Chinese Intel – Various Items of Interest

[TexaninVA]

Given the ongoing Covid19 catastrophe, and the likely tieback to China’s biowarfare labs, I thought it would be informative to provide TOTVers some background information on Chinese Intelligence. Unless one has worked in this field, it’s understandable most people wouldn’t know much about it. That’s because most of what happens is classified and never makes it into the media. But what goes on in this realm impacts all of us. Recall that spying & espionage has long been described as the “… world’s second oldest profession.:

The best way to think of Chinese Intelligence is as the “eyes and ears” of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). The CCP has total power within China and calls the shots for pretty much anything of consequence that happens therein.

This link, for example, is a recent Australian Sixty Minutes story on this topic. The primary source is a (former) Chinese spy who defected.

WORLD EXCLUSIVE: Chinese spy spills secrets to expose Communist espionage | 60 Minutes Australia - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdR-I35Ladk)

I will add other items to this thread, from time to time, and hopefully build up the database so to speak. All items will be unclassified and from open sources.

Hopefully, others who are likewise interested in the subject, or would like to learn more, can also add what they learn through research etc. Opinions offered in a civil manner are always welcome, and sources and links are especially helpful.

[junction29]

Given the ongoing Covid19 catastrophe, and the likely tieback to China’s biowarfare labs, I thought it would be informative to provide TOTVers some background information on Chinese Intelligence. Unless one has worked in this field, it’s understandable most people wouldn’t know much about it. That’s because most of what happens is classified and never makes it into the media. But what goes on in this realm impacts all of us. Recall that spying & espionage has long been described as the “… world’s second oldest profession.:

The best way to think of Chinese Intelligence is as the “eyes and ears” of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). The CCP has total power within China and calls the shots for pretty much anything of consequence that happens therein.

This link, for example, is a recent Australian Sixty Minutes story on this topic. The primary source is a (former) Chinese spy who defected.

WORLD EXCLUSIVE: Chinese spy spills secrets to expose Communist espionage | 60 Minutes Australia - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdR-I35Ladk)

I will add other items to this thread, from time to time, and hopefully build up the database so to speak. All items will be unclassified and from open sources.

Hopefully, others who are likewise interested in the subject, or would like to learn more, can also add what they learn through research etc. Opinions offered in a civil manner are always welcome, and sources and links are especially helpful.

Thanks for posting this.

One way or another China is responsible for this virus and they must be made to pay economically big time, by the whole world when this is under control.

Turning a blind eye to this evil regime, who want to control the world, is a big mistake!

[DianeM]

This video is eye opening. I firmly believe this was purposely started as a way to test a variation of bio warfare to shut down the democracy demonstrations and it got out of control. Thankfully it has opened our eyes as to how foolishly reliant we had become upon a country out to destroy us.

[nututv]

I firmly believe this was purposely started as a way to test a variation of bio warfare and it got out of control. Thankfully it has opened our eyes as to how foolishly reliant we had become upon a country out to destroy us.

You're saying someone is making a flu bug that only effect 3ish percent of the population and of that 3, just under 1 percent die from it? Not a very good bio weapon I'd say.
But it's psychological impact on society has been staggering. As far as an attempted psyops move, it was stunning to say the least.
.
This just in... flu that kills less than slip and falls shuts down world economy. You couldn't have made this all up 6 months ago.

[GoodLife]

You're saying someone is making a flu bug that only effect 3ish percent of the population and of that 3, just under 1 percent die from it? Not a very good bio weapon I'd say.
But it's psychological impact on society has been staggering. As far as an attempted psyops move, it was stunning to say the least.
.
This just in... flu that kills less than slip and falls shuts down world economy. You couldn't have made this all up 6 months ago.

Don't quit your day job.

I don't think coronavirus was released as a bioweapon, but there is a lot of evidence that it could have escaped by mistake from a bio weapons research facility in Wuhan.

Not a very good bioweapon you say? Economies of US and rest of world are decimated, costing trillions. Looks like a good weapon to me.

Sorry, I can't catch slip and fall virus at the grocery store, totally irrelevant.

[TexaninVA]

You're saying someone is making a flu bug that only effect 3ish percent of the population and of that 3, just under 1 percent die from it? Not a very good bio weapon I'd say.
But it's psychological impact on society has been staggering. As far as an attempted psyops move, it was stunning to say the least.
.
This just in... flu that kills less than slip and falls shuts down world economy. You couldn't have made this all up 6 months ago.

I think we need to revise our terms.

A “bioweapon” has classically meant large-scale casualties but that now seems outmoded. I think a better descriptor is “bio-economic weapon.”

Covid19 is analogous to a giant CCP warhead that went off in the atmosphere above the USA (and elsewhere). The difference is the Wuhan virus destroyed the economy & stock market as opposed to killing people and levelling buildings

[bumpygreens]

There are several articles available from medical sources that have already looked at this question. Their conclusions are that COVID19 mutated (or evolved) from animals into a form that infects humans. This isn't a selective virus. As a weapon, it makes about as much sense as using a grenade for home defense. That being said, I think the issue is what the Chinese Communist Party has done with the virus since it showed up. They have 'weaponized' it for their own political and economic gain, and to increase their influence in countries around the world. The Czech Republic, having lived for so many years under the Soviet's domination, is being smart. Spain not so much. Even some news outlets and politicians seem to be aligning themselves with the CCP's narrative. Some of the "loyal opposition" isn't looking all that loyal.

[karostay]

Where's James Bond when you need him ?

[TexaninVA]

Where's James Bond when you need him ?

I hear he's in quarantine, along with Boris.

[TexaninVA]

Even some news outlets and politicians seem to be aligning themselves with the CCP's narrative. Some of the "loyal opposition" isn't looking all that loyal.

I have noticed the same phenomenon.

Very bothersome. When we should all be pulling the oars in the same direction, a few seem to be obstructing a united effort towards victory. Or, it at least seems like that.

