Digital proof of vaccination is in the works

[coffeebean]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

[Aces4]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)


Get your wallet out, this will not be cheap.

If one has had their vaccination, what difference does it make? Or is government telling us all what medicines we have to take or have injected into our bodies the proposal here? Slippery slope. Btw, yes... I chose to have the vaccine.

[stanley]

Next a chip..
Be careful what you wish for!

[coffeebean]

Get your wallet out, this will not be cheap.

If one has had their vaccination, what difference does it make? Or is government telling us all what medicines we have to take or have injected into our bodies the proposal here? Slippery slope. Btw, yes... I chose to have the vaccine.
I will be willing to pay for this "passport" so I can travel, get back to normal activies and most important to hubby and me, cruise again.

[coffeebean]

Next a chip..
Be careful what you wish for!

I honestly do not think it will come to that..

[coffeebean]

Get your wallet out, this will not be cheap.

If one has had their vaccination, what difference does it make? Or is government telling us all what medicines we have to take or have injected into our bodies the proposal here? Slippery slope. Btw, yes... I chose to have the vaccine.

What difference does it make? When vaccination is mandated (and I truly believe it will be) to live our lives like we used to, we will all need proof of vaccination. As I said in my OP, there are so many activities that should mandate vaccination. That is the difference when you are vaccinated....to be able to live life normally again. No proof of vaccination? People will be restricted with what they can do in life. For example.....like to travel? You need to be vaccinated. Like to go to concerts or sporting events? You need to be vaccinated.

This is what I wish for.

[Aloha1]

"Ihre papieren bitte. You vill comply."

Let us hope this never happens here.

[Aces4]

What difference does it make? When vaccination is mandated (and I truly believe it will be) to live our lives like we used to, we will all need proof of vaccination. As I said in my OP, there are so many activities that should mandate vaccination. That is the difference when you are vaccinated....to be able to live life normally again. No proof of vaccination? People will be restricted with what they can do in life. For example.....like to travel? You need to be vaccinated. Like to go to concerts or sporting events? You need to be vaccinated.

This is what I wish for.

If you have your vaccination you can live life as you used to do. Mask until all who wanted the vaccine have received it. Perhaps birth control, number of children allowed and no vaccines for anyone over the age of 65 will be the next steps. Appears to be much hysteria in some where common sense should rule the day. People are being vaccinated, some are even getting vaccinated after having Covid a short time ago. Their taking vaccine from those that have no protection yet. Go figure.

[BluesToneDan]

Never in 10 years commented on TOTV until today.....I have had my first shot and am totally supportive of vaccine. My wife and I travel extensively, particularly on cruises. Due to a serious medical condition, her specialist says she cannot have vaccine as it could trigger a possible immune reaction which could cause her to go blind in one eye. So???????? I appreciate everyone wishing to be safe and smart. However, there will be exceptions as those folks who cannot accept a vaccine have and will continue to exercise appropriate and proactive measures to protect themselves and others. just sayin........

[Aces4]

Never in 10 years commented on TOTV until today.....I have had my first shot and am totally supportive of vaccine. My wife and I travel extensively, particularly on cruises. Due to a serious medical condition, her specialist says she cannot have vaccine as it could trigger a possible immune reaction which could cause her to go blind in one eye. So???????? I appreciate everyone wishing to be safe and smart. However, there will be exceptions as those folks who cannot accept a vaccine have and will continue to exercise appropriate and proactive measures to protect themselves and others. just sayin........


I get that and regular influenza could take me out but the flu vaccine has a lower efficacy that the Covid vaccine and not everyone will get the flu shots. They should should be mandated to take medications on my behalf? This country shouldn’t go there, IMHO.

[Mortal1]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

and government computers on a minute by minute basis and you think digital is safer than paper?

There is no safe way to guarantee someone has had the shot....and it doesn't mean they aren't a carrier...scared yet?

[coffeebean]

"Ihre papieren bitte. You vill comply."

Let us hope this never happens here.

No one will HAVE to comply. Those who do not comply, however, will probably not see a return to normal life as they knew it pre- pandemic if there are vaccine mandates.The choice is up to the individuals how they will live out the rest of their lives. Travel or no travel. Concerts or no concerts. Sporting events or no sporting events. Movie theaters or no movie theaters. Airline travel or drive. Cruising or no cruising. The list goes on and on and on and on.

[coffeebean]

and government computers on a minute by minute basis and you think digital is safer than paper?

There is no safe way to guarantee someone has had the shot....and it doesn't mean they aren't a carrier...scared yet?

No, I'm not scared. I plan to be fully vaccinated with the Moderna vaccine. (fingers, toes and eyes crossed!!!) That gives me 94.1% protection of not contracting Covid and 100% protection of not needing hospitalization if that remainder 5.9% gets me infected with Covid. I'm good with those odds.

[thelegges]

No worries by the time the cruise ships are up and running, the first vaccine may not be effective for the next strain. And so it begins. There are many who can’t take the vaccine, not won’t, but can’t. Those who are in treatment, pregnancy, or allergic reactions, may never get clearance for the current vaccine. The minute you fill out paperwork for vaccine, and answer YES to
Have you ever had an allergic reaction to any vaccine, or medication
Have you used an epi pen personally, or treated at a healthcare facility for a reaction.
This vaccine is not FDA approved, we do know if it will harm a fetus.
The vaccine will not be given at this time, or maybe never.
If one thinks the vaccine should be mandatory, no matter the situation, so they can get back to their previous Covid life, think again. If giving the vaccine might cause harm or death that would fall under the code of ethics to patients
Do No Harm.

I have continued to live my life, since last March, with very little change. I flew the first commercial flight after 911, so flying during the last 10 months has not been a life changing experience. Tomorrow is not guaranteed, so at least I didn’t waste all these months sitting in my house. Then again the new pastime of chasing the vaccine is getting people more screen time, and out of the house to drive 5 miles, or 500 miles to get in line. So I guess that’s a bonus

As far as digital imprinting, that will be the next money making scheme, ligit or not so much

[stanley]

I honestly do not think it will come to that..

Everybody "thinks" ....but nobody "knows".

[mlmarr1]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

Ditgal proof.. yes you are now trackable.. welcome to china..

[bd20166]

I believe in the wait and see approach. Never buy the first model of anything. Maybe in a year or two if the virus is still a thing perhaps I will get vaccinated. Until then I will wait and watch for adverse reactions in the guinea pigs. The frenzy people are in to get a vaccination is akin to the toilet paper craze.

[jamorela]

Never in 10 years commented on TOTV until today.....I have had my first shot and am totally supportive of vaccine. My wife and I travel extensively, particularly on cruises. Due to a serious medical condition, her specialist says she cannot have vaccine as it could trigger a possible immune reaction which could cause her to go blind in one eye. So???????? I appreciate everyone wishing to be safe and smart. However, there will be exceptions as those folks who cannot accept a vaccine have and will continue to exercise appropriate and proactive measures to protect themselves and others. just sayin........

Exactly! I had the first shot and had a rash reaction on my face and arms. (In fact, my face still is red after a month!). Since I have had an anaphylactic response to the sulfa drug in the past, two doctors, a nurse, and CDC guidelines have recommended not getting the second one. “Not worth the risk.” My sister-in-law has severe allergies and was also told by her doctor NOT to get the shot.

[La lamy]

I concur that some of us who have had allergic reactions to shots in the past have to be weary of getting this vaccine. There's also constant mutations that occur which scientist are already scrambling to figure out if this latest vaccine will be effective for them. No one knows how long your inoculation will be effective for either. Not a guarantee to prevent you or others from future infections (you can still be an asymptomatic carrier), so I'm always going to try to social distance and do good hand hygiene versus having blind faith in one vaccine. But with all that said I'm genuinely happy for those of you who feel more peace with the 'protection' of this first vaccine.

[Nick B]

Ditgal proof.. yes you are now trackable.. welcome to china..
You are trackable now. Welcome to US of A

[JustRita]

Couldn’t have said it better.

[Bill14564]

You have the freedom to refuse the vaccine but if you do then you will lose your freedom to travel and gather with others. Is this bullying, coercion, or outright extortion?

Many others (goog!e and Apple for two) built exposure trackers early on. As far as I know, these have not been mandated in any of the states. Hopefully a vaccine passport will also be an idea that never catches on.

[Scott O]

No one will HAVE to comply. Those who do not comply, however, will probably not see a return to normal life as they knew it pre- pandemic if there are vaccine mandates.The choice is up to the individuals how they will live out the rest of their lives. Travel or no travel. Concerts or no concerts. Sporting events or no sporting events. Movie theaters or no movie theaters. Airline travel or drive. Cruising or no cruising. The list goes on and on and on and on.
It’s sounds like your choice is imposing your fears and beliefs on others, not all of us live in fear, not all of us want a shot that doesn’t stop you from getting Covid, just lessens symptoms, has a risk factor and has not been completely tested...so basically if we don’t believe what you want, all our freedoms should be restricted or taken away...wow, just wow..

[Girlcopper]

What difference does it make? When vaccination is mandated (and I truly believe it will be) to live our lives like we used to, we will all need proof of vaccination. As I said in my OP, there are so many activities that should mandate vaccination. That is the difference when you are vaccinated....to be able to live life normally again. No proof of vaccination? People will be restricted with what they can do in life. For example.....like to travel? You need to be vaccinated. Like to go to concerts or sporting events? You need to be vaccinated.

This is what I wish for.
True. If kids are mandated to have certain vaccinations to start school, then adults should be mandated certain vaccines too. I dont think thats too much to ask

[Scott O]

No worries by the time the cruise ships are up and running, the first vaccine may not be effective for the next strain. And so it begins. There are many who can’t take the vaccine, not won’t, but can’t. Those who are in treatment, pregnancy, or allergic reactions, may never get clearance for the current vaccine. The minute you fill out paperwork for vaccine, and answer YES to
Have you ever had an allergic reaction to any vaccine, or medication
Have you used an epi pen personally, or treated at a healthcare facility for a reaction.
This vaccine is not FDA approved, we do know if it will harm a fetus.
The vaccine will not be given at this time, or maybe never.
If one thinks the vaccine should be mandatory, no matter the situation, so they can get back to their previous Covid life, think again. If giving the vaccine might cause harm or death that would fall under the code of ethics to patients
Do No Harm.

I have continued to live my life, since last March, with very little change. I flew the first commercial flight after 911, so flying during the last 10 months has not been a life changing experience. Tomorrow is not guaranteed, so at least I didn’t waste all these months sitting in my house. Then again the new pastime of chasing the vaccine is getting people more screen time, and out of the house to drive 5 miles, or 500 miles to get in line. So I guess that’s a bonus

As far as digital imprinting, that will be the next money making scheme, ligit or not so much
Thank you..agree 100%

[coffeebean]

No worries by the time the cruise ships are up and running, the first vaccine may not be effective for the next strain. And so it begins. There are many who can’t take the vaccine, not won’t, but can’t. Those who are in treatment, pregnancy, or allergic reactions, may never get clearance for the current vaccine. The minute you fill out paperwork for vaccine, and answer YES to
Have you ever had an allergic reaction to any vaccine, or medication
Have you used an epi pen personally, or treated at a healthcare facility for a reaction.
This vaccine is not FDA approved, we do know if it will harm a fetus.
The vaccine will not be given at this time, or maybe never.
If one thinks the vaccine should be mandatory, no matter the situation, so they can get back to their previous Covid life, think again. If giving the vaccine might cause harm or death that would fall under the code of ethics to patients
Do No Harm.

I have continued to live my life, since last March, with very little change. I flew the first commercial flight after 911, so flying during the last 10 months has not been a life changing experience. Tomorrow is not guaranteed, so at least I didn’t waste all these months sitting in my house. Then again the new pastime of chasing the vaccine is getting people more screen time, and out of the house to drive 5 miles, or 500 miles to get in line. So I guess that’s a bonus

As far as digital imprinting, that will be the next money making scheme, ligit or not so much

People who can not take the vaccine for medical reasons, unfortunately, will not be able to go back to pre-Covid life. Those who can and are willing to take the vaccine should have the opportunity to go back to the life as we knew it before this pandemic.

Moderna press release re: vaccines' efficacy with new variants......

Moderna COVID-19 Vaccine Retains Neutralizing Activity Against Emerging Variants First Identified in the U.K. and the Republic of South Africa | Moderna, Inc. (https://investors.modernatx.com/news-releases/news-release-details/moderna-covid-19-vaccine-retains-neutralizing-activity-against)

[coffeebean]

Ditgal proof.. yes you are now trackable.. welcome to china..

Only an anti-vaxxer would have that concern. Personally, I invite being able to digitally prove I have been vaccinated against Covid. Why not?

[coffeebean]

Exactly! I had the first shot and had a rash reaction on my face and arms. (In fact, my face still is red after a month!). Since I have had an anaphylactic response to the sulfa drug in the past, two doctors, a nurse, and CDC guidelines have recommended not getting the second one. “Not worth the risk.” My sister-in-law has severe allergies and was also told by her doctor NOT to get the shot.

Isn't that what epi-pens are for?

[coffeebean]

You have the freedom to refuse the vaccine but if you do then you will lose your freedom to travel and gather with others. Is this bullying, coercion, or outright extortion?

Many others (goog!e and Apple for two) built exposure trackers early on. As far as I know, these have not been mandated in any of the states. Hopefully a vaccine passport will also be an idea that never catches on.

I'm really surprised at the difference of opinion some people have about proving, a person has been vaccinated. We already have discussed that paper "proof" can easily be forged. Why not have a fail safe method of proof that can not be forged? I am truly appreciative that this opportunity will exist for those of us who have been vaccinated.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Get your wallet out, this will not be cheap.

