NO DOUBT the verdict will be strongly APPEALED by Defense

[DeanFL]

.
.
With the speed of the jury verdict - Chauvin will be found guilty of some, if not all charges. Not saying right or wrong at all.

BUT with the jury NOT sequestered for the 3 weeks, with all the local MN publicity and "commotion" and ESPECIALLY the public "commentary" by political leaders... Definite Appeal material for defense. Said directly from the Judge after the jury left the courtroom after the Closing>

"I wish elected officials would stop talking about this case, especially in a manner that is disrespectful to the rule of law and to the judicial branch and our function," Cahill added later. "I think if they want to give their opinions, they should do so in a respectful and in a manner that is consistent with their oath to the Constitution, to respect a coequal branch of government."
.
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[Stu from NYC]

So do you think the rioters and looters will be upset as they have no good excuse to do the things they like to do?

Missing out on the free stuff.

[coralway]

Guilty on all 3 counts. Sentencing in 8 weeks.

[Bucco]

So do you think the rioters and looters will be upset as they have no good excuse to do the things they like to do?

Missing out on the free stuff.

WOW......so many simply miss the point of exactly what justice is, and roll everything into some messed up ball of pure hate.

[Stu from NYC]

WOW......so many simply miss the point of exactly what justice is, and roll everything into some messed up ball of pure hate.

Chauvin got what he deserved. No problem with that at all.

My problem is with the people that use tragedies like this as an excuse to loot and steal.

Are you going to tell me this does not happen?

[tvbound]

WOW......so many simply miss the point of exactly what justice is, and roll everything into some messed up ball of pure hate.

You are exactly correct! Which is why this is such an important step toward change, true justice and equality - for everyone.

[tvbound]

Chauvin got what he deserved. No problem with that at all.

My problem is with the people that use tragedies like this as an excuse to loot and steal.

Are you going to tell me this does not happen?

You mean like those people who were fed up with unfairness, inequality and used it as an excuse, to dump someone else's property into Boston Harbor in 1773?

[Bogie Shooter]

Chauvin got what he deserved. No problem with that at all.

My problem is with the people that use tragedies like this as an excuse to loot and steal.

Are you going to tell me this does not happen?
You mean like the proud boys?

[gatorbill1]

I hope this sends a message that "everyone" is responsible for their actions

[Bucco]

Chauvin got what he deserved. No problem with that at all.

My problem is with the people that use tragedies like this as an excuse to loot and steal.

Are you going to tell me this does not happen?

Of course not, but how can your very first intinct be to come on any forum, and begin riot talk.

You "better than everybodys" think you and you alone are opposed to any violence in the street.

Most want justice...period, end of sentence.

[Bucco]

You mean like the proud boys?

Good point. Hearing already how they are misunderstood, and that bringing weapons into our capital, stealing, causing fear and confusion, threatening elected officials is quite okay.

[blueash]

back to the OP's original posting. Every conviction is appealed. I have no idea what STRONGLY appealed means. Unless there was an error of law by the judge or some sort of demonstrable jury tampering this conviction will stand. That the jury decided so quickly suggests that the prosecution had a very strong case and presented it well.

The jury decides the facts. They heard lots of facts including every negative thing that could be said about Floyd, his past behavior with arrests, his drug use etc. Despite that the jury correctly found that Chauvin killed him. The jury never heard about Chauvin's past history of excess force or the IRS case against him. So he got every benefit of the doubt, as is our system of law. Chauvin going to jail for 12 1/2 will not bring back Floyd and you know he is not going into a general population of prisoners.

Maybe, just maybe, one life will be saved by this conviction now that cops know some juries will hold them responsible.

[karostay]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[dewilson58]

I hope this sends a message that "everyone" is responsible for their actions

Somehow you think this will stop crime???
:1rotfl:

[DeanFL]

back to the OP's original posting. Every conviction is appealed. I have no idea what STRONGLY appealed means. Unless there was an error of law by the judge or some sort of demonstrable jury tampering this conviction will stand. That the jury decided so quickly suggests that the prosecution had a very strong case and presented it well.

The jury decides the facts. They heard lots of facts including every negative thing that could be said about Floyd, his past behavior with arrests, his drug use etc. Despite that the jury correctly found that Chauvin killed him. The jury never heard about Chauvin's past history of excess force or the IRS case against him. So he got every benefit of the doubt, as is our system of law. Chauvin going to jail for 12 1/2 will not bring back Floyd and you know he is not going into a general population of prisoners.

Maybe, just maybe, one life will be saved by this conviction now that cops know some juries will hold them responsible.
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please, one's "side" is so easily seen with comments as this. I'm the Op - and by "Strong Appeal", I meant possible OUTSIDE influences since the jury was not sequestered, especially the last weekend when a Congresswoman came to MN specifically to address the "crowd" outside of the courthouse with televised, reported "announcements" possibly threatening the "proper jury outcome", OR....

I ALWAYS flip issues 180degrees. For those with views on one side - simple introspect, and what if matters WERE 180degrees. Would you TRULY feel the same way?
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[Swoop]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...

[Taltarzac725]

Not much basis of an appeal. This has been news for quite some time. Hard to taint this jury pool, jury, etc.

[jebartle]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...

Me thinks, the video was strong evidence, no matter what race!

[JMintzer]

Not much basis of an appeal. This has been news for quite some time. Hard to taint this jury pool, jury, etc.

$27 MILLION, just before the case went to trial is pretty "tainting"...

[matandch]

And all appeals will be STRONGLY DENIED.

[MandoMan]

Chauvin got what he deserved. No problem with that at all.

My problem is with the people that use tragedies like this as an excuse to loot and steal.

Are you going to tell me this does not happen?

When people realize Chauvin has been sentenced to 12 1/2 years, there will be more riots, looting, and burning. That is, if he isn’t killed in jail before sentencing. I don’t know a single conservative who believes he is innocent or that his use of force was appropriate. However, rioting, looting, burning, throwing things at police officers, and screaming and shouting are NOT “peaceful assembly,” and they should be appropriately punished, too.

[jljl62040]

You mean like the proud boys?

You obviously do not know anything about the Proud Boys.

[noelphyl]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...
If Floyd were White he’d still be alive.

[Buckeye Bob]

I hope this sends a message that "everyone" is responsible for their actions

I hope everyone responsible for their actions includes the crooks and bums in office.

[Love2Swim]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...

If Floyd was white, he wouldn't have been killed by a white police officer.

[Love2Swim]

Nine out of ten appeals are rejected by the courts. In this instance we have a nine minute video that was seen by the whole world, showing how Chauvin killed Floyd. Of course the defense will appeal, but it will be an uphill battle.

[wamley]

So then we agree, arsonist, rioters and looters should pay for their actions as well as PO that go beond the law in applying what should be a legal use of force as opposed to an illegal use of force. When do the trials start for all those that committed arson, riot, burglary, grand larceny, felonious assault, criminal mischief and just about everything outlawed in the penal codes of the Sates they committed the acts, sometimes even murder.

[George Page]

You mean like those people who were fed up with unfairness, inequality and used it as an excuse, to dump someone else's property into Boston Harbor in 1773?

No! “Those people” took action against their oppressor not their neighbors and local merchants.
Try again.

[irishwonone]

If you’ve been watching the news over the last 6-8 years you know that those in power are never convicted 😳

[Tom2172]

Justice is now what the mobs and media say it is
Jury’s are now meaningless since they are now threaten as to how to vote
Members of congress openly threatened the Jury
Jury’s instructed vote to convict or mob riots & violence

[Swoop]

Me thinks, the video was strong evidence, no matter what race!

If Floyd were White he’d still be alive.

If Floyd was white, he wouldn't have been killed by a white police officer.
Take two minutes to look up the case of Tony Timpa. Almost identical to Floyd’s case:
The officer knelt on his neck for an extended time, Tony died, it was recorded on video, the cops even joked about killing him, the officers involved had their charges dismissed.
Tony was white - I rest my case...

[Bay Kid]

There will never be a fair trail or election, ever again.

[Bogie Shooter]

You obviously do not know anything about the Proud Boys.

Here is just a start for you to know more........
Judge revokes bail for Proud Boys leaders after prosecutors introduce new Capitol riot evidence (https://news.yahoo.com/judge-revokes-bail-proud-boys-202834560.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYmluZy5jb20v&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAJRPXBIPe8XRLsNTaGGW5exBikn7 lWlsIVTBEMtLpLWCN3JhC5bstkXHglhWLBWxz-yZPlynzhJ3ALJ89cuasBPRdguU5XwUxmyPSF2J7vmJxhMUYO-yXcnwtOXrgW952niMpyEDo4azaIgc1nDn01WgSVjsE96FjKrx1--0zRis)

[tvbound]

While justice was served in this case, just go back and read the original police release when it happened, it was totally played down until that brave young lady posted her video. It's also obvious that this is just a beginning, proved by all of those who are basically saying "yes, Chauvin probably killed him, but look at all of the other blacks who loot and riot when they've reached their breaking point on the obvious lack of equality, when it comes to black Americans being treated equally."

