Not-Good USA economic news (no politics please...)

[DeanFL]

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The April jobs report shocks as 266,000 payroll additions badly miss the forecast of 1 million - Unemployment unexpectedly rose to 6.1%

The US labor market's recovery slowed considerably in April as continued reopening butted heads with hiring difficulties. The country's count of nonfarm payrolls grew by 266,000 last month, the Bureau of Labor Statistics announced on Friday. The median estimate from economists surveyed by Bloomberg was for a 1 million-payroll gain. The April jump marks a fourth consecutive month of payroll increases, but the smallest since September.

Businesses across the manufacturing and service sectors reported difficulties in finding workers throughout April. While experts have suggested such shortages are only temporary, the Friday report seems to support such claims.

Also, March's gain was significantly revised downward to 770,000 from 916,000, further eroding the recently bullish outlook toward the labor market's recovery.
April Jobs Report: 266,000 Payrolls Added, Unemployment Rate Rises to 6.1% (https://www.businessinsider.com/april-jobs-report-266000-payrolls-unemployment-rate-labor-market-recovery-2021-5).
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On a POSITIVE NOTE (IMO)>

Florida Gov. DeSantis to unemployed: Start looking for a job
Work search requirement resuming

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. – Floridians receiving unemployment benefits will soon have to provide proof that they’re looking for a job, according to statements made by Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis on Wednesday.

DeSantis lifted the requirement that people receiving benefits look for work early in the pandemic when unemployment was rising and few were hiring. But DeSantis has lifted restrictions on businesses, and the unemployment rate is below the national average.

“Normally when you're getting unemployment, the whole idea is that's temporary, and you need to be looking for work to be able to get off unemployment,” DeSantis said at a news conference. “It was a disaster, so we suspended those job search requirements. I think it's pretty clear now, we have an abundance of job openings.”
He said May will be the last month when the search for work requirement will be in place. “We absolutely can put more people to work. The demand is there. Business what to hire more people, and I think we can go in that direction very soon,” DeSantis said.

Florida Gov. DeSantis to unemployed: Start looking for a job (https://www.clickorlando.com/news/florida/2021/05/05/florida-gov-desantis-to-unemployed-start-looking-for-a-job/).
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[DeanFL]

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Perhaps, just perhaps, the DeSantis action will 'de-incentifiy' people to sit home collecting gvt tax funds - and GET BACK TO WORK.
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[billethkid]

Paying people more to stay home can net only one result.....a shortage of people to do the work.

No special education required to calculate the impact of such programs.

[kkingston57]

Agree there is a problem with un employment compensation, but do feel that there are other issues. Seems like most of the companies that are hiring are the low paying jobs. Over past several years can not tell you how many LARGE gas stations and restaurants have opened or/are being built in this area and other areas of Florida. When restaurants closed in 2020 a lot of their employees went to work in businesses like Amazon at $15 an hour with benefits and more regular business hours and have no incentive to go back to their former job. Changing the unemployment is a good start, but businesses will need to get more creative in hiring and retaining employees.

[billethkid]

The problem is the employees are making more money staying home....they make no bones about it.

We have heard (3rd hand) of some employees asking if they come back could they be paid in cash so they can continue collecting....I believe it!
Granted no doubt in the minority.....but an example of selfish "monsters" we have created with the pay for no work policies.

[Pballer]

Agree there is a problem with un employment compensation, but do feel that there are other issues. Seems like most of the companies that are hiring are the low paying jobs. Over past several years can not tell you how many LARGE gas stations and restaurants have opened or/are being built in this area and other areas of Florida. When restaurants closed in 2020 a lot of their employees went to work in businesses like Amazon at $15 an hour with benefits and more regular business hours and have no incentive to go back to their former job. Changing the unemployment is a good start, but businesses will need to get more creative in hiring and retaining employees.

If you want a low paying job, Florida is your ticket.

[jimjamuser]

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Perhaps, just perhaps, the DeSantis action will 'de-incentifiy' people to sit home collecting gvt tax funds - and GET BACK TO WORK.
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What would "incentivize" people to go back to work is an INCREASE in pay. And an increased Federal minimum wage used by EVERY State.