[nututv]

Not a very good bioweapon you say? Economies of US and rest of world are decimated, costing trillions. Looks like a good weapon to me.
No, it is not. As I said before, it's a much better psyops weapon. Need proof? Try buying T/P or alcohol right now. Why we're overestimating the mortality rate for COVID-19 | World Economic Forum (https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/04/we-could-be-vastly-overestimating-the-death-rate-for-covid-19-heres-why/)


Sorry, I can't catch slip and fall virus at the grocery store, totally irrelevant.
According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), over one million Americans suffer a slip, trip, and fall injury and over 17, 000 people die in the U.S. annually because of these injuries.
Why are people still walking? It's crazy all these people taking chances like that. lol
Obesity kills far more than that so maybe there's another reason to stay out of the grocery store. Just a thought.
According to the National Institutes of Health, obesity and overweight together are the second leading cause of preventable death in the United States, close behind tobacco use (3). An estimated 300,000 deaths per year are due to the obesity epidemic

[Ben Franklin]

I love conspiracy theories, NOT.

This, however, about what the Pentagon knew, needs further investigation.

Report: Pentagon Knew Of Possible Coronavirus Threat For Years : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2020/04/05/827692672/report-pentagon-aware-of-possible-coronavirus-threat-for-years?utm_term=nprnews&utm_campaign=npr&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR0E3rAeuNVYxz5oMD9orstwSf9dGcjdG3TpBkxnw PtLQJCvpWbo-8bHZbE&fbclid=IwAR2u5ko73MKrL8WRZPkmFmUV8IKFEm727fJCVoPb-TSx1BeW_evstv5i7kk)

[bumpygreens]

Let's not roast somebody over a bad analogy. I don't think he meant any harm. With mitigation, we are still on track for about 100,000 deaths. Without mitigation, the death toll in the US would be over 2,000,000 which is about on par with the Spanish Flu of 1918 - 1920. Our population back then was 103 million and 675,000 died. Worldwide best estimates are 50 - 100 million died.

TB has killed 1 billion people in the past 200 years; small pox 300 million between 1900 and 1980; AIDS pandemic has killed 30 million so far; measles has killed 200 million in the last 150 years. As far as world pandemics, calamities and catastrophes go, this is apocalypse on the "Easy" setting. I just hope when it's over we don't find that we've hung ourselves by the neck to keep our feet out of the fire.

[nututv]

i just hope when it's over we don't find that we've hung ourselves by the neck to keep our feet out of the fire.

exactly!

[GoodLife]

No, it is not. As I said before, it's a much better psyops weapon. Need proof? Try buying T/P or alcohol right now. Why we're overestimating the mortality rate for COVID-19 | World Economic Forum (https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/04/we-could-be-vastly-overestimating-the-death-rate-for-covid-19-heres-why/)



According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), over one million Americans suffer a slip, trip, and fall injury and over 17, 000 people die in the U.S. annually because of these injuries.
Why are people still walking? It's crazy all these people taking chances like that. lol
Obesity kills far more than that so maybe there's another reason to stay out of the grocery store. Just a thought.
According to the National Institutes of Health, obesity and overweight together are the second leading cause of preventable death in the United States, close behind tobacco use (3). An estimated 300,000 deaths per year are due to the obesity epidemic

Dammit Jim, I'm a bio weapons expert not a kayaker!

[nututv]

Dammit Jim, I'm a bio weapons expert not a kayaker!

Not an expert at either. Just using facts and actual stats that are as accurate as we all know at this time. No need for snarky personal jabs but at the same time, I've got broad shoulders. Shoot.
You want to see how effective a bio weapon is/was? Here was a good one. Super Effective, you probably weren't leaving that town the same. Halabja chemical attack - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_chemical_attack) These were some of those pesky bio weapons Hussien never had. haha
The chance of getting COVID is actually quite low, dying from it is even lower. Granted, I'd prefer not to get sick or dead but facts are facts. Our chances of still being here even if we did get it are really quite good unless you have an underlying issue or have been abusing your body for the past few decades. As I said before, If this was bio weapon attack designed to kill, it was a very poor one. Now if it was a psyops move, it would be considered an insanely effective one.
Death rates are not the cause of the global recession we are now in. Fear is.
Just givin it all I got Scotty. :)

[TexaninVA]

I love conspiracy theories, NOT.

This, however, about what the Pentagon knew, needs further investigation.

Report: Pentagon Knew Of Possible Coronavirus Threat For Years : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2020/04/05/827692672/report-pentagon-aware-of-possible-coronavirus-threat-for-years?utm_term=nprnews&utm_campaign=npr&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR0E3rAeuNVYxz5oMD9orstwSf9dGcjdG3TpBkxnw PtLQJCvpWbo-8bHZbE&fbclid=IwAR2u5ko73MKrL8WRZPkmFmUV8IKFEm727fJCVoPb-TSx1BeW_evstv5i7kk)

The NPR link you provided is useful. On the other hand, those type of generic intell reports warning of pandemics have been around forever. The more useful intel reports provide actionable intelligence.

The term "conspiracy theory" is the modern day version of saying "you're not allowed to say that" which is related to a form of controlling speech by using the metaphorical "club" of PC. Not saying you're doing that, just my observation in general on the bandied about term conspiracy theory.

In any event, here's another NPR article that pertains to potential connections to Covid-19. Old news in a way, but still pertinent.

The man who supposedly sold useful material to China, Dr Charles Lieber, head of the chemistry and biology department at Harvard was arrested in late January. Among other things the Chinese wanted him to set up a lab at the Wuhan University of Technology.
There are apparently connections with Chinese intelligence. Details are murky, as per usual with intel matters, but more will come out.

This NPR article has a good summary in the meantime.
Why Harvard Professor Charles Lieber Was Arrested : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2020/02/14/806128410/harvard-professors-arrest-raises-questions-about-scientific-openness)

This video from the local news channel of the US Attorney provides insight into the arrest. .

Twitter (https://twitter.com/JohnBWellsCTM/status/1246505891911925762)

[TexaninVA]

Dammit Jim, I'm a bio weapons expert not a kayaker!

That's pretty funny. :a040:

Got me to thinking back to those Star Trek scenes ...

Dammit Jim - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJy3hRM7SPE)

[nututv]

While I'm not a believer of the conspiracy, I surely wouldn't put it past anyone. It did stop the Hong Kong riots overnight didn't it and that was becoming a huge thorn it their side.
... absolute power corrupts absolutely.