It's the systemic/institutional racism on how people of color are treated differently and that constant, big, "BUT" - that needs to change from here on out.

[billethkid]

The new America?

The many being intimidated by the few!!!!

[Bayco]

Justice is now what the mobs and media say it is
Jury’s are now meaningless since they are now threaten as to how to vote
Members of congress openly threatened the Jury
Jury’s instructed vote to convict or mob riots & violence

What a bunch of nonsense

[Proveone]

EVERYONE has the Right of FREE SPEECH. The judge was wrong in what he stated about a politician using her 1st Amendment right. If he was worried about public opinion, he should have sequestered the jury but he didn't and told them not to listen to news media. If anyone is at fault it is the Judge. The best line from the Prosecution was that George Floyd didn't die because of his heart, he died because the policeman didn't have a heart. The cell phone video said it all!

[Bogie Shooter]

While justice was served in this case, just go back and read the original police release when it happened, it was totally played down until that brave young lady posted her video. It's also obvious that this is just a beginning, proved by all of those who are basically saying "yes, Chauvin probably killed him, but look at all of the other blacks who loot and riot when they've reached their breaking point on the obvious lack of equality, when it comes to black Americans being treated equally."

It's the systemic/institutional racism on how people of color are treated differently and that constant, big, "BUT" - that needs to change from here on out.

Yes.

Whataboutism, should be added to "BUT".

[tvbound]

No! “Those people” took action against their oppressor not their neighbors and local merchants.
Try again.

Sorry, but it wasn't the British East India Company that instituted the taxes, so the analogy is totally legitimate. The difference being, a lot of people have no problem with rioting and illegal acts, as long as it is white people doing it (Jan 6 perfect example). What's sad is seeing so many white people who are upset and try to deflect, that a racist bad cop was finally held accountable. Let this be a springboard to hold the small % of bad cops accountable and their peers (who know who they are) speaking up - from here on out.

[Girlcopper]

If Floyd was white, he wouldn't have been killed by a white police officer.
Oh here we go again. If Floyd was purple and fought with cops, he would have still been killled. Quit the black n white garbage talk

[Love2Swim]

Take two minutes to look up the case of Tony Timpa. Almost identical to Floyd’s case:
The officer knelt on his neck for an extended time, Tony died, it was recorded on video, the cops even joked about killing him, the officers involved had their charges dismissed.
Tony was white - I rest my case...

One example. Overall, the rate of police killings of black people is far higher than that of whites. You're welcome to your own opinions, but not your own facts.

[DeanFL]

.
.

Personally, my main concern re all these """racist cop shootings""" episodes is how the MEDIA picks and chooses the ones that may fit their narrative. It's like Marketing 101.

As some mentioned before in the USA there typically is TWICE as many whites shot&killed by police.

Has ANYONE here seen THIS reported by the Mass Media/Networks/Social Media??? Happened last week in GEORGIA>

Cop begs knife-wielding man in standoff: 'You’re a black man. I’m a black man. You don’t have to die today. I don’t want you to die today.'

“I’m begging you,” the sergeant pleaded with a knife-wielding man through a closed door after a 911 call about a reported prowler, WXIA-TV said. “You’re a black man. I’m a black man. You don’t have to die today. I don’t want you to die today.”

Officers begged 35-year-old Matthew Williams at least 47 times to drop the knife he had been holding after lunging at one officer, the station said.
But it was no use. Williams lunged again at police, shots were fired, and Williams’ body was recovered from the premises an hour later, WXIA reported.

And police said Williams lunged at an officer with what they described as a blue ceramic knife, the station reported.

An officer fired one shot, but police said Williams fled into the trees surrounding the house, WXIA reported, adding that an officer said in the bodycam clip that she may have shot Williams in the shoulder.
“Drop the knife, man!” an officer hollers into the woods.
“Drop the weapon! Drop it!” another officers yells.

“We will shoot, man, all right? We gave you ample warnings, all right?” an officer is heard telling Williams.
“Please come out for us, boss man. What’s the problem? How can I help you?” says an officer who identified himself as Sgt. Perry with the DeKalb Police Department.

After a minute, an officer kicks in the door — but it soon closes from the inside, WXIA reported.

“I’m begging you,” the sergeant pleaded with Williams, the station said. “You’re a black man. I’m a black man. You don’t have to die today. I don’t want you to die today.”

After another minute, police told the station, Williams lunged at them again with the knife just as one officer was heard saying “we’re here to help you” — and then three gunshots rang out.

The door closed again, WXIA said, and officers withdrew and waited for a SWAT team. Williams’ body was recovered from the house over an hour later, the station reported.
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just one of (small) Media covering this story>Cop Begs Knife-Wielding Man In Standoff: ‘You Don’t Have To Die Today’ | Daily Street News (https://mynews.one/cop-begs-knife-wielding-man-in-standoff-you-dont-have-to-die-today/)

[George Page]

Sorry, but it wasn't the British East India Company that instituted the taxes, so the analogy is totally legitimate. The difference being, a lot of people have no problem with rioting and illegal acts, as long as it is white people doing it (Jan 6 perfect example). What's sad is seeing so many white people who are upset and try to deflect, that a racist bad cop was finally held accountable. Let this be a springboard to hold the small % of bad cops accountable and their peers (who know who they are) speaking up - from here on out.

Wrong! A little history lesson follows...........

The midnight raid, popularly known as the “Boston Tea Party,” was in protest of the British Parliament’s Tea Act of 1773, a bill designed to save the faltering East India Company by greatly lowering its tea tax and granting it a virtual monopoly on the American tea trade. The low tax allowed the East India Company to undercut even tea smuggled into America by Dutch traders, and many colonists viewed the act as another example of taxation tyranny.
Try again!

[maggie1]

You obviously do not know anything about the Proud Boys.

I believe we know enough by watching members of their organization who were seen crashing through the doors of the Capitol on January 6th. They might not represent the ideals of all Proud Boy factions, but how do you begin to separate the good apples from the bad?

[billethkid]

One example. Overall, the rate of police killings of black people is far higher than that of whites. You're welcome to your own opinions, but not your own facts.

Is it possible that because they are involved in more criminal activity...and running away or confronting law enforcement.

And the population in prisons is mostly what?

Suggesting there may well be a pattern.

:icon_bored:

[graciegirl]

You mean like the proud boys?

Yes like them.

Looting and stealing has no place in "activism". NONE. ZERO. No matter WHO does it. Bogie you and I sit on different sides of the political aisle. But stealing and burning and ruining anything is WRONG and should not be protected by the First Amendment.

[graciegirl]

In the aftermath of the verdict, I want to share this video from Live PD showing one of my favorite segments.

Please watch Policing done right. Please see that it isn't about RACE.

Live PD segment. cop cries - Bing video (https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=Live%20PD%20segment.%20cop%20cries&&view=detail&mid=A1A322598FB9C0B921C6A1A322598FB9C0B921C6&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3DLive%2520PD%2520segmen t.%2520cop%2520cries%26qs%3Dn%26form%3DQBVR%26sp%3 D-1%26pq%3Dlive%2520pd%2520segment.%2520cop%2520crie s%26sc%3D0-26%26sk%3D%26cvid%3DA77F16C879BD4FDEBCE443E0893A20 05&fbclid=IwAR2m5MYDz73bPYE2J6y8gtdEioECTTSWXCmnbWPJ_ w7lgGoyWLHv-V9mIXc)

[Gmaf6]

And I’m sure Tony’s family didn’t get $27 million

[Linnberg]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...

Wow! Can’t believe
You believe that!!

[jbrown132]

How many of those jurors do you think sat in that jury room and said to themselves if I vote to acquit on any of those charges I don’t want to be the one responsible for watching my city burn. The judge should have changed the venue and the jury should have been sequestered throughout the trial. Not saying innocent or guilty, just saying almost impossible to get a fair trial under those circumstances.

[tvbound]

If nothing else, a public service is being provided by a lot of posts that exemplify the root of the problem and demonstrating how so many don't view people of color as even being human beings - deserving of equal treatment under the law.

[diva1]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...

If Floyd was white, this incident would never have happened.

[Grill Meister]

Supreme Court Might Reverse Chauvin Convictions because of Maxine Waters

by Alan M. Dershowitz
April 21, 2021 at 5:00 am



The Minnesota appellate courts might not reverse the conviction but the United States Supreme Court well might, as they have done in other cases involving jury intimidation.

In seeking to put her thumb on the scales of justice, Rep. Maxine Waters perhaps unwittingly borrowed a tactic right out of the Deep South of the early 20th century.

In the Deep South during the 1920s and '30s, elected politicians would organize demonstrations by white voters in front of courthouses in which racially charged trials were being conducted. The politicians then threatened, explicitly or implicitly, that violence would follow the acquittal of a black defendant or the conviction of a white defendant. The U.S. Supreme Court and other federal courts reversed several convictions based on these tactics of intimidation.

The judge in the Chauvin trial made a serious error in not sequestering the jury during the entire trial.