[jimjamuser]

Agree there is a problem with un employment compensation, but do feel that there are other issues. Seems like most of the companies that are hiring are the low paying jobs. Over past several years can not tell you how many LARGE gas stations and restaurants have opened or/are being built in this area and other areas of Florida. When restaurants closed in 2020 a lot of their employees went to work in businesses like Amazon at $15 an hour with benefits and more regular business hours and have no incentive to go back to their former job. Changing the unemployment is a good start, but businesses will need to get more creative in hiring and retaining employees.
Like paying them better!!!!!!!!!!!

[jimjamuser]

The problem is the employees are making more money staying home....they make no bones about it.

We have heard (3rd hand) of some employees asking if they come back could they be paid in cash so they can continue collecting....I believe it!
Granted no doubt in the minority.....but an example of selfish "monsters" we have created with the pay for no work policies.
White-collar crime has always cost the country more than blue-collar crime. Bernie Madoff is an example - and 20 like him have NOT been caught. The average person MAY know a blue-collar individual that is corrupt. It is ONLY the multi-millionaires that know other multi-millionaires that are corrupt. You don't!

[Swoop]

Why work when you can get paid more to stay home?

[DeanFL]

Everything may be political, however, politics is not everything.
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yep.

Just about ANYTHING re News or Current Events can be made "political" by many folks. Some on ToTV are experts. My Thread here was not to 'point fingers' to any Party etc. Just facts. And hopefully draw out some interesting comments. Simply hopeful that some folks, receiving all these Fed/State $$$$ find it better to actually earn a living out there - especially to our small businesses, restaurants etc. I'm not here to judge, as some are finding more $$$ in NOT working. It's now a balance, and I hope that at some time soon many will find the balance shifts to WORK.
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[bilcon]

Stopped at Bahama Breeze in Gainesville after my granddaughter's graduation. The place had many empty tables, but was told it would be an hour wait. When I spoke to the manager, he said he would get us a table, but it might take an hour to get waited on because he cannot find enough staff to work. Keep giving the money away big gov't.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You know, most hard-working people - in fact every hard-working person I know - without exception, are the exact same people who will contribute to their society on their time off, without pay. They're the ones who run the church charity groups that help feed and clothe the hungry. They're the ones doing the outreach to assist the homeless in getting jobs, homes, medical care. They're the ones who volunteer their time to take a bunch of boy/girl scouts out on trips to acquire their badges/achievement points or whatever they do. They're the ones who buy materials and knit quilts and lap blankets to bring to battered womens' shelters.

None of them have any "incentive" to do these things, other than - it's the right thing to do.

And then we have the people who refuse to help anyone, who in fact will say "I am relying on all you sheeple to vaccinate so I don't have to, and I will have herd immunity so go ahead and risk YOUR life to protect ME."

When they do go out, they won't wear masks, and they won't social distance, because they know everyone ELSE will do it's not THEIR problems.

Basically - most of the people making the loudest noise about people who are staying home because the government is taking care of them, are the same people who refuse to vaccinate because the government is taking care of them.

[Swoop]

You know, most hard-working people - in fact every hard-working person I know - without exception, are the exact same people who will contribute to their society on their time off, without pay. They're the ones who run the church charity groups that help feed and clothe the hungry. They're the ones doing the outreach to assist the homeless in getting jobs, homes, medical care. They're the ones who volunteer their time to take a bunch of boy/girl scouts out on trips to acquire their badges/achievement points or whatever they do. They're the ones who buy materials and knit quilts and lap blankets to bring to battered womens' shelters.

None of them have any "incentive" to do these things, other than - it's the right thing to do.

And then we have the people who refuse to help anyone, who in fact will say "I am relying on all you sheeple to vaccinate so I don't have to, and I will have herd immunity so go ahead and risk YOUR life to protect ME."

When they do go out, they won't wear masks, and they won't social distance, because they know everyone ELSE will do it's not THEIR problems.

Basically - most of the people making the loudest noise about people who are staying home because the government is taking care of them, are the same people who refuse to vaccinate because the government is taking care of them.

Wow! That has to be the most convoluted reasoning I have ever seen in a TOTV post. And that’s saying a lot...