If one has had their vaccination, what difference does it make? Or is government telling us all what medicines we have to take or have injected into our bodies the proposal here? Slippery slope. Btw, yes... I chose to have the vaccine.

The vaccine will not be mandated. The government is not forcing anyone to get nor will they.

But it may be required to shoe proof that you have ben vaccinated in order to take part in certain activities or use certain facilities.

It's no different than stores requiring you to wear a mask. You don't want to wear a mask, don't go into that store. You don't want to be vaccinated, you can't get on the cruise ship.

That is very different than mandating a vaccine for everyone.

[Johnsocat]

If you ate vaccinated, why does it matter to you if another person isnt'..
You wont catch it because you are protected.
Seems it would be none of your business as there is no effect on you.
You want everyone to be forced to doing things your way and are willing and even desirous of "punishing" those who wont comply with what you want by limiting their personal freedoms. Sounds tyrannical to me.

[Viperguy]

And a new government agency in Washington and in each state employing thousand of folks. And yes, a substantial fee.

[Aces4]

The vaccine will not be mandated. The government is not forcing anyone to get nor will they.

But it may be required to shoe proof that you have ben vaccinated in order to take part in certain activities or use certain facilities.

It's no different than stores requiring you to wear a mask. You don't want to wear a mask, don't go into that store. You don't want to be vaccinated, you can't get on the cruise ship.

That is very different than mandating a vaccine for everyone.


Doesn’t make sense... if one is vaccinated what difference is it if an unvaccinated person sits next to you on a cruise ship? Isn’t one completely protected from the person who elects not to be vaccinated. Why would one care one way or the other?

[Bill14564]

Only an anti-vaxxer would have that concern. Personally, I invite being able to digitally prove I have been vaccinated against Covid. Why not?

It is false that only an anti-vaxxer would have this concern. I have this concern and I am definitely not an anti-vaxxer.

[coffeebean]

It’s sounds like your choice is imposing your fears and beliefs on others, not all of us live in fear, not all of us want a shot that doesn’t stop you from getting Covid, just lessens symptoms, has a risk factor and has not been completely tested...so basically if we don’t believe what you want, all our freedoms should be restricted or taken away...wow, just wow..

Absolutely (to the above highlighted text)!!!

The efficacy of the vaccines affords an individual 94.1% efficacy from the Moderna vaccine and 95% efficacy from the Pfizer vaccine. That means that an individual will have 94.1% protection of not becoming infected with Covid when taking the Moderna vaccine and 95% protection of not becoming infected when taking the Pfizer vaccine. Both vaccines offer 100% protection of not having severe disease therefore not requiring hospitalization.

That is extremely good for these vaccines to offer that kind of protection.

[coffeebean]

True. If kids are mandated to have certain vaccinations to start school, then adults should be mandated certain vaccines too. I dont think thats too much to ask

Yup. It really is as simple as that!

[Bill14564]

I'm really surprised at the difference of opinion some people have about proving, a person has been vaccinated. We already have discussed that paper "proof" can easily be forged. Why not have a fail safe method of proof that can not be forged? I am truly appreciative that this opportunity will exist for those of us who have been vaccinated.

If you want a gold star to wear or a "digital passport" to show so others can pat you on the back - go for it. But DO NOT try to impose your fears of beliefs on me.

Requirements for vaccinations for anything other than the most critical jobs where freedoms have VOLUNTARILY been given up are counter to what this country was founded on.

[Aces4]

Absolutely (to the above highlighted text)!!!

The efficacy of the vaccines affords an individual 94.1% efficacy from the Moderna vaccine and 95% efficacy from the Pfizer vaccine. That means that an individual will have 94.1% protection of not becoming infected with Covid when taking the Moderna vaccine and 95% protection of not becoming infected when taking the Pfizer vaccine. Both vaccines offer 100% protection of not having severe disease therefore not requiring hospitalization.

That is extremely good for these vaccines to offer that kind of protection.

What does that have to do with individual choice and freedom? When some decide what is best for others and impose their beliefs, freedom is lost which is far worse than covid19.

[coffeebean]

The vaccine will not be mandated. The government is not forcing anyone to get nor will they.

But it may be required to shoe proof that you have ben vaccinated in order to take part in certain activities or use certain facilities.

It's no different than stores requiring you to wear a mask. You don't want to wear a mask, don't go into that store. You don't want to be vaccinated, you can't get on the cruise ship.

That is very different than mandating a vaccine for everyone.
You get it! You said it better than I did and I thank you for that.

[Johnsocat]

Another way to divide people. "US" and "THEM".
It makes we really sad to see how "THEY" are changing our mindsets.
But then again, sheep will be sheep.
In the meantime, just another way to point fingers at and shame our friends and neighbors. It's an ugly look on people and those doing it should be ashamed of themselves.

[Aces4]

You get it! You said it better than I did and I thank you for that.

And the fact is lost on you that why do you care if someone else is vaccinated? You are safe if you have been, remember? It could be a real financial loser for businesses which adopt that policy. Many of us wouldn’t patronize them even though we had been vaccinated.

[coffeebean]

What does that have to do with individual choice and freedom? When some decide what is best for others and impose their beliefs, freedom is lost which is far worse than covid19.

No one is imposing anything on anyone. You can choose NOT to be vaccinated. That is your choice. BUT...........just wait until you can not get on an airplane if you are not vaccinated. Your choice NOT to be vaccinated will impact how you live your life. This is what I wish for and I will not change my stance on this. Having said that, my wish may not come true but I surely wish it will.

[Aces4]

No one is imposing anything on anyone. You can choose NOT to be vaccinated. That is your choice. BUT...........just wait until you can not get on an airplane if you are not vaccinated. Your choice NOT to be vaccinated will impact how you live your life. This is what I wish for and I will not change my stance on this. Having said that, my wish may not come true but I surely wish it will.

There are many regimes in the world which would love that stance.:shocked:

[coffeebean]

And the fact is lost on you that why do you care if someone else is vaccinated? You are safe if you have been, remember? It could be a real financial loser for businesses which adopt that policy. Many of us wouldn’t patronize them even though we had been vaccinated.

94.1% safe and 95% safe with the Moderna vaccine and Pfizer vaccine. With the soon to be emergency approved J&J vaccine, only 66% safe from becoming infected. It could be a real financial BOOST for businesses who adopt that policy. Have you thought about that?

[Scott O]

People who can not take the vaccine for medical reasons, unfortunately, will not be able to go back to pre-Covid life. Those who can and are willing to take the vaccine should have the opportunity to go back to the life as we knew it before this pandemic.

Moderna press release re: vaccines' efficacy with new variants......

Moderna COVID-19 Vaccine Retains Neutralizing Activity Against Emerging Variants First Identified in the U.K. and the Republic of South Africa | Moderna, Inc. (https://investors.modernatx.com/news-releases/news-release-details/moderna-covid-19-vaccine-retains-neutralizing-activity-against)
Wow, you really have some pompous words, people should not be entitled to their life back because you demand a vaccine, that really isn’t a vaccine....

[Aces4]

94.1% safe and 95% safe with the Moderna vaccine and Pfizer vaccine. With the soon to be emergency approved J&J vaccine, only 66% safe from becoming infected. It could be a real financial BOOST for businesses who adopt that policy. Have you thought about that?

Why would it boost business? If people have been vaccinated, they will be there. They won’t give a darn about who else is there and the non-vaxers never stopped.

[Two Bills]

Every time you turn on your cell phone, computor, make a purchase with a CC. you are being tracked.
What is so bad about a digital passport for covid?
Use your travel passport? You're being tracked.
Welcome to reality!

[Aces4]

Every time you turn on your cell phone, computor, make a purchase with a CC. you are being tracked.
What is so bad about a digital passport for covid?
Use your travel passport? You're being tracked!

The real problem is why is it important for you to know if someone has chosen to vaccinate or not? If you got yours, why do you care? If they determine the vaccine will harm children and they can’t receive it, should we ban them from life?

[ExecChef57]

I do not see what the issue is, the purpose of the vaccine is to get to herd immunity. If you get it and most of the people willing do to why should others be required when the purpose can be met by having willing people get to herd immunity. We should not be requiring others to get vaccinated if they do not wish to. We are or at least were supposed to be a free society. Remember "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness".

[coffeebean]

If you ate vaccinated, why does it matter to you if another person isnt'..
You wont catch it because you are protected.
Seems it would be none of your business as there is no effect on you.
You want everyone to be forced to doing things your way and are willing and even desirous of "punishing" those who wont comply with what you want by limiting their personal freedoms. Sounds tyrannical to me.

Let's wait and see what happens. As someone previously reminded us on this thread that children MUST be vaccinated before they can begin school. Those vaccines are mandated for in person learning in public schools. Do you consider that tyrannical too? Think about that.

[coffeebean]

Wow, you really have some pompous words, people should not be entitled to their life back because you demand a vaccine, that really isn’t a vaccine....

Yes, this is what I wish for

Of course it is a vaccine. Why do you feel it is not?

Vaccine
A vaccine is a biological preparation that provides active acquired immunity to a particular infectious disease. A vaccine typically contains a biological preparation from disease-causing microorganism, or since the beginning of the 21st century, made synthetically that resembles it. Wikipedia

[MandoMan]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

This is a good idea. Another possibility might be an endorsement on a hard-to-forge driver’s license.

Here’s the thing, though. We are hoping that these vaccines will be once (with two shots) in a lifetime. Think about it, though. When we were kids, we needed smallpox vaccinations every five years. Some vaccinations are once forever. I think tetanus is ten years unless you get wounded. Mumps? Measles? Whooping cough? Haven’t some adults been getting whooping cough even though they were vaccinated when they were little kids?

We’ve been told that this vaccine is once forever, but I’m not sure that is known yet. What if variations such as this South African one keep turning up. Many of us get flu shots every year that cover varieties that experts think are likely to be the worst that year. Maybe in six months there will be a re-jiggered vaccine that does a great job on the South African variety. Maybe we will be getting a new COVID-19 vaccination every year to cover the new varieties. I suspect that the drug companies really hope for that. Phizer and Moderna aren’t making a huge profit off their vaccines at present, but if it becomes yearly, they will raise the price and have a big step up on their competitors.

If this becomes the case, our Apple Wallet might contain a record of our latest vaccination. Then too, it may be that in a few years, everyone with any sense will keep up to date on their COVID-19 vaccinations, while the anti-vaxxers will not. Just as with the flu, if people are on public transportation while sick, they will pass around their sickness to those without vaccinations, and that is just the risk people take. No more need to check. People will either get sick and develop antibodies, most with a light case, or they will not because they were vaccinated. So it goes. Testing for antibodies may become rare except when people are clearly sick and doctors need to know. Hospitals will no longer quarantine patients with COVID-19 any more than they quarantine patients with colds. Healthcare personnel will continue to wash their hands a lot, as they should in any case, and maybe wear masks around patients, but will all be vaccinated themselves as a condition of employment. If patients don’t require the current quarantine conditions, relatives can visit them. It will be much cheaper to treat them. Many people will continue to die of COVID-19, but that is their choice. Many people will self-quarantine if they think they are sick, just as people now may stay home from work or school if they have a bad cold or the flu. People with weak immune systems and pre-existing conditions may choose to avoid crowds during times when infection rates are high, just as they do now, and may choose to wear masks and gloves and be extra careful on public transportation or crowds, and we will all be comfortable with that. People who have an active case may do the same.

Just as many people die of the flu every year, especially the elderly, many will die of Covid-19, and it may be a much larger number. But I’m grateful that it seems that those of us who choose to be vaccinated will have a way to lower our risks a lot.

[Scott O]

So your telling us, especially those of us who have worked to provide public services to everyone during this entire time without fear of going to work and have stayed healthy, that we all need to conform to your fears and if we don’t we are no longer allowed to live our lives in freedom, I don’t think so. If you live in fear it’s your own place...if your getting the so called vaccines to protect yourself, then you really don’t believe it provides protection if you say all need it to protect you...

[Bay Kid]

I do not see what the issue is, the purpose of the vaccine is to get to herd immunity. If you get it and most of the people willing do to why should others be required when the purpose can be met by having willing people get to herd immunity. We should not be requiring others to get vaccinated if they do not wish to. We are or at least were supposed to be a free society. Remember "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness".

This is the perfect scenario for certain groups to take full control of your life. They will never let it go.

[Two Bills]

The real problem is why is it important for you to know if someone has chosen to vaccinate or not? If you got yours, why do you care? If they determine the vaccine will harm children and they can’t receive it, should we ban them from life?

I don't give a Tinkers cuss whether you or anyone have been vaccinated.
I just don't get this obsession with being tracked, when it's a daily reality anyway!

[Aces4]

I don't give a Tinkers cuss whether you or anyone have been vaccinated.
I just don't get this obsession with being tracked, when it's a daily reality anyway!

I don’t give a tinkers cuss about that either.:ohdear: You are missing the point which is forcing people to receive the vaccine or be banned from activities. That is the argument, freedom of choice.

[Joe C.]

If everyone gets the vaccine, that means they won’t get COVID. So if I don’t get the vaccine, who cares? They won’t get it.
My wife has been vaccinated, but I won’t. I don’t trust big pharma. The FDA doesn’t test the vaccine, each manufacturer sends in it’s own test data for approval......and they have been known in the past to fudge their data so they can be the first one on the market. It seems that they all came out rather quickly and all at the same time. No thanks.....

