat anyone, regardless of condition...that is simply false.

It depends on whether they meet the definition of 'private' or 'public' hospital.

If they are a public hospital, the requirements under The Emergency Medical and Treatment Labor Act (EMTLA) are more stringent regarding turning away patients...but if they are private

Can Hospitals Turn Away Patients? (http://law.freeadvice.com/malpractice_law/hospital_malpractice/hospital-patients.htm)

Privately-owned hospitals may turn away patients in a non-emergency, but public hospitals cannot refuse care. Public hospitals, funded by taxpayer dollars, are held to a different standard than privately owned for-profit hospitals. This means that a public hospital is the best option for those without health insurance or the means to pay for care.


Difference Between Private Hospitals and Public Hospitals (http://www.differencebetween.com/difference-between-private-hospitals-and-vs-public-hospitals/)

Technically speaking, the difference between private hospitals and public hospitals lies with the governance of the hospital. The services provided in a private and a public hospital are more or less the same.

While I admit that I don't know if TVRH is legally considered a public or private hospital, my guess is that even though it is owned by a corporation...it is considered legally 'public' under EMTLA.

Which would make the statement of the person you talked to...correct.

If it is considered a 'private' hospital however, they would be wrong... from a legal perspective.

dirtbanker
03-09-2017, 06:17 PM
Anyone else notice some queefing in here??

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Shimpy
03-09-2017, 06:58 PM
If Obama care is so great, why did congress opp out of being included in it?

ColdNoMore
03-09-2017, 07:14 PM
If Obama care is so great, why did congress opp out of being included in it?

You didn't really just say that...did you? :oops:

If you already had healthcare (that met the minimum requirements)...there was no reason to change it.

Which was the vast majority of people.

Please go do a little research regarding people who had healthcare before ACA...and why they didn't have to go to 'Obamacare' either. :ohdear:


Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:

Rosie1950
03-09-2017, 07:29 PM
One thing that always bugged me here in Fl. when I managed a department for a major corp. here in Lady Lake. I had 12 young ladies working for me. My company offered medical insurance to full time employees at a very reasonable rate of 24.00 weekly. You would be surprised at how many of the SINGLE ladies would NOT sign up for the insurance. They paid the FINE!. NOW here's what KILLED me, they would become PREGNANT, go to a woman's health clinic, then get on STATE INSURANCE!

THIS BUGGED THE CRAP OUT OF ME. WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DID ALL OF US HAVE TO PAY FOR THEIR SORRY ASSES TO HAVE A BABY, WHEN THEY WERE ENTITLED TO AFFORDABLE INSURANCE FROM THEIR EMPLOYER?

DON'T YOU THINK THOSE LAWS NEED TO CHANGE?

In the years that the ACA was in effect my insurance at work went up only 1 year, and it was only a 10.00 a week increase the rates stayed pretty steady, so I would have to say that it did work for our company, the way it was promised. Before the ACA my insurance would increase by 20.00 or more weekly. I worked for this company for many years so I know how this was going up year after year.

Don Baldwin
03-09-2017, 07:41 PM
One thing that always bugged me here in Fl. when I managed a department for a major corp. here in Lady Lake. I had 12 young ladies working for me. My company offered medical insurance to full time employees at a very reasonable rate of 24.00 weekly. You would be surprised at how many of the SINGLE ladies would NOT sign up for the insurance. They paid the FINE!. NOW here's what KILLED me, they would become PREGNANT, go to a woman's health clinic, then get on STATE INSURANCE!

THIS BUGGED THE CRAP OUT OF ME. WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DID ALL OF US HAVE TO PAY FOR THEIR SORRY ASSES TO HAVE A BABY, WHEN THEY WERE ENTITLED TO AFFORDABLE INSURANCE FROM THEIR EMPLOYER?

DON'T YOU THINK THOSE LAWS NEED TO CHANGE?

In the years that the ACA was in effect my insurance at work went up only 1 year, and it was only a 10.00 a week increase the rates stayed pretty steady, so I would have to say that it did work for our company, the way it was promised. Before the ACA my insurance would increase by 20.00 or more weekly. I worked for this company for many years so I know how this was going up year after year.

We pay because they're women...NEVER held accountable...always bailed out....never blamed.

ColdNoMore
03-09-2017, 08:26 PM
We pay because they're women...NEVER held accountable...always bailed out....never blamed.

Do you really have to be a flaming A$$HOLE...ALL of the time?

Don Baldwin
03-09-2017, 09:11 PM
Do you really have to be a flaming A$$HOLE...ALL of the time?

This: "We pay because they're women...NEVER held accountable...always bailed out....never blamed."

Is being a "flaming as$hole"?

It's true...WHEN are women held accountable? The truth HURTS...yes it does. Don't expect me to go along with your delusion.

What were YOU better at than ANY man? Nothing. You're not an equal to men. Stop lying to yourself. How many programs are there JUST for women who need help? Why are there so many? Because WOMEN...ALWAYS...need help. They also NEED quotas because people don't hire them because they're NOT as good as white men in most fields.

They pop out a kid they shouldn't have and they have automatic welfare. Have enough kids and you can get up to $60,000 a year in benefits. Free house, free food, free phone, healthcare, education.

No wonder the young of today don't want to work, they see how easy it is NOT to work.

Go to the welfare office...minority women and whites with black kids. Go down there...it should be close to MLK Blvd to make it "convenient" for them. Be sure to stay around, watch how the neighborhood changes at night. Socialize with them...don't be afraid. IF you get back in one piece...you can tell us about it.

Yes...you suckered me in again. Wasted time for you...but not for others. If I've convinced just one that the nation MUST go back to the ways of the 50s. White men doing what they do best...creating and improving western civilization.

ColdNoMore
03-09-2017, 10:10 PM
This: "We pay because they're women...NEVER held accountable...always bailed out....never blamed."

Is being a "flaming as$hole"?

It's true...WHEN are women held accountable? The truth HURTS...yes it does. Don't expect me to go along with your delusion.

