What does Covid-19 in the White House teach us?

[skarra]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

[Kilmacowen]

Chris Christie has been checked into the hospital. He is old, morbidly obese, and has asthma. This doesn't look good.

[Wallyworld]

There will never be a vaccine. Live your life to the fullest every day!!!

[tophcfa]

Wear a mask!

[manaboutown]

Frankly, I was starting to relax a bit, going out to run a few errands to get me out of the house. Now I am back to ordering hardware and other items from Amazon and getting my groceries delivered. I have not had a haircut or been on an aircraft since February and thought maybe I was being a little paranoid but I no longer feel that way. I have always worn a mask in public buildings but not in their parking lots. I am now going to wear a mask in parking lots but not while out walking for exercise.

[golfing eagles]

Wear a mask!

///

[Bikeracer2009]

There was a guy on TOTV that was arguing with everyone about covid-19. He came across as an expert with a prediction that by October 1st the virus would be gone and he wouldn't have to live like Howard Hughes anymore. I won't say who he is. He knows I'm talking about him.

Where is this expert now?

Where is his scientific analysis and predictions?

Sometimes science gets it wrong so listen to your instincts and protect yourself at all times. The virus can still hit this place hard just like it did the Whitehouse.

[Bucco]

There was a guy on TOTV that was arguing with everyone about covid-19. He came across as an expert with a prediction that by October 1st the virus would be gone and he wouldn't have to live like Howard Hughes anymore. I won't say who he is. He knows I'm talking about him.

Where is this expert now?

Where is his scientific analysis and predictions?

Sometimes science gets it wrong so listen to your instincts and protect yourself at all times. The virus can still hit this place hard just like it did the Whitehouse.


Of all the messages we have heard, it is my opinion that the science message was never wrong, sometimes needing more data to update, but not wrong in the truest sense.

Lacking one message, we have had to choose.

[GoPacers]

There was a guy on TOTV that was arguing with everyone about covid-19. He came across as an expert with a prediction that by October 1st the virus would be gone and he wouldn't have to live like Howard Hughes anymore. I won't say who he is. He knows I'm talking about him.

Where is this expert now?

Where is his scientific analysis and predictions?

Sometimes science gets it wrong so listen to your instincts and protect yourself at all times. The virus can still hit this place hard just like it did the Whitehouse.

You're taking about Mr Herd Immunity? He was wrong from day one but was so eloquent in his musings that people thought he sounded smart. Science is never wrong. Misunderstanding the data and drawing erroneous conclusions is not science. Anyone who truly understood the science of infectious disease knew he was wrong.

I don't wish Covid on anyone and hope everyone infected recovers fully. I know this is not always the case unfortunately.

I'm still optimistic that Americans are resilient and will persevere, despite what the unhappy minority like to convey.

[cb1972]

any more info on why the recent spike in Sumpter Co. Thinking of driving down for a couple weeks to get the place ready for January . I know there was a separate thread on this but cant find it . I saw 80 cases in one day.

[LiverpoolWalrus]

Does anyone know what to make of the huge spike in positive rates in Sumter County on September 29 and 30 according to Home | Florida Department of Health COVID-19 Outbreak (https://floridahealthcovid19.gov/?) The county had been at about 4% on average and then spiked up to 21% on 9/29 and 22% on 9/30.

[VApeople]

Is there anything else that can be learned?

No, there is nothing else to learn. We learned everything we needed in February.

Social distance from others, stay away from indoor spaces with other people, wear clean masks in stores, wash your hands frequently.

Of course, that is easy for unemployed people like us.

[Cheapbas]

Did anyone see the short clip when Amy approached the rose garden party in a mask, she was met by 3 gentleman, one I think was mark meadows (could only see back of his head), it then appeared judging by the look on her face and actions, that she was asked to remove her mask which she promptly did.

[Leadbone1]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!

[Leadbone1]

Wear a mask!

Masks are useless against this virus. Covid molecule very small and can pass right through it. Read what leading epidemiologists say! Just psychological. Covid is not a death sentence. 99% survivable just like the flu. No mask for me!
So tired of the paranoia!

[Coal Miner]

Lets believe science not self serving politicians.

[Alicat5977]

Does anyone know what to make of the huge spike in positive rates in Sumter County on September 29 and 30 according to Home | Florida Department of Health COVID-19 Outbreak (https://floridahealthcovid19.gov/?) The county had been at about 4% on average and then spiked up to 21% on 9/29 and 22% on 9/30.
My guess would be Labor Day Celebrations: That would be about the end of the incubation period when people would start showing symptoms. No medical knowledge just a common sense guess.

[Heyitsrick]

Did anyone see the short clip when Amy approached the rose garden party in a mask, she was met by 3 gentleman, one I think was mark meadows (could only see back of his head), it then appeared judging by the look on her face and actions, that she was asked to remove her mask which she promptly did.

You mean the same Judge Barrett who already contracted Covid-19 during the summer?

Amy Coney Barrett had COVID-19 earlier this year, officials say - Chicago Tribune (https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-nw-amy-coney-barrett-covid-19-20201002-vjvmmnpjpzct5ijxesp7bmme64-story.html)

[coffeebean]

No, there is nothing else to learn. We learned everything we needed in February.

Social distance from others, stay away from indoor spaces with other people, wear clean masks in stores, wash your hands frequently.

Of course, that is easy for unemployed people like us.

You speak the truth with the exception of wearing of masks. Back in February, let's not forget, the American people were told by our experts not to wear masks if you had no symptoms. Oh yes, I know "they" had their reasons for lying to the American people. That was wrong as the science knew the virus was transmitted by asymptomatic and presymptomatic infected people.

That is water under the bridge now. Going forward, when the scientists finally DID tell the American people to cover their faces, the damage was already done and many people continued to believe that masks were not necessary and worse yet, were detrimental to our health. Of course there are many Americans who did head the advice and continue to this day to cover their faces in public spaces, especially indoors. Many people got to work making home made masks to mitigate the virus as soon as we were told to cover our faces in public spaces, especially indoors.

Back in February, a bad example was set for the American people and continued until a few days ago. Let's hope that message will now change going forward. Anti-maskers have been out there, infecting people they don't know and bringing the virus home to loved ones. Sorry to say, it's not getting any better, even today. Unless we have a safe and effective vaccine, America will never reach herd immunity. That is a sad state of affairs.

[rlcooper70]

This email about the virus going through a mask ... makes no sense considering the facts. Let's be real on these pages - wearing a mask keeps most if not all of the particles on the side of the wearer of the mask and keeps others safe. To think otherwise is mystifying.

[Joyce952]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.



Well said

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

Well said

[coffeebean]

Masks are useless against this virus. Covid molecule very small and can pass right through it. Read what leading epidemiologists say! Just psychological. Covid is not a death sentence. 99% survivable just like the flu. No mask for me!
So tired of the paranoia!

Agree, the Covid virus is so small that is can pass through masks. What you do not seem to understand is that the virus is transmitted in DROPLETS and AEROSOLS. There are up to thousands of Covid virus particles in one droplet. That one droplet can be easily blocked by a mask. Times that one droplet by many many more. Why not block thousands of those virus particles with masks? Even aerosols are blocked by masks so why not wear a mask? Everyone has been asked to do their part but anti-maskers seem to feel they don't have to.

[Singerlady]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!

Wear a mask. They are NOT useless.
We DON’T know about Trump’s comorbidities..he’s not forthcoming on his state of health.
Regardless of the percentages, I don’t want to be in that 2% category and I don’t want to be in the 98% category either BECAUSE we DON’T know the long term effects of this virus and NEITHER do the experts, yet.
The media (scientists reporting) is giving us the science behind what they know NOW. The non-scientists are telling us nothing based on fact.
Use your brains and TRY to HELP slow this this virus down. Stop being stupid and selfish.

[jebartle]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!

Leadbone, hmmmm!, I have another name for you, but, because moderator asks us to refrain from name-calling, I will behave. Folks, listen to the scientist, period.

[coffeebean]

No reason to hibernate for the rest of your life because the President got the virus. No hair cut? No grocery store? Mask wearing in a parking lot? Life doesnt end. Its called “adapting”. Go out and enjoy the day

I have been a proponent for mask wearing from mid March. I wear a mask in public spaces indoors. I will, however, remove my mask as soon as I exit the building. I will never wear a mask in a parking lot when I'm not close to anyone. Even passing someone in a parking lot will not make me cover my face. No need to do that. The science has said that you need close contact for at least a few minutes to contract enough of the virus to infect you. Passing someone in a parking lot will not be enough to infect anyone.

I will continue to dine in restaurants indoors only if the tables are distanced properly for social distancing. I do not wear a mask when seated in a restaurant. All other times, my mask is on my face.

[Niferlou06]

You are all adults and do not need the Government nor anyone else to tell you what to do. Listen to yourself, your instincts, and act accordingly. Too many people in TV "go along" with others. If it doesn't feel right; simply don't do it. You know how to protect yourself; wear a mask; wash hand frequently for at least 20 seconds or use sanitizer if unable to wash; remain away from others.

Most important; when with others:
6 feet distance, wearing a mask for 10 minutes OR LESS.
That does not mean wearing a mask makes group contact okay; it means 10 minutes OR LESS.

[coffeebean]

No reason to hibernate for the rest of your life because the President got the virus. No hair cut? No grocery store? Mask wearing in a parking lot? Life doesnt end. Its called “adapting”. Go out and enjoy the day

Which brings up a good point about being in close proximity to people who are infected. Early on in this pandemic, the story came out about two hairdressers who were infected with Covid. Not knowing they were positive for the virus, they continued to work on their customers. About 80 customers were in this close contact with the hairdressers. Not one of their customers became infected with the virus. Why? Both hairdressers wore masks and all their patrons wore masks. I like those odds for mask wearing.

[coffeebean]

This email about the virus going through a mask ... makes no sense considering the facts. Let's be real on these pages - wearing a mask keeps most if not all of the particles on the side of the wearer of the mask and keeps others safe. To think otherwise is mystifying.

That is the anti-masker mentality. Going forward, I'm hoping all Americans will be receiving a different message from "TPTB". We learn from our mistakes. I'm hoping there is humility involved with getting that message out. Hubby says, "no way". I'm hoping hubby is wrong.

[Leadbone1]

Wear a mask. They are NOT useless.
We DON’T know about Trump’s comorbidities..he’s not forthcoming on his state of health.
Regardless of the percentages, I don’t want to be in that 2% category and I don’t want to be in the 98% category either BECAUSE we DON’T know the long term effects of this virus and NEITHER do the experts, yet.
The media (scientists reporting) is giving us the science behind what they know NOW. The non-scientists are telling us nothing based on fact.
Use your brains and TRY to HELP slow this this virus down. Stop being stupid and selfish.

Educate yourself. Go read what leading epidemiologist have to say. The Covid molecule is small enough that it will pass through any mask. Believe what you choose to believe. You cannot hide from a virus. The fact that the president got it when everyone around him is tested daily is proof of that. Good news is, he will survive just like 99% do.

