The Bike police

[aninjamom]

Yesterday morning I was heading into Sumter Landing and a pack of bicycles was coming the other way. One of the lead cycles swerved INTO my path and waved at me to slow down!
Firstly, I was going maybe 20 coming out of the round-about, and I was already decelerating for the intersection while looking on both sides for golf carts. He had no way of knowing what my speed was.
Secondly, I was going in the opposite direction of the bikes, centered in my own lane and no danger to them whatsoever. Unless, like the arrogant fool who swerved into oncoming traffic to "police" my speed, they were to cross into the wrong lane. I thought cycling was a healthy activity. Apparently it hasn't helped his mental facilities any. I hope he doesn't make this a habit on the main roads, many drivers here have diminishing reaction times.
Whoever he is, if he thinks his bike can survive a head-on collision with a car, he needs another activity. OK, vent over.

[fred53]

Agree completely. Unfortunately there are a few cyclists who feel superior to those in cars.

[Chellybean]

Yesterday morning I was heading into Sumter Landing and a pack of bicycles was coming the other way. One of the lead cycles swerved INTO my path and waved at me to slow down!
Firstly, I was going maybe 20 coming out of the round-about, and I was already decelerating for the intersection while looking on both sides for golf carts. He had no way of knowing what my speed was.
Secondly, I was going in the opposite direction of the bikes, centered in my own lane and no danger to them whatsoever. Unless, like the arrogant fool who swerved into oncoming traffic to "police" my speed, they were to cross into the wrong lane. I thought cycling was a healthy activity. Apparently it hasn't helped his mental facilities any. I hope he doesn't make this a habit on the main roads, many drivers here have diminishing reaction times.
Whoever he is, if he thinks his bike can survive a head-on collision with a car, he needs another activity. OK, vent over.

welcome to the entitled villager!!!! IDiots
They also don't have the right of way and need to stay on the shoulder unless they can do the posted speed limit. Bikers need to read the law. Now lets see how much controversy this starts!

[tuccillo]

The rules of the road are essentially the same for cyclists as cars. In a circumstance where a car would have the right of way, a cyclist would also. Cyclists do not need to stay on the shoulder (in fact that is a dangerous place to be) and can occupy an entire lane. There is no requirement based on posted speed. You should think of cyclists (as well as street legal golf carts) as slow moving cars.

Here is the Florida Statute.

Statutes & Constitution
:View Statutes
:

Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0300-0399/0316/Sections/0316.2065.html)


welcome to the entitled villager!!!! IDiots
They also don't have the right of way and need to stay on the shoulder unless they can do the posted speed limit. Bikers need to read the law. Now lets see how much controversy this starts!

[Villager Joyce]

I think of it as a gang mentality more than a bike thing. For example, one or two walkers almost always go single file when a car or cart approaches. If three, one almost always separates from the two. Five or more walkers block the street and make no effort to allow space fir anyone to pass. I see that same mentality with bikers. The biggest difference is bikers seem to always be in a gaggle so they always take the right of way.

[njbchbum]

The rules of the road are essentially the same for cyclists as cars. In a circumstance where a car would have the right of way, a cyclist would also. Cyclists do not need to stay on the shoulder (in fact that is a dangerous place to be) and can occupy an entire lane. There is no requirement based on posted speed. You should think of cyclists (as well as street legal golf carts) as slow moving cars.

Here is the Florida Statute.

Statutes & Constitution
:View Statutes
:

Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0300-0399/0316/Sections/0316.2065.html)

Would this part of the statute not mean that it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit?

(1) Every person propelling a vehicle by human power has all of the rights and all of the duties applicable to the driver of any other vehicle under this chapter, except as to special regulations in this chapter, and except as to provisions of this chapter which by their nature can have no application.

Is this part of the Statute not in conflict with the highlighted part of your post above?

(5)(a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall ride in the lane marked for bicycle use or, if no lane is marked for bicycle use, as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:
1. When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction.

2. When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.

3. When reasonably necessary to avoid any condition or potential conflict, including, but not limited to, a fixed or moving object, parked or moving vehicle, bicycle, pedestrian, animal, surface hazard, turn lane, or substandard-width lane, which makes it unsafe to continue along the right-hand curb or edge or within a bicycle lane. For the purposes of this subsection, a “substandard-width lane” is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and another vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.

