rec center masks

[rakksk]

Does anyone know if rec center personnel are required to wear masks?

[Bogie Shooter]

Does anyone know if rec center personnel are required to wear masks?

Contact Us
Recreation Administration
984 Old Mill Run
The Villages, FL 32162

Phone: 352-674-1800

[Topspinmo]

Does anyone know if rec center personnel are required to wear masks?

When I go in rec center and get closer than 6 feet they mask up, course I am wearing mask. Once I make my way to pool table and there is no one within 10 feet I take mask off.

If people come in I move away from them. if they get close I mask up if the occupy table next to me. If anybody in room is coughing I immediately leave.

Last time I read the instructions said mask recommended?

[dnobles]

Yes Rec center employees are required to wear mask

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

When I go in rec center and get closer than 6 feet they mask up, course I am wearing mask. Once I make my way to pool table and there is no one within 10 feet I take mask off.

If people come in I move away from them. if they get close I mask up if the occupy table next to me. If anybody in room is coughing I immediately leave.

Last time I read the instructions said mask recommended?

The OP is asking if employees at the rec center are *required* to wear masks. They're not asking whether or not guests can consider optional.

[Topspinmo]

The OP is asking if employees at the rec center are *required* to wear masks. They're not asking whether or not guests can consider optional.

By my observation they are “required” IAW CDC guidelines. I guess if the OP wants LEGAL determination they can call the number provided by boogie. Thank you for you’re opinion.

[solomon]

YES They are required to wear masks.

[banjobob]

When I go in rec center and get closer than 6 feet they mask up, course I am wearing mask. Once I make my way to pool table and there is no one within 10 feet I take mask off.

If people come in I move away from them. if they get close I mask up if the occupy table next to me. If anybody in room is coughing I immediately leave.

Last time I read the instructions said mask recommended?
Good common sense approach , protect yourself, others are on their own.

[ts12755]

Why, do you want to get one of these minimum wage employees in trouble? Just wear your mask and stay away from people.

[Girlcopper]

Does anyone know if rec center personnel are required to wear masks?
I assume by your question that someone wasnt wearing a mask. Instead of looking to get them in trouble, just leave. Simple

[shannondwd]

They are NOT REQUIRED to wear a mask unless you get within 6 feet of them. Can you imagine wearing a mask 8 hours when there is. No one in the building. Very unhealthy that would be.

[Gmaf6]

Masks are requested.....employees should wear them if within 6 ft of someone, indoors.

[coffeebean]

Masks are requested.....employees should wear them if within 6 ft of someone, indoors.

That is what the rec center employees are doing at the sport's pool at Colony Rec Center. I can see the employee putting on the mask as I approach the desk that is set up outside the locker rooms. Works for me. I guess I'd be fine with it inside also but....there is a chance of aerosols lingering in the air of an indoor space if any employees are asymptomatic carriers of the virus. It would be better if the employees kept their masks on and take breaks every once in a while. Isn't that what the employees in our grocery stores and other public indoor buildings have to do?

[Waltdisney4life]

Aerosol lingering is not reported as true by the cdc ,it is media driven. The “death clouds are fiction’” masks are only required if you are unable to maintain six feet distance.

[billethkid]

Good common sense approach , protect yourself, others are on their own.

But I thought wearing of the mask is intended to protect "others"!?

[CFrance]

I assume by your question that someone wasnt wearing a mask. Instead of looking to get them in trouble, just leave. Simple
Why? If they are required to wear masks, why should I just leave (missing my class, meeting, or recreational activity, or maybe I came in to pick up guest passes) because someone in charge is not following the employer's rules?


Everybody needs to pay attention and do his/her part to help stop this ugly beast of a virus.

[Mikee1]

Why? If they are required to wear masks, why should I just leave (missing my class, meeting, or recreational activity, or maybe I came in to pick up guest passes) because someone in charge is not following the employer's rules?


Everybody needs to pay attention and do his/her part to help stop this ugly beast of a virus.

If masks worked the virus would be gone by now... Remember 14 days to slow the spread. All any of this has done is prolong the inevitable.

[CFrance]

If masks worked the virus would be gone by now... Remember 14 days to slow the spread. All any of this has done is prolong the inevitable.
IMO you have that backwards. If everyone wore a mask, the virus would have been gone a long time ago.


Regardless if masks are required by rec center employees, they should be worn.

[Curtisbwp]

Why would you ask. I dont care who wears what. I protect myself, that is my responsibility.

[macawlaw]

Aerosol lingering is not reported as true by the cdc ,it is media driven. The “death clouds are fiction’” masks are only required if you are unable to maintain six feet distance.

Could you supply your source please? This is contrary to everything I have read.

This is from the CDC website this morning.
Scientific Brief: SARS-CoV-2 and Potential Airborne Transmission | CDC (https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/scientific-brief-sars-cov-2.html)

[petiteone]

They are NOT REQUIRED to wear a mask unless you get within 6 feet of them. Can you imagine wearing a mask 8 hours when there is. No one in the building. Very unhealthy that would be.


It's not unhealthy to wear a mask for long durations, if necessary. I'm a retired health care professional and we wore masks for 10 hrs - 12 hrs a day depending on the length of our shift.

[GPGuar]

IMO you have that backwards. If everyone wore a mask, the virus would have been gone a long time ago.


Regardless if masks are required by rec center employees, they should be worn.
Seriously... do you really believe that?

[Bogie Shooter]

A simple question that could be answered with a phone call has once again turned into a debate on mask use. This debate appears to never have a conclusion.......

[Two Bills]

It's not unhealthy to wear a mask for long durations, if necessary. I'm a retired health care professional and we wore masks for 10 hrs - 12 hrs a day depending on the length of our shift.

For Gods sake!
Facts ruin arguments!!:icon_wink:

[sooziesoul]

CDC Seems to change its information daily!!!!! So which information should you believe . The WHO DOES THE SAME !!

[Gulfcoast]

It's not unhealthy to wear a mask for long durations, if necessary. I'm a retired health care professional and we wore masks for 10 hrs - 12 hrs a day depending on the length of our shift.

You did not wear the same mask all day long. No you did not. Nor were you wearing homemade cloth masks. You were in a sterile environment, wearing medical grade masks and you were regularly washing your hands and switching out your gloves and your masks.

I'm not picking on you but it truly troubles me when medical people make these kinds of comparisons.

[Gulfcoast]

For Gods sake!
Facts ruin arguments!!:icon_wink:

Is it true that a gym or grocery store is a sterile environment? Is it true that homemade cloth masks are sterile and as high a quality as medical grade masks? Is it safe for a cashier to be wearing/touching/adjusting a non sterile, non medical grade cloth mask all day long while scanning merchandise that has been touched by multiple hands?

[mneumann02]

Could you supply your source please? This is contrary to everything I have read.

This is from the CDC website this morning.
Scientific Brief: SARS-CoV-2 and Potential Airborne Transmission | CDC (https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/scientific-brief-sars-cov-2.html)

Thanks for giving us the facts with the appropriate source. Unfortunately, some people just refuse to accept the truth about how dangerous this pandemic is. e.g., they believe it is no worse than the flu. Even more unfortunately, they do not take the precautions the rest of us do, which leads to even more spreading of the disease.

[Gulfcoast]

Thanks for giving us the facts with the appropriate source. Unfortunately, some people just refuse to accept the truth about how dangerous this pandemic is. e.g., they believe it is no worse than the flu. Even more unfortunately, they do not take the precautions the rest of us do, which leads to even more spreading of the disease.

From what I've seen there is still high compliance in the stores and other crowded venues. People are being as patient about this as they can be. The more they are scolded and threatened with mandates, the weaker the compliance will be.

I walked into a store the other day w/o a mask on - not because I was being defiant but because I literally thought that I had one on. Oops. When I realized I didn't have one on, I put it on. No big deal. I don't think that anyone DIED from my momentary lapse. I saw a delivery driver pop into another store w/o a mask on his face to deliver a package. I doubt that he contaminated the entire store in that brief time he was in there.

We have got to use some common sense with this and give people the benefit of the doubt or people are just going to get frustrated and stop even trying to placate others by wearing masks.

[Number 10 GI]

I assume by your question that someone wasnt wearing a mask. Instead of looking to get them in trouble, just leave. Simple

That and why didn't the OP question the "evil doer" about their lack of a mask?

[Number 10 GI]

Why? If they are required to wear masks, why should I just leave (missing my class, meeting, or recreational activity, or maybe I came in to pick up guest passes) because someone in charge is not following the employer's rules?


Everybody needs to pay attention and do his/her part to help stop this ugly beast of a virus.

Why are you going to these classes, meetings or recreational activities where you are possibly exposed to the virus? How do you know that all the participants in theses activities aren't infected? You are ultimately responsible for your safety, not some one else.

[Number 10 GI]

IMO you have that backwards. If everyone wore a mask, the virus would have been gone a long time ago.


Regardless if masks are required by rec center employees, they should be worn.

Totally untrue, masks cannot and will not stop the spread of the virus.

[jimjamuser]

That is what the rec center employees are doing at the sport's pool at Colony Rec Center. I can see the employee putting on the mask as I approach the desk that is set up outside the locker rooms. Works for me. I guess I'd be fine with it inside also but....there is a chance of aerosols lingering in the air of an indoor space if any employees are asymptomatic carriers of the virus. It would be better if the employees kept their masks on and take breaks every once in a while. Isn't that what the employees in our grocery stores and other public indoor buildings have to do?
Indoor air brings up the problem and the need for there to be a high turnover of air in commercial indoor buildings. I am curious whether The Villages rec centers have made modifications to increase turnover. For example, hospitals turn the air over at a rate of 12 times per hour. Normal buildings turn the air over ONE time per hour.

[jimjamuser]

But I thought wearing of the mask is intended to protect "others"!?
Newest research shows that it protects BOTH the wearer and those around them.

[Number 10 GI]

It's not unhealthy to wear a mask for long durations, if necessary. I'm a retired health care professional and we wore masks for 10 hrs - 12 hrs a day depending on the length of our shift.

The other day at my doctor's office the nurse checked my oxygen level as well as BP, pulse, etc. My oxygen level was 89. She told me to pull up my mask and take a couple breaths, my oxygen went up to it's normal 98. She said that she was seeing that a lot of people had low oxygen levels wearing masks. She has been a RN for a few decades now, so is she a liar?

[Bill14564]

Newest research shows that it protects BOTH the wearer and those around them.