[Veiragirl]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

AND CONTINUE TO WEAR MASKS.NO ONE LIKES IT BUT IT'S SO IMPORTANT AND IT DOES HELP. :coolsmiley:

[Two Bills]

I don’t give a tinkers cuss about that either.:ohdear: You are missing the point which is forcing people to receive the vaccine or be banned from activities. That is the argument, freedom of choice.

That is your freedom of choice.
Live with it.

[Notsocrates]

Is anyone old enough to remember smallpox? The last diagnosed case in the world was in the 1970's. Totally eradicated!! This could not have been achieved if vaccination had been optional.

[Clark124]

About 15 years ago I had an allergic reaction to amoxicillin, it makes me cautious.

[Aces4]

That is your freedom of choice.
Live with it.

Doesn’t make sense, there are regimes though that will defend your analogy.

[bruce213]

It may come down to economics, I'm sure we'll see businesses advertising "All staff covid vaccinated" or your up for a promotion and the other leading contender is vaccinated. All things I'm going to pick the vaccinated hygienist over the non-vaccinated.

[Scott O]

What difference does it make? When vaccination is mandated (and I truly believe it will be) to live our lives like we used to, we will all need proof of vaccination. As I said in my OP, there are so many activities that should mandate vaccination. That is the difference when you are vaccinated....to be able to live life normally again. No proof of vaccination? People will be restricted with what they can do in life. For example.....like to travel? You need to be vaccinated. Like to go to concerts or sporting events? You need to be vaccinated.

This is what I wish for.
Maybe you’d like to stand in front of the people and families of those who have died from the “vaccine” or had severe reactions sending them to the emergency room, and tell them “what difference does it make” if you want any freedom in your life from here on out you, you have to do as I wish, because I want to go cruising again...I would be first in line for that audience...

[Arl]

I feel everyone should have the choice to get the shot or not. Not to be forced by anyone
if you’re not comfortable. They don’t know enough about how you will react to this shot
so everyone should be able to make their own decisions.

[ScottS]

Ask yourself why is it now illegal to report deaths from the vaccine. Why is there no place on a death certificate for death related to the vaccine. Coffee bean stop being so narrow minded about this subject. The actual amount of deaths from the vaccine would shock you. And the percentage grows astronomically the older you are. Most of us have gone back to life as we knew it. Other than being FORCED to wear a mask where you work. Yes FORCED. Over and over again masks have been proven to cause more harm than good, yet here we are a year later still wearing diapers on our faces like good little sheep. Anyone wanting digital proof of a vaccine is a fool. Anyone wanting mandated vaccines is a fool. And you saying they should be required to attend concerts, sporting events, public transportation etc is pure selfishness. Not surprising but yet selfish. The amount of deaths and tragic side effects from this virtually untested vaccine is astonishing, but thanks to the selfish people out there who choose to blindly follow the herd, these deaths are acceptable. How sad.

[Swoop]

Is anyone old enough to remember smallpox? The last diagnosed case in the world was in the 1970's. Totally eradicated!! This could not have been achieved if vaccination had been optional.
Smallpox killed people of all ages, not predominantly older people with multiple other medical issues.
I think it’s great that the vaccine is available. It will allow those in that demographic to resume their lives. For the rest of the population for whom Covid is only at minor risk, the vaccine should continue to be optional. At this point no one knows if there will be any long term side effects from the vaccine.

[rmd2]

Exactly! I had the first shot and had a rash reaction on my face and arms. (In fact, my face still is red after a month!). Since I have had an anaphylactic response to the sulfa drug in the past, two doctors, a nurse, and CDC guidelines have recommended not getting the second one. “Not worth the risk.” My sister-in-law has severe allergies and was also told by her doctor NOT to get the shot.

I had my first shot of Moderna. There was no problem with Moderna BUT the shot itself was not properly placed and this is what happened to me: the first 24 hours I had extreme pain from my shoulder to my finger tips and that felt that way for the whole 24 hours. This was 3 weeks ago and I still have pain in the arm when I move it and occasionally there is pain from the nerve in my arm that runs down from the injection site to my hand and when that happens it is extreme pain and fans out into my hand. It feels like an electrical charge. The person injecting me did not get it in the deltoid muscle but instead hit a nerve. It happens and I have since found evidence of this from medical journals, NIH, CDC and personal accounts but unfortunately didn't know this before my shot. I am considering seeing a neurologist for this problem because it is not going away.

[Spalumbos62]

Get your wallet out, this will not be cheap.

If one has had their vaccination, what difference does it make? Or is government telling us all what medicines we have to take or have injected into our bodies the proposal here? Slippery slope. Btw, yes... I chose to have the vaccine.

What difference does it make????? Are you kidding?
Get the dam shot- or just stay home.

[ScottS]

Where is your proof? Where is your proof in all of these BS numbers you keep spewing about a vaccine that hasn’t been tested and has no history to base anything on ? Stick to drinking coffee and stop posting false undocumented BS on here. Sheesh.

The efficacy of the vaccines affords an individual 94.1% efficacy from the Moderna vaccine and 95% efficacy from the Pfizer vaccine. That means that an individual will have 94.1% protection of not becoming infected with Covid when taking the Moderna vaccine and 95% protection of not becoming infected when taking the Pfizer vaccine. Both vaccines offer 100% protection of not having severe disease therefore not requiring hospitalization.

That is extremely good for these vaccines to offer that kind of protection.[/QUOTE]

[oldtimes]

I concur that some of us who have had allergic reactions to shots in the past have to be weary of getting this vaccine. There's also constant mutations that occur which scientist are already scrambling to figure out if this latest vaccine will be effective for them. No one knows how long your inoculation will be effective for either. Not a guarantee to prevent you or others from future infections (you can still be an asymptomatic carrier), so I'm always going to try to social distance and do good hand hygiene versus having blind faith in one vaccine. But with all that said I'm genuinely happy for those of you who feel more peace with the 'protection' of this first vaccine.

I agree. There is still way too much they don’t know.

[oldtimes]

I honestly do not think it will come to that..

There’s an awful lot of things I never thought could happen

[Aces4]

What difference does it make????? Are you kidding?
Get the dam shot- or just stay home.

I got the shot. I’m not out there “dictating” how everyone else should live but then I am an American that still respects personal choice.:blahblahblah:

[Two Bills]

Ask yourself why is it now illegal to report deaths from the vaccine. Why is there no place on a death certificate for death related to the vaccine. Coffee bean stop being so narrow minded about this subject. The actual amount of deaths from the vaccine would shock you. And the percentage grows astronomically the older you are. Most of us have gone back to life as we knew it. Other than being FORCED to wear a mask where you work. Yes FORCED. Over and over again masks have been proven to cause more harm than good, yet here we are a year later still wearing diapers on our faces like good little sheep. Anyone wanting digital proof of a vaccine is a fool. Anyone wanting mandated vaccines is a fool. And you saying they should be required to attend concerts, sporting events, public transportation etc is pure selfishness. Not surprising but yet selfish. The amount of deaths and tragic side effects from this virtually untested vaccine is astonishing, but thanks to the selfish people out there who choose to blindly follow the herd, these deaths are acceptable. How sad.

If all these 'shocking numbers' of deaths are not being reported, how did you get the information?

[Spalumbos62]

Ask yourself why is it now illegal to report deaths from the vaccine. Why is there no place on a death certificate for death related to the vaccine. Coffee bean stop being so narrow minded about this subject. The actual amount of deaths from the vaccine would shock you. And the percentage grows astronomically the older you are. Most of us have gone back to life as we knew it. Other than being FORCED to wear a mask where you work. Yes FORCED. Over and over again masks have been proven to cause more harm than good, yet here we are a year later still wearing diapers on our faces like good little sheep. Anyone wanting digital proof of a vaccine is a fool. Anyone wanting mandated vaccines is a fool. And you saying they should be required to attend concerts, sporting events, public transportation etc is pure selfishness. Not surprising but yet selfish. The amount of deaths and tragic side effects from this virtually untested vaccine is astonishing, but thanks to the selfish people out there who choose to blindly follow the herd, these deaths are acceptable. How sad.

Wow!! You are the narrow-minded. No one is saying you have to get a vaccine. But if you are going to any public event, or even private event, you better have had the shot...otherwise..dont come....now, is that so difficult to get thru your head?

[ldivens]

Mandating vaccines is un-American. My body my choice

[toeser]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

"Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless."

Except I am going to have to be able to use my paper proof to get my digital proof.

[jimjamuser]

"Ihre papieren bitte. You vill comply."

Let us hope this never happens here.
It may have already been close. And if it comes back, then no one will worry about a little detail like proper CV vaccine identification to get on a cruise ship. Be careful if you worry about the trees and do not worry about the forrest.

[Byte1]

No thanks. In THIS FREE COUNTRY we do not believe in gov. tyranny. Worry about yourself, not everyone else.

[Byte1]

Wow!! You are the narrow-minded. No one is saying you have to get a vaccine. But if you are going to any public event, or even private event, you better have had the shot...otherwise..dont come....now, is that so difficult to get thru your head?

On the other hand, if you are scared of someone else that may or may not be vaccinated, then YOU stay home.

[Byte1]

It may come down to economics, I'm sure we'll see businesses advertising "All staff covid vaccinated" or your up for a promotion and the other leading contender is vaccinated. All things I'm going to pick the vaccinated hygienist over the non-vaccinated.

Interesting. I have not seen one store with a sign that said that any of their staff were vaccinated against the FLU or any disease. NOT even in all those "other" countries I have lived in or traveled to.

[JustRita]

This is not about vaccinations. You will never be able to dictate that the world keep you safe. If you cruise, you will have many people working on that ship that are from other countries with different standards. You will also have people who may have been vaccinated and capable of carrying the virus. You may also have people that were legally exempt from vaccination, but the ADA will not allow that they be excluded. There have always been environmental risks. There will always be risks to living. You take one every time you get in your car.

My advice is that you always look to your own life goals. Do you prioritize quantity or quality. You will die. You cannot control the world. Make your decisions based on how they effect you.

[Byte1]

Mandated and documented is a hilarious and foolish idea. First off, we do not yet know how long this vaccine lasts as to the effectiveness. I've been told by medical professionals that they believe it will be about like the flu shot and only last a "season." I can see it now, "mam, I am going to have to issue you a citation as your shot has expired."
Some folks have way too much time on their hands, but not enough time or intelligence to reason something out. Our gov is already out of control and needs to be reigned back.
Sorry, but if you are too afraid of others to leave your home, then stay home...period.

[Topspinmo]

Next a chip..
Be careful what you wish for!

Or tattoo at least with tattoos they won’t have ability to monitor or spy.

[Topspinmo]

This is not about vaccinations. You will never be able to dictate that the world keep you safe. If you cruise, you will have many people working on that ship that are from other countries with different standards. You will also have people who may have been vaccinated and capable of carrying the virus. You may also have people that were legally exempt from vaccination, but the ADA will not allow that they be excluded. There have always been environmental risks. There will always be risks to living. You take one every time you get in your car.

My advice is that you always look to your own life goals. Do you prioritize quantity or quality. You will die. You cannot control the world. Make your decisions based on how they effect you.


Cruises are way done the list of priorities, it personal choice, cruise ship are virus nursery anyway.

[Beyond The Wall]

Amazing how easily we give up our liberty. Started with 9/11 and has stopped

[jimjamuser]

What difference does it make? When vaccination is mandated (and I truly believe it will be) to live our lives like we used to, we will all need proof of vaccination. As I said in my OP, there are so many activities that should mandate vaccination. That is the difference when you are vaccinated....to be able to live life normally again. No proof of vaccination? People will be restricted with what they can do in life. For example.....like to travel? You need to be vaccinated. Like to go to concerts or sporting events? You need to be vaccinated.

This is what I wish for.
That is an idealistic hope because you would need a bubble around the US. And a bubble around a ship cruise. And a bubble around all the cruisers as they went ashore. What would be the purpose of a cruise if you did NOT mingle with the locals? Maybe you could go to Antarctica without any stops and just look out at the glaciers? As long as the whole world is NOT vaccinated, when you travel, the risk would be high that you encounter some CV-positive people. Right now the medical experts are PREDICTING (?) that getting vaccinated completely protects you from CV. That can only be validated by time passing after most people in the US have been vaccinated and we have herd immunity. So to me, digital identification does not seem to matter much. There are other variables and some not yet known!

[PJackpot]

I’d much rather see you restricted out of your own fear. However, that being said, states probably could get away with mandating a vaccine shot. Personally, I have no intention of getting the vaccine shot until enough time has gone by that I feel confident in its level of efficacy and that there are no long term side effects. Nothing so far has proven to be effective in slowing the spread of this virus, not masks, not social distancing...nothing, and I am not convinced this vaccine will either. Infections continues to rise regardless, yet mortality rates continue to decline, suggesting to me herd immunity may be the reason. Thanks, but I’ll accept the risk and forgo the shot.

[tvmurray]

What difference does it make? When vaccination is mandated (and I truly believe it will be) to live our lives like we used to, we will all need proof of vaccination. As I said in my OP, there are so many activities that should mandate vaccination. That is the difference when you are vaccinated....to be able to live life normally again. No proof of vaccination? People will be restricted with what they can do in life. For example.....like to travel? You need to be vaccinated. Like to go to concerts or sporting events? You need to be vaccinated.

This is what I wish for.

Sounds like you are wishing for "Mark of the beast". I wish for a free America.

[coffeebean]

So your telling us, especially those of us who have worked to provide public services to everyone during this entire time without fear of going to work and have stayed healthy, that we all need to conform to your fears and if we don’t we are no longer allowed to live our lives in freedom, I don’t think so. If you live in fear it’s your own place...if your getting the so called vaccines to protect yourself, then you really don’t believe it provides protection if you say all need it to protect you...

