Derek Chauvin Trial

[retiredguy123]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

[manaboutown]

Floyd was a known violent thug who ODed and died from that.

[tvbound]

I hope that unlike the O.J Simpson and Rodney King trials, justice is served and Chauvin goes to prison for the rest of his life.

[Stu from NYC]

Unfortunately if Chauvin is found innocent the city will burn.

Amazing how a career criminal can be a martyr.

If only these people could learn to follow the officers directions.

[Tmarkwald]

Unfortunately if Chauvin is found innocent the city will burn.

Amazing how a career criminal can be a martyr.

If only these people could learn to follow the officers directions.

Notice how nobody burned the Cities when OJ was found not guilty? Nobody loots and burns - unless they know they can get away with it because the police are scared to do their jobs.

Chauvin was doing his job. Ask the women who this thug raped what they would do.

[Stu from NYC]

Notice how nobody burned the Cities when OJ was found not guilty? Nobody loots and burns - unless they know they can get away with it because the police are scared to do their jobs.

Chauvin was doing his job. Ask the women who this thug raped what they would do.

It would appear to me that there is fault on both sides and the officer used too much force for too long.

However let the judicial system do its job and if Chauvin is found not guilty not allow looting or lawlessness.

[B-flat]

I hope that unlike the O.J Simpson and Rodney King trials, justice is served and Chauvin goes to prison for the rest of his life.

REHAB THAT WORKS

After 6 burglaries, 3 car thefts, Multiple illegal trespasses,

An ongoing cocaine and alcohol addiction.

Committing 2 violent home invasions, 3 armed robberies,

Dealing with Fentanyl and meth, Passing counterfeit money.

Beating 4 victims senseless and

Being arrested 23 times since 1998,

George Floyd has not committed a crime in over nine months now.........

[Bucco]

REHAB THAT WORKS

After 6 burglaries, 3 car thefts, Multiple illegal trespasses,

An ongoing cocaine and alcohol addiction.

Committing 2 violent home invasions, 3 armed robberies,

Dealing with Fentanyl and meth, Passing counterfeit money.

Beating 4 victims senseless and

Being arrested 23 times since 1998,

George Floyd has not committed a crime in over nine months now.........

I am a big fan of facts and the law. Best formula, in my opinion.

Since the victim is not on trial, his past means very little.

Fair trial, and let the “fans” “rooting” for someone stay well on the sidelines.

[DeanFL]

.
.
This is a TRUE Headline in the USA Today. I had to read it several times to really understand it. I wondered if 'people of non-color' could watch too (really).

'They need to be watched':
How livestreaming the Derek Chauvin trial lets people of color monitor the justice system
Tami Abdollah USA TODAY
.....................................

This all said I do agree with many of the other comments - but if it IS a fact of NINE MINUTES on the man's neck... On the other hand Atty Crump got $27Mill for the family - from the taxpayers of MN...

Derek Chauvin trial update: Livestream lets people see justice system (https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/03/29/derek-chauvin-trial-how-livestream-lets-people-monitor-justice-system/4757702001/)

[blueash]

REHAB THAT WORKS

After 6 burglaries, 3 car thefts, Multiple illegal trespasses,

An ongoing cocaine and alcohol addiction.

Committing 2 violent home invasions, 3 armed robberies,

Dealing with Fentanyl and meth, Passing counterfeit money.

Beating 4 victims senseless and

Being arrested 23 times since 1998,

George Floyd has not committed a crime in over nine months now.........

And none of that, not one single word of that gives any cop the right to murder the man. It is entirely immaterial to Chavin's charges and his crime if any. It doesn't matter how a woman dresses or if she is a known prostitute or she had sex with you last time, you rape her now, you can't use any of that to excuse your behavior. That's the law. Chavin was a cop to protect the community not exact some man's dream of vigilante justice. The victim is not on trial nor should he be.

[Fredman]

Had the justice system worked the victim would have been jail where he belonged. Then there would not be an issue.

[Bucco]

Had the justice system worked the victim would have been jail where he belonged. Then there would not be an issue.

Yeah, that should absolve anyone who might kill him.

Not the way the real law works. If you err in your life, you do not become “fair game”

[Nucky]

Had the justice system worked the victim would have been jail where he belonged. Then there would not be an issue.

You hit the Nail On The Head Fred!

My guesstimate about this thread is it won't make it till lunchtime tomorrow. Too many bad actors whose words will be brought to justice by the moderators. :faint:

[FG111]

I say, sacrifice the cop and find him guilty of all charges, regardless of the facts of the case. This way, many of our cities will not burn and many lives will be saved.
There is not one person living in this country with a bit of common sense that honestly believes that if the cop is found innocent by a jury of his peer's and released, that the community will accept the verdict and do nothing. You know that if this cop walks, cities all across the US will burn and many will be injured and killed. So, sacrifice the cop and save our cities.

[JimJohnson]

Police must follow the law. Unfortunately this one is a bully and became judge, jury and executioner. Lock him up.

[ruralgoddess]

amen

[joseppe]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Doesn't matter. Only facts that matter are Floyd was Black and Chauvin was White.

[skarra]

And none of that, not one single word of that gives any cop the right to murder the man. It is entirely immaterial to Chavin's charges and his crime if any. It doesn't matter how a woman dresses or if she is a known prostitute or she had sex with you last time, you rape her now, you can't use any of that to excuse your behavior. That's the law. Chavin was a cop to protect the community not exact some man's dream of vigilante justice. The victim is not on trial nor should he be.

Well said.

We have what looks like 2 criminals. One is dead, and the other is on trial with criminal charges.

It remains to be seen if Chauvin is a criminal too, but from what I saw it is not acceptable to do what he did to someone who was restrained.

[shelley77]

And none of that, not one single word of that gives any cop the right to murder the man. It is entirely immaterial to Chavin's charges and his crime if any. It doesn't matter how a woman dresses or if she is a known prostitute or she had sex with you last time, you rape her now, you can't use any of that to excuse your behavior. That's the law. Chavin was a cop to protect the community not exact some man's dream of vigilante justice. The victim is not on trial nor should he be.
No one murdered anyone. 1. Check the cause of death. 2. Chauvin followed police procedure - he did what he was trained to do. 3. At least spell the officer's name right.

[ScottGo]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Can my wife put her knee on your neck for 9 minutes and see if you'll live? I'm 5'11 235 so I'm to big for your weight/height ratio.

[HogPilot]

Unfortunately if Chauvin is found innocent the city will burn.

Amazing how a career criminal can be a martyr.

If only these people could learn to follow the officers directions.

For those interested in what happened to George Floyd.
George Floyd's arrest and detention - the actual videos

All of this information was kept from the public for many months😡

George Floyd's arrest and detention - the actual videos
The narrator is George Parry, former federal and state prosecutor. From 1978 to 1983 Parry was the Chief of the Police Brutality/Misconduct Unit of the Philadelphia District Attorney’s Office, which investigated and prosecuted use of deadly force by police.
This video should receive the widest distribution possible. It is a clinical assessment of the entire incident, with on-scene video of all actions from beginning to end.
https://centaurfilmworks.com/ (https://centaurfilmworks.com/)

[RICH1]

REHAB THAT WORKS

After 6 burglaries, 3 car thefts, Multiple illegal trespasses,

An ongoing cocaine and alcohol addiction.

Committing 2 violent home invasions, 3 armed robberies,

Dealing with Fentanyl and meth, Passing counterfeit money.