I'm sure there are a number of people who will be really happy to hear that, though those who have already passed will be a bit harder to contact.

Wearing a mask can help protect both the wearer and those around them.

My cynical side wonders if this newest research didn't conveniently appear in order to increase mask compliance. If people weren't wearing masks to protect others then maybe they would wear them to protect themselves. Unfortunately, the "experts" had been telling people masks didn't work that way. But look! There's a new study that says.....

[jimjamuser]

If masks worked the virus would be gone by now... Remember 14 days to slow the spread. All any of this has done is prolong the inevitable.
Medical scientists say that masks work. You are "opinionating" that they don't. Logic says that I believe ALL the experts.......sorry

[jimjamuser]

IMO you have that backwards. If everyone wore a mask, the virus would have been gone a long time ago.


Regardless if masks are required by rec center employees, they should be worn.
Guaranteed, that if 90% wore their masks 90% of the time that the US would be back to "normal" like South Korea and New Zealand. The US citizens are too stubborn for their own good. They are like "herding cats". Hear kitty-kitty please, please wear your mask, please you stupid pu**y!

[jimjamuser]

It's not unhealthy to wear a mask for long durations, if necessary. I'm a retired health care professional and we wore masks for 10 hrs - 12 hrs a day depending on the length of our shift.
Thank you, Tiny Person. Both for your great service and your great post. Keep up the good work!

[Pairadocs]

Good common sense approach , protect yourself, others are on their own.

I agree, but is anyone else disturbed by the major Danish study released yesterday that the kind mask we are able to obtain have no value in protecting the wearer (something I have long suspected based on what I learned in microbiology in college classes), and that there "may" be a very low level of protection to others from you ? This is the reason public officials like the president elect and others wear N95 masks under their fashion masks. The study released last week done on our own marine recruits in training barracks found the same thing ! Startling stats that the wearing of cotton and cloth masks do not protect from a virus but could possibly stop the actual water vapor as in when someone sneezes directly on you, or your food. I wonder if "some day" we are going to find out that this virus is spreads and effects in a way we never even thought of ? Such as certain genetic markers found in our various cultural ethnicity's or cultures ? I have always questioned my "mind", or what's left of it, LOL, knowing what I do know about microbiology, microbes, bacteria, etc. (and believe me, I am not an expert for sure, just a little education in that area) for walking around with my Disney character mask on thinking I am protected in any way for the virus (not the water vapor surrounding it) penetrating cotton ? Sometimes I think some actual experts must know this, but, feel it's better psychologically for a population to feel they have some degree of personal control over their own safety rather than have the multiply dangers of a population overcome with anxiety (crowd madness), causing stark changes in personalities, behaviors, etc. ? What we think of a panic and people becoming "unlike" themselves ? Food for thought ?

[Bill14564]

Guaranteed, that if 90% wore their masks 90% of the time that the US would be back to "normal" like South Korea and New Zealand. The US citizens are too stubborn for their own good. They are like "herding cats". Hear kitty-kitty please, please wear your mask, please you stupid pu**y!

Guaranteed that is not the case. First, people would be wearing masks which has never been normal. Second, 90% of the people 90% of the time is no more than 80% compliance which would slow the virus but not stop it. We would still have limitations in sizes of gatherings, we would still have mandatory closing times for places where masks wouldn't be worn (restaurants and bars), and it's questionable whether large sports venues would be allowed to operate at capacity since they encourage cheering and yelling and other activities that increase the spread of the virus.

[Pairadocs]

Why are you going to these classes, meetings or recreational activities where you are possibly exposed to the virus? How do you know that all the participants in theses activities aren't infected? You are ultimately responsible for your safety, not some one else.

I don't know how anyone knows at all if someone in their golf league, ceramics class, or in Publix has, or soon will have, the virus ? I suppose the people going to their meetings and activities go because The Villages has these activities going on, and that's why people live here ? Surely if this was considered highly "dangerous", the villages would not allow such classes don't you think ? Maybe not, but I certainly think so. Of course we are all responsible for our own safety, I completely agree ! But, if we swim something could happening, could slip, hit head, drown, who knows. Just wondering what others think too, if this was considered highly dangerous do you think the rec centers would be open and having activities ? WHY are you going to Publix ? Maybe you are hungry and have assessed the risk and it is clear that dying from hunger is much more likely than dying from Covid-19 ? I am definitely NOT a risk taker, but some of the emotional issues here just don't make sense to me in a logical, factual, analysis ! ?

[Gulfcoast]

I don't know how anyone knows at all if someone in their golf league, ceramics class, or in Publix has, or soon will have, the virus ? I suppose the people going to their meetings and activities go because The Villages has these activities going on, and that's why people live here ? Surely if this was considered highly "dangerous", the villages would not allow such classes don't you think ? Maybe not, but I certainly think so. Of course we are all responsible for our own safety, I completely agree ! But, if we swim something could happening, could slip, hit head, drown, who knows. Just wondering what others think too, if this was considered highly dangerous do you think the rec centers would be open and having activities ?

If the virus was that deadly no one would be willing to attend these classes at all and the problem would solve itself. Clearly that is not the case. Demand for classes is only going up from what I've seen.

[jimjamuser]

A simple question that could be answered with a phone call has once again turned into a debate on mask use. This debate appears to never have a conclusion.......
The US has less than 5% of the world's population. It has 19 % of the world's death. That suggests to me that the US has done SOMETHING(?) wrong! Since mask-wearing is the best available response that epidemiologists have STRONGLY suggested to us to do - and since most of we Americans have been propagandized toward not wearing masks - we of TV Land need to talk it out over and over until the CORRECT and unpropagandized message gets through. It is difficult to drill through the hardened layers of propaganda that have clouded the minds of zombiezed Americans. The goal of LIFE, liberty, and happiness starts with LIFE simply because you can't have liberty and happiness when you are DEAD!

I guess unless you maybe believe in reincarnation?

[Dana1963]

I assume by your question that someone wasnt wearing a mask. Instead of looking to get them in trouble, just leave. Simple
If it's a work requirement refusing to wear a mask should be grounds for termination!

[jimjamuser]

From what I've seen there is still high compliance in the stores and other crowded venues. People are being as patient about this as they can be. The more they are scolded and threatened with mandates, the weaker the compliance will be.

I walked into a store the other day w/o a mask on - not because I was being defiant but because I literally thought that I had one on. Oops. When I realized I didn't have one on, I put it on. No big deal. I don't think that anyone DIED from my momentary lapse. I saw a delivery driver pop into another store w/o a mask on his face to deliver a package. I doubt that he contaminated the entire store in that brief time he was in there.

We have got to use some common sense with this and give people the benefit of the doubt or people are just going to get frustrated and stop even trying to placate others by wearing masks.
If what you say about compliance is true, then we would not have seat belts in our cars or speed bumps on our roads. People will comply with lawful orders, when those doing the ordering at the top grow up and give the US the correct messages. there is a reason that the US has 19% of the world's DEATHS. I know the reason. Do you?

[jimjamuser]

Totally untrue, masks cannot and will not stop the spread of the virus.
Then WHY are ALL the medical professionals on TV BEGGING US people to wear their masks? And how else can anyone explain why the US with its under 5% of the world's population be CAUSING 19 % of the world's DEATHS. I am thinking that not wearing masks is causing ALL the out --proportioned US DEATHS.

[Dana1963]

If masks worked the virus would be gone by now... Remember 14 days to slow the spread. All any of this has done is prolong the inevitable.
Republican Governors who fought mask-wearing Iowa, Wyoming, Utah, North Dakota are now changing their tune since the hospital census is increasing. While the Governors of South Dakota, Florida the exact opposite. The Villages on Wednesday test 15 positive and Wednesday 13 positive hope no one is hospitalized or even real sick just quarantine it's only 14 days

[Byte1]

Oh my! The sky is falling.
It's pathetic that some folks NEED a gov nanny to tell them how to live and then they need to get into everyone else's business because the gov nanny told them how to think.
I think you all should wear tin foil hats so that the radiation from the power towers don't mess up your minds. Ooops, too late. :MOJE_whot:

[jimjamuser]

I agree, but is anyone else disturbed by the major Danish study released yesterday that the kind mask we are able to obtain have no value in protecting the wearer (something I have long suspected based on what I learned in microbiology in college classes), and that there "may" be a very low level of protection to others from you ? This is the reason public officials like the president elect and others wear N95 masks under their fashion masks. The study released last week done on our own marine recruits in training barracks found the same thing ! Startling stats that the wearing of cotton and cloth masks do not protect from a virus but could possibly stop the actual water vapor as in when someone sneezes directly on you, or your food. I wonder if "some day" we are going to find out that this virus is spreads and effects in a way we never even thought of ? Such as certain genetic markers found in our various cultural ethnicity's or cultures ? I have always questioned my "mind", or what's left of it, LOL, knowing what I do know about microbiology, microbes, bacteria, etc. (and believe me, I am not an expert for sure, just a little education in that area) for walking around with my Disney character mask on thinking I am protected in any way for the virus (not the water vapor surrounding it) penetrating cotton ? Sometimes I think some actual experts must know this, but, feel it's better psychologically for a population to feel they have some degree of personal control over their own safety rather than have the multiply dangers of a population overcome with anxiety (crowd madness), causing stark changes in personalities, behaviors, etc. ? What we think of a panic and people becoming "unlike" themselves ? Food for thought ?
That IS food for thought! But, sometimes we as individuals, can OVER-think somethings, sometimes. This IS an emotional period. I look to the US's world-leading epidemiologists for their LATEST advice on mask-wearing. It is conclusive, so I wear one and hope others wear theirs. And in the future, I hope that US leaders in Washington start advising the wearing of masks. AND that they "walk the walk"!

[jimjamuser]

Guaranteed that is not the case. First, people would be wearing masks which has never been normal. Second, 90% of the people 90% of the time is no more than 80% compliance which would slow the virus but not stop it. We would still have limitations in sizes of gatherings, we would still have mandatory closing times for places where masks wouldn't be worn (restaurants and bars), and it's questionable whether large sports venues would be allowed to operate at capacity since they encourage cheering and yelling and other activities that increase the spread of the virus.
How would we know that, since we have NOT tried that?

[Advogado]

Totally untrue, masks cannot and will not stop the spread of the virus.
Where do you get this nonsense?

[Advogado]

Totally untrue, masks cannot and will not stop the spread of the virus.
Where do you get this nonsense?