What were YOU better at than ANY man? Nothing. You're not an equal to men. Stop lying to yourself. How many programs are there JUST for women who need help? Why are there so many? Because WOMEN...ALWAYS...need help. They also NEED quotas because people don't hire them because they're NOT as good as white men in most fields.

They pop out a kid they shouldn't have and they have automatic welfare. Have enough kids and you can get up to $60,000 a year in benefits. Free house, free food, free phone, healthcare, education.

No wonder the young of today don't want to work, they see how easy it is NOT to work.

Go to the welfare office...minority women and whites with black kids. Go down there...it should be close to MLK Blvd to make it "convenient" for them. Be sure to stay around, watch how the neighborhood changes at night. Socialize with them...don't be afraid. IF you get back in one piece...you can tell us about it.

Yes...you suckered me in again. Wasted time for you...but not for others. If I've convinced just one that the nation MUST go back to the ways of the 50s. White men doing what they do best...creating and improving western civilization.

I can't even fathom, going through life being as petrified of minorities and women...as you are.

It must be a living he11 for you.

Although I'm happy being three times the man you are, just the fact we share the same gender and skin color (supposedly you are a white male)...makes my skin crawl. :wave:

Don Baldwin
03-09-2017, 10:31 PM
I can't even fathom, going through life being as petrified of minorities and women...as you are.

It must be a living he11 for you.

Although I'm happy being three times the man you are, just the fact we share the same gender and skin color (supposedly you are a white male)...makes my skin crawl. :wave:

There you go again...confusing disgust and loathsomeness with fear. Fear is what you have, it's why you want white men squashed. You get the government to do it for you. Can't beat us on a level playing field, you have to tip it in your favor. You have to have the standards lowered. You have to have quotas. You're NOTHING pretending to be something and crying to mommy and daddy government to help you.

WHAT can women do that men can't? Give birth? Then go DO IT...SAVE your race. Quit pretending you have a "career", and get to having kids.

dirtbanker
03-09-2017, 10:40 PM
Looks like Don is standing on (unt's neck again...

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wjboyer1
03-10-2017, 12:33 AM
If we had single payer health insurance like in canada and britain, there would be no argument on this site. A canadian justly said that he doesn't mind paying more taxes because a person in a different part of the country needs life saving surgery.....he says that it is just plain concern and empathy for his fellow man. It looks like here in the u.s. You really don't care about your neighbor, or the person across the country that needs medical help.....you only think that you are being taken advantage of by those who "don't deserve" to be healthy, or to live. I think that collectively, you should be ashamed of yourselves.

Don Baldwin
03-10-2017, 06:07 AM
If we had single payer health insurance like in canada and britain, there would be no argument on this site. A canadian justly said that he doesn't mind paying more taxes because a person in a different part of the country needs life saving surgery.....he says that it is just plain concern and empathy for his fellow man. It looks like here in the u.s. You really don't care about your neighbor, or the person across the country that needs medical help.....you only think that you are being taken advantage of by those who "don't deserve" to be healthy, or to live. I think that collectively, you should be ashamed of yourselves.

Canada and the other "1st world European countries" who provide "free" healthcare...don't have the minority problem we have. They don't have a 49% white population...they don't have half their population receiving some form of "welfare" from the government.

If I'm supporting you because you refuse to support yourself...WHY should I pay the "fix you", when all you'll do is cost me more when you're well again? Why should we pay for people who are breeding us out? Why should we pay people to destroy our country?

Canadians and the other 1st world countries are paying for other humans, white people's, healthcare...not another species like we're doing.

They're NOT us.

ColdNoMore
03-10-2017, 06:26 AM
Looks like Don is standing on (unt's neck again...



:1rotfl:


Says Racist Boy Baldwin's...'Mini-Me.' :oops:




Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:

MDLNB
03-10-2017, 07:25 AM
If we had single payer health insurance like in canada and britain, there would be no argument on this site. A canadian justly said that he doesn't mind paying more taxes because a person in a different part of the country needs life saving surgery.....he says that it is just plain concern and empathy for his fellow man. It looks like here in the u.s. You really don't care about your neighbor, or the person across the country that needs medical help.....you only think that you are being taken advantage of by those who "don't deserve" to be healthy, or to live. I think that collectively, you should be ashamed of yourselves.

Sure, good old Canada's health care. That's why my wife's relatives come to the U.S. for medical treatment. That's why her sister died because she could not get cancer treatment early enough. That's why you have to pay supplemental private insurance if you wish to have quality service and that is why they have such high taxes.

Some folks say they don't mind paying higher taxes so others can have life saving care? B.S.! That is the liberal dream, only they want someone else to pay for it.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence(in this case BORDER).

Your comment is born of ignorance of truth and facts.

dave harris
03-10-2017, 07:42 AM
Although a little blunt I believe you have captured the problem quite well. Now for the forum, how do we constructively address it.

Tell me oh wise one, what would you do. Sounds like the repubs want a "death panel", weren't the repub's railing about a "death panel" with Obamacare?

dave harris
03-10-2017, 07:50 AM
Sure, good old Canada's health care. That's why my wife's relatives come to the U.S. for medical treatment. That's why her sister died because she could not get cancer treatment early enough. That's why you have to pay supplemental private insurance if you wish to have quality service and that is why they have such high taxes.

Some folks say they don't mind paying higher taxes so others can have life saving care? B.S.! That is the liberal dream, only they want someone else to pay for it.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence(in this case BORDER).

Your comment is born of ignorance of truth and facts.

So, I guess you would rather not have any health care at all. Do you have auto insurance, your paying more in your premiums for people who have accidents, maybe you should cancel your's. I have relatives in Canada and they love their health insurance, is it perfect, no, like you.

dave harris
03-10-2017, 07:54 AM
We pay because they're women...NEVER held accountable...always bailed out....never blamed.

Typical redneck, blame all woman, you must hate your mother, did she discipline and you cried.

dirtbanker
03-10-2017, 07:57 AM
:1rotfl:


Says Racist Boy Baldwin's...'Mini-Me.'