Beating 4 victims senseless and

Being arrested 23 times since 1998,

George Floyd has not committed a crime in over nine months now.........
Including putting a gun against a pregnant woman's stomach! Details ... The court system fails the victims ! 24 mil plus the 10 mil from GoFund me... the young thugs are watching how it's done

[tsmall22204]

You live in a fairy tale world. George Floyd was murderd by a police officer who felt he had the right to be judge, jury, and executioner. His prisoner was handcuffed. Other officers were there to assist. George Floyd was murdered.

[NotGolfer]

The "original" videos were edited to fit the msm's narrative. As several said here, the policeman was following police procedure. Floyd complained of not being able to breath when he was 1st put in the car, then he began to be combative (drugs probably). If he'd have stayed in the car, none of this would have happened. He was a "dead man walking" though. The autopsy showed A LOT of drugs in his system. Fentynal is a drug that kills many people and he had a large dose in his body. IF Floyd had been a white man---we'd not even know his name. Chauvin was proclaimed guilty before he even had a trial before a judge because of that community's hate for the police.

[JimJohnson]

You live in a fairy tale world. George Floyd was murderd by a police officer who felt he had the right to be judge, jury, and executioner. His prisoner was handcuffed. Other officers were there to assist. George Floyd was murdered.

Yes! You can debate on how bad Floyd was, but that does not allow for a bully police officer to kill a suspect.

[FromNY]

This situation is a mess. The officer has already been found guilty. The family already given 27 million. And if history repeats there will be attacks on communities that result in loss and destruction. All lives matter. Our media driven justice system has added fuel to the fires. Someday humans may learn to be civil.

[thevillagernie]

Rub the pain with 24 million dollars,that will make it better

[NoMo50]

[/QUOTE]...because the police are scared to do their jobs.[/QUOTE]

Not scared to do their jobs...ordered not to do their jobs. Big difference. Been there, done that.

[Girlcopper]

Police must follow the law. Unfortunately this one is a bully and became judge, jury and executioner. Lock him up.
He did follow the law. George didnt. Thats what started this whole fiasco. . Floyd was huger than the cop, high on drugs which give super human strength and chose to fight the cops. His poor decision. And he paid the price for it. It wouldnt matter if he was black, white or purple. He got the same treatment any thug would have gotten. This isnt a race issue.
Let the trial go on and let the jury make a decision. We all know people will riot and burn down and loot their own neighborhoods should the decision be ...not guilty. If found guilty, you will not see that occur because the ones who disagree with that decision are not thugs looking for any excuse to riot.

[ckbenjamin]

Why? Where was his crime?

[DaleDivine]

Why? Where was his crime?

UMMMM, passing counterfeit money is a crime.
:ohdear::ohdear:

[Bay Kid]

REHAB THAT WORKS

After 6 burglaries, 3 car thefts, Multiple illegal trespasses,

An ongoing cocaine and alcohol addiction.

Committing 2 violent home invasions, 3 armed robberies,

Dealing with Fentanyl and meth, Passing counterfeit money.

Beating 4 victims senseless and

Being arrested 23 times since 1998,

George Floyd has not committed a crime in over nine months now.........

Floyd is our new American hero... sad.... He should of been in jail. The system failed all.

[RedFoxRick]

The police chief for Minneapolis is expected to testify against Chauvin - pretty clear that this was a rogue policeman using excessive force. George Floyd did nothing to deserve a death sentence - justice will be served - and Chauvin will stay behind bars for a long time. Just watch the video.....

[Eg_cruz]

It would appear to me that there is fault on both sides and the officer used too much force for too long.

However let the judicial system do its job and if Chauvin is found not guilty not allow looting or lawlessness.
So because of fear an officer should be found guilty.......nope not buying.

[Get real]

The police chief for Minneapolis is expected to testify against Chauvin - pretty clear that this was a rogue policeman using excessive force. George Floyd did nothing to deserve a death sentence - justice will be served - and Chauvin will stay behind bars for a long time. Just watch the video.....

Chief wants to keep his job...facts don't matter. I hope the "best" for some of you posters.

[George Page]

if only these people could learn to follow the officers directions.

Amen

[Petersweeney]

27 Million is obscene - there should be a limit - that’s real money coming from R/E taxes on people who are poor or middle class- injustice breeds injustice

[Eg_cruz]

I am a big fan of facts and the law. Best formula, in my opinion.

Since the victim is not on trial, his past means very little.

Fair trial, and let the “fans” “rooting” for someone stay well on the sidelines.
But the victims acts are on trial here cause had the victim not resisting arrest the victim may or may not be alive today because autopsy showed he OD. So, what do you think would had happen had if the so called victim wasn’t hirer then a kite and resisting arrest?

[cleosmum]

My husband was in law enforcement for 38 years, and I am very pro law enforcement. But in this case, Derek Chavin absolutely used excessive force with no regard for the “perp”. “I can’t breathe” 27 times and he ignored it? I hope that Derek Chauvin spends many years behind bars. I expect more decency and compassion from our law enforcement officials, who normally do a great job.

[allsport]

I don't care what you were taught, you do not kneel on a man's neck and on his stomach compressing his lungs just to restrain. When the man has no pulse, you continue on his throat and think that is appropriate. Stop the misinformation, most police departments have outlawed this process because it is meant to kill.

[George Page]

REHAB THAT WORKS
George Floyd has not committed a crime in over nine months now.........

You’re welcome

[allsport]

He was a drug addicted man who had some fentanyl on board but not enough to kill someone his size and who had his tolerance due to years of abuse. Read the science.

[allsport]

Kneeling on a man's throat with his lungs crushed into the pavement is a way to kill not restrain. Most police departments do not permit this type of restraint. The murder part came when the man said, I can't breath and then had no pulse and the killer refused to get off of his neck.

[RedFoxRick]

There is a higher court than courts of justice and that is the court of conscience. It supersedes all other courts - Mahatma Gandhi

[Gmaf6]

From comments here it seems some are judge, jury and executioner before ALL facts are in. In this country, at least for now, a defendant is innocent until proven guilty by a jury of peers. It saddens me that a life was lost and it saddens me that millions are paid to one person’s family when so many others were affected....lives and businesses destroyed. Seriously, what are we becoming?

[golfing eagles]

He was a drug addicted man who had some fentanyl on board but not enough to kill someone his size and who had his tolerance due to years of abuse. Read the science.

He was a CRIMINAL who resisted arrest, read the LAW. He shouldn't be dead, but he should not be canonized either

[Get real]

Floyd killed Floyd.

[Tom2172]

Cause of death fentanyl overdose!
But fakenewsmedia need propaganda brainwashing so they blamed cops and America
Fakenewsmedia is worse then fentanyl overdose and much more painful

[Marykschulz]

Reverse the races of the cop and the victim. I bet a whole bunch of the posters here would have a different opinion.

[GOLFER54]

The worry is if the police officer is found to be not guilty, protesters will burn and riot throughout our country. I find this to be unacceptable and those who do these behaviors should be arrested immediately. Unless you live under a rock you should know Floyd was a menace to society and was full of drugs when he died. The police officer will not get first degree murder, but he will probably get 3rd degree manslaughter, to appease the public. Nevertheless, regardless of the punishment, some folks will never be appeased, so rioting, looting and burning of buildings will happen anyway.

