Hacienda Hills Country Club

[Polish Golfer]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

[drcar]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

They are a BUSINESS!, They own the land, and they can do want they so chose under certain zoning limits. Past history tells you they know what they are doing.

[tophcfa]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

A couple thoughts, first, don’t call it a country club, it’s a golf course. I have never been to a country club that didn’t have a clubhouse. Secondly, evidence points to the developer distancing themselves from the restaurant business and pools are a significant ongoing expense. Based on that, something resembling what was torn down will not be rebuilt. I think most people in the area would be happy as long as the multi story residential apartment complex idea is taken off the table. What would be really nice would be to add some kind of an open air market and Clubhouse like what is being built at Sawgrass Grove. If that is what the developers consultants are recommending as appropriate for future retires, why not do that at HH so northern residents can enjoy the same type of amenity. And northern residents desperately need a good place to buy fresh fruits and veggies since the farmers market at Spanish Springs is no longer. Wishful thinking I guess.

[drcar]

A couple thoughts, first, don’t call it a country club, it’s a golf course. I have never been to a country club that didn’t have a clubhouse. Secondly, evidence points to the developer distancing themselves from the restaurant business and pools are a significant ongoing expense. Based on that, something resembling what was torn down will not be rebuilt. I think most people in the area would be happy as long as the multi story residential apartment complex idea is taken off the table. What would be really nice would be to add some kind of an open air market and Clubhouse like what is being built at Sawgrass Grove. If that is what the developers consultants are recommending as appropriate for future retires, why not do that at HH so northern residents can enjoy the same type of amenity. And northern residents desperately need a good place to buy fresh fruits and veggies since the farmers market at Spanish Springs is no longer. Wishful thinking I guess.

Excellent points :BigApplause:

[ctmurray]

Most existing residents don't like the idea, but there is demand for apartment living. The Lofts at Brownwood have sold well. The developer wants to convert the second floor of commercial space in Spanish Springs to apartments. I was not here in the glory days of HH restaurant but it was failing at the end. The developer offered the building to the AAC, but after the fiasco of a previous restaurant that had to be torn down and rebuilt as a rec center (name escapes me at the moment), the AAC turned down the offer.

[Mortal1]

People shouldn't accuse someone else of greed unless it's used for evil. You wouldn't be living here now if it weren't for ability to make money. They're just harding working than you are. Doesn't make them greedy just because you might not like what they "MIGHT" be planning on doing. You don't even have proof they're building apptmts.

[dewilson58]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

Good Morning. :icon_wink:

[Topspinmo]

They are a BUSINESS!, They own the land, and they can do want they so chose under certain zoning limits. Past history tells you they know what they are doing.


They own land in already ready built out district. Which wasn’t approved for residential building by the two puppets on district board that signed off on in resident best interest. Ask the puppet’s that signed off on?

[Topspinmo]

Excellent points :BigApplause:

Not really, it not profitable.

[Rwirish]

The Developer always says the listen to residents.

[Annie66]

They are a BUSINESS!, They own the land, and they can do want they so chose under certain zoning limits. Past history tells you they know what they are doing.

Past history also tells us they get what they want in the long run.

[golfing eagles]

People shouldn't accuse someone else of greed unless it's used for evil. You wouldn't be living here now if it weren't for ability to make money. They're just harding working than you are. Doesn't make them greedy just because you might not like what they "MIGHT" be planning on doing. You don't even have proof they're building apptmts.

Actually, the OP did not accuse them of greed. He accused them of "creed", which I guess makes them "creedy". But I agree they may be "harding working" :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[Marathon Man]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

That property sat empty for a long time. Any concerned person could have signed a lease and hired a restaurant operator to re-start a restaurant. But, no one did. No one wanted to risk their own money. Can't blame them. But I can ask why they feel that they can demand that someone else take the risk.

[Phil D]

Lmao funny story??????

[airdale2]

You build it & they will come !

[justjim]

A couple thoughts, first, don’t call it a country club, it’s a golf course. I have never been to a country club that didn’t have a clubhouse. Secondly, evidence points to the developer distancing themselves from the restaurant business and pools are a significant ongoing expense. Based on that, something resembling what was torn down will not be rebuilt. I think most people in the area would be happy as long as the multi story residential apartment complex idea is taken off the table. What would be really nice would be to add some kind of an open air market and Clubhouse like what is being built at Sawgrass Grove. If that is what the developers consultants are recommending as appropriate for future retires, why not do that at HH so northern residents can enjoy the same type of amenity. And northern residents desperately need a good place to buy fresh fruits and veggies since the farmers market at Spanish Springs is no longer. Wishful thinking I guess.

