Glenn Beck Appearance

[Guest]

I have heard that the numbers of attendees reported at some of these guest appearances have been over-reported. For instance, 25,000 for Glenn Beck? Some people feel that the crowd numbered more like 5,000. Same with Sarah Palin's last appearance. Beck's "plan" seems like what everyone wants, but how many are willing to make any kind of sacrifice? Let's hear how enthusiastic people will get if called upon to state what they can promise or have already done to carry out his fantasy. Same with health reform. Nobody wants to "give", only to "get".

[Guest]

Interesting questions, but I think this topic belongs in Political.

[Guest]

I have heard that the numbers of attendees reported at some of these guest appearances have been over-reported. For instance, 25,000 for Glenn Beck? Some people feel that the crowd numbered more like 5,000. Same with Sarah Palin's last appearance. Beck's "plan" seems like what everyone wants, but how many are willing to make any kind of sacrifice? Let's hear how enthusiastic people will get if called upon to state what they can promise or have already done to carry out his fantasy. Same with health reform. Nobody wants to "give", only to "get".

What happend to that original number you threw out there of 125,000....still curious where you heard that ????

[Guest]

I have heard that the numbers of attendees reported at some of these guest appearances have been over-reported. For instance, 25,000 for Glenn Beck? Some people feel that the crowd numbered more like 5,000. Same with Sarah Palin's last appearance. Beck's "plan" seems like what everyone wants, but how many are willing to make any kind of sacrifice? Let's hear how enthusiastic people will get if called upon to state what they can promise or have already done to carry out his fantasy. Same with health reform. Nobody wants to "give", only to "get".

I was there so I cannot say how many people were there other than a whole lot. I spoke with several people who were from outside of TV. I didn't get a hint of welfare people but working stiffs who love God & country. These people could be revolutionaries. They are angry about government spending and control.

Will these people follow Becks 100 yr plan? I don't know. I am willing to bet they will for the next 3 or 4 elections. That is all they need. They know that if they get back to a conservative type government, with tax cuts for tax payers, that rewards work not sloth and a military that undertakes no war that it does not intend to win. they will prosper.

I was surprised at the number of young people who were there. I am encouraged.

The real question will prove to be: Does Glen Beck have enough followers to make a difference? Time will tell. I hope so.

Just some thoughts.

Yoda

[Guest]

Glen Beck is one of the most intelligent men in the country a truly gifted thinker with a command of communication like few men in history. he is also a Conservative.

This is why he is a perfect example of what leads Liberals to fear him and begin their tirades to destroy him personally without any attempt to address the issues he raises.

[Guest]

The larger figure was word-of-mouth. The lesser one was from the newspaper. An attendee gave his estimate.

[Guest]

Many of us do not take Glenn Beck seriously...rather we view him as nothing more than an entertainer and promoter (and a good one at that).

[Guest]

Beck and O'Reilly and FNC are posting massive ratings, consistently trouncing rival cable network news/opinion programs. The vast center-right numbers of the mainstream American populace have been stifled, conned and swindled by the corrupt pols of DC long enough; we're ready for the Revolution our founding fathers would demand.

Ask bold questions,
Speak without fear,
Hold to the truth

[Guest]

Many of us do not take Glenn Beck seriously...rather we view him as nothing more than an entertainer and promoter (and a good one at that).

How would you describe Obama?

[Guest]

POTUS...with three years to go. Let's see how he does and we'll decide then.

[Guest]

That will be too late.

Why don't you hold off on Beck for three more years to be fair?

[Guest]

Glen Beck is one of the most intelligent men in the country a truly gifted thinker with a command of communication like few men in history. he is also a Conservative.

This is why he is a perfect example of what leads Liberals to fear him and begin their tirades to destroy him personally without any attempt to address the issues he raises.

I can't imagine why you think Liberals fear Glen Beck or Sarah Palin??? It's simply not true. What is your reasoning behind this statement. Just curious???:shrug:

[Guest]

Many of us do not take Glenn Beck seriously...rather we view him as nothing more than an entertainer and promoter (and a good one at that).

What is it that Glen Beck says, that you disagree with?

Yoda

[Guest]

He plays loose with facts and often prefaces a comment thusly" "I can't prove this, but what if..."
Isn't that called "making things up?"

[Guest]

He plays loose with facts and often prefaces a comment thusly" "I can't prove this, but what if..."
Isn't that called "making things up?"

I agree! He's not a commentator, he's a storyteller, including all the tears and drama. :yuck:

[Guest]

He plays loose with facts and often prefaces a comment thusly" "I can't prove this, but what if..."
Isn't that called "making things up?"

I am not a big fan of Beck actually, but find it strange that you call him a liar...ok, you didnt say liar but your sure implied that....AND I would ask you to present a situation IN CONTEXT of his not telling the truth ! I assume this should be very easy based on your posts !