Thanx for your opinion.

[tuccillo]

The roads in The Villages are not wide enough (sub-standard width) to contain a bike and a car with the required 3 feet of clearance in a single lane. What this means is when passing a cyclist on a four lane road you need to move into the left hand lane. When passing a cyclist on a two lane road you need to wait till the oncoming lane is clear and pass in the oncoming lane (assuming a dashed center line). Since the roads are sub-standard width, you will often see cyclists in the middle of a lane and this is allowed by the law, regardless of their speed. Whether you hug the curb or not, a car and a bike cannot/shouldn't be adjacent to each other in the same lane on the roads in The Villages. The important part of the statute is highlighted in red in (5)(a) 3 below. If the roads weren't of sub-standard width then it would be different.

Would this part of the statute not mean that it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit?



(1) Every person propelling a vehicle by human power has all of the rights and all of the duties applicable to the driver of any other vehicle under this chapter, except as to special regulations in this chapter, and except as to provisions of this chapter which by their nature can have no application.

Is this part of the Statute not in conflict with the highlighted part of your post above?


(5)(a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall ride in the lane marked for bicycle use or, if no lane is marked for bicycle use, as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:
1. When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction.

2. When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.

3. When reasonably necessary to avoid any condition or potential conflict, including, but not limited to, a fixed or moving object, parked or moving vehicle, bicycle, pedestrian, animal, surface hazard, turn lane, or substandard-width lane, which makes it unsafe to continue along the right-hand curb or edge or within a bicycle lane. For the purposes of this subsection, a “substandard-width lane” is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and another vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.

Thanx for your opinion.

[autumnspring]

First of all, I drive a car, I drive a golf cart, I ride a bike and I of course walk.

Sadly, what we notice, what I notice are all the stupid things people do. As most accidents involve, a car, a golf cart, a bike or a walker, even if one is acting inappropriately, the other can avoid the COULD BE ENCOUNTER-politically correct termed an accident. PEOPLE since in almost all cases it can be avoided, it is not an accident, it is a stupid action.

THE LAW-as I read this and similar threads, assuming that others know the law is a stretch of reality. Then to assume people know the law and will follow it...................

To the original post-THEY ARE RIGHT. Bicycles are supposed to be going in the same direction as cars-not going into or is it at traffic.

I was tempted to post all the STUPID things I see people doing in the villages. If, I just posted yesterday, I would be far too long.

As I've posted before, my Dad taught me how to drive. He is long gone but I will never forget what he said. Expect people to do the stupidest possible thing because that is exactly what they are going to do. Or, more politely said,
you should always have a way out.

[Arctic Fox]

Would this part of the statute not mean that it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit?

Not wishing to defend any errant cyclists, but the posted speed limit is exactly that - the limit - how fast you can legally go.

There is clearly no requirement for any vehicle to go the maximum speed.

[tuccillo]

Please read post #7. I believe I have explained the situation in The Villages.

Not wishing to defend any errant cyclists, but the posted speed limit is exactly that - the limit - how fast you can legally go.

There is clearly no requirement for any vehicle to go the maximum speed.

[pauld315]

Yesterday morning I was heading into Sumter Landing and a pack of bicycles was coming the other way. One of the lead cycles swerved INTO my path and waved at me to slow down!
Firstly, I was going maybe 20 coming out of the round-about, and I was already decelerating for the intersection while looking on both sides for golf carts. He had no way of knowing what my speed was.
Secondly, I was going in the opposite direction of the bikes, centered in my own lane and no danger to them whatsoever. Unless, like the arrogant fool who swerved into oncoming traffic to "police" my speed, they were to cross into the wrong lane. I thought cycling was a healthy activity. Apparently it hasn't helped his mental facilities any. I hope he doesn't make this a habit on the main roads, many drivers here have diminishing reaction times.
Whoever he is, if he thinks his bike can survive a head-on collision with a car, he needs another activity. OK, vent over.
Reading through the responses to the OP I wonder how many of the people actually read it and understood it. Simply put, the bicyclist swerved into the lane the OP was driving their car in instead of staying in their own lane.The cyclist drove into the lane with oncoming traffic putting himself and others at risk. There is no lawful purpose for that to be done by anybody whether or not they are on a bike.