How about Condos instead of apartments? A compromise... You know “things” work better when you are willing to compromise. At least they use to!

[leejan121]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!
I would hope the developer would consider something along the lines of Edna’s on the Green. This would give residents in the northern end of the Villages a great option. Include multiple food trucks. I don’t believe Edna’s is run by TV so lease arrangements would need to be made.

[Jayhawk]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and if you are committed to your position, I bet a strong offer to buy the land and build what YOU see fit would be met with interest and consideration. You could get investors from the many residents who have agreed with your idea.

It's sometimes called putting your money where your mouth is. I recommend it.

Good luck.

[Villages Kahuna]

… I think most people in the area would be happy as long as the multi story residential apartment complex idea is taken off the table…
Not a chance.

The parcel that they cleared for the planned apartments is quite small. The Developer requested amenity approval for 150 apartments. Do the arithmetic — with apartments averaging 800 sq ft, plus hallways, stairwells, elevators, lobby, maintenance and storage, resident and guest parking, landscaping, plus the promised restaurant, walking paths, exercise facilities, etc. — there is no way the project can be any less than 5-6 stories high. That would be unless they used one of the three Hacienda Hills nine hole golf courses to build the apartments and promised amenities and other facilities… and maybe even more apartments!

The Developer is committed to including sources of ongoing and increasing cash flow in their future development plans. Look at the density of the apartments at Brownwood to get an idea of the future apartment plans.

[Joe C.]

The developer is a business, and a business is in the business of making money. They own the land, and want it to generate money, so from their point of view, apartments are the answer. They generate money (profit) as long as they are occupied.
And as much as I don't always agree on what the developer is doing, it is his land, and what he does with his land is his business.

[Bolsadd]

I want a nice adult pool
A dog park that provides shade for the owners
I don’t need a clubhouse or restaurant

[Villages Kahuna]

…as much as I don't always agree on what the developer is doing, it is his land, and what he does with his land is his business.I think you might get a strong difference of opinion from the homeowners who paid a premium to live adjacent to an attractive restaurant, pool, golf practice facilities, etc., who are now threatened with being looked down upon by temporary Villages residents living in rented apartments.

Let me take a wild guess, Joe and Hal with another opinion below… neither of you live anywhere near Hacienda Hills CC or the planned apartments!

[dewilson58]

I think you might get a strong difference of opinion from the homeowners who paid a premium to live adjacent to an attractive restaurant, pool, golf practice facilities, etc., who are now threatened with being looked down upon by temporary Villages residents living in rented apartments.

IF someone paid a premium, they paid for a golf course view.
IF someone paid a premium, the premium value continues to grow in value.
IF someone paid a premium, they have not lost a dime.

[OldManTime]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!

The Developer just might bee waiting for the Lady Lake Commission to approve Apartments, not sure, it could be.

[hal195z]

You did not talk to me. I think the apartments as described with a pool and outdoor recreation options with a clubhouse, restaurant and bar are a great idea.

[Aviator1211]

Step 1: sell people on an area of a certain population density with certain amenities. Sell the fact that the developer lives in the community.

Step 2: after selling all the lots, tear down the amenities cram as many more people into the area as possible and don't worry about the increased traffic and congestion. Move to a private compound.

[Villages Kahuna]

The Developer just might bee waiting for the Lady Lake Commission to approve Apartments, not sure, it could be. The parcel where the apartments have been proposed, in fact the entire country club and golf courses are in Sumter County.

The governmental unit that will consider plans, requests for building permits, etc. is the Sumter County Board of Commissioners, not Lady Lake. You may recall that the former commissioners, controlled by the Developer, approved the additional 150 amenities in a hearing lasting about half an hour. Subsequently, three new commissioners were elected and displaced three that had served for years, consistently approving every proposal made by the Developer.

It was those former commissioners who approved a 25% increase in property taxes on ALL Villages residents to pay for the new roads and infrastructure needed to continue development on the far south end of The Villages.

Three new candidates were elected in the 2020 election after campaigning to rescind that tax increase. All three were elected, displacing the “Developer’s commissioners”, taking control of the five member board, and quickly voted to rescind the tax increase as they had promised.

At this point the source of funding for the construction of roads and infrastructure to support development extending south from current Villages development has not been determined… unless the Developer pays for it, as he has in the past!

[tophcfa]

IF someone paid a premium, they paid for a golf course view.
IF someone paid a premium, the premium value continues to grow in value.
IF someone paid a premium, they have not lost a dime.

I have to respectfully disagree with all three of the above points.

Let’s consider one of the homes on the 9th fairway of the Oaks course.