Go ahead lash out at me with accusations for acknowledging Don beats you like an old rug, time after time.
Your an ugly woman (at least inside) that claims not to be a racist (although you slipped when you inferred people that did not speak good English were undocumented), but you have yet won an argument with the guy.

He has acknowledged being a racist...you call others on here racists because they won't debate racial issues with Don...simply put that makes you are a racist for not trying hard enough to dispute his claims!





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dirtbanker
03-10-2017, 08:09 AM
So, I guess you would rather not have any health care at all. Do you have auto insurance, your paying more in your premiums for people who have accidents, maybe you should cancel your's. I have relatives in Canada and they love their health insurance, is it perfect, no, like you.

Care to explain why insurance companies give a discount on auto insurance for not having accidents and not getting tickets...Idiot!

If you like Canada's socialized health care so much...move there!

I think it is terrible, a couple I have known for years has a daughter that had a brain tumor. They (socialized healthcare) scheduled the girl for treatment 18 months later and told them that was expedited service...that couple quickly moved thier family and their business to Ohio.



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Don Baldwin
03-10-2017, 08:30 AM
Tell me oh wise one, what would you do. Sounds like the repubs want a "death panel", weren't the repub's railing about a "death panel" with Obamacare?

Gotta have them. Can't give EVERYONE unlimited care. We're bankrupt already...you just don't realize it. They owe $20 trillion...$20,000,000,000,000...borrow over $1 trillion...$1,000,000,000,000, and pay over $500 billion...$500,000,000,000 every year in interest. WHY do you think your CD only pays 1%? They keep the interest rates artificially low...so they can make the "minimum" payment. They NEVER pay off the debt, they roll it over into new debt.

YES..."death panels" ARE coming. You'll know when the movies and TV start getting us used to the idea. Themes like "grandma isn't getting any better and she's so unhappy, in so much pain...let's fight for her RIGHT to a dignified death".

Anything else hastens our demise. The CERTAIN demise of the country becoming a minority majority. Whites have gone from 90% in the 50s...to 49% this year. As our numbers have dropped...the nation has dropped...from #1 to #25.

Racial diversity destroys...always.

So, I guess you would rather not have any health care at all. Do you have auto insurance, your paying more in your premiums for people who have accidents, maybe you should cancel your's. I have relatives in Canada and they love their health insurance, is it perfect, no, like you.

Not really...they pay more or they are dropped. A company won't WILLINGLY lose money on ANY customer. The GOVERNMENT forces them to. If you drive like sh!t...you pay more. Why isn't healthcare the same? You treat your body like sh!t, you're unfortunately born with a costly condition, you should pay for it. If you don't pay for car insurance, you self insure...or...you're supposed to not drive. With healthcare...you either pay your "fair share" based on what you'll use, of take care of it on your own.

The OTHER difference is...MOST people don't ever "cash in" on their car insurance policy. Most people don't cost the insurance company the whole $1 million of coverage. Whereas HEALTH insurance usually DOES get "cashed in" as in most people WILL use on average $1 million in healthcare costs. MOST happening in the LAST year of life...in a fruitless effort to give someone a few extra months. THAT is where "death panels" MUST come in.

Typical redneck, blame all woman, you must hate your mother, did she discipline and you cried.

Don't blame them ALL...just most. Don't blame ALL the minorities...just most.

Why would knowing my mother wasn't my fathers intellectual or physical equal mean I hate her? Do you HATE one of your children because they may be "inferior" to their other siblings?

Ah Davi...should have known.

wjboyer1
03-10-2017, 08:35 AM
sure, good old canada's health care. That's why my wife's relatives come to the u.s. For medical treatment. That's why her sister died because she could not get cancer treatment early enough. That's why you have to pay supplemental private insurance if you wish to have quality service and that is why they have such high taxes.

Some folks say they don't mind paying higher taxes so others can have life saving care? B.s.! That is the liberal dream, only they want someone else to pay for it.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence(in this case border).

Your comment is born of ignorance of truth and facts.

i am from canada, my relatives have had wonderful care there, and i will ask you how long it takes to get an appointment here in the us with a specialist.....especially "out of your network". You evidently don't understand insurance and the concept of group protection. It is like the fire department: You pay taxes for their service(most areas) and if your house catches fire they come, but you don't complain about the other guy's house catching fire because you pay "too much" in taxes....

Don Baldwin
03-10-2017, 09:01 AM
i am from canada, my relatives have had wonderful care there, and i will ask you how long it takes to get an appointment here in the us with a specialist.....especially "out of your network". You evidently don't understand insurance and the concept of group protection. It is like the fire department: You pay taxes for their service(most areas) and if your house catches fire they come, but you don't complain about the other guy's house catching fire because you pay "too much" in taxes....

Canada doesn't have the minority or poverty problems we have here. Canada is mostly white and Asian in the west. They don't have the Hispanic/black problem we have here. Canada has only 3% blacks...1% Hispanics...Canada is still 90% white...THAT is why Canada is a nice place. MOST of the people in Canada are not on welfare...MOST contribute into the system...not taking it out like here in the US. Canada is what the US COULD be if we didn't have a minority majority.

Demographics of Canada - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Canada#Ethnicity)

EVERYBODY MUST pay their fair share too. Should YOU pay $2000 a year and your neighbor only pays $1000? If your neighbor lets everything go and THEN files a claim to get it all fixed...is that fair to you who spent to keep things maintained all along?

Should EVERYONE get "free" insurance? A "free" $1 million in healthcare? No matter the circumstances? No matter how costly? How futile?

wjboyer1
03-10-2017, 09:50 AM
Canada doesn't have the minority or poverty problems we have here. Canada is mostly white and Asian in the west. They don't have the Hispanic/black problem we have here. Canada has only 3% blacks...1% Hispanics...Canada is still 90% white...THAT is why Canada is a nice place. MOST of the people in Canada are not on welfare...MOST contribute into the system...not taking it out like here in the US. Canada is what the US COULD be if we didn't have a minority majority.

Demographics of Canada - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Canada#Ethnicity)

EVERYBODY MUST pay their fair share too. Should YOU pay $2000 a year and your neighbor only pays $1000? If your neighbor lets everything go and THEN files a claim to get it all fixed...is that fair to you who spent to keep things maintained all along?

