A Service Dog?

[Sandtrap328]

I was at Spanish Springs this evening for the Rocky and the Rollers entertainment. They were excellent, as usual.

A few minutes before 5, a couple walked onto the square with their dog and took seats near me. In a couple of minutes, I go over and engage them in conversation. Their dog was wearing a vest that read, "Service Dog...Do Not Pet". I definitely can respect that in a service dog. This was a ShiuTsu! We got talking and I asked what kind of service the ShiuTsu performed. The man said his wife was a little hard of hearing. When the husband is out of the house, the dog will bark when someone rings the doorbell so his wife knows someone is there.

What dog doesn't bark when someone comes to the door? For this, they bought a service vest and can take the dog into restaurants, fly it free on airplanes, and stay in pet-free hotels with no extra charge.

I totally understand appreciating a dog announcing a visitor to someone hard of hearing ...but to take it to the squares, etc ... is gaming the system. What service was the dog going to do outdoors, going to a restaurant, on a plane, etc since the service only applied at their house?

Don't get me wrong, no one loves dogs or cats more than me - but gaming the system like this just rankled my feathers - so to speak.

My lovely wife just said that I do not know if this couple would do all those things and maybe the service vest was just to kindly tell people not to pet the dog. I did not think of that. It is a possibility either way.

[Wiotte]

I was at Spanish Springs this evening for the Rocky and the Rollers entertainment. They were excellent, as usual.



A few minutes before 5, a couple walked onto the square with their dog and took seats near me. In a couple of minutes, I go over and engage them in conversation. Their dog was wearing a vest that read, "Service Dog...Do Not Pet". I definitely can respect that in a service dog. This was a ShiuTsu! We got talking and I asked what kind of service the ShiuTsu performed. The man said his wife was a little hard of hearing. When the husband is out of the house, the dog will bark when someone rings the doorbell so his wife knows someone is there.



What dog doesn't bark when someone comes to the door? For this, they bought a service vest and can take the dog into restaurants, fly it free on airplanes, and stay in pet-free hotels with no extra charge.



I totally understand appreciating a dog announcing a visitor to someone hard of hearing ...but to take it to the squares, etc ... is gaming the system. What service was the dog going to do outdoors, going to a restaurant, on a plane, etc since the service only applied at their house?



Don't get me wrong, no one loves dogs or cats more than me - but gaming the system like this just rankled my feathers - so to speak.



My lovely wife just said that I do not know if this couple would do all those things and maybe the service vest was just to kindly tell people not to pet the dog. I did not think of that. It is a possibility either way.



Don't fret Sandy, this couple aren't the sharpest tools in the shed. But, you already know that.


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[bagboy]

I was shopping a few days ago at Walmart. There was a guy in the dairy section with a dachsund on his shoulder wearing a vest. My thought was, if someone started talking about him and his ears were burning, the dog could pee in his ear...and give him comfort. True story about the dog.

[graciegirl]

People who really don't care how other's feel will act selfishly. Many who live alone here feel sad and their pets are a great comfort. I think that we will just have to accept what is happening because the laws support it. I don't think that all people who take all pets to all places are always acting sincerely and honestly. I understand what you are saying Sandtrap.

[Carl in Tampa]

I was at Spanish Springs this evening for the Rocky and the Rollers entertainment. They were excellent, as usual.

A few minutes before 5, a couple walked onto the square with their dog and took seats near me. In a couple of minutes, I go over and engage them in conversation. Their dog was wearing a vest that read, "Service Dog...Do Not Pet". I definitely can respect that in a service dog. This was a ShiuTsu! We got talking and I asked what kind of service the ShiuTsu performed. The man said his wife was a little hard of hearing. When the husband is out of the house, the dog will bark when someone rings the doorbell so his wife knows someone is there.

What dog doesn't bark when someone comes to the door? For this, they bought a service vest and can take the dog into restaurants, fly it free on airplanes, and stay in pet-free hotels with no extra charge.

I totally understand appreciating a dog announcing a visitor to someone hard of hearing ...but to take it to the squares, etc ... is gaming the system. What service was the dog going to do outdoors, going to a restaurant, on a plane, etc since the service only applied at their house?

Don't get me wrong, no one loves dogs or cats more than me - but gaming the system like this just rankled my feathers - so to speak.

My lovely wife just said that I do not know if this couple would do all those things and maybe the service vest was just to kindly tell people not to pet the dog. I did not think of that. It is a possibility either way.

Well, let's take them in order.

1. MY Beagle doesn't bark when someone comes to the door. I can't speak for anyone else's dog.

2. You assume things that are not in evidence. That is that with the Service Dog vest they can take the dog all of the places that you list. The fact is that the vest is not an automatic pass. The various businesses can inquire whether or not the dog is a service dog and what the service is that the dog provides. (That's about all that can be asked.) And, if, as you observe, the service is only performed at home, the service dog does not get service dog protection at the businesses.

3. How is taking the dog to the Squares wearing its vest "gaming the system?" Any dog on a leash is allowed in the Squares.

4. It is possible that your wife is correct. The owners did not want the dog to be the target of well intentioned people who would want to pet the dog.

[Sandtrap328]

Well, let's take them in order.

