Covid 19 saliva test question

[jebartle]

If this test is a good test, why is this not MAILED to Americans, problem solved, healthcare workers removed from danger, tests done quickly, easy test to complete. There has to be a reason it's not happening.

[billethkid]

If this test is a good test, why is this not MAILED to Americans, problem solved, healthcare workers removed from danger, tests done quickly, easy test to complete. There has to be a reason it's not happening.

Too many tests might result in the dilution of the fear factor.

[LuvtheVillages]

If this test is a good test, why is this not MAILED to Americans, problem solved, healthcare workers removed from danger, tests done quickly, easy test to complete. There has to be a reason it's not happening.

I read an article about this test today. They FedEx the test to you. You swab you’re own nose. Then you FedEx the sample back to them. Cost is $119. Results emailed to you.

[chet2020]

I read an article about this test today. They FedEx the test to you. You swab you’re own nose. Then you FedEx the sample back to them. Cost is $119. Results emailed to you.

Take this a step further. Ramp production up to 327 million tests (I think we'd be eligible for a volume discount). Send the tests to every American, free of charge, on the same day. Every Covid positive person self-isolates, boom, three weeks later the virus is eradicated. This is sort of the idea behind Tom Romer's plan (Nobel laureate in Economics). Test the virus out of existence.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Take this a step further. Ramp production up to 327 million tests (I think we'd be eligible for a volume discount). Send the tests to every American, free of charge, on the same day. Every Covid positive person self-isolates, boom, three weeks later the virus is eradicated. This is sort of the idea behind Tom Romer's plan (Nobel laureate in Economics). Test the virus out of existence.

It's a faulty plan.

One test goes out to everyone. Everyone tests on the same day. Except those people who don't need to take no stankin test. And those people who forgot. And those people who didn't get the fedex yet. And those people who weren't home that week.

But everyone ELSE takes it - and sends it back. The very next day, before the tests are even out of the Fedex envelope at the lab, 50 people who were negative the day before, now test positive.

The test comes back negative. So they don't self-isolate, and then pass it to another 100 people.

And the beat goes on.

[kathyspear]

From what I have read, the swab has to go WAY BACK ... like several inches ... into your nose. Most people would not self-perform the test properly and the results would be worthless.

k.

[jebartle]

I read an article about this test today. They FedEx the test to you. You swab you’re own nose. Then you FedEx the sample back to them. Cost is $119. Results emailed to you.

Hmmm. There is the problem $119, most folks can't buy food, so how can they pay for test, but I thought there was a test, you spit in cup.

[MandoMan]

If this test is a good test, why is this not MAILED to Americans, problem solved, healthcare workers removed from danger, tests done quickly, easy test to complete. There has to be a reason it's not happening.

When the article below came out, on April 14, the saliva test had only been tested—by the company that developed it—on 60 people! That company hired a testing company to try it on 10 more people to see if it could confirm that the test worked. That is NOT enough for a clinical trial, and its accuracy has not been certified by testing agencies. For example, how accurate is the test? What is the percentage of false positives and false negatives? (There was an article in the New York Times last weekend about a group of virus researchers in California that tested, I think, 29 of the virus antibody tests flooding the market (there are many more now) and found only ONE that didn’t have lots of false readings. Ten percent false positives was common, and 5% false negatives.) (That study was done on multiple specimens of the blood of about 600 people already diagnosed as having the virus. It tested accuracy and sensitivity of what is on the market now.)

There is a big difference between a drug company making a few thousand swabs and making 330 million swabs, at once, all to be delivered on the same day. It takes time to even develop the packaging and the directions. It would be very difficult for, say, UPS to deliver that many packages to every house in the country in one day. It would be even harder to pick them up. A lot of people have to drive a half hour to a UPS pickup spot, whether in car or golf-cart.

Would this test be processed by the drug company that invented the test or by private labs around the country? Whichever, the processing will require several hundred thousand expensive machines that have to be built, certified, shipped around the country, tested. All before the first swab is sent for processing. And what happens to those machines once the rush is past? Will they see occasional use for the next few years?

I agree that your idea is a good one. It just isn’t feasible yet, and it may never be. Just think of all the trouble the government has trying to get everyone to fill out the 2020 census. Would everyone willingly give up their DNA for testing? What if they don’t have email? What if they are homeless, or illegals?

If the virus could be detected with a simple test that has been around for decades, like the TB tests, it would be so much easier. But I’m not sure this virus could have been easily tested for even a few years ago. Lab testing is getting better and better, fast, but some things take time.

First Saliva Test for COVID-19 Approved for Emergency Use by FDA | The Scientist Magazine(R) (https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/first-saliva-test-for-covid-19-approved-for-emergency-use-by-fda-67416)

[Indydealmaker]

Monkey wrench: too many will not self-quarantine.

[Bikeracer2009]

I've seen on many news channels that people are starting to go back outside in large groups. Playing in parks, beaches and other public places. It's like herding cats. You'l never get everyone to work together to defeat this virus, it's here to stay. The experts are saying China most likely lied about their numbers and it's 85 times higher than they reported. It light of all of this it seems the best thing to do is protect yourself as best you can.

I'm not a doctor or an expert and I don't guarantee any information I've given as 100% accurate.

[jebartle]

When the article below came out, on April 14, the saliva test had only been tested—by the company that developed it—on 60 people! That company hired a testing company to try it on 10 more people to see if it could confirm that the test worked. That is NOT enough for a clinical trial, and its accuracy has not been certified by testing agencies. For example, how accurate is the test? What is the percentage of false positives and false negatives? (There was an article in the New York Times last weekend about a group of virus researchers in California that tested, I think, 29 of the virus antibody tests flooding the market (there are many more now) and found only ONE that didn’t have lots of false readings. Ten percent false positives was common, and 5% false negatives.) (That study was done on multiple specimens of the blood of about 600 people already diagnosed as having the virus. It tested accuracy and sensitivity of what is on the market now.)

There is a big difference between a drug company making a few thousand swabs and making 330 million swabs, at once, all to be delivered on the same day. It takes time to even develop the packaging and the directions. It would be very difficult for, say, UPS to deliver that many packages to every house in the country in one day. It would be even harder to pick them up. A lot of people have to drive a half hour to a UPS pickup spot, whether in car or golf-cart.

Would this test be processed by the drug company that invented the test or by private labs around the country? Whichever, the processing will require several hundred thousand expensive machines that have to be built, certified, shipped around the country, tested. All before the first swab is sent for processing. And what happens to those machines once the rush is past? Will they see occasional use for the next few years?

I agree that your idea is a good one. It just isn’t feasible yet, and it may never be. Just think of all the trouble the government has trying to get everyone to fill out the 2020 census. Would everyone willingly give up their DNA for testing? What if they don’t have email? What if they are homeless, or illegals?

If the virus could be detected with a simple test that has been around for decades, like the TB tests, it would be so much easier. But I’m not sure this virus could have been easily tested for even a few years ago. Lab testing is getting better and better, fast, but some things take time.

First Saliva Test for COVID-19 Approved for Emergency Use by FDA | The Scientist Magazine(R) (https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/first-saliva-test-for-covid-19-approved-for-emergency-use-by-fda-67416)

Thanks for your reply, I googled but no answer, yours seems very logical.

[Jazzman]

If this test is a good test, why is this not MAILED to Americans, problem solved, healthcare workers removed from danger, tests done quickly, easy test to complete. There has to be a reason it's not happening.

No that simple. The reason, a lot of people will not follow the directions provided. Following correct protocols are the required basis for accurate diagnostic tests

[Earlride]

Bear in mind, once tested, you are only guaranteed free of infection until you interact with the next person in your day who may give it to you.

[bumpygreens]

The OP posts about a saliva test, and right away people are concerned about how far they will have to shove a swab up their nose. I think I know why self testing won't work.:ohdear:

[Altavia]

Thanks for your reply, I googled but no answer, yours seems very logical.

Good question and Jebartel provided a great response.

In case of interest, this video shows the steps required to process the sample using a fully automated system from BioFire illustrating the complexity of the test.

The BioFire® FilmArray® System - How It Works - YouTube (https://youtu.be/V5fUwjodmz4)

[thelegges]

It took 3 weeks for genealogy saliva test, due to it was a prime day event. Three weeks later, saliva insufficient, had to do it agin. I think they lost it

[kathyspear]

The OP posts about a saliva test, and right away people are concerned about how far they will have to shove a swab up their nose. I think I know why self testing won't work.:ohdear:

Since I am the IDIOT who talked about "swab(s) up their nose":

(1) I was commenting on post #3 which talked about nose swabs. Sorry I didn't make that clear.