Should EVERYONE get "free" insurance? A "free" $1 million in healthcare? No matter the circumstances? No matter how costly? How futile?

Your racism and ignorance is very apparent. The topic is health insurance and NOT demographics. All Canadians, no matter their race get health care. Comparing ethnicity is just avoiding the subject. Besides, more US whites are on welfare, get food stamps, and other social services than any other ethnic group in the US.

Don Baldwin
03-10-2017, 10:26 AM
Your racism and ignorance is very apparent. The topic is health insurance and NOT demographics. All Canadians, no matter their race get health care. Comparing ethnicity is just avoiding the subject. Besides, more US whites are on welfare, get food stamps, and other social services than any other ethnic group in the US.

There is no "ignorance" on my part at all...the ignorance is all yours young lady.

90% of Canadians are white...they have jobs and they contribute EQUALLY to the tax system that pays for healthcare for all...agreed? Or do you deny the census numbers? The welfare numbers? Go look for yourself...I'll wait.

In America...49% are white and the REST are minorities...in America half the population TAKES from the government, 50 million are on food stamps, millions are in public housing, section 8 housing. Our "poor" population is larger than Canada's total population of 35 million. We have states with almost that kind of population.

As the WHITE population declines...EVERYTHING declines with it. Health, safety, happiness...compare the villages, 99% white...to ANYWHERE that is "diverse".

WHITES do NOT receive more welfare benefits than anyone else. That is a LIE. Hispanics are counted as WHITE. Go down to the welfare office...today...if you're afraid to go in because of the neighborhood...park and watch WHO goes in...minority women...they're ALL minority women...with a sprinkling of white girls with black kids.

You are being fooled...we are NOT the same. We're NOT the same species. We're as different as wolves and your cockapoo. We don't belong together any more than we should be living with any of the other apes. They are apes that can speak...the "missing link". Uncomfortable...but true nonetheless.

The proof is EVERYWHERE. Where ARE they EVER successful? Where? Name ONE place YOU would move to that is a majority black. A place you'd want your granddaughter to live. There are NONE...not one.

We are NOT the same.

wjboyer1
03-10-2017, 10:44 AM
There is no "ignorance" on my part at all...the ignorance is all yours young lady.

90% of Canadians are white...they have jobs and they contribute EQUALLY to the tax system that pays for healthcare for all...agreed? Or do you deny the census numbers? The welfare numbers? Go look for yourself...I'll wait.

In America...49% are white and the REST are minorities...in America half the population TAKES from the government, 50 million are on food stamps, millions are in public housing, section 8 housing. Our "poor" population is larger than Canada's total population of 35 million. We have states with almost that kind of population.

As the WHITE population declines...EVERYTHING declines with it. Health, safety, happiness...compare the villages, 99% white...to ANYWHERE that is "diverse".

WHITES do NOT receive more welfare benefits than anyone else. That is a LIE. Hispanics are counted as WHITE. Go down to the welfare office...today...if you're afraid to go in because of the neighborhood...park and watch WHO goes in...minority women...they're ALL minority women...with a sprinkling of white girls with black kids.

You are being fooled...we are NOT the same. We're NOT the same species. We're as different as wolves and your cockapoo. We don't belong together any more than we should be living with any of the other apes. They are apes that can speak...the "missing link". Uncomfortable...but true nonetheless.

The proof is EVERYWHERE. Where ARE they EVER successful? Where? Name ONE place YOU would move to that is a majority black. A place you'd want your granddaughter to live. There are NONE...not one.

We are NOT the same.

We all bleed red blood, we are human......you are just plain racist and as such you have no credibility with this discussion regarding healthcare.

dillywho
03-10-2017, 11:51 AM
This: "We pay because they're women...NEVER held accountable...always bailed out....never blamed."

Is being a "flaming as$hole"?

It's true...WHEN are women held accountable? The truth HURTS...yes it does. Don't expect me to go along with your delusion.

What were YOU better at than ANY man? Nothing. You're not an equal to men. Stop lying to yourself. How many programs are there JUST for women who need help? Why are there so many? Because WOMEN...ALWAYS...need help. They also NEED quotas because people don't hire them because they're NOT as good as white men in most fields.

They pop out a kid they shouldn't have and they have automatic welfare. Have enough kids and you can get up to $60,000 a year in benefits. Free house, free food, free phone, healthcare, education.

No wonder the young of today don't want to work, they see how easy it is NOT to work.

Go to the welfare office...minority women and whites with black kids. Go down there...it should be close to MLK Blvd to make it "convenient" for them. Be sure to stay around, watch how the neighborhood changes at night. Socialize with them...don't be afraid. IF you get back in one piece...you can tell us about it.

Yes...you suckered me in again. Wasted time for you...but not for others. If I've convinced just one that the nation MUST go back to the ways of the 50s. White men doing what they do best...creating and improving western civilization.

Guess all those women got pregnant by immaculate conception, did they? And you talk about accountability? Hello.

While we're at it, why should women pay for men's Viagra that's covered by some insurance policies? Or do you consider that as "women being held accountable"?

tcxr750
03-10-2017, 01:10 PM
Let's not ignore the large Russian and Chinese population that pockets portions of the US that are getting welfare and SS benefits. Now that the US has become a melting pot, we just need a government that can function in a way that Deals with our problems instead of creating them.

Don Baldwin
03-10-2017, 02:02 PM
We all bleed red blood, we are human......you are just plain racist and as such you have no credibility with this discussion regarding healthcare.

No...actually we're not...that's the point that is lost on you. Genetically we are different species. Squirrels bleed red too...are you a squirrel?

Guess all those women got pregnant by immaculate conception, did they? And you talk about accountability? Hello.

While we're at it, why should women pay for men's Viagra that's covered by some insurance policies? Or do you consider that as "women being held accountable"?

They got pregnant by spreading their legs. Keep them closed. Or do you have NO self control?

Why do men pay for your "woman only" problems and medications?