1. MY Beagle doesn't bark when someone comes to the door. I can't speak for anyone else's dog.

2. You assume things that are not in evidence. That is that with the Service Dog vest they can take the dog all of the places that you list. The fact is that the vest is not an automatic pass. The various businesses can inquire whether or not the dog is a service dog and what the service is that the dog provides. (That's about all that can be asked.) And, if, as you observe, the service is only performed at home, the service dog does not get service dog protection at the businesses.

3. How is taking the dog to the Squares wearing its vest "gaming the system?" Any dog on a leash is allowed in the Squares.

4. It is possible that you wife is correct. The owners did not want the dog to be the target of well intentioned people who would want to pet the dog.

Okay, Carl - let's say MOST dogs bark when someone comes to the door.

I will actually go along with what my lovely wife said. She is a very smart woman - after all, she married me!

[Carl in Tampa]

How about a little three question test to see how much you know about Service Animals?

1. Can a cat be a Service Animal?

2. Under the Americans With Disabilities Act (ADA) can Emotional Support Animals or Comfort Animals be considered Service Animals?

3. Can miniature horses ever be use as Service Animals?

The answers?

They are somewhere on the linked page. It is interesting reading.

Service Animals and Emotional Support Animals | ADA National Network (https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-booklet)

[Carl in Tampa]

Okay, Carl - let's say MOST dogs bark when someone comes to the door.

I will actually go along with what my lovely wife said. She is a very smart woman - after all, she married me!

What about point #3?

:popcorn:

[Northwoods]

Sandtrap - you made me laugh! I agree... all dogs (except Carl's Beagle) bark when someone comes to the door. Gee -- I didn't realize I had a service dog!

[golf2140]

Can someone tell me why someone needs their dog in Ace Hardware. Come on folks leave the freaking dog home. Note: we had our last mutt for 17 years.

[Carl in Tampa]

Sandtrap - you made me laugh! I agree... all dogs (except Carl's Beagle) bark when someone comes to the door. Gee -- I didn't realize I had a service dog!

Well, no.

Nobody's Basenji barks when someone comes to the door.

(They never bark.)

:doggie:

[Wiotte]

I grew up with dogs and have always had a dog. My first wife threatened that if I brought home a dog she would lock herself in the bathroom and not come out till I got rid of it. I brought home a dog and kept the dog, now everyone knows where I stand on dogs.
To the point. People, leave your dogs HOME where they belong. Dogs DON'T belong in stores, in restaurants or on your freaking lap as you drive !



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[Nucky]

When I see one of those service doggies I don't even look anymore. I have learned it is not any of my business at all. If the dog was being mistreated I would discreetly call the correct person to handle it. We wanted to try our dog, Barney up at the square when we first moved in. Found the best parking spot, better than George Costanza. When I went to get him out of the back seat he said he didn't like the band and asked to go home. I obeyed him.

[Mrs. Robinson]

Well, no.

Nobody's Basenji barks when someone comes to the door.

(They never bark.)

:doggie:

But they do make noises tantamount to a bark.

[Mrs. Robinson]

I grew up with dogs and have always had a dog. My first wife threatened that if I brought home a dog she would lock herself in the bathroom and not come out till I got rid of it. I brought home a dog and kept the dog, now everyone knows where I stand on dogs.
To the point. People, leave your dogs HOME where they belong. Dogs DON'T belong in stores, in restaurants or on your freaking lap as you drive !

You forgot to add they also do not belong in the squares when some kind of event is going on!

[Carl in Tampa]

But they do make noises tantamount to a bark.

No, it is a "yodel," commonly called a "baroo," which has no where near the volume of a bark.

And, on the subject, you will find that many of the larger, self-confident breeds of dogs do not bark when someone is at the door. It is more commonly the little "yapping" dogs that are easily frightened and excited that do the barking.

Perhaps that is the reason that many in The Villages think that "most dogs" bark when someone is at the door...........because The Villages is overrun with little lap dogs.

:doggie:

[Mrs. Robinson]

No, it is a "yodel," commonly called a "baroo," which has no where near the volume of a bark.

And, on the subject, you will find that many of the larger, self-confident breeds of dogs do not bark when someone is at the door. It is more commonly the little "yapping" dogs that are easily frightened and excited that do the barking.

Perhaps that is the reason that many in The Villages think that "most dogs" bark when someone is at the door...........because The Villages is overrun with little lap dogs.

:doggie:

I didn't mean that a basenji made anything near the volume of a good size dog.
Yes, it is a strange sound and I was not familiar with the correct term for it.

Thankfully, our two big girls don't fit on anyone's lap (but they try). :a040:
In addition, their barks alert us to everything. :clap2:

[jimmemac]

I would say that all dogs are service animals - they all love us unconditionally and who doesn't need that?? But they don't need to be in the store or restaurant and they don't need a vest.

[karostay]

Were they also sitting in saved seats ?

[manaboutown]

Well, no.

Nobody's Basenji barks when someone comes to the door.

(They never bark.)

:doggie:

One of my aunts and her husband owned a Basenji back in the '60's. It howled relentlessly when left alone in the house loud enough for the neighbors to complain so often that they got rid of it. He was a Baltimore policemen so I know he knew his rights. They replaced it with a Belgian Shepherd which worked out fine.

[manaboutown]

I still travel often and it seems to me more people are taking "service" dogs with them on airplanes and into restaurants and hotels. In some situations a prescription is required - which can be obtained on the internet - so it is hard to distinguish true service dogs from pets people work the system to keep with them. My primary concern is of course sanitation as I do love dogs. Something needs to be done to tighten up the requirements, and soon!