[JMintzer]

My husband was in law enforcement for 38 years, and I am very pro law enforcement. But in this case, Derek Chavin absolutely used excessive force with no regard for the “perp”. “I can’t breathe” 27 times and he ignored it? I hope that Derek Chauvin spends many years behind bars. I expect more decency and compassion from our law enforcement officials, who normally do a great job.

He was yelling "I can't breath" before the even had him in handcuffs...

It's the new "get out of jail free" card...

[JMintzer]

I don't care what you were taught, you do not kneel on a man's neck and on his stomach compressing his lungs just to restrain. When the man has no pulse, you continue on his throat and think that is appropriate. Stop the misinformation, most police departments have outlawed this process because it is meant to kill.

According to the autopsy, none of what you said happened...

[JMintzer]

He was a drug addicted man who had some fentanyl on board but not enough to kill someone his size and who had his tolerance due to years of abuse. Read the science.

According to the autopsy, his lungs were full of fluid, weighing 2-3 Xs normal...

He was already dying from the Fentanyl overdose...

I did read the science...

[noslices1]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

He MAY have died from something else, but he certainly died from not being able to breathe for 9 minutes. I am totally Pro-Police, but he did not have to die that day

[JMintzer]

Kneeling on a man's throat with his lungs crushed into the pavement is a way to kill not restrain. Most police departments do not permit this type of restraint. The murder part came when the man said, I can't breath and then had no pulse and the killer refused to get off of his neck.

Good thing none of what you said actually happened...

He was going with the "I can't breath" before they even got him out of his car...

[JMintzer]

He MAY have died from something else, but he certainly died from not being able to breathe for 9 minutes. I am totally Pro-Police, but he did not have to die that day

The autopsy says otherwise...

And yes, he did not have to die that day. Simply complying with the 4 officers who were trying to arrest him would have saved his life.

It's interesting how the other guy in the car followed instructions and wasn't harmed in any way...

[4moiSRT8OldCodger]

Where in the blue blazes did you come up with Chauvin weighing 145 pounds?

[Bill14564]

The autopsy says otherwise...

And yes, he did not have to die that day. Simply complying with the 4 officers who were trying to arrest him would have saved his life.

It's interesting how the other guy in the car followed instructions and wasn't harmed in any way...

If simply complying would have saved his life then it was the interaction with the officers that ended his life, yes? That is what the trial should be about, whether the action of the officer caused or contributed to his death.

He was on the ground, handcuffed, one knee on his neck, another knee at least occasionally on his back, not moving, and not breathing and yet the officer still applied pressure. Can you explain what more he needed to do to comply when dying was not enough?

[DeanFL]

If simply complying would have saved his life then it was the interaction with the officers that ended his life, yes? That is what the trial should be about, whether the action of the officer caused or contributed to his death.

He was on the ground, handcuffed, one knee on his neck, another knee at least occasionally on his back, not moving, and not breathing and yet the officer still applied pressure. Can you explain what more he needed to do to comply when dying was not enough?

.
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I support LEOs all across the country - an unforgiving job, esp the last few years. I ALWAYS thank them personally when seeing some in a store etc.

But, no matter the other circumstance noted here, NINE MINUTES is the deciding factor for me. period. What was the cop thinking all that time?

EVERY group has bad apples - the focus should be culling them out. But 'excusing' the criminals and offenders is NOT the right thing to do.

But the Media etc etc pressure on all of this is troubling. Rodney King all over again? Gotta wonder if stores are all boarded up and citizens worried once the verdict comes out.
.
.

[JMintzer]

If simply complying would have saved his life then it was the interaction with the officers that ended his life, yes? That is what the trial should be about, whether the action of the officer caused or contributed to his death.

He was on the ground, handcuffed, one knee on his neck, another knee at least occasionally on his back, not moving, and not breathing and yet the officer still applied pressure. Can you explain what more he needed to do to comply when dying was not enough?

He applied so much pressure that Floyd was still able to lift his head and move around...

You act like the officer Who was surrounded by screaming people knew that Floy was dead.

In reality, he wasn't pronounced dead until much later...

But with your logic, it's the officer's fault any time a suspect is injured, regardless of the suspects actions...

I mean, it was the cop who initiated the interaction, right?

[Villages Kahuna]

Never got by the first few responses. Wow!

[Stu from NYC]

Never got by the first few responses. Wow!

Easy to predict how this thread would go

[larbud]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

I’ll add a million to that..

[Bill14564]

He applied so much pressure that Floyd was still able to lift his head and move around...

You act like the officer Who was surrounded by screaming people knew that Floy was dead.

In reality, he wasn't pronounced dead until much later...

But with your logic, it's the officer's fault any time a suspect is injured, regardless of the suspects actions...

I mean, it was the cop who initiated the interaction, right?

Chauvin was told at least once if not twice that Floyd had no pulse. With one knee on Floyd's neck and another on his back he was close enough to notice the man was no longer breathing.

No movement for several minutes, no signs of breathing, no pulse, and CPR in the ambulance... sure, the official determination of death did not occur until much later.

Surrounded? Don't think so. Screaming? Yeah, screaming that the man was dying or already dead.

Actually, it was a different cop who initiated the interaction, Chauvin came along later.

[Spalumbos62]

Doesn't matter. Only facts that matter are Floyd was Black and Chauvin was White.

Please explain....
I certainly don't agree that is the ONLY fact....that's the problem, there are many facts.

[JMintzer]

Chauvin was told at least once if not twice that Floyd had no pulse. With one knee on Floyd's neck and another on his back he was close enough to notice the man was no longer breathing.

No movement for several minutes, no signs of breathing, no pulse, and CPR in the ambulance... sure, the official determination of death did not occur until much later.

Surrounded? Don't think so. Screaming? Yeah, screaming that the man was dying or already dead.

Actually, it was a different cop who initiated the interaction, Chauvin came along later.

You seem to think the officer's full weight was on Floyd's neck. It wasn't. The fact that Floyd lifted his head several times during the encounter proves that point...

And yes, Chauvin was surrounded. How many times did they have to tell the crowd to "get back", to "get on the sidewalk"?

He was "told he had no pulse"?

I must have missed that part, was it before or after they called for the ambulance the first, then second time?

Have you ever tried to take someone's pulse during a medical emergency?

I have, multiple times. It's damn difficult to do. Many times what you're actually feeling is your own pulse instead of the patient's...

[npmcnmom]

If this officer was your son would you feel this way?

[JSR22]

If this officer was your son would you feel this way?

I would be ashamed if he was my son.

[Bill14564]

You seem to think the officer's full weight was on Floyd's neck. It wasn't. The fact that Floyd lifted his head several times during the encounter proves that point...

And yes, Chauvin was surrounded. How many times did they have to tell the crowd to "get back", to "get on the sidewalk"?

He was "told he had no pulse"?

I must have missed that part, was it before or after they called for the ambulance the first, then second time?

Have you ever tried to take someone's pulse during a medical emergency?

I have, multiple times. It's damn difficult to do. Many times what you're actually feeling is your own pulse instead of the patient's...

I see that we are not going to agree on what our lying eyes are telling us. Watch the video, read the autopsy reports, and draw your conclusions but leave me out of it.

I started this with an open mind, hoping the evidence presented at trial would lead to a just verdict. Countering your version of the "facts" is driving me to convict Chauvin before the trial has ended and that's not the way our justice system should work.