Let's not ignore the large Russian and Chinese population that pockets portions of the US that are getting welfare and SS benefits. Now that the US has become a melting pot, we just need a government that can function in a way that Deals with our problems instead of creating them.

Yes...lets do it...kick out the illegals AND their illegal anchor babies...about 50 million of them. Norplant while on welfare. Drug tests for welfare recipients and if found positive, sterilization.

Rosie1950
03-10-2017, 04:42 PM
Omg there is something wrong with you people!

Did you even read the original post?

Evidently there is something wrong with our laws!

If you're employer can provide you with affordable health care, and you decide not to sign up and pay the fine, why should you be entitled to welfare?

That was the question, you people are as stupid as the president!

And for all you new comers to florida our dear governor was involved in the biggest medicaid fraude in the history of the us!

His fine was the largest in history also! But you elephants are sooooo proud!

wjboyer1
03-10-2017, 05:38 PM
No...actually we're not...that's the point that is lost on you. Genetically we are different species. Squirrels bleed red too...are you a squirrel?





They got pregnant by spreading their legs. Keep them closed. Or do you have NO self control?

Why do men pay for your "woman only" problems and medications?



Yes...lets do it...kick out the illegals AND their illegal anchor babies...about 50 million of them. Norplant while on welfare. Drug tests for welfare recipients and if found positive, sterilization.

This racist rant does not address the medical insurance discussion. It only proves that there are people that can only think in one dimension, and science has proven that most of those kinds of people have a family tree with only one branch.

Cedwards38
03-10-2017, 07:48 PM
Why do men pay for your "woman only" problems and medications? you ask.

Well, I think you'll find that the health insurance rates charged for men are higher than for women for very good reasons. Women have a longer life expectancy, lower rate of heart disease and cancer, typically practice a healthier lifestyle as far as exercise and diet, engage in far fewer dangerous hobbies, and pay more attention to their health and go see their doctor more often.

So, tell me, why should women pay for men only problems and medications?

Cedwards38
03-10-2017, 07:52 PM
The GOP answer to health care:

Don Baldwin
03-10-2017, 08:11 PM
This racist rant does not address the medical insurance discussion. It only proves that there are people that can only think in one dimension, and science has proven that most of those kinds of people have a family tree with only one branch.

Yes...the HUMAN branch.

The minorities don't pay their fair share, they're subsidized. They use $12,000 a year in healthcare costs yet contribute only $1000. That's a problem...a BIG problem. An unsustainable problem.

Why do men pay for your "woman only" problems and medications? you ask.

Well, I think you'll find that the health insurance rates charged for men are higher than for women for very good reasons. Women have a longer life expectancy, lower rate of heart disease and cancer, typically practice a healthier lifestyle as far as exercise and diet, engage in far fewer dangerous hobbies, and pay more attention to their health and go see their doctor more often.

So, tell me, why should women pay for men only problems and medications?

Because that is YOUR argument...that everyone should pay the same irregardless of actual cost.

Are you changing your position now and you DON'T want to subsidize others any more?

We can't afford to give everyone a high level of healthcare. There are TOO MANY in need and not enough "providers". At least 50 million in need of free healthcare. We're giving away $600,000,000,000 worth of healthcare coverage each year. And borrowing to do it.

Cedwards38
03-11-2017, 08:01 AM
Yes...the HUMAN branch.

The minorities don't pay their fair share, they're subsidized. They use $12,000 a year in healthcare costs yet contribute only $1000. That's a problem...a BIG problem. An unsustainable problem.



Because that is YOUR argument...that everyone should pay the same irregardless of actual cost.

Are you changing your position now and you DON'T want to subsidize others any more?

We can't afford to give everyone a high level of healthcare. There are TOO MANY in need and not enough "providers". At least 50 million in need of free healthcare. We're giving away $600,000,000,000 worth of healthcare coverage each year. And borrowing to do it.

No. I'm pointing out the selfish hypocrisy of your statement. I think most people got that.

dirtbanker
03-11-2017, 08:07 AM
No. I'm pointing out the selfish hypocrisy of your statement. I think most people got that.
I missed it...are you saying you disagree with Don's math?

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Don Baldwin
03-11-2017, 08:25 AM
No. I'm pointing out the selfish hypocrisy of your statement. I think most people got that.

I missed it...are you saying you disagree with Don's math?

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She's saying I'm a selfish a$shole because I don't think I should be supporting almost half the population in one form or another.

She ignores the math. Women do that...they want and want...with no concept of cost and what it takes to make it happen. Because MEN take care of all that...MEN run things, make them work...women mostly shuffle papers.

wjboyer1
03-11-2017, 12:43 PM
He wrote on Twitter early this Saturday, “We are making great progress with healthcare. ObamaCare is imploding and will only get worse. Republicans coming together to get job done!”


No, no, and no.

Republicans are not coming together to “get the job done” of “making great progress with healthcare.” Actually, what’s happening is that a powerful small group of Republican leaders are working feverishly to remove as many safeguards as possible from the healthcare system as quickly as possible.

Subsidies to ensure that poor people don’t die a preventable death due to lack of healthcare? Out the window! After all, these “coming together Republicans” have to protect the interests of their rich buddies before those of the poor, right?

With the Republican healthcare plan including massive tax cuts for the wealthy at the expense of the subsidized health care programs that serve the poor of the United States, it can hardly be said, Mr. President, that you’re making “great progress with healthcare.”

Don Baldwin
03-11-2017, 10:26 PM
He wrote on Twitter early this Saturday, “We are making great progress with healthcare. ObamaCare is imploding and will only get worse. Republicans coming together to get job done!”


No, no, and no.

Republicans are not coming together to “get the job done” of “making great progress with healthcare.” Actually, what’s happening is that a powerful small group of Republican leaders are working feverishly to remove as many safeguards as possible from the healthcare system as quickly as possible.

Subsidies to ensure that poor people don’t die a preventable death due to lack of healthcare? Out the window! After all, these “coming together Republicans” have to protect the interests of their rich buddies before those of the poor, right?