[Gerald]

I have a trained service dog. He is small only 6 lbs. his job is to help people and kids in the hospital. He wears a service dog I'd and jacket when in service mode. He is trained to be playful or be held and petted for long periods of time. Giving comfort to those that need it. Could I bring him with me everyplace. Yes I could, of course I don't. Out in the sun on that hot floor with a bunch of drunk people at the square, LOL

Also people should not be asking questions about what a service dog is for. Both the dog and owner have privacy laws . All stores know this as does the airlines. To fly with a service dog you must also have a signed paper showing that the service dog has been approved by a doctor.

You can get into a very big legal issue if you start doing what you did. People normally do not tell others what the function of a service dog is. That is why they have a tag and service dog jacket. When you see it. You do not have the right to challenge if the dog is or is not a service dog. There will always be some who take advantage. That is part of life.
The same thing goes for handicap stickers for cars. Stop judging others so much and you will enjoy life a lot more.
You can't tell if a person is handicap just by looking at them.

[Wiotte]

It takes all kinds I suppose.


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[fishon]

I think that most of the itsy-bitsy dogs with a service dog jacket are simply owned by selfish people.
If someone is so emotionally unstable that they need constant comfort from a little dog, I hope they have lost their right to drive.
Heaven forbid someone that disturbed should drive a car or a cart.

[Fredster]

Here are two links to some interesting information on this subject.

Service Animals and Emotional Support Animals | ADA National Network (https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-booklet)

Service Animals | Disability Rights Florida (http://disabilityrightsflorida.org/resources/disability_topic_info/service_animals)

[Sandtrap328]

I have a trained service dog. He is small only 6 lbs. his job is to help people and kids in the hospital. He wears a service dog I'd and jacket when in service mode. He is trained to be playful or be held and petted for long periods of time. Giving comfort to those that need it. Could I bring him with me everyplace. Yes I could, of course I don't. Out in the sun on that hot floor with a bunch of drunk people at the square, LOL

Also people should not be asking questions about what a service dog is for. Both the dog and owner have privacy laws . All stores know this as does the airlines. To fly with a service dog you must also have a signed paper showing that the service dog has been approved by a doctor.

You can get into a very big legal issue if you start doing what you did. People normally do not tell others what the function of a service dog is. That is why they have a tag and service dog jacket. When you see it. You do not have the right to challenge if the dog is or is not a service dog. There will always be some who take advantage. That is part of life.
The same thing goes for handicap stickers for cars. Stop judging others so much and you will enjoy life a lot more.
You can't tell if a person is handicap just by looking at them.

No, you DO NOT have a service dog. You have a comfort dog. They do not get the REAL service dog credentials. They are nice to take this hospitals but they ARE NOT service dogs.

[Wiotte]

I'm not sure when this happened, I guess I wasn't paying attention. At what point in our society did the distance between man and beast become blurred. I love my dog and I keep a definite boundary between the dog and me, it's master. I do not tolerate my dog on furniture which includes the BED, uggh. Any business that needs to be done is done OUTSIDE. None of that wee wee pad nonsense, REALLY ? Only human pigs allow this. When it comes time to put my dog down, he goes down. I will not spend $15K to extend it's life for another 6 months. At the end, I will dig a hole 6' deep and place my beloved companion wrapped in his favorite blanket and place him at the bottom of his final resting spot. Along with his favorite toys. As I backfill his new home I'll think of all the good times we had together knowing that the distance we kept between us was healthy for BOTH of us, for I'm his master and he the dog.

[Chi33]

I highlighted some of the key ones that a small dog can do. IMHO its not a very good person who judges others' disabilities when they don't mind their own disabilities. And everyone has something.

Person with a Disability
Under the ADA, an individual with a disability is a person who has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities of such an individual; a record of such an impairment; or be regarded as having such an impairment.
Work and Tasks
According to the § 35.104 and § 36.104 (2010), examples of work and tasks performed by service animals include, but are not limited to:

guiding people who are blind or have low vision
alerting people who are deaf or hard of hearing
providing non-violent protection or rescue work
pulling a wheelchair
assisting an individual during a seizure
alerting individuals to the presence of allergens
retrieving items
providing physical support and assistance with balance and stability to individuals with mobility disabilities
helping persons with psychiatric or neurological disabilities by preventing or interrupting impulsive or destructive behaviors
reminding a person with mental illness to take prescribed medications, or
calming a person with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) during an anxiety attack.

Crime deterrence or provision of comfort or emotional support do not constitute "work or tasks" under the ADA.

[BoatRatKat]

When I see one of those service doggies I don't even look anymore. I have learned it is not any of my business at all. If the dog was being mistreated I would discreetly call the correct person to handle it. We wanted to try our dog, Barney up at the square when we first moved in. Found the best parking spot, better than George Costanza. When I went to get him out of the back seat he said he didn't like the band and asked to go home. I obeyed him.