[MDLNB]

Seems to me that right after the "Great Recession" started, a certain gov extended unemployment for a YEAR/YEAR. When you have more incentive to stay home than to go to work, what does one expect? Now they are speaking of a long gov subsidized holiday. And folks wonder why there are no waiters, shelf stockers, etc. And as long as we have FREE give-aways, we will have folks that VOTE for the GIVER.

[Byte1]

What would "incentivize" people to go back to work is an INCREASE in pay. And an increased Federal minimum wage used by EVERY State.

Nope, that would result in inflation. The gov needs to stay out of business, since it fails at every endeavor.

[Aloha1]

White-collar crime has always cost the country more than blue-collar crime. Bernie Madoff is an example - and 20 like him have NOT been caught. The average person MAY know a blue-collar individual that is corrupt. It is ONLY the multi-millionaires that know other multi-millionaires that are corrupt. You don't!

If you are going to post assumptions please back them up with vetted research. Sources please??

[chet2020]

266,000 new jobs is below expectations, but still better than every month in 2019. In addition to the expanded unemployment benefits, we have a lot of kids still not in school full-time. It is cheaper for one parent to stay home versus returning to a $9/hour job that doesn't cover child-care costs. A lot of this will resolve in the fall when unemployment benefits run out and most of the nation's kids, hopefully, return full-time to the classroom.

[GrumpyOldMan]

Why work when you can get paid more to stay home?

Saying something does not make it true.

I was homeless for a while, and on the dole (in 2008). Eventually, I got a job driving a cash register at a convenience store. That cost me MOST of my free money and paid me about $800/mth - and that included a lot of overtime. After 3 years of driving a cash register, I retired at 62 and tripled my salary (Social Security based on a high-paying career as an IT consultant).

I can say from personal experience and from observing others in my situation that only a very few want to be on the dole. Most want better.

Our system sucks, and it does make it hard to pull yourself up when you are down. We should try designing a system that offers a hand-up and not a handout. But...

This past year is not normal. Right now is the time for the government to help as many people and businesses as possible. There is NO easy solution. Both Trump and Biden have provided "hand-outs" to help people feed their children and keep them safe while we try to recover.

[Bucco]

Saying something does not make it true.

I was homeless for a while, and on the dole (in 2008). Eventually, I got a job driving a cash register at a convenience store. That cost me MOST of my free money and paid me about $800/mth - and that included a lot of overtime. After 3 years of driving a cash register, I retired at 62 and tripled my salary (Social Security based on a high-paying career as an IT consultant).

I can say from personal experience and from observing others in my situation that only a very few want to be on the dole. Most want better.

Our system sucks, and it does make it hard to pull yourself up when you are down. We should try designing a system that offers a hand-up and not a handout. But...

This past year is not normal. Right now is the time for the government to help as many people and businesses as possible. There is NO easy solution. Both Trump and Biden have provided "hand-outs" to help people feed their children and keep them safe while we try to recover.

Your post is appreciated.

And you are correct. Those called various names on here (freeloader being the nicest) do not want UE money. Most, not all as usually portrayed on this forum, want to work and support their family. They are not, again as portrayed, trying to live off others.

[GrumpyOldMan]

Wow! That has to be the most convoluted reasoning I have ever seen in a TOTV post. And that’s saying a lot...

I disagree, I do believe there is a lot of truth in that post.

[GrumpyOldMan]

Nope, that would result in inflation. The gov needs to stay out of business since it fails at every endeavor.

Public schools were the best in the world and help make the US the largest strongest economy in the world.

The Post office was the model post office in the world. People came from countries all over the world to see how to do what we did.

The Interstate Highway system was a model for the rest of the world and succeeded in giving our economy and businesses a major lift with faster cheaper product and material transportation.

Our space program put a man on the moon in a decade and the spin-off products reverberated throughout the economy making life easier and better for everyone.

I could go on and on. The Government was not the problem.

Predatory capitalism that purchased our government is the problem. Once people and businesses became so rich they were above the law and could purchase politician's souls, our country began the spiral down.