With the Republican healthcare plan including massive tax cuts for the wealthy at the expense of the subsidized health care programs that serve the poor of the United States, it can hardly be said, Mr. President, that you’re making “great progress with healthcare.”

You CANNOT provide $1000 a month equivalent healthcare to everyone when almost half the population don't contribute.

Labor Force Participation : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (https://www.bls.gov/bls/cps_fact_sheets/lfp_mock.htm)

Almost half the population relies on the other half. You DON'T see that in other 1st world countries that have universal healthcare...in those countries you have up to 90% of the population being productive and contributing.

It works with whites and white countries...it doesn't work with brown people and brown countries. It just doesn't...never has.

wjboyer1
03-12-2017, 12:24 AM
You CANNOT provide $1000 a month equivalent healthcare to everyone when almost half the population don't contribute.

Labor Force Participation : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (https://www.bls.gov/bls/cps_fact_sheets/lfp_mock.htm)

Almost half the population relies on the other half. You DON'T see that in other 1st world countries that have universal healthcare...in those countries you have up to 90% of the population being productive and contributing.

It works with whites and white countries...it doesn't work with brown people and brown countries. It just doesn't...never has.

You never cease in blaming non-whites for everything and the cause of problems, and the failure of solutions....don't you ever quit? Money is green, health care is needed by all of us, and universal health care has been shown to be successful in MANY countries and the US has resisted it because the pharmaceutical companies have "bought" Congress.....race has NOTHING TO DO WITH IT....only in your weak and perverted mind (and I am being generous with that statement giving you some sort of mind)

Don Baldwin
03-12-2017, 05:33 AM
You never cease in blaming non-whites for everything and the cause of problems, and the failure of solutions....don't you ever quit? Money is green, health care is needed by all of us, and universal health care has been shown to be successful in MANY countries and the US has resisted it because the pharmaceutical companies have "bought" Congress.....race has NOTHING TO DO WITH IT....only in your weak and perverted mind (and I am being generous with that statement giving you some sort of mind)

When they ARE to blame...I blame them.

WHITE countries...universal healthcare has been successful in WHITE countries. Show me ANY black/hispanic country with free healthcare for everyone that is successful...just one. The countries you say are successful...are all "white" countries...European, North American, Australia...NONE in Africa, none in S America.

Race has EVERYTHING to do with it...make a list of your "successful universal healthcare countries"...what do they ALL have in common? They're 1st world...and they're a majority WHITE.

I'm correct...YOU refuse to accept the truth...we are NOT the same species. We're HALF minorities now and as their numbers have risen and white numbers fallen...America has gone from #1 to #25.

wjboyer1
03-12-2017, 10:48 AM
When they ARE to blame...I blame them.

WHITE countries...universal healthcare has been successful in WHITE countries. Show me ANY black/hispanic country with free healthcare for everyone that is successful...just one. The countries you say are successful...are all "white" countries...European, North American, Australia...NONE in Africa, none in S America.

Race has EVERYTHING to do with it...make a list of your "successful universal healthcare countries"...what do they ALL have in common? They're 1st world...and they're a majority WHITE.

I'm correct...YOU refuse to accept the truth...we are NOT the same species. We're HALF minorities now and as their numbers have risen and white numbers fallen...America has gone from #1 to #25.

Your racist rant is pathetic.

Country Start Date of Universal Health Care System Type
Click links for more source material on each country’s health care system.
Norway 1912
New Zealand 1938
Japan 1938
Germany 1941
Belgium 1945
United Kingdom 1948
Kuwait 1950
Sweden 1955
Bahrain 1957
Brunei 1958
Canada 1966
Netherlands 1966
Austria 1967
United Arab Emirates 1971
Finland 1972
Slovenia 1972
Denmark 1973
Luxembourg 1973
France 1974
Australia 1975
Ireland 1977
Italy 1978
Portugal 1979
Cyprus 1980
Greece 1983 I
Spain 1986
South Korea 1988
Iceland 1990
Hong Kong 1993
Singapore 1993
Switzerland 1994
Israel 1995

Don Baldwin
03-12-2017, 11:09 AM
Your racist rant is pathetic.

Country Start Date of Universal Health Care System Type
Click links for more source material on each country’s health care system.
Norway 1912
New Zealand 1938
Japan 1938
Germany 1941
Belgium 1945
United Kingdom 1948
Kuwait 1950
Sweden 1955
Bahrain 1957
Brunei 1958
Canada 1966
Netherlands 1966
Austria 1967
United Arab Emirates 1971
Finland 1972
Slovenia 1972
Denmark 1973
Luxembourg 1973
France 1974
Australia 1975
Ireland 1977
Italy 1978
Portugal 1979
Cyprus 1980
Greece 1983 I
Spain 1986
South Korea 1988
Iceland 1990
Hong Kong 1993
Singapore 1993
Switzerland 1994
Israel 1995

Well...where are the S American and African countries? The "brown" countries? Middle Easterners are dark skinned...but they're not BLACK...they're not Negroid.

That list is ALL White and Asian...didn't I say that?

I didn't specifically mention Asian's...You know what I meant, brown being Africa/Hispanic. The Asian countries are ALL "westernized"...very "white" acting.

24 countries on that list are "white".
4 Middle Eastern
4 Asian

I said:
"Race has EVERYTHING to do with it...make a list of your "successful universal healthcare countries"...what do they ALL have in common? They're 1st world...and they're a majority WHITE."

I wasn't wrong. I don't speak unless/until I can back it up. I don't THINK a certain way unless/until I can back it up.

cologal
03-12-2017, 11:48 AM
Bye Bye Obammacare, Good riddance!! My healthcare went from $750 a month to $1300 a month...I don't want to provide healthcare for the lazy!!

Who are the Lazy?

dirtbanker
03-12-2017, 12:20 PM
Who are the Lazy?

Oh come on you know who they are...

The ones that sleep till noon, walk back and forth to the cigarette smoke shelter wearing thier pajamas all day long (can't smoke in federal owned buildings), have developed a sense of entitlement due to never having to work to support thier families or themselves. Have no intentions of ever moving out.