Thanks

[Guest]

I am not a big fan of Beck actually, but find it strange that you call him a liar...ok, you didnt say liar but your sure implied that....AND I would ask you to present a situation IN CONTEXT of his not telling the truth ! I assume this should be very easy based on your posts !

Thanks

DITTO!

Yoda :popcorn:

[Guest]

Beck speaks for himself...it is up to him to support or justify his claims, assertions and innuendos. Surprise...he doesn't.
You ask me to identify when he is wrong? I suggest that you analyze what he says and investigate it for yourself. Otherwise, you seem willing to accept as 'gospel' whatever he suggests or insinuates. That is a sheep mentality.
You tell me where he has been correct...and identify the sources for his claims and your support for them.
I can be convinced...but you have to prove it.
I look forward to your reply.

[Guest]

That will be too late.

Why don't you hold off on Beck for three more years to be fair?

The people of USA didn't vote for Beck for anything, let alone a term of four years with three more to go. He's been harping his stuff for way longer than the current occupant of the White House has been in office.

Most of us -- by both popular vote (including the voters in Florida!) and electoral vote -- voted for Obama as POTUS for four years.

Obama will be held accountable in 2012...Beck will never be held accountable until his book sales, ratings and advertising dollars slump. By the way, his advertising dollars have recently been dropping.

I don't have to give Beck any more time. He's a charlatan and a self-promoter. His interest is his own wallet...his histrionics and crocodile tears are sad and pathetic. I'm sorry that you do not see through him. He's selling books, pure and simple.

This country has problems...but they are surmountable if we pull together and get off the partisan/divisive crap. Beck and his cohorts offer nothing but negative thinking...they prey on people's concerns and disappointments and stoke the fires of fear to build ratings and sell books They offer ZERO alternatives.

Beck was to reveal last Saturday here in The Villages, his plan. He presented bupkus...alluded to a 100-year plan. A 100-year plan defacto doesn't apply to us. Neither he nor we will be here to know if it worked or failed. He has outdone Mao Tse Tung with his infamous five-year and ten-year plans!

It appears that you are not happy with some things in this country's direction. I'm not either. But Glenn Beck's stuff is about him, not us.
Please think this through...for you, for me, for our children and grandchildren.

[Guest]

That will be too late.

Why don't you hold off on Beck for three more years to be fair?

Why don't you hold off on Obama for three more years?

[Guest]

Beck speaks for himself...it is up to him to support or justify his claims, assertions and innuendos. Surprise...he doesn't.
You ask me to identify when he is wrong? I suggest that you analyze what he says and investigate it for yourself. Otherwise, you seem willing to accept as 'gospel' whatever he suggests or insinuates. That is a sheep mentality.
You tell me where he has been correct...and identify the sources for his claims and your support for them.
I can be convinced...but you have to prove it.
I look forward to your reply.


Sorry...you wont draw me into a conversation like this. YOU implied he was a liar...I think that is a very strong accusation and asked you to validate it...you cant.....chapter closed !

[Guest]

Beck speaks for himself...it is up to him to support or justify his claims, assertions and innuendos. Surprise...he doesn't.
You ask me to identify when he is wrong? I suggest that you analyze what he says and investigate it for yourself. Otherwise, you seem willing to accept as 'gospel' whatever he suggests or insinuates. That is a sheep mentality.
You tell me where he has been correct...and identify the sources for his claims and your support for them.
I can be convinced...but you have to prove it.
I look forward to your reply.

EXCELLENT - giving the homework assignment. It's usually the other way around. :pepper2::pepper2::pepper2::pepper2::pepper2:

[Guest]

Otherwise, you seem willing to accept as 'gospel' whatever he suggests or insinuates. That is a sheep mentality.

Sounds a little like Obama voters. :icon_wink:

[Guest]

Beck speaks for himself...it is up to him to support or justify his claims, assertions and innuendos. Surprise...he doesn't.
You ask me to identify when he is wrong? I suggest that you analyze what he says and investigate it for yourself. Otherwise, you seem willing to accept as 'gospel' whatever he suggests or insinuates. That is a sheep mentality.
You tell me where he has been correct...and identify the sources for his claims and your support for them.
I can be convinced...but you have to prove it.
I look forward to your reply.

Here is one for you. For years Glen Beck said that Global Warming was a Liberal hoax and nothing but another scheme to create more taxes and bigger Government.

Now that it can be shown that Beck was correct. What do you say?

[Guest]

Here is one for you. For years Glen Beck said that Global Warming was a Liberal hoax and nothing but another scheme to create more taxes and bigger Government.

Now that it can be shown that Beck was correct. What do you say?

So, show me how 'he is correct?'