I agree, not any of my business at all and I don't really care. Walking up to someone with a service dog and asking what service the dog provides is not all that much different than walking up to someone in a wheelchair and asking them why they need to use it. Not my business. I think dogs in TV are used to their retired owners always being around and they get used to the constant companionship and don't like being left alone all day. Also, many people here have lost their spouses and their dogs help to fill the void left in their lives and provide companionship throughout the day and in their travels. They probably come in stores with their dogs because you can't leave them in a hot car. As far as sanitation, I never see problems being caused. On the other hand, I've seen little kids in stores lick stuff, pick their noses and wipe their fingers on merchandise and make ear piercing noises and nobody wants to ban them.

[Bonny]

I'm not sure when this happened, I guess I wasn't paying attention. At what point in our society did the distance between man and beast become blurred. I love my dog and I keep a definite boundary between the dog and me, it's master. I do not tolerate my dog on furniture which includes the BED, uggh. Any business that needs to be done is done OUTSIDE. None of that wee wee pad nonsense, REALLY ? Only human pigs allow this. When it comes time to put my dog down, he goes down. I will not spend $15K to extend it's life for another 6 months. At the end, I will dig a hole 6' deep and place my beloved companion wrapped in his favorite blanket and place him at the bottom of his final resting spot. Along with his favorite toys. As I backfill his new home I'll think of all the good times we had together knowing that the distance we kept between us was healthy for BOTH of us, for I'm his master and he the dog.
Not quite sure what to say about that remark. :confused:
To each their own. Years ago we had to get a king bed so our dogs and cat had room on the bed with us. :D

[Bennie]

We have two dogs, one is a registered therapy dog, which is not the same as a service dog and the other in training. We take both everywhere that is pet friendly for socializing including the town squares, Ace Hardware, Home Depot, etc. This teaches them different scents, sounds, etc to not be afraid of and how to behave around people, to sit, no licking or jumping. We encourage petting so they will be comfortable around adults and children. We do not put the therapy dog vest, which says Therapy Dog along with her name, on her unless she is actually working, by visiting a facility where she is helping people.

[GypsyBuddy]

I continue to be amazed at how many people will always assume the worst intentions of others.

[MaryAnne28]

With a lot of things these days, when people take advantage of a system (not to say these people are), it hurts those that really need the assistance. I love dogs, too. But it appears that it's gotten a bit out of control. An example was when a friend of mine was in the ladies room at the airport and a woman gave her little dog its own stall and was talking it into doing what its got to do. A bit extreme!

[Barblebus]

well, let's take them in order.

1. My beagle doesn't bark when someone comes to the door. I can't speak for anyone else's dog.

2. You assume things that are not in evidence. That is that with the service dog vest they can take the dog all of the places that you list. The fact is that the vest is not an automatic pass. The various businesses can inquire whether or not the dog is a service dog and what the service is that the dog provides. (that's about all that can be asked.) and, if, as you observe, the service is only performed at home, the service dog does not get service dog protection at the businesses.





3. How is taking the dog to the squares wearing its vest "gaming the system?" any dog on a leash is allowed in the squares.

4. It is possible that your wife is correct. The owners did not want the dog to be the target of well intentioned people who would want to pet the dog.

amen

[amexsbow]

Having worked in the government and then transitioning to private industry I can relate to the posts about people gaming the system. I am afraid that the worst comes out in people when they perceive they can "get over' a regulation or get something "free." These people are leaches who suck the lifeblood from all the honest people in this world. NOTHING IS FREE. You are doing a disservice to those who are truly disabled and in need of assistance. What you are getting for "free' is costing the company providing it and the costs are passed on to those who purchase the product honestly. As of late I was astounded to have a neighbor tell me he called the company which guaranteed a particular item in his home and had them send replacements due to defects. The replacements are stored in his garage he said "in case he needs them." This man is STEALING. Just like the people who lie and classify their pets as "service animals."

For that woman who is hard of hearing. GET A HEARING AID. (I did.)
STOP LYING ABOUT THE DOG.
BTW(BY THE WAY) MY DOG BARKED EVERY TIME THE DOORBELL RANG.
There is a name for these people but I am keeping this post G-rated.

[Proslayer]

Dont hate the player, hate the game!

[Bonny]

It really saddens me to read all the people bashing on here.
I have a friend who lost her husband a couple of years ago after 55 years of marriage. He was her world and did everything. After he passed away, she mostly stayed in the house depressed and crying. Her friends tried to help, but it was so hard on her. Some of us talked her into getting a little dog. Needless to say, the dog is now her life. Several of us think that little fur baby saved her.
Yes, she doesn't go anywhere without her little dog. So what. She now gets out some instead of being shut in. They don't hurt anyone. I truly believe, contrary to what others say, that this dog is a service dog, therapy dog, whatever.
She's not an evil person "gaming the system". She's a wonderful person. She just needed a little help to help her get through life.
God bless her. She and her fur baby can sit by me any day.

[airstreamingypsy]

So many things to gripe about, so little time.

[ffresh]

[QUOTE=Wiotte;1433035]I'm not sure when this happened, I guess I wasn't paying attention. At what point in our society did the distance between man and beast become blurred.

LOL Good question ... I think it was about the same time that animals started TALKING on TV (television) and acting like people. :a20:

[xcaligirl]

Service animals that I KNOW are true service animals have extensive training. They will not walk away from the owner at a square when the owners are up dancing and having the dog dance in between them. There is a huge difference between a true service dog and a dog with a service vest on (that was bought online). The owners had to grab the dog a few times from just walking away!! Yes, a fake service dog really hits a nerve with me. It's not right for true service dogs. Just another person who thinks they are more important than anyone else and they use the vest to game the system. AND, the dog was not on a leash the entire time. If it was, it wouldn't have been able to start to walk away. That's when the owners finally put a leash on it. I am a huge dog lover but I'm always someone who plays by the rules!