[graciegirl]

Paranoid much?

Why would anyone in a Pandemic refuse to do something as simple as wear a mask in public places for the duration?

It doesn't cause pain. It is affordable. It is easy. It is socially acceptable. It makes 70% of the country agree with you.

If you want to push against what is acceptable you can go around with your pants unzipped.

You can wear your "Make love, not War Shirt.".

[coffeebean]

Okay, YOU stay inside, don't socialize and we'll call you in a year.

Staying inside is not an option. Most folks don't want to become Howard Hughes. Social distancing, wearing a mask, washing our hands and not touching our face with unwashed hands is what we have been asked to do. These are the CDC guidelines to help us all stay safe and mitigate this virus. Doing any of these things does not infringe on enjoying life. It is very easy to enjoy life while following the guidelines.

[Ragman]

My guess would be Labor Day Celebrations: That would be about the end of the incubation period when people would start showing symptoms. No medical knowledge just a common sense guess.

The recent Sumter county spike was due to an outbreak at the Coleman prison complex.

Cases in The Villages have been about 5 per day (667 total since March) for over a month except for a 20 case spike on one day. Complete data is available daily including cases by zip-code.

I believe everyone should take reasonable precautions commensurate with their risk factors, including household members. I don't believe now is not the time to return to a pre-covid lifestyle, nor grovel in fear.

[graciegirl]

Covid-19 doesn't care where you sit or what you do for a living;

Boris Johnson: it was 50-50 whether to put me on ventilator | World news | The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/03/boris-johnson-it-was-50-50-whether-to-put-me-on-ventilator-coronavirus)

[pattytracey]

Live our lives to the fullest and pray to God it will be over soon

[msilagy]

NOTHING.....the villagers just want to dance in the squares!

[wiltma]

Who’s dancing in the squares now?

[Dahabs]

Masks are useless against this virus. Covid molecule very small and can pass right through it. Read what leading epidemiologists say! Just psychological. Covid is not a death sentence. 99% survivable just like the flu. No mask for me!
So tired of the paranoia!

Good luck.

[GaryKoca]

We all hope for a full recovery for the President, but let's face it - he flaunted the medical experts and mocked those who wore masks. The best advice is still - wear masks when indoors, social distance, and wash your hands frequently. I don't know about the last one, but he certainly did not observe the first two - nor did anyone around him - and now he is paying the price.

[doodles]

Doctors and nurses have been wearing masks for all these years to keep their Germs away from their patients. Don’t understand how so many can be so self centered that they won’t wear a mask to protect others.

[Bucco]

You speak the truth with the exception of wearing of masks. Back in February, let's not forget, the American people were told by our experts not to wear masks if you had no symptoms. Oh yes, I know "they" had their reasons for lying to the American people. That was wrong as the science knew the virus was transmitted by asymptomatic and presymptomatic infected people.

That is water under the bridge now. Going forward, when the scientists finally DID tell the American people to cover their faces, the damage was already done and many people continued to believe that masks were not necessary and worse yet, were detrimental to our health. Of course there are many Americans who did head the advice and continue to this day to cover their faces in public spaces, especially indoors. Many people got to work making home made masks to mitigate the virus as soon as we were told to cover our faces in public spaces, especially indoors.

Back in February, a bad example was set for the American people and continued until a few days ago. Let's hope that message will now change going forward. Anti-maskers have been out there, infecting people they don't know and bringing the virus home to loved ones. Sorry to say, it's not getting any better, even today. Unless we have a safe and effective vaccine, America will never reach herd immunity. That is a sad state of affairs.

Just for proper context...on Dr Fauci and masks
---------
""I don't regret anything I said then because in the context of the time in which I said it, it was correct. We were told in our task force meetings that we have a serious problem with the lack of PPEs and masks for the health providers who are putting themselves in harm's way every day to take care of sick people," Fauci told O'Donnell. [/B]

"When it became clear that the infection could be spread by asymptomatic carriers who don't know they're infected, that made it very clear that we had to strongly recommend masks," he said.

"And also, it soon became clear that we had enough protective equipment and that cloth masks and homemade masks were as good as masks that you would buy from surgical supply stores," Fauci added. "So in the context of when we were not strongly recommending it, it was the correct thing.""

--------

Dr. Fauci doesn'''t regret advising against masks early in pandemic - Business Insider (https://www.businessinsider.com/fauci-doesnt-regret-advising-against-masks-early-in-pandemic-2020-7)

Just to diminish the "he changed his mind"..."he is anti mask"
Theories.

[Ele201]

He’s not that old — just 58. Chris Christie has been checked into the hospital. He is old, morbidly obese, and has asthma. This doesn't look good.

[ruralgoddess]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!
His comorbities: obese, high cholesterol

[jbrown132]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

Who knows where the President contracted Covid from. If nothing else it proves if he can get it anyone can. Everyone of those people in the Rose Garden had to test negative before they were admitted. Everyone that enters or gets near the President has to test negative. So what does this tell us. Is this telling us testing is ineffective? I keep reading in these posts that science is never wrong. That is incorrect. Scientific theories that came out years ago can and often are disproved today. Remember this virus started less than a year ago. The science is still evolving on this. I suspect a year or two years from now much of what has been taken as gospel today will change. So what are our choices. We can hide in our homes and never leave or we can go about our lives as normally as possible and take as many precautions as we can. The one thing that is a fact is that this is a virus. You cannot hide from it no more than you can from a common cold or the flu. So it comes down to personal choice and you have to make that decision. So if you choose to go out, wear your mask, wash your hands, use hand sanitizers but remember there is always a risk as is much of life.

[billyb1950]

Chris Christie has been checked into the hospital. He is old, morbidly obese, and has asthma. This doesn't look good.

Yes, he is obese and has asthma, but he's only 58 years old...that's not old, at least compared to us old codgers here in TV. :icon_wink:

[ruralgoddess]

March? That is old news. Dr. Fauci has since changed his tune and has been telling us that masks do stop much of the virus from escaping into the surrounding air. He is pleading with Americans to cover their faces and has been saying that for several months.

I haven't posted the following video in a few months, but I'll post it again now. It is so easy to understand how covering the nose and mouth can minimize the spread of a virus, including the virus that causes Covid.......

How a mask blocks droplets - YouTube (https://youtu.be/F0RcH9DfuyE)

There are plenty of other videos on YouTube that demonstrate, with ultra violet cameras, how droplets and aerosols are blocked by covering the face. It really baffles me how anti-maskers can not grasp the concept.
thanks for posting this

[Fore!]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!
Thank you. A voice of reason. The media is to blame for much of this. Scientists cannot agree on anything as can’t the physicians.

[ruralgoddess]

Educate yourself. Go read what leading epidemiologist have to say. The Covid molecule is small enough that it will pass through any mask. Believe what you choose to believe. You cannot hide from a virus. The fact that the president got it when everyone around him is tested daily is proof of that. Good news is, he will survive just like 99% do.
While the President may well survive the initial disease, there is no guarantee that he won't have to suffer its long term, ongoing residual debilitating effects.

[greenflash245]

wrong. he is 74

[ruralgoddess]

respectfully disagree

[Astron]

You can find articles by leading epidemiologist explaining that the Covid molecule is so small that it will pass through any mask. When they initially told you not to wear a mask because it will do no good they were not lying to you. Wearing them now is pretty much only psychological. You cannot hide from a virus. But you should not worry about it either because it has the same survivability as the flu. I’m looking forward to the day that people lose the paranoia and stop walking around with their face covered looking like idiots!
The COVID19 virus does not float alone in the air. It is in tiny droplets of water that can be trapped in a mask. Of course you can find article on the internet that say anything, but you have to consider the source. I trust the Mayo Clinic, do you? COVID-19: How much protection do face masks offer? - Mayo Clinic (https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449)

[drgoofy]

Cult members heedlessly follow their leaders often against their better judgement. Don't follow the "herd mentality." Think for yourself. If you don't feel safe without a mask, don't be intimidated by the deniers. I agree that a cloth mask alone reduces one's chances of contracting the virus somewhat, but why not make it safer by inserting a HEPA filter between the layers? I purchased a vacuum cleaner bag with HEPA filter and cut it to fit the insert in my mask. It didn't affect breathability at all. Even though I know I'm not totally safe from the virus, I feel that I have done everything I can do to keep myself as safe as possible without completely isolating myself.

[graciegirl]

We have elevated scientists' pronouncements to the same level as the tablets Moses carried down from the mountain top. And I say, which scientists? Those who prefer 'lockdown forever, stay in your homes and wear masks when going to the bathroom and when tending your flowers" favor scientists who predict gloom and doom. Those who prefer "let's party" prefer scientists of a different set of views.

Just a few random thoughts: 1. If you recall, our goal was to 'flatten the curve." We did it! Extending that strategy to cover lockdown now/lockdown forever, like Frau Whitmer, is a strategy that we never signed onto 2. We cannot defeat the virus, which is the goal claimed by the zealots and the Mask Enforcers; the virus will continue and if we postpone its effects by prolonged shutdowns, we just ensure it will emerge with a tidal wave of infections 3. "We must mask and fine those who don't and scream at everyone who calls for getting out and about" results in more societal damage than the virus 4. If you are comorbid, stay home, lock down and wear a mask all the time; if you are not comorbid but think Dr. Fauci is like Mother Teresa, then social distance from your spouse and eat with paper plates and throwaway plastic spoons: we'll send someone to your cave when it's safe. 5. For everyone under 50, you are very unlikely to die; for you, just be considerate of those much older (thank you to the nice waitress who served us at Red Sauce, outside, she was most cautious). 6. For those who think the vaccine is the Holy Grail that will allow Frau Whitmer and other authoritarian govs to grant freedom to the serfs to move about, take note that only a small percentage of folks say they will take vaccine as soon as it comes out. After all, if NYT and CNN say it's safe to take, HOLD OFF. Peace and tranquility to all.

This post jumps from one illogical and incorrect premise to another. Scientists are not all respected or listened to equally. No. I take that back. Some people do listen to anyone who has Dr. in front of their name, like many listened to Drew Pinsky early on.

First to define the problem. The problem for most of us is what we do in the face of a previously unknown virus that has the potential to kill people and has done so in unprecedented numbers in many countries of the world??? Many people have used denial and bravado and sadly even religion to deal with the problem..........and then the rest of us feel pity and rush to correct their inaccurate assessments.

Some choose to listen to the best scientists they can find from large and respected institutions in this country who have previously given good advice we have counted on...........but the trouble we have had with that is that it was too new for even those scientists to assess accurately.

Some think a strong leader issueing strong rules could have made the mortality less.

Some think a pastor with the right scripture will save our lives.

Some think that we are all the victim of one hoax after another and only sissies and dumbasses wear masks and use social distancing.

There are many, many, many, many people who vote Republican and Democrat who think this is a huge frightening issue that is extremely dangerous and they are doing what they can to protect themselves and people that they love and even in some instances people they don't care about at all.