Already, we have seen blood sprayed over the former home of a witness who testified for Chauvin; the defendant's lawyers have received threats. An aura of violence is in the air. Jurors breathe that same air....

This is not the Deep South in the 1920s. It is the "Identity Politics" of the 21st century. But the motives of the protesters are not relevant to whether jurors in the Chauvin case could be expected to consider the evidence objectively without fear of the kind of intimidation threatened by Waters.

The evidence, in my view, supports a verdict of manslaughter, but not of murder. Any verdict that did not include a conviction for murder was likely to be unacceptable to Waters and her followers, however, even if the facts and the law mandate that result. Waters is not interested in neutral justice. She wants vengeance for what she and her followers justifiably see as the unjustified killing of George Floyd.... That is not the rule of law. That is the passion of the crowd.

We must be certain that threats of intimidation do not influence jury verdicts. That certainty does not exist now in the Chauvin case, thanks largely to the ill-advised threats and demands of Maxine Waters and others.

The convictions of Derek Chauvin might not mark the end of this racially divisive case. The US Supreme Court might ultimately decide whether to uphold the convictions.

Congresswoman Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) made a statement — while jurors in the trial of former Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin were not yet sequestered — which demanded street confrontations unless Chauvin were found guilty of murder. The trial judge correctly suggested that any conviction in the case might ultimately be thrown out on appeal, based on what Waters said. He condemned Waters' remarks in the strongest terms, but he did not have the courage to grant a defense motion for a mistrial. Had he done so, that almost certainly would have led to riots — which would have been blamed on the judge, not on Rep. Waters. So he left it to the court of appeals, months in the future, to grant a new trial -- which he should have granted.

The Minnesota appellate courts might not reverse the conviction but the United States Supreme Court well might, as they have done in other cases involving jury intimidation.

In seeking to put her thumb on the scales of justice, Rep. Waters perhaps unwittingly borrowed a tactic right out of the Deep South of the early 20th century. Though her motives and intentions were far better than those of the white southerners, the tactic is essentially the same. In the Deep South during the 1920s and '30s, elected politicians would organize demonstrations by white voters in front of courthouses in which racially charged trials were being conducted. The politicians then threatened, explicitly or implicitly, that violence would follow the acquittal of a black defendant or the conviction of a white defendant. The U.S. Supreme Court and other federal courts reversed several convictions based on these tactics of intimidation.

The judge in the Chauvin trial made a serious error in not sequestering the jury during the entire trial. Instead, he merely told them not to read or watch the news. That is not nearly enough; even if the jurors scrupulously followed the judge's narrow instruction, it is inconceivable that some of them did not learn what was going on outside the courtroom from friends, family, media and TV shows that were not "the news." It is safe to assume that many if not all of the jurors were fearful — either consciously or unconsciously —that a verdict other than the one desired by Waters and her followers would result in violence that threatens them, their homes, their businesses and their families.

Already, we have seen blood sprayed over the former home of a witness who testified for Chauvin; the defendant's lawyers have received threats. An aura of violence is in the air. Jurors breathe that same air, and the guilty verdict in this case — whether deserved or undeserved — should be scrutinized carefully by the appellate courts.

This is not the Deep South in the 1920s. It is the "Identity Politics" of the 21st century. But the motives of the protesters are not relevant to whether jurors in the Chauvin case could be expected to consider the evidence objectively without fear of the kind of intimidation threatened by Waters.

Both the prosecution and the defense put on effective cases. The evidence, in my view, supports a verdict of manslaughter, but not of murder. Any verdict that did not include a conviction for murder was likely to be unacceptable to Waters and her followers, however, even if the facts and the law mandate that result. Waters is not interested in neutral justice. She wants vengeance for what she and her followers justifiably see as the unjustified killing of George Floyd.

Yet, justice is not black and white. It requires calibration, common-sense nuance and a careful evaluation of all the evidence presented by both sides. There can be no assurance that this jury was capable of rendering justice without the threatening sword of Damocles — unsheathed by Waters — hanging over their heads. That is not the rule of law. That is the passion of the crowd.

We must do a better job of insulating jurors from outside influences in racially charged cases. We must be certain that threats of intimidation do not influence jury verdicts. That certainty does not exist now in the Chauvin case, thanks largely to the ill-advised threats and demands of Maxine Waters and others.

[JanetMM]

If Floyd was white, the charges against Chauvin would have been dismissed...

If Floyd were white, he would still be alive. Your above statement of charges would be moot since there would have been no murder.

[Joe C.]

These are my thoughts. Maybe they are wrong, but still, seeing what I have on the body cams, I don't think that Chauvin is guilty. The jury says yes, but I think that they considered all the rioting across the country that would have happened if an innocent verdict was issued and that was heavily weighed in their decision.
George Floyd kept saying "I can't breathe", yet he was breathing. As the defense said, that in order to talk you must breathe. Chauvin did use his knee to the neck, but it was to the side of the neck and not the windpipe. Floyd was on fentanyl and methamphetamine when he passed the counterfeit money and got arrested. He was foaming at the mouth when he was approached. That in itself could cause breathing problems.
Then there is the "race factor. The media and the left played that to the hilt. Too much publicity and left wing activism tainted the jury's decision.
Is Chauvin "innocent"? I think that he is complicit, yes. But murder? Not so much.

[Pat2015]

If Floyd were White he’d still be alive.

I don’t believe that at all. I think actions have consequences and in this case the officer was wrong to use that kind of force. If you believe that police officers kill people because they are black, does it also hold true that they kill twice as many white people a year because they are white?

[skarra]

.
.
With the speed of the jury verdict - Chauvin will be found guilty of some, if not all charges. Not saying right or wrong at all.

BUT with the jury NOT sequestered for the 3 weeks, with all the local MN publicity and "commotion" and ESPECIALLY the public "commentary" by political leaders... Definite Appeal material for defense. Said directly from the Judge after the jury left the courtroom after the Closing>

"I wish elected officials would stop talking about this case, especially in a manner that is disrespectful to the rule of law and to the judicial branch and our function," Cahill added later. "I think if they want to give their opinions, they should do so in a respectful and in a manner that is consistent with their oath to the Constitution, to respect a coequal branch of government."
.
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This is the first step towards EVERYONE regaining confidence in law enforcement, particularly amongst people of color who have been singled out in the past.

We eliminated one very bad apple which is good for the entire system.

[Swoop]

Wow! Can’t believe
You believe that!!

If Floyd was white, this incident would never have happened.

If Floyd were white, he would still be alive. Your above statement of charges would be moot since there would have been no murder.
The three of you should read post #33...

[Pat2015]

While justice was served in this case, just go back and read the original police release when it happened, it was totally played down until that brave young lady posted her video. It's also obvious that this is just a beginning, proved by all of those who are basically saying "yes, Chauvin probably killed him, but look at all of the other blacks who loot and riot when they've reached their breaking point on the obvious lack of equality, when it comes to black Americans being treated equally."

It's the systemic/institutional racism on how people of color are treated differently and that constant, big, "BUT" - that needs to change from here on out.
There is never an excuse or justification to burn down and destroy people’s property and steal from their businesses. If you want to march in protest that’s fine, but I feel these incidents have little to do with “Justice” and more about destroying places and getting free stuff. Where is the “Justice” for people who’s lives and businesses are destroyed that had nothing to do with the latest case that’s used as an excuse to behave in this way?

[tvbound]

I don’t believe that at all. I think actions have consequences and in this case the officer was wrong to use that kind of force. If you believe that police officers kill people because they are black, does it also hold true that they kill twice as many white people a year because they are white?

"does it also hold true that they kill twice as many white people a year because they are white?"

You may want to research the per-capita ratio, in your misleading statement. Almost 5 times as many whites than blacks in this country, but only twice as many whites killed - tells a different story.

[jog222]

You mean like those people who were fed up with unfairness, inequality and used it as an excuse, to dump someone else's property into Boston Harbor in 1773?

So you would have no problem if people who were fed up with with unfairness, inequality, etc..., burned your house down in the name of justice?

[djspinner1]

This was nothing but politics. It was wrong what he did but he did not get a fair trail.
Put your self on that jury, would you have said not guilty knowing what would happen.

[DeanFL]

"does it also hold true that they kill twice as many white people a year because they are white?"

You may want to research the per-capita ratio, in your misleading statement. Almost 5 times as many whites than blacks in this country, but only twice as many whites killed - tells a different story.
.
.
actually, Paul Harvey would tell "the rest of the story". It would include the %'s of serious crime nationwide, fleeing suspects, armed and dangerous perps - etc etc. by racial demographics.
.
.

[Pat2015]

How many of those jurors do you think sat in that jury room and said to themselves if I vote to acquit on any of those charges I don’t want to be the one responsible for watching my city burn. The judge should have changed the venue and the jury should have been sequestered throughout the trial. Not saying innocent or guilty, just saying almost impossible to get a fair trial under those circumstances.
Agree! There was a lot of media; a huge civil settlement before the criminal trial even started; rioting; incitement to riot by Maxine based on the verdict; and an overall fear for their own well being. I’m not saying he was innocent. What I am saying is that there could never have been a fair trial there given all of these circumstances and the tremendous pressure on the jury to vote to convict.