[Gulfcoast]

The US has less than 5% of the world's population. It has 19 % of the world's death. That suggests to me that the US has done SOMETHING(?) wrong! Since mask-wearing is the best available response that epidemiologists have STRONGLY suggested to us to do - and since most of we Americans have been propagandized toward not wearing masks - we of TV Land need to talk it out over and over until the CORRECT and unpropagandized message gets through. It is difficult to drill through the hardened layers of propaganda that have clouded the minds of zombiezed Americans. The goal of LIFE, liberty, and happiness starts with LIFE simply because you can't have liberty and happiness when you are DEAD!

I guess unless you maybe believe in reincarnation?

U.S. hospitals were given monetary incentive to label deaths as Covid caused.

That's the part they forget to mention in all of those fancy dancy statistics.

[jimjamuser]

I don't know how anyone knows at all if someone in their golf league, ceramics class, or in Publix has, or soon will have, the virus ? I suppose the people going to their meetings and activities go because The Villages has these activities going on, and that's why people live here ? Surely if this was considered highly "dangerous", the villages would not allow such classes don't you think ? Maybe not, but I certainly think so. Of course we are all responsible for our own safety, I completely agree ! But, if we swim something could happening, could slip, hit head, drown, who knows. Just wondering what others think too, if this was considered highly dangerous do you think the rec centers would be open and having activities ? WHY are you going to Publix ? Maybe you are hungry and have assessed the risk and it is clear that dying from hunger is much more likely than dying from Covid-19 ? I am definitely NOT a risk taker, but some of the emotional issues here just don't make sense to me in a logical, factual, analysis ! ?
The Villages have about everything open, Not on the advice of medical experts. It is open because it was decreed that way by our big-time state tribal leader called a Governor. And this tribal leader has allegiance to ...........something? Out West and in the northern mid-west, the CV is raging and their rec centerlike places called gyms are closing down, and indoor restaurants are closing.

In reality, as a conclusion - we are living in a time period called "before CV and after CV". TV Land has been lucky so far. And some are looking ahead to a vaccine to put all of the broken Humpty-dumpty of America back together again. I predict that that does NOT go smoothly - NOTHING in life goes smoothly. The rec center question is just a microcosm of the greater macro forces of a national nature!

[coffeebean]

Aerosol lingering is not reported as true by the cdc ,it is media driven. The “death clouds are fiction’” masks are only required if you are unable to maintain six feet distance.

I first heard about aerosols lingering in the air from the CDC.

CDC Says Coronavirus Might Be Adrift in Indoor Air - The New York Times (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/05/health/cdc-coronavirus-airborne-indoor-air.html)

[Gulfcoast]

If what you say about compliance is true, then we would not have seat belts in our cars or speed bumps on our roads. People will comply with lawful orders, when those doing the ordering at the top grow up and give the US the correct messages. there is a reason that the US has 19% of the world's DEATHS. I know the reason. Do you?

Getting into a car accident while not wearing a seat belt is often harmful to people. So we wear seat belts because we don't want to get hurt.

You generally don't have to nag people to not jump out of skyscraper windows or not walk in the middle of busy roads, set their bodies on fire or drink gasoline. There is no need to ban tall buildings, roads or gasoline.

You don't have to remind people that knives can be sharp. But if you go around screaming about how dangerous plastic butter knives are and that they should all be BANNED, people are going to look at you funny and use their butter knives anyway in spite of the "risks" involved.

Exercise classes promote health, relaxation and mental well being. There might be a heightened chance to catch a virus but that is a risk people are willing to take. If you don't agree, don't take a class.

[kenoc7]

They are NOT REQUIRED to wear a mask unless you get within 6 feet of them. Can you imagine wearing a mask 8 hours when there is. No one in the building. Very unhealthy that would be.
Plenty of hospital workers and grocery workers wear masks for 8 hour shifts, why not Rec Centre staff/ Saying it is unhealthy is ridiculous and absurd.

[coffeebean]

If masks worked the virus would be gone by now... Remember 14 days to slow the spread. All any of this has done is prolong the inevitable.

Masks WOULD work if only the majority of people wore them. That is not happening in most parts of our country. The anti-maskers are akin to petulant children. That is the hard truth about this. I've said many times before, The US will never see this virus under control until the vaccine is made available to the masses. Slowing the spread of the virus is apparently not feasible with the way the people of our country conduct themselves.

An example right here in The Villages......I passed a very popular corner restaurant/bar in Lake Sumter Landing the other evening. The outdoor bar was PACKED TO THE GILLS. People were standing within one foot of each other. Holy cow. If that is not a recipe for disaster. That is just one little example so there you have it. I rest my case.

[jimjamuser]

U.S. hospitals were given monetary incentive to label deaths as Covid caused.

That's the part they forget to mention in all of those fancy dancy statistics.
It is hard to comment on ideas propagated by science deniers and statistic deniers and the flat earthers of the world that apparently regurgitate their QAnon and foxy propaganda often and at will. It is a lovely world in Q-land, I hope you are NOT my neighbor!

[coffeebean]

Why would you ask. I don't care who wears what. I protect myself, that is my responsibility.

I care if you don't. It is up to EVERYONE to do their part. Wear a mask when in public indoor spaces and wear a mask outdoors when you can not maintain distance from others. It is that simple.

[Bill14564]

Then WHY are ALL the medical professionals on TV BEGGING US people to wear their masks? And how else can anyone explain why the US with its under 5% of the world's population be CAUSING 19 % of the world's DEATHS. I am thinking that not wearing masks is causing ALL the out --proportioned US DEATHS.

Look up confirmation bias. I don't believe all, even capitalized, is strictly accurate.

Other possible reasons for the large percentage in the US:
- Not the highest ratio in the world (top 10? maybe)
- Higher population density in areas of the US that are spiking
- Mis-steps in the beginning (NY nursing homes among others)
- No lockdowns (I don't want to live in a country with police on every corner asking for my papers if I leave my house)
- Poor counting in some countries
- Generally obstinate
- Too many "experts" demanding something today then something different tomorrow
- Fake news (from all sides) driving a lack of compliance (and common sense)
- US love of freedom - Don't Tread on Me - Just leave me the h**l alone

[Bill14564]

How would we know that, since we have NOT tried that?

In the same way we would know that it would work: proof by emphatic assertion.

[coffeebean]

You did not wear the same mask all day long. No you did not. Nor were you wearing homemade cloth masks. You were in a sterile environment, wearing medical grade masks and you were regularly washing your hands and switching out your gloves and your masks.

I'm not picking on you but it truly troubles me when medical people make these kinds of comparisons.
My aunt was an OR nurse for many years. She did wear a mask for hours on end in the OR. I can only report what she told me and I have no reason to doubt her word.

[Bill14564]

I first heard about aerosols lingering in the air from the CDC.

CDC Says Coronavirus Might Be Adrift in Indoor Air - The New York Times (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/05/health/cdc-coronavirus-airborne-indoor-air.html)

Please read the article.

[Dayeight99]

Who cares.

[coffeebean]

Is it true that a gym or grocery store is a sterile environment? Is it true that homemade cloth masks are sterile and as high a quality as medical grade masks? Is it safe for a cashier to be wearing/touching/adjusting a non sterile, non medical grade cloth mask all day long while scanning merchandise that has been touched by multiple hands?

I don't worry anymore about who has touched my merchandise in a grocery store. I've long stopped wiping every single grocery item down with sanitizer once it was stated by the CDC that the virus is not primarily transmitted by touching a surface. I do not ever touch my face with unwashed hands so I have no worry there. It has also been stated by the CDC that food does not transmit the virus so, no, I'm not concerned if people adjust their masks with their hands.

I do, however, wash apples that will not be cooked. It just makes me feel better to do that.

[Gulfcoast]

My aunt was an OR nurse for many years. She did wear a mask for hours on end in the OR. I can only report what she told me and I have no reason to doubt her word.

It was a sterile medical grade mask, in a sterile hospital environment with lots of hand washing/sanitzing. That is not the same thing as being a busboy or a cashier.

There was someone earlier in this thread who mentioned how mask wearing made their own oxygen levels fall pretty dramatically which isn't healthy. It doesn't matter if that doesn't happen to you, it does happen to them. And they should be able to choose not to wear a mask at Publix if that is what they want to choose.

[Gulfcoast]

I don't worry anymore about who has touched my merchandise in a grocery store. I've long stopped wiping every single grocery item down with sanitizer once it was stated by the CDC that the virus is not primarily transmitted by touching a surface. I do not ever touch my face with unwashed hands so I have no worry there. It has also been stated by the CDC that food does not transmit the virus so, no, I'm not concerned if people adjust their masks with their hands.

I do, however, wash apples that will not be cooked. It just makes me feel better to do that.

Are you a cashier?

[coffeebean]

Thanks for giving us the facts with the appropriate source. Unfortunately, some people just refuse to accept the truth about how dangerous this pandemic is. e.g., they believe it is no worse than the flu. Even more unfortunately, they do not take the precautions the rest of us do, which leads to even more spreading of the disease.

I saw an interview on TV the other day that made my mouth drop open in disbelief. An ICU nurse said that she has had patients, sick with Covid, come off a ventilator and say that they do not believe they were sick with Covid because they truly believe this pandemic is a hoax. She was in near tears explaining how overworked she and her colleagues are and trying their best to save the lives of these people. There is just something very wrong about this. I was aghast listening to her. People can be such fools.

[coffeebean]

Totally untrue, masks cannot and will not stop the spread of the virus.

You made a true statement. Masks SLOW THE SPREAD of the virus and coupled with social distancing, will do what is expected of that mitigation process. All we can expect is for our risk to be minimized and keep the virus from exploding in our cities and overwhelm our health care systems.

Wear a mask in public indoor spaces and outdoors when social distancing can not be maintained. Always keep your distance from others.

[Byte1]

The Villages have about everything open, Not on the advice of medical experts. It is open because it was decreed that way by our big-time state tribal leader called a Governor. And this tribal leader has allegiance to ...........something? Out West and in the northern mid-west, the CV is raging and their rec centerlike places called gyms are closing down, and indoor restaurants are closing.

In reality, as a conclusion - we are living in a time period called "before CV and after CV". TV Land has been lucky so far. And some are looking ahead to a vaccine to put all of the broken Humpty-dumpty of America back together again. I predict that that does NOT go smoothly - NOTHING in life goes smoothly. The rec center question is just a microcosm of the greater macro forces of a national nature!

SO the Villages is violating everything that you believe and yet have hardly any virus related deaths(compared to everywhere else). Go figure. And you believe it is due to "LUCK?" What's luck got to do with your "science?" I am not denying the existence of luck, but I am denying the absolutes of "science."

[coffeebean]

The other day at my doctor's office the nurse checked my oxygen level as well as BP, pulse, etc. My oxygen level was 89. She told me to pull up my mask and take a couple breaths, my oxygen went up to it's normal 98. She said that she was seeing that a lot of people had low oxygen levels wearing masks. She has been a RN for a few decades now, so is she a liar?

What type of mask were you wearing? How many layers? Filter too? Was it easy to breath through your mask?

[Bogie Shooter]

A simple question that could be answered with a phone call has once again turned into a debate on mask use. This debate appears to never have a conclusion.......

The US has less than 5% of the world's population. It has 19 % of the world's death. That suggests to me that the US has done SOMETHING(?) wrong! Since mask-wearing is the best available response that epidemiologists have STRONGLY suggested to us to do - and since most of we Americans have been propagandized toward not wearing masks - we of TV Land need to talk it out over and over until the CORRECT and unpropagandized message gets through. It is difficult to drill through the hardened layers of propaganda that have clouded the minds of zombiezed Americans. The goal of LIFE, liberty, and happiness starts with LIFE simply because you can't have liberty and happiness when you are DEAD!

I guess unless you maybe believe in reincarnation?


I think you are beating a dead horse.
Here are the past efforts.....



https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/what-they-thinking-313045/?highlight=masks 333 posts


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/covid-19-a-312888/?highlight=masks 96 posts

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/current-events-news-541/dr-mercola-holidays-covid-such-important-reminder-312985/?highlight=masks 56 posts

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/search.php?searchid=18739096 205 posts


:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[NoMoSno]

I first heard about aerosols lingering in the air from the CDC.

CDC Says Coronavirus Might Be Adrift in Indoor Air - The New York Times (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/05/health/cdc-coronavirus-airborne-indoor-air.html)
So are you wearing goggles also?

[Pairadocs]

Why, do you want to get one of these minimum wage employees in trouble? Just wear your mask and stay away from people.

Or .... if you don't like to go, or are not allowed by your doctor, etc. to go, into a place where all are NOT masked, what about.... do NOT go on in ? This applies to the bank, the school, the rec center, or Publix. Simple ? If it is personally, PERSONALLY threatening to YOU (don't worry about other people, worry about YOU), then do not frequent those places. If you feel more comfortable outside, do outside things, if you don't feel completely safe outside either, stay in your own house and do not let anyone else in, use inst-cart, have meds delivered, order clothing, shoes, Christmas presents on line and have mailed or use curb side pickup. But the endless/useless discussions about what OTHER people should do, or WHO should wear a mask at WHICH rec center is just on the border of insanity. Maybe passing information on there that might be helpful to others would be a good idea. Things like: Went to El Santiago rec center yesterday, they don't wear masks there (so a person who wants to play pool could be aware and go to another), or forming fall pickle-ball teams, masks NOT required, Base ball card collectors are meeting again at _____ rec center, be aware if you want to come our club does require masking ! Things like this would be HELPFUL, and, it would (hopefully) stop all those on either "side" of this to STOP telling others to do what they think or believe ! Adults ? We are a mature, educated, experienced community... or so they say !

[jimjamuser]

I saw an interview on TV the other day that made my mouth drop open in disbelief. An ICU nurse said that she has had patients, sick with Covid, come off a ventilator and say that they do not believe they were sick with Covid because they truly believe this pandemic is a hoax. She was in near tears explaining how overworked she and her colleagues are and trying their best to save the lives of these people. There is just something very wrong about this. I was aghast listening to her. People can be such fools.
Just shows the strength of propaganda. We must be underestimating its influence. Social media has math models designed to KEEP you in front of your screen for long periods of time. You get slowly pushed toward like-thinking users. Then you get propagandized and even radicalized. There is little diversity of thinking. Like everything else, social media has an upside and a downside. We get wedged into groups like mask wearers and non-mask wearers.

[jimjamuser]

SO the Villages is violating everything that you believe and yet have hardly any virus related deaths(compared to everywhere else). Go figure. And you believe it is due to "LUCK?" What's luck got to do with your "science?" I am not denying the existence of luck, but I am denying the absolutes of "science."
True so far. I hope it continues!

[Pairadocs]

Look up confirmation bias. I don't believe all, even capitalized, is strictly accurate.

Other possible reasons for the large percentage in the US:
- Not the highest ratio in the world (top 10? maybe)
- Higher population density in areas of the US that are spiking
- Mis-steps in the beginning (NY nursing homes among others)
- No lockdowns (I don't want to live in a country with police on every corner asking for my papers if I leave my house)
- Poor counting in some countries
- Generally obstinate
- Too many "experts" demanding something today then something different tomorrow
- Fake news (from all sides) driving a lack of compliance (and common sense)
- US love of freedom - Don't Tread on Me - Just leave me the h**l alone

And even more can be added. You probably realize how easily one can manipulate stats without changing any FACT (just sorting on different variables of the study, etc. etc.) and publish them to reinforce your original hypothesis (learned that little trick in grad school research, without ever lying, you can publish your data in the most advantageous way to support your hypothesis. Give me your data, I'll show you how to display it without being nefarious or unprincipled. Also, have you noticed how (some) people on here seem to actually believe statements such as "ALL experts agree that......." and so on. Most certainly they do not (example resent research on the use of NON medical cotton masks in marine corps basic training barracks, the Danish research (one of the largest projects thus far) that showed NO protection to the person wearing the little cotton fabric mask and inconclusive if it protects OTHER from the virus, "possibly" from wet droplets of a sneeze, possibly for a bacteria, but not evidence of protection from covid ! Greatest benefit, gives frightened individuals a SLIGHT reduction of psychological anxiety, even from just the act of donning the mask before going out, but, it does not come close to the damage from the LONG STANDING stress and anxiety of living in an environment, such as a big city in India or Nepal where masks are required to for "normal" breathing due to the pollution. Not "against" masks, but this false sense of doing something as "protection" can be very harmful in a number of ways.

[jimjamuser]

I think you are beating a dead horse.
Here are the past efforts.....



https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/what-they-thinking-313045/?highlight=masks 333 posts


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/covid-19-a-312888/?highlight=masks 96 posts

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/current-events-news-541/dr-mercola-holidays-covid-such-important-reminder-312985/?highlight=masks 56 posts

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/search.php?searchid=18739096 205 posts


:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:
Who IS Dr. Mercola - the Q doctor? I have never heard his name mentioned anywhere but on this forum? DR. Atlas is a joke. Maybe they share the same office in the Q-building?

[coffeebean]

U.S. hospitals were given monetary incentive to label deaths as Covid caused.

That's the part they forget to mention in all of those fancy dancy statistics.

Statistics aside......have you seen the health care professionals, nurses mostly, in tears or near tears in sheer exhaustion begging people to PLEASE comply with the CDC guidelines. That is a sad state of affairs when Americans simply do not care what is happening to our health care workers. My heart breaks for these people who can not get a handle of the death and dying they see and have to deal with every day. Health care professionals are retiring early or just quitting because they can not stand the stress anymore. This is our America people. Let's do our part to not overwhelm our hospitals. I'm not just talking about our bubble here in The Villages; I'm referring to people everywhere in America.

[Pairadocs]

Then WHY are ALL the medical professionals on TV BEGGING US people to wear their masks? And how else can anyone explain why the US with its under 5% of the world's population be CAUSING 19 % of the world's DEATHS. I am thinking that not wearing masks is causing ALL the out --proportioned US DEATHS.

"ALL" are not, far from it, just take the time to look up the experience, education, and credentials of some of the medical and bio people who ARE trying to get people to realize the the weave of cotton or synthetic fibers of fabrics are NOT going to protect them or the public from the MICROBES penetrating no matter how many coffee filters you stuff behind it thinking nothing can get to you ! What you don't see, and have to do your own research, are the many recognized experts that know this is a campaign to keep the panic down.

[jimjamuser]

So are you wearing goggles also?
I wear safety glasses when I have to be indoors around many people. There are YouTube videos showing droplets coming from breathing, yelling, and sneezing. You can SEE it with your own EYES. So, STOP with the denying.

[Pairadocs]

If what you say about compliance is true, then we would not have seat belts in our cars or speed bumps on our roads. People will comply with lawful orders, when those doing the ordering at the top grow up and give the US the correct messages. there is a reason that the US has 19% of the world's DEATHS. I know the reason. Do you?

I believer seat belts are placed in an automobile as a reminder to use, they are there, why not use them. Most of the time, I do. Some times I do forget. Of course I know that could be the very time I get hit. I might be killed ! I might not, maybe just get a head bump ? But, it would be because I just forgot.... and left my garage.

[Pairadocs]

Oh my! The sky is falling.
It's pathetic that some folks NEED a gov nanny to tell them how to live and then they need to get into everyone else's business because the gov nanny told them how to think.
I think you all should wear tin foil hats so that the radiation from the power towers don't mess up your minds. Ooops, too late. :MOJE_whot:

I am not a "disbeliever" but my goodness, have you ever heard anything like some of the things presented on here as "fact"... sky is falling is right. This is a serious illness, but the depth of the fear it is instilling in our community is really beyond what you would expect from a relatively affluent, educated, and mature community of intelligent experienced people. Even health professionals are not as emotional and irrational as so many in our own community.

[jimjamuser]

Statistics aside......have you seen the health care professionals, nurses mostly, in tears or near tears in sheer exhaustion begging people to PLEASE comply with the CDC guidelines. That is a sad state of affairs when Americans simply do not care what is happening to our health care workers. My heart breaks for these people who can not get a handle of the death and dying they see and have to deal with every day. Health care professionals are retiring early or just quitting because they can not stand the stress anymore. This is our America people. Let's do our part to not overwhelm our hospitals. I'm not just talking about our bubble here in The Villages; I'm referring to people everywhere in America.
What you are saying is born out by the stats that I said about the US 5% population and 19% CV deaths in the world. When stats and real-world experience line up, together they produce TRUTH! In truth, the US is overall, a cesspool of CV and a cesspool of purposeful misinformation.

[Joe V.]