- Yes, part of the premium paid was for a view of the golf course, but part of the premium was for what is viewed on the other side of the fairway, along with living in a Country Club atmosphere. They used to see tennis courts and a pool which they had easy access to. They also saw a practice facility, and a clubhouse/restaurant. The building they looked at was a couple stories high and did not have the planned multiple story apartment complex with balconies facing their homes. A good portion of the premium they paid for is no longer there, and there is extreme uncertainty as to what will eventually be there. People pay a premium for certainty and discount value for uncertainty.

- In my opinion it is a major stretch to claim the premium value paid for the home is currently increasing given the negative changes that have already taken place, as well as future uncertainty. That is not to say the home price itself has not increased because of both home price appreciation as well as significant increases in the cost of building a new home. But that is entirely separate from the premium they paid for the home. The relevant comparison should be how has their premium increased relative to the premiums paid for similar homes on other Championship courses that have not experienced the same unfortunate turmoil.

- Again, using the proper comparison, how can it be said that if someone paid a premium, they have not lost a dime. Granted, unless one of the homes in question was purchased just before the plans for HH became public, the homes are most likely worth more than their cost basis, so technically they have not lost a dime. But again, the proper comparison would be what would the fair market value of the home be If HH was still the Country Club they bought into versus what it is now and will most likely become. I am generally not a gambler, but I would put a substantial wager on the fact the homes have lost some real value based on the proper relative value comparison.

[Gator_Girl]

I'm glad I'm not alone with my thoughts 😂

[rogerk]

Do you really want the noise and traffic a center like Sawgrass will draw in a residential area. The idea of an an appointment option, like the Lofts, in the SS area makes a lot of sense. It gives current residents a local option to stay close to their friends once they are no longer comfortable taking care of a house.

[nevjudbaker]

Most existing residents don't like the idea, but there is demand for apartment living. The Lofts at Brownwood have sold well. The developer wants to convert the second floor of commercial space in Spanish Springs to apartments. I was not here in the glory days of HH restaurant but it was failing at the end. The developer offered the building to the AAC, but after the fiasco of a previous restaurant that had to be torn down and rebuilt as a rec center (name escapes me at the moment), the AAC turned down the offer.

The Loft’s apartments are rentals for 55+. They are not to be bought like a condo. Many older people want to be within walking distance to the squares, shopping & restaurants without maintenance of a home. The small living area is easy to keep up & by renting one does not have to deal with maintenance. The Loft’s recreation bldg, pool & outside BBQ area is for everyone in the Villages. Many come to use the pool table & etc in the game area of the rec center, cookout & sit under the covered area by the fireplace with their friends. The cooking area needs to be reserved. You would get a pool, rec center & outdoor cooking. I don’t know if the golf course is part of the plans to build an apartment complex or if the golf course would stay. Anyway that is how the Loft Apartments are set up. We do have a small dog park but it is only for residents. Many hated the idea of the Loft’s but now the members of the surrounding areas are enjoying the pool, rec center & cook out area. On the screened in patios many meet their friends to play cards or games. It is a very nice area. Plus they have lowered the rent which was extremely high. Now it is still high end but affordable.

Many have wanted a 55+ apartment compound so this gives you a positive side to think about on the apartment plans. They are for the older people who are not ready for independent living with tiny living areas. 55+ is much different than just apartments. It is quiet with no kids running up & down the halls, Outside area is kept up by the Villages. .

The apartments being built around the Villages are for any age & are not part of the Villages so if you moved there you couldn’t take advantage of the Villages amenities.

Just to give the naysayers something to think about. Come visit the Trillium Rec center & pool to see the advantages that would come in your area if the apartments are set up like The Loft’s.

[rogerk]

They did NOT rescind the property tax increase! The previous BOCC lowered it. The new commissioners voted to INCREASE the impact fees, a tax!

[jellybeanrt]

I agree with you. Greed third family generation.

[Holpat39]

Were you worried about the "greed" when you bought into The Village Lifestyle? Should the developer have stopped building before you moved here? You wouldn't be here if not for the "Greed".

[toeser]

Big apartment buildings are totally inappropriate for that area. That would really be sticking it in the face of people who paid a premium for nearby golf course lots. Plus, Morse Blvd. does not need more density development in the area.

What would be far, far more appropriate would be townhouses similar to those near Glenview or Spanish Springs. The developer could make their bucks and nearby residents would be a lot happier.

[donassaid]

Wrong, wrong, wrong. They can only do what the Supervisors and planning commissioners allow and approve of in that zoning ordinance.