And let's not forget the wackadoodles that live for a certain Wednesday of the month when the funds are transferred to thier account. Now they can live large on someone else's dime, eating out at expensive places like the Bonefish Grill. They have to curb the spending a little as the weeks go by, and then the funds show up again.



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cologal
03-12-2017, 01:04 PM
Oh come on you know who they are...

The ones that sleep till noon, walk back and forth to the cigarette smoke shelter wearing thier pajamas all day long (can't smoke in federal owned buildings), have developed a sense of entitlement due to never having to work to support thier families or themselves. Have no intentions of ever moving out.

And let's not forget the wackadoodles that live for a certain Wednesday of the month when the funds are transferred to thier account. Now they can live large on someone else's dime, eating out at expensive places like the Bonefish Grill. They have to curb the spending a little as the weeks go by, and then the funds show up again.



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There is a problem with your characterization...There will always be but people who game the system! Its human nature. I don't think you can use an EBT card at Bonefish Grill.

As we have discussed before welfare should NOT be provided for LIFE and the Disability Program needs a complete revamping. Whole families live their lifetime on disability.

However, I cannot see people who have lost their jobs for profit margins in the name of productivity gains kicked to the curb, So I agree to pay for them until they can get on their feet! Proudly COPUFF

Don Baldwin
03-12-2017, 01:28 PM
There is a problem with your characterization...There will always be but people who game the system! Its human nature. I don't think you can use an EBT card at Bonefish Grill.

As we have discussed before welfare should NOT be provided for LIFE and the Disability Program needs a complete revamping. Whole families live their lifetime on disability.

However, I cannot see people who have lost their jobs for profit margins in the name of productivity gains kicked to the curb, So I agree to pay for them until they can get on their feet! Proudly COPUFF

WHAT do you do with them? Throw them on the street? THAT will look real good on the news...!!! They have us by the balls...and they know it...we can do NOTHING to "correct" or "discipline" them unless they've broken a serious law.

dillywho
03-12-2017, 02:04 PM
There is a problem with your characterization...There will always be but people who game the system! Its human nature. I don't think you can use an EBT card at Bonefish Grill.

As we have discussed before welfare should NOT be provided for LIFE and the Disability Program needs a complete revamping. Whole families live their lifetime on disability.

However, I cannot see people who have lost their jobs for profit margins in the name of productivity gains kicked to the curb, So I agree to pay for them until they can get on their feet! Proudly COPUFF

:agree:

cologal
03-12-2017, 02:26 PM
WHAT do you do with them? Throw them on the street? THAT will look real good on the news...!!! They have us by the balls...and they know it...we can do NOTHING to "correct" or "discipline" them unless they've broken a serious law.

The idea is to retrain them for work or put them to work in local communities doing community services.

We also shouldn't be providing them with Section 8 housing, free cable TV and a free phone.

Don Baldwin
03-13-2017, 06:11 AM
The idea is to retrain them for work or put them to work in local communities doing community services.

We also shouldn't be providing them with Section 8 housing, free cable TV and a free phone.

"Retrain" them? They never knew how to do anything in the first place. Most are untrainable. What "jobs" there are no jobs in the inner city slums.

"Put them to work"...don't you know...that's SLAVERY...we can't FORCE a minority to do anything. That's why they sit at home, drinking all day, as we support their every need.

Don't you think in the 150 years since they've been "free" people haven't looked at the black part of town and said..."can't we get them to clean this place up"?

dave harris
03-13-2017, 06:21 AM
"Retrain" them? They never knew how to do anything in the first place. Most are untrainable. What "jobs" there are no jobs in the inner city slums.

"Put them to work"...don't you know...that's SLAVERY...we can't FORCE a minority to do anything. That's why they sit at home, drinking all day, as we support their every need.

Don't you think in the 150 years since they've been "free" people haven't looked at the black part of town and said..."can't we get them to clean this place up"?

First and third paragraph, did you ever think as to why this has happened? Second paragraph, they are put to work in some states.

dirtbanker
03-13-2017, 07:10 AM
There is a problem with your characterization...There will always be but people who game the system! Its human nature. I don't think you can use an EBT card at Bonefish Grill.

As we have discussed before welfare should NOT be provided for LIFE and the Disability Program needs a complete revamping. Whole families live their lifetime on disability.

However, I cannot see people who have lost their jobs for profit margins in the name of productivity gains kicked to the curb, So I agree to pay for them until they can get on their feet! Proudly COPUFF

My characterization is based on real life experience, not something someone else told me or some whimsical desire of mine...

I will agree with you there will always be people "gaming the system" it is in THEIR nature (not mine or everyone's nature). Unfortunately it seems those that have it in their nature are out numbering those that do not (52% of this country is receiving benefits). There are over 9 million people living in HUD properties...hardly a success story.
Assisted Housing: National and Local | HUD USER (https://www.huduser.gov/portal/datasets/assthsg.html#2009-2016)

The Wackadoodles do not have an EBT card, they get the SSD funds transferred direct to their bank accounts. If their birthday was in the first 7 days of the month they were born, the funds arrive on the first Wednesday (if their birthday was the 17th of the month the funds arrive on the 3rd Wednesday of the month). Mental health problems are the most common reason they file for SSD. Leading Causes of Disability (http://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/features/top-causes-disability)

"Work or Starve" is the only answer to this epidemic. They have developed a strong sense of entitlement over the years, there will be violence and lives lost when they end the assistance...and it will have to end, as 48% should not have to support the 52% (and growing) forever...

Don Baldwin
03-13-2017, 01:47 PM
My characterization is based on real life experience, not something someone else told me or some whimsical desire of mine...

I will agree with you there will always be people "gaming the system" it is in THEIR nature (not mine or everyone's nature). Unfortunately it seems those that have it in their nature are out numbering those that do not (52% of this country is receiving benefits). There are over 9 million people living in HUD properties...hardly a success story.
Assisted Housing: National and Local | HUD USER (https://www.huduser.gov/portal/datasets/assthsg.html#2009-2016)

The Wackadoodles do not have an EBT card, they get the SSD funds transferred direct to their bank accounts. If their birthday was in the first 7 days of the month they were born, the funds arrive on the first Wednesday (if their birthday was the 17th of the month the funds arrive on the 3rd Wednesday of the month). Mental health problems are the most common reason they file for SSD. Leading Causes of Disability (http://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/features/top-causes-disability)

"Work or Starve" is the only answer to this epidemic. They have developed a strong sense of entitlement over the years, there will be violence and lives lost when they end the assistance...and it will have to end, as 48% should not have to support the 52% (and growing) forever...