Statistics aside......have you seen the health care professionals, nurses mostly, in tears or near tears in sheer exhaustion begging people to PLEASE comply with the CDC guidelines. That is a sad state of affairs when Americans simply do not care what is happening to our health care workers. My heart breaks for these people who can not get a handle of the death and dying they see and have to deal with every day. Health care professionals are retiring early or just quitting because they can not stand the stress anymore. This is our America people. Let's do our part to not overwhelm our hospitals. I'm not just talking about our bubble here in The Villages; I'm referring to people everywhere in America.

No one knows more about working to sheer exhaustion then a combat medic. He also knows he may not make it through the day. My wife was an ER nurse for 30 years. Sure she came home exhausted and stressed. She never blamed the diseases or circumstances she worked under for it. She knew she was going home after her shifts. You sound like all ER nurses do is deal with a virus. The hospitals are not overwhelmed. BTW: the nurses are paid very well for what they do. Stop spreading panic and lies.

[Byte1]

You all can breath easier now. An interview is currently going on with the NEW reign and a mask mandate for all and a mandate for EVERYONE to have a vaccination is in the imminent future. No worries now. You all can become just like the USSR commie informers that call the law whenever you see a mask violation or hear of someone that did not get their shots. You all can breath easier now. Wipe your tears and rejoice because you are saved.

[jimjamuser]

"ALL" are not, far from it, just take the time to look up the experience, education, and credentials of some of the medical and bio people who ARE trying to get people to realize the the weave of cotton or synthetic fibers of fabrics are NOT going to protect them or the public from the MICROBES penetrating no matter how many coffee filters you stuff behind it thinking nothing can get to you ! What you don't see, and have to do your own research, are the many recognized experts that know this is a campaign to keep the panic down.
And maybe I know things that others may NOT know! Let me say that there needed to be more panic leading to action back in Feb when Bob Woodward was doing in-person research.

[Number 10 GI]

Where do you get this nonsense?

Uh, common sense. Nothing is 100% effective.

[Number 10 GI]

You made a true statement. Masks SLOW THE SPREAD of the virus and coupled with social distancing, will do what is expected of that mitigation process. All we can expect is for our risk to be minimized and keep the virus from exploding in our cities and overwhelm our health care systems.

Wear a mask in public indoor spaces and outdoors when social distancing can not be maintained. Always keep your distance from others.

Thank you. The point I was making is that nothing is 100% effective and for someone to try and convince people that a mask is just that is dangerous and unsafe. I wear a mask whenever I enter a store however I only go to shopping for groceries or other necessary items. I'm doing as much as possible to limit my possible exposure to the virus.

[Number 10 GI]

What type of mask were you wearing? How many layers? Filter too? Was it easy to breath through your mask?

I don't really remember, I use cloth masks and the disposable masks sold in the drug stores.

[Number 10 GI]

Guaranteed, that if 90% wore their masks 90% of the time that the US would be back to "normal" like South Korea and New Zealand. The US citizens are too stubborn for their own good. They are like "herding cats". Hear kitty-kitty please, please wear your mask, please you stupid pu**y!

In those countries they also had draconian lock downs that had far more effect for a low infection rate than the use of a mask.

[Number 10 GI]

It's not unhealthy to wear a mask for long durations, if necessary. I'm a retired health care professional and we wore masks for 10 hrs - 12 hrs a day depending on the length of our shift.

I've been in a lot of hospitals over the years as a patient and visitor. I saw very few medical staff wearing masks even in the ICU. Only since the Covid virus have I seen widespread use of masks by medical personnel. Also did you ever check your oxygen level while you were wearing a mask? I seriously doubt it. Medical personnel are for the most part younger people in reasonably good health vs older people with existing health problems or just older bodies that aren't functioning at optimal levels. Does it not make sense that an older person may have a lower oxygen level while wearing a mask?

[coffeebean]

Please read the article.

I read the article. I stand by my original comment.

[coffeebean]

Are you a cashier?

No, not a cashier.

[Bill14564]

I read the article. I stand by my original comment.

Okay

[coffeebean]

So are you wearing goggles also?


Always wear eye glasses, no goggles.

[Topspinmo]

I think you are beating a dead horse.
Here are the past efforts.....



https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/what-they-thinking-313045/?highlight=masks 333 posts


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/covid-19-a-312888/?highlight=masks 96 posts

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/current-events-news-541/dr-mercola-holidays-covid-such-important-reminder-312985/?highlight=masks 56 posts

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/search.php?searchid=18739096 205 posts


:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:


Obvious the horse not dead yet, somebody keeps reviving the poor horse. The horse will make come back again and again... bong, bong, bong.

[coffeebean]

No one knows more about working to sheer exhaustion then a combat medic. He also knows he may not make it through the day. My wife was an ER nurse for 30 years. Sure she came home exhausted and stressed. She never blamed the diseases or circumstances she worked under for it. She knew she was going home after her shifts. You sound like all ER nurses do is deal with a virus. The hospitals are not overwhelmed. BTW: the nurses are paid very well for what they do. Stop spreading panic and lies.

I speak of what I see on TV with my own eyes. I speak of interviews I have seen with my own eyes. I am not spreading panic and lies. I am spreading current news.

[Number 10 GI]

I speak of what I see on TV with my own eyes. I speak of interviews I have seen with my own eyes. I am not spreading panic and lies. I am spreading current news.

You don't think that the media doesn't cherry pick the interviewees to get the responses they desire to support the narrative they are pushing?

[NoMoSno]

I wear safety glasses when I have to be indoors around many people. There are YouTube videos showing droplets coming from breathing, yelling, and sneezing. You can SEE it with your own EYES. So, STOP with the denying.
What in my question, shows I am denying anything?
Unless your "safety glasses" completely seal your eyes, they do nothing for you. So, STOP pretending.

[coffeebean]

You don't think that the media doesn't cherry pick the interviewees to get the responses they desire to support the narrative they are pushing?

Honestly, no.

[jimjamuser]

In those countries they also had draconian lock downs that had far more effect for a low infection rate than the use of a mask.
Yes, for South Korea. No way lockdowns in New Zealand _ just smart people listening to their Scientists!

[jimjamuser]

What in my question, shows I am denying anything?
Unless your "safety glasses" completely seal your eyes, they do nothing for you. So, STOP pretending.
Perfection need NOT be the enemy of the good!

[blueash]

I've been in a lot of hospitals over the years as a patient and visitor. I saw very few medical staff wearing masks even in the ICU. Only since the Covid virus have I seen widespread use of masks by medical personnel. Also did you ever check your oxygen level while you were wearing a mask? I seriously doubt it. Medical personnel are for the most part younger people in reasonably good health vs older people with existing health problems or just older bodies that aren't functioning at optimal levels. Does it not make sense that an older person may have a lower oxygen level while wearing a mask?

The above is one in a string of comments that began with a claim that a person was seen at their doctor and was hypoxic and after a couple breaths without a mask was then normal with the oxygen saturation going from high 80's to high 90's Further the nurse reportedly said she is seeing this frequently.

This social media claim has been studied and refuted as a significant problem. No study can prove it didn't happen once. Or that the nurse errantly applied the oximeter giving wrong numbers. But a study of elderly adults wearing non-medical cloth masks was done where multiple oxygen measurements were taken over three hours and there were ZERO persons who had hypoxia from wearing a mask. Peripheral Oxygen Saturation in Older Persons Wearing Nonmedical Face Masks in Community Settings | Geriatrics | JAMA | JAMA Network (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2772655) The study looked for a 2% drop in oxygen saturation. It didn't find one. The poster here claimed a 10% drop relieved by a couple breaths with no supplemental oxygen.

Sorry, but an oxygen saturation of 89 will never go up to 98 with a couple breaths within a few seconds. Measurement error or fabrication.

[justjim]

Wow! Sure glad we got the wearing of a mask squared away.

[Number 10 GI]

Yes, for South Korea. No way lockdowns in New Zealand _ just smart people listening to their Scientists!

A five second search shows that New Zealand locked down for 19 weeks.

[Number 10 GI]

Honestly, no.

Really! You believe everything the media tells you?

[Pairadocs]

Aerosol lingering is not reported as true by the cdc ,it is media driven. The “death clouds are fiction’” masks are only required if you are unable to maintain six feet distance.

I've also been doing a bit of research on that; difficult to do as just so many journalist type stories you really have to dig down to search out actual research studies, but yes, "aerosol effect" does NOT linger and wait to infect victims. Conclusions of studies done in such locations as super markets showed that even if an infected person sneezed in an isle, the chances of the next person coming down that isle passing thru a concentration great enough to cause risk was extremely low and those were studies using < > .05 !

[Number 10 GI]

The above is one in a string of comments that began with a claim that a person was seen at their doctor and was hypoxic and after a couple breaths without a mask was then normal with the oxygen saturation going from high 80's to high 90's Further the nurse reportedly said she is seeing this frequently.

This social media claim has been studied and refuted as a significant problem. No study can prove it didn't happen once. Or that the nurse errantly applied the oximeter giving wrong numbers. But a study of elderly adults wearing non-medical cloth masks was done where multiple oxygen measurements were taken over three hours and there were ZERO persons who had hypoxia from wearing a mask. Peripheral Oxygen Saturation in Older Persons Wearing Nonmedical Face Masks in Community Settings | Geriatrics | JAMA | JAMA Network (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2772655) The study looked for a 2% drop in oxygen saturation. It didn't find one. The poster here claimed a 10% drop relieved by a couple breaths with no supplemental oxygen.

Sorry, but an oxygen saturation of 89 will never go up to 98 with a couple breaths within a few seconds. Measurement error or fabrication.

So you are calling me and the nurse liars?

[Pairadocs]

And maybe I know things that others may NOT know! Let me say that there needed to be more panic leading to action back in Feb when Bob Woodward was doing in-person research.

True, it is very difficult (if only the internet available as a tool) to really drill down on this....

[Pairadocs]

Just shows the strength of propaganda. We must be underestimating its influence. Social media has math models designed to KEEP you in front of your screen for long periods of time. You get slowly pushed toward like-thinking users. Then you get propagandized and even radicalized. There is little diversity of thinking. Like everything else, social media has an upside and a downside. We get wedged into groups like mask wearers and non-mask wearers.

I suspect you have some background in psychology. You hit EVERY important point, especially the subtle ways the minds of people can be manipulated (as your example of maskers, no maskers, democrat, republican) and slowly but surely they are controlled (herded is a great common term) toward one psychological mind set or another. The really insidious part of the on screen social media addiction is that the anonymity itself REINFORCES the participants and yes, personalities can be changed and since posting is a one way communication (even when someone comes slamming back in reproach) it is still a very different process than face to face conversations which can add infinitely to one's own knowledge, but also gives you the opportunity to consider other people's opinions, expertise, knowledge; face to face input keeps the mind more "flexible", and the personality (ego, subconscious) in check, more sociable, and more open to learning !