Service workers have gone to work WEARING MASKS, keeping their distance as much as feasible and washing their hands more than ever before. This is NOT living a normal life if you ask me. Also, I do not believe for one moment that most people have not feared going to work and dealing with the general public. An individual would have to be very uninformed to do that.

[coffeebean]

I do not see what the issue is, the purpose of the vaccine is to get to herd immunity. If you get it and most of the people willing do to why should others be required when the purpose can be met by having willing people get to herd immunity. We should not be requiring others to get vaccinated if they do not wish to. We are or at least were supposed to be a free society. Remember "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness".

What? You can not be serious. Who in their right mind would WANT to get Covid so they help our population reach herd immunity naturally? Maybe that quack Dr. Scott Altas? Shaking my head.

[coffeebean]

I don't give a Tinkers cuss whether you or anyone have been vaccinated.
I just don't get this obsession with being tracked, when it's a daily reality anyway!

Anti-trackers = anti-vaxxers.

[Spalumbos62]

On the other hand, if you are scared of someone else that may or may not be vaccinated, then YOU stay home.

No..you see the goal here is to get everyone vaccinated so the world can open up again...not so they can continue to sit home. So what is best for all....not just you..is to get vaccinated and get out there and live again without worry. Its not a hard concept...kind of like the store, no mask..no entry.....you don't like it. Go elsewhere

[coffeebean]

I don’t give a tinkers cuss about that either.:ohdear: You are missing the point which is forcing people to receive the vaccine or be banned from activities. That is the argument, freedom of choice.

But it most certainly is your choice. It is your choice not to partake in activities and all sorts of other daily life events that can help to spread the virus. Folks that are vaccinated will not spread the virus and therefore should be able to partake in all activities life has to offer.

I see I have hurt some feelings here and so sorry you do not see it my way. But.....that is the way it is. My wishes may not come to fruition so there is that, if that makes you feel any better.

Over and out. I'm done with this conversation.

[Byte1]

Service workers have gone to work WEARING MASKS, keeping their distance as much as feasible and washing their hands more than ever before. This is NOT living a normal life if you ask me. Also, I do not believe for one moment that most people have not feared going to work and dealing with the general public. An individual would have to be very uninformed to do that.

Oh my, the sky is falling!

Maybe what this country NEEDS is for more to get infected and either perish or survive. Is living life in fear, really LIVING? Just a thought, not wishing for an apocalypse.

[kathyspear]

"Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless."

Except I am going to have to be able to use my paper proof to get my digital proof.

It is my understanding that the CDC (ie THE FEDERAL GOVT) knows who is getting vaccinated. Didn't we have to give our SSN when we registered online? If so, we will not be using the little card they gave us (which is easily forged) to prove we got our shots.

kathy

[Bill14564]

Anti-trackers = anti-vaxxers.

Not at all. No matter how many times you assert this, being against trackers and for privacy and freedom has NOTHING TO DO with being anti-vax!

(And with that, the ignore list becomes one larger)

[Packer Fan]

Anti-trackers = anti-vaxxers.

I had read this whole thread, and until you made that statement, I thought you were ok, just a little misguided. I was wrong- why would you make such a statement? I know plenty of people, including myself that are getting the vaccine, very pro vaccine - I am married to a nurse who is already vaccinated. HOWEVER, I value my personal privacy and liberty too. I am totally anti tracking - have you heard of HIPA? Have you heard of the right to privacy? I believe that with the correct education and enough time, we can get people to take the vaccine to reach herd immunity. We don't need tracking.

[Andyb]

You no nothing of Constitutional rights.
I hope you are kidding, because no one can be that ignorant of our rights.

[dhdallas]

Myself, my family, my neighbors, and millions of others have already had COVID and are naturally immune.

Vaccines train our immune systems to create proteins that fight disease, known as ‘antibodies’, just as would happen when we are exposed to a disease . Even people without symptoms develop an immune response. - WHO (World Health Organization)

People with underlying health conditions that weaken their immune systems (such as cancer or HIV) or who have severe allergies to some vaccine components may not be able to get vaccinated - WHO (World Health Organization)

Vaccines can cause anaphylaxis and other dangerous life-threatening side effects. - NIH (National Institute of Health)

Example: The United States stopped giving mandatory smallpox vaccinations 30 years ago. Some people die from it; and others have serious reactions, some permanent. Scientists say it's the most dangerous vaccine known to man. - CBS News, 60 Minutes

These new COVID vaccines were rushed into use with extremely short trial periods. According to the IFPMA, the development of novel vaccines is a long endeavor. It takes usually between 10 to 15 years to develop a novel vaccine, as well as establishing its quality, safety and efficacy. - International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers & Associations

Thus, for those who have had COVID, getting vaccinated is not only pointless but potentially dangerous. - David H. Dallas, RN-ASN, EMT-P, retired

[jimjamuser]

I get that and regular influenza could take me out but the flu vaccine has a lower efficacy that the Covid vaccine and not everyone will get the flu shots. They should should be mandated to take medications on my behalf? This country shouldn’t go there, IMHO.
There is a difference between a government mandate and a mandate or rule by a private company or corporation. if you are using, as a customer, a particular business, then you need to follow their rules.

[jimjamuser]

I'm really surprised at the difference of opinion some people have about proving, a person has been vaccinated. We already have discussed that paper "proof" can easily be forged. Why not have a fail safe method of proof that can not be forged? I am truly appreciative that this opportunity will exist for those of us who have been vaccinated.
Voting is MADE more reliable with paper backup. On average, paper should be a more SECURE ID than digital. Digital is designed to be more convenient - it is, likely, less secure.

[Bill14564]

Oh how we need a “misinformation “ or “not commonly accepted medical opinion” or “ignorant and likely to get you killed” tag.

[jimjamuser]

Doesn’t make sense... if one is vaccinated what difference is it if an unvaccinated person sits next to you on a cruise ship? Isn’t one completely protected from the person who elects not to be vaccinated. Why would one care one way or the other?
Scientists are STILL researching how "COMPLETE" the protection is to a vaccinated person. You could possibly (?) get it again and you might (?) be able to spread it. Only time and research can tell for sure and the virus is mutating.

[jimjamuser]

And the fact is lost on you that why do you care if someone else is vaccinated? You are safe if you have been, remember? It could be a real financial loser for businesses which adopt that policy. Many of us wouldn’t patronize them even though we had been vaccinated.
It could also be profitable because socially conscious people may patronize those businesses.

[DFEECH]

Look this up
Merck Stops Developing Both Of Its COVID-19 Vaccine Candidates

[dhdallas]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

Fraudsters will always be able to defeat any form of proof whether it is digital or paper. It doesn't even need to be a forgery. Just simple identity theft will allow the criminal to use the victims "Proof of Vaccination".

See my other response about vaccines not necessary for the already immune. I am not an anti-vaxxer and routinely get flu shots. However, I would think twice about this new vaccine that was rushed to market. COVID is just a nuisance for the majority of us that are healthy and have no pre-existing health issues. The FDA has approved many drugs that were later found to have serious side effects (anyone remember thalidomide babies?). I advise using some common sense, something I have seen little of in regard to COVID!

[jimjamuser]

This is a good idea. Another possibility might be an endorsement on a hard-to-forge driver’s license.

Here’s the thing, though. We are hoping that these vaccines will be once (with two shots) in a lifetime. Think about it, though. When we were kids, we needed smallpox vaccinations every five years. Some vaccinations are once forever. I think tetanus is ten years unless you get wounded. Mumps? Measles? Whooping cough? Haven’t some adults been getting whooping cough even though they were vaccinated when they were little kids?

We’ve been told that this vaccine is once forever, but I’m not sure that is known yet. What if variations such as this South African one keep turning up. Many of us get flu shots every year that cover varieties that experts think are likely to be the worst that year. Maybe in six months there will be a re-jiggered vaccine that does a great job on the South African variety. Maybe we will be getting a new COVID-19 vaccination every year to cover the new varieties. I suspect that the drug companies really hope for that. Phizer and Moderna aren’t making a huge profit off their vaccines at present, but if it becomes yearly, they will raise the price and have a big step up on their competitors.

If this becomes the case, our Apple Wallet might contain a record of our latest vaccination. Then too, it may be that in a few years, everyone with any sense will keep up to date on their COVID-19 vaccinations, while the anti-vaxxers will not. Just as with the flu, if people are on public transportation while sick, they will pass around their sickness to those without vaccinations, and that is just the risk people take. No more need to check. People will either get sick and develop antibodies, most with a light case, or they will not because they were vaccinated. So it goes. Testing for antibodies may become rare except when people are clearly sick and doctors need to know. Hospitals will no longer quarantine patients with COVID-19 any more than they quarantine patients with colds. Healthcare personnel will continue to wash their hands a lot, as they should in any case, and maybe wear masks around patients, but will all be vaccinated themselves as a condition of employment. If patients don’t require the current quarantine conditions, relatives can visit them. It will be much cheaper to treat them. Many people will continue to die of COVID-19, but that is their choice. Many people will self-quarantine if they think they are sick, just as people now may stay home from work or school if they have a bad cold or the flu. People with weak immune systems and pre-existing conditions may choose to avoid crowds during times when infection rates are high, just as they do now, and may choose to wear masks and gloves and be extra careful on public transportation or crowds, and we will all be comfortable with that. People who have an active case may do the same.

Just as many people die of the flu every year, especially the elderly, many will die of Covid-19, and it may be a much larger number. But I’m grateful that it seems that those of us who choose to be vaccinated will have a way to lower our risks a lot.
No medical expert has said ANYTHING about these vaccines being "once in a lifetime". They have said that maybe we will be lucky to get a year out of it.

[Packer Fan]

I am specifically going to not reply directly to anyone here, but write a post based on reading the whole thread. Overall a decent discussion, but there were a few HUGE falsehoods too, one that was scarey in how off base it was. Please read my whole post before you comment. Let me preface by saying I am still working and own 2 houses in TV. I am 57 and have an Engineering degree and an MBA and my wife, who agrees with everything I am going to write is a nurse with 35 years of experience and now is a district nurse in a school system. We are both conservatives. My wife has been vacinated with the Pfizer vaccine, my CNA daughter with the Moderna, as well as my daughter in law who is a Dental assistant. I will get vaccinated as soon as I can.
I have read everything on the vaccines INCLUDING the entire scientific reports on the Moderna and Pfizer phase 1/2 and 3 studies. I will read the J&J when it is available. What's more important is I UNDERSTAND THE STATISTICS AND WHAT THEY MEAN. I have taught basic statistics at the college level in fact as an adjunct professor.

1. This virus is a real pain in the butt. For the VAST majority of people, it is no big deal(I have MANY employees that have had it, for most it was a headache or being tired a few days). HOWEVER, for some, especially the old, it kills them. It also does kill a small number of people you would not expect it to seamingly at random. For the most part it really does not hurt kids. Seriously, it is way less deadly to those under 25 than the Flu. People that are worried about their kids or grandkids should stop - worry about your elderly relatives in The Villages! I would rather get the vaccine than play russian roulette with my life.
2. These vaccines are effective and SAFE. The sample sizes in this study are HUGE. The p values are such that application of these statistics to conclusions about the population is basically a certainty. There are some side effects that pass quickly. The one side effect that happens in people with a history of alergic reactions can be treated with an Epi pen. NOBODY HAS DIED FROM THE VACCINE in the trials. Statistically, based on the trial data, it would be more likely that you have a car accident while being struck by lightning and having a heart attack all at the same time than dying from this vaccine.
3. Long term side effects- ok, seriously? What crazyperson have you been listening to that you got the video from your consiracy theory loving cousin in Facebook personal messenger? Come on, we all are getting this crazy crap. So here is the reality - there are hundreds of vaccines and ZERO have ever had side effects more than a few weeks out. That is why they insist the trials run for at least 2 months. Now, maybe you make the case that the new mRNA vaccines are new technology, so we are not sure. OK, then take the J&J vaccine when it is approved next month - that is OLD PROVEN TECHNOLOGY. On top of that, you do realize this is a few micrograms of material that can't replicate right? You should read the boxes you are eating your food out of and by WAY more worried about all the chemicals in that than in these vaccines.
4. Lots of people dying from the vaccine - please refer to number 2 above, but let me say that like 8000 people die every day in the USA, mostly the elderly but not exclusively. The chances of a few of those having had the vaccine in the past few days is just about certain since we are giving 1.3 million doses a day. EVERY ONE OF THESE is being publicized in the media, and they are all being investigated by the CDC. NONE have been found to be caused by the vaccine, and they won't be. This notion is as crazy as people who think vaccines cause Autism because some crazy actress said it did.
5. Masks and shutdowns. ok, so have you noticed that the places that have the toughest mask mandates and lockdowns have had the biggest spikes???? I can read a graph, Masks do zero. Lockdowns are effective, IF they are like the Chinese and you actually lock everyone down, but we don't do that and can't, so the virus keeps spreading. It makes our rulers feel good, but just hurts small business.
6. Tracking - here we get to it. We have laws in this country- a right to privacy, HIPAA, ADA that will prevent this. Also, I believe the vast majority including most of us who will be getting vacinated don't think it is good. It is tyranny and fascism. It is mainly being pushed by the "My body, my choice" crowd, but I guess this is somehow different when it actually IS my body? I think not. The difference between this and requiring vaccinations in schools to me comes down to this - if you don't want to get vaccinated, that is up to you, if you don't want to vaccinate your kids, that is hurting another human being- have you seen the results of getting polio? Not vaccinating your kids with proven vaccines that have been around for decades and been proven safe is just wrong. Sorry. Even that is pushing the line to some extent, but the line IS a grey one, we all know that.
7. Herd immunity- yes, this is important. Even the 20 and 30 somethings should get vacinnated so we reach herd immunity - the main reason is these annoying variants. If you have lots of people with Covid, lots of chances for variants, if not, less chances. Simple as that. The quicker we get to herd immunity, the better.