[Miles42]

gaming the system is what Villagers do. Service dog what a joke

[golfing eagles]

gaming the system is what Villagers do. Service dog what a joke

All 120,000 of us???? What an awful place to live :cus::cus::cus:

True service dogs are no joke, just ask a blind person. Fake service dogs are worse than a joke, there should be a criminal penalty, or at least a hefty fine, for those who try to pawn off their little 7# rodent as a true service animal.

[Wiotte]

Home (http://www.guidedog.org/)

The REAL thing


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[wisbad1]

what service does a mini horse provide? Mini manure? I've been in Publix at deli counter when some idiot carries her ankle bitter in and stands by open food,they don't say anything to her,don't wanna make a scene, I find it sickening, I love dogs,wouldn't bring my dog in a food store.

[borjo]

Can someone tell me why someone needs their dog in Ace Hardware. Come on folks leave the freaking dog home. Note: we had our last mutt for 17 years.

Many reasons the dog may be needed in Ace Hardware. They may be used to sense low or high blood sugars, detect seizures before they happen, help their owner get up after a fall etc. It's hard for us to judge why they are needed, but is it our business?

[justjim]

I have a trained service dog. He is small only 6 lbs. his job is to help people and kids in the hospital. He wears a service dog I'd and jacket when in service mode. He is trained to be playful or be held and petted for long periods of time. Giving comfort to those that need it. Could I bring him with me everyplace. Yes I could, of course I don't. Out in the sun on that hot floor with a bunch of drunk people at the square, LOL

Also people should not be asking questions about what a service dog is for. Both the dog and owner have privacy laws . All stores know this as does the airlines. To fly with a service dog you must also have a signed paper showing that the service dog has been approved by a doctor.

You can get into a very big legal issue if you start doing what you did. People normally do not tell others what the function of a service dog is. That is why they have a tag and service dog jacket. When you see it. You do not have the right to challenge if the dog is or is not a service dog. There will always be some who take advantage. That is part of life.
The same thing goes for handicap stickers for cars. Stop judging others so much and you will enjoy life a lot more.
You can't tell if a person is handicap just by looking at them.

The problem (real or not) is being able to determine if the dog is a trained service dog. The local government entity (partially why we pay taxes) should issue a tag ,following proof by the owner, that the dog has indeed been TRAINED as a Service Dog. I'm sure restaurant management would like this as it takes the pressure off them with other restaurant customers. It's unfair to put them (management) in the middle. :popcorn:

[golfing eagles]

Many reasons the dog may be needed in Ace Hardware. They may be used to sense low or high blood sugars, detect seizures before they happen, help their owner get up after a fall etc. It's hard for us to judge why they are needed, but is it our business?

Detect blood sugar??----a 15# dog in a pouch on your chest or a 3 oz. glucometer in your pocket---which makes more sense??

Detect a seizure in advance----not possible, the dog is just sensing the very early start of a seizure already underway, and you'll know you're having one about 10 seconds later

How does a 7# rug rat help someone get up?????

If there is legitimate training for these dogs and evidence that they are superior to standard methodology, I'm all ears. But I am willing to bet 90+% of dogs that supposedly perform these tasks are just along for the ride. I think the exception in public places for service dogs should be restricted to TRUE service dogs, lest the tide turns and the people who really need these animals come up short.

[New Englander]

Detect blood sugar??----a 15# dog in a pouch on your chest or a 3 oz. glucometer in your pocket---which makes more sense??

Detect a seizure in advance----not possible, the dog is just sensing the very early start of a seizure already underway, and you'll know you're having one about 10 seconds later

How does a 7# rug rat help someone get up?????

If there is legitimate training for these dogs and evidence that they are superior to standard methodology, I'm all ears. But I am willing to bet 90+% of dogs that supposedly perform these tasks are just along for the ride. I think the exception in public places for service dogs should be restricted to TRUE service dogs, lest the tide turns and the people who really need these animals come up short.

:agree:

[duffysmom]

Well, let's take them in order.

1. MY Beagle doesn't bark when someone comes to the door. I can't speak for anyone else's dog.

2. You assume things that are not in evidence. That is that with the Service Dog vest they can take the dog all of the places that you list. The fact is that the vest is not an automatic pass. The various businesses can inquire whether or not the dog is a service dog and what the service is that the dog provides. (That's about all that can be asked.) And, if, as you observe, the service is only performed at home, the service dog does not get service dog protection at the businesses.

3. How is taking the dog to the Squares wearing its vest "gaming the system?" Any dog on a leash is allowed in the Squares.

4. It is possible that your wife is correct. The owners did not want the dog to be the target of well intentioned people who would want to pet the dog.

:bigbow:

[Carl in Tampa]

The problem (real or not) is being able to determine if the dog is a trained service dog. The local government entity (partially why we pay taxes) should issue a tag ,following proof by the owner, that the dog has indeed been TRAINED as a Service Dog. I'm sure restaurant management would like this as it takes the pressure off them with other restaurant customers. It's unfair to put them (management) in the middle. :popcorn:

First, note that the general public has no standing to challenge whether or not a dog is a "true service dog." Nor is there anything in the federal ADA law, or in Florida law that provides for (or requires) any sign, tag, harness, or vest, to indicate that a dog is a service dog.