[Advogado]

I've also been doing a bit of research on that; difficult to do as just so many journalist type stories you really have to dig down to search out actual research studies, but yes, "aerosol effect" does NOT linger and wait to infect victims. Conclusions of studies done in such locations as super markets showed that even if an infected person sneezed in an isle, the chances of the next person coming down that isle passing thru a concentration great enough to cause risk was extremely low and those were studies using < > .05 !

.05 is not a comforting rate of infections. If a airplane crashed out of 20 flights, would you fly?

[biker1]

0.05 is a typical significance used in statistical hypothesis testing in the biological sciences. Don't conflate it with engineering reliability requirements.

.05 is not a comforting rate of infections. If a airplane crashed out of 20 flights, would you fly?

[Two Bills]

Is it true that a gym or grocery store is a sterile environment? Is it true that homemade cloth masks are sterile and as high a quality as medical grade masks? Is it safe for a cashier to be wearing/touching/adjusting a non sterile, non medical grade cloth mask all day long while scanning merchandise that has been touched by multiple hands?

Is it true what they say about Dixie?:icon_wink:

[Neils]

Stay safe
Just wear your mask and limit indoor exposure in all public places. Only go inside if required and stay for shortest time possible.

[cheweycat]

Required? Not in the vernacular of the The Villages!

[Waltdisney4life]

5 minutes on google or good morning America does not make someone on expert. When a person quotes experts with words might or could shows that the so called experts have no clue.

[Dana1963]

The above is one in a string of comments that began with a claim that a person was seen at their doctor and was hypoxic and after a couple breaths without a mask was then normal with the oxygen saturation going from high 80's to high 90's Further the nurse reportedly said she is seeing this frequently.

This social media claim has been studied and refuted as a significant problem. No study can prove it didn't happen once. Or that the nurse errantly applied the oximeter giving wrong numbers. But a study of elderly adults wearing non-medical cloth masks was done where multiple oxygen measurements were taken over three hours and there were ZERO persons who had hypoxia from wearing a mask. Peripheral Oxygen Saturation in Older Persons Wearing Nonmedical Face Masks in Community Settings | Geriatrics | JAMA | JAMA Network (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2772655) The study looked for a 2% drop in oxygen saturation. It didn't find one. The poster here claimed a 10% drop relieved by a couple breaths with no supplemental oxygen.

Sorry, but an oxygen saturation of 89 will never go up to 98 with a couple breaths within a few seconds. Measurement error or fabrication.
This past week in THE VILLAGES Tuesday 15, Wednesday 13, Thursday 13 highest consistent testing to date. Did we have a spreader event? Don't wish anyone to be hospitalized. Do we have contract tracing in The Villages?

[dhdallas]

That is what the rec center employees are doing at the sport's pool at Colony Rec Center. I can see the employee putting on the mask as I approach the desk that is set up outside the locker rooms. Works for me. I guess I'd be fine with it inside also but....there is a chance of aerosols lingering in the air of an indoor space if any employees are asymptomatic carriers of the virus. It would be better if the employees kept their masks on and take breaks every once in a while. Isn't that what the employees in our grocery stores and other public indoor buildings have to do?

"lingering in the air..." So many people have bought into the media's scare-mongering, it would be funny were it not so sad. As a retired ER RN & paramedic who worked through the AIDS & H1N1 time periods, we professionals did NOT take even half the precautions that the public afraid of COVID do. Common sense ruled the day. COVID is only "deadly" for a fraction of a percentage of the general population unless you have underlying health problems. Then wear a mask and social distance when around other people. I am in my late 60's and have been exposed to known tested persons with active COVID (as in sleeping next to my infected wife), never wore a mask, and never developed any symptoms (she only complained of an occasional cough & mild diarrhea).

News outlets thrive on stories of death & violence. "If it bleeds, it leads" is the age old axiom. One would think that the Black Death that occurred in the 1300's was upon us! The stress, anxiety, lonleiness & loss of income caused by the fear of COVID is far more damaging than the virus itself.

We need to enjoy the time we have left on this earth, so lets use some common sense and stop living in fear!

[Gulfcoast]

"lingering in the air..." So many people have bought into the media's scare-mongering, it would be funny were it not so sad. As a retired ER RN & paramedic who worked through the AIDS & H1N1 time periods, we professionals did NOT take even half the precautions that the public afraid of COVID do. Common sense ruled the day. COVID is only "deadly" for a fraction of a percentage of the general population unless you have underlying health problems. Then wear a mask and social distance when around other people. I am in my late 60's and have been exposed to known tested persons with active COVID (as in sleeping next to my infected wife), never wore a mask, and never developed any symptoms (she only complained of an occasional cough & mild diarrhea).

News outlets thrive on stories of death & violence. "If it bleeds, it leads" is the age old axiom. One would think that the Black Death that occurred in the 1300's was upon us! The stress, anxiety, lonleiness & loss of income caused by the fear of COVID is far more damaging than the virus itself.

We need to enjoy the time we have left on this earth, so lets use some common sense and stop living in fear!

Excellent post. If I could rep you 1000 times, I would.

Unfortunately, people are tuning into programs like CNN and falling for the hysteria. It's sad.

[jimjamuser]

In those countries they also had draconian lock downs that had far more effect for a low infection rate than the use of a mask.
Actually, in South Korea, New Zealand, Australia, and Japan it was NOT "DRACONIAN". There are many factors related to the differences in the society of the US and these more SUCCESSFUL countries at handling a Plague. The MAIN one is their citizens have a positive and confident attitude of a WILLINGNESS to COOPERATE with their government's CV effort. Whereas, the US of A has citizens with a STUBBORNNESS, inflexible, and uncooperative attitude to our government's CV effort. Citizens of those 4 non-US countries have great TRUST in their governments and what their governments tell them. They TRUST their leadership and their government mechanisms and laws. In New Zealand, they love their Prime Minister. The US, when it comes to a National emergency like this CV Plague, could be rightfully be called the DIS-United States. WE have a jumble of states competing for money, power, and favors from the Central government. US citizens were NOT told the truth about CV, early on, when it was 1st recognized as a MAJOR health problem( in Feb.). It became a Political football instead of an emergency to be turned over to the Epidemiologists for their judgment, and direction. Then they should have been given the POWER to solve the problem - the Political football was dropped, fumbled.

The US became a case study for Medical Scientists about what NOT to do!

[Gulfcoast]

The CDC just reversed itself and said that schools should NOT be shutting down. Schools should be open and children should be in class.

[jimjamuser]

The above is one in a string of comments that began with a claim that a person was seen at their doctor and was hypoxic and after a couple breaths without a mask was then normal with the oxygen saturation going from high 80's to high 90's Further the nurse reportedly said she is seeing this frequently.

This social media claim has been studied and refuted as a significant problem. No study can prove it didn't happen once. Or that the nurse errantly applied the oximeter giving wrong numbers. But a study of elderly adults wearing non-medical cloth masks was done where multiple oxygen measurements were taken over three hours and there were ZERO persons who had hypoxia from wearing a mask. Peripheral Oxygen Saturation in Older Persons Wearing Nonmedical Face Masks in Community Settings | Geriatrics | JAMA | JAMA Network (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2772655) The study looked for a 2% drop in oxygen saturation. It didn't find one. The poster here claimed a 10% drop relieved by a couple breaths with no supplemental oxygen.

Sorry, but an oxygen saturation of 89 will never go up to 98 with a couple breaths within a few seconds. Measurement error or fabrication.
Great post! Well written and informative, such clarity. Nice to know that there are so many thoughtful and clever people in TV Land. Impressive!

[jimjamuser]

I suspect you have some background in psychology. You hit EVERY important point, especially the subtle ways the minds of people can be manipulated (as your example of maskers, no maskers, democrat, republican) and slowly but surely they are controlled (herded is a great common term) toward one psychological mind set or another. The really insidious part of the on screen social media addiction is that the anonymity itself REINFORCES the participants and yes, personalities can be changed and since posting is a one way communication (even when someone comes slamming back in reproach) it is still a very different process than face to face conversations which can add infinitely to one's own knowledge, but also gives you the opportunity to consider other people's opinions, expertise, knowledge; face to face input keeps the mind more "flexible", and the personality (ego, subconscious) in check, more sociable, and more open to learning !
I agree with all the content in this post - very well written and informative! Myself, I have taken and enjoyed, probably more psychology and sociology courses that the average. It builds a good base of thought to take into other classes.

[graciegirl]

"lingering in the air..." So many people have bought into the media's scare-mongering, it would be funny were it not so sad. As a retired ER RN & paramedic who worked through the AIDS & H1N1 time periods, we professionals did NOT take even half the precautions that the public afraid of COVID do. Common sense ruled the day. COVID is only "deadly" for a fraction of a percentage of the general population unless you have underlying health problems. Then wear a mask and social distance when around other people. I am in my late 60's and have been exposed to known tested persons with active COVID (as in sleeping next to my infected wife), never wore a mask, and never developed any symptoms (she only complained of an occasional cough & mild diarrhea).

News outlets thrive on stories of death & violence. "If it bleeds, it leads" is the age old axiom. One would think that the Black Death that occurred in the 1300's was upon us! The stress, anxiety, lonleiness & loss of income caused by the fear of COVID is far more damaging than the virus itself.

We need to enjoy the time we have left on this earth, so lets use some common sense and stop living in fear!

I agree with some parts of this post but not others. I cannot tell you how I personally respect all of the nurses and first responders I know and those who have cared for my family and me over time. However, sometimes they get it wrong.

Covid-19 was first explained to be very contagious, then slowly as the world learned more about it, we found a number of qualifiers for it's contagion. I am sure you have read them too from valid sources.

I have avoided indoor activity.

I think that within 12 weeks, most of the people who live in The Villages will be offered a Vaccine that is 90% effective, and that has been tested by over 70,000 people. Governor DiSantis says that no one will be required to take it.

I have been following this closely, as I am sure you have too, and I am being very picky with the sources of my news. We all know that one doctor is NOT as good as another and one Research Facility is not as ethical as another.

I have great hope that very soon the worst will be behind us and I will be able to hug people and paint with my friends at Laurel Manor without a second thought.

[Gulfcoast]

I took a lot of psychology and child development classes when I was in college. I am glad that the CDC has FINALLY reversed their stance on school closures.

I believe that the experts are finding that all of this social distancing and self isolation is doing FAR more harm than good. First do no harm...

[graciegirl]

I took a lot of psychology and child development classes when I was in college. I am glad that the CDC has FINALLY reversed their stance on school closures.

I believe that the experts are finding that all of this social distancing and self isolation is doing FAR more harm than good. First do no harm...

I no longer have children to protect. If mine were little, I would hesitate, because one was born with Cardiological and Pulmonary factors that would put her at high risk, like the elderly. Children are not affected as seriously, from what I've read but...One would bring it to the other who would be affected seriously.

The vaccine will slow this damned virus very soon.

I am so happy with THAT news.

Right now, we can celebrate that all reading these argumentative posts are STILL ALIVE.

I shelter now so that when I am again together with those I treasure, no one will be missing.

[Gulfcoast]

I no longer have children to protect. If mine were little, I would hesitate, because the other was born with Cardiological and Pulmonary factors that would put her at high risk, like the elderly. Children are not affected as seriously, from what I've read but...One would bring it to the other who would be affected seriously.

The vaccine will slow this damned virus very soon.

I am so happy with THAT news.

Right now, we can celebrate that all reading these argumentative posts are STILL ALIVE.

I shelter now so that when I am again together with those I treasure, no one will be missing.

I am hoping and praying that the vaccine will be released soon. The isolation is having seriously adverse consequences in the elderly, too. I know from your posts that you are still getting out to the stores and whatnot. Some elderly people have not left their homes since this whole thing began which is not healthy. Their cognitive and physical declines are substantial and extremely worrisome. People need fresh air, sunshine and to be around other people.

This vaccine can not come soon enough in my own inexpert opinion.

[jimjamuser]

This past week in THE VILLAGES Tuesday 15, Wednesday 13, Thursday 13 highest consistent testing to date. Did we have a spreader event? Don't wish anyone to be hospitalized. Do we have contract tracing in The Villages?
That is a good question about contact tracing. I feel that MIGHT(?) work in The Villages, but only now and for a short time because The Villages is for some reason a lucky outlier for CV compared to the overall US. Which, yesterday recorded an all-time high of 193,000 cases of deadly CV. I feel that when most all parts of the US are one big "hot spot", that contact tracing is NOT possible. I feel that, unfortunately, the contract tracing method is like "closing the barn door after the horse has left the barn"! The overall US lost that capability around March or the 1st wave hitting us.

Here is something to watch out for in the near future.......For some reason unknown to me, Canada celebrates Thanksgiving several weeks earlier than we in the US do. If you pull up a graph of Canada's cases, you will find that 2 to 3 weeks after THEIR Thanksgiving they had a BIG spike in Cases! This gives a proof-positive visual example of why indoor gatherings of non-regular household people can be a LARGE spreader of CV cases in national aggregate. It also applies as a warning to TV landers to NOT go over to their neighbor's house for dinner or drinks. And to NOT go to bars with or without masks. Overall it proves that socialization indoors IS dangerous to yourself and your friends. Don't do it!

You can see this graph with your own eyes and it is logical (and has nothing WHATSOEVER to do with DRACONIAN countries). You either take this fact as a hint or you put it out of your mind and choose risk, pain, and possible DEATH. Another example to think about is, why do Wisconsin and their neighboring states have about 36% positive cases? My answer is - the popularity of indoor bars. There is little to do outside in Fall and Winter in Wisconsin, and the Dakotas. I hate to say this but churches are INDOOR gatherings of diverse, non-nuclear family type people. I wonder if any social scientist has studied the effect of high numbers of churches in various rural and urban settings?

[jimjamuser]

"lingering in the air..." So many people have bought into the media's scare-mongering, it would be funny were it not so sad. As a retired ER RN & paramedic who worked through the AIDS & H1N1 time periods, we professionals did NOT take even half the precautions that the public afraid of COVID do. Common sense ruled the day. COVID is only "deadly" for a fraction of a percentage of the general population unless you have underlying health problems. Then wear a mask and social distance when around other people. I am in my late 60's and have been exposed to known tested persons with active COVID (as in sleeping next to my infected wife), never wore a mask, and never developed any symptoms (she only complained of an occasional cough & mild diarrhea).

News outlets thrive on stories of death & violence. "If it bleeds, it leads" is the age old axiom. One would think that the Black Death that occurred in the 1300's was upon us! The stress, anxiety, lonleiness & loss of income caused by the fear of COVID is far more damaging than the virus itself.

We need to enjoy the time we have left on this earth, so lets use some common sense and stop living in fear!
That advice might(?) be good for a situation where risk is constant. Then people can better evaluate THEIR particular risk preference. But, we now have a situation that is RAPIDLY increasing in risks (namely 193,000 cases yesterday). The RISK is going up TOO rapidly for US citizens to wrap their heads around. And emotions and leadership misinformation have ADDED a large component to the uncertainty and confusion of the US public. It is a bad situation and it is getting worse!

[jimjamuser]

So you are calling me and the nurse liars?
He said that there was confusion, not lies. Give the man SOME credit for shedding much factual light on this bantered about topic often seen here on this forum.

[jimjamuser]

I took a lot of psychology and child development classes when I was in college. I am glad that the CDC has FINALLY reversed their stance on school closures.

I believe that the experts are finding that all of this social distancing and self isolation is doing FAR more harm than good. First do no harm...
You are correct up to a point. That point, in my opinion, would be around 5th grade. YOUNG CHILDREN for some unknown (?) reason may have the CV but be asymptomatic AND not SPREAD it. Now, remember, adults are quite different. They can get it easily (about 50% in the Dakotas) and they can spread it easily. And it is serious! The Dakotas and that area are filling up their hospitals and their staffs are exhausted and catching CV.

That is why teachers (ADULTS) are deadly afraid to be in schools (indoor air problems). Nurses in Philadelphia are on strike. This IS all serious and unprecedented! I can NOT dismiss these facts and blame these facts on CNN. That is just bizzaro!

[jimjamuser]

I am hoping and praying that the vaccine will be released soon. The isolation is having seriously adverse consequences in the elderly, too. I know from your posts that you are still getting out to the stores and whatnot. Some elderly people have not left their homes since this whole thing began which is not healthy. Their cognitive and physical declines are substantial and extremely worrisome. People need fresh air, sunshine and to be around other people.

This vaccine can not come soon enough in my own inexpert opinion.
Dr. Michael Olsterholm said the vaccine will LIKELY be available around June or July to regular people. You can Google that! He has been right all along about CV predictions. Take that to the Google and CV BANK!

[Dana1963]

Great post! Well written and informative, such clarity. Nice to know that there are so many thoughtful and clever people in TV Land. Impressive!
It takes approximately 45 seconds for blood to flow through the heart and return. Upon my last Dr appointment sitting in the waiting room with so-called minor COPD, wearing a mask for 30 min my blood oxygen level is 99%.

[graciegirl]

Dr. Michael Olsterholm said the vaccine will LIKELY be available around June or July to regular people. You can Google that! He has been right all along about CV predictions. Take that to the Google and CV BANK!

Now I have to look up who is Dr. Michael Olsterholm. I haven't heard of him.

I am keeping my fingers crossed they will let our daughter Helene have the vaccine too when we get it. She is 55 and has Williams Syndrome.

[Pairadocs]

"lingering in the air..." So many people have bought into the media's scare-mongering, it would be funny were it not so sad. As a retired ER RN & paramedic who worked through the AIDS & H1N1 time periods, we professionals did NOT take even half the precautions that the public afraid of COVID do. Common sense ruled the day. COVID is only "deadly" for a fraction of a percentage of the general population unless you have underlying health problems. Then wear a mask and social distance when around other people. I am in my late 60's and have been exposed to known tested persons with active COVID (as in sleeping next to my infected wife), never wore a mask, and never developed any symptoms (she only complained of an occasional cough & mild diarrhea).

News outlets thrive on stories of death & violence. "If it bleeds, it leads" is the age old axiom. One would think that the Black Death that occurred in the 1300's was upon us! The stress, anxiety, lonleiness & loss of income caused by the fear of COVID is far more damaging than the virus itself.

We need to enjoy the time we have left on this earth, so lets use some common sense and stop living in fear!

When I read one of the VERY few posts such as yours, it is a breath of fresh air as the saying goes. I am not a health professional, but had enough university classes in some areas to really make me question what is happening to the minds of people in our community. People (and the cable TV) blasts 24.7 about staying with "science" and the "facts", and my mind is saying to ME: could the facts of science concerning how bacteria, viruses, microbes, etc. behave, act, and interact, since I was talking classes and tests in grad school in the 80's ? ? The same "lingering" in the air, almost laying in wait for a victim. I stopped reading this with my morning coffee for awhile, not because I disagreed with these folks, but seeing how desperately afraid so many of my friends and neighbors are really depressed me. So destructive to have so many so fearful for so many months. It would sure be in the interest of everyone's health, if our leaders, and even our friends and neighbors here would write the REAL (as opposed to made up "facts" that fit someone's personal opinion) facts. Have seen a relative of mine, 72, good general health, no chronic conditions, become nearly obsessive. Does absolutely nothing now, orders food on line, does not shop in stores, wears a mask when walking her dog, and uses Lysol wipes to wipe down every single can, box, package of food, and even wipes her mail. I know what people must be thinking but NO, this is a person who has been reliable, very practical, logical, and has never been a person who obsesses on health, visits doctors constantly, or had a cabinet that looks like a pharmacy. I know up close and personal that this is doing some very strange things to people. If only the media would encourage and uplift people, not my sugar coating it, but by giving some balance. Can't even watch TV without endless pictures of exhausted health care workers just breaking down and weeping and BEGGING people to do exactly what my relative has fallen into.... caution, common sense, of course, but what Y:bigbow::bigbow:OU wrote may help more people than you will ever know !

[graciegirl]

Dr. Michael Olsterholm said the vaccine will LIKELY be available around June or July to regular people. You can Google that! He has been right all along about CV predictions. Take that to the Google and CV BANK!

So. Dr. Michael Olsterholm appears to be picked for the next person in charge of the Pandemic in U.S.

He isn't an M.D.??

Dr's Fauci and Birx were M.D.s. with CDC. He lives in Minnesota.

Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH | CIDRAP (https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/about-us/cidrap-staff/michael-t-osterholm-phd-mph)

[CFrance]

So. Dr. Michael Olsterholm appears to be picked for the next person in charge of the Pandemic in U.S.