[DeanFL]

Agree! There was a lot of media; a huge civil settlement before the criminal trial even started; rioting; incitement to riot by Maxine based on the verdict; and an overall fear for their own well being. I’m not saying he was innocent. What I am saying is that there could never have been a fair trial there given all of these circumstances and the tremendous pressure on the jury to vote to convict.

.
.
agree. and now, when this 'story' plays out and loses Media interest - it will be 'NEXT!!!' and the next one (if it fits their narrative) will be exploited.
.
.

[tvbound]

.
.
actually, Paul Harvey would tell "the rest of the story". It would include the %'s of serious crime nationwide, fleeing suspects, armed and dangerous perps - etc etc. by racial demographics.
.
.

NAACP | Criminal Justice Fact Sheet (https://www.naacp.org/criminal-justice-fact-sheet/)

[DAVES]

.
.
With the speed of the jury verdict - Chauvin will be found guilty of some, if not all charges. Not saying right or wrong at all.

BUT with the jury NOT sequestered for the 3 weeks, with all the local MN publicity and "commotion" and ESPECIALLY the public "commentary" by political leaders... Definite Appeal material for defense. Said directly from the Judge after the jury left the courtroom after the Closing>

"I wish elected officials would stop talking about this case, especially in a manner that is disrespectful to the rule of law and to the judicial branch and our function," Cahill added later. "I think if they want to give their opinions, they should do so in a respectful and in a manner that is consistent with their oath to the Constitution, to respect a coequal branch of government."
.
.

The verdict was obvious. I could have told you before it was announced. It was trial by riot. Was anything appropriate? Of that I am not sure.

Imagine the judge. The sentence will be announced in six months. I am far from a legal expert but that seems not to be normal. Perhaps, the motive is to allow threat of riot to
cool.

Appeal? The judge himself knows it will be appealed. Will it be granted? That will be interesting to find the answer to that question.

Imagine being a cop today. Not sure how much that has changed. Do i really want to catch this guy? I worked in a bad neighborhood. Often the obvious answer was no.

[Swoop]

One example. Overall, the rate of police killings of black people is far higher than that of whites. You're welcome to your own opinions, but not your own facts.
Do you really want facts?!?
Fact: black males comprise 5.8% of the population in the US
Fact: black males commit more than 50% of the murders and burglaries in the US
Fact: whites are twice as likely to be killed by police as blacks
Not opinions - just facts...

[ribil]

WOW......so many simply miss the point of exactly what justice is, and roll everything into some messed up ball of pure hate.
Rioting and looting have absolutely nothing to do with “the point of what justice is...”. And I “hate” that it is allowed to happen.

[Bogie Shooter]

Yes like them.

Looting and stealing has no place in "activism". NONE. ZERO. No matter WHO does it. Bogie you and I sit on different sides of the political aisle. But stealing and burning and ruining anything is WRONG and should not be protected by the First Amendment.
I am in agreement with your opinion.
Where I sit doesn’t matter on this.........

[ron32162]

With all of the information on the jury, names, faces and how they voted. Who in their right mind would of voted any other way these people waiting outside of the courthouse would have erupted.

[Bogie Shooter]

This was nothing but politics. It was wrong what he did but he did not get a fair trail.
Put your self on that jury, would you have said not guilty knowing what would happen.

Would you?

[DAVES]

"does it also hold true that they kill twice as many white people a year because they are white?"

You may want to research the per-capita ratio, in your misleading statement. Almost 5 times as many whites than blacks in this country, but only twice as many whites killed - tells a different story.

For most of us, we can and do spin facts to support our point of view. I am amused that people's point of view changes when it directly effects them.

My sister, a liberal, repeatedly told me we should support illegal aliens. Hum, she is now playing a different tune. My niece was rear ended by a car driven by an illegal alien. Her car was rolled over onto her left arm. There was a chance she would lose her left arm.
She still has it but it is virtually useless. The driver of the other car did not even have a valid drivers license or insurance. The driver was not deported. Her father bought her another car and she was out driving again before my niece was out of the hospital.

Things are not perfect nor will they ever be.

[jbrown132]

This is the first step towards EVERYONE regaining confidence in law enforcement, particularly amongst people of color who have been singled out in the past.

We eliminated one very bad apple which is good for the entire system.

I’m not sure what it’s the beginning of. It could be the beginning of police saying I’m not going to arrest that guy or I could end up in prison or loose my pension. Let’s see what the crime statistics look like in two years. No one knows where this is going.

[riamd1954]

It’s so obvious the jury was already to say not guilty even before they sequestered!

[tomhinz]

Agreed

[DeanFL]

I’m not sure what it’s the beginning of. It could be the beginning of police saying I’m not going to arrest that guy or I could end up in prison or loose my pension. Let’s see what the crime statistics look like in two years. No one knows where this is going.

.
.
THAT has ALREADY started across the USA. And as time goes on, LEO's could very well plug that into their initial decision-making when protecting us all and enforcing laws.

Like - 'He's running - he's 'of color' - nope, not worth it. and off he goes to be a repeat offender.

Can't blame them. I would not want to be a LEO, or anyone in family or friends nowadays. It's simply a no-win.
.
.

[DAVES]

I don’t believe that at all. I think actions have consequences and in this case the officer was wrong to use that kind of force. If you believe that police officers kill people because they are black, does it also hold true that they kill twice as many white people a year because they are white?

Things are quite different when you are there. We sit here in the safety of our computer room saying what should have been.

I lived in a city housing project till I was 13. My dad an injured WWII vet increased his income through hard work. By high school we had moved in to a upper middle class neighborhood. I recall in high school 1968, the subject of race, came up. The riots were not where we lived but in the cities. I offered a tour of where I used to live. Of course,
I was shut up.

How many times do we hear people say I don't go there. I have lived there and was glad to get out.

[Chuckndianne]

Simply - “BS” to simplistic thinking from simple minds!

[Stu from NYC]

There is never an excuse or justification to burn down and destroy people’s property and steal from their businesses. If you want to march in protest that’s fine, but I feel these incidents have little to do with “Justice” and more about destroying places and getting free stuff. Where is the “Justice” for people who’s lives and businesses are destroyed that had nothing to do with the latest case that’s used as an excuse to behave in this way?

Exactly. The police are told to look the other way while people who put their life savings and blood sweat and tears into building their businesses had everything destroyed.

Still amazed that black leadership does not point out that the rioters and looters are destroying the jobs that many of their people worked at.

Nothing at all wrong with peaceful protest but no excuse for what happened after the murder.

[Toymeister]

I don't know about you but this thread has given me an amazing number of posters to add to my ignore list!

[Pat La Rosa]

I find it amazing how much money towns and cities pay people who probably earn minimum wage. I had an apartment building and one night a drunken friend who was visiting one of the tenants was sitting on the railing in front of the apartment and fell off it and hit his head. He was earning $8.00 an hour and did not lose one hours time from work. He sued me and the insurance company paid him over $200,000.00. You wonder how the insurance companies and cities come up with these astronomical figures. I think including "Go Fund Me" Floyd's family and friends received over $40,000,000. Just saying, is that fair. People are dying from Covid and no one is getting a dime from China. Why????

[jimbomaybe]

Murder = knowingly,intentionally without legal justification cause the death of another person.. he did all those things?

[christine J Toft]

This was nothing but politics. It was wrong what he did but he did not get a fair trail.
Put your self on that jury, would you have said not guilty knowing what would happen.
I would have done the job I took an oath to do. Period. And from my perspective, the jury did just that.

[rlcooper70]

Odd ... when I watch a video of someone being killed and then hear that the jury deliberated for too short a time ... I find myself wondering .... "should I believe the story told by the defense or my own eyes?" Easy answer.

[blueash]

Fox News must be hitting hard on the jury being a bunch of weak willed people who were so intimidated by potential riots that they totally ignored the oath they took when they were sworn in, that they ignored all the evidence that Chauvin was really innocent, that they by a 12 to 0 vote in just a few hours unanimously agreed to falsely convict him without even one true patriot holding out for a hung jury. Every juror was interviewed before being allowed to sit for this trial. There were eight whites on the jury, all 8 of which agreed with the jury verdicts on all three charges.

Yet on this very website we have people spouting nonsense about how Chauvin was innocent. What convicted Chauvin was his own brutality, his murder of G. Floyd, and most importantly that he was video taped doing it. No opportunity to lie his way out of it. The earlier post calling Black people animals has now been removed. But racism is huge on this website and in this country. If you don't believe that cops just might let Whites get away with ignoring their orders (https://www.tmz.com/2020/12/05/ohio-police-standoff-body-camera-video-white-suspect-threatens-shoot/), and threatening to kill the cop, and picking up a gun sitting on the car seat and fleeing all without being tased or shot

-- He refuses to put his hands on the steering wheel

-- He refuses to get out of the car

-- He puts his hand on his gun

-- He twice threatens to shoot the cop

-- He closes the car door and speeds away

You suspect and know in your heart this would have gone differently if that driver were Black.