Only the operator of an establishment has standing to challenge whether or not a dog accompanying a person is a service dog. And only two questions may be asked. 1. Is this a service dog? 2. What service does it provide? There can be no in depth inquiry into the disability of the person who has the dog. If the service provided does not seem to apply to the situation, the operator can ask the person to remove the dog.

Alas, I don't foresee any changes in these long established laws just because retirees in The Villages are lying or confused about what constitutes a genuine service dog..........or just don't care.

[Carl in Tampa]

what service does a mini horse provide? Mini manure? I've been in Publix at deli counter when some idiot carries her ankle bitter in and stands by open food,they don't say anything to her,don't wanna make a scene, I find it sickening, I love dogs,wouldn't bring my dog in a food store.

How about your horse? As you apparently know, miniature horses can also be official Service Animals. They work in much the same manner as Guide Dogs for the Blind.

City Faces Lawsuit Over Girl's Mini Horse Service Animal | HuffPost (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/20/mini-horse-girl-special-needs-ohio-anderson_n_4824657.html)
.
.Yeah, the photo below is a service horse on a commercial airplane.
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[KakiOmmm]

I believe some people use the system to keep their pets with them when they go somewhere...if that makes them feel better then maybe that's a good thing. Shouldn't we all be able to feel better? Why not give everyone a break and live and let live? I help with service dog training and they are real service dogs. I suppose I could be questioned about any dog I am working with, since I don't have a disability and am not a veteran, but I continue to hope for the goodness of humanity and less judgement of other people's lives.

[Bonny]

I believe some people use the system to keep their pets with them when they go somewhere...if that makes them feel better then maybe that's a good thing. Shouldn't we all be able to feel better? Why not give everyone a break and live and let live? I help with service dog training and they are real service dogs. I suppose I could be questioned about any dog I am working with, since I don't have a disability and am not a veteran, but I continue to hope for the goodness of humanity and less judgement of other people's lives.
:bigbow:

[golfing eagles]

I believe some people use the system to keep their pets with them when they go somewhere...if that makes them feel better then maybe that's a good thing. Shouldn't we all be able to feel better? Why not give everyone a break and live and let live? I help with service dog training and they are real service dogs. I suppose I could be questioned about any dog I am working with, since I don't have a disability and am not a veteran, but I continue to hope for the goodness of humanity and less judgement of other people's lives.

Surely you don't mean to imply that people should be able to do things that make them "feel good".
Maybe someone would feel good about swimming nude in a family pool, or getting drunk in a bar and starting a brawl, or driving 90 mph on 466.

True service dogs like the ones you train are an invaluable asset to those in need, and thank you for doing this. But pawning a little rug rat off as a service animal is a disservice to those with legitimate needs. Even people with allergies to dogs are willing to tolerate a seeing eye dog, but why should dozens of people in the vicinity have to tolerate the behaviors of others that "make them feel good"?

[tikigal]

Service dogs can be used for a multitude of reasons. Although it's only an opinion, if an animal is used for hearing, why would you take it to the square, where the music is so loud, it is 50 times louder for a dog. This could contribute to not only hearing loss in humans but in dogs. But again, it's only a question, or is it a red flag to let them know that dogs hearing can be impaired with constant loud noises. Maybe they truly never thought of that, and just don't know any better, but it is Better discussed with a licensed Vet.

I never understood why people always ask what someone's service dog does, as it isn't really there business and can be very embarrassing for the person owning the service animal. How many times a day do you hear this from people. Just try sitting down next to one having coffee outside with their dog sometime, it doesn't stop. I have nothing but empathy for the disabled human berated by people asking them personal health questions. If a person is in a wheelchair, do you ask them what is wrong with you? Of course not. Best to be polite, and just smile and be compassionate of others with a problem they may not want to discuss with the general public.

Most service animals accompany their humans every where they go, as they are part of the "package", so sometimes, it isn't a good idea to criticise, they may be on vacation and just visiting the Villages. Most service dogs are constant companions of their humans, regardless of where they go, but it is also the owner that must understand the limitations of a dog or the risk you may put it in, such as walking your dog in the middle of the afternoon on hot pavement. There are people we know that don't go places, because they do have a service dog, and need it full time. Life is full of adjustments.

Sometimes, it's just best to close the book on other people's disabilities. as our job is really to love our neighbors as ourselves. The "why's", we just have to let go of sometimes.

[New Englander]

Surely you don't mean to imply that people should be able to do things that make them "feel good".
Maybe someone would feel good about swimming nude in a family pool, or getting drunk in a bar and starting a brawl, or driving 90 mph on 466.

True service dogs like the ones you train are an invaluable asset to those in need, and thank you for doing this. But pawning a little rug rat off as a service animal is a disservice to those with legitimate needs. Even people with allergies to dogs are willing to tolerate a seeing eye dog, but why should dozens of people in the vicinity have to tolerate the behaviors of others that "make them feel good"?

Well said!