[JMintzer]

I see that we are not going to agree on what our lying eyes are telling us. Watch the video, read the autopsy reports, and draw your conclusions but leave me out of it.

I started this with an open mind, hoping the evidence presented at trial would lead to a just verdict. Countering your version of the "facts" is driving me to convict Chauvin before the trial has ended and that's not the way our justice system should work.

Leave you out of it? You inserted yourself "into it" when you entered this thread... And no, you started with "Chauvin is guilty" and went from there.

Watch the video? Read the autopsy? I did all of that.

Me, otoh, I tend to look at things more clinically, without emotion. In medicine, if you treat someone emotionally, you're screwed...

[Spalumbos62]

According to the autopsy, his lungs were full of fluid, weighing 2-3 Xs normal...

He was already dying from the Fentanyl overdose...

I did read the science...

A few questions, bc you sound like you are in med field.
He was high in the store, lungs full of fluid, gets arrested/handcuffed and put into car. At that point of excitement wouldn't the not able to breath kick in? Then somehow he's out of the car( sorry, I don't know these details) must of been some scuffling going on...again agitating the breathing issue. He's then put to ground and we all know the results.
Had he stopped breathing in car,, no murder......or roughing up outside...no murder...but when they get this football player sized man down to ground,, he succumbs, stops breathing, and now we have a murder.
(I am no way in agreement with the extended time of the knee-throat thing)...but I do believe there are many variables here, that might not be able to be answered.

[JimJohnson]

If this officer was your son would you feel this way?

If he was my son and all else the same, I would be ashamed of him. This was at least Manslaughter.

[JMintzer]

A few questions, bc you sound like you are in med field.
He was high in the store, lungs full of fluid, gets arrested/handcuffed and put into car. At that point of excitement wouldn't the not able to breath kick in? Then somehow he's out of the car( sorry, I don't know these details) must of been some scuffling going on...again agitating the breathing issue. He's then put to ground and we all know the results.
Had he stopped breathing in car,, no murder......or roughing up outside...no murder...but when they get this football player sized man down to ground,, he succumbs, stops breathing, and now we have a murder.
(I am no way in agreement with the extended time of the knee-throat thing)...but I do believe there are many variables here, that might not be able to be answered.

You make some very good observations...

But he sure was able to breath when he was resisting arrest, screaming at the top of his lungs and was strong enough to prevent 4 officers from simply putting him in the back of a cruiser...

Unfortunately, most of the other stuff will never be able to be proved in court...

[baramu]

Your two cents is off the mark. This cop had his knee on Floyd’s neck for almost nine minutes. This is not police training. Floyd told Derek 28 times he couldn’t breathe. If this isn’t murder, I don’t know what is. What is the matter with you?

[OhioBuckeye]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Retiredguy123, I agree with you totally. But personally I think the court already knows what the verdict is going to be against Chauvin, GUILTY! If he acquitted they’ll be more protest & riots. You watch Chauvin will be GUILTY, just my opinion.

[JMintzer]

Your two cents is off the mark. This cop had his knee on Floyd’s neck for almost nine minutes. This is not police training. Floyd told Derek 28 times he couldn’t breathe. If this isn’t murder, I don’t know what is. What is the matter with you?

Another emotional argument...

He was shouting I can't breathe upon the initial contact. That has become the new attempt to "get out of jail free"...

There are multiple videos of people immediately going to the "I can't breathe" defense, thinking it will get them out of being arrested. Even when the cop hasn't laid hands on them...

If you can scream "I can't breathe" over and over again, you most certainly CAN breathe...

[tvbound]

A lot of posts in this thread, perfectly exemplify why it is so hard to discipline and hold accountable the small percentage of bad cops in this country and that there is no question that systemic and institutional racism/bigotry - is still a huge problem.

[Justus]

A few questions, bc you sound like you are in med field.
He was high in the store, lungs full of fluid, gets arrested/handcuffed and put into car. At that point of excitement wouldn't the not able to breath kick in? Then somehow he's out of the car( sorry, I don't know these details) must of been some scuffling going on...again agitating the breathing issue. He's then put to ground and we all know the results.
Had he stopped breathing in car,, no murder......or roughing up outside...no murder...but when they get this football player sized man down to ground,, he succumbs, stops breathing, and now we have a murder.
(I am no way in agreement with the extended time of the knee-throat thing)...but I do believe there are many variables here, that might not be able to be answered.
Watch the video again. The officer's knee was NOT on Floyd's throat. It was on the back of his neck. And yes, the officer occasionally did move his hold to ease up on Floyd's neck, contrary to some comments herein that he was squeezing down on it. Floyd's windpipe was on the opposite side of the hold. This "football player-sized" thug could have conceivably risen and killed Officer Chauvin at any point. The ambulance was called a second time when Floyd showed signs of physical distress due to his Fentanyl overdose. Many people's minds are made up, so it's futile to confuse them with the facts. This officer doesn't stand a snowball's chance in hell of justice.

[John41]

Police must follow the law. Unfortunately this one is a bully and became judge, jury and executioner. Lock him up.

And who appointed you judge, jury and executioner before the cops have a trial.

[golfing eagles]

Your two cents is off the mark. This cop had his knee on Floyd’s neck for almost nine minutes. This is not police training. Floyd told Derek 28 times he couldn’t breathe. If this isn’t murder, I don’t know what is. What is the matter with you?

If he "couldn't breathe", then he couldn't say it 28 times, or even once for that matter

[Bayco]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Why don’t you watch entire trial before giving your opinion?

[FG111]

Just curious, the next time a black criminal kills a white cop ( its eventually going to happen based solely on statistics) will the city pay the cops family 27 million dollars to compensate the cops family for their loss? How did the city come up with this amount? This ain't free money folks. This high civil pay-out is just a bribe to minimize the burning and looting. This entire case has nothing to do with the facts.

[Bill14564]

If he "couldn't breathe", then he couldn't say it 28 times, or even once for that matter

Obviously, air was moving in and out of his lungs, no question.

But serious question: What would he have experienced as his lungs were being affected by the drugs? How would someone experiencing that describe it?

[Sherry8bal]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

You are correct. If he actually "couldn't breathe", he would have not been able to say that so many times. He would have been gagging and gasping for air. Of course, the black population will use this as another excuse to go "shopping" all across the country for free stuff.

I don't know why they don't seem to rely on the facts. The guy was a criminal - past and present, was high on drugs and alcohol according to the facts and had a very bad heart. He was a ticking time bomb.

[JimJohnson]

The officer will be convicted of Manslaughter, given 3 to 12 years confinement and removed from being a police officer. This officer has ha numerous complaints of excessive force for 19 years. If he would have been removed from the force years ago, this would not have happened. Did he intend to kill GF, probably not, but he is a proven bully and should have been fired long ago.

[meme5x]

I do totally agree..George Floyd was a burglar and a drug addict..did he do as police asked... no, but we don’t hear that side.. instead he is made a martyr and family gets 27M..and taxpayers get to pay it.. so guess crime pays???

[Hogfan55]

I am a conservative law and order and police supporter. But after watching the video IMHO I don’t think it rises to a case of murder by any means because I don’t think it was his intent to kill George Floyd. Yet I don’t understand why at least 3 cops on scene can’t get a man in handcuffs under control. His callousness even after he obviously had lost consciousness is criminal. I think the best outcome would be a conviction of manslaughter or some sort of negligent homicide. I see people who want to talk about George Floyd’s past but say the officer’s past is irrelevant. You can’t have it both ways. Like I said I’m a law enforcement supporter but if this was a black cop doing this to a white citizen would you defend the cop? Ferguson , Missouri was a lie. So many other charges of excessive force weren’t true. But I think this one has legs. This is a bad cop.