But they're black...it's SLAVERY to make them work!

They borrow the welfare money now...but yes, when it stops...there WILL be a major chimpout.

wjboyer1
03-13-2017, 11:28 PM
Not for a minute do I believe it will, but if the Republican's plan results in just as many American citizens being covered and slows the rise of healthcare costs that have been rising for three decades now...then I'm all for it.

What I predict will happen though, is that premiums will actually increase at a greater rate than they have, given that preexisting conditions still have to be covered...but there is now no mandate that everyone has to participate to offset the higher risk pools.

How can they not? :oops:

I also predict that the bigger mess this creates compared to the ACA, will come back to haunt the Repub's...since they now own it. :D

It should be interesting to watch. :popcorn:

Better financial minds than ours agree....66737

wjboyer1
03-14-2017, 05:04 PM
There is no "ignorance" on my part at all...the ignorance is all yours young lady.

90% of Canadians are white...they have jobs and they contribute EQUALLY to the tax system that pays for healthcare for all...agreed? Or do you deny the census numbers? The welfare numbers? Go look for yourself...I'll wait.

In America...49% are white and the REST are minorities...in America half the population TAKES from the government, 50 million are on food stamps, millions are in public housing, section 8 housing. Our "poor" population is larger than Canada's total population of 35 million. We have states with almost that kind of population.

As the WHITE population declines...EVERYTHING declines with it. Health, safety, happiness...compare the villages, 99% white...to ANYWHERE that is "diverse".

WHITES do NOT receive more welfare benefits than anyone else. That is a LIE. Hispanics are counted as WHITE. Go down to the welfare office...today...if you're afraid to go in because of the neighborhood...park and watch WHO goes in...minority women...they're ALL minority women...with a sprinkling of white girls with black kids.

You are being fooled...we are NOT the same. We're NOT the same species. We're as different as wolves and your cockapoo. We don't belong together any more than we should be living with any of the other apes. They are apes that can speak...the "missing link". Uncomfortable...but true nonetheless.

The proof is EVERYWHERE. Where ARE they EVER successful? Where? Name ONE place YOU would move to that is a majority black. A place you'd want your granddaughter to live. There are NONE...not one.

We are NOT the same.

You are probably one of this group:66762

Don Baldwin
03-14-2017, 07:23 PM
You are probably one of this group:66762

And once again...an insult...but not ONE word to support your side. You disagree...just because I guess.

I didn't vote for Trump, he'll be just like Obama...borrow and spend. The new boss will be quite similar to the old boss. You watch. He'll do a few meaningless social issue things to keep the public entertained and reasonably happy...but the big things will chug along. And in 30 years, we'll be a majority Hispanic and none of it will matter any more because the country will be a sh!thole. Mexico II.

From #1 to #25 because whites have gone from 90% to 49%.

that picture is a complete fake...the picture I posted earlier of the black gang members...that was real...they exist...your picture is a fantasy.

wjboyer1
03-15-2017, 08:21 AM
And once again...an insult...but not ONE word to support your side. You disagree...just because I guess.

I didn't vote for Trump, he'll be just like Obama...borrow and spend. The new boss will be quite similar to the old boss. You watch. He'll do a few meaningless social issue things to keep the public entertained and reasonably happy...but the big things will chug along. And in 30 years, we'll be a majority Hispanic and none of it will matter any more because the country will be a sh!thole. Mexico II.

From #1 to #25 because whites have gone from 90% to 49%.

that picture is a complete fake...the picture I posted earlier of the black gang members...that was real...they exist...your picture is a fantasy.

The last leader who advocated for a "white" society albeit "Aryan Race" was Hitler. Looks like you have joined ranks

Don Baldwin
03-15-2017, 09:16 AM
The last leader who advocated for a "white" society albeit "Aryan Race" was Hitler. Looks like you have joined ranks

OK...you added a title..."Racism is a smoke screen"

Back it up...prove it...list WHY they are equal...the same as us...and race doesn't matter.

I figured out they're inferior all by myself.

Since Hitler happened to be right and rallied for something I am too...we're joining ranks? Really Boyer? Really? I don't want them dead...I just want want them gone. Borrow $1 trillion to send them back if that's what it takes...they cost us more than that much every year in welfare.

Funny...I did a Google search and it came up opposite of what I expected...

leaders advocating white people - Google Search (https://www.google.com/search?q=leaders+advocating+white+people&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8)



Portland ‘Black Lives Matter’ leader OPENLY advocates for MURDER of police [VIDEO] – The Right Scoop (http://therightscoop.com/portland-black-lives-matter-leader-openly-advocates-for-murder-of-police-video/)

Black Lives Matter Leader: White People Are ‘Sub-Human', Blacks Can Kill All Whites If They Had The Power To (http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/02/wow-black-lives-matter-leader-white-people-sub-human-blacks-can-kill-whites-power/)

Black Lives Matter protest leader calls for racial segregation during demonstration | Daily Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3710701/White-people-march-Black-Lives-Matter-protest-leader-calls-racial-segregation-demonstration-outside-DNC-Philadelphia.html)

Black Activists Call for Lynching and Hanging of White People and Cops (http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2015/08/28/black-activists-called-for-lynching-and-hanging-of-white-people-and-cops/)

black-lives-matter-leader-white-people-are-sub-human (http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/13/black-lives-matter-leader-white-people-are-sub-human/)

Did you know they think so highly of you? Did you know they were as delusional as women? Well...because most of them ARE women.

This search is just as bad...

leaders+advocating+white+race (https://www.google.com/search?q=leaders+advocating+white+race&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8)

Nah...they're not racist...