(2) The first saliva test was approved by the FDA two weeks ago but is NOT approved for home use. Right now, testing involves the swab procedure I described.

k.

[chet2020]

It's a faulty plan.

One test goes out to everyone. Everyone tests on the same day. Except those people who don't need to take no stankin test. And those people who forgot. And those people who didn't get the fedex yet. And those people who weren't home that week.

But everyone ELSE takes it - and sends it back. The very next day, before the tests are even out of the Fedex envelope at the lab, 50 people who were negative the day before, now test positive.

The test comes back negative. So they don't self-isolate, and then pass it to another 100 people.

And the beat goes on.

It was a "food for thought" comment, you are correct, of course such a plan would not work.

[Donb0975]

If you test negative today doesn’t mean you test negative tomorrow.

[thelegges]

If you test negative today doesn’t mean you test negative tomorrow.

That could be said a year from now

[NFRicaS]

The OP posts about a saliva test, and right away people are concerned about how far they will have to shove a swab up their nose. I think I know why self testing won't work.:ohdear:
Boy, are you on point...people are stupid (lots of them..) they will not read instructions, will skew the results, fake the tests, etc...
Too bad it wouldn’t work, it’s a good idea!!

[Troopie]

The answer is $$$$$$$$

[coffeebean]

If this test is a good test, why is this not MAILED to Americans, problem solved, healthcare workers removed from danger, tests done quickly, easy test to complete. There has to be a reason it's not happening.

Testing would have to be done on a regular basis. Look at one of President Trump's staff members......she tested negative every day than one day she tested positive.

Honestly, it is impossible to test every person every day. Should we test every person every day until they have a positive test? This all seems very daunting.

[Number 10 GI]

The only thing testing will do is provide an infection rate for statistical analysis. It will do nothing to reduce the number of infections.

[Altavia]

A nice synopsis on the different test methods.


Testing and Diagnosis

You have heard a lot about testing and its probably getting a little confusing, Especially with the new tests coming online. So let me break them down for you.

RT-rPCR: this was the molecular test designed by the German Scientist in January. Basically, you collect a sample, using a swab, from the very very back of your nose (nasopharangeal). In that sample, you have your own cells, and if you are infected, the virus as well. The virus is then extracted from the sample (Bust cells, wash away crud, capture nucleic acids, and then collect pure nucleic acids fro analysis. We then have to convert the viral RNA to DNA. Following this step a pair of primers and a probe are used to amplify any detect any viral genetic material. These primers/probe are VERY specific and will only amplify a specific part of the genome of this virus. For a more detailed description see here Kits, reagents and viruses - Virology Down Under (https://virologydownunder.com/kits-reagents-and-viruses/)

Basically, if this test comes back positive, it means you are currently infected with SARS-CoV2. It does not mean you have COVID-19, which is the disease the virus CAN cause.

We have currently done about 3 million of these tests in the USA. The test can be done in 15 minutes (Roche POC test), but typically takes 24-48 hours when you are having to process 100-1000's of samples at a time.

Antigen Test: This is the new test coming to market soon. It basically uses antibodies, which have been made in the lab, to detect viral proteins in your mucus and spit. It works just like a pregnancy test, but with spit rather than pee. There is the potential that millions of these tests can be made available per week. They can be done at home, or if done in a hospital or doctors surgery, they are much safer for the staff.

If this test comes back positive, it means you are currently infected with SARS-CoV2. It does not mean you have COVID-19, which is the disease the virus CAN cause

Serological test (Antibody test): These tests are available now. Serological tests determine if you have been PREVIOUSLY infected. They test your blood to see if you have antibodies that recognize proteins found on the surface of the virus. At the moment, these tests are highly problematic. Too many unverified tests coming in from overseas. If the manufacturer has designed it wrong, it will give you a false positive reading. It will signal that you were infected, but in reality you are still susceptible.

If this test comes back positive, and it works properly, it means you were previously infected SARS-CoV2. PLEASE NOTE: That more than 50% of all diagnosis coming from these serological test, even the best designed ones, will give you a false positive reading. Tread very carefully with making life decisions based on outcomes of this test (For now).

Where we are now? (https://www.erinbromage.com/post/where-we-are-now)

[coffeebean]

The only thing testing will do is provide an infection rate for statistical analysis. It will do nothing to reduce the number of infections.

Antibody testing will be a better indication of mortality rate.

[Swoop]

Antibody testing will be a better indication of mortality rate.

Absolutely correct!