Here is my bottom line- If you have had Covid-19 with minor symptoms, I believe you should wait until at least the summer to get vaccinated - you have the antibodies and even if you get it again, probably won't be bad. Let others get vacinnated first. If you have not and are over 50, I think you are crazy not to get vaccinated unless you have serious allergic reactions to things. If you have concerns, get the J&J vaccine that should be available in March. If you don't, it's like playing Russian roulette, sorry, it is if you don't get vaccinated. ALL 3 vaccines have had ZERO people end up in the hospital with Covid after being vaccinated, it makes it non deadly. I do understand the people who are 30 that work for me saying they don't need it, but even most of them are going to get it after the older people do, so we can reach herd immunity and maybe we can get rid of it completely - we will see.

[Two Bills]

Myself, my family, my neighbors, and millions of others have already had COVID and are naturally immune.

Vaccines train our immune systems to create proteins that fight disease, known as ‘antibodies’, just as would happen when we are exposed to a disease . Even people without symptoms develop an immune response. - WHO (World Health Organization)

People with underlying health conditions that weaken their immune systems (such as cancer or HIV) or who have severe allergies to some vaccine components may not be able to get vaccinated - WHO (World Health Organization)

Vaccines can cause anaphylaxis and other dangerous life-threatening side effects. - NIH (National Institute of Health)

Example: The United States stopped giving mandatory smallpox vaccinations 30 years ago. Some people die from it; and others have serious reactions, some permanent. Scientists say it's the most dangerous vaccine known to man. - CBS News, 60 Minutes

These new COVID vaccines were rushed into use with extremely short trial periods. According to the IFPMA, the development of novel vaccines is a long endeavor. It takes usually between 10 to 15 years to develop a novel vaccine, as well as establishing its quality, safety and efficacy. - International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers & Associations

Thus, for those who have had COVID, getting vaccinated is not only pointless but potentially dangerous. - David H. Dallas, RN-ASN, EMT-P, retired


A lot of research says those immunity anti-bodies are not that long lasting, and start to reduce after months, not years.
Just what I have read in several reports.

[jimjamuser]

Is anyone old enough to remember smallpox? The last diagnosed case in the world was in the 1970's. Totally eradicated!! This could not have been achieved if vaccination had been optional.
Smallpox is making a comeback in some 3rd world countries and it could also be in the anti-vaxxers in the US.

[Byte1]

Myself, my family, my neighbors, and millions of others have already had COVID and are naturally immune.

Vaccines train our immune systems to create proteins that fight disease, known as ‘antibodies’, just as would happen when we are exposed to a disease . Even people without symptoms develop an immune response. - WHO (World Health Organization)

People with underlying health conditions that weaken their immune systems (such as cancer or HIV) or who have severe allergies to some vaccine components may not be able to get vaccinated - WHO (World Health Organization)

Vaccines can cause anaphylaxis and other dangerous life-threatening side effects. - NIH (National Institute of Health)

Example: The United States stopped giving mandatory smallpox vaccinations 30 years ago. Some people die from it; and others have serious reactions, some permanent. Scientists say it's the most dangerous vaccine known to man. - CBS News, 60 Minutes

These new COVID vaccines were rushed into use with extremely short trial periods. According to the IFPMA, the development of novel vaccines is a long endeavor. It takes usually between 10 to 15 years to develop a novel vaccine, as well as establishing its quality, safety and efficacy. - International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers & Associations

Thus, for those who have had COVID, getting vaccinated is not only pointless but potentially dangerous. - David H. Dallas, RN-ASN, EMT-P, retired

You may be in error. I was told by my doctor that immunity from this virus only lasts about three months. I don't care if you get the shot or not, but I hope you are not basing your decision on false hopes.

[jimjamuser]

Ask yourself why is it now illegal to report deaths from the vaccine. Why is there no place on a death certificate for death related to the vaccine. Coffee bean stop being so narrow minded about this subject. The actual amount of deaths from the vaccine would shock you. And the percentage grows astronomically the older you are. Most of us have gone back to life as we knew it. Other than being FORCED to wear a mask where you work. Yes FORCED. Over and over again masks have been proven to cause more harm than good, yet here we are a year later still wearing diapers on our faces like good little sheep. Anyone wanting digital proof of a vaccine is a fool. Anyone wanting mandated vaccines is a fool. And you saying they should be required to attend concerts, sporting events, public transportation etc is pure selfishness. Not surprising but yet selfish. The amount of deaths and tragic side effects from this virtually untested vaccine is astonishing, but thanks to the selfish people out there who choose to blindly follow the herd, these deaths are acceptable. How sad.
This post is the 1st time that I have heard about tragic reactions and deaths from the vaccine. And I watch a lot of news on TV. It is CV that IS causing reactions, long haul symptoms, and deaths. Be real about this!

[Byte1]

It is my understanding that the CDC (ie THE FEDERAL GOVT) knows who is getting vaccinated. Didn't we have to give our SSN when we registered online? If so, we will not be using the little card they gave us (which is easily forged) to prove we got our shots.

kathy

Nope, you do not have to give your SSN when you register on line.

[Trishakaye]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html).

Ive been vaccinated but have you really considered all aspects of tracking citizens movements?

[LoriL]

We are not supposed to direct comments directly to another person. Your term "anti-laxer" is very offensive. There are many who do not want this vaccine or any other for many reasons. I believe this vaccine mandate would be unconstitutional. Plus this entire pandemic was proven to be over exaggerated by numbers of infected and number of deaths. How often have we heard about number of survivors?

[Trishakaye]

We don’t even know yet if the vaccine works. Collecting data will take several years

[LoriL]

Could not have said it better! Thank you.

[Topspinmo]

You are trackable now. Welcome to US of A

Anybody that has cell phone is tracked and spied on. Social media and web site are tracking and spying on you. Plus selling you’re private information, how do you think CEO become billionaires by offer free site? FB, shy-ter, google, ( who owns utube now), -sswhoo, and dozens more. You don’t get something for nothing in cyberspace.

[jimjamuser]

Anybody that has cell phone is tracked and spied on. Social media and web site are tracking and spying on you. Plus selling you’re private information, how do you think CEO become billionaires by offer free site? FB, shy-ter, google, ( who owns utube now), -sswhoo, and dozens more. You don’t get something for nothing in cyberspace.
The concept of Facebook is good. The prime owner is a problem.

[LoriL]

You just said it. Those who choose not to be vaccinated are punished by the government! That is not who we are.

[LoriL]

ExecChef, you nailed it! Thank you.

[JoMar]

You just said it. Those who choose not to be vaccinated are punished by the government! That is not who we are.

Yes it is....those that voluntarily choose to put others in harm's way should be punished. Just because people don't believe the science or the statistics doesn't give them any more right to put others in danger. Taking care of each other is who we are and even if you don't believe you could participate to keep those that do safe.

[Byte1]

No..you see the goal here is to get everyone vaccinated so the world can open up again...not so they can continue to sit home. So what is best for all....not just you..is to get vaccinated and get out there and live again without worry. Its not a hard concept...kind of like the store, no mask..no entry.....you don't like it. Go elsewhere

That's just your opinion. Personally, I am not worried about everyone else getting the vaccination. And I do not care if I get the virus, since I know of at least two dozen that have had it and shrugged it off easier than a common cold. And I am in better shape than almost all of them. So, you see just because some are ruled by fear and insist on fear mongering, I do not allow unproven statements influence my opinion. If you wish to get the shot, so be it. Just don't insist I do the same FOR YOU. If I decide to get the shot, I will do it solely for my spouse, not you or anyone else that insists that everyone do what you wish them to do. I have been to a leprosy colony and I know what some folks ignorant fear mongering can do to ostracize folks when they are not well informed with legitimate facts.
Facts so far that seem to be proven:
More folks over 65yo die of covid than under 65.
More folks survive covid infection than die from it.
Most young folks that are infected with the virus, suffer little if any from it.
The population of the U.S. over 65yo is about 16.5%.
40-50% of those that tested positive have been asymptomatic.
For those over 65yo the mortality to infection rate is about 5.6%. [of those infected]

By examining stats, one can determine if someone is blowing smoke up your rear and fear mongering. On the other hand, information is powerful and gives you the satisfaction of knowing that you are not basing your decision on hysteria, but on evidence/facts.

I am not an anti-vaxxer, but I prefer to weigh the options and see if the action of participating out weighs the long term effects.
Things to know:
How long will the immunity last? six months? three months?
How great is my existing immunity? Will this increase my survival or weaken it?
Why is the infection rate increasing, but deaths from the virus DECREASING? Will the death rate level off or drop down to an acceptable level of risk?
Things that will not influence my decision:
What other folks think that have no more information than me.
What other folks demand as far as conformance to their specifications.
Someone else's opinion of non-conformance, and insisting that they are morally superior when evidence/facts does not support their disingenuous outrage.

I am not a threat as I do not have COVID so telling me that I need to conform to your standard has little effect on my need to protect you from the evil plague.

[Schaumburger]

Ask yourself why is it now illegal to report deaths from the vaccine. Why is there no place on a death certificate for death related to the vaccine. Coffee bean stop being so narrow minded about this subject. The actual amount of deaths from the vaccine would shock you. And the percentage grows astronomically the older you are. Most of us have gone back to life as we knew it. Other than being FORCED to wear a mask where you work. Yes FORCED. Over and over again masks have been proven to cause more harm than good, yet here we are a year later still wearing diapers on our faces like good little sheep. Anyone wanting digital proof of a vaccine is a fool. Anyone wanting mandated vaccines is a fool. And you saying they should be required to attend concerts, sporting events, public transportation etc is pure selfishness. Not surprising but yet selfish. The amount of deaths and tragic side effects from this virtually untested vaccine is astonishing, but thanks to the selfish people out there who choose to blindly follow the herd, these deaths are acceptable. How sad.

What is your source for the statements about people dying after receiving the COVID-19 vaccine? Also what is the source for the statement that it is illegal to report deaths from the vaccine? How is it possible for an individual to gain access to all the death certificates issued in the U.S. since the vaccine became available in December to see if the vaccine could be listed as a cause of death?

If having a to wear a face mask when working in my office (before my employer went all remote again in early November) or in a retail store is the most burdensome thing I have been asked to do, I have certainly led a most fortunate life. I think about what PPE my nieces and friends in health care have to wear when they are on duty in the the hospitals they work at.

My 90 year old father is anxious to get the vaccine so he can attend in-person church again. I hope he can get the vaccine within a few weeks. As for me, I am under 65, so realistically I may not be able to get the vaccine before June 1. i will be glad to get the vaccine when I am eligible. I would like to visit my father without worrying that I am an asymptomatic carrier. I want to sing with my church choir again...something that hasn't happened since mid-March last year. I would like to return to in-person church services again. I would like to attend live theater with my theater friends again. I haven't seen the majority of my coworkers in person for almost a year now. I would love for my youngest niece, who is a freshman in college, to be able to take her classes in person, not via Zoom. So for this person, and a lot of other people I know, life has has not returned to what it was before mid-March 2020. But hey, I'm just a sheep, so what do I know?

[Swoop]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

Realistically the federal government can not mandate that you get the vaccine. Private business can certainly require that their employees are vaccinated. I doubt that private businesses such as cruise lines would require their customers be vaccinated. They operate worldwide and thus far other countries are even less willing than Americans to receive the vaccine.
My question is, if you get the vaccine, why are you concerned if I don’t? You are the one who is “protected”.

[oldtimes]

Realistically the federal government can not mandate that you get the vaccine. Private business can certainly require that their employees are vaccinated. I doubt that private businesses such as cruise lines would require their customers be vaccinated. They operate worldwide and thus far other countries are even less willing than Americans to receive the vaccine.
My question is, if you get the vaccine, why are you concerned if I don’t? You are the one who is “protected”.

:bigbow:

[Bev Fricks]

I can tell you this! I am an RN and I do COVID-19 vaccinations. I have access to the cards that YOU think can be forged!! How dare you?? We are professionals and NO ONE where I work would ever forge anything! We have licenses to protect. These cards are not left out to the public, just like the vaccines, they are protected by lock and key. Let's tattoo it on your forehead so you feel better.
Bev, RN.

[stanley]

People hear that concept all the time - like in church - like the 10 commandments. Do unto others as you would do to yourself.

That's not how it goes at all

[stanley]

....those that voluntarily choose to put others in harm's way should be punished. .

So who would do the "punishing" and what should the "punishment" be?

[Altavia]

I am specifically going to not reply directly to anyone here, but write a post based on reading the whole thread. Overall a decent discussion, but there were a few HUGE falsehoods too, one that was scarey in how off base it was. Please read my whole post before you comment. Let me preface by saying I am still working and own 2 houses in TV. I am 57 and have an Engineering degree and an MBA and my wife, who agrees with everything I am going to write is a nurse with 35 years of experience and now is a district nurse in a school system. We are both conservatives. My wife has been vacinated with the Pfizer vaccine, my CNA daughter with the Moderna, as well as my daughter in law who is a Dental assistant. I will get vaccinated as soon as I can.
I have read everything on the vaccines INCLUDING the entire scientific reports on the Moderna and Pfizer phase 1/2 and 3 studies. I will read the J&J when it is available. What's more important is I UNDERSTAND THE STATISTICS AND WHAT THEY MEAN. I have taught basic statistics at the college level in fact as an adjunct professor.