[DAVIDW5084]

I say, sacrifice the cop and find him guilty of all charges, regardless of the facts of the case. This way, many of our cities will not burn and many lives will be saved.
There is not one person living in this country with a bit of common sense that honestly believes that if the cop is found innocent by a jury of his peer's and released, that the community will accept the verdict and do nothing. You know that if this cop walks, cities all across the US will burn and many will be injured and killed. So, sacrifice the cop and save our cities.
Have some guts and support the legal system that we have. If we used your theory we would all be living under communism and the state would make all the decisions. In our society we do not sacrifice one person to please the majority as we might be the next person chosen to be sacrificed.

[DAVIDW5084]

I am a conservative law and order and police supporter. But after watching the video IMHO I don’t think it rises to a case of murder by any means because I don’t think it was his intent to kill George Floyd. Yet I don’t understand why at least 3 cops on scene can’t get a man in handcuffs under control. His callousness even after he obviously had lost consciousness is criminal. I think the best outcome would be a conviction of manslaughter or some sort of negligent homicide. I see people who want to talk about George Floyd’s past but say the officer’s past is irrelevant. You can’t have it both ways. Like I said I’m a law enforcement supporter but if this was a black cop doing this to a white citizen would you defend the cop? Ferguson , Missouri was a lie. So many other charges of excessive force weren’t true. But I think this one has legs. This is a bad cop.
Yes, I would defend a black, asian, female, gay, lesbian or whatever designation the police officer belongs to if he/she is enforcing the law and doing all he can to effect a lawful arrest. I have watched all the video available, bystander video, body cameras, etc and the officers had their hands full with a big guy that was resisting their efforts to make a peaceful arrest. Perhaps the officers should have thrown up their hands and let him go when it got the the point of having to restrain him until help could arrive and if that happened we would no longer have a law and order society. Support your police and let the judicial system work as intended. I am worried in this case that the officer is being tried in a court of popular opinion and will not have a chance to go free for doing what he is paid to do. How many of you would step into his shoes for even a day and deal with the violence that he and his fellow officers encounter every day?

[Heytubes]

I agree with you, having fought drunks and drugged up resisters. They can hurt you bad.

[Hogfan55]

Yes, I would defend a black, asian, female, gay, lesbian or whatever designation the police officer belongs to if he/she is enforcing the law and doing all he can to effect a lawful arrest. I have watched all the video available, bystander video, body cameras, etc and the officers had their hands full with a big guy that was resisting their efforts to make a peaceful arrest. Perhaps the officers should have thrown up their hands and let him go when it got the the point of having to restrain him until help could arrive and if that happened we would no longer have a law and order society. Support your police and let the judicial system work as intended. I am worried in this case that the officer is being tried in a court of popular opinion and will not have a chance to go free for doing what he is paid to do. How many of you would step into his shoes for even a day and deal with the violence that he and his fellow officers encounter every day?

I guess all I’m saying is we all must imagine your family member was in George Floyd’s position and also imagine the officer was your family member. If you can honestly say that if your son, whether he had a drug problem or whatever, was held in that position even AFTER he was unconscious and you say it was justified I don’t buy it. If the officer was my son I wouldn’t think it was intentional but I would have to admit he made a horrible error in judgement that may not have been the complete cause but at least contributed to this man’s death. I can’t lie to myself.

[Tmarkwald]

My husband was in law enforcement for 38 years, and I am very pro law enforcement. But in this case, Derek Chavin absolutely used excessive force with no regard for the “perp”. “I can’t breathe” 27 times and he ignored it? I hope that Derek Chauvin spends many years behind bars. I expect more decency and compassion from our law enforcement officials, who normally do a great job.

He was saying 'I can't breathe' before even being arrested. The drugs had him dead already. No getting away from it.

[Tmarkwald]

I agree with you, having fought drunks and drugged up resisters. They can hurt you bad.

The only way to put a perp down is to use overwhelming force.

You have no choice - you got a maniac high on drugs, fighting off 4 police officers! He showed a lot of restraint only kneeling on him. I'd probably have tazed him and kicked him in the throat to knock him down. He was endangering the lives of the other officers. You don't any more chances after that.

Life's tough - follow the law

[dougjb]

This clown of a cop with a long history of abuse of civilians is a perfect reason to defund the cops. The other cops (look at them in the pics) were not looking at Floyd. They were looking at the civilians as if to keep them from saving a person who was being murdered by the errant cop. This cop...and his compatriots...deserve the full sword of justice. Lock them up with the other criminals if found guilty. No special holding cages for these animal cops! The system really sucks when we have a miscreant of a cop who is brought up repeatedly on abuse of power and yet he still "serves". Is that the right term....."serves"? The other cops who stood idly by as a civilian was being murdered are as guilty as the one who did the deed. For those of you who support the cop, I want you to think of the next time you run a stop sign...if you would really like these cops to pull you over? Perhaps you might feel the knee to the neck. Why? Because you broke the law.

[Swoop]

FYI there was a case almost identical to Floyd’s. The man who died was white. It didn’t even make the national news. The officers involved were all acquitted. No looting no burning...

[butch69]

Resisting arrest while on the ground and handcuffed behind his back. I don’t see the logic in that.

[DaleDivine]

This clown of a cop with a long history of abuse of civilians is a perfect reason to defund the cops. The other cops (look at them in the pics) were not looking at Floyd. They were looking at the civilians as if to keep them from saving a person who was being murdered by the errant cop. This cop...and his compatriots...deserve the full sword of justice. Lock them up with the other criminals if found guilty. No special holding cages for these animal cops! The system really sucks when we have a miscreant of a cop who is brought up repeatedly on abuse of power and yet he still "serves". Is that the right term....."serves"? The other cops who stood idly by as a civilian was being murdered are as guilty as the one who did the deed. For those of you who support the cop, I want you to think of the next time you run a stop sign...if you would really like these cops to pull you over? Perhaps you might feel the knee to the neck. Why? Because you broke the law.

Soooo, Defund the cops. Who would you call if you had an intruder that was going to harm you or possibly rape your wife or daughter. You would probably tell them that's not nice.
:blahblahblah::blahblahblah::blahblahblah:

[Joe V.]

Resisting arrest while on the ground and handcuffed behind his back. I don’t see the logic in that.


Never made a drug arrest of a meth or crack infused suspect, violently resisting, did you?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I'm kind of wondering - what was it about the EMS arriving on the scene, that made George Floyd suddenly no longer qualify as a threat that needed Chauvin's knee to remain on his neck? Did the EMS sprinkle magick pixie dust over them? Because - Floyd was already completely unconscious and unresponsive before the EMS arrived but Chauvin refused to get up until being approached by the EMS responder. And even then, he didn't make sure Floyd was still being restrained by the other officers and the EMS's hand/knee replacing his knee, before he got up. He just - got up. Like he knew there wasn't anything Floyd was gonna do about it all along.

[Jacob85]

Are you a doctor or someone who determines cause of death as a profession? I was trained each year in restraining offenders in my job. We were told never keep a person on their stomach for a length of time and I also remember something about time and his dangerous if is to keep your weight on them when they are face down. I have been retired since 2011 so can’t remember all the details but I don’t think you can come to the conclusion that that didn’t kill him without seeing the autopsy!