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Alot of the employment assumptions is that people only go back to their prior job. But good service employees might just have gotten another service job with benefits. Restaurants don't have benefits, and most want medical benefits which is discounted with employment. Restaurant management is notoriously poorly skilled, and service jobs are not a career position, so the workforce is very transient. The pandemic enabled the good employers to turn over their workforce with quality motivated employees, able to get rid of the less productive, without any legal consequences. . . This turnover changed the available employees for the lowest skilled employees . . . . to a lower quality . .

yes, my daughter worked two jobs throughout the pandemic when she could, and quit her restaurant job for a lower paying jobs with benefits. . . so no sympathy for employers who think that their former employees are going to come back just because they should when they run a crappy business with no benefits. . .

the world is a bit more complex than just the simple "they don't want to work due to unemployment." The inability to evict dead beats is more of the reason why people aren't paying rent so they don't need to work, and are putting off the inevitable, living in the moment. . .

economics guy

[stanley]

Predatory capitalism that purchased our government is the problem. Once people and businesses became so rich they were above the law and could purchase politician's souls, our country began the spiral down.

So who is really the problem? The capitalist, or the politicians that are bought by said capitalists?

[Bucco]

So who is really the problem? The capitalist, or the politicians that are bought by said capitalists?

My opinion, a little bit of both.

Mostly, I blame the politicians who spend very little time worrying or being concerned about what is best for the country.

Actually, it appears that "what is best for the country" is far down the list of priorities.

The capitalist role is easy . "On Jan. 21, 2010, the Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that the longstanding prohibition on independent expenditures by corporations violated the First Amendment. With its decision, the court allowed corporations, including nonprofits, and labor unions to spend unlimited sums to support or oppose political candidates. The majority made the case that political spending from independent actors, even from powerful corporations, was not a corrupting influence on those in office."

More money, less transparency: A decade under Citizens United • OpenSecrets (https://www.opensecrets.org/news/reports/a-decade-under-citizens-united)

[stanley]

My opinion, a little bit of both.

Mostly, I blame the politicians who spend very little time worrying or being concerned about what is best for the country.

Actually, it appears that "what is best for the country" is far down the list of priorities.

More money, less transparency: A decade under Citizens United • OpenSecrets (https://www.opensecrets.org/news/reports/a-decade-under-citizens-united)

On this we agree........

[GrumpyOldMan]

So who is really the problem? The capitalist, or the politicians that are bought by said capitalists?

Yes

[GrumpyOldMan]

I would like to suggest, again, that Sortition is the solution. It won't happen, since the politicians would have to vote themselves out of a job... but, I believe it would solve the problem of money in politics.

[Swoop]

Saying something does not make it true.

I was homeless for a while, and on the dole (in 2008). Eventually, I got a job driving a cash register at a convenience store. That cost me MOST of my free money and paid me about $800/mth - and that included a lot of overtime. After 3 years of driving a cash register, I retired at 62 and tripled my salary (Social Security based on a high-paying career as an IT consultant).

I can say from personal experience and from observing others in my situation that only a very few want to be on the dole. Most want better.

Our system sucks, and it does make it hard to pull yourself up when you are down. We should try designing a system that offers a hand-up and not a handout. But...

This past year is not normal. Right now is the time for the government to help as many people and businesses as possible. There is NO easy solution. Both Trump and Biden have provided "hand-outs" to help people feed their children and keep them safe while we try to recover.
Going back to work cost you most of your “free” money? Seriously, free money?!? Someone had to earn that money & have it taken from them in the form of taxes and redistribute it to you. It’s not “free”...

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Going back to work cost you most of your “free” money? Seriously, free money?!? Someone had to earn that money & have it taken from them in the form of taxes and redistribute it to you. It’s not “free”...

If they're going "back" to work, that means they were working prior to all this. And so some of their own taxes paid for this. It wasn't free to them - they paid for it. Now they're getting some of it back.

That's not justifying staying home when you can be productive. It's just explaining that no one is getting unemployment money for "free." That is propaganda. You can't get unemployment money if you haven't worked and contributed to the federal tax base in the first place, for at least 18 months prior to your first claim.