[Swoop]

Fox News must be hitting hard on the jury being a bunch of weak willed people who were so intimidated by potential riots that they totally ignored the oath they took when they were sworn in, that they ignored all the evidence that Chauvin was really innocent, that they by a 12 to 0 vote in just a few hours unanimously agreed to falsely convict him without even one true patriot holding out for a hung jury. Every juror was interviewed before being allowed to sit for this trial. There were eight whites on the jury, all 8 of which agreed with the jury verdicts on all three charges.

Yet on this very website we have people spouting nonsense about how Chauvin was innocent. What convicted Chauvin was his own brutality, his murder of G. Floyd, and most importantly that he was video taped doing it. No opportunity to lie his way out of it. The earlier post calling Black people animals has now been removed. But racism is huge on this website and in this country. If you don't believe that cops just might let Whites get away with ignoring their orders (https://www.tmz.com/2020/12/05/ohio-police-standoff-body-camera-video-white-suspect-threatens-shoot/), and threatening to kill the cop, and picking up a gun sitting on the car seat and fleeing all without being tased or shot



You suspect and know in your heart this would have gone differently if that driver were Black.

This was sort of the reverse of the OJ trial...

Do yourself a favor and research Tony Timpa...

[DeanFL]

.
.
agree. and now, when this 'story' plays out and loses Media interest - it will be 'NEXT!!!' and the next one (if it fits their narrative) will be exploited.
.
.

.
ALREADY STARTED. NEXT is in the news. Get your plane ticket Benjamin Crump and activists...

Columbus, Ohio, police release bodycam footage of officer fatally shooting Black teen

Columbus police shooting: Bodycam footage released as protests develop (https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/04/20/columbus-police-shooting-teenager-family/7311835002/)
.
.

[Roron123]

The appeal will show final decision!

[blueash]

This was sort of the reverse of the OJ trial...

Do yourself a favor and research Tony Timpa...

I know about Timpa, you have mentioned his case many many times. For those that don't know, in Texas about 5 years ago the cops were called by the victim himself asking for help. They arrived to a situation where a severely disturbed schizophrenic white man was encountered. He was already cuffed and prone on the grass by store security. The cops restrained him on the ground for several minutes mocking him and making jokes about his mental illness of which they were very aware. He stopped breathing and died, with cocaine in his system.

The cops were indicted by the grand jury but the local prosecutor refused to go to trial when the coroner refused to state that the cause of death was the police action. Maybe this is one example you can continue to cite, but it is not the same, and has nothing to do with OJ. I will concede that in the chart of persons that cops are likely to abuse people with severe mental health problems are right up there with Black people. This is why there is a push by many to have some police actions be taken over by mental health experts with cops only as back up. If a social worker had been dispatched to Mr Timba he would almost certainly be alive.

[meme5x]

Not to stir the pot, but question why it’s OK for blacks to continually keep killing each other... also when police question someone, black or white, resistant shouldn’t be an option when a crime has been committed. Most publicized cases have been noted that a crime was committed... should they just go unnoticed?

[Swoop]

I know about Timpa, you have mentioned his case many many times. For those that don't know, in Texas about 5 years ago the cops were called by the victim himself asking for help. They arrived to a situation where a severely disturbed schizophrenic white man was encountered. He was already cuffed and prone on the grass by store security. The cops restrained him on the ground for several minutes mocking him and making jokes about his mental illness of which they were very aware. He stopped breathing and died, with cocaine in his system.

The cops were indicted by the grand jury but the local prosecutor refused to go to trial when the coroner refused to state that the cause of death was the police action. Maybe this is one example you can continue to cite, but it is not the same, and has nothing to do with OJ. I will concede that in the chart of persons that cops are likely to abuse people with severe mental health problems are right up there with Black people. This is why there is a push by many to have some police actions be taken over by mental health experts with cops only as back up. If a social worker had been dispatched to Mr Timba he would almost certainly be alive.
And the only reason you know about Tony Timpa is because I have cited his case. But you would have to be living under a rock not to have heard about Floyd. The difference - is black & white...

[gatorbill1]

Somehow you think this will stop crime???
:1rotfl:

My meaning was even police are responsible for their actions. No one is above law

[blueash]

And I’m sure Tony’s family didn’t get $27 million

The lawsuit was dismissed on a very controversial decision on a IMO terrible legal basis of qualified immunity. (https://www.lawfareblog.com/what-qualified-immunity-and-what-does-it-have-do-police-reform) And the situation is different. In Floyd's case the government admitted that its cop killed the victim thus it was at fault for the death. In Tony's case the government is not accepting legal responsibility for his death and declined to prosecute the cops.

[BlackhawksFan]

No! “Those people” took action against their oppressor not their neighbors and local merchants.
Try again.

You don't think Black people see the White establishment as their oppressors?

[tvbound]

Fox News must be hitting hard on the jury being a bunch of weak willed people who were so intimidated by potential riots that they totally ignored the oath they took when they were sworn in, that they ignored all the evidence that Chauvin was really innocent, that they by a 12 to 0 vote in just a few hours unanimously agreed to falsely convict him without even one true patriot holding out for a hung jury. Every juror was interviewed before being allowed to sit for this trial. There were eight whites on the jury, all 8 of which agreed with the jury verdicts on all three charges.

Yet on this very website we have people spouting nonsense about how Chauvin was innocent. What convicted Chauvin was his own brutality, his murder of G. Floyd, and most importantly that he was video taped doing it. No opportunity to lie his way out of it. The earlier post calling Black people animals has now been removed. But racism is huge on this website and in this country. If you don't believe that cops just might let Whites get away with ignoring their orders (https://www.tmz.com/2020/12/05/ohio-police-standoff-body-camera-video-white-suspect-threatens-shoot/), and threatening to kill the cop, and picking up a gun sitting on the car seat and fleeing all without being tased or shot

You suspect and know in your heart this would have gone differently if that driver were Black.

"The earlier post calling Black people animals has now been removed. But racism is huge on this website and in this country."

I have mixed feelings on that removed post. While I applaud management for addressing such a racist statement, I also believe that if it had stood, more people might have gained a clue as to how so many claimed law enforcement officers - actually think.

As to whether this case may make LEO's pause and examine their own prejudices and bias' before taking action in the future, in the long run that will be a good thing IMHO.

Let's also not lose sight of the fact that the sentencing hasn't occurred yet, however. Did the judge tip his own bias, when he commented on Water's statement? We'll soon see if complete justice will happen.

[DALEPQ]

There is no doubt that this was trial by media, who were not in the Jury Box.
Not defending the Cop, but the media held him guilty from the start.
Floyd didn't need to die, but he was no 'Choir Boy' that is being put on forth as a hero.
He was a criminal, and broke the law many times.
His family so far has gotten $27 Mil. in a payment from MSP. and over $20 Mil. in go-fund-me.
Like it or not the Media is destroying democracy by dictating what they want to report,
not what the actual facts are.
This is not political, just the reality of what is taking place.

[tvbound]

My meaning was even police are responsible for their actions. No one is above law

I agree that no one should be above the law. History has shown however, that's not really the case.

[kenoc7]

.
.
With the speed of the jury verdict - Chauvin will be found guilty of some, if not all charges. Not saying right or wrong at all.

BUT with the jury NOT sequestered for the 3 weeks, with all the local MN publicity and "commotion" and ESPECIALLY the public "commentary" by political leaders... Definite Appeal material for defense. Said directly from the Judge after the jury left the courtroom after the Closing>

"I wish elected officials would stop talking about this case, especially in a manner that is disrespectful to the rule of law and to the judicial branch and our function," Cahill added later. "I think if they want to give their opinions, they should do so in a respectful and in a manner that is consistent with their oath to the Constitution, to respect a coequal branch of government."
.
.

Of course, it was the right decision = 9.29 minute video. Everrything else is irrelevant, appropriate or not, jury sequestered or not.

[blueash]

Not to stir the pot, but question why it’s OK for blacks to continually keep killing each other... also when police question someone, black or white, resistant shouldn’t be an option when a crime has been committed. Most publicized cases have been noted that a crime was committed... should they just go unnoticed?

No one ever in this history of race relations ever said it's "OK for blacks to kill each other. " Well, I'm wrong. I have heard racists say it is great that they kill each other.

No one has every said that cops should not do their job to protect and serve. The issue is whether the cops do it wrong, and for the wrong reasons. You certainly have never heard of cops planting drugs (https://gothamist.com/news/videos-appear-show-cop-planting-marijuana-during-arrests-staten-island-da-sees-nothing-wrong), or even dropping a gun at a scene (https://abcnews.go.com/US/baltimore-officers-planted-gun-man-deliberately-running-indictment/story?id=61498790) These are both well known techniques. And cops certainly always tell the truth about what happened in their reports and on the stand. Have you heard the term "testilying"

Cameras are now documenting what POC have been saying. Read this story of cops being brutal and lying about it, of course regarding a Black man (https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/police-dash-cam-video-exonerates-nj-man-implicates-cops-article-1.1701763)

Cops are not paragons of virtue, nor is that true of any field. There are great cops, ok cops, and sadly terrible cops, racist cops, abusive cops, power hungry cops, etc. And the good ones certainly outnumber the bad ones.

