Villages really helping small businesses?

[72lions]

The headline in today’s paper says that Villages is taking big steps to help small businesses. When you read the article, all it talks about is the Village owned bank doing what every other bank is doing to help process loans under the new federal law. Wouldn’t it be nice to learn that the Villages was taking some steps to postpone or reduce lease payments being made by retail owners during this trying time?

[billethkid]

In my opinion TV will not make such a pronouncement.
Based on past behavior/experience they would more likely deal one on one with tenants as and or if they come forward.

They also have an option of sorts to defer "current" rent payments and have till the end of the existing lease to repay.

While I do not know for sure, one would think since they do own banks here, they might be able to establish a priority processing for tenants.

Not being negative, just offering observations. It would be a pleasant surprise if they came forward with a specific action....like rent deferral or even forgiveness. They would in turn be able to accumulate a revenue loss claim and submit it to the government for reimbursing.

[Bogie Shooter]

The headline in today’s paper says that Villages is taking big steps to help small businesses. When you read the article, all it talks about is the Village owned bank doing what every other bank is doing to help process loans under the new federal law. Wouldn’t it be nice to learn that the Villages was taking some steps to postpone or reduce lease payments being made by retail owners during this trying time?

Isn't that what the loans are for? Keep your employees and the loan is forgiven.

[retiredguy123]

Isn't that what the loans are for? Keep your employees and the loan is forgiven.
I think a business owner can get a loan for 2.5 months of their payroll. Then, if they continue to pay the employees, the loan will be forgiven. I don't think that has any effect on their rent. But, in fairness, a business that shuts down has two victims, the tenant and the landlord.

[JoMar]

Do you have information on other Developers that are reducing or forgiving rent or is this just a bash the Morse post?

[Michigan Farmer]

Yes, Yes, Yes!!!!

[davidakins]

I think a business owner can get a loan for 2.5 months of their payroll. Then, if they continue to pay the employees, the loan will be forgiven. I don't think that has any effect on their rent. But, in fairness, a business that shuts down has two victims, the tenant and the landlord.

Below is a copy of the summary of the loan specs from the SBA website:
"Loan Information
The Paycheck Protection Program is a loan designed to provide a direct incentive for small businesses to keep their workers on the payroll.

SBA will forgive loans if all employees are kept on the payroll for eight weeks and the money is used for payroll, rent, mortgage interest, or utilities.

You can apply through any existing SBA 7(a) lender or through any federally insured depository institution, federally insured credit union, and Farm Credit System institution that is participating. Other regulated lenders will be available to make these loans once they are approved and enrolled in the program. You should consult with your local lender as to whether it is participating in the program.

Lenders may begin processing loan applications as soon as April 3, 2020. The Paycheck Protection Program will be available through June 30, 2020."

As for the developer, they probably debt-financed the building of the commercial property leased out in The Villages. This means they have mortgage payments to make. Not knowing how many they employ, but assuming they have more than 500 employees, they would not qualify for this particular program.

I believe it would be an invalid assumption to think all landlords forgive lease payments due to the fact that the landlords have mortgage payments to make. Of course, the bank earns money via the interest earned on the mortgage loans. It is a more complex chain of events than the average person thinks.

If the landlords do not have debt related to the property they own, they would be in a more flexible position to reduce or delay the receipt of rents.

Just some things to consider...l

[BlueHeronFan]

The headline in today’s paper says that Villages is taking big steps to help small businesses. When you read the article, all it talks about is the Village owned bank doing what every other bank is doing to help process loans under the new federal law. Wouldn’t it be nice to learn that the Villages was taking some steps to postpone or reduce lease payments being made by retail owners during this trying time?
It would sure be nice for some info on the $155 monthly amenity fee not being able to use, or the rec center gym membership I just renewed before they closed the rec centers. Just some info. Not too much to ask.

[biker1]

With regard to the amenity fee, what do you want to know? The executive courses are still being maintained, the debt on the amenities is still being paid, the pools are still being maintained, the utilities on the rec centers are still being paid, etc.

It would sure be nice for some info on the $155 monthly amenity fee not being able to use, or the rec center gym membership I just renewed before they closed the rec centers. Just some info. Not too much to ask.

[retiredguy123]

The headline in today’s paper says that Villages is taking big steps to help small businesses. When you read the article, all it talks about is the Village owned bank doing what every other bank is doing to help process loans under the new federal law. Wouldn’t it be nice to learn that the Villages was taking some steps to postpone or reduce lease payments being made by retail owners during this trying time?
I don't understand how the Federal stimulus bill will really help a small business to survive. You can pay your employees, but they are not doing any work for you. You can get a loan, but you still need to pay your rent and other fixed expenses with no income to offset them. Many businesses are stuck with a multi-year lease. When you reopen in a few months, will your customers come back? And, what about your employees? They may decide to do something else. I think a lot of small businesses will be gone forever.

[Jayhawk]

With regard to the amenity fee, what do you want to know? The executive courses are still being maintained, the debt on the amenities is still being paid, the pools are still being maintained, the utilities on the rec centers are still being paid, etc.

Exactly right. Everyone shares the cost burden and you hope there is a cushion for unforeseen expenses, but in the end, the amenities have to be maintained during this time whether used or not.

I pay the same every month for cable TV whether I watch it or not. And it's more expensive than our amenity fee.

[CFrance]

If loss of use of amenities while still paying the monthly fee is the worst that hits my husband me, we are happy campers and grateful for all that we have here and the fact that it's being maintained. Also that the people who are doing the maintaining still have jobs.

[Nordhagen]

[QUOTE=retiredguy123;1740602]I don't understand how the Federal stimulus bill will really help a small business to survive. You can pay your employees, but they are not doing any work for you. You can get a loan, but you still need to pay your rent and other fixed expenses with no income to offset them. Many businesses are stuck with a multi-year lease. When you reopen in a few months, will your customers come back? And, what about your employees? They may decide to do something else. I think a lot of small businesses will be gone forever.[/QUOTE
In the legislation, payments of rent or mortgage plus utilities can be forgiven as well as long as the employees are paid.

[retiredguy123]

Rent and mortgage payments are two entirely different things. I have seen where mortgage payments to a bank can be suspended, but not forgiven. But, most small businesses pay rent to a landlord under a private lease agreement. I have not seen anything that will suspend or forgive the lease payments. Can you cite a provision in the legislation? I know a person with a small business, and her landlord has refused to do anything to alter the lease.

[72lions]

I am referring to them as landlords, not a developer. There have been countless examples in the media of landlords sharing the burden. The family can well afford to provide some short-term leniency for the benefit of all. My point was the paper implied the family was healing out small businesses when there is no evidence to this.

[huange@verizon.net]

Hey Jayhawk - Have you considered switching from cable to streaming. I did and went from $150/mo to $54/mo.

[billethkid]

"unused" amenity fees?
How about the registration for our cars that are not being used?
How about the insurance premium for the unused car?

As we would tell our kids.....nice try!!!

[theruizs]

Do you have information on other Developers that are reducing or forgiving rent or is this just a bash the Morse post?

The only post I read here about bashing the Morse family is yours. The others are just a reasonable discussion of the new act regarding the business loans, and a simple question. These unwarranted attacks is what starts these threads to go awry.

[Bogie Shooter]

The only post I read here about bashing the Morse family is yours. The others are just a reasonable discussion of the new act regarding the business loans, and a simple question. These unwarranted attacks is what starts these threads to go awry.

Your post March 10. (What is it they say about glass houses...……………)
"That may be true, but the rep is still going to be blamed. It is pretty clear that the developers are having reps say whatever they think will sell the houses. They told us in 2012 that build out would be in 5 years max. How many lies does the developers have to tell you before you begin to understand what you/they are doing? If you keep working and keep passing on the lies, well, you’re going to get blamed."

[J1ceasar]

FIrst off, landlords all have expenses also , I am waiting for BANKS to allow mortgages to be late without foreclosure. giving free money to small businesses allows them to pay employees to be off and home safe. This means they can come back if the business is still alive.

[kcrazorbackfan]

Do you have information on other Developers that are reducing or forgiving rent or is this just a bash the Morse post?

There are the many on here that incessantly bash The Developer no matter what they do/don’t do, however, lately they’ve turned their bashing to the Governor.

[EdFNJ]

I don't understand how the Federal stimulus bill will really help a small business to survive. You can pay your employees, but they are not doing any work for you. You can get a loan, but you still need to pay your rent and other fixed expenses with no income to offset them. Many businesses are stuck with a multi-year lease. When you reopen in a few months, will your customers come back? And, what about your employees? They may decide to do something else. I think a lot of small businesses will be gone forever. Very sad and very true. This pandemic will sadly serve to push the inevitable up by a few years. Unfortunately the writing has been on the wall for small non-service businesses for years. Not referring to government defined (under 500 employees) small businesses but TRUE small businesses with just a few employees. If anyone here belongs to the Segway club and read the email from a few days ago you'd see the loss of small business is already here. :(

[Guy&Connie1103]

It would be very generous for the CSU to reduce the fee since we have no use of the facilities. Of course they still have to maintain everything but I’ve not seen anyone cleaning pools.

[Bogie Shooter]

It would be very generous for the CSU to reduce the fee since we have no use of the facilities. Of course they still have to maintain everything but I’ve not seen anyone cleaning pools.

How much of a reduction would you suggest? 5% 50% 100%. Really?
BTW I saw a pool cleaner at the Bridgeport rec center.

[MSchad]

It would be very generous for the CSU to reduce the fee since we have no use of the facilities. Of course they still have to maintain everything but I’ve not seen anyone cleaning pools.

Monitoring them all 24/7 are you?

[CFrance]

It would be very generous for the CSU to reduce the fee since we have no use of the facilities. Of course they still have to maintain everything but I’ve not seen anyone cleaning pools.

Monitoring them all 24/7 are you?
Back when my dog was young and agile enough to walk three miles, I used to walk him after dark in the summer. I would frequently see pool maintenance trucks at both Tamarind Grove and St. James pools. Probably 8:30-9:00 at night.

[OhioBuckeye]

The headline in today’s paper says that Villages is taking big steps to help small businesses. When you read the article, all it talks about is the Village owned bank doing what every other bank is doing to help process loans under the new federal law. Wouldn’t it be nice to learn that the Villages was taking some steps to postpone or reduce lease payments being made by retail owners during this trying time?
I take it TV told you what most others tell you how they’re going to help, NOTHING! But I’m sure if they said they were going help they will.

[Celebrator]

The one response I hope the Morse family will take at this this time is to provide The Villagers a statement which shows they are concerned and thinking about the people who live in their town. I think this would be a positive measure that would be appreciated by all Villagers. I believe they are or will help their tenants as they certainly want them to thrive once this pandemic becomes less of a threat.

Be safe.

[Bogie Shooter]

The one response I hope the Morse family will take at this this time is to provide The Villagers a statement which shows they are concerned and thinking about the people who live in their town. I think this would be a positive measure that would be appreciated by all Villagers. I believe they are or will help their tenants as they certainly want them to thrive once this pandemic becomes less of a threat.

Be safe.

It would make no difference to me. Anymore than all the many ads saying the same thing.

[Jerseygirl08]

I agree. Many small businesses may be destroyed forever because of this calamity that has come upon them. Many are retrofitting and re-inventng themselves but many cannot make changes quickly enough. Very sad.

[Dan9871]

Has your friend tried applying for an SBA loan?

The legislation does not require landlords to forgive or defer rent, but the loan can be used for rent and utilities and then forgiven if the the employees are paid.

The SBA loan does not forgive mortgage principal payments made with the loan but it does forgive the interest on those payments. So at the end of the SBA loan forgiveness period (6 months at the moment) he will be paying back the principle amount to the SBA at a rate that is probably lower than his mortgage rate.

In effect he skips paying any interest and defers paying off the principle but at a lower rate then his mortgage.

Seems like a good deal but, of course, but the devil is in the details so he really should check with a bank about getting the SBA loan.


Paycheck Protection Program (https://www.sba.gov/funding-programs/loans/coronavirus-relief-options/paycheck-protection-program-ppp)

"The loan will be fully forgiven if the funds are used for payroll costs, interest on mortgages, rent, and utilities (due to likely high subscription, at least 75% of the forgiven amount must have been used for payroll). Loan payments will also be deferred for six months. No collateral or personal guarantees are required. Neither the government nor lenders will charge small businesses any fees.

Forgiveness is based on the employer maintaining or quickly rehiring employees and maintaining salary levels. Forgiveness will be reduced if full-time headcount declines, or if salaries and wages decrease.

This loan has a maturity of 2 years and an interest rate of 1%.

If you wish to begin preparing your application, you can download a copy of the PPP borrower application form to see the information that will be requested from you when you apply with a lender."


Rent and mortgage payments are two entirely different things. I have seen where mortgage payments to a bank can be suspended, but not forgiven. But, most small businesses pay rent to a landlord under a private lease agreement. I have not seen anything that will suspend or forgive the lease payments. Can you cite a provision in the legislation? I know a person with a small business, and her landlord has refused to do anything to alter the lease.

[retiredguy123]

Has your friend tried applying for an SBA loan?

The legislation does not require landlords to forgive or defer rent, but the loan can be used for rent and utilities and then forgiven if the the employees are paid.

The SBA loan does not forgive mortgage principal payments made with the loan but it does forgive the interest on those payments. So at the end of the SBA loan forgiveness period (6 months at the moment) he will be paying back the principle amount to the SBA at a rate that is probably lower than his mortgage rate.

In effect he skips paying any interest and defers paying off the principle but at a lower rate then his mortgage.

Seems like a good deal but, of course, but the devil is in the details so he really should check with a bank about getting the SBA loan.


Paycheck Protection Program (https://www.sba.gov/funding-programs/loans/coronavirus-relief-options/paycheck-protection-program-ppp)

"The loan will be fully forgiven if the funds are used for payroll costs, interest on mortgages, rent, and utilities (due to likely high subscription, at least 75% of the forgiven amount must have been used for payroll). Loan payments will also be deferred for six months. No collateral or personal guarantees are required. Neither the government nor lenders will charge small businesses any fees.

Forgiveness is based on the employer maintaining or quickly rehiring employees and maintaining salary levels. Forgiveness will be reduced if full-time headcount declines, or if salaries and wages decrease.

This loan has a maturity of 2 years and an interest rate of 1%.

If you wish to begin preparing your application, you can download a copy of the PPP borrower application form to see the information that will be requested from you when you apply with a lender."
Yes, she got a $10,000 loan, but all but one of her employees, who are young, quit. And, most of her customers have cancelled their regular accounts. She has had a successful fitness business for 15 years, but her rent is about $5,500 per month. So, I think it will be very hard to maintain the business. I don't see how the stimulus bill comes close to making her whole.

[Dan9871]

Yes, she got a $10,000 loan, but all but one of her employees, who are young, quit. And, most of her customers have cancelled their regular accounts. She has had a successful fitness business for 15 years, but her rent is about $5,500 per month. So, I think it will be very hard to maintain the business. I don't see how the stimulus bill comes close to making her whole.

I agree, I don't see this making her anywhere near whole. But she does have 6 months before she has to start paying back the loan. Hopefully things will start picking back up in a couple of months and then and she can recover. If they don't my guess is that the forgiveness period will be extended.

I had a friend who had a fitness center in upstate New York. It's a hard business to keep going.

But I think the main purpose of these loans was to give businesses a way to retain employees and to insure that employees got a paycheck even if the business had no customers.

[DavidStockhausen]

they helped a family run small business Crown Carts by strong arming the rotary club to kick them out of the Chili CookOff because they were showing golf carts!

[Villageswimmer]

The headline in today’s paper says that Villages is taking big steps to help small businesses. When you read the article, all it talks about is the Village owned bank doing what every other bank is doing to help process loans under the new federal law. Wouldn’t it be nice to learn that the Villages was taking some steps to postpone or reduce lease payments being made by retail owners during this trying time?

Just my opinion, but the headline didn’t quite match the content. This seems very common these days.

[bhemingway]

What do you know about what the family is or is not doing? They are not going to public with what they do or don't do. My goodness, do you enjoy living in TV or not? If not then please move. We do not need people like you here.

[Goldwingnut]

The other side of the issue nobody wants to address is if sales start to slow down (pretty sure they have already) and it puts stress on the developer will any of these companies, that many seem to want the developer to help, provide them with any relief? Will they say you can hold off paying us for another month? Will they offer them a discount on their invoicing? Will they give the developer anything? Not very likely.

The developer is still building houses and paying their contractors (and keeping people employed). This is not a paid-when-paid business, the developer pays for the construction of each and every house and then must sell it to make their money back. Sitting on inventory, which will increase as sales are slowing due to this virus, costs them money, it costs them working capital, if they are using construction loans the interest is accumulating and will have to be paid. Their chance of recovery of any expenses or losses is close to zero.

The commercial properties are no different, taxes and common utilities still have to be paid, the building have to be maintained (roofs, exterior cleaning, landscaping, etc.), all of which falls to the property owner not the tenants. If a water line breaks and a parking lot needs to be repaired or the roof starts to leak, who takes care of that? The property owner of course. How would the tenants react if the property owner said "I'm falling on hard times and need you to pay more rent"? The likely response would not be "sure, no problem" but more to the affect of "we have a contract", "not our responsibility/problem", or "you're hurting our business, we're going to sue".

All parties are in this economic downturn together and need to work together to weather the storm. The perception that "they have all the money" lacks the reality that "they are taking most of the risk", to the tune of hundreds of millions. What The Villages (developer) is doing with their merchants and contractors is their business not ours, unless it's your money at risk you have no say and your opinions matter not. It's in the best interest of all parties that everything survives this mess, and they know it, more so than you or I.

How many falsely perceive the wealthy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEmjiCoZ6e4)

[vintageogauge]

Your post March 10. (What is it they say about glass houses...……………)
"That may be true, but the rep is still going to be blamed. It is pretty clear that the developers are having reps say whatever they think will sell the houses. They told us in 2012 that build out would be in 5 years max. How many lies does the developers have to tell you before you begin to understand what you/they are doing? If you keep working and keep passing on the lies, well, you’re going to get blamed."
Our sales rep. was Beth Pope and she didn't lie to us. Used here service again for a rental home recently and again she didn't lie to us. Maybe it's the rep. not the policy?

[vintageogauge]

The other side of the issue nobody wants to address is if sales start to slow down (pretty sure they have already) and it puts stress on the developer will any of these companies, that many seem to want the developer to help, provide them with any relief? Will they say you can hold off paying us for another month? Will they offer them a discount on their invoicing? Will they give the developer anything? Not very likely.

The developer is still building houses and paying their contractors (and keeping people employed). This is not a paid-when-paid business, the developer pays for the construction of each and every house and then must sell it to make their money back. Sitting on inventory, which will increase as sales are slowing due to this virus, costs them money, it costs them working capital, if they are using construction loans the interest is accumulating and will have to be paid. Their chance of recovery of any expenses or losses is close to zero.

The commercial properties are no different, taxes and common utilities still have to be paid, the building have to be maintained (roofs, exterior cleaning, landscaping, etc.), all of which falls to the property owner not the tenants. If a water line breaks and a parking lot needs to be repaired or the roof starts to leak, who takes care of that? The property owner of course. How would the tenants react if the property owner said "I'm falling on hard times and need you to pay more rent"? The likely response would not be "sure, no problem" but more to the affect of "we have a contract", "not our responsibility/problem", or "you're hurting our business, we're going to sue".

All parties are in this economic downturn together and need to work together to weather the storm. The perception that "they have all the money" lacks the reality that "they are taking most of the risk", to the tune of hundreds of millions. What The Villages (developer) is doing with their merchants and contractors is their business not ours, unless it's your money at risk you have no say and your opinions matter not. It's in the best interest of all parties that everything survives this mess, and they know it, more so than you or I.