In the state of Florida, the most recent 6 months of that 18 months is thrown aside, and your benefit rate is based on the remaining 12 month period. They look at your total income, and you can receive up to 75% of it OR $275/week, which ever is LESS. Plus $300/week for 26 weeks (currently, that's the PEUC add-on).

So if you were earning $700/week in an actual job, you'll earn more if you continue working. If you were earning $550/week in an actual job, you'll earn more if you continue working, just barely. If you were earning under $450/week in your job, you will definitely get a better unemployment check than paycheck. For 26 weeks. At the end of the 26th week you'll have no income, and no job. But if you continue working, you'll still have a job and income.

[Two Bills]

Going back to work cost you most of your “free” money? Seriously, free money?!? Someone had to earn that money & have it taken from them in the form of taxes and redistribute it to you. It’s not “free”...

If as grumpy says, he was a high earner as an IT Specialist before his job loss, he was supporting other unemployed with his tax contributions whilst in that job.
That is how the system of the richer supporting the poorer is supposed to work.
His only mistake was the word 'free.'
We have the same problem with many calling the UK health system a 'free medical service.'
We pay a lot in tax, and deductions for our 'free' treatment!

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Public schools were the best in the world and help make the US the largest strongest economy in the world.

The Post office was the model post office in the world. People came from countries all over the world to see how to do what we did.

The Interstate Highway system was a model for the rest of the world and succeeded in giving our economy and businesses a major lift with faster cheaper product and material transportation.

Our space program put a man on the moon in a decade and the spin-off products reverberated throughout the economy making life easier and better for everyone.

I could go on and on. The Government was not the problem.

Predatory capitalism that purchased our government is the problem. Once people and businesses became so rich they were above the law and could purchase politician's souls, our country began the spiral down.

Exactly. Capitalism is important for a society such as America. It's a good thing, I'm a Capitalist, I am a consumer, and I'm fine with that.

But when the government creates a program that WORKS - they need to not sell it to the highest corporate bidder. The moment you do that, it stops being about "we the people" and becomes all about "they the stockholders" or "him the CEO."

It is not the corporations that are by the people, for the people, of the people. That's what the government is for. So programs that help us as a nation need to remain government-overseen and government-run.

Private schools? Great. As long as EVERYONE has the opportunity for a QUALITY public school FIRST. Then you can decide to take Junior out of his QUALITY public school and stick him in parochial school, if that's what you prefer for him. Or homeschool him, or unschool him

Private health care? Awesome. But FIRST - provide basic medical care to ALL residents, citizens or not, of the USA. If they're not a citizen, and they have an infectious disease, treat them so they don't give the disease to YOUR family. If they have a broken bone, or were shot, or are having a heart attack, take care of them so they don't become a burden on society and can return to being productive.

You want these immigrants to NOT be a burden? Then make sure they are able to do what is necessary to keep themselves productive. THAT is capitalism. It is not socialism.

[Byte1]

Public schools were the best in the world and help make the US the largest strongest economy in the world.

The Post office was the model post office in the world. People came from countries all over the world to see how to do what we did.

The Interstate Highway system was a model for the rest of the world and succeeded in giving our economy and businesses a major lift with faster cheaper product and material transportation.

Our space program put a man on the moon in a decade and the spin-off products reverberated throughout the economy making life easier and better for everyone.

I could go on and on. The Government was not the problem.

Predatory capitalism that purchased our government is the problem. Once people and businesses became so rich they were above the law and could purchase politician's souls, our country began the spiral down.

Public schools WERE, no longer. The gov got involved. Private is better.
The Post Office WAS, no longer. Private is better
Highways "WAS." Nuff said.
Space Program? Private is better
The Gov involvement only produces slaves of the Gov. I am not saying that we have a bad gov, but I am saying that it is getting worse than it ever was. We are becoming Europe and that is not a good thing. We WERE the model for the rest of the world.