[gbburgess]

The above posts sum up why I do not ride with the groups. I have seen 5,10, and 15 in a group riding the main roads. While the bikers appear to be following the rules of the road the cars assume they have the right of way. Bikes cannot compete when cars get too close and cars cannot stop when bikes swerve erratically. Bikers should be in single file and in the center of the right lane (curbs are to dangerous) when on the main roads around here. Everyone needs to follow the rules - like stop signs! Cars fly through them, golf carts ignore them and bikers seldom stop (a discussion for another time) at them. I wish everyone would respect the others.

[New Englander]

Reading through the responses to the OP I wonder how many of the people actually read it and understood it. Simply put, the bicyclist swerved into the lane the OP was driving their car in instead of staying in their own lane.The cyclist drove into the lane with oncoming traffic putting himself and others at risk. There is no lawful purpose for that to be done by anybody whether or not they are on a bike.

:agree:

[Villager Joyce]

Reading through the responses to the OP I wonder how many of the people actually read it and understood it. Simply put, the bicyclist swerved into the lane the OP was driving their car in instead of staying in their own lane.The cyclist drove into the lane with oncoming traffic putting himself and others at risk. There is no lawful purpose for that to be done by anybody whether or not they are on a bike.

You are correct. I did not respond to the OP. There is not an excuse to behave as the bicyclist did unless he/she has an attitude—a bad attitude.

[rubicon]

Tuccillo's postings and explanations are accurate.

Obligations caused me to follow State driving regulations across this nation. States are pretty much the same when they define "vehicles"and their application to the responsibility of drivers/riders of those vehicles as applied to the Rules of the Road.

Bicycles, cars, golf carts for purposes of the rules of the road are all vehicles and the rules of the road apply to all as to right of way (ROW) overtaking, signaling, backing , merging, etc.

Overtaking and backing carry the greatest responsibility to the moving vehicle. It is almost absolute.

I have read or heard some folks believe that a car has the right of way over a golf cart in every situation here and that is not correct

We have people from all over the country who have brought with them some of their very bad driving habits.

We have people here because of age disability or both over or under react to traffic situations.

We have cowboys on the road that believe when the golf cart ahead of them is merging at the entrance of a gate that, that won't do,and speed up to pass them. " No carts going to get in front of me" type

We have far too many Sunday drivers in cars and carts

We have pedestrians who walk before sunset or sunrise in dark clothing and without reflectors or lights walking in the diamond lane or with their backs to traffic

And we have the ubiquitous cyclers with the motto "lead follow or get out of my way"

What we have is human frailty at its best:D

Personal Best Regards:

[Rapscallion St Croix]

You are correct. I did not respond to the OP. There is not an excuse to behave as the bucyckist dudeunless he/she has an attitude—a bad attitude.

Generally speaking, when riding in packs, the cyclists display extreme arrogance. They seem to view themselves as exempt from stop signs and blow through them en masse as if they were a single vehicle. They rightfully demand three feet clearance but don't extend the same passing autos.

[Arctic Fox]

Please read post #7. I believe I have explained the situation in The Villages.

I was merely addressing njbchbum's claim that "it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit".

That would rule out most recreational cyclists in TV from using even the residential streets, where the speed limit is 20 mph.

Many drivers in TV seem to think a 30 mph sign means everyone must travel at (at least) that speed.

[CFrance]

A cyclist swerving into oncoming traffic must be suicidal. Even if you were speeding (which it sounds like you weren't), it's none of his business and not his place to attempt to control traffic. That's the sheriff's job. Too bad no LEO was there to ticket him.

[tuccillo]

I did not make that claim. You are referring to post #6 by user "njbchbum". In my post #7, I was explaining what the actual law is.

I was merely addressing your claim that "it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit".

Your claim would effectively rule out most cyclists in TV from using even the residential streets, where the speed limit is 20 mph.

Many drivers in TV seem to think a 30 mph sign means everyone must travel at (at least) that speed.

[NotGolfer]

Tuccillo's postings and explanations are accurate.

Obligations caused me to follow State driving regulations across this nation. States are pretty much the same when they define "vehicles"and their application to the responsibility of drivers/riders of those vehicles as applied to the Rules of the Road.

Bicycles, cars, golf carts for purposes of the rules of the road are all vehicles and the rules of the road apply to all as to right of way (ROW) overtaking, signaling, backing , merging, etc.

Overtaking and backing carry the greatest responsibility to the moving vehicle. It is almost absolute.

I have read or heard some folks believe that a car has the right of way over a golf cart in every situation here and that is not correct

We have people from all over the country who have brought with them some of their very bad driving habits.

We have people here because of age disability or both over or under react to traffic situations.

We have cowboys on the road that believe when the golf cart ahead of them is merging at the entrance of a gate that, that won't do,and speed up to pass them. " No carts going to get in front of me" type

We have far too many Sunday drivers in cars and carts

We have pedestrians who walk before sunset or sunrise in dark clothing and without reflectors or lights walking in the diamond lane or with their backs to traffic

And we have the ubiquitous cyclers with the motto "lead follow or get out of my way"

What we have is human frailty at its best:D

Personal Best Regards:

Well stated!!! Add to this the folks who want to be right in every instance.

[tuccillo]

Any suggestion that a cyclist would swerve into an oncoming lane in an attempt control traffic is not believable. Cyclists do, however, go out of there way to avoid cars. We aren't really hearing the whole story and probably never will. Let's just leave with the following thought: let's try to look out for other cars, cyclists, golf carts, and pedestrians.

A cyclist swerving into oncoming traffic must be suicidal. Even if you were speeding (which it sounds like you weren't), it's none of his business and not his place to attempt to control traffic. That's the sheriff's job. Too bad no LEO was there to ticket him.

[Polar Bear]

Any suggestion that a cyclist would swerve into an oncoming lane in an attempt control traffic is not believable...We aren't really hearing the whole story and probably never will...
My thoughts exactly.

[TimeForChange]

Yesterday morning I was heading into Sumter Landing and a pack of bicycles was coming the other way. One of the lead cycles swerved INTO my path and waved at me to slow down!
Firstly, I was going maybe 20 coming out of the round-about, and I was already decelerating for the intersection while looking on both sides for golf carts. He had no way of knowing what my speed was.
Secondly, I was going in the opposite direction of the bikes, centered in my own lane and no danger to them whatsoever. Unless, like the arrogant fool who swerved into oncoming traffic to "police" my speed, they were to cross into the wrong lane. I thought cycling was a healthy activity. Apparently it hasn't helped his mental facilities any. I hope he doesn't make this a habit on the main roads, many drivers here have diminishing reaction times.
Whoever he is, if he thinks his bike can survive a head-on collision with a car, he needs another activity. OK, vent over.

I bike and try to stay on the cart trails. It is amazing how many golf carts I get behind me trying to overtake me on curves and hills with no view of the oncoming traffic. On the other hand the packs of bikers do not realize how dangerous riding on the roads actually is. If the lead biker goes down then the rest will fall to try and escape the front rider. I have witnessed this in 20 to 100 mile rides from here to Texas. At the average age in TV a broken collar bone or hip will put you down for a year. They have no idea and I will not ride in a group.

[Aloha1]

I think of it as a gang mentality more than a bike thing.

Biker Gangs in The Villages. Who woulda thought...

Let's see; ride in a pack; all wearing the same "colors".. Hmmm, could be.

[Arctic Fox]

I did not make that claim. You are referring to post #6 by user "njbchbum". In my post #7, I was explaining what the actual law is.

I apologize, tucillo - it was, indeed, njbchbum who made that claim, not you. I have edited my post to correct my error.

[Marathon Man]

Any suggestion that a cyclist would swerve into an oncoming lane in an attempt control traffic is not believable. Cyclists do, however, go out of there way to avoid cars. We aren't really hearing the whole story and probably never will. Let's just leave with the following thought: let's try to look out for other cars, cyclists, golf carts, and pedestrians.

I thought the same thing. When a story doesn't seem to make sense, there is usually something missing or in error. I just can't imaging a bike rider playing chicken with an oncoming car.

[bbbbbb]

[QUOTE=tuccillo;1466804]The roads in The Villages are not wide enough (sub-standard width) to contain a bike and a car with the required 3 feet of clearance in a single lane. What this means is when passing a cyclist on a four lane road you need to move into the left hand lane. When passing a cyclist on a two lane road you need to wait till the oncoming lane is clear and pass in the oncoming lane (assuming a dashed center line). Since the roads are sub-standard width, you will often see cyclists in the middle of a lane and this is allowed by the law, regardless of their speed. Whether you hug the curb or not, a car and a bike cannot/shouldn't be adjacent to each other in the same lane on the roads in The Villages. The important part of the statute is highlighted in red in (5)(a) 3 below. If the roads weren't of sub-standard

Comment: Thank you Tuccillo for your very good information. OK here are some comments, take them or not, this is an opinion.
(We bike and Electric cart and almost never use the car).
1. Originally, as I heard from a good friend in another state, long ago and before we moved here, the Villages was supposedly for Carts and walking, retired seniors. It could be the roads are as you say because they probably did not plan on the cars in such an abundance. Here now, some folks do not have a cart, only cars, 3 or 4. Also, the newer areas, Fenney etc. you can see are set, almost a must to have a car.
2. The Villages thrives on on drinking, happy hours and happy hours etc. Starting early in the day, it is so apparent, and note all the parking spaces so a person can get close to the bar and be able to find the car at the end of the drinking bout, if it does end.
3. We do bicycles for exercise, to not use gas, to get the fresh air. We know of several families that have sold their bikes, too dangerous. The MMP are sometimes a real hazard for sure. When riding the bike, here is some safety suggestions:. a. On a MMP have a good rear view mirror, when a cart is approaching from the rear, I stop pedaling, I move over as far as possible and sometimes on the grass to avoid problems. b. Watch oncoming carts and others who "must" pass and cramp all the available space, they ignore the 3 foot rule and there is no way of catching them or reporting them, it is just look out for your own safety because there are not many who care about your safety or mine. c. At a crosswalk, I will not go in front of a stopped car, just wave them on. Caution, if you go in front of that stopped car, and if he gets rear ended, you will get hit, so wait and be safe.
d. Not much can be done here for safety as the authorities are not readily available, the drinking is excessive and as one lawyer friend said: It will all come to a screeching halt someday, we hope. e. There could be a cart registration with an identity # as in boats, so a person could report a wild driver and catch some of the drunks who drink heavily and drive like going to a fire.
Have you noted on here, the folks who want the cart to do 22 instead of 20 MPH? OK, so in traveling a distance of half a mile, they risk life and limb of themselves and others to get to the destination a few seconds earlier.
Oh well, I hear your rebuttals, maybe we do not belong here.
:ho:

[aninjamom]

Any suggestion that a cyclist would swerve into an oncoming lane in an attempt control traffic is not believable. Cyclists do, however, go out of there way to avoid cars. We aren't really hearing the whole story and probably never will. Let's just leave with the following thought: let's try to look out for other cars, cyclists, golf carts, and pedestrians.

Wrong. It was not a "suggestion", I did not make it up. It was in broad daylight. It was the reason for my post in the first place! The guy on the bicycle - one of the "low" ones no less, swerved OVER the center line and into my path, then swerved back and started flapping his arm at me to slow down. The arrogant stupidity of it made me very angry. If I had hit him, I'm sure it would have been made my fault somehow.

[Polar Bear]

There are different State design standards for roads of various classifications...arterial, collector, local, etc..

The roads in The Villages are not sub-standard.

Bicycles (or cars for that matter) are not required to hug road edges or lane lines. It is perfectly legal for bikes to ride in the center of the lane. So if accommodation of the width of a car, plus the width of a bicycle, plus three feet, plus a reasonable safety margin on each side, was considered standard, almost all roads anywhere would be considered sub-standard.

[njbchbum]

I apologize, tucillo - it was, indeed, njbchbum who made that claim, not you. I have edited my post to correct my error.

"Claim"? LOL I asked a question - you failed to quote it as so!

"Would this part of the statute not mean that it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit?"

[Topspinmo]

Who would not want 15 or more bikers come to stop one at time and alternate at intersections? I don't, I don't want to have to be 25 in line waiting while biker stops his momentum and has to start back up. IMO let go through and be done with it. Now for walkers walking against the flow of traffic in diamond lane or no diamond lane. YOU see on coming traffic when car over takes cart and all three of you may meet. Why put yourself or the person in the cart in danger step off the street, I do it all the time even if it's not close, cause I don't know what the cart driver or the car driver going to do. Why get somebody including yourself hurt or killed cause I'm walking here. Now for the walkers walking 2 plus abreast, again why risk somebody getting hurt. Just fall in single file till the danger over. I had four walking side by side on MMP I actually had to stop cause I couldn't move my cart off the path due to scrubs next to the cart lane. They looked as me like - why are you in our road!

[Paper1]

I belong to one of the bike clubs here in Villages and have put a lot of miles on Morse and Buena Vista mostly riding by myself. Although I can legally “take the lane” I choose to ride close to white line to allow traffic behind me to pass hoping cars will use good judgement and adhere to 3’ law. Most of the time I have no problem but there are many that go by me much closer than 36” although majority of drivers are very considerate. I too have a hard time believing a bike rider in a club group would travel into an oncoming lane to make some kind of statement. That said I wasn’t there.

[tuccillo]

The term is actually "sub-standard width" and applies to all of the roads in The Villages. The reason that cyclists can "take the lane" legally is because the roads are of "sub-standard width". It could be that few roads (anywhere) are actually "standard width". This is actually an important concept as I suspect many don't realize that cars must move into another lane to pass a cyclist as the lanes are not wide enough for a car, cyclist, and 3 feet of clearance.

There are different State design standards for roads of various classifications...arterial, collector, local, etc..

The roads in The Villages are not sub-standard.

Bicycles (or cars for that matter) are not required to hug road edges or lane lines. It is perfectly legal for bikes to ride in the center of the lane. So if accommodation of the width of a car, plus the width of a bicycle, plus three feet, plus a reasonable safety margin on each side, was considered standard, almost all roads anywhere would be considered sub-standard.

[Aloha1]

The term is actually "sub-standard width" and applies to all of the roads in The Villages. The reason that cyclists can "take the lane" legally is because the roads are of "sub-standard width". It could be that few roads (anywhere) are actually "standard width". This is actually an important concept as I suspect many don't realize that cars must move into another lane to pass a cyclist as the lanes are not wide enough for a car, cyclist, and 3 feet of clearance.

To post the old oft quoted wisdom: "Just because you can doesn't mean you should".

[Polar Bear]

The term is actually "sub-standard width" and applies to all of the roads in The Villages. The reason that cyclists can "take the lane" legally is because the roads are of "sub-standard width". It could be that few roads (anywhere) are actually "standard width". This is actually an important concept as I suspect many don't realize that cars must move into another lane to pass a cyclist as the lanes are not wide enough for a car, cyclist, and 3 feet of clearance.
Your “standard” specifies what is considered to be acceptable for safe passing of bicycles. No argument there.

But it in no way describes what are considered standard road widths in the State of Florida.

Federal Highway Administration (https://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/geometric/pubs/mitigationstrategies/chapter3/3_lanewidth.cfm)

Florida, as most states, adheres to Federal Highway Administration (FHWA) standards for road design, including lane widths.

You will find that almost all streets/roads in TV fall within the accepted standards for lane widths.

[tuccillo]

Do you ride?

To post the old oft quoted wisdom: "Just because you can doesn't mean you should".

[tuccillo]

I did find a references that indicated that 14' was a "standard" or "wide" width that would allow the sharing of a lane by a car and a bike. That notwithstanding, the FL statute would lead one to believe that the wording "sub-standard width" or "narrow" is defined within the statute itself as a road not wide enough for a car and bike. So, I see your point that that statute terminology is not aligned with FHWA terminology.


Your “standard” specifies what is considered to be acceptable for safe passing of bicycles. No argument there.

But it in no way describes what are considered standard road widths in the State of Florida.

Federal Highway Administration (https://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/geometric/pubs/mitigationstrategies/chapter3/3_lanewidth.cfm)

Florida, as most states, adheres to Federal Highway Administration (FHWA) standards for road design, including lane widths.

You will find that almost all streets/roads in TV fall within the accepted standards for lane widths.

[Arctic Fox]

"Claim"? LOL I asked a question - you failed to quote it as so!

"Would this part of the statute not mean that it is the duty of the person riding the bike in the roadway to maintain the posted speed limit?"

I think you are misunderstanding the word "limit".

A 30mph speed limit means that you cannot legally go faster than 30mph, not that everyone has to travel at exactly that speed (or, presumably, above it).

[rubicon]

Wrong. It was not a "suggestion", I did not make it up. It was in broad daylight. It was the reason for my post in the first place! The guy on the bicycle - one of the "low" ones no less, swerved OVER the center line and into my path, then swerved back and started flapping his arm at me to slow down. The arrogant stupidity of it made me very angry. If I had hit him, I'm sure it would have been made my fault somehow.

I believe what you say. too often judge a situation based on what they would do or wouldn't do. I would never think of robbing a bank but there are some people that would do it for the adrenaline rush.

In order to be an objective and apt investigator you have to work at not thinking of what you would do because it represses the possibilities ( expect the unexpected).

Personal Best Regards:

[rubicon]

The term is actually "sub-standard width" and applies to all of the roads in The Villages. The reason that cyclists can "take the lane" legally is because the roads are of "sub-standard width". It could be that few roads (anywhere) are actually "standard width". This is actually an important concept as I suspect many don't realize that cars must move into another lane to pass a cyclist as the lanes are not wide enough for a car, cyclist, and 3 feet of clearance.

Simply stated the roads in The Villages when constructed fit the times/use/purpose before The Villages began expanding. What we are all saying is that The Village growing population makes them inadequate.

We have seen continual road construction in and around The Villages but with the fast growing population, government bureaucracy, cost/budget limitations, etc they are not moving fast enough .

In my personal view I believe The Villages's has design flaws. There should have been bike/walking trails. The MMP should have been restrict to golf carts only.

I believe that every time I am on a MMP observing walkers concerned looks as carts approach them. I am convinced every time I am on a MMP and behind a bicyclist that is moving a snails pace.

I do not gt mad at these walkers or bicyclist I get mad at the planners and designers.

I will come to a complete stop or close to one as I approach a walker because I do not want to scare the bejesus out of them

Personal Best Regards:

[Polar Bear]

Simply stated the roads in The Villages when constructed fit the times/use/purpose before The Villages began expanding. What we are all saying is that The Village growing population makes them inadequate.

We have seen continual road construction in and around The Villages but with the fast growing population, government bureaucracy, cost/budget limitations, etc they are not moving fast enough .
In my personal view I believe The Villages's has design flaws. There should have been bike/walking trails. The MMP should have been restrict to golf carts only.

I believe that every time I am on a MMP observing walkers concerned looks as carts approach them. I am convinced every time I am on a MMP and behind a bicyclist that is moving a snails pace.


I do not gt mad at these walkers or bicyclist I get mad at the planners and designers.

I will come to a complete stop or close to one as I approach a walker because I do not want to scare the bejesus out of them

Personal Best Regards:
First of all, recent posts were discussing lane widths. Just lane widths. And lane widths in TV are not sub-standard by accepted engineering design standards.

And we are ALL saying TV roads are inadequate?? Not even close. I think many realize TV infrastructure is well designed and excellent. Perfect? Of course not. But I don't get mad at TV planners and designers. I admire them and applaud them for their planning, design and implementation.

[njbchbum]

I think you are misunderstanding the word "limit".

A 30mph speed limit means that you cannot legally go faster than 30mph, not that everyone has to travel at exactly that speed (or, presumably, above it).

Per multiple other posts throughout TOTV - drivers are HIGHLY criticized for NOT driving at the posted speed limit!!!

Which is it to be? lolololol

[Marathon Man]

Wrong. It was not a "suggestion", I did not make it up. It was in broad daylight. It was the reason for my post in the first place! The guy on the bicycle - one of the "low" ones no less, swerved OVER the center line and into my path, then swerved back and started flapping his arm at me to slow down. The arrogant stupidity of it made me very angry. If I had hit him, I'm sure it would have been made my fault somehow.

Is it possible that he made an emergency maneuver that forced him into your lane, and his arm gesture was an apology?

[Aloha1]

Do you ride?

Only for fun, and not in a pack.

[dewilson58]

Most bikers (motorcycle & bicycle), most drivers (cars & carts) and most walkers/runners are alert,defensive and follow the laws/rules, but there are a few morons in each category.

Always has been, Always will be.

:duck:

[Polar Bear]

Most bikers (motorcycle & bicycle), most drivers (cars & carts) and most walkers/runners are alert,defensive and follow the laws/rules, but there are a few morons in each category.

Always has been, Always will be.

:duck:
Pretty well sums it up.