[Bucco]

FYI there was a case almost identical to Floyd’s. The man who died was white. It didn’t even make the national news. The officers involved were all acquitted. No looting no burning...

Link to that please !

Thanks

[Jacob85]

Are you saying those crimes warrant the death penalty?

[DeanFL]

.
.
hmm, Even after he died, many here did it again and again>

I don't see him moving.
No flickering of the eyelids,
No pulse,
Lips turning a grayish color.
No breath at all.
No movement.

Yes folks - we beat the dead horse.
.
.

[Joe V.]

He was saying 'I can't breathe' before even being arrested. The drugs had him dead already. No getting away from it.


If he can say I can't breathe then he is actually breathing.

[Bucco]

An overdose of fentynol will do that to you.

You do know who is on trial here and you have read the various coroner reports, right ?

Of course facts and truth take a back seat to some....

[stanley]

Link to that please !

Thanks

Lawyer: Officer'''s knee to neck killed man during 2018 arrest - ABC News (https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/lawyer-officers-knee-neck-killed-man-2018-arrest-71347397)

Family: 30-year-old Angelo Quinto died after Northern California police placed knee on his neck - ABC11 Raleigh-Durham (https://abc11.com/angelo-quinto-knee-on-neck-man-dies-after-police-put-antioch-ca/10366915/)

'''You'''re gonna kill me!''': Dallas police body cam footage reveals the final minutes of Tony Timpa'''s life (https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investigations/2019/07/31/you-re-gonna-kill-me-dallas-police-body-cam-footage-reveals-the-final-minutes-of-tony-timpa-s-life/)

These are just a couple that made some national news but went nowhere because it didn't fit the racial narrative that the MSM likes to spew.

[Road-Runner]

Notice how nobody burned the Cities when OJ was found not guilty? Nobody loots and burns - unless they know they can get away with it because the police are scared to do their jobs.

Chauvin was doing his job. Ask the women who this thug raped what they would do.

Actually I was working in downtown Atlanta at the time, there were riots and violence celebrating their 'win'. There's usually burning by some whatever the verdict.

[Bucco]

Lawyer: Officer'''s knee to neck killed man during 2018 arrest - ABC News (https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/lawyer-officers-knee-neck-killed-man-2018-arrest-71347397)

Family: 30-year-old Angelo Quinto died after Northern California police placed knee on his neck - ABC11 Raleigh-Durham (https://abc11.com/angelo-quinto-knee-on-neck-man-dies-after-police-put-antioch-ca/10366915/)

'''You'''re gonna kill me!''': Dallas police body cam footage reveals the final minutes of Tony Timpa'''s life (https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investigations/2019/07/31/you-re-gonna-kill-me-dallas-police-body-cam-footage-reveals-the-final-minutes-of-tony-timpa-s-life/)

These are just a couple that made some national news but went nowhere because it didn't fit the racial narrative that the MSM likes to spew.

Thanks.

I apologize for doubting, but so much is made up on here, but thanks for the links.

Used to be I came on this forum for this kind of thing. To become more informed.

[blueash]

You are correct. If he actually "couldn't breathe", he would have not been able to say that so many times. He would have been gagging and gasping for air. Of course, the black population will use this as another excuse to go "shopping" all across the country for free stuff.

I don't know why they don't seem to rely on the facts. The guy was a criminal - past and present, was high on drugs and alcohol according to the facts and had a very bad heart. He was a ticking time bomb.

So you think that this is all so black people can buy stuff? What a racist comment.

Of course Mr Floyd should have been more articulate in his symptom description to fit your requirement. Perhaps "Officer Sir, I am experiencing dyspnea which is being exacerbated by your femur compressing my trachea." Would that work for you? I'll go with the short hand of "I can't breathe" as fully informative.

It does not matter if Mr Floyd was a past or present criminal. Cops are not authorized to kill people because of their history past or present. It does not matter if he had a bad heart. Only one question needs to answered by the jury. Did Chauvin's action shorten Floyd's life. If he died one second earlier than he would have without Chauvin's knee on his neck, that fits the definition of the criminal statute as murder or manslaughter. Why is that so hard to understand by people like you?

If I have terminal pancreatic cancer, that doesn't mean you can kill me. The law here even prohibits mercy killing where I am near death and you help me. See, the law is consistent. You cannot speed someone's death by your actions. Even if they are a criminal, even if they might have passed a counterfeit bill, even if they have drugs in their system.

Unless you actually are so warped by your political viewpoint that you believe Mr Floyd would have died at that exact moment no matter whether he was sitting on a park bench, or having his airway obstructed and blood flow to his brain obstructed, you need to understand that the law says Chauvin is responsible for his earlier than otherwise may have happened death. We will see how the charge of the judge presents the law. Pay great attention to how the judge explains the law. It will be up to the jury to decide which crime if any fits his actions.

[ChrissyI1]

George Floyd absolutely died from aphixiation caused by the police officer’s knee. He literally killed this unarmed, handcuffed black man for no reason whatsoever! How many police officers do you need to handle a handcuffed man? Cut me a break - the videos don’t lie! I hope Chauvin gets the death penalty - even that is too good for this murderer.

[talleyjm]

[QUOTE=retiredguy123;1922765]Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Kudos for sticking to facts and not trying to promote the left’s agenda. :bigbow:

[talleyjm]

Floyd was a known violent thug who ODed and died from that.

Yup. :clap2:

[Jacob85]

There are techniques for this type of restraint but The cop did not follow the correct procedures and most police departments do not use this type of restraint. .they have to receive special training.

I was trained by the police departments trainer several years in a row and we were told never to leave a person on their stomach as you are restricting their ability to breath. If they are cuffed in this position you get them on their side as soon as possible and have them sit up. It is dangerous to have a person in that position for any length of time.

[Stu from NYC]

So you think that this is all so black people can buy stuff? What a racist comment.



Do all black people loot? Of course not but quite a few actually do use it as an excuse to get stuff for nothing because they know they will get away with it.

[DeanFL]

Do all black people loot? Of course not but quite a few actually do use it as an excuse to get stuff for nothing because they know they will get away with it.

.
.
OK now. I'm taking bets in how much longer this Thread will last.

tic tic tic.....
.
.

[Larchap49]

I say, sacrifice the cop and find him guilty of all charges, regardless of the facts of the case. This way, many of our cities will not burn and many lives will be saved.
There is not one person living in this country with a bit of common sense that honestly believes that if the cop is found innocent by a jury of his peer's and released, that the community will accept the verdict and do nothing. You know that if this cop walks, cities all across the US will burn and many will be injured and killed. So, sacrifice the cop and save our cities.

Isn't that both the saddest and yet the truest of statements depicting the state of this once proud and now deteriorating nation. I am saddened watching the downfall of the greatest civilization ever. I didn't think I would live to see it but apparently I will. Very sorry for our youth but they are doing nothing to prevent it. The saying you made your bed now you have to sleep in it comes to mind.

[Bucco]

Do all black people loot? Of course not but quite a few actually do use it as an excuse to get stuff for nothing because they know they will get away with it.

We are nearing the very bottom.

[PNaughton]

I'll raise that two cents and just agree.

[Larchap49]

Can my wife put her knee on your neck for 9 minutes and see if you'll live? I'm 5'11 235 so I'm to big for your weight/height ratio.