This is a world issue. Right now as I type, there is a person in Belgium and one in Denmark who are choking to death as mucous clogs the small tubes in their lungs. They are dying without the people they love. They cannot even speak their goodbyes.
This virus doesn't care. Thousands and thousands are leaving this earth that way, but many do survive. Yes. Many do survive.

[Lindsyburnsy]

Does this sound like an independant thinker whose decisions will be based on science, etc?

[RoadToad]

Masks are useless against this virus. Covid molecule very small and can pass right through it. Read what leading epidemiologists say! Just psychological. Covid is not a death sentence. 99% survivable just like the flu. No mask for me!
So tired of the paranoia!

However, the Molecule is contained in droplets of sputum which IS blocked by the mask.

[Ralpha]

I couldn’t agree with you more! I hope the fools who refused to listen to science will come to their senses and pay attention to what they say. Trump should be living proof of what happens when you ignore and poo poo off the experts.

[Cheiro]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.




Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

The takeaway: If you flout the virus, the virus will smite you.

[sooziesoul]

Maybe that’s why doctors “practice” medicine!!!!

[Villages Kahuna]

The disappointing news regarding the vaccine being so highly touted came from Dr. Fauci several weeks ago. He said that if the first version of the vaccine was as much as 50% effective (efficacy of 50%), that “I’d be thrilled.” He went on to explain that it takes several years of tweaking and retesting to get a vaccine to a high rate of efficacy. He used the measles vaccine, currently with an efficacy in the 97-98% range as an example. It took more than a decade to get that vaccine to that level of effectiveness.

COVID-19 is going to change our lives for a long time to come.

[Ele201]

To me, the White House outbreak teaches two things. First, that the infectious disease doctors are right about what they warned about this virus. They said that it’s not just going to go away, it isn’t seasonal and we must continue wearing masks and distancing. Also, being outdoors doesn’t necessarily stop the spread.


Secondly, The White House employs a special events staff and a medical staff, and they bear some responsibility for letting this happen at the Rose Garden.

I mean, no one said, “Having all of these people sitting right next to each other, no masks, isn’t safe.” Plus there was close mingling after the ceremony.

And of course, the President has a dedicated physician whose job it is to keep him safe and monitor his health. Trump needed better guidance in avoiding the virus, especially with his risk factors of age and excess weight.

[davem4616]

after reflecting upon all the posts on this thread "What does Covid-19 in the White House teach us?"

for me it reinforces that we don't know what we don't know...

so I'm going to behave like I'm 'from Missouri' for quite awhile longer...and play it safe

things that we wanted to do will continue to be on hold (disappointing), but, we're adapting and finding alternate approaches to do many things that bring us joy

Covid-19 may have "moved the cheese", but life goes on

[KRM0614]

Chris Christie has been checked into the hospital. He is old, morbidly obese, and has asthma. This doesn't look good.
Chris Christie is approx 60 years old hardly aged. He had lap band surgery but it’s slow going !
Why write these things

[BlackhawksFan]

Masks are useless against this virus. Covid molecule very small and can pass right through it. Read what leading epidemiologists say! Just psychological. Covid is not a death sentence. 99% survivable just like the flu. No mask for me!
So tired of the paranoia!

It is highly survivable IF you're healthy. If you're fat, have high blood pressure, diabetes, heart condition, on chemo, etc you're susceptible. Also remember you could be asymptomatic and it not only affects you but the people you with, work with, hang out with.

As we are seeing from the events of the past week anyone can get it, anyone can spread it. If you're not wearing a face covering in public I hope you're healthy and 100% positive that you're negative.

Remember our president said no mask for me too.

[Bonnevie]

I always do. But Dr. Fauci co-authored an article published March 30, 2020 saying that masks don’t really prevent the spread of the virus. Wish he’d make up his mind!

what is so difficult to understand that as more was discovered about the virus, recommendations changed. it was a NOVEL virus, the knowledge evolved but it was based on science. and, more importantly, he admitted it was wrong, but he has always tried to make recommendations on the known science at the time.

now, it was said it would magically go away at Easter, then when the heat of summer came, etc, etc. none of it based on science but some people ignore that.

[lkagele]

While the President may well survive the initial disease, there is no guarantee that he won't have to suffer its long term, ongoing residual debilitating effects.

There is also no guarantee that he WILL suffer from long term, ongoing residiual debilitating effects. Odds are that he won't.

[graciegirl]

I feel so bad for Amy Coney Barrett who was asked to remove her mask before entering the Rose Garden last week. Who among us would have had to courage to not do that?

Now many people in that gathering are testing positive. I hope Counselor Barrett does not get Covid.

[OhioBuckeye]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

This is just my opinion but I personally think staying 6 ft. or more away from someone is more important that wearing a mask but I do both. I also think President Trump isn’t the best shape but Mrs. Trump is in GREAT shape! I also think there’s nothing wrong with fist bumps & elbow bumps. But grasping someone’s hand, well you might as well kiss them. This Covid thing can’t last forever so do what they’re telling us to do & stay healthy!

[DeanFL]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.
.
.
To the OP - could not agree more. When I viewed the Rose Garden video, appalling. Yes, no doubt the WH had relaxed some COVID rules recently. From what I read, it is possible to be infected and very early-on not show any significant symptoms and perhaps not show positive on the test. So, apparently someone on the POTUS staff was in this position and infected him.

...and perhaps so many others at the Rose Garden ceremony. There could be more showing COVID signs the next couple days. Imagine if the VP is infected, and the Supreme Court nominee...

BTW as for POTUS "not in great shape", before COVID, his daily medicine was one baby aspirin. period. Apparently from all accounts he is in very good shape (other then his "shape"...) for a 74 year old man... good genes. He seldom ever gets sick, even a cold or flu. And is an EXTREMELY hard working guy. Contrary to some news reports...

But the apparent "relaxed" COVID protection, esp at that RG gathering was SO WRONG. And they now have a price to pay. too bad, but an excellent reminder to us all. We still practice everyday life, but careful re social distance, mask wearing, and all the other recommendations.
.
.

[Taltarzac725]

I feel so bad for Amy Coney Barrett who was asked to remove her mask before entering the Rose Garden last week. Who among us would have had to courage to not do that?

Now many people in that gathering are testing positive. I hope Counselor Barrett does not get Covid.

She had it during the Summer of 2020.

Amy Coney Barrett - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amy_Coney_Barrett)

[graciegirl]

At Least 8 From Rose Garden Event Test Positive For Coronavirus : Live Updates: Trump Tests Positive For Coronavirus : NPR (https://www.npr.org/sections/latest-updates-trump-covid-19-results/2020/10/03/919851907/at-least-7-people-test-positive-for-coronavirus-after-rose-garden-event-for-barr)

[Heyitsrick]

I feel so bad for Amy Coney Barrett who was asked to remove her mask before entering the Rose Garden last week. Who among us would have had to courage to not do that?

Now many people in that gathering are testing positive. I hope Counselor Barrett does not get Covid.

According to reports, she already had Covid-19 earlier in the summer.

Amy Coney Barrett Had COVID-19 in Recent Months, Friends of Supreme Court Pick Say | Time (https://time.com/5895544/amy-coney-barrett-covid-19/)

[CoachKandSportsguy]

What have we learned:
1 - A lot!
2 - Having decoded the virus’ genetics, vaccine development will be faster than prior, if possible
3 - the virus mimics bradykinin storms in the body, more a vascular event than previously thought google covid Tennessee super computer analysis from July
4 - Everyone likes more data, but more data is harder to synthesize without the required experience / knowledge
5 - social media is an echo chamber for what people want to believe - and has confirmation bias built in as a bonus
6 - managing a very large independent population with information and voluntary compliance with worldwide social media is very very hard, really impossible
7 - one can decode another’s personality type / time preferences of beliefs wrt workforce mgmt / science / analysis / economics from reactions posted on social media. (How many dimensions of a problem can one identify, with secondary and tertiary effects with humans who have no std deviations of outcomes)
8 - the virus is incredibly contagious through the air and information increases over time over time with study and analysis. ( read up on anchoring bias)
9 - humans dislike change, don’t perceived very small risks with very significant outcomes well ( think people living below dams with cracks)
10 - everyone wants everyone else to be treated equal but the self wants to be treated special ( no one will admit to being below average driver , who are those people anyway?)

Sportsguy

[Taltarzac725]

Villager’s death proves that COVID-19 virus must be taken seriously | News Break (https://www.newsbreak.com/florida/the-villages/news/1541090218438/villagers-death-proves-that-covid-19-virus-must-be-taken-seriously)

You could be a real version of the Energizer Bunny and still die from the Corona Virus.

[dtennent]

To quote a sign I saw recently

Not all Superheroes wear capes, but they all wear masks/"

[Chitown]

What did this teach us? Let me see. How about that the President and the First Lady contracted a virus, a flu, like millions of people do every year. And that they will be under doctors care, recover and go on with their lives. This virus will be around for 10 years. Get over it. I’ll wear my mask in stores only because it’s mandatory. As soon as I get out of the stores that mask is off. I look forward to seeing many of you at the squares and restaurants and I look forward to shaking your hand. And please stop with your statement that the virus may have long term health effects. All viruses, germs and flu’s have always had that possibility. All viruses germs and flu’s have effected people differently. I’ll see those of you who want to go on with you lives at the squares and restaurants.

[pmken2]

More than half of the cases were at the prison. The Villages has between 3-7 cases daily during the time of the spike in Sumter. The Villages is being shown as Lake, Marion and Sumter.

[zendog3]

any more info on why the recent spike in Sumpter Co. Thinking of driving down for a couple weeks to get the place ready for January . I know there was a separate thread on this but cant find it . I saw 80 cases in one day.

It has always been the case that, if you walk or drive around the square at Sumpter you will see little clusters of people sitting together chatting at bars or tables outside. You know those people are at risk. If one of them has Covid-19, the rest are likely to get it.

Now, since our governor has opened bars and restaurants, high risk activity is much greater. There was going to be a winter spike anyway. Now it will be MUCH greater as Covid spreads to those poets of risk takers. And deaths among Villagers is going to be MUCH higher than deaths among younger people.

But it has always been mostly in our power to survive this thing. Stay away from crowds, wear a mask, wash your hands, don't touch door handles, etc. The danger for us now is greater than it has been. And for god's sake don't listen to the happy news.

[spubear2]

You speak the truth with the exception of wearing of masks. Back in February, let's not forget, the American people were told by our experts not to wear masks if you had no symptoms. Oh yes, I know "they" had their reasons for lying to the American people. That was wrong as the science knew the virus was transmitted by asymptomatic and presymptomatic infected people.

That is water under the bridge now. Going forward, when the scientists finally DID tell the American people to cover their faces, the damage was already done and many people continued to believe that masks were not necessary and worse yet, were detrimental to our health. Of course there are many Americans who did head the advice and continue to this day to cover their faces in public spaces, especially indoors. Many people got to work making home made masks to mitigate the virus as soon as we were told to cover our faces in public spaces, especially indoors.