The government is too big. We need the gov to motivate, NOT run the country. Americans are becoming drones, dependent on the government. Until someone can absolutely prove different, I believe in our form of Capitalism and the trickle down effect. Why? Because I have lived overseas and KNOW that our low income folks live as well as middle class anywhere else in the world. I know that the rich produce jobs, not the unmotivated. I know many people that have told me that it was far easier to take unemployment and welfare than to take a temp low paying job. The big LIE that comes from certain factions is that low paying, minimum wage paying jobs cannot support a family. Those jobs were NOT meant to support a family. Anyone expecting to do the minimum to support their family, deserves exactly what they get. If they are not motivated to rise above poverty, then they get exactly what they expect. A hand up? Part-time, low paying jobs are expected to be just that, part-time or temporary. I have worked three jobs at once in order to support my family and I knew that I was not going to make those jobs a career choice. I knew that I would rise above that. I had no intention of DOING the minimum and get paid the minimum. I took those jobs rather than accept food stamps or welfare, knowing that there were plenty of jobs out there waiting for me to apply for them. I find no disgrace or embarrassment in the fact that I cleaned toilets for a while. I went from poverty and high debt to debt free and retirement from a six figure income. I am not special. No one GAVE me anything. I worked for it and I did it without the gov interference.
As for politicians being the problem, I can agree to a certain extent. I know that it is the American voters' fault that we elect those that will DO THE MOST FOR US. We need leaders, not givers. They are giving us someone else's money, not theirs. And we will vote for those that bid the highest. The problem with the gov is us.

[Bay Kid]

Public schools WERE, no longer. The gov got involved. Private is better.
The Post Office WAS, no longer. Private is better
Highways "WAS." Nuff said.
Space Program? Private is better
The Gov involvement only produces slaves of the Gov. I am not saying that we have a bad gov, but I am saying that it is getting worse than it ever was. We are becoming Europe and that is not a good thing. We WERE the model for the rest of the world.

The government is too big. We need the gov to motivate, NOT run the country. Americans are becoming drones, dependent on the government. Until someone can absolutely prove different, I believe in our form of Capitalism and the trickle down effect. Why? Because I have lived overseas and KNOW that our low income folks live as well as middle class anywhere else in the world. I know that the rich produce jobs, not the unmotivated. I know many people that have told me that it was far easier to take unemployment and welfare than to take a temp low paying job. The big LIE that comes from certain factions is that low paying, minimum wage paying jobs cannot support a family. Those jobs were NOT meant to support a family. Anyone expecting to do the minimum to support their family, deserves exactly what they get. If they are not motivated to rise above poverty, then they get exactly what they expect. A hand up? Part-time, low paying jobs are expected to be just that, part-time or temporary. I have worked three jobs at once in order to support my family and I knew that I was not going to make those jobs a career choice. I knew that I would rise above that. I had no intention of DOING the minimum and get paid the minimum. I took those jobs rather than accept food stamps or welfare, knowing that there were plenty of jobs out there waiting for me to apply for them. I find no disgrace or embarrassment in the fact that I cleaned toilets for a while. I went from poverty and high debt to debt free and retirement from a six figure income. I am not special. No one GAVE me anything. I worked for it and I did it without the gov interference.
As for politicians being the problem, I can agree to a certain extent. I know that it is the American voters' fault that we elect those that will DO THE MOST FOR US. We need leaders, not givers. They are giving us someone else's money, not theirs. And we will vote for those that bid the highest. The problem with the gov is us.

Public schools in Virginia have the Governors School for top grade students. They allow 5 students per school. Now the govern wants to dumb that down for equality. The same thing that has happened to public schools over the past 60 years will now happen to the governors school. Plus they removed 11th grade excel math courses, for equality. Sad

[Byte1]

I would like to suggest, again, that Sortition is the solution. It won't happen, since the politicians would have to vote themselves out of a job... but, I believe it would solve the problem of money in politics.

Fancy term for Lottery.
I guess it would make sense to run a country by a form of anarchy. Since everything else has been tried, why not? WE can appoint folks that win the lottery and they can plunder and rule. OR, we can go back to the Constitution and run it according to the Founders' plan. Seemed to work pretty well for some time. How about we ENFORCE our laws instead of modifying existing and producing more redundant laws? Want new laws? How about we start out with term limits? Not going to happen as long as we have law makers that intend to leach from the populace as long as possible. No different than having Supreme Court justices that have a lifetime appointment.

Why not have Congress only meet once every two or there years? They can get into less trouble that way.