[Guest]

Absolutely nothing has been shown that he's incorrect. In fact new things are coming to light such as the emails that prove numbers are being doctored and withheld by the supposed experts. Add a little common sense into the mix and the conclusion is simple. It's a scam.

I'll quote myself.

Guess what... even if the climate is changing which I'm sure it has been for millions of years, there's not a damn thing we can do about it one way or the other.

We didn't create the earth nor do we control it's climate no more than we can control the weather. There's larger and greater forces at work than wee little humans.

Anyone who tells you different, follow the money. Trust me, there are tens of billions to be made. We'll pay it and others will get it.

[Guest]

So Beck so declares on global warming and smugly says that it's a liberal thing...whatever that is supposed to mean.
I don't believe he has any science background to merit dismissing the work of climatologists around the world.
Let's wait for him to declare that the world was flat but that liberals rounded it out.

[Guest]

It's not a matter of what Beck says, it's pure common sense. We can't control the weather anymore that we can affect the global climate.

What we can seemingly do as humans is scam each other into believing there is a global crisis so that some are willing to pay big dollars to others to save the world.

Millions of dollars in government grants to scientists that fudge the data to keep the pay checks coming, new reasons for massive tax increases that governments collect of course, etc, etc, etc. It is a scam with a very ugly dark side.

[Guest]

So Beck so declares on global warming and smugly says that it's a liberal thing...whatever that is supposed to mean.
I don't believe he has any science background to merit dismissing the work of climatologists around the world.
Let's wait for him to declare that the world was flat but that liberals rounded it out.

If you wish a scientific presentation on the subject of global warming (AGW), I would refer you to Richard S. Lindzen, The Alfred P. Sloan Professor of Atmospheric Sciences at The Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT). This presentation, titled Deconstructing Global Warming was made on October 26th of this year.

http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/cooler_heads_lindzen-talk-pdf.pdf

If you wish your information packaged in a way similar to that done by Al Gore, I suggest the presentation done by Lord Christopher Monckton on October 15th of this year.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stij8sUybx0

If after reading Dr Lindzen’s report and watching Lord Monckton’s presentation, you still believe that there is no scientific basis for skepticism about the claims for AGW, then I will wish to discuss some excellent land I have for sale 50 miles west of Miami. Don't just read whatever comes in the newspaper or is broadcast on tv and take it as gospel. Go look up the data on the various NOAA and NASA web sites. Before you buy into Cap and Trade, look at who is backing it and why.

[Guest]

If Fox News is not a part of your news team, you are not getting enough information.

IMHO

Yoda
\

[Guest]

of the fate of the polar ice-cap is presented here - http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/seaice/extent/AMSRE_Sea_Ice_Extent.png

The data goes back to only 2002 since that is when AMERSE was formed as a joint project between NASA and The Japanese Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXX). The data is honest as you would expect from these two agencies. The conclusion is clear; polar ice is NOT going away.

I again urge everyone to check the source data and avoid the alarmist statements in the news media. You sell many more papers by printing that, "...Florida will soon be under water and hurricanes are growing stronger because of global warming" than you will by simply stating the truth.

[Guest]

Yeah, Fox claims that it is 'fair and balanced' and the 'voice of the opposition.'
Next you'll tell me that there is no contradiction in that.
Believe what you want to; you still have produced no proof.
Buy his books and continue to enrich him. You and Beck's other acolytes pay his welfare.
The polar ice cap is shrinking, the seas are rising, co2 emissions are increasing and mankind has nothing to do with it?
How blissful it all is.
P.S. Citing "Lord Monckton" is pathetic. He is not a lord (a title reserved for legitimate members of the British House of Lords) and has no science background.
He's a schill (paid for by whom?) who has been previously discredited for views on a variety of issues. Guess who dug him as an 'expert' on global warming -- your good buddy Glenn Beck.
Never let facts get in the way of telling a good story.

[Guest]

Yeah, Fox claims that it is 'fair and balanced' and the 'voice of the opposition.'
Next you'll tell me that there is no contradiction in that.
Believe what you want to; you still have produced no proof.
Buy his books and continue to enrich him. You and Beck's other acolytes pay his welfare.
The polar ice cap is shrinking, the seas are rising, co2 emissions are increasing and mankind has nothing to do with it?
How blissful it all is.
P.S. Citing "Lord Monckton" is pathetic. He is not a lord (a title reserved for legitimate members of the British House of Lords) and has no science background.
He's a schill (paid for by whom?) who has been previously discredited for views on a variety of issues. Guess who dug him as an 'expert' on global warming -- your good buddy Glenn Beck.
Never let facts get in the way of telling a good story.

I take it you have not gone to the sources I suggested. Does this mean that you prefer ignorance and loud shouting to actually checking the facts?