1. This virus is a real pain in the butt. For the VAST majority of people, it is no big deal(I have MANY employees that have had it, for most it was a headache or being tired a few days). HOWEVER, for some, especially the old, it kills them. It also does kill a small number of people you would not expect it to seamingly at random. For the most part it really does not hurt kids. Seriously, it is way less deadly to those under 25 than the Flu. People that are worried about their kids or grandkids should stop - worry about your elderly relatives in The Villages! I would rather get the vaccine than play russian roulette with my life.
2. These vaccines are effective and SAFE. The sample sizes in this study are HUGE. The p values are such that application of these statistics to conclusions about the population is basically a certainty. There are some side effects that pass quickly. The one side effect that happens in people with a history of alergic reactions can be treated with an Epi pen. NOBODY HAS DIED FROM THE VACCINE in the trials. Statistically, based on the trial data, it would be more likely that you have a car accident while being struck by lightning and having a heart attack all at the same time than dying from this vaccine.
3. Long term side effects- ok, seriously? What crazyperson have you been listening to that you got the video from your consiracy theory loving cousin in Facebook personal messenger? Come on, we all are getting this crazy crap. So here is the reality - there are hundreds of vaccines and ZERO have ever had side effects more than a few weeks out. That is why they insist the trials run for at least 2 months. Now, maybe you make the case that the new mRNA vaccines are new technology, so we are not sure. OK, then take the J&J vaccine when it is approved next month - that is OLD PROVEN TECHNOLOGY. On top of that, you do realize this is a few micrograms of material that can't replicate right? You should read the boxes you are eating your food out of and by WAY more worried about all the chemicals in that than in these vaccines.
4. Lots of people dying from the vaccine - please refer to number 2 above, but let me say that like 8000 people die every day in the USA, mostly the elderly but not exclusively. The chances of a few of those having had the vaccine in the past few days is just about certain since we are giving 1.3 million doses a day. EVERY ONE OF THESE is being publicized in the media, and they are all being investigated by the CDC. NONE have been found to be caused by the vaccine, and they won't be. This notion is as crazy as people who think vaccines cause Autism because some crazy actress said it did.
5. Masks and shutdowns. ok, so have you noticed that the places that have the toughest mask mandates and lockdowns have had the biggest spikes???? I can read a graph, Masks do zero. Lockdowns are effective, IF they are like the Chinese and you actually lock everyone down, but we don't do that and can't, so the virus keeps spreading. It makes our rulers feel good, but just hurts small business.
6. Tracking - here we get to it. We have laws in this country- a right to privacy, HIPAA, ADA that will prevent this. Also, I believe the vast majority including most of us who will be getting vacinated don't think it is good. It is tyranny and fascism. It is mainly being pushed by the "My body, my choice" crowd, but I guess this is somehow different when it actually IS my body? I think not. The difference between this and requiring vaccinations in schools to me comes down to this - if you don't want to get vaccinated, that is up to you, if you don't want to vaccinate your kids, that is hurting another human being- have you seen the results of getting polio? Not vaccinating your kids with proven vaccines that have been around for decades and been proven safe is just wrong. Sorry. Even that is pushing the line to some extent, but the line IS a grey one, we all know that.
7. Herd immunity- yes, this is important. Even the 20 and 30 somethings should get vacinnated so we reach herd immunity - the main reason is these annoying variants. If you have lots of people with Covid, lots of chances for variants, if not, less chances. Simple as that. The quicker we get to herd immunity, the better.

Here is my bottom line- If you have had Covid-19 with minor symptoms, I believe you should wait until at least the summer to get vaccinated - you have the antibodies and even if you get it again, probably won't be bad. Let others get vacinnated first. If you have not and are over 50, I think you are crazy not to get vaccinated unless you have serious allergic reactions to things. If you have concerns, get the J&J vaccine that should be available in March. If you don't, it's like playing Russian roulette, sorry, it is if you don't get vaccinated. ALL 3 vaccines have had ZERO people end up in the hospital with Covid after being vaccinated, it makes it non deadly. I do understand the people who are 30 that work for me saying they don't need it, but even most of them are going to get it after the older people do, so we can reach herd immunity and maybe we can get rid of it completely - we will see.

Excellent synthesis of the facts - thanks!

[oneclickplus]

So glad there is digital proof of vaccination in the works. Paper proof is so easily forged and is basically worthless.

I want to see vaccination mandated for public transportation, getting on cruise ships, entrance to theme parks, entrance to sporting events, entrance to concerts and so much more. The list is endless. Maybe some of you anti-vaxers will change your minds about getting the shot.

Microsoft, Salesforce and Oracle working on Covid vaccination passport (https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/14/microsoft-salesforce-and-oracle-working-on-covid-vaccination-passport.html)

You sound like a true totalitarian dictator. Move to Venezuela and run for office.

[oneclickplus]

Mandating vaccines is un-American. My body my choice

That is exactly correct. I (anyone) have the right to refuse to be vaccinated. My body, my choice. My right to make this choice is in the SAME paragraph of the constitution where a woman can choose to have an abortion. Go look it up - it's right there in plain text.

And don't think about arguing that failure to get vaccinated puts others at risk. Getting an abortion is 100% lethal to someone else. This stupid virus is weak and has only a 0.3% chance of death and most of those are the very old and sick.

[oneclickplus]

Anti-trackers = anti-vaxxers.

Proud anti-vaxxer here. And I'm in the majority.

Most healthcare workers declining the vaccine. What do they know?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/nursing-homes-vaccine-decline/2021/01/27/22a602f6-5fe2-11eb-afbe-9a11a127d146_story.html

[Packer Fan]

Myself, my family, my neighbors, and millions of others have already had COVID and are naturally immune.

Vaccines train our immune systems to create proteins that fight disease, known as ‘antibodies’, just as would happen when we are exposed to a disease . Even people without symptoms develop an immune response. - WHO (World Health Organization)

People with underlying health conditions that weaken their immune systems (such as cancer or HIV) or who have severe allergies to some vaccine components may not be able to get vaccinated - WHO (World Health Organization)

Vaccines can cause anaphylaxis and other dangerous life-threatening side effects. - NIH (National Institute of Health)

Example: The United States stopped giving mandatory smallpox vaccinations 30 years ago. Some people die from it; and others have serious reactions, some permanent. Scientists say it's the most dangerous vaccine known to man. - CBS News, 60 Minutes

These new COVID vaccines were rushed into use with extremely short trial periods. According to the IFPMA, the development of novel vaccines is a long endeavor. It takes usually between 10 to 15 years to develop a novel vaccine, as well as establishing its quality, safety and efficacy. - International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers & Associations

Thus, for those who have had COVID, getting vaccinated is not only pointless but potentially dangerous. - David H. Dallas, RN-ASN, EMT-P, retired

Just to clarify one thing - the reason we don't get smallpox vaccinations anymore is Smallpox is EXTINCT due to the Vaccine. It was such a horrible disease that enough people got the vaccine to kill Smallpox forever. We should be thankful for that.

As far as getting the vaccine if you have had it. I am fine with that logic, but we don't know how long your immunity will last. It is hard to blame you, especially if you had a very mild case.

[Packer Fan]

Smallpox is making a comeback in some 3rd world countries and it could also be in the anti-vaxxers in the US.

Where did you hear that? It is incorrect, no smallpox on the planet for decades, believe me, you want a global pandemic - that would be way worse.

[kathyspear]

I can tell you this! I am an RN and I do COVID-19 vaccinations. I have access to the cards that YOU think can be forged!! How dare you?? We are professionals and NO ONE where I work would ever forge anything! We have licenses to protect. These cards are not left out to the public, just like the vaccines, they are protected by lock and key. Let's tattoo it on your forehead so you feel better.
Bev, RN.

Are you talking about those "COVID-19 Vaccination Record Card" things they give you where they jot down what vaccine you got and when? You don't honestly believe that those would be difficult to forge, do you? I don't think anyone is insinuating that medical people will be handing them out to un-vax'd people. However, someone with a good printer can run them off by the thousands and sell them to people if that is all it takes to get a "digital passport".

All my card says is that I got a Pfizer shot on 1/15 (no lot number) given by "EMS" (no name). They didn't ask me to fill out my name or DOB, either. Those are still blank. I guess I will fill them in before I drive to Leesburg on Friday for shot #2.

k.

[Aces4]

It could also be profitable because socially conscious people may patronize those businesses.

Socially conscience people wouldn’t force people to receive vaccinations if they reject them. What country is this anyway?

[Aces4]

Anti-trackers = anti-vaxxers.

Trackers=Big Brother

[Velvet]

What about segregating those who vaccinate from those who don’t? ;) They could have their own country, own health system....

[Two Bills]

All these claims of huge numbers dying from vaccination in secret, and not one source is posted when asked.
Do you honestly think that some posters on here are party to this information, and yet the media is in the dark.
C'mon son!!

[Mac1996]

China demands that everyone be obedient.Let’s not forget where this virus came from.

[Scott O]

I can tell you this! I am an RN and I do COVID-19 vaccinations. I have access to the cards that YOU think can be forged!! How dare you?? We are professionals and NO ONE where I work would ever forge anything! We have licenses to protect. These cards are not left out to the public, just like the vaccines, they are protected by lock and key. Let's tattoo it on your forehead so you feel better.
Bev, RN.
Thank you!!

[Scott O]

But it most certainly is your choice. It is your choice not to partake in activities and all sorts of other daily life events that can help to spread the virus. Folks that are vaccinated will not spread the virus and therefore should be able to partake in all activities life has to offer.

I see I have hurt some feelings here and so sorry you do not see it my way. But.....that is the way it is. My wishes may not come to fruition so there is that, if that makes you feel any better.

Over and out. I'm done with this conversation.
But that is the way it’s is?? Oh really did you start legislating laws? Give me a break, and your done? You started your condemnation of freedom, so live with your gaslighting....insert multiple eye rolls...

[Scott O]

Wow!! You are the narrow-minded. No one is saying you have to get a vaccine. But if you are going to any public event, or even private event, you better have had the shot...otherwise..dont come....now, is that so difficult to get thru your head?
Yes it is, and a lot of you believe you have the right to block our rights...I don’t think so..

[Stuholden]

Today you are tracked by your phone, your activity on the web, the messages you send and databases are built profiling your every detail by companies you've never heard of.
It's a conjuring trick; you worry about a chip while your emotions are tracked (Amazon), the church you attend, the liquor store you visit and your political views are all bought and sold.

Delta is now using facial recognition from curbside to boarding - just smile at the camera - I don't see a need for a vaccine passport - they'll use your face.

[golfing eagles]

Is anyone old enough to remember smallpox? The last diagnosed case in the world was in the 1970's. Totally eradicated!! This could not have been achieved if vaccination had been optional.

Vaccination WAS optional

Smallpox was eradicated because there was an effective vaccine, but more importantly the disease was confined to humans with no animal reservoirs

[golfing eagles]

About 15 years ago I had an allergic reaction to amoxicillin, it makes me cautious.

And what does a penicillin allergy have to do with a synthetic messenger RNA vaccine???? I once tripped over my own feet, so now I'm afraid to walk:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl: (Actually that makes more sense than a PCN allergy)

[golfing eagles]

What difference does it make????? Are you kidding?
Get the dam shot- or just stay home.

Is that the 2021 version of "wear the damn mask"????, aka do what I want you to

[golfing eagles]

Wow!! You are the narrow-minded. No one is saying you have to get a vaccine. But if you are going to any public event, or even private event, you better have had the shot...otherwise..dont come....now, is that so difficult to get thru your head?

By all means, let's make the unvaccinated wear a scarlet "C". Thomas Jefferson and friends are rolling over in their graves

[golfing eagles]

Anti-trackers = anti-vaxxers.

YOU CAN'T BE SERIOUS! Or are you, comrade?

[golfing eagles]

But it most certainly is your choice. It is your choice not to partake in activities and all sorts of other daily life events that can help to spread the virus. Folks that are vaccinated will not spread the virus and therefore should be able to partake in all activities life has to offer.

I see I have hurt some feelings here and so sorry you do not see it my way. But.....that is the way it is. My wishes may not come to fruition so there is that, if that makes you feel any better.

Over and out. I'm done with this conversation.

Probably 99% of Americans don't see it "your way"

[golfing eagles]

I am specifically going to not reply directly to anyone here, but write a post based on reading the whole thread. Overall a decent discussion, but there were a few HUGE falsehoods too, one that was scarey in how off base it was. Please read my whole post before you comment. Let me preface by saying I am still working and own 2 houses in TV. I am 57 and have an Engineering degree and an MBA and my wife, who agrees with everything I am going to write is a nurse with 35 years of experience and now is a district nurse in a school system. We are both conservatives. My wife has been vacinated with the Pfizer vaccine, my CNA daughter with the Moderna, as well as my daughter in law who is a Dental assistant. I will get vaccinated as soon as I can.
I have read everything on the vaccines INCLUDING the entire scientific reports on the Moderna and Pfizer phase 1/2 and 3 studies. I will read the J&J when it is available. What's more important is I UNDERSTAND THE STATISTICS AND WHAT THEY MEAN. I have taught basic statistics at the college level in fact as an adjunct professor.