He isn't an M.D.??

Dr's Fauci and Birx were M.D.s. with CDC. He lives in Minnesota.

Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH | CIDRAP (https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/about-us/cidrap-staff/michael-t-osterholm-phd-mph)


He's a researcher. Not all researchers are MD's. Glad you edited out the part about him being in Wisconsin.



Michael Thomas Osterholm is an American epidemiologist, regents professor, and director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota.

[Gulfcoast]

You are correct up to a point. That point, in my opinion, would be around 5th grade. YOUNG CHILDREN for some unknown (?) reason may have the CV but be asymptomatic AND not SPREAD it. Now, remember, adults are quite different. They can get it easily (about 50% in the Dakotas) and they can spread it easily. And it is serious! The Dakotas and that area are filling up their hospitals and their staffs are exhausted and catching CV.

That is why teachers (ADULTS) are deadly afraid to be in schools (indoor air problems). Nurses in Philadelphia are on strike. This IS all serious and unprecedented! I can NOT dismiss these facts and blame these facts on CNN. That is just bizzaro!

The CDC has said that children K-12 should be back in school. And I am in solid agreement with that.

My own kids have been back in school, working, seeing friends, going to the beach, even taking trips out of state. It has been a high priority of my own to make sure that my own kids have not been isolated and limited during this very difficult year.

In Florida, parents have always had the option to choose distance learning or brick and mortar for their children. Some have opted to home school. Parents know what's best for their own kids. I think that is a solidly good policy.

[graciegirl]

He's a researcher. Not all researchers are MD's. Glad you edited out the part about him being in Wisconsin.



Michael Thomas Osterholm is an American epidemiologist, regents professor, and director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota.

And he is a PHD not an M.D.

As for why I often confuse the two states that are way up there North of Chicago. I have only been to Minnesota once. One has excellent cheese they talk about a lot and the other is considered to have a lot of "Nice" people.

I just expected the person in charge of the Pandemic to be an M.D. Now I will research that. Maybe I'm wrong. I know that having an M.D. after your name is not a universally accepted reason to extol a person. However I usually am very honoring of M.D.s. AND most researchers.

I listened to and respected both Dr's Fauci and Birx directions.

It won't matter a lot in a very short time. Thank God.

WE HAVE THE VACCINE!!!

[jimjamuser]

So. Dr. Michael Olsterholm appears to be picked for the next person in charge of the Pandemic in U.S.

He isn't an M.D.??

Dr's Fauci and Birx were M.D.s. with CDC. He lives in Minnesota.

Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH | CIDRAP (https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/about-us/cidrap-staff/michael-t-osterholm-phd-mph)
I see him all the time on the TV channels that I usually watch. His predictions on CV have been as or more accurate than that University of Washington group that does math modeling to predict the future behavior and amount of CV. Over a month ago Olsterholm predicted 200,000 cases by Jan1. He now says about 450,000 by March. And so does the U. of Wa. He is extremely sincere and intelligent! He worries about Thanksgiving.

[graciegirl]

I see him all the time on the TV channels that I usually watch. His predictions on CV have been as or more accurate than that University of Washington group that does math modeling to predict the future behavior and amount of CV. Over a month ago Olsterholm predicted 200,000 cases by Jan1. He now says about 450,000 by March. And so does the U. of Wa. He is extremely sincere and intelligent! He worries about Thanksgiving.

Me too. I worry about it too. It is my take that the cold weather is making the virus more contagious. We won't be having family or friends this year. Just the three of us.


Next year we will have company around our table....Whooooopppppppppppeeeeeeeee.

[coffeebean]

Really! You believe everything the media tells you?

Honestly, yes. Why would they lie? What media news sources do is put a slant on the news but they don't out and out lie. They also neglect (on purpose) to report a news story if it doesn't fit their agenda. That's how I see it anyway.

[coffeebean]

I've also been doing a bit of research on that; difficult to do as just so many journalist type stories you really have to dig down to search out actual research studies, but yes, "aerosol effect" does NOT linger and wait to infect victims. Conclusions of studies done in such locations as super markets showed that even if an infected person sneezed in an isle, the chances of the next person coming down that isle passing thru a concentration great enough to cause risk was extremely low and those were studies using < > .05 !

I have not heard this but thank you for posting. I surely hope this information is true.

[Kilmacowen]

So. Dr. Michael Olsterholm appears to be picked for the next person in charge of the Pandemic in U.S.

He isn't an M.D.??

Dr's Fauci and Birx were M.D.s. with CDC. He lives in Minnesota.

Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH | CIDRAP (https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/about-us/cidrap-staff/michael-t-osterholm-phd-mph)

Dr Fauci and Dr Birx are currently with the WH team, unless they get fired like everyone else. They will certainly transition to Biden's team.

[Number 10 GI]

He said that there was confusion, not lies. Give the man SOME credit for shedding much factual light on this bantered about topic often seen here on this forum.

Apparently you didn't read the last word in the last sentence, "fabricated". That is an accusation that I was lying.

[coffeebean]

5 minutes on google or good morning America does not make someone on expert. When a person quotes experts with words might or could shows that the so called experts have no clue.

I rely on the "experts". Those folks who have those letters at the end of their names such as MD certainly know more than I do. I rely on their knowledge to guide me. Thanks to all those who have that education and expertise.

[coffeebean]

"lingering in the air..." So many people have bought into the media's scare-mongering, it would be funny were it not so sad. As a retired ER RN & paramedic who worked through the AIDS & H1N1 time periods, we professionals did NOT take even half the precautions that the public afraid of COVID do. Common sense ruled the day. COVID is only "deadly" for a fraction of a percentage of the general population unless you have underlying health problems. Then wear a mask and social distance when around other people. I am in my late 60's and have been exposed to known tested persons with active COVID (as in sleeping next to my infected wife), never wore a mask, and never developed any symptoms (she only complained of an occasional cough & mild diarrhea).



News outlets thrive on stories of death & violence. "If it bleeds, it leads" is the age old axiom. One would think that the Black Death that occurred in the 1300's was upon us! The stress, anxiety, lonleiness & loss of income caused by the fear of COVID is far more damaging than the virus itself.

We need to enjoy the time we have left on this earth, so lets use some common sense and stop living in fear!
You really slept next to your infected wife? No mask when around her? Sorry, but I will not take any advice you have to offer. But that's just me. Hope you both will be fine.

[coffeebean]

Actually, in South Korea, New Zealand, Australia, and Japan it was NOT "DRACONIAN". There are many factors related to the differences in the society of the US and these more SUCCESSFUL countries at handling a Plague. The MAIN one is their citizens have a positive and confident attitude of a WILLINGNESS to COOPERATE with their government's CV effort. Whereas, the US of A has citizens with a STUBBORNNESS, inflexible, and uncooperative attitude to our government's CV effort. Citizens of those 4 non-US countries have great TRUST in their governments and what their governments tell them. They TRUST their leadership and their government mechanisms and laws. In New Zealand, they love their Prime Minister. The US, when it comes to a National emergency like this CV Plague, could be rightfully be called the DIS-United States. WE have a jumble of states competing for money, power, and favors from the Central government. US citizens were NOT told the truth about CV, early on, when it was 1st recognized as a MAJOR health problem( in Feb.). It became a Political football instead of an emergency to be turned over to the Epidemiologists for their judgment, and direction. Then they should have been given the POWER to solve the problem - the Political football was dropped, fumbled.

The US became a case study for Medical Scientists about what NOT to do!

I agree with most of what you said. I would like to add that our government has spent billions to develop a Covid vaccine(s). Our government will also spend more to distribute and offer this vaccine to all Americans for FREE. I thank the Trump administration for getting this done.

[graciegirl]

Honestly, yes. Why would they lie? What media news sources do is put a slant on the news but they don't out and out lie. They also neglect (on purpose) to report a news story if it doesn't fit their agenda. That's how I see it anyway.

There will be a major sea change soon. We will have articulate messages and a lot of money spent and not much accomplished.

[coffeebean]

I took a lot of psychology and child development classes when I was in college. I am glad that the CDC has FINALLY reversed their stance on school closures.

I believe that the experts are finding that all of this social distancing and self isolation is doing FAR more harm than good. First do no harm...

We can social distance and still be together. That is the easy part. Isolation does not have to be part of the equation.

[coffeebean]

I no longer have children to protect. If mine were little, I would hesitate, because one was born with Cardiological and Pulmonary factors that would put her at high risk, like the elderly. Children are not affected as seriously, from what I've read but...One would bring it to the other who would be affected seriously.

The vaccine will slow this damned virus very soon.

I am so happy with THAT news.

Right now, we can celebrate that all reading these argumentative posts are STILL ALIVE.

I shelter now so that when I am again together with those I treasure, no one will be missing.

Gracie,
I know you have been very careful with the Covid precautions and mostly sheltering in place. It will all be worth it. As you always say (stolen from someone else who I can not remember who)......"Patience grasshopper".

[coffeebean]

I am hoping and praying that the vaccine will be released soon. The isolation is having seriously adverse consequences in the elderly, too. I know from your posts that you are still getting out to the stores and whatnot. Some elderly people have not left their homes since this whole thing began which is not healthy. Their cognitive and physical declines are substantial and extremely worrisome. People need fresh air, sunshine and to be around other people.

This vaccine can not come soon enough in my own inexpert opinion.

I can understand sheltering in place and not leaving one's home but why not get fresh air? There is no reason why anyone should not sit on their lanai or even a driveway with their family member.

[Kwenner]

https://cdn.summit.news/2020/11/181120doctor1.jpg

[Gulfcoast]

I can understand sheltering in place and not leaving one's home but why not get fresh air? There is no reason why anyone should not sit on their lanai or even a driveway with their family member.

Depression, isolation, fear.

[jklfairwin]

Wearing a mask protects primarily others, but also provides some protection to the wearer.

[graciegirl]

Depression, isolation, fear.

Everyone in The Villages has a lanai, many have a nice front area to sit. Most of us who are trying to keep to themselves have a golf cart for a little spin and many enjoy working in the yard. We aren't locked inside.

Plus we have many social interactions with our friends on Facebook, sharing many craft projects and recipes and showing some home decorating projects. Many are Christmas gathering and there is a lot of surprises arriving in the mail from friends and family. People are doing all they can to think of others and to enjoy pictures of grandchildren and pets and family members all over this country. The true joy of the internet keeps us mentally healthy and happy.