What happens when a cop complains up the chain (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Serpico) that one of the other cops is a bad cop? Do you honestly believe that making a complaint like that is good for the complaining cop? Does the police union protect bad cops?

If the Black experience in this country is that they are targeted by cops, I believe them. Every study has shown there are more stops of Blacks while driving (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_while_black). Marijuana arrests are overwhelming higher in Black people than white even though whites use at a higher rate than Blacks. Selective policing at its worst. That a Black man stopped by a cop is in fear that he is not going to be treated fairly is based on reality. When reaching for your ID as ordered by the cop gets you killed as the cop says he thought you were reaching for a gun and the cop gets away with it, you might fear for your life in a routine traffic stop for a broken tail light.

The problem with the few bad apples in the barrel is that it spoils the whole barrel.

Are there justified shootings, of course. One in Columbus Ohio yesterday. Amazingly the police released the video within a couple hours of the shooting. Proves it can be done, release video right away when it shows the cop was justified. Makes me wonder about those cases where it takes months to get the video released.

Chauvin is a bad apple. His rot is going to take down a couple more cops who had the misfortune to be assigned with him and who were afraid to do what they should have done.. stopped a murder, because they knew what was expected of a rookie cop, defend the blue line. Wrong, they should have defended the public and the life of George Floyd.

[Sherry8bal]

back to the OP's original posting. Every conviction is appealed. I have no idea what STRONGLY appealed means. Unless there was an error of law by the judge or some sort of demonstrable jury tampering this conviction will stand. That the jury decided so quickly suggests that the prosecution had a very strong case and presented it well.

The jury decides the facts. They heard lots of facts including every negative thing that could be said about Floyd, his past behavior with arrests, his drug use etc. Despite that the jury correctly found that Chauvin killed him. The jury never heard about Chauvin's past history of excess force or the IRS case against him. So he got every benefit of the doubt, as is our system of law. Chauvin going to jail for 12 1/2 will not bring back Floyd and you know he is not going into a general population of prisoners.

Maybe, just maybe, one life will be saved by this conviction now that cops know some juries will hold them responsible.

My feeling is that it will be appealed because there was no way he could get a fair trial by not moving the trial OUT of the city. Can you imagine being on that jury knowing that sooner or later your name is going to be released to the public and that everyone will know where you live. If you would give any kind of a not guilty verdict, you and your home would be burned to the ground and you would feel the wrath of a group of people who expect to continually get their way when one of them gets killed. They don't take into account that the guy was trying to pass a fake $20 bill, that he was drunk and high on drugs and driving, that he was resisting arrest and he had a mile long record of crimes and prison time. Granted that doesn't make Floyd automatically guilty but pas behavior is a sign of future behavior - normally.

If people who have criminal backgrounds would quit resisting the police, we wouldn't be having these problems, regardless of their skin color. Why don't the black people get outraged when they kill their own? More white people are killed by police than black people. That's a fact but where is the outrage?

[allsport]

The judge was out of line and prejudicial.

[allsport]

The percent of blacks abused and killed by police is much higher than the percent of whites. Passing a counterfeit 20 does not deserve guns pulled and an execution. Policing today is equivalent to treating the citizens like enemy combatants instead helping a variety of people with multidimensional problems. You give some cops a gun and they have to show how big they are. I have law enforcement in my family and they are disgusted with the police of today. I cared for the mentally ill and drug abusers for decades and putting them in jail or under a knee until they die is not the way to do it. EVERYONE has a right to question why the cops are arresting them and every black and brown person in this country has a right to fear going anywhere with the police.

[stebooo]

Everything you said is accurate but there's one thing to miss. Not once during this trial as much as I watched it was there a single mention of race involved. As it should be chauvin didn't kill this guy because he was black I was never brought up it was never talked about it was never witnessed. But now that's all it is is this the race war is one it's not this we still have an issue not near to the extent that people say it is but there still is a race issue in this country that needs to be dealt with it's not systemic racist but it's there Sooner or later we have to start dealing with the fact that we're not building tribes here thank you Al sharpton, it's not black against white It should never be that

[Swoop]

No one ever in this history of race relations ever said it's "OK for blacks to kill each other. " Well, I'm wrong. I have heard racists say it is great that they kill each other.

No one has every said that cops should not do their job to protect and serve. The issue is whether the cops do it wrong, and for the wrong reasons. You certainly have never heard of cops planting drugs (https://gothamist.com/news/videos-appear-show-cop-planting-marijuana-during-arrests-staten-island-da-sees-nothing-wrong), or even dropping a gun at a scene (https://abcnews.go.com/US/baltimore-officers-planted-gun-man-deliberately-running-indictment/story?id=61498790) These are both well known techniques. And cops certainly always tell the truth about what happened in their reports and on the stand. Have you heard the term "testilying"

Cameras are now documenting what POC have been saying. Read this story of cops being brutal and lying about it, of course regarding a Black man (https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/police-dash-cam-video-exonerates-nj-man-implicates-cops-article-1.1701763)

Cops are not paragons of virtue, nor is that true of any field. There are great cops, ok cops, and sadly terrible cops, racist cops, abusive cops, power hungry cops, etc. And the good ones certainly outnumber the bad ones.

What happens when a cop complains up the chain (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Serpico) that one of the other cops is a bad cop? Do you honestly believe that making a complaint like that is good for the complaining cop? Does the police union protect bad cops?

If the Black experience in this country is that they are targeted by cops, I believe them. Every study has shown there are more stops of Blacks while driving (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_while_black). Marijuana arrests are overwhelming higher in Black people than white even though whites use at a higher rate than Blacks. Selective policing at its worst. That a Black man stopped by a cop is in fear that he is not going to be treated fairly is based on reality. When reaching for your ID as ordered by the cop gets you killed as the cop says he thought you were reaching for a gun and the cop gets away with it, you might fear for your life in a routine traffic stop for a broken tail light.

The problem with the few bad apples in the barrel is that it spoils the whole barrel.

Are there justified shootings, of course. One in Columbus Ohio yesterday. Amazingly the police released the video within a couple hours of the shooting. Proves it can be done, release video right away when it shows the cop was justified. Makes me wonder about those cases where it takes months to get the video released.

Chauvin is a bad apple. His rot is going to take down a couple more cops who had the misfortune to be assigned with him and who were afraid to do what they should have done.. stopped a murder, because they knew what was expected of a rookie cop, defend the blue line. Wrong, they should have defended the public and the life of George Floyd.
Yep, body cams are good:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/wpde.com/amp/news/local/timmonsville-naacp-president-says-was-racially-profiled-body-cam-video-shows-otherwise

[Chi-Town]

Going back to the chance of an appeal per the thread's origin this is an interesting article.

Few options seen for Chauvin appeal - POLITICO (https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/20/chauvin-appeal-conviction-murder-483921)

[Lulu52]

Don't think every person that police shoot, the family gets 27 million. Is that going to be the *going rate*?

[Stu from NYC]

Don't think every person that police shoot, the family gets 27 million. Is that going to be the *going rate*?

If they shoot someone who is a law abiding citizen apparently your life is worth less.

[jimjamuser]

So do you think the rioters and looters will be upset as they have no good excuse to do the things they like to do?

Missing out on the free stuff.
That IS thinly disguised (conscious or subconscious) animosity toward certain groups. Those that benefitted from US society should show empathy to the less successful.

[stanley]

That IS thinly disguised (conscious or subconscious) animosity toward certain groups. Those that benefitted from US society should show empathy to the less successful.

Animosity towards "rioters and looters"............I think that's perfectly justified.

And what do you mean by "the less successful"........sounds a little prejudicial if you ask me

[jimjamuser]

No! “Those people” took action against their oppressor not their neighbors and local merchants.
Try again.
Just who is the "oppressor" and the "oppressed" today?

[jimjamuser]

If you’ve been watching the news over the last 6-8 years you know that those in power are never convicted 😳
Elliot Spitzer and Bernie Madoff!

[Stu from NYC]

That IS thinly disguised (conscious or subconscious) animosity toward certain groups. Those that benefitted from US society should show empathy to the less successful.

So we should allow the rioters and looters to do as they wish?

[Fairway Cruises]

You mean like those people who were fed up with unfairness, inequality and used it as an excuse, to dump someone else's property into Boston Harbor in 1773?