[borjo]

i'm not sure when this happened, i guess i wasn't paying attention. At what point in our society did the distance between man and beast become blurred. I love my dog and i keep a definite boundary between the dog and me, it's master. I do not tolerate my dog on furniture which includes the bed, uggh. Any business that needs to be done is done outside. None of that wee wee pad nonsense, really ? Only human pigs allow this. When it comes time to put my dog down, he goes down. I will not spend $15k to extend it's life for another 6 months. At the end, i will dig a hole 6' deep and place my beloved companion wrapped in his favorite blanket and place him at the bottom of his final resting spot. Along with his favorite toys. As i backfill his new home i'll think of all the good times we had together knowing that the distance we kept between us was healthy for both of us, for i'm his master and he the dog.

like

[borjo]

Detect blood sugar??----a 15# dog in a pouch on your chest or a 3 oz. glucometer in your pocket---which makes more sense??

Detect a seizure in advance----not possible, the dog is just sensing the very early start of a seizure already underway, and you'll know you're having one about 10 seconds later

How does a 7# rug rat help someone get up?????

If there is legitimate training for these dogs and evidence that they are superior to standard methodology, I'm all ears. But I am willing to bet 90+% of dogs that supposedly perform these tasks are just along for the ride. I think the exception in public places for service dogs should be restricted to TRUE service dogs, lest the tide turns and the people who really need these animals come up short.

#1. A brittle diabetic gets fluctuations very quickly and often cannot recognize when he's too low with the brain fog they get. Grandson was offered a dog.
#2. The seizure service dog alerts the owner of his impending seizure so the person can lie down, protecting them from injury in a fall.
#3. A 7# rug rat wouldn't be able to help someone get up of course, but a full grown lab could. Saw one.

[golfing eagles]

Detect blood sugar??----a 15# dog in a pouch on your chest or a 3 oz. glucometer in your pocket---which makes more sense??

Detect a seizure in advance----not possible, the dog is just sensing the very early start of a seizure already underway, and you'll know you're having one about 10 seconds later

How does a 7# rug rat help someone get up?????

If there is legitimate training for these dogs and evidence that they are superior to standard methodology, I'm all ears. But I am willing to bet 90+% of dogs that supposedly perform these tasks are just along for the ride. I think the exception in public places for service dogs should be restricted to TRUE service dogs, lest the tide turns and the people who really need these animals come up short.

#1. A brittle diabetic gets fluctuations very quickly and often cannot recognize when he's too low with the brain fog they get. Grandson was offered a dog.
#2. The seizure service dog alerts the owner of his impending seizure so the person can lie down, protecting them from injury in a fall.
#3. A 7# rug rat wouldn't be able to help someone get up of course, but a full grown lab could. Saw one.

And for every service dog that TRULY fits category 1 & 2, there are how many frauds?????.
The training required would be truly amazing----let's see, get a bunch of people with seizure disorders, hold their meds, induce seizures and then train the dogs as to early signs that the dog, and only the dog can sense??? Induce hypoglycemia in an insulin dependent diabetic just to train dogs??? Maybe it is possible, but I have my doubts. Anyone remember "facilitation"????

As far as falls go, I've fallen, maybe you've fallen, and millions of us have fallen. So I guess we all need a big dog wherever we go. Oh, wait, there are OTHER PEOPLE around to help in those places. The only time the dog is needed is when the owner is ALONE---like at home, which is where they should leave the dog

I've already posted how valuable TRUE service dogs are; I am concerned over some "fringe" uses and the frauds negatively impacting those with true need

PS. Please feel free to "educate" me about diabetes and seizure disorders any time you like:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[graciegirl]

One should always try to be considerate of others. We can't expect people to love our children or our pets like we do, but many find that hard to understand or even consider. The world can't always revolve around our needs and our loves and our passions and our interests.


.

[JerryP]

It really saddens me to read all the people bashing on here.
I have a friend who lost her husband a couple of years ago after 55 years of marriage. He was her world and did everything. After he passed away, she mostly stayed in the house depressed and crying. Her friends tried to help, but it was so hard on her. Some of us talked her into getting a little dog. Needless to say, the dog is now her life. Several of us think that little fur baby saved her.
Yes, she doesn't go anywhere without her little dog. So what. She now gets out some instead of being shut in. They don't hurt anyone. I truly believe, contrary to what others say, that this dog is a service dog, therapy dog, whatever.
She's not an evil person "gaming the system". She's a wonderful person. She just needed a little help to help her get through life.
God bless her. She and her fur baby can sit by me any day.

I'm happy for your friend.

[Jestski2016]

Good info!

[capecodder1]

I was at one of the regional rec centers and a man came into the line dance class, with a dog in a stroller. I inquired at the front desk if this was allowed and was told rec center employees are not allowed to question anyone claiming to have a comfort dog.
Does not sound right to me.

[Wiotte]

I was at one of the regional rec centers and a man came into the line dance class, with a dog in a stroller. I inquired at the front desk if this was allowed and was told rec center employees are not allowed to question anyone claiming to have a comfort dog.

Does not sound right to me.



https://www.ada.gov/cguide.htm


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Barefoot]

I help with service dog training and they are real service dogs. I continue to hope for the goodness of humanity and less judgement of other people's lives.
Kudos to anyone that helps train service dogs, it can't be easy.

I was at one of the regional rec centers and a man came into the line dance class, with a dog in a stroller. The dog probably didn't enjoy being at the line dance class, especially if it had to learn the New Jersey Shuffle.