Except the knee had little to nothing to do with his death. He was gasping for air and saying he couldn't breath while still in the police car. Cause of death enlarged heart from overdose and drug use. Over zealous use of force? maybe, murder? No he was already dying. But as previous poster stated a not guilty verdict will result in burning cities instigated by imported thugs who don't have to live there afterward. Very very sad

[Swoop]

George Floyd tested positive for the Coronavirus at the time of his death. Was he coded as another Covid death?...

[blueash]

Originally Posted by stanley View Post
Lawyer: Officer'''s knee to neck killed man during 2018 arrest - ABC News

Family: 30-year-old Angelo Quinto died after Northern California police placed knee on his neck - ABC11 Raleigh-Durham

'''You'''re gonna kill me!''': Dallas police body cam footage reveals the final minutes of Tony Timpa'''s life

These are just a couple that made some national news but went nowhere because it didn't fit the racial narrative that the MSM likes to spew.

I looked at all three of your links.
The first is of a white man with significant mental health issues who was completely out of control and died 4 days after his police encounter where he became unconscious
Coffman fled when the first officer to arrive asked to speak to him. The officer fired a stun gun at him, and Coffman ripped out the barbs and kept running. The officer sprayed Coffman with pepper spray. Coffman then grabbed a bottle of insecticide and sprayed the officer.

The second is a Filipino with mental health issues who died three days after his police encounter in his own home where a decision on charging the officer may be pending
Antioch Police Lt. Tarra Mendes told the newspaper that "the investigation is still ongoing. We want it to be completed. As soon as it is completed, we will be able to provide the public with more information.

The third is a white male with schizophrenia who died at the scene 5 years ago in Dallas Texas after being restrained. The cops stood around his unconscious body and mocked him They joke that he’s merely asleep and try to wake him: “It’s time for school. Wake up!”

One officer mimics a teen saying: “I don’t want to go to school! Five more minutes, Mom!”

They joke about buying him new shoes for the first day of school and making him a special breakfast, laughing loudly. This case is the most similar to Mr Floyd but occurred well before the increased awareness of police actions killing civilians. His case resulted in the cops being indicted by a grand jury after the coroner found "cause of death was a homicide, sudden cardiac death due to "the toxic effects of cocaine and the stress associated with physical restraint." but the coroner refused to testify in court that the cause of death was the cop and the case was dropped. I wonder what pressure was applied to get the coroner to refuse to testify. I don't think the result would be the same in 2021, hopefully

The common thread in these three cases is severe mental health issues and that cops really don't have the skills to deal with those problems. That is exactly why there is now a movement to have mental health professionals much more involved in such situations. (https://www.npr.org/2020/09/18/913229469/mental-health-and-police-violence-how-crisis-intervention-teams-are-failing)

The MSM does report these cases, as evidenced by your finding all the reports. Those organizations which represent the interest of those with mental illness have been very clear in decrying the brutality in which those with mental illnesses are treated by police. Those organizations which represent the interest of Black Americans have been very loud in decrying the brutality in which POC are treated by police. Nobody is spewing anything other than your spewing of an implication that only the murder of Blacks is reported because of a media agenda. Many more Blacks have died at the hands of police than those cases that get more attention, and those are only some of the cases where a colorblind observer can tell that the cops got it wrong.

In 2019 did you hear about "28-year-old Michael Dean, who police killed in Texas on Dec. 2; 31-year-old Christopher Whitfield, who police killed in Louisiana on Oct. 14; 54-year-old Melvin Watkins, who police killed in Louisiana on Sept. 14; and 33-year-old Channara Tom Pheap, who police killed on Aug. 26 in Tennessee." Hardly a blip on the news about those cases, but look them up if you'd like. And there are more.

[dougjb]

Soooo, Defund the cops. Who would you call if you had an intruder that was going to harm you or possibly rape your wife or daughter. You would probably tell them that's not nice.
:blahblahblah::blahblahblah::blahblahblah:

I certainly would not call this murderous cop with a long history of abuse of civilians. Neither would you if you had half a brain!

[John41]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Let’s be honest. The cops did the world a favor even though it was accidentally.

[Bsturner]

Floyd was a known violent thug who ODed and died from that.

I don’t know who needs to hear this but police aren’t suppose to kill guilty people either.

[blueash]

If he "couldn't breathe", then he couldn't say it 28 times, or even once for that matter

You never had a patient come in and say "I can't breathe"? I'm sure you did and you didn't berate them or explain that if they really couldn't breathe they would be blue and unable to talk. We all understand that what Floyd meant was I can't breathe normally. I think he was telling the truth and you're obfuscating to minimize his accurate and dying complaint.

[stanley]

I looked at all three of your links.
The first is of a white man with significant mental health issues who was completely out of control and died 4 days after his police encounter where he became unconscious


The second is a Filipino with mental health issues who died three days after his police encounter in his own home where a decision on charging the officer may be pending


The third is a white male with schizophrenia who died at the scene 5 years ago in Dallas Texas after being restrained. The cops stood around his unconscious body and mocked him This case is the most similar to Mr Floyd but occurred well before the increased awareness of police actions killing civilians. His case resulted in the cops being indicted by a grand jury after the coroner found "cause of death was a homicide, sudden cardiac death due to "the toxic effects of cocaine and the stress associated with physical restraint." but the coroner refused to testify in court that the cause of death was the cop and the case was dropped. I wonder what pressure was applied to get the coroner to refuse to testify. I don't think the result would be the same in 2021, hopefully

The common thread in these three cases is severe mental health issues and that cops really don't have the skills to deal with those problems. That is exactly why there is now a movement to have mental health professionals much more involved in such situations. (https://www.npr.org/2020/09/18/913229469/mental-health-and-police-violence-how-crisis-intervention-teams-are-failing)

The MSM does report these cases, as evidenced by your finding all the reports. Those organizations which represent the interest of those with mental illness have been very clear in decrying the brutality in which those with mental illnesses are treated by police. Those organizations which represent the interest of Black Americans have been very loud in decrying the brutality in which POC are treated by police. Nobody is spewing anything other than your spewing of an implication that only the murder of Blacks is reported because of a media agenda. Many more Blacks have died at the hands of police than those cases that get more attention, and those are only some of the cases where a colorblind observer can tell that the cops got it wrong.

In 2019 did you hear about "28-year-old Michael Dean, who police killed in Texas on Dec. 2; 31-year-old Christopher Whitfield, who police killed in Louisiana on Oct. 14; 54-year-old Melvin Watkins, who police killed in Louisiana on Sept. 14; and 33-year-old Channara Tom Pheap, who police killed on Aug. 26 in Tennessee." Hardly a blip on the news about those cases, but look them up if you'd like. And there are more.

The point was..............in those three cases, if the victims were people of color...........what do you think would have happened? Do you think it would've been just a blurb here and there on national news, or do you think the media would've been relentless to fan the flames of racism......anti police....?

[Bsturner]

Sometimes racism looks like a white person trying to justify why it’s okay to kill a black person.

QUOTE=retiredguy123;1922765]Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.[/QUOTE]

[Bucco]

I don’t know who needs to hear this but police aren’t suppose to kill guilty people either.

I am awaiting the inventive theories, when the January 6 indictments hit and those trials.

This case, and surely all of those will give new meaning to trying to twist the law.