So are you saying you're prepared for he consequences it leads to? That comparison is entirely different. A bit ridiculous to be fair.
As for the trial we all have a view and whatever that is it should be respected. Biden made comments that guarantee an appeal - were they deliberate for that purpose? I think the cop was over bearing somewhat but not out of control. The victim resisted arrest, he did not die at the scene, he was taken into custody. Cops have to deal with scumbags every day (white and black, just in case you think it's racist) and trained to use force appropriately. The victim was shouting I can't breath, yet he was shouting? He was full of serious drugs, an accident waiting to happen. Who'd want to be a cop today? I'm sorry the scumbag died in custody from his misuse of drugs, I really am but to make this whole thing about race, then to loot, destroy property, to demand defunding the police...is everyone out of their minds? Please do not let American values get detroyed.

[blueash]

Fairway Cruises
I think the cop was over bearing somewhat but not out of control.
The Chief of Police of his own city thought he was guilty of murder. The medical examiner said murder. Chauvin absolutely was totally in control of his actions as he killed George Floyd.

The victim resisted arrest, he did not die at the scene, he was taken into custody.
He stopped resisting very quickly once he was on the ground. The video and the testimony are absolutely clear on that question. I watched the testimony. He was dead for several minutes on the street under Chauvin's knee and body, several minutes and Chauvin never got off. He 100% did die at the scene, not in your alternate universe opinion that he died elsewhere.

Cops have to deal with scumbags every day (white and black, just in case you think it's racist) and trained to use force appropriately.

His own Chief of Police testified that the use of force was not appropriate. The manual and continuing training said that force was not appropriate. You don't change the truth by not believing it, but you are wrong according to the experts from his own department

The victim was shouting I can't breath, yet he was shouting?
Did you listen to the testimony explaining the mechanics of breathing and how speaking is not evidence that the person is not having real and severe compromise of their respiratory system? Or do you ignore evidence if it doesn't fit your narrative?

He was full of serious drugs, an accident waiting to happen. Who'd want to be a cop today? I'm sorry the scumbag died in custody from his misuse of drugs,
Again you make up your own story which is not what the coroner nor the pulmonologists said when they testified. Yes he took drugs. No they did not cause his death. He was killed by the cop. So said both coroners. Did the drugs perhaps play a role in making it easier to kill him, maybe but that is not in evidence. The evidence is a man on drugs was killed by the excessive use of force being place on the street in a prone position with his hands cuffed behind him and a knee pressing on the back of the neck with weight interfering with the ability to inhale and hypopharyngeal collapse.
He did not die of a drug overdose. That was the evidence. The jury heard it. The world heard it. Apparently you were not listening.

I really am but to make this whole thing about race, then to loot, destroy property, to demand defunding the police...is everyone out of their minds? Please do not let American values get detroyed.

I don't understand. If this is not about race why are you mentioning looting and defunding? Those are apparently race linked in your mind. Do you even understand what is meant by defunding? I doubt it. It was a poor word choice for a very good idea (https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixgov/2020/06/19/what-does-defund-the-police-mean-and-does-it-have-merit/).

[jimjamuser]

So we should allow the rioters and looters to do as they wish?
All laws should be enforced equally. The US is the most incarcerated country of the 1st world countries. Stusy other countries judicial system - see what works. Adapt!

[Swoop]

Fairway Cruises
I think the cop was over bearing somewhat but not out of control.
The Chief of Police of his own city thought he was guilty of murder. The medical examiner said murder. Chauvin absolutely was totally in control of his actions as he killed George Floyd.

The victim resisted arrest, he did not die at the scene, he was taken into custody.
He stopped resisting very quickly once he was on the ground. The video and the testimony are absolutely clear on that question. I watched the testimony. He was dead for several minutes on the street under Chauvin's knee and body, several minutes and Chauvin never got off. He 100% did die at the scene, not in your alternate universe opinion that he died elsewhere.

Cops have to deal with scumbags every day (white and black, just in case you think it's racist) and trained to use force appropriately.

His own Chief of Police testified that the use of force was not appropriate. The manual and continuing training said that force was not appropriate. You don't change the truth by not believing it, but you are wrong according to the experts from his own department

The victim was shouting I can't breath, yet he was shouting?
Did you listen to the testimony explaining the mechanics of breathing and how speaking is not evidence that the person is not having real and severe compromise of their respiratory system? Or do you ignore evidence if it doesn't fit your narrative?

He was full of serious drugs, an accident waiting to happen. Who'd want to be a cop today? I'm sorry the scumbag died in custody from his misuse of drugs,
Again you make up your own story which is not what the coroner nor the pulmonologists said when they testified. Yes he took drugs. No they did not cause his death. He was killed by the cop. So said both coroners. Did the drugs perhaps play a role in making it easier to kill him, maybe but that is not in evidence. The evidence is a man on drugs was killed by the excessive use of force being place on the street in a prone position with his hands cuffed behind him and a knee pressing on the back of the neck with weight interfering with the ability to inhale and hypopharyngeal collapse.
He did not die of a drug overdose. That was the evidence. The jury heard it. The world heard it. Apparently you were not listening.

I really am but to make this whole thing about race, then to loot, destroy property, to demand defunding the police...is everyone out of their minds? Please do not let American values get detroyed.

I don't understand. If this is not about race why are you mentioning looting and defunding? Those are apparently race linked in your mind. Do you even understand what is meant by defunding? I doubt it. It was a poor word choice for a very good idea (https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixgov/2020/06/19/what-does-defund-the-police-mean-and-does-it-have-merit/).
And all that made the national news for one reason. Floyd was black and the cop was white. That is what you fail to understand. I brought up the Tony Timpa case to show the media bias. If Floyd was white the national news media would never have even picked up the story. Can’t you see that?!?!?

[CFrance]

And all that made the national news for one reason. Floyd was black and the cop was white. That is what you fail to understand. I brought up the Tony Timpa case to show the media bias. If Floyd was white the national news media would never have even picked up the story. Can’t you see that?!?!?
Does that make the facts not true?

[stanley]

Does that make the facts not true?

Were you on the jury?

[Swoop]

Does that make the facts not true?

The national news media covered the Floyd case 24/7. The outcome of that trial was predetermined by the national news media. Tony Timpa - same circumstances, no national news coverage. Tony was white, the charges were dismissed...
Those are the facts...

[Taltarzac725]

Derek Chauvin Held at Oak Park Heights Prison: What We Know (https://www.insider.com/derek-chauvin-held-at-maximum-security-oak-park-heights-prison-2021-4)

I represented a man in Oak Park Heights or helped with it while a student lawyer with Legal Assistance to Minnesota Prisoners back in Spring of 1989. Most of the people though I had were connected with Minnesota Correctional Facility-Stillwater. In 1989 they were well run prisons with very little in the way of disturbances. Stillwater had a barber shop and probably the oldest prisoner run newspaper in the US if not the world--The Prison Mirror. It was founded by the Younger brothers who had gotten shot up with their other cohorts in the Northfield MN bank robbery. The Prison Mirror | Minnesota Historical Society (https://www.mnhs.org/newspapers/hub/prison-mirror#:~:text=The%20Prison%20Mirror%20was%20co,No rthfield%2C%20Minnesota%2C%20in%201876.&text=The%20Stillwater%20State%20Prison%20was,when% 20Minnesota%20was%20a%20territory).

[tvbound]

There sure seems to be a lot of people who are upset, that a bad white cop (with at least 18 previous complaints and only 1 disciplinary action) didn't get away with murdering an unarmed black person - again. With the sentencing still to come, we'll see if the judge has tipped his hand with his comments about Water's statement - on whether he's one of them.

[tvbound]

Fairway Cruises
I think the cop was over bearing somewhat but not out of control.
The Chief of Police of his own city thought he was guilty of murder. The medical examiner said murder. Chauvin absolutely was totally in control of his actions as he killed George Floyd.

The victim resisted arrest, he did not die at the scene, he was taken into custody.
He stopped resisting very quickly once he was on the ground. The video and the testimony are absolutely clear on that question. I watched the testimony. He was dead for several minutes on the street under Chauvin's knee and body, several minutes and Chauvin never got off. He 100% did die at the scene, not in your alternate universe opinion that he died elsewhere.

Cops have to deal with scumbags every day (white and black, just in case you think it's racist) and trained to use force appropriately.

His own Chief of Police testified that the use of force was not appropriate. The manual and continuing training said that force was not appropriate. You don't change the truth by not believing it, but you are wrong according to the experts from his own department

The victim was shouting I can't breath, yet he was shouting?
Did you listen to the testimony explaining the mechanics of breathing and how speaking is not evidence that the person is not having real and severe compromise of their respiratory system? Or do you ignore evidence if it doesn't fit your narrative?

He was full of serious drugs, an accident waiting to happen. Who'd want to be a cop today? I'm sorry the scumbag died in custody from his misuse of drugs,
Again you make up your own story which is not what the coroner nor the pulmonologists said when they testified. Yes he took drugs. No they did not cause his death. He was killed by the cop. So said both coroners. Did the drugs perhaps play a role in making it easier to kill him, maybe but that is not in evidence. The evidence is a man on drugs was killed by the excessive use of force being place on the street in a prone position with his hands cuffed behind him and a knee pressing on the back of the neck with weight interfering with the ability to inhale and hypopharyngeal collapse.
He did not die of a drug overdose. That was the evidence. The jury heard it. The world heard it. Apparently you were not listening.