1. This virus is a real pain in the butt. For the VAST majority of people, it is no big deal(I have MANY employees that have had it, for most it was a headache or being tired a few days). HOWEVER, for some, especially the old, it kills them. It also does kill a small number of people you would not expect it to seamingly at random. For the most part it really does not hurt kids. Seriously, it is way less deadly to those under 25 than the Flu. People that are worried about their kids or grandkids should stop - worry about your elderly relatives in The Villages! I would rather get the vaccine than play russian roulette with my life.
2. These vaccines are effective and SAFE. The sample sizes in this study are HUGE. The p values are such that application of these statistics to conclusions about the population is basically a certainty. There are some side effects that pass quickly. The one side effect that happens in people with a history of alergic reactions can be treated with an Epi pen. NOBODY HAS DIED FROM THE VACCINE in the trials. Statistically, based on the trial data, it would be more likely that you have a car accident while being struck by lightning and having a heart attack all at the same time than dying from this vaccine.
3. Long term side effects- ok, seriously? What crazyperson have you been listening to that you got the video from your consiracy theory loving cousin in Facebook personal messenger? Come on, we all are getting this crazy crap. So here is the reality - there are hundreds of vaccines and ZERO have ever had side effects more than a few weeks out. That is why they insist the trials run for at least 2 months. Now, maybe you make the case that the new mRNA vaccines are new technology, so we are not sure. OK, then take the J&J vaccine when it is approved next month - that is OLD PROVEN TECHNOLOGY. On top of that, you do realize this is a few micrograms of material that can't replicate right? You should read the boxes you are eating your food out of and by WAY more worried about all the chemicals in that than in these vaccines.
4. Lots of people dying from the vaccine - please refer to number 2 above, but let me say that like 8000 people die every day in the USA, mostly the elderly but not exclusively. The chances of a few of those having had the vaccine in the past few days is just about certain since we are giving 1.3 million doses a day. EVERY ONE OF THESE is being publicized in the media, and they are all being investigated by the CDC. NONE have been found to be caused by the vaccine, and they won't be. This notion is as crazy as people who think vaccines cause Autism because some crazy actress said it did.
5. Masks and shutdowns. ok, so have you noticed that the places that have the toughest mask mandates and lockdowns have had the biggest spikes???? I can read a graph, Masks do zero. Lockdowns are effective, IF they are like the Chinese and you actually lock everyone down, but we don't do that and can't, so the virus keeps spreading. It makes our rulers feel good, but just hurts small business.
6. Tracking - here we get to it. We have laws in this country- a right to privacy, HIPAA, ADA that will prevent this. Also, I believe the vast majority including most of us who will be getting vacinated don't think it is good. It is tyranny and fascism. It is mainly being pushed by the "My body, my choice" crowd, but I guess this is somehow different when it actually IS my body? I think not. The difference between this and requiring vaccinations in schools to me comes down to this - if you don't want to get vaccinated, that is up to you, if you don't want to vaccinate your kids, that is hurting another human being- have you seen the results of getting polio? Not vaccinating your kids with proven vaccines that have been around for decades and been proven safe is just wrong. Sorry. Even that is pushing the line to some extent, but the line IS a grey one, we all know that.
7. Herd immunity- yes, this is important. Even the 20 and 30 somethings should get vacinnated so we reach herd immunity - the main reason is these annoying variants. If you have lots of people with Covid, lots of chances for variants, if not, less chances. Simple as that. The quicker we get to herd immunity, the better.

Here is my bottom line- If you have had Covid-19 with minor symptoms, I believe you should wait until at least the summer to get vaccinated - you have the antibodies and even if you get it again, probably won't be bad. Let others get vacinnated first. If you have not and are over 50, I think you are crazy not to get vaccinated unless you have serious allergic reactions to things. If you have concerns, get the J&J vaccine that should be available in March. If you don't, it's like playing Russian roulette, sorry, it is if you don't get vaccinated. ALL 3 vaccines have had ZERO people end up in the hospital with Covid after being vaccinated, it makes it non deadly. I do understand the people who are 30 that work for me saying they don't need it, but even most of them are going to get it after the older people do, so we can reach herd immunity and maybe we can get rid of it completely - we will see.

Absolutely, positively 110% right on! Now, if only the paranoid among us would read your post and understand it.........

[golfing eagles]

Smallpox is making a comeback in some 3rd world countries and it could also be in the anti-vaxxers in the US.

Source????Proof????? Oh, I thought so.
Don't go around spreading crap and tell me you are fertilizing TOTV

[riley2011]

Maybe it’s none of your business who gets the vaccine. Take care of yourself.

[Trishakaye]

Do you know how many people died from TB in 2020?

[Mrodmh]

The flu vaccine is NOT required for school kids. Nor is Gardisil or meningitis vaccines. Your suggestions are very alarming and your assumptions are just that. You have unwarranted faith in the experimental drugs. Time will tell.

[Pat2015]

Not everyone is going to be able to take this vaccine due to their medical history. Sounds a little Nazi/Communist like to dictate to people what they are required to do to their own body. Are yellow stars going to be issued/required so we can easily identify who the people are who haven’t gotten the vaccine?

[oldtimes]

Absolutely, positively 110% right on! Now, if only the paranoid among us would read your post and understand it.........

My question is since so many people get the virus and have little or no symptoms how do they even know how many people have actually had it? Could we be reaching herd immunity and not even know it?

[golfing eagles]

My question is since so many people get the virus and have little or no symptoms how do they even know how many people have actually had it? Could we be reaching herd immunity and not even know it?

Possible but unlikely. The only way to know would be to test over 1/2 the population for antibodies. Maybe a previous poster would like to "mandate" that as well:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[oldtimes]

Possible but unlikely. The only way to know would be to test over 1/2 the population for antibodies. Maybe a previous poster would like to "mandate" that as well:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

So everyone should get the vaccine even if they might have had the virus?

[thelegges]

My question is since so many people get the virus and have little or no symptoms how do they even know how many people have actually had it? Could we be reaching herd immunity and not even know it?

Interview this morning with George Stephanopoulos and the president of Moderna.
Moderna stated that we could possibly reach herd immunity with 50 to 70% vaccinations.He hopes that percentage will be by June. So the myth of 100% vaccinated may not be true. But who to believe the President of Moderna, or a posters on TOTV, that those who can’t take the vaccine should be hunted down. I’m going with Moderna President and Physician

Six months from now I hope there is more intelligent conversations on this site other than vaccines and masks.

[coffeebean]

I can tell you this! I am an RN and I do COVID-19 vaccinations. I have access to the cards that YOU think can be forged!! How dare you?? We are professionals and NO ONE where I work would ever forge anything! We have licenses to protect. These cards are not left out to the public, just like the vaccines, they are protected by lock and key. Let's tattoo it on your forehead so you feel better.
Bev, RN.

I never implied health care workers would forge the vaccination card but there are plenty of bad people out there that will. I'm not the only person who believes a Covid vaccination card can be forged. Blank Covid Vaccination cards are already on the internet. I'm sure there are plenty of tech savvy folks who will print these cards. This is just one example. and the reason a digital record is the better way to go.

I don't know how to post a photo on this site so all I can do is provide a link........

COVID-19 vaccination card :: WRAL.com (https://www.wral.com/covid-19-vaccination-card/19429713/)

[oldtimes]

Six months from now I hope there is more intelligent conversations on this site other than vaccines and masks.

:1rotfl: Let's remember that this is still TOTV.

[golfing eagles]

I never implied health care workers would forge the vaccination card but there are plenty of bad people out there that will. I'm not the only person who believes a Covid vaccination card can be forged. Blank Covid Vaccination cards are already on the internet. I'm sure there are plenty of tech savvy folks who will print these cards. This is just one example. and the reason a digital record is the better way to go.

I don't know how to post a photo on this site so all I can do is provide a link........

COVID-19 vaccination card :: WRAL.com (https://www.wral.com/covid-19-vaccination-card/19429713/)

So, do people walk around with "digital proof" they had the polio vaccine, or pertussis??? The following from the CDC lists diseases with an available vaccine. Together these illnesses have killed hundreds of millions yet they are not "mandated" and no one has suggested we carry "digital proof" of any. In the scheme of things, as pandemics go, COVID is a minor player. It is the "flavor of the month", what amazes me is the reaction to COVID is so much different than avian flu, or SARS or MERS or swine flu. It has been a polarizing force, given birth to a new religion (the holy mask), changed social interactions, changed education and the workplace. Now there are those that would sacrifice our rights and freedoms for what they perceiveas a little safety, enforced by the government, and them cram their ideas down everyone else's throat. Seig heil!

List of Vaccines Used in United States
Links to Clinical info about the vaccine

Adenovirus
Anthrax
AVA (BioThrax)
Cholera
Vaxchora
Diphtheria
DTaP (Daptacel, Infanrix)
Td (Tenivac, generic)
DT (-generic-)
Tdap (Adacel, Boostrix)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Hepatitis A
HepA (Havrix, Vaqta)
HepA-HepB (Twinrix)
Hepatitis B
HepB (Engerix-B, Recombivax HB, Heplisav-B)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
HepA-HepB (Twinrix)
Haemophilus influenzae type b (Hib)
Hib (ActHIB, PedvaxHIB, Hiberix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Human Papillomavirus (HPV)
HPV9 (Gardasil 9) (For scientific papers, the preferred abbreviation is 9vHPV)
Seasonal Influenza (Flu) only
IIV* (Afluria, Fluad, Flublok, Flucelvax, FluLaval, Fluarix, Fluvirin, Fluzone, Fluzone High-Dose, Fluzone Intradermal)
*There are various acronyms for inactivated flu vaccines – IIV3, IIV4, RIV3, RIV4 and ccIIV4.
LAIV (FluMist)
Japanese Encephalitis
JE (Ixiaro)
Measles
MMR (M-M-R II)
MMRV (ProQuad)
Meningococcal
MenACWY (Menactra, Menveo)
MenB (Bexsero, Trumenba)
Mumps
MMR (M-M-R II)
MMRV (ProQuad)
Pertussis
DTaP (Daptacel, Infanrix)
Tdap (Adacel, Boostrix)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Pneumococcal
PCV13 (Prevnar13)
PPSV23 (Pneumovax 23)
Polio
Polio (Ipol)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Rabies
Rabies (Imovax Rabies, RabAvert)
Rotavirus
RV1 (Rotarix)
RV5 (RotaTeq)
Rubella
MMR (M-M-R II)
MMRV (ProQuad)
Shingles
RZV (Shingrix)
Smallpox
Vaccinia (ACAM2000):
Tetanus
DTaP (Daptacel, Infanrix)
Td (Tenivac, generic)
DT (-generic-)
Tdap (Adacel, Boostrix)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Tuberculosis
Typhoid Fever
Typhoid Oral (Vivotif)
Typhoid Polysaccharide (Typhim Vi)
Varicella
VAR (Varivax)
MMRV (ProQuad):
Yellow Fever
YF (YF-Vax)

[allenpegg1@gmail.com]

BS. Of all the stores REQUIRING masks, how many people NOT wearing a mask have you seen thrown out of the store, arrested, shot, etc???

[lpkruege1]

No worries by the time the cruise ships are up and running, the first vaccine may not be effective for the next strain. And so it begins. There are many who can’t take the vaccine, not won’t, but can’t. Those who are in treatment, pregnancy, or allergic reactions, may never get clearance for the current vaccine. The minute you fill out paperwork for vaccine, and answer YES to
Have you ever had an allergic reaction to any vaccine, or medication
Have you used an epi pen personally, or treated at a healthcare facility for a reaction.
This vaccine is not FDA approved, we do know if it will harm a fetus.
The vaccine will not be given at this time, or maybe never.
If one thinks the vaccine should be mandatory, no matter the situation, so they can get back to their previous Covid life, think again. If giving the vaccine might cause harm or death that would fall under the code of ethics to patients
Do No Harm.

I have continued to live my life, since last March, with very little change. I flew the first commercial flight after 911, so flying during the last 10 months has not been a life changing experience. Tomorrow is not guaranteed, so at least I didn’t waste all these months sitting in my house. Then again the new pastime of chasing the vaccine is getting people more screen time, and out of the house to drive 5 miles, or 500 miles to get in line. So I guess that’s a bonus

As far as digital imprinting, that will be the next money making scheme, ligit or not so much

You have to ask yourself. Do you really trust your government that much that they could implant a digital chip in you and they won't abuse it? For those that want to mandate a vaccine, are they willing to personally go to the families of people that had reactions to the vaccine and died to comfort them? Oh sorry but it was for the greater good? Talk about selfish. What if your child dies, or grandchild? This is still a free country and this sounds more about controlling people than combating a virus.

[Sherrilee]

Ok just because you got the vaccine you can still get covid... congressman in Ma got it after second dose of vaccine. Although they say lesser serious reaction you still quarrentine 10 days. I feel we will never be “back to normal” this is with us forever as is the flu and other viruses. Hopefully if mose are vaccinated it will slow the progression of spread and have heard immunity

[golfing eagles]

Ok just because you got the vaccine you can still get covid... congressman in Ma got it after second dose of vaccine. Although they say lesser serious reaction you still quarrentine 10 days. I feel we will never be “back to normal” this is with us forever as is the flu and other viruses. Hopefully if mose are vaccinated it will slow the progression of spread and have heard immunity

He must have been in the 5% that did not gain immunity from 2 doses. For the other 95%, you CAN'T get it if you are vaccinated.

Or, we just go on, living life normally, with the knowledge that there is yet another among hundreds, of deadly diseases out there, none of which has triggered such an overkill reaction.

[Love2Swim]

Interview this morning with George Stephanopoulos and the president of Moderna.
Moderna stated that we could possibly reach herd immunity with 50 to 70% vaccinations.He hopes that percentage will be by June. So the myth of 100% vaccinated may not be true. But who to believe the President of Moderna, or a posters on TOTV, that those who can’t take the vaccine should be hunted down. I’m going with Moderna President and Physician

Six months from now I hope there is more intelligent conversations on this site other than vaccines and masks.