[nututv]

Good point. The American media will probably also give us a pass.

haha. Now that is a FACT!

[wamley]

A wounded soldier requires much more resources then a dead one. We are crippled from this virus, sounds like it works well if that is your motive. This is with us taking all these precautions.

[Texased]

I'm not a big fan of conspiracy theories and I think the biowarfare scenario is hogwash.

[Pedrocarrasco01@yahoo.com]

Given the ongoing Covid19 catastrophe, and the likely tieback to China’s biowarfare labs, I thought it would be informative to provide TOTVers some background information on Chinese Intelligence. Unless one has worked in this field, it’s understandable most people wouldn’t know much about it. That’s because most of what happens is classified and never makes it into the media. But what goes on in this realm impacts all of us. Recall that spying & espionage has long been described as the “… world’s second oldest profession.:

The best way to think of Chinese Intelligence is as the “eyes and ears” of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). The CCP has total power within China and calls the shots for pretty much anything of consequence that happens therein.

This link, for example, is a recent Australian Sixty Minutes story on this topic. The primary source is a (former) Chinese spy who defected.

WORLD EXCLUSIVE: Chinese spy spills secrets to expose Communist espionage | 60 Minutes Australia - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdR-I35Ladk)

I will add other items to this thread, from time to time, and hopefully build up the database so to speak. All items will be unclassified and from open sources.

Hopefully, others who are likewise interested in the subject, or would like to learn more, can also add what they learn through research etc. Opinions offered in a civil manner are always welcome, and sources and links are especially helpful.
Real journalism from Australia 60 minutes, versus the propaganda that we see here from the US networks, need to really improve in the news rather than the amount of negative news that we see and the disruptions that he networks here are doing. :bigbow::bigbow::coolsmiley::coolsmiley::boom::boo m:

[Alana33]

Please educate yourself.

COVID-19 coronavirus epidemic has a natural origin -- ScienceDaily (https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/03/200317175442.htm)

[TexaninVA]

Actually, it is on good authority that Covid-19 was created in Russian labs. But, the way they worked it was to introduce it in China so the blame would go to China. The US knew about this but our on the ground spies in Russia and China who were aware of this were fired by high level US administrators. They simply did not want any more blame place on Russia. The same modus operandus worked well in diverting Russia's influence on the 2016 election to the Ukraine. Those Ruskie's....got to give them credit for good conspiracies

Brevity is the soul of wit

[TexaninVA]

Please educate yourself.

COVID-19 coronavirus epidemic has a natural origin -- ScienceDaily (https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/03/200317175442.htm)


Always a good idea to educate yourself ... agree.


Gravitas: Wuhan Coronavirus: Will China profit from the outbreak?, World News | wionews.com (https://www.wionews.com/videos/gravitas-wuhan-coronavirus-will-china-profit-from-the-outbreak-289014)

.

[mico8143]

Great obscure Star Trek reference.

[dougawhite]

What bothers me is how did the Iran Minister of health contract the virus so soon (in January) after it started in China? Could Iran have been dirty dealing at the Wuhan lab and got careless transporting the samples?

[NFRicaS]

There are several articles available from medical sources that have already looked at this question. Their conclusions are that COVID19 mutated (or evolved) from animals into a form that infects humans. This isn't a selective virus. As a weapon, it makes about as much sense as using a grenade for home defense. That being said, I think the issue is what the Chinese Communist Party has done with the virus since it showed up. They have 'weaponized' it for their own political and economic gain, and to increase their influence in countries around the world. The Czech Republic, having lived for so many years under the Soviet's domination, is being smart. Spain not so much. Even some news outlets and politicians seem to be aligning themselves with the CCP's narrative. Some of the "loyal opposition" isn't looking all that loyal.
Not “animals”....from bats in the wet market...funny thing..we have wet markets here in the U.S.....

[GoodLife]

Not “animals”....from bats in the wet market...funny thing..we have wet markets here in the U.S.....

Have our wet markets unleashed any global pandemics lately?

[roscoguy]

...the likely tieback to China’s biowarfare labs...

According to WHOM??? I hope it's not in that 40 minute video. Even in self-isolation, I have too much to do to invest quite that much time to investigating others' conspiracy theories. (Admitted, it does sound like it may be worth watching at another time, but not merely for the sake of justifying this "tieback" theory.)

I firmly believe this was purposely started as a way to test a variation of bio warfare...

This, too! Seriously? Who is spreading this little gem?

The term "conspiracy theory" is the modern day version of saying "you're not allowed to say that" which is related to a form of controlling speech by using the metaphorical "club" of PC.

No, it's not. It's more like saying 'That is absolutely bizarre. Where on earth did you read/hear that???'

CREDIBLE "sources and links are especially helpful."

[DianeM]

Have our wet markets unleashed any global pandemics lately?

We have wet markets here? I did not know that. Where?

[jklfairwin]

Where in the world did you get the tinfoil hat theory about Coronavirus "tieback to biowarfare labs?" Utterly unsupported nonsense.

[Koapaka]

Either way, NEVER, EVER trust the CCP. There were reports on Twitter that they were locking people in their apt buildings as far back as Jan and not allowing them out to stop the spread locally, leaving them without food, water, dying people in their midst and they could not get help. And then this story. If you can trust them after reading this, you have serious issues.
Report: Wuhan Funeral Homes Burned Coronavirus Victims Alive (https://www.breitbart.com/asia/2020/04/07/report-wuhan-funeral-homes-burned-people-alive/)

[Tblue]

This video is eye opening. I firmly believe this was purposely started as a way to test a variation of bio warfare to shut down the democracy demonstrations and it got out of control. Thankfully it has opened our eyes as to how foolishly reliant we had become upon a country out to destroy us.

When the China flu started it has been said the first thing to disappear from the news was the pro democracy demonstrations in China.

[Twiganne]

Interestingly enough the bat, horseshoe bat, lives 700 miles from those wet market. Also China was working with coronaviruses and these horseshoe bats long before it got or was let out. This was not from a wet market but got to blame it on someone.

[quietpine]

The 1918 Spanish Flu originated at a US military installation and carried to Europe by US soldiers during WW1. The result was 20-50 million deaths.

[DianeM]

According to WHOM??? I hope it's not in that 40 minute video. Even in self-isolation, I have too much to do to invest quite that much time to investigating others' conspiracy theories. (Admitted, it does sound like it may be worth watching at another time, but not merely for the sake of justifying this "tieback" theory.)



This, too! Seriously? Who is spreading this little gem?



No, it's not. It's more like saying 'That is absolutely bizarre. Where on earth did you read/hear that???'

CREDIBLE "sources and links are especially helpful."


Guess what? I’m entitled to my opinions. I believe this was total retaliation for not groveling to their tariff practices and they retaliated. That’s okay. They’ll be going down soon when we are finally getting smart and will bring manufacturing home where it should be.

[TexaninVA]

According to WHOM??? I hope it's not in that 40 minute video. Even in self-isolation, I have too much to do to invest quite that much time to investigating others' conspiracy theories. (Admitted, it does sound like it may be worth watching at another time, but not merely for the sake of justifying this "tieback" theory.)


This, too! Seriously? Who is spreading this little gem?

No, it's not. It's more like saying 'That is absolutely bizarre. Where on earth did you read/hear that???'



CREDIBLE "sources and links are especially helpful."

"Although the the U.S. intelligence community early on dismissed the notion that the coronavirus is a synthesized bioweapon, it is still weighing the possibility that the pandemic might have been touched off by an accident at a research facility rather than by an infection from a live-animal market, according to nine current and former intelligence and national security officials familiar with ongoing investigations." Here's the link;

Intelligence officials weigh possibility coronavirus escaped from a Chinese lab (https://news.yahoo.com/intelligence-officials-weigh-possibility-coronavirus-escaped-from-a-chinese-lab-194958353.html)


The President was asked during today's news (4/15/20) conference about the possibility that Covid-19 (ie CCP) virus originated in a Chinese Lab. He said the intel community is looking into it.

Here's the link:

President Donald Trump and White House Coronavirus Task Force Daily Press Briefing | FULL — 4/15/20 - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYg0yibrpFw)

Go to the 1h14m28s mark and listen to the press question and then the POTUS reply, and then think about what was just said. And then listen to the follow-up question which POTUS declined to answer.

[Topspinmo]

You're saying someone is making a flu bug that only effect 3ish percent of the population and of that 3, just under 1 percent die from it? Not a very good bio weapon I'd say.
But it's psychological impact on society has been staggering. As far as an attempted psyops move, it was stunning to say the least.
.
This just in... flu that kills less than slip and falls shuts down world economy. You couldn't have made this all up 6 months ago.

How do you know if low dosage works unless you test it out of the lab in real world setting??????????

[Topspinmo]

Please educate yourself.

COVID-19 coronavirus epidemic has a natural origin -- ScienceDaily (https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/03/200317175442.htm)

Originated in China. IMO Enough said.

[GoodLife]

The main reason I think the virus accidently escaped from the Wuhan virus lab (besides the fact that the horseshoe bat identified as carrier lives 600 miles away and were not sold in Wuhan wet market) is Chinese government behavior.

Their delay in letting the world know it was highly contagious and the disappearing of various Doctors speaks volumes.

[BobnBev]

Where's James Bond when you need him ?

Meeting with Chuck Norris, as we speak.

[Koapaka]

I'll go out on a limb here being medical for 30+ yrs in the military....today is 4/16 at 11:28pm with a current rate of 72 Villagers testing positive. IF the number of confirmed cases in TV in 2 weeks (which would be 30 April 2020 stats) is LESS than 450, I will be SHOCKED! Am I PRAYING I AM WRONG, HELL YEAH!!! Can I pray to be able to say, Oh, damn, I got that all screwed up...HELL YEAH! But 30 years as a military medical officer, I am afraid I will be proven correct. PRAYING I am wrong, wishing LIKE HELL I CAN SAY WAS!!!!! That will be the "tasty crow" anyone EVER ate!

[graciegirl]

The main reason I think the virus accidently escaped from the Wuhan virus lab (besides the fact that the horseshoe bat identified as carrier lives 600 miles away and were not sold in Wuhan wet market) is Chinese government behavior.

Their delay in letting the world know it was highly contagious and the disappearing of various Doctors speaks volumes.

I can remember the valid reporting of at least one doctor involved in the early treatment of Covid-19 in China that died of Covid-19.

It sounds very unlikely to me that China did it on purpose but people who we can trust will sort it out later when the why becomes more important than saving lives.

Some are in for a penny, in for a pound and throwing all kinds of babies out with the bath water. They are leaping to invalid conclusions and listening to doctors whose careers on Television have kept them out of examining rooms and away from current hands on care of patients for years. People like Drew Pinsky who has since disappeared from appearing on Fox News Network..A very good choice when his statements in March have been discounted as incorrect. (He has since publicly apologized, but probably will not get many chances to appear on TV again as a medical consultant.)

For some, politics become almost like a religion and that is unhealthy. No one person has all of the answers. I am so tired of the flipping back and forth from both sides of the aisle, the incorrect information, the change of subject, the unwarranted attacks on the other side, the mixing of opinion and fact. The limited valid medical people we see in the national information "task force" I am just plain tired, boss. When did we only consult doctors according to their politics or their faithfulness to the person currently in charge of this country???

Those who know me well, know how I usually vote and this subject, Covid-19 has not a damn thing to do with politics.

[ficoguy]

Our career politicians seems scared of China. What they are really scared of is losing the money from China that is being funneled into their campaign coffers thru lobbyists. Its money laundering, political style.

[TexaninVA]

I can remember the valid reporting of at least one doctor involved in the early treatment of Covid-19 in China that died of Covid-19.

It sounds very unlikely to me that China did it on purpose but people who we can trust will sort it out later when the why becomes more important than saving lives.

Some are in for a penny, in for a pound and throwing all kinds of babies out with the bath water. They are leaping to invalid conclusions and listening to doctors whose careers on Television have kept them out of examining rooms and away from current hands on care of patients for years. People like Drew Pinsky who has since disappeared from appearing on Fox News Network..A very good choice when his statements in March have been discounted as incorrect. (He has since publicly apologized, but probably will not get many chances to appear on TV again as a medical consultant.)

For some, politics become almost like a religion and that is unhealthy. No one person has all of the answers. I am so tired of the flipping back and forth from both sides of the aisle, the incorrect information, the change of subject, the unwarranted attacks on the other side, the mixing of opinion and fact. The limited valid medical people we see in the national information "task force" I am just plain tired, boss. When did we only consult doctors according to their politics or their faithfulness to the person currently in charge of this country???

Those who know me well, know how I usually vote and this subject, Covid-19 has not a damn thing to do with politics.

I think some posters are afraid of confronting the truth about the virus.

It has essentially been proven, or pretty close to it, that “Covid-19” originated in a Chinese lab. That means it’s connected to the Chinese PLA … i.e. their military, and its origins thus trace back to the bio-weapons family so to speak. It’s unclear still if it was unleased deliberately.

More likely, once it got out accidentally, the CCP said, if we’re going to take a hit so will the main enemy … ie the US.

Early on in this discussion, those who pointed out the origination of the virus stemming from a Chinese biowarfare lab as a reasonable theory were derided as “conspiracy theorists.” This is nothing more than the contemporary means of saying “you’re not allowed to say that” or, that’s not PC.

Speaking of PC, a more accurate description of the virus would simply be the “Wuhan virus.” All I’m doing is stating the obvious at this point.

There’s a lesson here. Don’t be too quick to say don’t talk about something if it makes one “uncomfortable” etc. That’s the power of free speech, and the free compilation of evidence to make one’s point … it’s still the best means we have of getting to the truth, even if “uncomfortable.”

[roscoguy]

"Although the the U.S. intelligence community early on dismissed the notion that the coronavirus is a synthesized bioweapon, it is still weighing the possibility that the pandemic might have been touched off by an accident at a research facility rather than by an infection from a live-animal market, according to nine current and former intelligence and national security officials familiar with ongoing investigations." Here's the link;

Intelligence officials weigh possibility coronavirus escaped from a Chinese lab (https://news.yahoo.com/intelligence-officials-weigh-possibility-coronavirus-escaped-from-a-chinese-lab-194958353.html)

Interesting for sure, but the last I read is that scientists are calling it naturally occurring and discounting the "synthesized bioweapon" aspect.


The President was asked during today's news (4/15/20) conference about the possibility that Covid-19 (ie CCP) virus originated in a Chinese Lab. He said the intel community is looking into it.

Here's the link:

President Donald Trump and White House Coronavirus Task Force Daily Press Briefing | FULL — 4/15/20 - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYg0yibrpFw)

Go to the 1h14m28s mark and listen to the press question and then the POTUS reply, and then think about what was just said. And then listen to the follow-up question which POTUS declined to answer.

The link above is to a 59:02 video. I'd like to check out what was said, but need a different video.

[roscoguy]

It has essentially been proven, or pretty close to it, that “Covid-19” originated in a Chinese lab.

But this has NOT been "proven". It is still speculation that it even leaked from a lab, as a naturally occurring virus. A distinct possibility, it appears, but as yet no more than that.

[TexaninVA]

Interesting for sure, but the last I read is that scientists are calling it naturally occurring and discounting the "synthesized bioweapon" aspect.




The link above is to a 59:02 video. I'd like to check out what was said, but need a different video.

Video was apparently edited afterwards. Not sure what happened. Go to the current 53m56s mark. POTUS answers the first question and then defers on the second one.

There's also increasing evidence of molecular level engineering in a lab in connection with the AIDS virus. I think the primary question remains --was it an intentional, or accidental, release of the virus? It's also becoming more apparent that, in either case, the CCP lied like crazy afterwards. No surprise there.

The term "weapon" is also interesting. What it has amounted to in practical terms is a "bio-economic" weapon. It's like a CCP weapon "exploded" over the US and killed the economy as opposed to destroying buildings and massive numbers of people.

[DianeM]

But this has NOT been "proven". It is still speculation that it even leaked from a lab, as a naturally occurring virus. A distinct possibility, it appears, but as yet no more than that.

Are you really still clinging to that nonsense regardless of all the data provided that the virus was being played with in the level 4 lab in Wuhan? I’m not even saying it was on purpose (although I personally think it was).

[roscoguy]

Are you really still clinging to that nonsense regardless of all the data provided that the virus was being played with in the level 4 lab in Wuhan? I’m not even saying it was on purpose (although I personally think it was).

Exactly WHAT data have you provided, Diane? Not opinions from people you know, actual data. I choose to believe the scientific consensus, which presently still appears to be that it is a naturally occurring virus & NOT bio-engineered. Also that there is no evidence of it having leaked from a Chinese lab. If baseless speculation arouses your conspiracy theory antennae, you can go ahead and cling to that nonsense.

Personally, I think that the idea that it was released on purpose is flat out rediculous. But that's my opinion.

[DianeM]

Exactly WHAT data have you provided, Diane? Not opinions from people you know, actual data. I choose to believe the scientific consensus, which presently still appears to be that it is a naturally occurring virus & NOT bio-engineered. Also that there is no evidence of it having leaked from a Chinese lab. If baseless speculation arouses your conspiracy theory antennae, you can go ahead and cling to that nonsense.

Personally, I think that the idea that it was released on purpose is flat out rediculous. But that's my opinion.

I don’t have to prove jack. All I have to do is pay attention to newscasts and anything but the TV rag. Guess you never watch news on any channel.

[TexaninVA]

Exactly WHAT data have you provided, Diane? Not opinions from people you know, actual data. I choose to believe the scientific consensus, which presently still appears to be that it is a naturally occurring virus & NOT bio-engineered. Also that there is no evidence of it having leaked from a Chinese lab. If baseless speculation arouses your conspiracy theory antennae, you can go ahead and cling to that nonsense.

Personally, I think that the idea that it was released on purpose is flat out rediculous. But that's my opinion.

This may help you a bit.

"With my colleague, bio-mathematician Jean-Claude Perez, we carefully analyzed the description of the genome of this RNA virus," explains Luc Montagnier, interviewed by Dr Jean-François Lemoine for the daily podcast at Pourquoi Docteur, adding that others have already explored this avenue:

"In order to insert an HIV sequence into this genome, molecular tools are needed, and that can only be done in a laboratory," he added."

Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab (https://www.ibtimes.sg/nobel-winning-scientist-who-co-discovered-hiv-claims-novel-coronavirus-was-made-wuhans-lab-43277)

The headline of this link says "Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab" and it's dated 4/18/2020.


Its humorous, and sad, to see the media still trying to peddle the notion of a "conspiracy theory" to discredit what's essentially been factually established. I've already explained what the "conspiracy theory" argument means in practice, so won't repeat it.

Most of the media guys don't seem to have a clue in terms of how they get manipulated by the CCP and the "narrative." Talk about having one's head in a dark place. They become unwitting dupes unfortunately, and what's worse, prevent the public from being fully informed.

Here's a real conspiracy theory for you if you want one: the owners of much of the prestige media are probably making megabucks from China (i.e., CCP) in some form or fashion. If only we had some real investigative journalists .... sigh.

[graciegirl]

I think some posters are afraid of confronting the truth about the virus.

It has essentially been proven, or pretty close to it, that “Covid-19” originated in a Chinese lab. That means it’s connected to the Chinese PLA … i.e. their military, and its origins thus trace back to the bio-weapons family so to speak. It’s unclear still if it was unleased deliberately.

More likely, once it got out accidentally, the CCP said, if we’re going to take a hit so will the main enemy … ie the US.

Early on in this discussion, those who pointed out the origination of the virus stemming from a Chinese biowarfare lab as a reasonable theory were derided as “conspiracy theorists.” This is nothing more than the contemporary means of saying “you’re not allowed to say that” or, that’s not PC.

Speaking of PC, a more accurate description of the virus would simply be the “Wuhan virus.” All I’m doing is stating the obvious at this point.

There’s a lesson here. Don’t be too quick to say don’t talk about something if it makes one “uncomfortable” etc. That’s the power of free speech, and the free compilation of evidence to make one’s point … it’s still the best means we have of getting to the truth, even if “uncomfortable.”

I will consider the rest of your opinion when I see a valid entity say it came out of Chinese biowarfare lab. That is just conjecture. I have read and I believe that it happened just like all changes to viruses and other cells happen; through a naturally occurring series of events.

what causes a mutation in a virus - Bing (https://www.bing.com/search?q=what%20causes%20a%20mutation%20in%20a%20v irus&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=what%20causes%20a%20mutation%20in%20a%20virus&sc=1-33&sk=&cvid=D97652C75B9F4C7AB78538473B0A7AC1)

[roscoguy]

Video was apparently edited afterwards. Not sure what happened. Go to the current 53m56s mark. POTUS answers the first question and then defers on the second one.

OK, although 'multiple sources' reporting to FOX News is not exactly proof. I'll admit his answer was pretty responsible: he said "We'll see" rather than fully jumping on that bandwagon.

[roscoguy]

I don’t have to prove jack. All I have to do is pay attention to newscasts and anything but the TV rag. Guess you never watch news on any channel.

So says someone without any proof. You've posted nothing but opinion and far out, baseless theories & then don't understand why others don't automatically prescribe to them...

I do watch news, just not the 'alternative facts' reporting that you seem to.

[roscoguy]

This may help you a bit.

"With my colleague, bio-mathematician Jean-Claude Perez, we carefully analyzed the description of the genome of this RNA virus," explains Luc Montagnier, interviewed by Dr Jean-François Lemoine for the daily podcast at Pourquoi Docteur, adding that others have already explored this avenue:

"In order to insert an HIV sequence into this genome, molecular tools are needed, and that can only be done in a laboratory," he added."

Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab (https://www.ibtimes.sg/nobel-winning-scientist-who-co-discovered-hiv-claims-novel-coronavirus-was-made-wuhans-lab-43277)

The headline of this link says "Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab" and it's dated 4/18/2020.


Its humorous, and sad, to see the media still trying to peddle the notion of a "conspiracy theory" to discredit what's essentially been factually established. I've already explained what the "conspiracy theory" argument means in practice, so won't repeat it.

Round and round we go. Another article, same site, same day refutes his claim:
" Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon

Scientists analysed the genome sequence of the new Coronavirus

No human error or leak from any lab"

Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon (https://www.ibtimes.sg/novel-coronavirus-genome-sequence-finally-reveals-origin-natural-not-bio-weapon-41239)

There are even two dissenting opinions within the article you linked to. I guess it comes down to which experts you want to believe.

I've also given my interpretation of what the term "conspiracy theory" means; no need to go there again either.

Lastly, I'm afraid I still don't see how it's "essentially been factually established" when there are at least as many experts that have said & continue to say that it was a naturally occurring virus.

[DianeM]

So says someone without any proof. You've posted nothing but opinion and far out, baseless theories & then don't understand why others don't automatically prescribe to them...

I do watch news, just not the 'alternative facts' reporting that you seem to.

Why on earth are you supporting China?

Yes, the virus is naturally occurring but they were messing with it in a lab in Wuhan that we funded in 2015 so they could be as technically savvy as possible. In 2018 their own scientists were saying the handling was sloppy and could end bad.

It could very well be a Typhoid Mary situation. I personally would not put it past them To have done this on purpose since life is meaningless in communist countries. Remember also that they withheld dispersing information on their situation for all of December until reports came out holding their respective hands to the fire. They also got into the pocket of the WHO to minimize their responsibility.

Because of their duplicity, 184 countries are fighting this killer. How can you possibly defend them?

[TexaninVA]

Round and round we go. Another article, same site, same day refutes his claim:
" Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon

Scientists analysed the genome sequence of the new Coronavirus

No human error or leak from any lab"

Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon (https://www.ibtimes.sg/novel-coronavirus-genome-sequence-finally-reveals-origin-natural-not-bio-weapon-41239)

There are even two dissenting opinions within the article you linked to. I guess it comes down to which experts you want to believe.

I've also given my interpretation of what the term "conspiracy theory" means; no need to go there again either.

Lastly, I'm afraid I still don't see how it's "essentially been factually established" when there are at least as many experts that have said & continue to say that it was a naturally occurring virus.

Round and round indeed … at some point hopefully we’ll all know what the truth is. A key point from the beginning is unsheathing the conspiracy theory sword to preempt discussion of a reasonable explanation is not conducive to reaching the truth. Not necessarily saying you did this but some posters in this thread did.

Anyway, we’ll soon find out …maybe. Some of the findings could end up being classified, and for very good reasons.

In the meantime, here’s a discussion between the former American Defense Attaché, who served in Beijing, and American investor Kyle Bass. Brigadier General Spaulding (USAF-Ret) provides his insights on the Chinese in general and CCP in particular.

Is the US-China Trade War a Cold War? (w/ Kyle Bass and Gen. Robert Spalding) - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl5279dWqGs&t=1s)

One example (at about the 13m mark) is how the CCP strives to control the narrative on topics related to China. That is, they try to control what we (i.e. Americans) are, in effect, “allowed” to think and say about China. They tend to play back our cultural expressions. It’s actually quite clever.

This provides insight into how a topic can become taboo and forbidden by contemporary PC rules. A good example is how the initial discussion of the Wuhan virus as being a product of Chinese biolabs was “forbidden” and quickly scorned by the prestige media as a “conspiracy theory” as already discussed.

The interview was conducted prior to the virus pandemic. I’d be interested people’s thoughtful observations and opinions on the issues the General raises.

[roscoguy]

Anyway, we’ll soon find out …maybe. Some of the findings could end up being classified, and for very good reasons.

In the meantime, here’s a discussion between the former American Defense Attaché, who served in Beijing, and American investor Kyle Bass. Brigadier General Spaulding (USAF-Ret) provides his insights on the Chinese in general and CCP in particular.

Is the US-China Trade War a Cold War? (w/ Kyle Bass and Gen. Robert Spalding) - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl5279dWqGs&t=1s)

One example (at about the 13m mark) is how the CCP strives to control the narrative on topics related to China. That is, they try to control what we (i.e. Americans) are, in effect, “allowed” to think and say about China. They tend to play back our cultural expressions. It’s actually quite clever.

This provides insight into how a topic can become taboo and forbidden by contemporary PC rules. A good example is how the initial discussion of the Wuhan virus as being a product of Chinese biolabs was “forbidden” and quickly scorned by the prestige media as a “conspiracy theory” as already discussed.

The interview was conducted prior to the virus pandemic. I’d be interested people’s thoughtful observations and opinions on the issues the General raises.

You make some very good points, especially this one, to me: "Anyway, we’ll soon find out …maybe." Someday we may know the truth, but it won't necessarily be what we're told by the CCP.

I'll confess: I didn't watch the whole video, but caught the section you cited above. Very interesting stuff & scary, if completely true.

[roscoguy]

Why on earth are you supporting China?

Because of their duplicity, 184 countries are fighting this killer. How can you possibly defend them?

Who on earth said I supported or defended China, for crying out loud??? That never even entered the discussion as far as I can recall. I think I have already explained that I put my faith in non-politically biased science, rather than politically slanted, one-sided, unsubstantiated opinions and rumors.

[DianeM]

Who on earth said I supported or defended China, for crying out loud??? That never even entered the discussion as far as I can recall. I think I have already explained that I put my faith in non-politically biased science, rather than politically slanted, one-sided, unsubstantiated opinions and rumors.

How can you pretend that you are not defending China? Every post that mentions their behavior gets defended by you with the “that’s just rumor” nonsense. Far more learned than I have supplied you with documentation of reports by far more learned than them. There are none so blind as they who will not see.

[roscoguy]

How can you pretend that you are not defending China? Every post that mentions their behavior gets defended by you with the “that’s just rumor” nonsense. Far more learned than I have supplied you with documentation of reports by far more learned than them. There are none so blind as they who will not see.

That is just a completely bizarre interpretation of my posts. Show me ONE instance where I have even implied support or defense of China. Go ahead, I'll wait...

( "Jeopardy" theme song on endless loop...)

If the majority of experts, especially scientists, refute the possibility of leaks or bio-engineering, I'm going to believe them until better evidence is shown. This is NOT a case where the only choices are (a) believe the opinions and theories of the few, or (b) be a cheerleader for China. For crying out loud. :ohdear: :ohdear:

[Koapaka]

How can you pretend that you are not defending China? Every post that mentions their behavior gets defended by you with the “that’s just rumor” nonsense. Far more learned than I have supplied you with documentation of reports by far more learned than them. There are none so blind as they who will not see.


This is a VERY telling video...

https://dl-mail.ymail.com/ws/download/mailboxes/@.id==VjN-cmSXqw9pjLIiwGArqvuVdvCjoucprXwM63vYnZnqSWR7w-Io3ng2VJDs89EhMkotBmBxuc2UTjmHlmQVvjcwMQ/messages/@.id==ABgE4oVy0FvAXpxwLQUkaKiDDt0/content/parts/@.id==2/raw?appid=YMailNorrinLaunch&ymreqid=870699b4-07ad-f429-1cf1-440000017600&token=zitEzqOML3j84e6ealFTT5U7-km5qEQF52lp7AcCuBbgUNK5TTvXYginJCToSuwDWGinYDuUljh-THL_DZUK4PbauQyXLTs2EiS0z24iZCQaXYsR4RvwvgV3QYEmzl 84

[Kenswing]

China is just ruining everything...
China cracks down on funeral strippers (https://nypost.com/2018/02/21/china-cracks-down-on-funeral-strippers/?utm_source=twitter_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site+buttons&utm_campaign=site+buttons&fbclid=IwAR2nb9dTIuw4OIqCo300tf6YpU0SdanSrPDXCa2Ap bY4CMr5bu0D5NnDsH0)

[roscoguy]

This is a VERY telling video...

https://dl-mail.ymail.com/ws/download/mailboxes/@.id==VjN-cmSXqw9pjLIiwGArqvuVdvCjoucprXwM63vYnZnqSWR7w-Io3ng2VJDs89EhMkotBmBxuc2UTjmHlmQVvjcwMQ/messages/@.id==ABgE4oVy0FvAXpxwLQUkaKiDDt0/content/parts/@.id==2/raw?appid=YMailNorrinLaunch&ymreqid=870699b4-07ad-f429-1cf1-440000017600&token=zitEzqOML3j84e6ealFTT5U7-km5qEQF52lp7AcCuBbgUNK5TTvXYginJCToSuwDWGinYDuUljh-THL_DZUK4PbauQyXLTs2EiS0z24iZCQaXYsR4RvwvgV3QYEmzl 84

This seems to be a bad link. Has anyone else gotten it to work?

China is just ruining everything...
China cracks down on funeral strippers (https://nypost.com/2018/02/21/china-cracks-down-on-funeral-strippers/?utm_source=twitter_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site+buttons&utm_campaign=site+buttons&fbclid=IwAR2nb9dTIuw4OIqCo300tf6YpU0SdanSrPDXCa2Ap bY4CMr5bu0D5NnDsH0)

That just about does it! I'm NEVER going to another Chinese funeral again. And I'm gonna peel the "Made in China" label off everything I buy from now on. :1rotfl:

[TexaninVA]

Thanks for posting this.

One way or another China is responsible for this virus and they must be made to pay economically big time, by the whole world when this is under control.

Turning a blind eye to this evil regime, who want to control the world, is a big mistake!

This is an article from today’s NYT that explains how Chinese intelligence operatives spread messages to sow virus panic in the US.

Here’s the link: Chinese Agents Helped Spread Messages That Sowed Virus Panic in U.S., Officials Say - The New York Times (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/22/us/politics/coronavirus-china-disinformation.html?smid=fb-share)

This is the first several paragraphs … the article itself is longer.

(My Takeaway this is simply more evidence that China, under the boot of the CCP, is an enemy of our country. They are at war with us but most Americans remains uninformed, more accurately clueless, about the true nature and aims of the CCP.)

WASHINGTON — The alarming messages came fast and furious in mid-March, popping up on the cellphone screens and social media feeds of millions of Americans grappling with the onset of the coronavirus pandemic.
Spread the word, the messages said: The Trump administration was about to lock down the entire country.
“They will announce this as soon as they have troops in place to help prevent looters and rioters,” warned one of the messages, which cited a source in the Department of Homeland Security. “He said he got the call last night and was told to pack and be prepared for the call today with his dispatch orders.”
The messages became so widespread over 48 hours that the White House’s National Security Council issued an announcement via Twitter that they were “FAKE.”

Since that wave of panic, United States intelligence agencies have assessed that Chinese operatives helped push the messages across platforms, according to six American officials, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to publicly discuss intelligence matters. The amplification techniques are alarming to officials because the disinformation showed up as texts on many Americans’ cellphones, a tactic that several of the officials said they had not seen before.
That has spurred agencies to look at new ways in which China, Russia and other nations are using a range of platforms to spread disinformation during the pandemic, they said.

The origin of the messages remains murky. American officials declined to reveal details of the intelligence linking Chinese agents to the dissemination of the disinformation, citing the need to protect their sources and methods for monitoring Beijing’s activities.

The officials interviewed for this article work in six different agencies. They included both career civil servants and political appointees, and some have spent many years analyzing China. Their broader warnings about China’s spread of disinformation are supported by recent findings from outside bipartisan research groups, including the Alliance for Securing Democracy and the Center for a New American Security, which is expected to release a report on the topic next month.

(much more to the article)


...

[TexaninVA]

There are several articles available from medical sources that have already looked at this question. Their conclusions are that COVID19 mutated (or evolved) from animals into a form that infects humans. This isn't a selective virus. As a weapon, it makes about as much sense as using a grenade for home defense. That being said, I think the issue is what the Chinese Communist Party has done with the virus since it showed up. They have 'weaponized' it for their own political and economic gain, and to increase their influence in countries around the world. The Czech Republic, having lived for so many years under the Soviet's domination, is being smart. Spain not so much. Even some news outlets and politicians seem to be aligning themselves with the CCP's narrative. Some of the "loyal opposition" isn't looking all that loyal.

CNN, amongst other sources, reports that US intelligence is looking into the possibility that the Coronavirus (i.e., more accurately, the Wuhan virus, but I digress) originated in a Chinese bio lab.

To put this in perspective, a “bio lab” in China means, by definition, it has military and intelligence ties in some form or fashion. The PLA’s primary mission to “preserve, protect and defend”, so to speak, the Chines Communist Party (CCP).

Here’s the link:

Coronavirus Began in Chinese Lab? US Investigates - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0Dw7mPt-zM&feature=emb_logo)

The Chinese lab director has denied any and all involvement … yadda. The director is also a senior member of the CCP.


...

[TexaninVA]

When the China flu started it has been said the first thing to disappear from the news was the pro democracy demonstrations in China.

Related in the sense that Chinese Intel is working this behind the scenes with their "diplomats."

“An EU report about Chinese and Russian disinformation on coronavirus was watered down after pressure from Beijing.

Three people confirmed to POLITICO that Chinese diplomats exerted pressure on the EU to change the wording of the report, details of which were first reported in Brussels Playbook on Tuesday.

The report — on "narratives and disinformation" around the coronavirus pandemic — was finally published on Friday with heavily toned-down language on China.”

The complete story can be found in this link:

China put pressure on EU to soften coronavirus disinformation report - POLITICO (https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/25/china-put-pressure-on-eu-to-soften-coronavirus-disinformation-report-207797)


...

[TexaninVA]

I love conspiracy theories, NOT.

This, however, about what the Pentagon knew, needs further investigation.

...

When it comes to the ongoing Stealth War by the CCP against the USA, it’s easy to understand why they would think we are existentially dumb, or maybe naïve is a nicer word?

Here’ the first part of the article:

“Chinese company Da Jiang Innovations, the world’s largest maker of drones, has donated drones to 43 law enforcement agencies operating in 22 U.S. states to enforce social distancing rules.”

It's a safe bet the Chinese drones flying over US cities are passing the feed back to Chinese Intel through various technical means.

Here’s the link for the full article.
Chinese Company Suspected Of Spying On US Citizens Donates Police Drones To 22 States | Zero Hedge (https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/chinese-company-suspected-spying-us-citizens-donates-police-drones-22-states)


...