I really am but to make this whole thing about race, then to loot, destroy property, to demand defunding the police...is everyone out of their minds? Please do not let American values get detroyed.

I don't understand. If this is not about race why are you mentioning looting and defunding? Those are apparently race linked in your mind. Do you even understand what is meant by defunding? I doubt it. It was a poor word choice for a very good idea (https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixgov/2020/06/19/what-does-defund-the-police-mean-and-does-it-have-merit/).

"He was killed by the cop. So said both coroners."


Excellent post. Trying to say differently and believing those alternative facts, are rife on certain media platforms and from certain demographics.

[Love2Swim]

What really resonated was how many fellow officers testified against him. That tells you something.

[PugMom]

If Floyd was white, he wouldn't have been killed by a white police officer.

i don't know how much of that is true. it could've been anyone of us under that cop's knee, that he felt 'deserved' such extreme treatment. no excuse for what took place

[Fredman]

If Floyd were White he’d still be alive.

Conjecture on your part

[Becca9800]

There sure seems to be a lot of people who are upset, that a bad white cop (with at least 18 previous complaints and only 1 disciplinary action) didn't get away with murdering an unarmed black person - again. With the sentencing still to come, we'll see if the judge has tipped his hand with his comments about Water's statement - on whether he's one of them.

So... where's your outrage with the Administration that allowed such a "bad white cop" to continue serving until the time he murdered an unarmed black person - again? Is there no culpability for "bad white cop's" leader? You know, the one who ultimately threw the "bad white cop" under the bus to save his own slimy self. No ulterior motive there, eh?

Did it occur to you that perhaps the "bad white cop" had only 1 disciplinary action on his record because the other 17 complaints were found unjustifiable/unverifiable? Because no one is ever angry with their arresting officer, or lies when caught in a crime, right? And if that's not the case, then "the bad white cop's" leader is responsible for his own lack of action in removing that "bad white cop" from the street. Right? But we've heard NOT a whisper of the leadership failing its responsibilities.

The media directed this show. They told you what they wanted you to know e.g. 18 prior complaints exist but not the findings of those complaints? They told you his own chief said he was guilty, but never pursued why the chief allowed DC to stay with the PD despite so many complaints. The media made this entire event about white cop v black man. Never once during the trial was race mentioned. So was it really about white v black? Or did the media get a big one over on you?

DC was a sacrificial lamb, found guilty of murder to appease the mob, to keep the cities from burning. And it literally makes me feel sick. I don't believe DC murdered GF, he contributed to the death but he didn't cause it. And it certainly wasn't murder. Saying DC "murdered" is as ludicrous as saying GF committed suicide bc he did not address his health (90% occlusion of a coronary artery is def significant), and pumping lethal doses of fentanyl, coupled w methamphetamines into his body. Tic tic tic it was only a matter of time and he'd have died by his own actions/inactions. That's my humble opinion, and I hold it strongly.

[Swoop]

If Floyd were White he’d still be alive.

If Floyd was white you would never know, because it wouldn’t have made the national news...

[Boffin]

The judge overseeing former Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin's trial in the death of George Floyd said Monday that Rep. Maxine Waters' comments could be grounds for appealing a verdict.

"I'll give you that Congresswoman Waters may have given you something on appeal that may result in this whole trial being overturned," Judge Peter Cahill told defense attorney Eric Nelson on Monday.

“We've got to stay in the street and demand justice," Waters said to reporters.

"We're looking for a guilty verdict and we're looking to see if all of the talk that took place and has been taking place after they saw what happened to George Floyd. If nothing does not happen, then we know that we got to not only stay in the street, but we have got to fight for justice," she added.

[Boffin]

Then and now?

[fpmoravcik]

Maybe the cops should sit in their cars and drink coffee. That way the bad guy won't get hurt. When you need help, call your councilman instead of the police. They can send someone down to talk to the thug who has a gun in your face.

[Bay Kid]

There are some police that may be bad, but it is very sad when the crook/druggie is the hero.

[CFrance]

There are some police that may be bad, but it is very sad when the crook/druggie is the hero.
It's a very difficult job. They need to be paid more and vetted more thoroughly.

[Justus]

If Floyd was white, he wouldn't have been killed by a white police officer.
Tony Timpa, who called police for help, was white. Do you feel the same about him? One of the officers was black, per video.

[Lindsyburnsy]

The jury was sequestered as soon as the Prosecutors/Defense rested their cases. They did not see or hear the politician that the Judge admonished. The Judge overstepped his boundaries when he told the Defense they had a probable case for appeal. Totally inappropriate and uncalled for.

[DeanFL]

The jury was sequestered as soon as the Prosecutors/Defense rested their cases. They did not see or hear the politician that the Judge admonished. The Judge overstepped his boundaries when he told the Defense they had a probable case for appeal. Totally inappropriate and uncalled for.
.
.
wrong.


U.S. Rep. Maxine Waters, D-Calif., showed up at an anti-police brutality protest in Brooklyn Center, Minnesota, on Saturday evening, saying demonstrators needed to "stay on the street," demanding justice until police reform becomes a reality.

"I’m going to fight with all of the people who stand for justice," Waters told reporters shortly before an 11 p.m. curfew. "We’ve got to get justice in this country and we cannot allow these killings to continue."

The jury was home then (not in the courthouse), and the trial ended Monday when they went into deliberation.

The judge DID NOT say "probable", but alluded to the fact that politicians speech should not undermine the judicial system.

Please don't make up your own facts....
.
.

[retiredguy123]

The Chauvin trial was not fair. In a fair trial, all 12 jurors must individually agree to convict. And, they must be able to make that decision without any fear of retribution against them. Can you imagine being the only juror to disagree with the verdict? Would you feel safe?

[rustyp]

The Chauvin trial was not fair. In a fair trial, all 12 jurors must individually agree to convict. And, they must be able to make that decision without any fear of retribution against them. Can you imagine being the only juror to disagree with the verdict? Would you feel safe?

That is interesting food for thought. If the trial is moved out the area in this case out of the Minneapolis Police Jurisdiction it would probably help relieve the jurors fear factor some. But then does this mean "by a jury of your peers" ? I have no idea.

A point of note about hung juries. Having one juror not coming to consensus is not the same as acquittal. It is not over at that point. The option then go as follows:

After a mistrial has been declared due to a hung jury
1. the prosecutor may end up dismissing the charges levied against the defendant.
2. a plea bargain may be reached after a mistrial has been declared.
3. If neither of these things occur, the mistrial will end up leading to the defendant being tried on all of the same charges in another trial to be held at a later date. Double jeopardy does not apply in the event of a mistrial.

[Stu from NYC]

The Chauvin trial was not fair. In a fair trial, all 12 jurors must individually agree to convict. And, they must be able to make that decision without any fear of retribution against them. Can you imagine being the only juror to disagree with the verdict? Would you feel safe?

I have to believe that at least some of the jurors were persuaded to vote guilty out of a sense of fear.

Their names get out and the next thing that happens a mob shows up outside their front door.

Prominent politicians are calling for a guilty vote or taking to the streets before the verdict was even decided.

In what world was this a fair trial?

I believe he deserved a guilty verdict but not like this.

[Becca9800]

You are exactly correct! Which is why this is such an important step toward change, true justice and equality - for everyone. There was NO justice here. I'm left w even more distrust in our criminal justice system. And now, Qualified Immunity is at risk. I wouldn't be a LEO today on a bet. God bless those that are.

[Becca9800]

I believe we know enough by watching members of their organization who were seen crashing through the doors of the Capitol on January 6th. They might not represent the ideals of all Proud Boy factions, but how do you begin to separate the good apples from the bad? Yep. And one bad cop in the mix makes them all bad cops. One bad doc... all are rotten. One bad FedEx driver, and they all suck. One surly server, they're all surly. Jesus, please help us.

[Catalina36]

George Floyds family sued and received 27 Million? I understand the police officer was wrong in how he acted and caused the death of George Floyd but 27 million dollars?????

[Catalina36]

If George Floyd was not trying to pass a $20 counterfeit bill he would be alive today.
If George Floyd respected the Police Officers and was not resisting arrest he would be alive today.
George Floyd was a drug dealer, a drug addict, and served time in prison with a history of violence.
George Floyd is not a Dr. Martin Luther King, but yet the news media is making him seem like he was a good citizen??
George Floyds family sued the City and received 27 million. I don't understand why 27 million??

[retiredguy123]

If George Floyd was not trying to pass a $20 counterfeit bill he would be alive today.
If George Floyd respected the Police Officers and was not resisting arrest he would be alive today.
George Floyd was a drug dealer, a drug addict, and served time in prison with a history of violence.
George Floyd is not a Dr. Martin Luther King, but yet the news media is making him seem like he was a good citizen??
George Floyds family sued the City and received 27 million. I don't understand why 27 million??
It was $27 million because the person or persons who authorized the amount did not need to spend a dime of their own money. Spending other people's money (taxpayers) is very easy to do.