[toeser]

I would hope the developer would consider something along the lines of Edna’s on the Green. This would give residents in the northern end of the Villages a great option. Include multiple food trucks. I don’t believe Edna’s is run by TV so lease arrangements would need to be made.

This nearby resident absolutely does not want commercial development that would add to the traffic in the area, plus, I don't want to be looking at food trucks.

[Papa_lecki]

I agree with you. Greed third family generation.

Or capitalism

[SERENITY52]

I have talked with a lot of residents about apartments being suggested in place of the Hacienda Hills Country Club, restaurant and swimming pool that the developer destroyed. Not one person who I spoke with in the past months wanted apartments! The developer should built back a club house with restaurant and swimming pool. He should forget about building an apartment where Hacienda Hills Country Club was. There are so-many apartments being built around The Villages now, I just can’t understand the logic of building more. Except for creed!
The developers don't give a damn about the residents. Hacienda Hills was wonderful the way it was before it was destroyed.

[Jayhawk]

The developers don't give a damn about the residents. Hacienda Hills was wonderful the way it was before it was destroyed.

Rundown and health violations. Yeah, wonderful.

[JoMar]

Does anyone know what the final plans are? Are you sure no pool, no tennis courts, no restaurant?

[Marathon Man]

I really really really don't understand why people continue to live in a place that they are unhappy with. Why not go find a place where you do not hate the people who built it, that is not growing because no one is moving there, and that never changes (including improvements)?

You know, a place like Spruce Creek. Have you seen it?

[jmcica@aol.com]

I really really really don't understand why people continue to live in a place that they are unhappy with. Why not go find a place where you do not hate the people who built it, that is not growing because no one is moving there, and that never changes (including improvements)?

You know, a place like Spruce Creek. Have you seen it?
Love reading these ������

[milling73]

It is true that many residents are opposed to apartments being built in the location. However it is also true that many are anticipating and hopeful of their arrival. Consider this:
1) whatever is built will be attractive, probably following the same theme of the area.
2) there are many residents in this area who are long-term, alone, or of the age who would greatly appreciate the maintenance free living of an apartment, and yet which also allows independence and continued usage of The Villages amenities.
And
3) the Brownwood apartments are at a cost level that reflects home values of that area. They are also at a price that not all who would like to live in an apartment - can afford.
The Hacienda area, while extremely beautiful with well-maintained homes, is an older section with a lower price point. Also the complex will not have the “walk to stores/restaurants” convenience as Brownwood.

Thus the hope the rent at these apartments will be at more moderate rates and will allow many to continue living here.

[NoMoSno]

I wish there was a way to get cart traffic off the Morse Blvd. roundabout.
It can be a challenge having to dodge entering/exiting cars.
When the apartments are built car and cart traffic will increase at that roundabout.

[Topspinmo]

How about Condos instead of apartments? A compromise... You know “things” work better when you are willing to compromise. At least they use to!

Why compromise when you get you way either right off or eventually.

[Topspinmo]

Rundown and health violations. Yeah, wonderful.

From NOT being keep up and sub par management.

[milling73]

It is true that many residents are opposed to apartments being built in the location. However it is also true that many are anticipating and hopeful of their arrival. Consider this:
1) whatever is built will be attractive, probably following the same theme of the area.
2) there are many residents in this area who are long-term, alone, or of the age who would greatly appreciate the maintenance free living of an apartment, and yet which also allows independence and continued usage of The Villages amenities.
And
3) the Brownwood apartments are at a cost level that reflects home values of that area. They are also at a price that not all who would like to live in an apartment - can afford.
The Hacienda area, while extremely beautiful with well-maintained homes, is an older section with a lower price point. Also the complex will not have the “walk to stores/restaurants” convenience as Brownwood.

Thus the hope the rent at these apartments will be at more moderate rates and will allow many to continue living here.

[Villages Kahuna]

They did NOT rescind the property tax increase! The previous BOCC lowered it. The new commissioners voted to INCREASE the impact fees, a tax! Not only are the impact fees created by the new county board not a tax, they won’t be required to be paid by the Developer.

An executive of the Developer is also an elected state representative, a clear conflict of interest. In anticipation of the impact fees planned by the “new” county board, that Developer executive-state rep proposed a new Florida law severely limiting impact fees passed by local government bodies and payable by real estate companies in Florida. The lobbying efforts of those deep pocket developer-beneficiaries of the proposed bill went into action and the bill quickly passed both the Florida House and Senate.

So the large real estate tax increase passed by the “Developer’s county board” has been rescinded, as promised by the newly-elected county commissioners. And the impact fees passed to replace tax revenues and provide funding for new roads and infrastructure has been gutted by the statewide legislation proposed by our Developer’s executive-state rep and passed by the Florida legislature.