[Swoop]

I looked at all three of your links.
The first is of a white man with significant mental health issues who was completely out of control and died 4 days after his police encounter where he became unconscious


The second is a Filipino with mental health issues who died three days after his police encounter in his own home where a decision on charging the officer may be pending


The third is a white male with schizophrenia who died at the scene 5 years ago in Dallas Texas after being restrained. The cops stood around his unconscious body and mocked him This case is the most similar to Mr Floyd but occurred well before the increased awareness of police actions killing civilians. His case resulted in the cops being indicted by a grand jury after the coroner found "cause of death was a homicide, sudden cardiac death due to "the toxic effects of cocaine and the stress associated with physical restraint." but the coroner refused to testify in court that the cause of death was the cop and the case was dropped. I wonder what pressure was applied to get the coroner to refuse to testify. I don't think the result would be the same in 2021, hopefully

The common thread in these three cases is severe mental health issues and that cops really don't have the skills to deal with those problems. That is exactly why there is now a movement to have mental health professionals much more involved in such situations. (https://www.npr.org/2020/09/18/913229469/mental-health-and-police-violence-how-crisis-intervention-teams-are-failing)

The MSM does report these cases, as evidenced by your finding all the reports. Those organizations which represent the interest of those with mental illness have been very clear in decrying the brutality in which those with mental illnesses are treated by police. Those organizations which represent the interest of Black Americans have been very loud in decrying the brutality in which POC are treated by police. Nobody is spewing anything other than your spewing of an implication that only the murder of Blacks is reported because of a media agenda. Many more Blacks have died at the hands of police than those cases that get more attention, and those are only some of the cases where a colorblind observer can tell that the cops got it wrong.

In 2019 did you hear about "28-year-old Michael Dean, who police killed in Texas on Dec. 2; 31-year-old Christopher Whitfield, who police killed in Louisiana on Oct. 14; 54-year-old Melvin Watkins, who police killed in Louisiana on Sept. 14; and 33-year-old Channara Tom Pheap, who police killed on Aug. 26 in Tennessee." Hardly a blip on the news about those cases, but look them up if you'd like. And there are more.
If you do the research and look at the makeup of those who commit violent crimes, you will see that whites are killed at a higher percentage than blacks by police.
Tony Timpa’s case was almost identical to Floyd’s, yet it only received local media coverage. You never even heard of Tony Timpa before today. If George Floyd was white, you would never have heard of him either...

[Stu from NYC]

If you do the research and look at the makeup of those who commit violent crimes, you will see that whites are killed at a higher percentage than blacks by police.
Tony Timpa’s case was almost identical to Floyd’s, yet it only received local media coverage. You never even heard of Tony Timpa before today. If George Floyd was white, you would never have heard of him either...

Very true the media has its agenda and only care when whites kill blacks.

And of course when blacks riot and loot that is ok.

[Bucco]

Sometimes racism looks like a white person trying to justify why it’s okay to kill a black person.

QUOTE=retiredguy123;1922765]Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.[/QUOTE]

And this thread is replete.

I hadn't followed much of this, but in reading the autopsies, some of the rationale being used to make the victim guilty is simply mind boggling.

I think of the rape cases, lessening now....where the female victim ended up on trial because she wore a short skirt, gave off vibes, etc. Blame the victim....she was not a virgin...she deserved to be raped.

Lots of similarities. I hope the law wins in this case, and people just put their hate away, learn and grow

[stanley]

If you do the research and look at the makeup of those who commit violent crimes, you will see that whites are killed at a higher percentage than blacks by police.
Tony Timpa’s case was almost identical to Floyd’s, yet it only received local media coverage. You never even heard of Tony Timpa before today. If George Floyd was white, you would never have heard of him either...

It's all in the narrative the media wants to present and pound everyone into believing.....I'm f'n sick of it!

[stanley]

Lots of similarities. I hope the law wins in this case, and people just put their hate away, learn and grow

You mean the law the way you interpret it?

[tvbound]

Sometimes racism looks like a white person trying to justify why it’s okay to kill a black person.


As I stated the same thing a few pages back, you are absolutely correct. It's downright sickening actually.

[golfing eagles]

You never had a patient come in and say "I can't breathe"? I'm sure you did and you didn't berate them or explain that if they really couldn't breathe they would be blue and unable to talk. We all understand that what Floyd meant was I can't breathe normally. I think he was telling the truth and you're obfuscating to minimize his accurate and dying complaint.

Not a fair comparison. My patients were not criminals resisting arrest. They did not state they could not breathe as an attempt to possibly escape or harm the LEOs. And they did not complain they could not breathe long before they had any respiratory problem whatsoever.

And we DO NOT understand what Floyd meant, unless you are psychic

But if you think I am taking sides, I am not. I don't know what happened that day.
For example, it has been suggested he died from a fentanyl OD, not from the choke hold. I find that unlikely, as I'm sure you do, since he would not be in any condition to resist anything. This was fentanyl, not PCP, he would be lethargic and weak from it.

[JMintzer]

Resisting arrest while on the ground and handcuffed behind his back. I don’t see the logic in that.

Did you see the 4 cops try (and fail) to get him into the squad car?

That's resisting arrest...

[JMintzer]

George Floyd absolutely died from aphixiation caused by the police officer’s knee. He literally killed this unarmed, handcuffed black man for no reason whatsoever! How many police officers do you need to handle a handcuffed man? Cut me a break - the videos don’t lie! I hope Chauvin gets the death penalty - even that is too good for this murderer.

The autopsy report says otherwise...

[JMintzer]

There are techniques for this type of restraint but The cop did not follow the correct procedures and most police departments do not use this type of restraint. .they have to receive special training.

I was trained by the police departments trainer several years in a row and we were told never to leave a person on their stomach as you are restricting their ability to breath. If they are cuffed in this position you get them on their side as soon as possible and have them sit up. It is dangerous to have a person in that position for any length of time.

That exact technique is taught in their police training and is in their handbook...

[Tmarkwald]

Soooo, Defund the cops. Who would you call if you had an intruder that was going to harm you or possibly rape your wife or daughter. You would probably tell them that's not nice.
:blahblahblah::blahblahblah::blahblahblah:

Baltimore announced yesterday that they will no longer prosecute people for minor crimes such as pickpocketing, shoplifting, drugs, minor assaults, prostitution etc etc.. Too many minorities were filling up the jails. And that is discrimination.

Baltimore will no longer prosecute drug possession, prostitution and other low-level offenses - CNN (https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/27/us/baltimore-prosecute-prostitution-drug-possession/index.html)

So, effectively, prostitution is now LEGAL in Baltimore. Amongst a lot of other crimes...

[DAVES]

Police training videos show that putting a knee on a person's neck is an acceptable restraining procedure. This was not the cause of death. George Floyd was 6 foot 3 and weighed 225 pounds. Chauvin was 5 foot 9 and weighed 145 pounds. Floyd was resisting arrest and was high on drugs. Put yourself in Chauvin's position. I hope he is found not guilty. My 2 cents.

Yet, another trial by riot. There is no one in the country, potential juror that does not know if Chauvin is found innocent of all charges we will have riots. If he is found guilty of lesser charges, we will have riots.

The drugs Floyd was on were given to WWII German soldiers. It not only closes down normal fear but suppresses normal moral behavior, not wanting to cause pain to others.

[Tmarkwald]

Very true the media has its agenda and only care when whites kill blacks.

And of course when blacks riot and loot that is ok.

yep, nailed it.