How many falsely perceive the wealthy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEmjiCoZ6e4)

They are truly still building at a fast pace. Bradford is now going up and it's hard to believe what they get done over there in just 24 hours. Also, TV does not want to come out of this with a bunch of empty commercial spaces, I think they're smart enough to help their tenants get through this. Things like City Fire selling store products would most likely not have been allowed prior to the virus but it's a good service that is helping them pay their bills.

[JCMSr]

All parties are in this economic downturn together and need to work together to weather the storm. The perception that "they have all the money" lacks the reality that "they are taking most of the risk", to the tune of hundreds of millions. What The Villages (developer) is doing with their merchants and contractors is their business not ours, unless it's your money at risk you have no say and your opinions matter not. It's in the best interest of all parties that everything survives this mess, and they know it, more so than you or I.

How many falsely perceive the wealthy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEmjiCoZ6e4)

In addition to what Goldwingnut has already stated I ask the question what business of yours is it what actions are taken by the Developer between him and his rentors/business associates. Would it make you feel better if they agreed to forgive one month's rent? The truth is this would just give the developer bashers more fuel to start saying how cheap they are for not giving two, three or more months. Furthermore, as a rentor/leasee how would you feel about the developer sharing your private terms and conditions with the world? Next month you would probably expect the businesses to offer discounts to you since they got free rent. Unless you are a stockholder or partner of the businesses connected to the lease it is non of your business. Perhaps you may think it is the developers responsibility to share this information to satisfy your own curiosity but I can see this as wrong on so many levels. Perhaps we should require each prospective homeowner to share his tax returns with his future neighbors just so they can feel better about who will be living next door. Would that be acceptable to those who feel entitled to this type of sharing?

[DianeM]

Do you have information on other Developers that are reducing or forgiving rent or is this just a bash the Morse post?

Nailed it !

[DianeM]

It would sure be nice for some info on the $155 monthly amenity fee not being able to use, or the rec center gym membership I just renewed before they closed the rec centers. Just some info. Not too much to ask.

Are your roads still clean? Are the green spaces still mowed? Are plants still planted? Guess where your amenity fee goes. Surprise!

[DianeM]

Rent and mortgage payments are two entirely different things. I have seen where mortgage payments to a bank can be suspended, but not forgiven. But, most small businesses pay rent to a landlord under a private lease agreement. I have not seen anything that will suspend or forgive the lease payments. Can you cite a provision in the legislation? I know a person with a small business, and her landlord has refused to do anything to alter the lease.

If I were a landlord, I could understand postponing rent a month or two perhaps. But, at the end of the day the landlord’s bills need to be paid as well so rent cannot be “forgiven”. You sign a contract (lease) and for exceptional circumstances, rent can be postponed but will still need to be paid when this is over.

[DianeM]

I am referring to them as landlords, not a developer. There have been countless examples in the media of landlords sharing the burden. The family can well afford to provide some short-term leniency for the benefit of all. My point was the paper implied the family was healing out small businesses when there is no evidence to this.

There’s that green eyed monster again. “The family can well afford” mentality. They owe nothing to anyone.

[DianeM]

The only post I read here about bashing the Morse family is yours. The others are just a reasonable discussion of the new act regarding the business loans, and a simple question. These unwarranted attacks is what starts these threads to go awry.

Read post #15

[DianeM]

It would be very generous for the CSU to reduce the fee since we have no use of the facilities. Of course they still have to maintain everything but I’ve not seen anyone cleaning pools.

Guess you haven’t noticed that the streets are clean and the open spaces are mowed. And by the way, pools are still being cleaned or they would become extremely difficult to clean when this is finally over.

[DianeM]

The one response I hope the Morse family will take at this this time is to provide The Villagers a statement which shows they are concerned and thinking about the people who live in their town. I think this would be a positive measure that would be appreciated by all Villagers. I believe they are or will help their tenants as they certainly want them to thrive once this pandemic becomes less of a threat.

Be safe.

I could not give a rats behind what the Morse family has to say. It is not THEIR TOWN. Grandpa conceived it and they inherited it. You bought into it, as did I, and now it’s OUR TOWN.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

How do you know the Morse family isn’t negotiating with there tenants ? I never told anybody what I was doing or not doing in my business unless it was necessary