:bigbow: Well said. As far as "more intelligent conversations on this site", don't hold your breath.

[shut the front door]

If you ate vaccinated, why does it matter to you if another person isnt'..
You wont catch it because you are protected.
Seems it would be none of your business as there is no effect on you.
You want everyone to be forced to doing things your way and are willing and even desirous of "punishing" those who wont comply with what you want by limiting their personal freedoms. Sounds tyrannical to me.

Well said. OP sounds very Orwellian to me. I can't believe someone would even say "so what if you have allergies, isn't that what epi pens are for"? OMG the lack of knowledge.

[Swoop]

So, do people walk around with "digital proof" they had the polio vaccine, or pertussis??? The following from the CDC lists diseases with an available vaccine. Together these illnesses have killed hundreds of millions yet they are not "mandated" and no one has suggested we carry "digital proof" of any. In the scheme of things, as pandemics go, COVID is a minor player. It is the "flavor of the month", what amazes me is the reaction to COVID is so much different than avian flu, or SARS or MERS or swine flu. It has been a polarizing force, given birth to a new religion (the holy mask), changed social interactions, changed education and the workplace. Now there are those that would sacrifice our rights and freedoms for what they perceiveas a little safety, enforced by the government, and them cram their ideas down everyone else's throat. Seig heil!

List of Vaccines Used in United States
Links to Clinical info about the vaccine

Adenovirus
Anthrax
AVA (BioThrax)
Cholera
Vaxchora
Diphtheria
DTaP (Daptacel, Infanrix)
Td (Tenivac, generic)
DT (-generic-)
Tdap (Adacel, Boostrix)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Hepatitis A
HepA (Havrix, Vaqta)
HepA-HepB (Twinrix)
Hepatitis B
HepB (Engerix-B, Recombivax HB, Heplisav-B)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
HepA-HepB (Twinrix)
Haemophilus influenzae type b (Hib)
Hib (ActHIB, PedvaxHIB, Hiberix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Human Papillomavirus (HPV)
HPV9 (Gardasil 9) (For scientific papers, the preferred abbreviation is 9vHPV)
Seasonal Influenza (Flu) only
IIV* (Afluria, Fluad, Flublok, Flucelvax, FluLaval, Fluarix, Fluvirin, Fluzone, Fluzone High-Dose, Fluzone Intradermal)
*There are various acronyms for inactivated flu vaccines – IIV3, IIV4, RIV3, RIV4 and ccIIV4.
LAIV (FluMist)
Japanese Encephalitis
JE (Ixiaro)
Measles
MMR (M-M-R II)
MMRV (ProQuad)
Meningococcal
MenACWY (Menactra, Menveo)
MenB (Bexsero, Trumenba)
Mumps
MMR (M-M-R II)
MMRV (ProQuad)
Pertussis
DTaP (Daptacel, Infanrix)
Tdap (Adacel, Boostrix)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Pneumococcal
PCV13 (Prevnar13)
PPSV23 (Pneumovax 23)
Polio
Polio (Ipol)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Rabies
Rabies (Imovax Rabies, RabAvert)
Rotavirus
RV1 (Rotarix)
RV5 (RotaTeq)
Rubella
MMR (M-M-R II)
MMRV (ProQuad)
Shingles
RZV (Shingrix)
Smallpox
Vaccinia (ACAM2000):
Tetanus
DTaP (Daptacel, Infanrix)
Td (Tenivac, generic)
DT (-generic-)
Tdap (Adacel, Boostrix)
DTaP-IPV (Kinrix, Quadracel)
DTaP-HepB-IPV (Pediarix)
DTaP-IPV/Hib (Pentacel)
Tuberculosis
Typhoid Fever
Typhoid Oral (Vivotif)
Typhoid Polysaccharide (Typhim Vi)
Varicella
VAR (Varivax)
MMRV (ProQuad):
Yellow Fever
YF (YF-Vax)
You are absolutely correct. Sadly the Covid virus has been used as a tool by both politicians and the media.

[Spalumbos62]

I can tell you this! I am an RN and I do COVID-19 vaccinations. I have access to the cards that YOU think can be forged!! How dare you?? We are professionals and NO ONE where I work would ever forge anything! We have licenses to protect. These cards are not left out to the public, just like the vaccines, they are protected by lock and key. Let's tattoo it on your forehead so you feel better.
Bev, RN.

Maybe where you work they are extra careful, but no doubt, if fraud could hapoen- it will.

[lpkruege1]

First off this is the link to MIT.
Will you have to carry a vaccine passport on your phone? | MIT Technology Review (https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/12/21/1015353/covid-vaccine-passport-digital-immunity-record/)

There's a lot more to the article but here is the point you should be aware of. Immunization doesn’t mean safety
While several vaccines appear highly effective at preventing symptoms of covid-19, we don’t know whether they stop people from catching and spreading the virus asymptomatically. Trials of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine suggested it may limit transmission from asymptomatic carriers, but Pfizer and Moderna’s trials didn’t regularly test participants for the virus if they didn’t have symptoms.

More data is needed to prove conclusively that vaccination prevents you from giving covid-19 to other people, and how long immunity lasts. It’s also important to remember that what’s true for one vaccine may not be true for another.

Without these crucial pieces of information, vaccination credentials only prove that you received a vaccine on a particular date—not that you do not have and cannot catch the disease. In the meantime, a negative covid test remains the best evidence that you’re not contagious. And since tests are far from perfect, you should still follow public health guidance about limiting spread whenever you can.

[Spalumbos62]

That is exactly correct. I (anyone) have the right to refuse to be vaccinated. My body, my choice. My right to make this choice is in the SAME paragraph of the constitution where a woman can choose to have an abortion. Go look it up - it's right there in plain text.

And don't think about arguing that failure to get vaccinated puts others at risk. Getting an abortion is 100% lethal to someone else. This stupid virus is weak and has only a 0.3% chance of death and most of those are the very old and sick.

I dont think most people are in agreement with the 2nd half of your post...or at least in the way it was said.
The first half...you are right- you may not have to get the shot...your bod-your choice....you may just be excluded from things....your choice.

[oldtimes]

First off this is the link to MIT.
Will you have to carry a vaccine passport on your phone? | MIT Technology Review (https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/12/21/1015353/covid-vaccine-passport-digital-immunity-record/)

There's a lot more to the article but here is the point you should be aware of. Immunization doesn’t mean safety
While several vaccines appear highly effective at preventing symptoms of covid-19, we don’t know whether they stop people from catching and spreading the virus asymptomatically. Trials of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine suggested it may limit transmission from asymptomatic carriers, but Pfizer and Moderna’s trials didn’t regularly test participants for the virus if they didn’t have symptoms.

More data is needed to prove conclusively that vaccination prevents you from giving covid-19 to other people, and how long immunity lasts. It’s also important to remember that what’s true for one vaccine may not be true for another.

Without these crucial pieces of information, vaccination credentials only prove that you received a vaccine on a particular date—not that you do not have and cannot catch the disease. In the meantime, a negative covid test remains the best evidence that you’re not contagious. And since tests are far from perfect, you should still follow public health guidance about limiting spread whenever you can.

There is still so much that they don't know about the virus and about the vaccine. I think people have to weigh the information and decide for themselves what they feel is appropriate and the self righteous need to mind their own business because it is just possible that they may be wrong.

[Spalumbos62]

Yes it is, and a lot of you believe you have the right to block our rights...I don’t think so..

Just as a very small example...a restaurant owner who has finally got things up and running postcovid, is now serving...do you really think they are going to want patrons that have not had their vaccinated.
I know, everyone is gonna to yell... "there are rules" etc,etc...but let's face these businesses will do what they want. There may be signs that won't allow you
.....js

[Spalumbos62]

And what does a penicillin allergy have to do with a synthetic messenger RNA vaccine???? I once tripped over my own feet, so now I'm afraid to walk:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl: (Actually that makes more sense than a PCN allergy)

Mean....

[oldtimes]

Just as a very small example...a restaurant owner who has finally got things up and running postcovid, is now serving...do you really think they are going to want patrons that have not had their vaccinated.
I know, everyone is gonna to yell... "there are rules" etc,etc...but let's face these businesses will do what they want. There may be signs that won't allow you
.....js

They have been doing it for months

[Two Bills]

You have to ask yourself. Do you really trust your government that much that they could implant a digital chip in you and they won't abuse it? For those that want to mandate a vaccine, are they willing to personally go to the families of people that had reactions to the vaccine and died to comfort them? Oh sorry but it was for the greater good? Talk about selfish. What if your child dies, or grandchild? This is still a free country and this sounds more about controlling people than combating a virus.


Total BS!:ohdear:

[golfing eagles]

Mean....

Seriously???? I pointed out, well let's call it somewhat less than logical or educated conclusion, lest you consider it mean.

OK, I'll give a chance at payback. I'm afraid to eat chocolate cake because 15 years ago my cousin's landscaper's babysitter's hair dresser's mother had an allergic reaction to shellfish.:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[shut the front door]

All these claims of huge numbers dying from vaccination in secret, and not one source is posted when asked.
Do you honestly think that some posters on here are party to this information, and yet the media is in the dark.
C'mon son!!

Not sure where you've been or why you apparently don't have google, but there are numerous articles about it, many of which were shared in a thread a couple of weeks ago.
Here is one to get you started, if you still struggle with google, I'm sure a neighbor could help you out.
Pfizer vaccine worries Norway as 29 elderly people die after taking shot | Business Standard News (https://www.business-standard.com/article/current-affairs/pfizer-vaccine-worries-norway-as-29-elderly-people-die-after-taking-shot-121011700157_1.html)

[coffeebean]

More information regarding what may be in our future for a Covid Vaccination "Passport".

COVID-19 vaccine card is not an immunity passport. Here's the difference - CNET (https://www.cnet.com/health/covid-19-vaccine-card-is-not-an-immunity-passport-heres-the-difference/)

[Bill14564]

Just as a very small example...a restaurant owner who has finally got things up and running postcovid, is now serving...do you really think they are going to want patrons that have not had their vaccinated.
I know, everyone is gonna to yell... "there are rules" etc,etc...but let's face these businesses will do what they want. There may be signs that won't allow you
.....js

Yes, I believe the business owner will want all paying customers regardless of race, religion, or vaccination status. If they don’t, if they chose to discriminate, then they won’t get my business either.

[shut the front door]

I think everyone here knows the OP agenda. Endless threads, every day about the same thing. OP has 23 posts IN THIS THREAD (so far, the day is young). I truly hope she gets her 2nd vax soon and is able to step away from the keyboard for a while.
In the meantime, I can tell you that the ONLY poster on this board that I give any credibility in this discussion (and many others) is Golfing Eagle.

[coffeebean]

Well said. OP sounds very Orwellian to me. I can't believe someone would even say "so what if you have allergies, isn't that what epi pens are for"? OMG the lack of knowledge.

Are you aware that epi-pens are to reverse an anaphylactic reaction? Do you know what an anaphylactic reaction is?

[coffeebean]

First off this is the link to MIT.
Will you have to carry a vaccine passport on your phone? | MIT Technology Review (https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/12/21/1015353/covid-vaccine-passport-digital-immunity-record/)

There's a lot more to the article but here is the point you should be aware of. Immunization doesn’t mean safety
While several vaccines appear highly effective at preventing symptoms of covid-19, we don’t know whether they stop people from catching and spreading the virus asymptomatically. Trials of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine suggested it may limit transmission from asymptomatic carriers, but Pfizer and Moderna’s trials didn’t regularly test participants for the virus if they didn’t have symptoms.

More data is needed to prove conclusively that vaccination prevents you from giving covid-19 to other people, and how long immunity lasts. It’s also important to remember that what’s true for one vaccine may not be true for another.

Without these crucial pieces of information, vaccination credentials only prove that you received a vaccine on a particular date—not that you do not have and cannot catch the disease. In the meantime, a negative covid test remains the best evidence that you’re not contagious. And since tests are far from perfect, you should still follow public health guidance about limiting spread whenever you can.

I am certainly not alone in wanting a safer world around us and to be able to return to a normal existence. Here is another excerpt from the same article which supports my POV.......

"Some of the terms being thrown around are confusing, like “vaccine passport.” In some scenarios, your records might function like an actual passport—think of arriving at the airport in a new country, pulling out your smartphone, and scanning a digital record of your vaccination or negative test. But those records could also act like a work authorization at your job, or a pass to get into restaurants, bars, and shopping malls."

[Byte1]

Or tattoo at least with tattoos they won’t have ability to monitor or spy.

Great idea! How about a bar code right on everyone's forehead so that it is visible to anyone that might question?

[oldtimes]

I am certainly not alone in wanting a safer world around us and to be able to return to a normal existence. Here is another excerpt from the same article which supports my POV.......

"Some of the terms being thrown around are confusing, like “vaccine passport.” In some scenarios, your records might function like an actual passport—think of arriving at the airport in a new country, pulling out your smartphone, and scanning a digital record of your vaccination or negative test. But those records could also act like a work authorization at your job, or a pass to get into restaurants, bars, and shopping malls."

What about the part that said this:

No one solution will work for everybody

Even if these tools are built, blocking people from ordinary activities on the basis of their vaccination status brings up serious ethical and legal considerations. Screening people by vaccination status is hard when no country has made vaccination mandatory so far, and there are many cases in which people who might otherwise be eligible (for example, pregnant women or those who suffer from serious allergies) are discouraged from receiving the vaccine while more data is gathered.

[almyers]

Amen