Fact one: Christopher Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Benchley, is a British politician, business consultant, policy adviser, writer, columnist, inventor and hereditary peer.
Fact two: Lord Monckton served as Margaret Thatcher’s science advisor – providing him with a significantly stronger scientific background than Al Gore.
Fact three: Lord Monckton was well known, as were his views, long before any of us heard of Glenn Beck.
Fact four: The seas are not rising any faster than they have for the last few thousand years.
Fact five: Al Gore has gone on record saying that he deliberately overstated the case for global warming –in other words – lied.
Fact six: The concept for cap and trade was developed by Enron and first presented to then President Clinton and VP Gore in a White House meeting by none other than Ken Lay.
Fact seven: Al Gore went on to become chairman of a London based carbon trading company that has made him a very rich man. No conflict if interest here?! Follow the money, as people often say.

Take time to read Professor Lindzen’s presentation. Go back and look at the data on total sea ice. Then tell me again where I am in error and provide data to support your views.

[Guest]

"Lord" Monckton is neither a lord (never elected to Britain's House of Lords) nor a scientist and his pitch has been widely read and discredited.

[Guest]

Why Liberals believe all the lies about Global Warming But Conservatives do not ?

[Guest]

Because they put their faith in government. I find it fascinating they won't believe a thing Beck or Limbaugh says but put total faith and believing into what politicians say.

[Guest]

"Lord" Monckton is neither a lord (never elected to Britain's House of Lords) nor a scientist and his pitch has been widely read and discredited.

Election to the House of Lords is not required for a hereditary peerage. You say he has been discredited -'show me the DATA'! I know it's hard for a liberal to understand, but saying the same thing time after time without facts to back you up is less than convincing.

[Guest]

Why is it that distinguished meteorolgists/scientists like Lindzen don't get any press time? My opinion is that the warming crowd doesn't want any debate, period. When there is debate, we can then make intelligent decisions regarding whether the warming is really caused by man. Until then, it will continue to appear to be a poltical movement only.

[Guest]

Because they put their faith in government. I find it fascinating they won't believe a thing Beck or Limbaugh says but put total faith and believing into what politicians say.


DK, if you can't put any faith in your government, you're in the wrong country. I hope you turn down your S.S. Check and Medicare when you're eligible. Make a real statement, not just a word fest! :mornincoffee:

[Guest]

How glib of you. I'll not take what I haven't paid into my whole life and I don't put my faith in any government in any country. My faith comes from elsewhere and my security come from self reliance. I don't look to others to pay my bills, buy my cars or feed my family. Stay out of my bank account with your bleeding heart liberal social programs.

If the feds want to give me a life long refund of the money they've already confiscated I'll gladly opt-out. A word fest is all liberals have because everything they try is an abject bankrupt social failure.

[Guest]

How glib of you. I'll not take what I haven't paid into my whole life and I don't put my faith in any government in any country. My faith comes from elsewhere and my security come from self reliance. I don't look to others to pay my bills, buy my cars or feed my family. Stay out of my bank account with your bleeding heart liberal social programs.

If the feds want to give me a life long refund of the money they've already confiscated I'll gladly opt-out. A word fest is all liberals have because everything they try is an abject bankrupt social failure.

Well, as long as YOU have YOURS, I guess the rest of the country can go chase it's tail! (I cleaned that up!) Hey, have you checked your Bible lately??? I'm just asking...

Proverbs 11:24-25
One man gives freely, yet gains even more; another withholds unduly, but comes to poverty. A generous man will prosper; he who refreshes others will himself be refreshed.

[Guest]

Why is it that distinguished meteorolgists/scientists like Lindzen don't get any press time? My opinion is that the warming crowd doesn't want any debate, period. When there is debate, we can then make intelligent decisions regarding whether the warming is really caused by man. Until then, it will continue to appear to be a poltical movement only.

Why is it that the emails that were discovered that show the fraud and conspiracy that has been used to support the climate change doomers, gets no press? The New York times says that they are true but wont run the story.

Yoda

[Guest]

DK, if you can't put any faith in your government, you're in the wrong country. I hope you turn down your S.S. Check and Medicare when you're eligible. Make a real statement, not just a word fest! :mornincoffee:

Were our founders in the wrong country? They had no faith in the government. They took steps and here we are.

Yoda

[Guest]

Well, as long as YOU have YOURS, I guess the rest of the country can go chase it's tail! (I cleaned that up!) Hey, have you checked your Bible lately??? I'm just asking...

Proverbs 11:24-25
One man gives freely, yet gains even more; another withholds unduly, but comes to poverty. A generous man will prosper; he who refreshes others will himself be refreshed.

Why don't "They" have theirs? What % just made wrong decisions. What % don't belong here. What % don't deserve "Theirs" or mine for that matter.

We as a nation have a long history of taking care of the less fortunate. The government stepped in to see that the greedy got "Theirs" (mine) also.