Back in February, a bad example was set for the American people and continued until a few days ago. Let's hope that message will now change going forward. Anti-maskers have been out there, infecting people they don't know and bringing the virus home to loved ones. Sorry to say, it's not getting any better, even today. Unless we have a safe and effective vaccine, America will never reach herd immunity. That is a sad state of affairs.

They told people in March not to wear masks because there weren't enough masks to go around and health professionals needed what was available. Still, it was a bad call. For people who say masks don't work - just because masks don't work 100% at stopping the virus molecules, they do stop a lot of it and it keeps people from catching the virus. That is well proven.

[donfey]

Of all the messages we have heard, it is my opinion that the science message was never wrong, sometimes needing more data to update, but not wrong in the truest sense.

Lacking one message, we have had to choose.

In the case of Covid-19, it seem to me, that "science" has been wrong MOST of the time. I'd love to see an actual, scientific discussion, if the politics were removed. "Experts" often disagree. I do believe that the personal hygiene and protection steps we can all take are wise.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

I feel so bad for Amy Coney Barrett who was asked to remove her mask before entering the Rose Garden last week. Who among us would have had to courage to not do that?

Now many people in that gathering are testing positive. I hope Counselor Barrett does not get Covid. it doesn’t take courage to wear your mask it just takes common sense. Remember when you complained to your mother , and she would say I don’t care what the other kids are doing you’ll do it this way , courage is running into a burning building, crossing an open field under fire, wearing a mask at public gatherings is called being a good citizen

[DonnaNi4os]

Does anyone know what to make of the huge spike in positive rates in Sumter County on September 29 and 30 according to Home | Florida Department of Health COVID-19 Outbreak (https://floridahealthcovid19.gov/?) The county had been at about 4% on average and then spiked up to 21% on 9/29 and 22% on 9/30.

I believe that the spike in positivity in Sumter County is a reminder that this isn’t over yet. With snow birds returning I suspect TV will find an upsurge in cases. This is my opinion and my decision to continue cautious behavior is mine to make. We all must do what makes us comfortable. I think the president’s diagnosis is a reminder that we must remain vigilant.

[Gmaf6]

You’re right in that unless you can afford a new one every time you touch it or wash and dry it multiple times a day, it offers very little protection. Seeing people touching them, wearing them under their nose or chin and moving them up and down repeatedly is, I guess for them, better than no protection. Some cannot wear one and it’s not our place to judge. Some follow the guidelines to the letter and still get sick. This is a virus....more deadly to some than others. Do what you feel is right for you...,I do not know what your situation is so it’s not my place to judge you or anyone else. Take the precautions laid out, stay home, enjoy the time we have left doing what we like....if you’re sick, stay home....many have succumbed to this and so many other diseases over the last 8 months. Be careful....but be alive!

[Gigi3000]

You mean the same Judge Barrett who already contracted Covid-19 during the summer?

Amy Coney Barrett had COVID-19 earlier this year, officials say - Chicago Tribune (https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-nw-amy-coney-barrett-covid-19-20201002-vjvmmnpjpzct5ijxesp7bmme64-story.html)

Still, I am surprised a mother of 7 especially, didnt stand up for her mask wearing. We still dont know if you can get it again plus apparently there are new strains. Imho, this makes her appear weak. If she cant stand up for her mask wearing, something so simple, how can she stick to her guns when wrangling with the other justices.
Weak, weak, weak. I'm embarrassed for her!!

[graciegirl]

It has always been the case that, if you walk or drive around the square at Sumpter you will see little clusters of people sitting together chatting at bars or tables outside. You know those people are at risk. If one of them has Covid-19, the rest are likely to get it.

Now, since our governor has opened bars and restaurants, high risk activity is much greater. There was going to be a winter spike anyway. Now it will be MUCH greater as Covid spreads to those poets of risk takers. And deaths among Villagers is going to be MUCH higher than deaths among younger people.

But it has always been mostly in our power to survive this thing. Stay away from crowds, wear a mask, wash your hands, don't touch door handles, etc. The danger for us now is greater than it has been. And for god's sake don't listen to the happy news.

Your advice is good except when you malign the Daily Sun who has never directed anyone to ignore advice from Scientists on Covid-19. And chitown. This isn't the seasonal flu. This isn't the seasonal flu. This isn't the seasonal flu. This ******* can kill you by choking you to death with thick mucosa that first makes you gasp for breath than suffocates you. This isn't the seasonal flu.

[ahayward65]

Politicians believe in their invincibility.

[Joanne19335]

There will never be a vaccine. Live your life to the fullest every day!!!

If living your life to the fullest means not wearing a mask or social distancing, you will have a very short one. Good luck and God bless.

[Joanne19335]

Why would anyone in a Pandemic refuse to do something as simple as wear a mask in public places for the duration?

It doesn't cause pain. It is affordable. It is easy. It is socially acceptable. It makes 70% of the country agree with you.

If you want to push against what is acceptable you can go around with your pants unzipped.

You can wear your "Make love, not War Shirt.".

Well put, Gracie. Nice to know there are some Villagers who don’t only think about themselves!

[jimjamuser]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!
Wrong lesson to be learned from the recent news. Completely off base and 180 degrees off of true north. Processing news requires flexibility of thinking. Humans are adaptive and creative creatures, not programmable automatons confined to tribal camps forever. This is a GREAT learning opportunity!

[deebrock]

Or to Barr. He is not staying in either.

[New Englander]

Why was Amy Coney Barrett asked to remove her mask???

[worahm]

Wearing anything other then a N-95 mask is like fencing in your back yard with wire fence to keep the mosquitoes out .

[Joe C.]

I'll say what most say: Wearing a mask protects others from you. Not the other way around. Stay clean, keep hands from eyes and nose, and if you have a cold, allergy or covid, wear a mask to keep your exhaled breath (and spittle) close to you and not 6 feet away into someone's face. That said, ... the virus is airborne, so we will eventually breathe some of it.
Even the vaccine, when it comes out, won't kill the virus. It will be here always, like the regular flu that's here yearly, and modified each time, so the best we can do is hope we don't get it. And even when (not if) we finally get it, I don't think that it will hurt most of us. The regular flu sometimes kills those who are elderly or have underlying issues, and this covid will just go on. And so will I. Just go on with life the way I always have. I'm not worried. Never have been and never will. It's just the way things are.
I think that there is a certain amount of paranoia that is totally ridiculous, and yet there should be a reasonable amount of caution.
I just won't hide from the boogie man.

[jrosaltal1]

Did he know his DX before all his events and didn't care?

[jimjamuser]

The disappointing news regarding the vaccine being so highly touted came from Dr. Fauci several weeks ago. He said that if the first version of the vaccine was as much as 50% effective (efficacy of 50%), that “I’d be thrilled.” He went on to explain that it takes several years of tweaking and retesting to get a vaccine to a high rate of efficacy. He used the measles vaccine, currently with an efficacy in the 97-98% range as an example. It took more than a decade to get that vaccine to that level of effectiveness.

COVID-19 is going to change our lives for a long time to come.
Great post. So true and realistic.

[Byte1]

It doesn't matter if you wear a mask if you get the virus from your spouse. The "scientists and doctors" say that you do not contract the virus from briefly passing someone or being outside and social distancing. You would have to be having a conversation with someone with both of you not wearing a mask and one of you would have to be infected. Then MAYBE one of you would become infected....maybe. So, if "science" is so relevant, then why worry? According to their "science" you would not catch the virus when shopping and you do not catch it from the food that you are served at a restaurant. But, do what you want because "the sky is falling."
I wear a mask when shopping because the signs require it to be worn. I would wear one at other times IF I felt I was in danger of infection. I'm not going to let this pandemic scare me into putting my life on hold. Already passed my expiration date anyway, so I might as well enjoy what is left.
Some of you will likely pass from stress. Wear your mask and quit worrying about it. Do what you feel is necessary to keep the stress level down.

[graciegirl]

'Silent hypoxia' may be killing some COVID-19 patients. But there's hope. | Live Science (https://www.livescience.com/silent-hypoxia-killing-covid-19-coronavirus-patients.html)

[NancyLee]

You can find articles by leading epidemiologist explaining that the Covid molecule is so small that it will pass through any mask. When they initially told you not to wear a mask because it will do no good they were not lying to you. Wearing them now is pretty much only psychological. You cannot hide from a virus. But you should not worry about it either because it has the same survivability as the flu. I’m looking forward to the day that people lose the paranoia and stop walking around with their face covered looking like idiots!
I think we are forgetting that the Covid virus itself does not swim through the air on its own. It is attached to water vapor from your breathing and from juicy particles from your talking, laughing, sneezing, or coughing. Masks are a barricade to these vapors and particles. Also, Covid does not have the same survivability as the flu if you count the possible after effects of lung damage, which may be long term.

[jimjamuser]

What did this teach us? Let me see. How about that the President and the First Lady contracted a virus, a flu, like millions of people do every year. And that they will be under doctors care, recover and go on with their lives. This virus will be around for 10 years. Get over it. I’ll wear my mask in stores only because it’s mandatory. As soon as I get out of the stores that mask is off. I look forward to seeing many of you at the squares and restaurants and I look forward to shaking your hand. And please stop with your statement that the virus may have long term health effects. All viruses, germs and flu’s have always had that possibility. All viruses germs and flu’s have effected people differently. I’ll see those of you who want to go on with you lives at the squares and restaurants.
Re: shaking hands - That would have to INCREASE a person's chance of getting CV, even if they had a 6ft long arm. Maybe someday there will be a survey of the greater % of deaths suffered (and caused) by shaking hands. All just because of inflexibility and adversion to change. The last 3 days SHOULD have been a teaching moment.

[LiverpoolWalrus]

Some of you will likely pass from stress. Wear your mask and quit worrying about it. Do what you feel is necessary to keep the stress level down.

Truer words were never spoken. Stress symptoms: Effects on your body and behavior - Mayo Clinic (https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/stress-management/in-depth/stress-symptoms/art-20050987)

[jimjamuser]

They told people in March not to wear masks because there weren't enough masks to go around and health professionals needed what was available. Still, it was a bad call. For people who say masks don't work - just because masks don't work 100% at stopping the virus molecules, they do stop a lot of it and it keeps people from catching the virus. That is well proven.
The greater problem was that the DPA was NOT used to increase the manufacture of masks and other PPEs. It was one of the flaws in the US dealing with the CV. Other countries suffered MUCH less just because they took it seriously and early. The US was late and did NOT even TRY to catch up. It is now too late to do much, but suffer.

[carolfry44]

Chris Christie is 58 years old.

[coffeebean]

Who knows where the President contracted Covid from. If nothing else it proves if he can get it anyone can. Everyone of those people in the Rose Garden had to test negative before they were admitted. Everyone that enters or gets near the President has to test negative. So what does this tell us. Is this telling us testing is ineffective? I keep reading in these posts that science is never wrong. That is incorrect. Scientific theories that came out years ago can and often are disproved today. Remember this virus started less than a year ago. The science is still evolving on this. I suspect a year or two years from now much of what has been taken as gospel today will change. So what are our choices. We can hide in our homes and never leave or we can go about our lives as normally as possible and take as many precautions as we can. The one thing that is a fact is that this is a virus. You cannot hide from it no more than you can from a common cold or the flu. So it comes down to personal choice and you have to make that decision. So if you choose to go out, wear your mask, wash your hands, use hand sanitizers but remember there is always a risk as is much of life.

No, that is not what this proves. People who wear masks and social distance have much more of a chance to avoid this virus than our President. He is an anti-masker and does not insist that people social distance. The tests which are used to test everyone who comes close to our President have proven to be 50% inaccurate. That breeds false security. He got caught and so did several others. What is so surprising to me is how he was able to avoid contracting the virus before this.

[coffeebean]

thanks for posting this

You're welcome. Any mask I plan to wear in public gets the "droplet test" as I call it. So far, every mask I have purchased has passed the test and my mirror remains untouched by the water.

I also do a flame test which I have seen demonstrated by experts on TV. Try to blow out a candle flame with your mask holding the flame about 12" from your mouth. Blow as hard as you can and if the flame goes out, your mask is not good enough to contain aerosols or droplets. Simple test but very important to do.

[rmd2]

There will never be a vaccine. Live your life to the fullest every day!!!

I think we will have a vaccine by the end of the year.

[Bucco]

No, that is not what this proves. People who wear masks and social distance have much more of a chance to avoid this virus than our President. He is an anti-masker and does not insist that people social distance. The tests which are used to test everyone who comes close to our President have proven to be 50% inaccurate. That breeds false security. He got caught and so did several others. What is so surprising to me is how he was able to avoid contracting the virus before this.

Actually the administration has been actively asking people to remove their masks, as with the Rose Garden, and refusing requests from others to don them, as in Cleveland the entourage asked by a doctor to remove and they refused.

[graciegirl]

Actually the administration has been actively asking people to remove their masks, as with the Rose Garden, and refusing requests from others to don them, as in Cleveland the entourage asked by a doctor to remove and they refused.

I believe that everyone is aware of how this happened. I am aware that some posters only jump on ways to work in a rant that is negative or one that brings up lying. I can't remember any positive posts from some posters unless it is agreeing with a post that is also negative. In fact this interim with the President hospitalized has been a respite for me. Hating someone and pointing out their faults day after day after day after day is wearing. I make no excuses for this man getting sick. He endangered himself and others and I hope that this experience will change his thinking. I doubt it. You can't teach an old dog new tricks. We all on this forum pretty much keep saying the same thing, day after day. May God spare the President's life and and may he keep us all safe. If He is. I pretty much think He is.

[Jacob85]

The masks protect the person wearing it as well as the other people. It is common sense as well as there have been a large number of demonstrations showing where the virus droplets go. If you have nothing on your face the droplets can go in your nose and mouth!

[Bucco]

I believe that everyone is aware of how this happened. I am aware that some posters only jump on ways to work in a rant that is negative or one that brings up lying. I can't remember any positive posts from some posters unless it is agreeing with a post that is also negative. In fact this interim with the President hospitalized has been a respite for me. Hating someone and pointing out their faults day after day after day after day is wearing. I make no excuses for this man getting sick. He endangered himself and others and I hope that this experience will change his thinking. I doubt it. You can't teach an old dog new tricks. We all on this forum pretty much keep saying the same thing, day after day. May God spare the President's life and and may he keep us all safe. If He is. I pretty much think He is.

You certainly jumped on this post, which I admit was a bit sharper than intended.

I was replying to a post, which I may have over read, which I thought implied that this was "by chance" which it was not.

I cannot ever wish any other human being to suffer. Not my style and never has been, although much has been aimed at my and my wife's health on here 😁

Not sure of whom you speak with the capital H in he, but hoping it was the only person who should receive that. I will refrain on our POTUS keeping us safe, and make no comment.

[SRQWillie]

Leadbone, hmmmm!, I have another name for you, but, because moderator asks us to refrain from name-calling, I will behave. Folks, listen to the scientist, period.

It's called ridiculous.
I wear a mask out and about, do not shake hands, keep distance etc. Recently developed flu like symptoms and had a LITTLE anxiety. Tested positive for this so called Covid scare..... 3 days later was back to normal.
Again, I'd you are scared, stay home and live in fear. Not me. Life goes on and so do I.
Watch and learn. Trump will be on his feet and back at it as this is total BS and I am sick and tired of the paranoia.

[graciegirl]

It's called ridiculous.
I wear a mask out and about, do not shake hands, keep distance etc. Recently developed flu like symptoms and had a LITTLE anxiety. Tested positive for this so called Covid scare..... 3 days later was back to normal.
Again, I'd you are scared, stay home and live in fear. Not me. Life goes on and so do I.
Watch and learn. Trump will be on his feet and back at it as this is total BS and I am sick and tired of the paranoia.

Many of us have other tales to share. Many of us are taking this novel virus very seriously.

[justjim]

Wear a mask!

Excellent advice. Some people are stubborn and will not admit they are wrong.

[Snorkl46]

The flu does not kill 208,000 Americans in 8 months!!!!

[coffeebean]

what is so difficult to understand that as more was discovered about the virus, recommendations changed. it was a NOVEL virus, the knowledge evolved but it was based on science. and, more importantly, he admitted it was wrong, but he has always tried to make recommendations on the known science at the time.

now, it was said it would magically go away at Easter, then when the heat of summer came, etc, etc. none of it based on science but some people ignore that.

Those statements were not made by scientists. We all know who said those things.

[bumpygreens]

Have you passed a person with your mask on, and noticed the scent of that person's perfume or after shave? The particles that enter your nose which allow you to detect the scent are approximately 1 micron in size. A micron is 1,000 nanometers. The Covid virus is between 60 to 140 nanometers in diameter. A virus, however, doesn't just float around on its own. It's attached to a larger particle.

A properly fit N95 filter is effective at removing particles down to 300 nanometers (0.3 microns). In fact, the smaller the particle the more effective the N95 is at removing it.

Surgical masks, depending on the manufacturer and materials of which they are made, are highly variable in their efficiency...anywhere from 10 to 90%. They are better suited for filtering particles emitted from the wearer (in other words, they protect others from you).

Plastic face shields protect the wearer from splatter into their eyes, nose or mouth. They don't filter the air you inhale, nor do they filter the air you exhale.

Large, well ventilated spaces are pretty safe. Masks offer some protection when you can't always maintain social distance. Have fun at the squares - just don't kiss your bartender, and you will probably be okay.

[coffeebean]

I feel so bad for Amy Coney Barrett who was asked to remove her mask before entering the Rose Garden last week. Who among us would have had to courage to not do that?

Now many people in that gathering are testing positive. I hope Counselor Barrett does not get Covid.

Amy Coney Barrett had Covid in the summer. I would hope (for all our sakes) that she has immunity to the disease at this point.

[coffeebean]

.
.
To the OP - could not agree more. When I viewed the Rose Garden video, appalling. Yes, no doubt the WH had relaxed some COVID rules recently. From what I read, it is possible to be infected and very early-on not show any significant symptoms and perhaps not show positive on the test. So, apparently someone on the POTUS staff was in this position and infected him.

...and perhaps so many others at the Rose Garden ceremony. There could be more showing COVID signs the next couple days. Imagine if the VP is infected, and the Supreme Court nominee...

BTW as for POTUS "not in great shape", before COVID, his daily medicine was one baby aspirin. period. Apparently from all accounts he is in very good shape (other then his "shape"...) for a 74 year old man... good genes. He seldom ever gets sick, even a cold or flu. And is an EXTREMELY hard working guy. Contrary to some news reports...

But the apparent "relaxed" COVID protection, esp at that RG gathering was SO WRONG. And they now have a price to pay. too bad, but an excellent reminder to us all. We still practice everyday life, but careful re social distance, mask wearing, and all the other recommendations.
.
.

I have seen video of a reception INDOORS before the guests arrived in the Rose Garden. No masks and no social distancing. This type of behavior should not be flaunted to America. See what it gets you?

[Villageswimmer]

Amy Coney Barrett had Covid in the summer. I would hope (for all our sakes) that she has immunity to the disease at this point.


I think the judge was demonstrating her respect for others by wearing the mask. She was put in an uncomfortable position if she (allegedly) was asked to remove it.

[Villageswimmer]

Have you passed a person with your mask on, and noticed the scent of that person's perfume or after shave? The particles that enter your nose which allow you to detect the scent are approximately 1 micron in size. A micron is 1,000 nanometers. The Covid virus is between 60 to 140 nanometers in diameter. A virus, however, doesn't just float around on its own. It's attached to a larger particle.

A properly fit N95 filter is effective at removing particles down to 300 nanometers (0.3 microns). In fact, the smaller the particle the more effective the N95 is at removing it.

Surgical masks, depending on the manufacturer and materials of which they are made, are highly variable in their efficiency...anywhere from 10 to 90%. They are better suited for filtering particles emitted from the wearer (in other words, they protect others from you).

Plastic face shields protect the wearer from splatter into their eyes, nose or mouth. They don't filter the air you inhale, nor do they filter the air you exhale.

Large, well ventilated spaces are pretty safe. Masks offer some protection when you can't always maintain social distance. Have fun at the squares - just don't kiss your bartender, and you will probably be okay.


“Large, well ventilated spaces...” You mean like the Rose Garden?
Or the Squares?

[Topspinmo]

Soooo, the CDC guidelines for 2 week quarantine, when exposed to covid, does not
apply to VP Pence, chair of covid. Hmmmm.

Exposed such a wide open word. Exposed like being in Close contact? I sure he’s tested daily. We are all exposed to virus when we’re out in public, that why we social distance, wash ours hands, and wear mask. Some people put themselves at risk and some don’t have clue how the caught the virus. Only thing we peons can do is protect ourselves using guidelines.

[coffeebean]

Wearing anything other then a N-95 mask is like fencing in your back yard with wire fence to keep the mosquitoes out .

That is so wrong on every level.

[equaintance]

Listen to the scientists. Wear a mask and do not expose the rest of us. Maintain safe distance. Stay home if you are a senior and have underlying medical conditions. Have your groceries delivered. The person in the highest office of our country did not listen to the scientists to protect himself, his family, his aids and anyone he was close to and came down with Covid 19. Does that not tell you something?

[coffeebean]

Did he know his DX before all his events and didn't care?

Trump attended the NJ fundraising event after knowing he was exposed to Hope Hicks who had tested positive. Aren't we supposed to self quarantine if we are aware we have been in contact with someone who tests positive? What was he thinking?

[tvbound]

Let's look a little further in the future. Besides the obvious lesson of what can happen by not following almost universally prescribed precautions by medical experts and getting the virus, I believe up until now we have already learned quite a bit from this. Chief among them are the wildly varying stories we citizens keep being told regarding the timelines, seriousness and facts on what has happened. What I also predict, is that when he gets through it (I think the odds are good that he will) many will start using the fact that he made it (ignoring the obvious in that he had every resource in the world available, which the average person doesn't) to say - "see, it isn't all that bad after all."

Should that occur, then IMHO this nation will have been set back tremendously in trying to truly get our arms around this pandemic and the couple hundred thousand (just to date) who have already died, will be but just a small beginning. For the long term benefit of our great nation, I have never before in my life, hoped harder that I am completely wrong. This is a lifetime opportunity for a leader to do immeasurable good, by uttering the simple phrase of - "I was wrong."

[Topspinmo]

I couldn’t agree with you more! I hope the fools who refused to listen to science will come to their senses and pay attention to what they say. Trump should be living proof of what happens when you ignore and poo poo off the experts.

Along with Boris, prince Charles, and 100 plus more. O make that millions more.

[Brynnie]

Does anyone know what to make of the huge spike in positive rates in Sumter County on September 29 and 30 according to Home | Florida Department of Health COVID-19 Outbreak (https://floridahealthcovid19.gov/?) The county had been at about 4% on average and then spiked up to 21% on 9/29 and 22% on 9/30.

I was told that several test results were backlogged and reported all at once, which is the reason for the large number in one day.

[coffeebean]

Actually the administration has been actively asking people to remove their masks, as with the Rose Garden, and refusing requests from others to don them, as in Cleveland the entourage asked by a doctor to remove and they refused.

Yes, I'm aware of this and I am appalled by it.

[bumpygreens]

“Large, well ventilated spaces...” You mean like the Rose Garden?
Or the Squares?

Yes. That's exactly what I mean. Outdoors is very safe especially if you can maintain some space between yourself and others. The White House is one of the most secure places on earth, but hundreds of people work there, and hundreds more go in and out on official business. People who work there are tested daily; some are tested more than once in a day; visitors are tested. But tests can give false results. All it takes is one inaccurate test, and all the precautions are worthless. Most of the people in the rose garden were probably in the White House first. That's the way it usually works for state functions. My guess is negative screenings made most of them feel pretty secure, and they weren't as cautious as they could have been while inside.

[coffeebean]

Exposed such a wide open word. Exposed like being in Close contact? I sure he’s tested daily. We are all exposed to virus when we’re out in public, that why we social distance, wash ours hands, and wear mask. Some people put themselves at risk and some don’t have clue how the caught the virus. Only thing we peons can do is protect ourselves using guidelines.

It has been reported that the rapid Abbot tests which have been used at the White House are only 50% accurate. How helpful is that? It isn't.

[coffeebean]

Let's look a little further in the future. Besides the obvious lesson of what can happen by not following almost universally prescribed precautions by medical experts and getting the virus, I believe up until now we have already learned quite a bit from this. Chief among them are the wildly varying stories we citizens keep being told regarding the timelines, seriousness and facts on what has happened. What I also predict, is that when he gets through it (I think the odds are good that he will) many will start using the fact that he made it (ignoring the obvious in that he had every resource in the world available, which the average person doesn't) to say - "see, it isn't all that bad after all."

Should that occur, then IMHO this nation will have been set back tremendously in trying to truly get our arms around this pandemic and the couple hundred thousand (just to date) who have already died, will be but just a small beginning. For the long term benefit of our great nation, I have never before in my life, hoped harder that I am completely wrong. This is a lifetime opportunity for a leader to do immeasurable good, by uttering the simple phrase of - "I was wrong."
Can I "like" this 100000000000000000000 times? Please?

[Bucco]

Can I "like" this 100000000000000000000 times? Please?

Plus one.

Leadership in January when first advised would have been great, but even late might save lives.

[Marshaw]

Just remember 99.4% recovery. Pretty darn good if you ask me. Enjoy life just be careful not fearfull

[jmcote]

Let's look a little further in the future. Besides the obvious lesson of what can happen by not following almost universally prescribed precautions by medical experts and getting the virus, I believe up until now we have already learned quite a bit from this. Chief among them are the wildly varying stories we citizens keep being told regarding the timelines, seriousness and facts on what has happened. What I also predict, is that when he gets through it (I think the odds are good that he will) many will start using the fact that he made it (ignoring the obvious in that he had every resource in the world available, which the average person doesn't) to say - "see, it isn't all that bad after all."

Should that occur, then IMHO this nation will have been set back tremendously in trying to truly get our arms around this pandemic and the couple hundred thousand (just to date) who have already died, will be but just a small beginning. For the long term benefit of our great nation, I have never before in my life, hoped harder that I am completely wrong. This is a lifetime opportunity for a leader to do immeasurable good, by uttering the simple phrase of - "I was wrong."

Never going to happen.

[Scbang]

Just remember 99.4% recovery. Pretty darn good if you ask me. Enjoy life just be careful not fearfull

True, but what about your neighbors, friends or your loved ones you might infect unintentionally?

Let's just review some facts. I am not an MD but from a engineer's perspective.

One sneeze can spit out 3000 droplets traveling 200 mph and can travel 40+ feet.
Each droplet can contain 5000+ viruses. Everyone including very old and weak still has some immunity to fight off the virus even CV. If you caught 1 virus, you might still be OK.
It's numbers game, if you are in a proximity to a infected person without a mask ( not necessarily 6 ft but closer the worse ) your chances of catching CV dramatically increases even if you are very healthy. Then your are asymptomatic but still dangerous for the rest of the population because you are not aware that you can kill many others.

Asians have been wearing masks for decades. Not just for flu and cold but also for allergies. Just imagine someone sneezed without covering their mouth in front of you and you felt a droplet in your face. Even a healthy person can carry a lot of bacteria and/or virus.

So, wearing a mask protects other people from your germs. Also minimize number of viruses you might be exposed to. There is no 100% protection unless you wear hazard suit 24 hours. So, at this moment, nobody knows whether one has CV or not. Even when you have been tested negative for CV yesterday, you could have caught it right after that.

Let's wear a mask for humanity and for yourself.

[Hackercraft]

How do the masks prevent us from getting the virus?

[santiagobob]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!

People who refuse to wear a mask have no regard for those around them. During the night time bombing of London, none of the Londoners broke the blackout by leaving their lights on by citing personal liberty and so putting others in danger.

[Rosebud1949]

MOST OF US who have not had, been negatively tested for, or do not intend to have this virus ALWAYS listened to the scientists. Always wore a mask, and were sensible in social distancing. Shame that those "know alls" in the White House, and many other places, DID NOT. Just how many have they infected now.. NO ONE IS IMMUNE.......


I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

[GoPacers]

Science is never wrong? Seriously? The very nature of science and the scientific method is to try and replicate the results of prior studies and hypotheses. Quite often, the original "science" can't be replicated. That's part of the process. That has nothing to do with "misunderstanding the data and drawing erroneous conclusions", which I guess is your way of trying to criticize this other commenter here.

Well, thank goodness we have omniscient scientists here at TOTV.

Wired.com: "Scientists Are Wrong All The Time...And That's Fantastic" (https://www.wired.com/2015/02/scientists-wrong-time-thats-fantastic/)

The referenced article says scientists are wrong, not science. Scientists are people. Science is not a person. You'll have to explain how science can be wrong...

[Scbang]

How do the masks prevent us from getting the virus?

It reduces numbers of viruses you are exposed to by stopping droplets that carries viruses. Statistically, less of viruses you are exposed to less of chances that you can get infected to CV. It's not really black or white, yes or no game. When virus overwhelms your immune system, you get infected. Let's wear a mask. You might still get some virus but you may not get infected.

[Tennisnut]

If I have Covid, is there anyone on TOTV that would like to go for ride with me? We could ride around the neighborhood and let everyone know that I am still alive.

[TooColdNJ]

. I’m looking forward to the day that people lose the paranoia and stop walking around with their face covered looking like idiots!

Vanity. Do you think everyone is looking at you in the first place? That’s one of the reasons people don’t wear masks... they think they look stupid or, as you put it, like idiots. Vanity isn’t part of the bigger picture here. Judging masked people as looking like idiots is very shallow. There’s also a middle ground between paranoia and flagrant disregard— it’s called caution. While tiny molecules may get through an ordinary mask, it’s comforting to know that just maybe we’re a tiny bit safer than without a mask. While the millions of molecules permeate a room with poor air circulation, or the people that spew many of them all over your maskless face, wearing a face condom and practicing safe breathing can help a little with hope that it might keep a little slower molecule from getting in. 😜

[jimjamuser]

True, but what about your neighbors, friends or your loved ones you might infect unintentionally?

Let's just review some facts. I am not an MD but from a engineer's perspective.

One sneeze can spit out 3000 droplets traveling 200 mph and can travel 40+ feet.
Each droplet can contain 5000+ viruses. Everyone including very old and weak still has some immunity to fight off the virus even CV. If you caught 1 virus, you might still be OK.
It's numbers game, if you are in a proximity to a infected person without a mask ( not necessarily 6 ft but closer the worse ) your chances of catching CV dramatically increases even if you are very healthy. Then your are asymptomatic but still dangerous for the rest of the population because you are not aware that you can kill many others.

Asians have been wearing masks for decades. Not just for flu and cold but also for allergies. Just imagine someone sneezed without covering their mouth in front of you and you felt a droplet in your face. Even a healthy person can carry a lot of bacteria and/or virus.

So, wearing a mask protects other people from your germs. Also minimize number of viruses you might be exposed to. There is no 100% protection unless you wear hazard suit 24 hours. So, at this moment, nobody knows whether one has CV or not. Even when you have been tested negative for CV yesterday, you could have caught it right after that.

Let's wear a mask for humanity and for yourself.
Great post! Kudos!

[jimjamuser]

If I have Covid, is there anyone on TOTV that would like to go for ride with me? We could ride around the neighborhood and let everyone know that I am still alive.
Good knowledge of very current events. Strange events!!!!!!!!

[bob47]

People who refuse to wear a mask have no regard for those around them. During the night time bombing of London, none of the Londoners broke the blackout by leaving their lights on by citing personal liberty and so putting others in danger.

Excellent analogy. Thank you for pointing it out.

[Bucco]

Good knowledge of very current events. Strange events!!!!!!!!

The last few hours are so typical of a period of our history that future generations will never believe.

[Msdafliz]

:coolsmiley:

There was a guy on TOTV that was arguing with everyone about covid-19. He came across as an expert with a prediction that by October 1st the virus would be gone and he wouldn't have to live like Howard Hughes anymore. I won't say who he is. He knows I'm talking about him.

Where is this expert now?

Where is his scientific analysis and predictions?

Sometimes science gets it wrong so listen to your instincts and protect yourself at all times. The virus can still hit this place hard just like it did the Whitehouse.

[Chitown]

Your advice is good except when you malign the Daily Sun who has never directed anyone to ignore advice from Scientists on Covid-19. And chitown. This isn't the seasonal flu. This isn't the seasonal flu. This isn't the seasonal flu. This ******* can kill you by choking you to death with thick mucosa that first makes you gasp for breath than suffocates you. This isn't the seasonal flu.
I get it, it can kill, it can make you hospitalized, it can make you feel miserable, or you may not have symptoms at all. 98% will not die, 90% will not require hospitalization. In my case I was tested positive on April 10 and had a fever between 100-101 for 1 week. I had a slight cough. And recovered. Several friends of which we are all in our 60’s have also had it and were either a symptomatic or mild symptoms like me. This Covid will be with us For 10 years whether there is a vaccine or not like the Swine flu and sars virus Are still with us and killing people.

[talleyjm]

I feel so bad for Amy Coney Barrett who was asked to remove her mask before entering the Rose Garden last week. Who among us would have had to courage to not do that?

Now many people in that gathering are testing positive. I hope Counselor Barrett does not get Covid.

She had COVID-19 this past summer. She’s probably chock full of antibodies❗️

[JimJohnson]

I have learned that medical experts are correct and politicians are wrong.

[Pamelah]

Did anyone see the short clip when Amy approached the rose garden party in a mask, she was met by 3 gentleman, one I think was mark meadows (could only see back of his head), it then appeared judging by the look on her face and actions, that she was asked to remove her mask which she promptly did.
Awful! Whether this actually happened, it again shows the mindset of everyone in the Rose Garden cuddled up close without a care in the world. Don’t think this clip wasn’t shown to the world and once again, America is the butt of jokes and laughter. Don’t ANY of them have the gumption to say “ No, my mask stays on. “. ( maybe some did and they were escorted out.). I hope all the self righteous Villagers who say,” I have my rights!” Learn from this, but doubt any change. Call me a cold New Englander but I have no sympathy for any in the Rose Garden or the maskless Village people who test positive.

[maggie1]

All it teaches us is that you can’t hide from a virus! Mask or no mask! I don’t wear a mask as I know they are useless! We will all be exposed to Covid just like we are the flu or the common cold. Trump has no co-morbidities so he will be past this in a week or so, just like 99% of those that get it!
The media has done a good job of tuning much of the population into paranoid people!

I wonder if any of the 209,000 that have died from the virus would still be alive today if they had worn masks and maintained distance. Trump's age and obesity make him a perfect candidate for covid, which he has developed, and might be in worse shape than we are being told. Your statement has no basis in fact, and your cavalier attitude toward self protection just might come back to haunt you.

[Bay Kid]

We have learned it is a flu. Sometimes it will kill you.

[Plants]

Good luck

[matandch]

It teaches us that gathering in large groups is not safe and puts you at risk for catching Covid-19.

[Lindsyburnsy]

Poor judgment and weak. She should not have complied. Her kids were all there too. Guarantee RBG would have stood her ground.

[FromNY]

What was learned
1.The office of the President of my great country is inhabited by an egotistical self-centered dysfunctional human. I truly did not want to believe that these past years. The flaunting and using Covid-19 as a publicly stunt..riding in a car last evening was the straw that broke the donkeys back. Health care workers have been suffering holding the patients who had to die ALONE. This man insulted everyone of those last night on his joy ride.
2. Position and privilege get you top medical care. Even if the treatments are outside acceptable guidelines.
3.The news media are like the guy who says to the women his marriage is over so they can play...work it to meet their needs.
4. It has been a reminder that as an individual I will do what is right for me. And avoid if need be those that do not consider Covid-19 serious. I respect others choices and most of all I respect my choice to stay safe.
5. Biggest lesson: I have the right to change my mind when I cast my ballot.
Stay safe.

[Joanne D]

Respectfully disagree and will follow the recommendations of our scientist.

[csricksdds]

Amazing how much press for the White House gathering and how little press for the larger peaceful, and non peaceful, demonstrations? Both have the same potential to spread the virus?

[Girlcopper]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.
Its assumed thats where people spread the virus. Theres no way to confirm. Yes, it can be spread outdoors and thats been said from the very beginning. Hence, 6 feet apart. Those not in great shape, fat, elderly, medical probs have always been more prone. None of any of this is new info

[greenflash245]

you can't fix stupid!

[Fromtherock]

Listen to the science. Use common sense. Wear a mask.

[LiverpoolWalrus]

you can't fix stupid!

How To Fix Stupid (Leadership And Influence) - Larry Hochman (http://nomoreholdingback.com/how-to-fix-stupid/)

I respectfully disagree. Ron White was wrong. I'm looking forward to the day people stop parroting this.

[Bucco]

I agree with all you say...except the beginning about the masks.

At the beginning of the awareness of the danger in the U.S. there was a huge demand for masks and a short supply and what happened is that we were advised to allow the medical people to have them first.

I am hoping for a vaccine and looking carefully at this regimen used to treat President Trump. The hospital in Ocala claims to have had major success using a similar one.

I think President Trump is extremely ignorant of medical science and I am wondering if like a lot of people he has not had to face first hand cancer or any other frightening medical event. Most of us opine on things without a medical education and years of experience treating people. I cannot tell you how I respect medical science. There are doctors and there are extremely good doctors but they all are on a level above mine. I have heard some dingbats on Youtube with M.D. after their name and Drew Pinksy started the misinformation on Fox in my opinion.

We are left pretty much to our own devices to discern who to listen to. I take medical advice from experts. I take my chances on politicians. Most of them are not great statesmen. Power corrupts and people behave like humans all too often.

Hardly anyone is wild about the election choices and most of us are at least a little bit scared about catching Covid-19 and dying from it.

All of us need to use our common sense and all remember that if you have grandchildren they will cry if you die from this damned bug. Be careful. Be a little paranoid.

“The death of human empathy is one of the earliest and most telling signs of a culture about to fall into barbarism.”

Hannah Arendt

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

No, there is nothing else to learn. We learned everything we needed in February.

Social distance from others, stay away from indoor spaces with other people, wear clean masks in stores, wash your hands frequently.

Of course, that is easy for unemployed people like us.

It's also easy for us employed people. I wear a mask to work. Inconvenient and sweaty, yes. Unbearable, no.

[Vonjor@gmail.com]

For those of you who are STILL science deniers, I say "Just go for it". This is Darwin's theory in action. Clearly it's a wonderful way to thin the herd! You were giving us rednecks a bad name.

[Lottoguy]

All of Barrets children were shown not wearing masks too. Maybe her judgement is not up to par?

[Lottoguy]

The flu doesn't put you on a respirator for a month either.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Your advice is good except when you malign the Daily Sun who has never directed anyone to ignore advice from Scientists on Covid-19. And chitown. This isn't the seasonal flu. This isn't the seasonal flu. This isn't the seasonal flu. This ******* can kill you by choking you to death with thick mucosa that first makes you gasp for breath than suffocates you. This isn't the seasonal flu.

This isn't ANY flu. It's not a flu. It isn't a flu. It is not an influenza virus. It is a coronavirus. Obviously it's not a seasonal anything, since it started in the winter, and lasted through spring, through summer, and is still around in the autumn.

That judge used poor judgment. Even though she already had CV-19 in the summer, she should have erred on the side of caution (not paranoia) and said "oh, no thanks, I'll just keep wearing my mask." She should have SET a good example, contrary to those who wanted her to remove it and provide better photo ops.

When you side with someone who is more concerned with how things LOOK, than someone who is more concerned with how things ARE, then you are presenting a poor example, and poor judgment. She is clearly not fit to judge anything at all.

[MandoMan]

What does it teach us?

The triumph of Science, Reason, Self-Control, and Common Sense over Wishful Thinking, Hope, Prayer, YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, and Television News.

The photos I’ve seen of the “get together” at the White House shocked me. They might as well have been having an orgy, they were so close together.

[Nanny32162]

I've been watching the recordings of the assembly in the Rose garden earlier this week, and it's hard to fathom what they were thinking - not wearing masks, shaking hands, hugging in some cases. Seems to go against everything our experts tell us.

But to me the biggest take-away is that even out in the open air, it looks like you can still get the virus if you don't practice social distancing. I know it's going to make me think twice about eating outside, and I'm re-thinking all my activites now.

Is there anything else that can be learned? Super-spreader events like this just seem all too common. I've still not had a hair cut in 8 months now, and don't see that changing any time soon.

We have to get back to listneing to the Scientists on this. Wishful thinking is not going to cut it folks, and I don't like playing Russian roulette.

I beelive Trump is not in great shape, so if there is some good from this it's that he may become a poster child for why we all need to take it seriously and wear masks when with others.

You've made really good points. We had started to eat at restaurants, outside only, however, when the numbers in Florida started increasing we stopped. I hope people learn a lesson from this. Do you think we'll see masks on everyone and social distancing on the squares, at the eating (okay mostly drinking) establishments around the squares? Or are our fellow Villagers still in the ICBM mentality?

[Barefoot]

listen to the scientist, period.
I agree, listen to the Scientists - not the politicians.

[Boomer]

One of Dorothy Parker’s quips, “What fresh hell can this be? — was what she supposedly said when her doorbell or her phone rang. I quote Dorothy every morning when I flip on the news.

2020 is telling us who we are — and 2020 is definitely telling us who other people are, as in:

“Lie down with dogs, get up with fleas.” — ? . . .
:ohdear: (No, no can’t use that one. I like dogs a lot and respect the joy and help they so often bring to people’s lives. )

“Birds of a feather flock together.” — ? . . .
:ohdear: (Nope. Can’t use that one either. Birds constantly amaze me with the wonder and beauty they bring to our world..)

“We are judged by the company we keep.” — ?. . .
(Yes. That’s it.) What do we defend, excuse, admire, support, want to be a part of? That’s what I see as the company we keep. That’s what’s telling us who we are — and who other people are — really are.

And, oh yeah, I have learned something else from this latest “fresh hell.”

I have learned that the Secret Service needs a union.

Boomer

[angelasclark66]

Labor Day. By the time people started showing symptoms and getting tested it would have reflected a spike around this timeframe.

[Byte1]

So, the way I read these hysterical posts, ALL of you wear your masks at home around your spouse? If not, why not? After all, you should be considerate of them, right? I am glad that you all agree to wear a mask out in public. That means that it is not necessary for me to wear one, right? Because you say one should wear a mask to be considerate of others and it is our obligation to wear one to protect others. Well, I see it another way. If you are considerate of me, then you should stay home if you fear catching the virus. Stay away from me and we will all be happy. Don't put guilt trips on others if they do not wish to wear a mask. That is like telling someone that they do not care about others if they do not wear a seat belt or a motorcycle helmet. Worry about yourselves and leave everyone else alone.
Also, get your facts straight. Yes, there is still those getting infected in the Villages. BUT, how many have died lately of the virus? Very few compared to when it first started, right? Why don't you compare the stats of how many have died of natural causes to how many have died since the virus. Bet you will find that there is very little difference if any.
Now, quit pushing the panic button like it's your horn while stuck in traffic. You cannot mandate that anyone wear their mask in public. A store can mandate a mask wearing, but once the customer leaves the store they can take it off. Like I said, do you wear one when you are within six feet of your family? If not, you are putting them in jeopardy.
That said, I do wear my mask when shopping. But, I also have always taken advantage of the hand wipes at the entrances, washed my hands when using the bathroom, attempt to always keep my hands away from my face. Common stuff that shouldn't be abnormal for the average person. I wear my mask, but don't assume that I am doing it for you. Your premise is that everyone should be concerned for your welfare. Surprise, many don't give a hoot about your welfare.
Wear your mask if it gives you that placebo effect. I lost someone in my family that wore their mask EVERYWHERE they went and even wore disposable gloves. Some folks die and some folks can fall down the stairs stone drunk without harming themselves.
Do what you gotta do, but don't presume to demand others to cater to your whims.

[jklfairwin]

Are you aware that over 210,000 people have died from Covid 19 so far this year? I believe that the worst year for common flu deaths was 60,000 for the entire year. All experts agree that masks do provide protection; maybe not 100% but significant and they protect others if you are infectious.

[jimjamuser]

“The death of human empathy is one of the earliest and most telling signs of a culture about to fall into barbarism.”

Hannah Arendt
Really excellent post !!!!!

[Byte1]

Are you aware that over 210,000 people have died from Covid 19 so far this year? I believe that the worst year for common flu deaths was 60,000 for the entire year. All experts agree that masks do provide protection; maybe not 100% but significant and they protect others if you are infectious.

Numbers don't matter unless you have something to compare them with. Most likely, most of those folks would have died anyway. No one lives forever. Ask any tree hugger, this world is over populated anyway. Environmental folks should be dancing in the streets.

[jimjamuser]

So, the way I read these hysterical posts, ALL of you wear your masks at home around your spouse? If not, why not? After all, you should be considerate of them, right? I am glad that you all agree to wear a mask out in public. That means that it is not necessary for me to wear one, right? Because you say one should wear a mask to be considerate of others and it is our obligation to wear one to protect others. Well, I see it another way. If you are considerate of me, then you should stay home if you fear catching the virus. Stay away from me and we will all be happy. Don't put guilt trips on others if they do not wish to wear a mask. That is like telling someone that they do not care about others if they do not wear a seat belt or a motorcycle helmet. Worry about yourselves and leave everyone else alone.
Also, get your facts straight. Yes, there is still those getting infected in the Villages. BUT, how many have died lately of the virus? Very few compared to when it first started, right? Why don't you compare the stats of how many have died of natural causes to how many have died since the virus. Bet you will find that there is very little difference if any.
Now, quit pushing the panic button like it's your horn while stuck in traffic. You cannot mandate that anyone wear their mask in public. A store can mandate a mask wearing, but once the customer leaves the store they can take it off. Like I said, do you wear one when you are within six feet of your family? If not, you are putting them in jeopardy.
That said, I do wear my mask when shopping. But, I also have always taken advantage of the hand wipes at the entrances, washed my hands when using the bathroom, attempt to always keep my hands away from my face. Common stuff that shouldn't be abnormal for the average person. I wear my mask, but don't assume that I am doing it for you. Your premise is that everyone should be concerned for your welfare. Surprise, many don't give a hoot about your welfare.
Wear your mask if it gives you that placebo effect. I lost someone in my family that wore their mask EVERYWHERE they went and even wore disposable gloves. Some folks die and some folks can fall down the stairs stone drunk without harming themselves.
Do what you gotta do, but don't presume to demand others to cater to your whims.
So many words, so LITTLE truth, so confused

[Bellavita]

They were reckless and did not adhere to any CDC protocols after a few more go down it will be Melania in the White House alone

[jimjamuser]

Numbers don't matter unless you have something to compare them with. Most likely, most of those folks would have died anyway. No one lives forever. Ask any tree hugger, this world is over populated anyway. Environmental folks should be dancing in the streets.
So, tree huggers are bad. It is good to degrade the environment and, I guess, breathing clean air does NOT matter? And the Polar Bear can just go extinct - who cares? The oceans will rise and The Villages will become 1st a swamp - who cares? Then, alligators will be swimming through your house - but it does NOT matter because by then, you will be in "DENIER HEAVEN" sitting at the feet of your special "DENIER GOD" I hope that you can take your polluting gas engines with you.

[equaintance]

Do you think whoever you are talking about will now wear a mask, keep a safe distance and avoid crowds?

[Heyitsrick]

Question: Where is this story about Judge Barrett being asked to remove her mask coming from?

I saw a speculative comment on page 1 of this topic that read this way:



Did anyone see the short clip when Amy approached the rose garden party in a mask, she was met by 3 gentleman, one I think was mark meadows (could only see back of his head), it then appeared judging by the look on her face and actions, that she was asked to remove her mask which she promptly did.

Is that what we're using as "the facts" here? Later in the topic, others chimed in, such as feeling sorry for Barrett that she was asked to remove the mask. Another person lambasted her as "weak" for doing so and for not standing up for her right/desire to wear a mask. And more recently in this thread, someone said "she's clearly not fit to judge anything" for this decision.

OK, from the start - is there an actual news link that states she was asked by someone to remove her mask? I'm not saying there isn't one, but that's not how the topic is being presented here (unless I missed it). Instead, it seems like someone saw something on a video clip, and then assumed that she was asked to remove her mask. The rest of the comments in the thread seem to follow from that original comment.

So she removes a mask when up on the podium. She was going to speak at the podium. So the thought is that she should have kept a mask on while making her comments?

I watched what I'll charitably call a debate this past week. You probably did, too. And what did we see? We saw the president, the former vice-president and the moderator, all mask-free. Why was that ok? Rank has its privileges? Are you going to say that "it was so the audience could hear / understand them better!"? So, that's different when someone - someone who had already contracted Covid-19 this past summer - is at a podium to speak in the Rose Garden?

[Bucco]

Question: Where is this story about Judge Barrett being asked to remove her mask coming from?

I saw a speculative comment on page 1 of this topic that read this way:



Is that what we're using as "the facts" here? Later in the topic, others chimed in, such as feeling sorry for Barrett that she was asked to remove the mask. Another person lambasted her as "weak" for doing so and for not standing up for her right/desire to wear a mask. And more recently in this thread, someone said "she's clearly not fit to judge anything" for this decision.

OK, from the start - is there an actual news link that states she was asked by someone to remove her mask? I'm not saying there isn't one, but that's not how the topic is being presented here (unless I missed it). Instead, it seems like someone saw something on a video clip, and then assumed that she was asked to remove her mask. The rest of the comments in the thread seem to follow from that original comment.

So she removes a mask when up on the podium. She was going to speak at the podium. So the thought is that she should have kept a mask on while making her comments?

I watched what I'll charitably call a debate this past week. You probably did, too. And what did we see? We saw the president, the former vice-president and the moderator, all mask-free. Why was that ok? Rank has its privileges? Are you going to say that "it was so the audience could hear / understand them better!"? So, that's different when someone - someone who had already contracted Covid-19 this past summer - is at a podium to speak in the Rose Garden?

"https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/notre-dame-president-apologizes-for-not-wearing-mask-at-amy-coney-barrett-nomination/2346035/


"Jenkins explained that when he arrived at the White House, he and others underwent a rapid COVID-19 test, and once they had all tested negative, they were told it was safe to remove their masks.
__________________________________________________ _-

[jimjamuser]

That's not Judge Barrett, but again, even if it was a case where they (and she) were told it was safe, why would Judge Barrett - a person who had already gone through her Covid-19 battle - be affected by this?

And again...why is ok for presidential debates to go mask-free, yet there's a presumably (according to some here) higher standard at the Rose Garden?
This is the NOVEL CV, which means that it is NEW and LITTLE is known about it. Japanese scientists have seen SOME evidence that a person can be RE-INFECTED by CV. They are testing for that further.

Also, there is a picture of Mike Lee, while inside, talking to Judge Barrett with his face OVERLY close to hers. It looks like he is about to kiss her. He was in a lot of GOP faces while outside in the Rose Garden.

[Heyitsrick]

On the debate.......they were well apart much more than is required or mandated by health officials.

Seems like there's some real concerns over what constitutes a safe distance - particularly when Covid-19 is carried by the much, much smaller "aerosol" format (vs. larger droplets).

From ScientificAmerica a few days ago:

This feels like a lopsided fight. In one corner, we have scientists, epidemiologists, infectious-disease physicians, clinicians, engineers—many different experts in the medical community, that is—arguing that the spread of COVID-19 by aerosols (that is, tiny droplets that can remain airborne long enough to travel significantly farther than the six-foot separation we’ve been told to observe) is both real and dangerous. In the other, it’s the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) and the World Health Organization (WHO), which until very recently have allowed only that aerosol spread is possible, not necessarily likely.

And while watching experts going against governmental agencies isn’t always riveting stuff, this particular battle is terribly important. It has significant implications for how we as a country handle this epidemic, and what decisions we make going forward—and those decisions need to be made sooner, not later.

On some level, this is a discussion of droplets versus aerosols. You’ve probably heard plenty this year about droplets: they’re larger in size and may be exhaled by someone talking, shouting, singing, coughing or sneezing. These droplets don’t travel far and fall quickly to the ground, one reason why a “social distance” of roughly six feet is seen as a safe one.

Aerosols, on the other hand, are tiny by comparison, nearly 10,000 times smaller than a human hair. They’re spread at far greater distances—20 to 30 feet—and can linger in the air for minutes to hours, infecting others.

Protecting against COVID's Aerosol Threat - Scientific American (https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/protecting-against-covids-aerosol-threat/)

[coffeebean]

Respectfully disagree and will follow the recommendations of our scientist.

Who do you respectfully disagree with? When you do not quote someone, I have no idea who you directed your comment to.

[vilger]

What does Covid-19 in the White House teach us? It provides a very teachable moment:

If you know you may have been exposed to COVID-19, give yourself the benefit of the doubt and don't let it interfere with your life. If there is a large gathering that you must go to, go to it - don't wear a mask there, shake hands, press the flesh. If other people get it, that's their tough luck.

And if you are certain that you have COVID-19, and desperately need to go somewhere -- like from one car entrance to a hospital to another car entrance of the same hospital, find someone to drive you, preferably someone who has no choice in the matter.

[coffeebean]

Thanks for the input. You came on here looking for trouble, so please....for the time being, I, as you want to do, will choose for myself how to protect myself and family.

I am not looking to protect anyone but me and my family...you obviously are trying to protect more than that.

That goes without saying.....I also want to protect me and my family too. Having said that, I want to also protect our way of life here in America. Following the CDC guidelines will allow us to have some semblance of normalcy, getting the economy back to pre-Covid levels, getting people back to work and get the cruise lines sailing again among other things.

[jimjamuser]

What does Covid-19 in the White House teach us? It provides a very teachable moment:

If you know you may have been exposed to COVID-19, give yourself the benefit of the doubt and don't let it interfere with your life. If there is a large gathering that you must go to, go to it - don't wear a mask there, shake hands, press the flesh. If other people get it, that's their tough luck.

And if you are certain that you have COVID-19, and desperately need to go somewhere -- like from one car entrance to a hospital to another car entrance of the same hospital, find someone to drive you, preferably someone who has no choice in the matter.
Good post! Kudos!

[Velvet]

He’s back! So far it looks like the President is winning his personal fight against the virus, but it looks like quite a fight. I bet everyone in the WH wears N95 masks though.