[Mrs. Robinson]

Home (http://www.guidedog.org/)

The REAL thing

Yes!

This organization is the "real thing."
We have been a financial supporter to them for many years.
They are remarkable.

[Mrs. Robinson]

I'm not sure when this happened, I guess I wasn't paying attention. At what point in our society did the distance between man and beast become blurred. I love my dog and I keep a definite boundary between the dog and me, it's master. I do not tolerate my dog on furniture which includes the BED, uggh. Any business that needs to be done is done OUTSIDE. None of that wee wee pad nonsense, REALLY ? Only human pigs allow this. When it comes time to put my dog down, he goes down. I will not spend $15K to extend it's life for another 6 months. At the end, I will dig a hole 6' deep and place my beloved companion wrapped in his favorite blanket and place him at the bottom of his final resting spot. Along with his favorite toys. As I backfill his new home I'll think of all the good times we had together knowing that the distance we kept between us was healthy for BOTH of us, for I'm his master and he the dog.

I assume you are speaking about your home here. Please do not do that.
It won't be your home forever and would be horrible for someone to be digging a hole to plant something and . . .
I don't think I have to be graphic.
In addition, I don't think burying an animal on a residential lot is legal.

[TimeForChange]

I was at Spanish Springs this evening for the Rocky and the Rollers entertainment. They were excellent, as usual.

A few minutes before 5, a couple walked onto the square with their dog and took seats near me. In a couple of minutes, I go over and engage them in conversation. Their dog was wearing a vest that read, "Service Dog...Do Not Pet". I definitely can respect that in a service dog. This was a ShiuTsu! We got talking and I asked what kind of service the ShiuTsu performed. The man said his wife was a little hard of hearing. When the husband is out of the house, the dog will bark when someone rings the doorbell so his wife knows someone is there.

What dog doesn't bark when someone comes to the door? For this, they bought a service vest and can take the dog into restaurants, fly it free on airplanes, and stay in pet-free hotels with no extra charge.

I totally understand appreciating a dog announcing a visitor to someone hard of hearing ...but to take it to the squares, etc ... is gaming the system. What service was the dog going to do outdoors, going to a restaurant, on a plane, etc since the service only applied at their house?

Don't get me wrong, no one loves dogs or cats more than me - but gaming the system like this just rankled my feathers - so to speak.

My lovely wife just said that I do not know if this couple would do all those things and maybe the service vest was just to kindly tell people not to pet the dog. I did not think of that. It is a possibility either way.

I have a five year old black lab rescue that really only barks in his sleep. Lots of dogs don't bark at the door.

[Kup Kake]

Wow. After reading many of the comments made in this thread, I am certain that TV is NOT America's Friendliest Home Town!

[Wiotte]

I assume you are speaking about your home here. Please do not do that.

It won't be your home forever and would be horrible for someone to be digging a hole to plant something and . . .

I don't think I have to be graphic.

In addition, I don't think burying an animal on a residential lot is legal.



My property is large enough. If by chance someone digs a hole to plant whatever, it won't be as deep as I would bury my buddy.

[Barefoot]

Sometimes, it's just best to close the book on other people's disabilities. as our job is really to love our neighbors as ourselves. The "why's", we just have to let go of sometimes.:agree:

[Sgroemm]

Interesting note: some dogs (often small in stature) can actually smell/detect a hypoglycemic attack in those who suffer from diabetes. Dogs are trained by an organization called Cancer and Bio-detection Dogs. These dogs also are trained to detect increased levels in those who have Bladder Cancer. Some of the smallest pups could be on duty and you might assume it was a spoiled lapdog....Just proves, you never know what another person's story is....if the dog is not disturbing you....live and let live.

[EPutnam1863]

It is perfectly ok to ask the owner what kind of service his dog provides as long as the conversation is carried in a friendly manner.

However, the public belongs to us all, and if the service dog or its owner is being offensive in some manner, we have the right to remind the owner public is public, not private.

[graciegirl]

A service dog for someone who has a medical problem is one thing...........and another is to just carry one's pet about because the person "wants to". And in so doing blatantly fib about it.

I don't know why that annoys me so much but it does.

[Viperguy]

I put the "service" dog in the same category as the family members of a handicapped person parking in a "Handicapped" parking spot. JMHO

[Sandtrap328]

[QUOTE=EPutnam1863;1466574]It is perfectly ok to ask the owner what kind of service his dog provides as long as the conversation is carried in a friendly manner. QUOTE]

Thank you. I am the OP of this long thread. When I was talking to the dog's owner at Spanish Springs, it was a friendly conversation about dogs in general. When I asked about the service provided by a ShiuTsu, he laughed and said the dog barks when someone rings the doorbell. I laughed at that also. Yes, it was a friendly conversation - not an angry confrontation.

People who know me will agree I am a friendly conversationist (I hope).

[cc1246]

We were ar Ricciardi’s and a couple brought their lap dog in a stroller and sat at the inside bar it to was a service dog. Come on folks what service was he doing in the stroller. Then there’s the nut that brings his squirrel into Home Depot and they tell me someone also brings in a snake.

[mtdjed]

After reading about the hard of hearing lady at a Christmas Party leaving a silent toot and asking husband what she should do, and he then said put a new battery in your hearing aid, we now know that OP was talking to the owners of a service dog trained to remind woman when she needs new battery. Keep your distance.