What % of "Mine" (our) do you think goes to the $150K fat cat congressmen for giving it to the greedy?

It is better that local communities take care of the needy, it's cheaper. It is because of liberals who did not want to part with their own money to help the poor that we have the problems of today. It is they who are selfish.

Yoda

[Guest]

How glib of you. I'll not take what I haven't paid into my whole life and I don't put my faith in any government in any country. My faith comes from elsewhere and my security come from self reliance. I don't look to others to pay my bills, buy my cars or feed my family. Stay out of my bank account with your bleeding heart liberal social programs.

If the feds want to give me a life long refund of the money they've already confiscated I'll gladly opt-out. A word fest is all liberals have because everything they try is an abject bankrupt social failure.

What an attitude. All about me and the H--- with the rest. Good thing the majority doesnt think this way.

[Guest]

What an attitude. All about me and the H--- with the rest. Good thing the majority doesnt think this way.

What is wrong with letting the individual decide who he gives his money to and not the government?

[Guest]

I'm 50 years old and my wife is 53. She stays home and I go to work each and every morning 55-60 hours per week. I've worked full time since I was 18 non-stop. I have no college degree. I make way less than 90k a year, WAY less. I drive a 6 year old truck and my wife drives a 7 year old Jeep. I have a job, decent health benefits 1/2 of which I pay, we give to the church every week and donate regularly to the Good Will and others.

We have a small home out in the country in Tennessee. Our kids and grand kids also live here and from time to time we help them with a little cash if they need it. I'd say a good 30-40% or more of what I earn is taken by the government already in one tax or another. I only have what little I have because I was smart enough to make a few good decisions along the way.

No one gave me a damn thing.

I guess it isn't fair I have a job. I guess it isn't fair that I have health benefits, I guess it isn't fair I can pay my mortgage, I guess it isn't fair that I have a truck when so many can't afford a car at all. I guess just about everything I've worked for all my life isn't fair because I have and others don't. According to Obama and apparently you too, I have too much. I need to give up more.

So my question to all the holier than thou liberals, just how much more do I need to give. How much is enough? Should I give up 60% of my earnings, 70%, 80%, all of it? Tell me Chels, how much of what I earn would you let me to keep to take care of my family?

Will you be happy when I can barely make my mortgage? Maybe you'll be happy if I just give up and go on the government hand-out train? Cap-n-Tax will raise my energy costs significantly. The liberals will let the Bush tax cuts expire so I can pay even more out of my families budget. Maybe it would make you happy if the government punishes the rich evil people who created my job?

What the hell is it you want??? More middle class blood so YOU can sleep better at night?

I give plenty and enough is taken from me in taxes. I'm so sick and tired of the liberal sanctimonious assaults against those like me just because there is a small percentage who can't seem to make it on their own. I can decide just fine on my own where my money goes and who I can help and who i can't. We don't need liberal thieves taking it from us at will all the while voting themselves pay raises whenever they want.

You want to help? Then break out your own damn money and leave mine alone. I have a family to feed.

Have you checked your Bible lately?

2 Thessalonians 3:10

"For even when we were with you, we commanded you this: "If anyone will not work, neither let him eat."

"The slothful hand hath wrought poverty: but the hand of the industrious getteth riches. He that trusteth to lies feedeth the winds: and the same runneth after birds that fly away."

[Guest]

dklassen---BRAVO!!!!

[Guest]

My question is "Why do you keep accusing liberals for wanting to give YOUR money away?"

Our government system didn't spring up over night! Are you saying only Democrats want to help the needy and no Republicans? I'm confused on this whole liberal rant.

Pastor Rick Warren was on Meet the Press this morning and I loved what he said. He said he was not Right Wing or Left Wing, he's the whole bird! He supports our country, our president and our congress. He doesn't want any to fail because that would be saying he wants America to fail. (BTW, he gave 90% of his earnings from his book, Purpose-Driven Life, to the needy. It is only the biggest selling book, next to the Bible, earning 10's of millions. I guess he must be some kind of socialist liberal in sheeps clothing!)

All I see in all of these Right Wing rants is an underlying, salivating, narcissistic war cry of "I got mine so leave me alone!!!! I want Obama to fail!" Oh yeah, that's real clever.

I don't care if you're right, left, or pigeon-toed. If there is one hungry or homeless person in this country, it is a travesty! And I won't stop bringing it to everyone's attention, so put on your ear muffs!

My Dad was my hero. Here was a man that worked hard as a bricklayer all of his life. He provided for my mother and I to the best of his abilities. Then when he came of age, he was "screwed" out of his pension by the bricklayer's union because of a loophole. He should have been bitter. I should be bitter. But no. My Dad was the kind of man, that if he had one dollar left to his name, and you needed it, he would give it to you. Sometimes keep a dime, sometimes not. Never missed a Santa Claus with a bell, or a bucket for Jerry's Kids. And it was not only money, but his time. He was the one digging people's cars out in a snowstorm. The one that would take all the kids in the neighborhood to the Zoo every Sunday, paying for them because many of their parents had even less than we did. He had a giving heart. And do you know, that when he passed away, people came from all around to grieve. You could barely get in the door of the chapel. Don't get me started on giving, because I learned from the best!

We will all be judged one day for our deeds. Faith, hope and charity. Not just words to needlepoint on a pillow!

[Guest]

My question is "Why do you keep accusing liberals for wanting to give YOUR money away?"

Our government system didn't spring up over night! Are you saying only Democrats want to help the needy and no Republicans? I'm confused on this whole liberal rant.

Pastor Rick Warren was on Meet the Press this morning and I loved what he said. He said he was not Right Wing or Left Wing, he's the whole bird! He supports our country, our president and our congress. He doesn't want any to fail because that would be saying he wants America to fail. (BTW, he gave 90% of his earnings from his book, Purpose-Driven Life, to the needy. It is only the biggest selling book, next to the Bible, earning 10's of millions. I guess he must be some kind of socialist liberal in sheeps clothing!)

All I see in all of these Right Wing rants is an underlying, salivating, narcissistic war cry of "I got mine so leave me alone!!!! I want Obama to fail!" Oh yeah, that's real clever.

I don't care if you're right, left, or pigeon-toed. If there is one hungry or homeless person in this country, it is a travesty! And I won't stop bringing it to everyone's attention, so put on your ear muffs!

My Dad was my hero. Here was a man that worked hard as a bricklayer all of his life. He provided for my mother and I to the best of his abilities. Then when he came of age, he was "screwed" out of his pension by the bricklayer's union because of a loophole. He should have been bitter. I should be bitter. But no. My Dad was the kind of man, that if he had one dollar left to his name, and you needed it, he would give it to you. Sometimes keep a dime, sometimes not. Never missed a Santa Claus with a bell, or a bucket for Jerry's Kids. And it was not only money, but his time. He was the one digging people's cars out in a snowstorm. The one that would take all the kids in the neighborhood to the Zoo every Sunday, paying for them because many of their parents had even less than we did. He had a giving heart. And do you know, that when he passed away, people came from all around to grieve. You could barely get in the door of the chapel. Don't get me started on giving, because I learned from the best!

We will all be judged one day for our deeds. Faith, hope and charity. Not just words to needlepoint on a pillow!


I have no problem with your support of all these social programs at all...everyone has their opinions, but jumping to judgements on folks is a bit bothersome.

If you think that those who oppose this particular health bill are not good people, you are wrong. If you think that those who oppose this particular health bill do not care about the needy, you are wrong. That seems to be your thrust in total....you dont discuss how good or bad this is for the country from a pragmatic standpoint which is what we are doing.

I oppose this bill because it is the wrong bill at the wrong time. I do NOT oppose A health insurance bill, but I DO NOT support this one. I hope that is ok with you and your passing judgement on folks who dont approve of this health bill with biblical quotes is, to me anyway, very insulting.

You know how I feel about this President....I abhor and fear the social direction and it has NOTHING to do with what I do or dont do in my giving.....I have said I reserve judgement on his handling of foreign affairs.

I also know with all the hate and such you had for the previous president you surely didnt support him but you expect everyone to bow down and oppose nothing that is done by this administration.

Heck, even the Democrats dont agree on THIS bill, you quote biblical passages because people here and around the country can see the direction this is going !

[Guest]

Bucco, I've said this before and I'll say it again... FOR THE LAST TIME... I do not, nor did I HATE Bush. I don't HATE anyone. Nor did I abhor him. This is part of your dramatic language -- not mine!

I did support Bush, right up until the time all of his lies started to surface. It is my deep belief that he should NEVER have been in office. And before you even start spouting more drama, we're all aware that that's how you feel about Obama. That's fine. It's your opinion.

Never our "twains" shall meet! :)

[Guest]

My question is "Why do you keep accusing liberals for wanting to give YOUR money away?"

Because that's what they do. They take from producers and give to non-produers. That's exactly what Obama is doing right now. Government in general takes and takes and takes. It's NEVER enough and it's not about helping anyone. It's about VOTES and control.

How did they get the 60th vote for the health care debate? They gave 300 million in federal tax payers dollars to a Democrat Senator to buy her off because she was going to vote no. How many poor people could buy health insurance for 300 million?

THINK PEOPLE! It's not about I have mine and now screw you. It's about government taking and taking and taking and doing as they damn well please with it... mostly for their own benefit.

I earned it and I should make the decision who I help and who I don't. Did you ever stop to think how people may be able to help each other or even themselves if the government wasn't picking everyone's pocket for every last red cent?

They all do it and they are all thieves. They are out for themselves and no one else. Democrats are the worst when it comes to that and Republicans hold a close second.

[Guest]

Bucco, I've said this before and I'll say it again... FOR THE LAST TIME... I do not, nor did I HATE Bush. I don't HATE anyone. Nor did I abhor him. This is part of your dramatic language -- not mine!

I did support Bush, right up until the time all of his lies started to surface. It is my deep belief that he should NEVER have been in office. And before you even start spouting more drama, we're all aware that that's how you feel about Obama. That's fine. It's your opinion.

Never our "twains" shall meet! :)


Well, here we go again with that word LIE...strong word !!!! I never use it about anyone unless it is personal. But wont search any posts...just know that your "disregard" "strong dislike" for anyone in that administration is/has been demonstrated. (heck used to be you even didnt like Obama)

HOWEVER, I still think it a bit "self important" to judge with biblical terms those who oppose this particular health bill, because it does not apply on a lot of levels...certainly those words do not apply to those who give but dont want to be TOLD to whom they must give ! Self righteousness is also mentioned quite a bit in the Bible.

[Guest]

Election to the House of Lords is not required for a hereditary peerage. You say he has been discredited -'show me the DATA'! I know it's hard for a liberal to understand, but saying the same thing time after time without facts to back you up is less than convincing.
I'll grant you the peerage point but neither you nor Monckton offer precise info that claims to scientifically say that there is no global warming going on.
What about those island nations that are seeing their above-water land disappear? Who can disprove what they are experiencing?
Forget the politics...what about what is actually happening?

[Guest]

I'll grant you the peerage point but neither you nor Monckton offer precise info that claims to scientifically say that there is no global warming going on.
What about those island nations that are seeing their above-water land disappear? Who can disprove what they are experiencing?
Forget the politics...what about what is actually happening?

What are you reading. Where did you get the idea that we are now experiencing global warming. You must be still reading the Gorey lies. If You do not believe that the global warming hoax has been exposed then there is no more I can say to you.

[Guest]

It has been several days since I asked for substantive information from those of you who claim to debunk the scientific claim that there is global warming...global climate change...even Sarah Palin acknowledges it.
Why are you so silent?

[Guest]

Sorry...you wont draw me into a conversation like this. YOU implied he was a liar...I think that is a very strong accusation and asked you to validate it...you cant.....chapter closed !
I did not imply anything...you inferred stuff that was not on my mind.

[Guest]

[QUOTE=saratogaman;237536]I did not imply anything...you inferred stuff that was not on my mind.

Okay...state your point...substantiate your point of view...and let's discuss ir.

[Guest]

Saratogaman--- Of course there is climate change. Always and forever. Sarah Palin believes in climate change, as does everybody, but she does not believe it is man made.

[Guest]

It is stupid to think that Man not God can change the climate.

[Guest]

Saratogaman--- Of course there is climate change. Always and forever. Sarah Palin believes in climate change, as does everybody, but she does not believe it is man made.

Sally, if this is your position, are you saying you don't think "man" has contributed and accelerated it either? And what are your thoughts on air pollution? :024:

[Guest]

Chels--- Yes, I think man can pollute the air, to a degree. I know you're from Chicago. Remember how horrible Gary, IN was, years ago? Becasue of the mills you couldn't see the sky. Steps were taken and it is much better now. What I don't agree with is that man can cause seas to rise etc.etc. I think it is all about control, as is the health care bill. Just my opinion.

[Guest]

Chels--- Yes, I think man can pollute the air, to a degree. I know you're from Chicago. Remember how horrible Gary, IN was, years ago? Becasue of the mills you couldn't see the sky. Steps were taken and it is much better now. What I don't agree with is that man can cause seas to rise etc.etc. I think it is all about control, as is the health care bill. Just my opinion.

Sally you say it so well. God bless people like you who have the ability to think without being influenced by idiology.

[Guest]

It has been several days since I asked for substantive information from those of you who claim to debunk the scientific claim that there is global warming...global climate change...even Sarah Palin acknowledges it.
Why are you so silent?

Here are two very honest takes on climate change. The first is an article in the November 30, 2009 WSJ titled, “The Climate Science Isn’t Settled” by Richard S. Lindzen, Sloan Professor of Meteorology at MIT.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703939404574567423917025400.html

This second article is a slide presentation detailing the, “Thirty Five Inconvenient Truths”, in Al Gore’s movies that have come to be accepted the ‘overwhelming scientific consensus.’

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/monckton/goreerrors.html

If you would like further information, I can provide it, including open statements of skepticism by a Nobel Prize winning physicist. I would have posted sooner, but had not been following this thread.

[Guest]

global warming is as bad for us as they say health care reform is good for us!!!!

:icon_bored:btk

[Guest]

Given how eager the news is to tear down people who are 'on top', I'm surprised many of these connections don't get more press. I mean, they were all over Clinton - so it can't really be a Democrat/GOP thing.

[Guest]

I'll grant you the peerage point but neither you nor Monckton offer precise info that claims to scientifically say that there is no global warming going on.
What about those island nations that are seeing their above-water land disappear? Who can disprove what they are experiencing?
Forget the politics...what about what is actually happening?

I's been more than a few days since I first replied to your question and I decided to add a little bit more evidence.

Real data concerning such things as warming and rising sea level has been requested. First, let’s deal with warming. The best source of data from a consistently measured source is the US NCDC Annual Climate Review. This source provides annual data including average annual temperature for the United States. Source site- http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/2008/ann/us-summary.html

Even a casual perusal of this site with show two significant warming periods:

The first from 1895 to 1934 - a rise of 4.8 degrees Fahrenheit.
The second from 1978 to 1998 – a rise of 4.2 degrees Fahrenheit.

Both these periods had a high temperature of 55.0 degrees Fahrenheit.

The first cooling period went from 1994 to 1978 – a drop of 4 degrees Fahrenheit.
The second cooling period began in 1998 and through 2008 has shown a drop of 2 degrees Fahrenheit to 53.0 degrees. This is only 0.2 degrees above the 20th century average of 52.8 degrees.

The second subject is “What about those island nations that are seeing their above-water land disappear?” To look at this objectively, I again go back to data provided by The National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration, NOAA.

The data from 149 stations around the world is summarized at http://www.pol.ac.uk/psmsl/psmsl_individual_stations.html The period of time measured varies from a few decades to well over 150 years. The locations go from Reykjavik, Iceland to Argentine Islands, Antarctica hitting 147 points around the world in between. Some of the stations show sea level rising and some show it dropping. This nasty old world of ours insists on variation over time.

Anyone is welcome to go to the source documents and examine them and then draw conclusions, however, after do a spreadsheet analysis of the data, I found the average rate of sea level rise to be 2.42” per century. This is hardly a disaster in the making.

Is our globe warming at this time? I believe, though am not sure, the answer is yes. We are certainly warmer than we were in the 18th century when the East River regularly froze over. We are certainly cooler than we were when the Vikings established colonies on Greenland and supported an agrarian life style there.

Is there any evidence that the causes of this warming, in contrast to others that have gone before it, are anthropogenic? In MYHO the answer is to this is an emphatic NO!
What we need to fear is not global warming, but global cooling. Ice ages have dominated the history of the earth with for every 15 to 20 thousand years of warming, such as we enjoy now, there were centuries of cold. In severe cases, this resulted in ‘ice-ball’ earth. The last ice age came to an end about 18,00 years ago when the ice above what is now Chicago was over three miles deep. Imagine the impact on our ‘bread basket’ of this vast cold and then imagine how many of us could exist in this bare earth with only ice and desert.

Just my thoughts. I’d love to hear positions supporting anthropogenic global warming, and/or anthropogenic climate change, backed up with real scientific data rather the scare mongering tactics now employed. Can anyone supply this, please?

[Guest]

I wish I had the source data - but I was watching a report that was done on atmosperic temperatures in the aftermath of 9/11 - when there were no planes in the sky other than a few military aircraft. If I remember correctly, there was a measurable amount of cooling when the airplanes weren't contributing to atmospheric pollution - which then went "back to normal" when the planes started flying again.

So, again, there are even more factors to consider and we DON'T have all the answers.

[Guest]

I wish I had the source data - but I was watching a report that was done on atmosperic temperatures in the aftermath of 9/11 - when there were no planes in the sky other than a few military aircraft. If I remember correctly, there was a measurable amount of cooling when the airplanes weren't contributing to atmospheric pollution - which then went "back to normal" when the planes started flying again.

So, again, there are even more factors to consider and we DON'T have all the answers.

I quite agree- unfortunately the source data for 1999-2001 has been redacted by NOAA. http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/index.php

While we do not have all the information, we do know that last year and by projections this year are back to the 1900-2000 mean. No'global warming' here. We do know that total sea ice area remains unchanged over the last thirty years per NASA reports and we do know that sea levels have not been rising at a rate above previous centuries. The question remains, "How long will we continue to listen to special interest groups and ignore the scientific data?"

BTW, Saratogaman I am still waiting for some data supporting your beliefs. I have provided a great deal of data supporting skepticism, but have seen no data that justifies the religious fervor of the climate change believers. Please spare us rants from Al Gore, the Island nations, etc. Just give us the data.

[Guest]

Did anyone see Beck's appearance on Leno from Friday night? I was, to say the least, surprised.