So the effect of the self-cancelling measures is that there is no funding in place for the construction of new roads and facilities desired by the Developer to support further development on the south end of The Villages. Sumter County homeowners won’t suffer a big real estate tax increase. And the Developer has figured out how to avoid paying impact fees to pay for the roads.

There are other options that can be used to pay for the new roads, but discussing them here would take too long. What’s important is that the new roads won’t be paid for by all the home owners of Sumter County in the form of big real estate tax increases!

[Joanh@wny.twcbc.com]

i love this idea of an open air farmers market- we "northerners" should have the same availability as Sawgrass to fresh food! and can we rethink apartments? !! this is a really pretty, and quiet area- apartments will be an "intrusion" in addition to a traffic nightmare!
DEVELOPERS: can you reconsider? i understand the concept of "you own it and can do whatever with it" and i understand "business decision" but truly, aren't there enough living units in and around the villages?

[cegallup]

I want a nice adult pool
A dog park that provides shade for the owners
I don’t need a clubhouse or restaurantIt IS the prerogative of the OWNER of commercial Real Estate to put it to its most profitable use. Yes, there are limits and ordinances - but the opinion of residents of The Villages should be just that, OPINIONS. Just put yourself in the position of the OWNER - then calculate your options.

[JoMar]

Not only are the impact fees created by the new county board not a tax, they won’t be required to be paid by the Developer.

An executive of the Developer is also an elected state representative, a clear conflict of interest. In anticipation of the impact fees planned by the “new” county board, that Developer executive-state rep proposed a new Florida law severely limiting impact fees passed by local government bodies and payable by real estate companies in Florida. The lobbying efforts of those deep pocket developer-beneficiaries of the proposed bill went into action and the bill quickly passed both the Florida House and Senate.

So the large real estate tax increase passed by the “Developer’s county board” has been rescinded, as promised by the newly-elected county commissioners. And the impact fees passed to replace tax revenues and provide funding for new roads and infrastructure has been gutted by the statewide legislation proposed by our Developer’s executive-state rep and passed by the Florida legislature.

So the effect of the self-cancelling measures is that there is no funding in place for the construction of new roads and facilities desired by the Developer to support further development on the south end of The Villages. Sumter County homeowners won’t suffer a big real estate tax increase. And the Developer has figured out how to avoid paying impact fees to pay for the roads.

There are other options that can be used to pay for the new roads, but discussing them here would take too long. What’s important is that the new roads won’t be paid for by all the home owners of Sumter County in the form of big real estate tax increases!

Impact fees are a tax...anytime we pay the cost that goes to the government it's a tax. And that never gets rolled back. Package it any way you want to, apply it to whomever you wish to, but residents, either all or a portion, will pay for it and the government will receive it and that makes it a tax.

[stebooo]

Are u new here? There been talking about apts for 2 years if not longer

[Villages Kahuna]

…Morse Blvd. does not need more density development in the area….
The traffic circle at the north end of Morse, providing access to Spanish Springs town square, the traffic light at 441/27, and access to The Villages Regional Hospital, is already the busiest traffic circle in The Villages, and has the most accidents… by far.

Proposing an additional 150 apartments only a half mile from that circle is irresponsible and dangerous. The only way those apartments should be granted a building department is if a major traffic study is performed and the necessary re-routing and reconstruction of the roads in that area. The cost of the study and the necessary changes should be borne by the Developer, NOT the residents of Sumter County!

If you question what I’ve said here, try going thru that circle/intersection anytime near rush hour. Better yet, try taking your golf cart thru the Morse-Paige Place traffic circle to go to the hospital or the many doctor’s offices in the area. After you’ve gone thru that circle, requiring going thru two intersections with moving traffic that you can only see by craning your neck and looking over your left shoulder. Do that and report back whether you think the traffic from 150 apartments is a good idea.

[Topspinmo]

I really really really don't understand why people continue to live in a place that they are unhappy with. Why not go find a place where you do not hate the people who built it, that is not growing because no one is moving there, and that never changes (including improvements)?

You know, a place like Spruce Creek. Have you seen it?


Sorry to disagree, but apartments in already built out area sold to district long ago is not an improvement, it over crowding and already over crowded area that was built out 20 plus years ago. Plus couple puppets signed off on it in the best interest of the residents in area which I’ve sure the took poll and one immediately retired form board. IMO The district should of brought it like the other three run down clubs they pawned off district. Tore down the club house if it was as bad and left the rest amenities there.

[Two Bills]

""Que sera, sera
Whatever will be, will be
The future's not ours to see
Que sera, sera
What will be, will be"":icon_wink: