Golf cart speed

[elevatorman]

:police:I heard a rumor from 2 different sources that police were ticketing golf carts exceeding 20 mph. A court appearance is required and then there is a $850.00 fine. Has anyone been stopped?

[Becky]

Last week they were pulling them over in Belvedere and ticketing them. I was in my car! :laugh:

Becky

[elevatorman]

Belvedere is one of the spots I was told about. The tickets are for driving an unregistered motor vehicle. Florida Statute 320.01.

[ajbrown]

Would be interesting to get some facts about what gets you pulled over. I think this is a good thing for safety. At $800+ it should be quite a deterrent.

On the other hand, I would hope it is not a major crime to be at 20.8 MPH just because my Club Car DS caught a gust of wind.....

Back to the other hand, I would also like them to hand out tickets for carts that can only go 13 MPH :duck:

[Rag Bagger]

I hope these RUMORS are true. I am tired of some of the high speed carts driving recklessly. Some times they are swerving nearly out of control.

BUT does anyone have some real facts on this RUMOR?

[SALYBOW]

Maybe that last golf cart wreck prompted this clampdown.

"Back to the other hand, I would also like them to hand out tickets for carts that can only go 13 MPH" I wonder if there is a lower limit at which they can ticket you. If not, "merrily ? we creep along. :ohdear:

[spk7951]

One of our neighbors got stopped and was given a $135 ticket for doing 27mph near Cane Garden last week. She does plan on fighting the ticket and has had a speedometer installed and her electric cart tested for its speed. Top speed is 22.5 mph, so it should be interesting when she goes to court later this month.

[Chopper]

They were checking cart speeds as they passed the St. Charles pool yesterday. I didn't see the police officers, but some of our neighbors did see them. They weren't sitting in a car. Instead, they were hiding behind some of the landscaping.

One neighbor was told that if you purchased the cart new, you should have received a certificate that contained the maximum speed for your specific cart. I never received anything like that when I bought my new cart from the Villages Golf Cars store. Is there really such a certificate?

[graciegirl]

..

[jebartle]

You are a hoot!:clap2::clap2::clap2:

[Halle]

One of our neighbors got stopped and was given a $135 ticket for doing 27mph near Cane Garden last week. She does plan on fighting the ticket and has had a speedometer installed and her electric cart tested for its speed. Top speed is 22.5 mph, so it should be interesting when she goes to court later this month.

It will be interesting to see what her defense is, considering the Florida Law reference what is classified as a Golf Cart.

320.01 Definitions, general.--As used in the Florida Statutes, except as otherwise provided, the term:

(42) "Low-speed vehicle" means any four-wheeled electric vehicle whose top speed is greater than 20 miles per hour but not greater than 25 miles per hour, including neighborhood electric vehicles. Low-speed vehicles must comply with the safety standards in 49 C.F.R. s. 571.500 and s. 316.2122.

If your Golf Cart is capable of going more than 20 miles per hour it is no longer classified as Golf Cart but a LSV and is required to be registered and insured as stated in the Florida Statues.

[BlueHeronFan]

I had the radar gun on my cart as I came around a corner a few weeks ago. Also, I noticed in the paper an article about the new police golf cart that was just acquired.

I too believe all the accidents we have been reading about recently is part of the new crackdown. Watch for driving under the influence to be part of this too.

[K9-Lovers]

..

Huh? C'mon Gracie, we all want to know what you said that was so :p funny, and now you removed it! :cryin2:

[zcaveman]

Back to the other hand, I would also like them to hand out tickets for carts that can only go 13 MPH :duck:

Some of these carts that only go 13 mph are rentals from the golf courses. As you pass them you will see the number on the side and no rain apparatus.

For some reason, some new carts do not have a lot of speed. A friend bought the cheapest cart he could and it only goes about 14 mph. I think it is the controller they put in it.

But I do agree they are a PITA at 13 mph.

As for those going over 20 MPH, give them the tickets!!!

[spk7951]

It will be interesting to see what her defense is, considering the Florida Law reference what is classified as a Golf Cart.

320.01 Definitions, general.--As used in the Florida Statutes, except as otherwise provided, the term:

(42) "Low-speed vehicle" means any four-wheeled electric vehicle whose top speed is greater than 20 miles per hour but not greater than 25 miles per hour, including neighborhood electric vehicles. Low-speed vehicles must comply with the safety standards in 49 C.F.R. s. 571.500 and s. 316.2122.

If your Golf Cart is capable of going more than 20 miles per hour it is no longer classified as Golf Cart but a LSV and is required to be registered and insured as stated in the Florida Statues.


I am not a lawyer but I could see two things that I would find interesting, in this case, to see what the judge would say.
1. Yes the law says 20 and this cart can do 22.5 but the ticket says 27, which to me is an error.
2. The officer drove up behind her on a motorcycle and used his speedometer to guage her speed. No radar was used.

Not sure how much weight either of those has but I still think they could be interesting arguments.

[otherbruddaDarrell]

Police use a certified speedometer with a +or- of 1mph given.
A vehicle that is properly pace clocked with a certified speedomter is every bit as accurate as radar.
Radar is most accurate while running "stationary" or MV (moving vehicle) radar as they are approaching you.
Go fast.............get a ticket:BigApplause:

[paulandjean]

Police have to much time on their hands in the Villages.

[Bogie Shooter]

Police have to much time on their hands in the Villages.

What does this mean??

[mrdills]

Anyone that wants to go over 19.8 MPH should get a ticket, even going down the hills.

[golfnut]

If we go back to the original post here, I think "rumor" is the operative word. I too would like to know what comment GG edited, come on Gracie, oh persnickety pundit or whatever your title is.....gn

[Taj44]

A friend of one of my friends got a ticket for going 31 mph in a 25 mph zone - $130 fine.

[golf2140]

If we go back to the original post here, I think "rumor" is the operative word. I too would like to know what comment GG edited, come on Gracie, oh persnickety pundit or whatever your title is.....gn

There's an article in todays edition of Village Voice concerning this issue. " Law Enforcement responds to your requests and have been cracking down on moving violations) They mention rolling stop sigh and speeding. (page 4) :crap2:

[Ohiogirl]

What is the Village Voice and can it be accessed online (for those of us who are not in TV at the moment)?

[downeaster]

:police:I heard a rumor from 2 different sources that police were ticketing golf carts exceeding 20 mph. A court appearance is required and then there is a $850.00 fine. Has anyone been stopped?

There are a number of factors contributing to the cost of being ticketed for travelling 25 MPH in a golf cart.

Any golf cart capable of exceeding 20 MPH is no longer a golf cart. A ticket is issued based on it being unlicensed vehicle. Add to that it is not properly equipped. Plus it is improperly insured. To top it all off, it must be reconfigure so it will not be capable of exceeding 20 MPH.

Oh yes, let's not forget the cost of souping it up in the first place.

I would like to know the actual cost. If I did I would be tempted to place a sign on the back of my cart stating "PASSING ME COULD COST YOU $X,XXX.00". On second thought I wouldn't do that. It might anger some one who "carries" and I might get shot.

[Halle]

There are a number of factors contributing to the cost of being ticketed for travelling 25 MPH in a golf cart.

Any golf cart capable of exceeding 20 MPH is no longer a golf cart. A ticket is issued based on it being unlicensed vehicle. Add to that it is not properly equipped. Plus it is improperly insured. To top it all off, it must be reconfigure so it will not be capable of exceeding 20 MPH.

Oh yes, let's not forget the cost of souping it up in the first place.

I would like to know the actual cost. If I did I would be tempted to place a sign on the back of my cart stating "PASSING ME COULD COST YOU $X,XXX.00". On second thought I wouldn't do that. It might anger some one who "carries" and I might get shot.

:BigApplause:

I agree,and the woman who was given the ticket for speeding and is going to contest it may end up paying much more if her Golf Cart is not properly licensed,registered and insured.

[Talk Host]

If I'm not mistaken, when a violator contests a traffic ticket in court, and is subsequently found guilty, the judge has the prerogative to impose an even higher than normal fine. For example a $175 speeding ticket could turn into a $500 fine.

[BogeyBoy]

If I'm not mistaken, when a violator contests a traffic ticket in court, and is subsequently found guilty, the judge has the prerogative to impose an even higher than normal fine. For example a $175 speeding ticket could turn into a $500 fine.

??? So you're entitled to your day in court but it will cost you extra?

[nitehawk]

There are a number of factors contributing to the cost of being ticketed for travelling 25 MPH in a golf cart.

Any golf cart capable of exceeding 20 MPH is no longer a golf cart. A ticket is issued based on it being unlicensed vehicle. Add to that it is not properly equipped. Plus it is improperly insured. To top it all off, it must be reconfigure so it will not be capable of exceeding 20 MPH.

Oh yes, let's not forget the cost of souping it up in the first place.

I would like to know the actual cost. If I did I would be tempted to place a sign on the back of my cart stating "PASSING ME COULD COST YOU $X,XXX.00". On second thought I wouldn't do that. It might anger some one who "carries" and I might get shot.

i too would be afraid of being shot - yes they were out on Belvedere today by the bonnybrook rec center. one of the offers had a motorcycle and a radar gun - i think they were giving warnings not tickets as i pulled into the mailboxes i saw three people get pulled over they gave each a piece of paper and did not ask for id so i am assuming it was a notice of the law. i hope it puts a stop to the fast carts - it seems there are more and more fast carts maybe its the baby boomers feel the need to go fast??? all you fast cart owners beware of the gendarme.

[Funfan]

I think it was bound to happen. And with the villages growing, I think the chance of an accident will go higher with more and more golf cars on the roads and the increase in the speed of a golf car does not help. Lets look at this as a good thing being proactive rather than reactive. Is 20mph in a golf car really that bad? and whats the rush?

[Tom Hannon]

FunFan is right... What's the rush?"

It's not like we have to go to work tomorrow morning.

[RichieLion]

I think it's interesting the slant of the large majority of these posts in consideration of my observation that almost every cart I've been on the paths and roads with go faster than legally proscribed. It's no so common to see a truly legal cart in the true definition. All you have to do is see the many carts with 10" wheels, and they now go faster, for one example.

[Tom Hannon]

20 MPH is fine..as long as everyone does the same speed. What bites is the rentals that go 13-14 mph. I had one of those and it was frustrating. If I went any slower-I'd be going in reverse.

[golf2140]

What is the Village Voice and can it be accessed online (for those of us who are not in TV at the moment)?

You cannot access it on line. It's a publication of TV Homeowners Association. It was inserted into todays paper. (I don't think they have on line access)

[Halle]

I think it's interesting the slant of the large majority of these posts in consideration of my observation that almost every cart I've been on the paths and roads with go faster than legally proscribed. It's no so common to see a truly legal cart in the true definition. All you have to do is see the many carts with 10" wheels, and they now go faster, for one example.

I have a legal cart, no oversized tires and it cannot exceed 19.9mph and yes the speed has been checked. It is a golf cart orginally designed to go 14mph, I'm happy that we are allowed to go 19.9mph.

If I really wanted to go faster I would buy an LSV and register and insure it as required by Florida law.

[RichieLion]

I have a legal cart, no oversized tires and it cannot exceed 19.9mph and yes the speed has been checked. It is a golf cart orginally designed to go 14mph, I'm happy that we are allowed to go 19.9mph.

If I really wanted to go faster I would buy an LSV and register and insure it as required by Florida law.

That's very laudable of you, but I'm merely making an observation, not an accusation. I still believe you're in the minority.

[chacam]

The Villages Voice is on line. thevha.net


You cannot access it on line. It's a publication of TV Homeowners Association. It was inserted into todays paper. (I don't think they have on line access)

[tkret]

:police:I heard a rumor from 2 different sources that police were ticketing golf carts exceeding 20 mph. A court appearance is required and then there is a $850.00 fine. Has anyone been stopped?
Before work began on the golf path along El Camino, I went by a motorcycle officer who was checking with a detector, not the cars, but the golf cars along the path.

[JimJoe]

This thread is kind of nuts. Are you serious there are uniformed police officers spending their time with radar guns checking for golf carts that go over 20 mph? How fast can a non licensed one realistically go? 25 or 30?
Are speeding carts on golf paths really that big of problem. I have been all over TV on 6 visits and never saw one.
I think a few paths should be widened for safety on northside, and they are working on that now.. but seriously... Uniformed officers after golf carts going 5mph over their max speed?
Do they also patrol in TV or just come in once in awhile to write tickets?

[Bryan]

I have to disagree with JimJoe - it is a good use of the officers (actually deputies) time. As noted in The Village Voice yesterday, many TV residents have been clamoring for increased golf cart traffic enforcement. Our local law enforcement is simply responding to the desires of the public they serve. I think their efforts should be applauded. More than golf carts use our "internodal recreational trails" - walkers, joggers, bicycles, etc. Speeding golf carts make it unsafe for them. I, for one, am very happy to see the laws being enforced on our golf cart trails and I hope it keeps up.:BigApplause:

[elevatorman]

Some of the posts bring on another question. Do the police have any jurisdiction on the trails? After all they are private property. I think the tickets have been issued only where carts are driven on roads with seperate lanes for cart use.

[Taj44]

This thread is kind of nuts. Are you serious there are uniformed police officers spending their time with radar guns checking for golf carts that go over 20 mph? How fast can a non licensed one realistically go? 25 or 30?
Are speeding carts on golf paths really that big of problem. I have been all over TV on 6 visits and never saw one.
I think a few paths should be widened for safety on northside, and they are working on that now.. but seriously... Uniformed officers after golf carts going 5mph over their max speed?
Do they also patrol in TV or just come in once in awhile to write tickets?

Sorry JimJoe, I have to disagree with you on this one. I live here full time, and we see a lot of it. I ride my bicycle on the rec trails, and I find the speeding carts to be a safety hazard. They whiz by me on some of the narrower portions, so close, I have almost been forced off the trail. They go around curves so fast, that often times pedestrians that are also using hte trail have to quickly jump aside to avoid being hit. The Morse Blvd. bridge has a 10 mph speed limit that is completely disregarded. I was passed by someone the other day had to be going 30 mph on the rec trail. We have to share the trails with carts, cyclists, and walkers, and the speeding carts are a menace IMHO.

[Talk Host]

The "private property" question is a really good one. While I agree for the need for enforcement, how can the deputies do it on "private property." Are the multiuse trails "private?" There has got to be some loop hole they are using.

If I'm not mistaken, the newspaper once quoted law enforcement as saying that souped up carts would be charged with "tampering with or changing mandatory factory safety equipment."

I would love to hear from an expert on this matter.

JIMJOE..............where are you?

JLK

[zcaveman]

The "private property" question is a really good one. While I agree for the need for enforcement, how can the deputies do it on "private property." Are the multiuse trails "private?" There has got to be some loop hole they are using.

If I'm not mistaken, the newspaper once quoted law enforcement as saying that souped up carts would be charged with "tampering with or changing mandatory factory safety equipment."

I would love to hear from an expert on this matter.

JIMJOE..............where are you?

JLK

I think that once you get off of the multinodal paths and are on one of the main roads (Belle Meade Circle, Morris, Madiera, Enrico, etc,) they are allowed to issue tickets for not obeying the traffic laws. They sit in Azteca loop on the side roads and on Legacy Lane and give tickets for running the stop signs.

Although a few years ago, I did see a cop on a cycle chase a cart down the multinodal path. Maybe the cart committed an infraction on Southern Trace and did not stop for the cop so he pursued.

[BlueHeronFan]

Uh Oh

TOTV Advertiser.

http://www.digitaloverdrivesystems.com/

[Talk Host]

Uh Oh

TOTV Advertiser.

http://www.digitaloverdrivesystems.com/

We were concerned about this too. I talked with the owner of the company and he said this product is for those 13 mph carts that want to go 19.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

I looked at the demo video on the web site. Looks like there'd be nothing to worry about - speed got up to just short of 19 mph.

Bill

[chacam]

I think that once you get off of the multinodal paths and are on one of the main roads (Belle Meade Circle, Morris, Madiera, Enrico, etc,) they are allowed to issue tickets for not obeying the traffic laws. They sit in Azteca loop on the side roads and on Legacy Lane and give tickets for running the stop signs.

Although a few years ago, I did see a cop on a cycle chase a cart down the multinodal path. Maybe the cart committed an infraction on Southern Trace and did not stop for the cop so he pursued.

With regards to Azteca Loop. I questioned this with the CCD and here's their reply from Eva Rey. I assume the other districts have similar agreements.

And, according to Lt Wolfe, the multi-modal paths are district property and SCSO has no jurisdiction with regard to cart speed.

Response from Eva Rey:

Thank you for your e-mail. Villa roads are the property of the District they are in, which in this case would be District #2. However, these villa roads are also public roads, which grant the Sheriff’s Office the authority under Florida Statutes to patrol/write citations. In addition, F.S. 316.006 grants municipalities the authority to enter into agreements with special districts, such as District #2, to provide these services. District #2 and the Sumter County Sheriff’s Office entered into such an agreement in 2002.

In summary, the Sheriff is granted the authority to patrol villa roads by Florida Statutes and by written agreement with the District. I hope this answers your question. Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.

[skip0358]

There's a related post to this one under " How much protection do we need". I brought up the fact of be careful what you ask for. We really don't want a heavy police watch for a lot of reasons. I got hammered by several people who said all the rules should be inforced. Speed, driving under the influance etc. I guess it all depends on what rules are important to each individual. I agree the faster carts are a problem as are the slow carts. I do have a question though. Someone buys a street legal that goes 25mph+, pays for ins., registration, gets the tax cradit. Why does that person ride on the path, in the golf cart lane, use multi mogul paths and pass the slower moving carts instead of using the road which is supposedly what they paid extra for?

[escapequeen]

I'd like to know when they are going to start enforcing the speed limits for passenger cars and trucks in Silver Lake and surrounding villages.

[red tail]

There's a related post to this one under " How much protection do we need". I brought up the fact of be careful what you ask for. We really don't want a heavy police watch for a lot of reasons. I got hammered by several people who said all the rules should be inforced. Speed, driving under the influance etc. I guess it all depends on what rules are important to each individual. I agree the faster carts are a problem as are the slow carts. I do have a question though. Someone buys a street legal that goes 25mph+, pays for ins., registration, gets the tax cradit. Why does that person ride on the path, in the golf cart lane, use multi mogul paths and pass the slower moving carts instead of using the road which is supposedly what they paid extra for?

simple answer....because the vehicle traffic runs you off the road. i drive a lsv and the cars come right up my you know what until i pull over into the cart lane! then they pass doing much more than the speed limit.

[skip0358]

Now I know. I guess much like on the paths when a faster vehicle comes on my you know what in my slower vehicle.

[Vinny]

Last week they were pulling them over in Belvedere and ticketing them.

Good. I am tired of the illegal fast carts riding my rear and then zooming past me in their impatience. Fast carts do not make up for any shortcomings in other areas. :smiley:

[memason]

I guess I'm wondering if all the folks expressing dissatisfaction about fast golf carts also obey the posted speed limits in their cars?

You ONLY drive the posted speed limit on the tollways too ???

Just saying .... :shrug:

[BogeyBoy]

I guess I'm wondering if all the folks expressing dissatisfaction about fast golf carts also obey the posted speed limits in their cars?

You ONLY drive the posted speed limit on the tollways too ???

Just saying .... :shrug:

This is a good point. I believe a lot of the concerns are in regard to safe use of the golf carts and if they are really able to be operated safely at speeds over 20 mph. I think the answer is in the details of the law. Florida law states:

320.01 Definitions, general.--As used in the Florida Statutes, except as otherwise provided, the term:
(22) "Golf cart" means a motor vehicle that is designed and manufactured for operation on a golf course for sporting or recreational purposes and that is not capable of exceeding speeds of 20 miles per hour.

So when you are going over 20 mph in a golf cart you are not just speeding, you are driving a vehicle that is in violation of Florida law.

Automobiles are obviously manufactured to exceed speed limits because they travel on roadways with many different speed limits. If the law stated that an automobile was a vehicle that is not capable of exceeding 70 miles per hour you could still speed with it all day long on city streets.

Another point - the speed limit in front of my villa is 10 mph. I doubt that many cars, golf carts, delivery vehicles, maintenance vehicles, etc. obey that speed limit.

So - when is it legal for the average citizen to exceed the speed limit? But when does that same average citizen accept speeding as okay? I would say that most of us accept 5 mph over the limit on Interstate 75 as okay. We accept it, it happens all the time. But from these threads it is obvious that not many of us accept 5 mph over the limit in a golf cart as okay. (BTW, if you are doing 75 in a 70 zone you are about 7% over the limit, if you are doing 25 in a 20 zone you are 25% over the limit.)

[RichieLion]

I guess I'm wondering if all the folks expressing dissatisfaction about fast golf carts also obey the posted speed limits in their cars?

You ONLY drive the posted speed limit on the tollways too ???

Just saying .... :shrug:

They're likely the people that do the speed limit in the passing lane and self-righteously refuse to move over because they figure they're moving "fast enough". I'm just saying .......:icon_wink:

[JimJoe]

The "private property" question is a really good one. While I agree for the need for enforcement, how can the deputies do it on "private property." Are the multiuse trails "private?" There has got to be some loop hole they are using.

If I'm not mistaken, the newspaper once quoted law enforcement as saying that souped up carts would be charged with "tampering with or changing mandatory factory safety equipment."

I would love to hear from an expert on this matter.

JIMJOE..............where are you?

JLK

I did not practice in Florida so I will talk about my experience in Iowa.
Most traffic laws do not apply on private property in Iowa but a few do such as Operating While Intoxicated.
I am not sure if the cart paths are actually on private property. They could be on the right away which is public property, much like the parking that you are required to mow and maintain but do not own.
My guess is they are ticketing speeders who are in the cart lane on a public roadway.

[JimJoe]

Sorry JimJoe, I have to disagree with you on this one. I live here full time, and we see a lot of it. I ride my bicycle on the rec trails, and I find the speeding carts to be a safety hazard. They whiz by me on some of the narrower portions, so close, I have almost been forced off the trail. They go around curves so fast, that often times pedestrians that are also using hte trail have to quickly jump aside to avoid being hit. The Morse Blvd. bridge has a 10 mph speed limit that is completely disregarded. I was passed by someone the other day had to be going 30 mph on the rec trail. We have to share the trails with carts, cyclists, and walkers, and the speeding carts are a menace IMHO.

Thanks for the info.. I never noticed any speeding or bad driving while I have been in TV. Maybe it is because I was too busy speeding myself!! (NOPE).
I definitely did notice the narrow paths north of 466, and getting under 466 going north down BV.. if you dont get off soon enough.. oh boy.. you are at the intersection with no where to go. I take the fifth on what I did next.
JJ

[memason]

They're likely the people that do the speed limit in the passing lane and self-righteously refuse to move over because they figure they're moving "fast enough". I'm just saying .......:icon_wink:

That's exactly the fact... Where I'm living now, it's illegal to pass on the right and the fine for doing so is very hefty...no speed limits, but there are still some rules.

[laryb]

I agree that speeding in carts is dangerous, not just for passengers of the cart, but for the poor souls in the other carts they blow by. Here in Mass., all vehicles must go under mandatory safety inspection yearly, and it's my understanding that Florida doesn't do this. I find it really ironic that the State of Florida lets cars on the road that emit pollutants, have bald tires, bad suspensions, defective lights, bad brakes, etc., but will give someone a ticket for going a couple of mph over 19 mph because it is considered modifying the vehicle so it is no longer a cart.

[Shimpy]

Since I don't need a drivers license to operate my cart I sometimes don't carry any ID with me if I'm just going to pick up my mail. How does a police officer issue a ticket? Does he take my word as to what my name is? How about my address? I can tell him anything. My cart of course doesn't have a license plate so how does he know who I am? Just wondering.

[Tom Hannon]

I guess you go directly to jail, you do not pass go nor do you collect $200.

[BBQMan]

Several posters have expressed concern about the possibility of getting a ticket for going one or two mph over the posted speed. This should not happen. FL law requires giving warning tickets for speed less than 5mph over the limit except in school zones.

http://www.mit.edu/~jfc/laws.html

One person asked why people with LSV's (and I am one of them) do not drive on the road as they are allowed to do. I do not drive my LSV on the on El Camino Real and Buena Vista because I feel by doing so I expose others as well as myself to needless and inconsiderate risk. For this same reason I do not drive 45mph on the Interstate although it is perfectly legal. I know others may not agree, but believe that legal justification should never replace common sense and courtesy.

[Taj44]

Thanks for the info.. I never noticed any speeding or bad driving while I have been in TV. Maybe it is because I was too busy speeding myself!! (NOPE).
I definitely did notice the narrow paths north of 466, and getting under 466 going north down BV.. if you dont get off soon enough.. oh boy.. you are at the intersection with no where to go. I take the fifth on what I did next.
JJ

Funny! :smiley:

[RichieLion]

Several posters have expressed concern about the possibility of getting a ticket for going one or two mph over the posted speed. This should not happen. FL law requires giving warning tickets for speed less than 5mph over the limit except in school zones.

http://www.mit.edu/~jfc/laws.html

One person asked why people with LSV's (and I am one of them) do not drive on the road as they are allowed to do. I do not drive my LSV on the on El Camino Real and Buena Vista because I feel by doing so I expose others as well as myself to needless and inconsiderate risk. For this same reason I do not drive 45mph on the Interstate although it is perfectly legal. I know others may not agree, but believe that legal justification should never replace common sense and courtesy.

Wow!!, "common sense and courtesy". What a radical idea. You think people should use their heads in situations where the letter of the law may not be the prudent thing to do even if you are, in effect, in the legal right of things?
hmmmmmmm............:icon_wink:

[NJblue]

I guess I'm wondering if all the folks expressing dissatisfaction about fast golf carts also obey the posted speed limits in their cars?

You ONLY drive the posted speed limit on the tollways too ???

Just saying .... :shrug:

Good point. It's not just speed either. There is at least one person on this thread who is all for ticketing a golf cart going a few MPH faster than him, but who has declared that he will continue to violate the traffic circle laws because his way is "more intuitive" to him. I'd say that traffic circle violations lead to many more accidents than a cart going a few MPH faster than yours can go.

[rn_4tots]

I have heard from several sources that the police are using radar guns while sitting in rec and pool parking lots and motorcycle cops are "hiding" in the bushes and ticketing golf carts. I don't know at what speed they are stopping people, but it is all over the area.

[Tom Hannon]

It's not fair if the cops are nailing carts going downhill @ 21 MPH. I have no problem with them ticketing the hotshots who have upgraded their carts and try to run the law abiding citizen off the road. The last thing Village people want to to drive in fear each time they go for a what is supposed to be a pleasurable ride. I wish one of the police in the area would clearify this issue.

[elevatorman]

Several posters have expressed concern about the possibility of getting a ticket for going one or two mph over the posted speed. This should not happen. FL law requires giving warning tickets for speed less than 5mph over the limit except in school zones.

http://www.mit.edu/~jfc/laws.html

One person asked why people with LSV's (and I am one of them) do not drive on the road as they are allowed to do. I do not drive my LSV on the on El Camino Real and Buena Vista because I feel by doing so I expose others as well as myself to needless and inconsiderate risk. For this same reason I do not drive 45mph on the Interstate although it is perfectly legal. I know others may not agree, but believe that legal justification should never replace common sense and courtesy.

What I was told is they are not giving speeding tickets. They are giving tickets for driving an unregistered motor vehicle. The police were at the Sable Chase Pool at about 2 this afternoon.

[Indydealmaker]

This community is largely populated by those of an age who do not have the reflexes and peripheral vision of only a few years ago. It is time to discard the "macho" nascar facade and realize our limitations. If it takes enforcement of laws and regulations already on the books, then so be it. What is the hurry? Slow down and take advantage of the scenery. We are lucky to be alive and where we are.

[Mikeod]

What I was told is they are not giving speeding tickets. They are giving tickets for driving an unregistered motor vehicle. The police were at the Sable Chase Pool at about 2 this afternoon.
They were at Caroline mail station about the same time today as well. They appear to be emphasizing those roads where carts share the roadway with autos, rather than the multi-modal paths.

[redwitch]

Okay, I have a cart that will easily exceed the speed limit -- I didn't ask for it to be fast, it came that way. My speed is usually between 19 and 21, occasionally a little faster, rarely any slower. I'm passed as if I'm stopped and this is on Morse where the carts are going out into traffic and sometimes cutting off a car. As Homer would say, "DOH!!" If I do get pulled over for speeding when going 21, I'll suck it up, just like I would in a car -- I may not have been going over the speed limit by a lot, but I was speeding. And, yes, I know the ticket is technically for operating an unregistered vehicle since it is being driven over the authorized limit for a cart.

I don't think the police can ticket on non-street multi-modal paths -- they're considered private property. Personally, I wish they could. Some people really do drive on these paths way too fast.

I doubt if they'll get those going 20 or 21, but anything faster is really insane (unless street legal) and they deserve the ticket. If my understanding of the law is correct, street legal vehicles, including golf carts and scooters must keep their speed to under 21 mph when using the multi-modal paths. (Please note that's "IF.")

[chacam]

If my understanding of the law is correct, street legal vehicles, including golf carts and scooters must keep their speed to under 21 mph when using the multi-modal paths. (Please note that's "IF.")



What law would that be ?

[Halle]

Does anyone know where I can find out what type of vehicles are authorized to operate on the Multi-modal paths?

[pooh]

After reading so many posts on this subject, for the life of me, I can't understand why some feel they aren't subject to Florida laws concerning golf CART speeds. If you have to go no faster than 19.9mph, what's the problem. Most golf carts aren't equipped with seat belts, and passengers can easily be ejected from a cart. It's happened around here and if I recall correctly, someone was seriously injured or died as a result. Correct me if I'm mistaken.

In Florida, a golf cart may be operated only upon a county road that has been designated by a county, or a municipal street that has been designated by a municipality, for use by golf carts. Prior to making such a designation, the responsible local governmental entity must first determine that golf carts may safely travel on or cross the public road or street, considering factors including the speed, volume, and character of motor vehicle traffic using the road or street. Upon a determination that golf carts may be safely operated on a designated road or street, the responsible governmental entity shall post appropriate signs to indicate that such operation is allowed.

Multimodal paths most likely don't fall under this rule, but again, it's not just carts on these paths....there are bikers, walkers, and even some in motorized chairs. What's the big rush? Why do you have to drive faster than the law states? What are the golf cart rules in the state you left?

[pooh]

What law would that be ?

For driving on Florida roads:

Florida law 320.01 ......320.01 Definitions, general.--As used in the Florida Statutes, except as otherwise provided, the term:

(22) "Golf cart" means a motor vehicle that is designed and manufactured for operation on a golf course for sporting or recreational purposes and that is not capable of exceeding speeds of 20 miles per hour.

If golf carts can't be driven at speeds faster than 20 on the roads, the same most likely applies to the paths since that is the state definition of a golf cart. If not, driving faster than 20 on paths is reckless and could endanger many, including the driver of said cart.

[chacam]

Well now, she didn't say roads, she said multi modal paths ! ! ! Again, what law ? ?

[pooh]

Well now, she didn't say roads, she said multi modal paths ! ! ! Again, what law ? ?

I realize she didn't say roads and I stated that the law is for carts on Florida roads....but if you look at the definition of what a golf cart is here.......

Is there a specific law for the paths? Haven't found one yet, but did find a report about the number of accidents north of 466 involving carts. Have to look specifically at where the accidents happened. The report stated a three year period, 2006 to 2009.

Honestly, if someone is driving their cart at 25 mph on the cart path and cause an injury to me or any of those riding in my cart because of their speed, I'd take legal action against them. If they have this need for speed, get a street legal cart and drive it on the roads. Personally, it's not something I'd want to do....cars are much heavier than any street legal cart.

If I can't find a specific law regarding the speed on the multimodal paths, then there should be something specific about it since those paths are used by many, including walkers and joggers.

Back to searching.

[redwitch]

Chacam, my reference to multi-modal paths was not in regard to the private ones, but the ones that adjoin streets such as those north of 466 on Morse. Sorry that became such an issue to you.

[redwitch]

As to why people in retirement communities speed, whether in car, cart or whatever -- there could be several reasons. A storm is coming and you're racing to get home to not get caught in the lightning, especially in a cart. You're late for an appointment, a game, whatever. A friend or relative needs you NOW. Illness. You have an inherent lead foot.

[pooh]

As to why people in retirement communities speed, whether in car, cart or whatever -- there could be several reasons. A storm is coming and you're racing to get home to not get caught in the lightning, especially in a cart. You're late for an appointment, a game, whatever. A friend or relative needs you NOW. Illness. You have an inherent lead foot.

I understand that, but when I've seen speeders, it's been people with golf clubs on their carts, talking and laughing. They don't appear to be rushing for any other reason than driving fast. I could be wrong, but my gut feeling is, I'm not. That doesn't make me right, gut feelings are less than proof.... ;)

Honestly, I'm always giving drivers the benefit of the doubt when I see cars driving faster than they should, and I don't know why I feel differently about carts.

Maybe I'm more upset about people driving recklessly....and to me, driving at speed on the multimodal paths is reckless.

[Halle]

I realize she didn't say roads and I stated that the law is for carts on Florida roads....but if you look at the definition of what a golf cart is here.......

Is there a specific law for the paths? Haven't found one yet, but did find a report about the number of accidents north of 466 involving carts. Have to look specifically at where the accidents happened. The report stated a three year period, 2006 to 2009.

Honestly, if someone is driving their cart at 25 mph on the cart path and cause an injury to me or any of those riding in my cart because of their speed, I'd take legal action against them. If they have this need for speed, get a street legal cart and drive it on the roads. Personally, it's not something I'd want to do....cars are much heavier than any street legal cart.

If I can't find a specific law regarding the speed on the multimodal paths, then there should be something specific about it since those paths are used by many, including walkers and joggers.

Back to searching.


I'm searching too and I agree with you that there should be a posted speed limit on the multi-modal trails, there is one on the bridge on Morse but I have not found any other posted speed limits. I know most if not all of the neighborhoods south of 466 have a posted speed limit of 15mph.

I have read several post where it is recommended to use common sense, my common sense is I don't believe it is safe to drive a vehicle designed to go 14mph per hour 25mph. It is obvious from the number of post that condone exceeding the speed that defines a golf cart as a golf cart that my common sense and theirs are very different.

I feel fortunate that Florida Law allows us to drive 19.8 in our golf carts and don't want to lose that privilege.

[pooh]

I'm searching too and I agree with you that there should be a posted speed limit on the multi-modal trails, there is one on the bridge on Morse but I have not found any other posted speed limits. I know most if not all of the neighborhoods south of 466 have a posted speed limit of 15mph.

I have read several post where it is recommened to use common sense, my common sense is I don't believe it is safe to drive a vehicle designed to go 14mph per hour 25mph. It is obvious from the number of post that condone exceeding the speed that defines a golf cart as a golf cart that my common sense and theirs are very different.

I feel fortunate that Florida Law allows us to drive 19.8 in our golf carts and don't want to lose that privilege.

It is a privilege, Halle, and it can be revoked by the county for their roads. We'd be seriously limited in our travels if we were unable to drive on roads with cart lanes here in TV. Would it happen? Probably not, TV provides too much $$ to county coffers. Legally it could happen, though.

[red tail]

the speed limit on rio grande is 25mph...the next time you pass a golf cart on that road look down at your speedometer and see how fast you are going!!!!!

[pooh]

the speed limit on rio grande is 25mph...the next time you pass a golf cart on that road look down at your speedometer and see how fast you are going!!!!!

I remember our first visit to TV in 2005. We were driving on a major road north of 466 (can't remember which) and there was a golf cart on one of the cart paths. We were driving at 25mph (we checked) and that cart just moved right by us. It was going faster than 25 that particular time.

With all the talk about golf cart speeds, you're right, we do need to remember there are speed limits for autos around here, too.

[jebartle]

I'm not sure as a street legal owner you can rationalize the added insurance, tagging etc.charge for 5 mph extra but in some areas of the Villages where cart paths narrow (Morse Blvd. bridge), I feel safer on the street, go figure!!! Was surprised that some Villagers are upset when street leglsl use cart path, thought I was being courteous to cars that might want to go the 35 mph speed.....Besides, lets face it, there are a LOT of carts out there that are not tagged street legal that exceed 25 mph,

[pooh]

I'm not sure as a street legal owner you can rationalize the added insurance, tagging etc.charge for 5 mph extra but in some areas of the Villages where cart paths narrow (Morse Blvd. bridge), I feel safer on the street, go figure!!! Was surprised that some Villagers are upset when street leglsl use cart path, thought I was being courteous to cars that might want to go the 35 mph speed.....Besides, lets face it, there are a LOT of carts out there that are not tagged street legal that exceed 25 mph,

I'll admit to being scared when I have to drive over the bridge on Morse. It's narrow and too many people don't obey the posted speed limit there. When there is no golf cart traffic coming towards me, I ride in the middle. When I see another cart, it's over to my lane and an additional decrease in speed. Honestly, I'd feel safer in the traffic there, too.

Actually, one thing I think might could play some part in the need to drive faster....so many have arrived here from areas where driving to and from work was horrific. Some arrive having left traffic from large cities and aggressive driving is more the norm than not. When arriving here, old habits die hard. It takes a while to adjust to driving a bit slower. We left the CA freeway system....a nightmare to say the least. Others could have left the Chicago highway system....that is beyond comprehension and don't even talk about New York, Washington DC, etc. Life in, and the surroundings in TV, beautiful. It's nice to just take a bit of time to enjoy them.

Question.....when you do take the multimodal paths, do you watch your speed? I don't have any problem with street legals on the paths, I just hope they keep the speed down because of walkers, joggers, cyclists, etc.

You're right, there are MANY carts that exceed the golf cart definition speed limit. They're not driving them in the traffic lanes, maybe they think that allows them the right to drive faster than the state allows since they're in the cart lane and not in the flow of vehicles.

[jebartle]

I'll admit to being scared when I have to drive over the bridge on Morse. It's narrow and too many people don't obey the posted speed limit there. When there is no golf cart traffic coming towards me, I ride in the middle. When I see another cart, it's over to my lane and an additional decrease in speed. Honestly, I'd feel safer in the traffic there, too.

Actually, one thing I think might could play some part in the need to drive faster....so many have arrived here from areas where driving to and from work was horrific. Some arrive having left traffic from large cities and aggressive driving is more the norm than not. When arriving here, old habits die hard. It takes a while to adjust to driving a bit slower. We left the CA freeway system....a nightmare to say the least. Others could have left the Chicago highway system....that is beyond comprehension and don't even talk about New York, Washington DC, etc. Life in, and the surroundings in TV, beautiful. It's nice to just take a bit of time to enjoy them.

Question.....when you do take the multimodal paths, do you watch your speed? I don't have any problem with street legals on the paths, I just hope they keep the speed down because of walkers, joggers, cyclists, etc.

You're right, there are MANY carts that exceed the golf cart definition speed limit. They're not driving them in the traffic lanes, maybe they think that allows them the right to drive faster than the state allows since they're in the cart lane and not in the flow of vehicles.


I try to behave myself when in the golf cart path, BUT if I come across a 13 mph cart, I've GOT to pass it, sorry!...Some one suggested a minimum speed limit, is there one for golf carts? Like earlier posted, carts are being ticketed for excess speed, this works for awhile...

[pooh]

I try to behave myself when in the golf cart path, BUT if I come across a 13 mph cart, I've GOT to pass it, sorry!...Some one suggested a minimum speed limit, is there one for golf carts? Like earlier posted, carts are being ticketed for excess speed, this works for awhile...
Saw nothing about minimum speed for carts, and I agree with you about passing a cart going extremely slowly. The rental carts from Villages Golf Cars are really, really slow. Not sure why. Maybe they're slow so you can better see what you'll get if you live here.... ;)

[Shimpy]

FunFan is right... What's the rush?"

It's not like we have to go to work tomorrow morning.

Maybe somebody is rushing to the nearest bathroom??? Maybe they need medical attention and don't have a cell phone??? Just because we're retired doesn't mean there's never a reason to be in a rush.

[BBQMan]

Any discussion of minimum and maximum speeds on multimodal paths ignores the fact that these are multimodal. The paths are used by walkers, runners, cyclists, rollerbladers, motorized chairs, segways, golf carts, LSVs, motor scooters and a few more categories I'm sure I have forgotten. Identical minimum and maximum speeds could not apply to all methods of transportation.

LSVs, built from the ground up for 25mph speeds can safely be driven at that speed. Segways max speed is 12mph. Bicycles and motor scooters can exceed 30mph. I suggest what I see done every day - people using their own common sense on how fast or slow they go. Putting in more rules and having more people to enforce them is just going to result in more people being aggravated - getting more aggravation in my life was not my reason for moving to The Villages.

[Indy-Guy]

I have read all 90 posts before mine and I have come to this conclusion.

If you are pulled over by the police in your golf cart simply tell them that you post on Talk of The Villages and you won't get a ticket since in the privious 90 posts 5,337 views not one person has stated that they have received a ticket. They all know of someone, saw someone or heard of someone. The story of the amount or type of ticket is also much varried. I would like to hear from someone who has received a ticket I just hope it won't be me.

I also notice that Lady Lake police are putting empty police cars at busy intersections. Perhaps the Sumter County Sherrif has put mannequins by a motorcycle and mannequins next to a golf cart and it looks like they are writting tickets.

As Talk of The Villages posters we must be exempt!

[logdog]

I also notice that Lady Lake police are putting empty police cars at busy intersections. Perhaps the Sumter County Sherrif has put mannequins by a motorcycle and mannequins next to a golf cart and it looks like they are writting tickets.

As Talk of The Villages posters we must be exempt!

Okay... you got me. I confess... I was the Sumter County mannequin standing next to the golf cart that wasn't giving out tickets to speeders. You guys are just too sharp for me. Therefore, TOTV posters are hereby exempt. Just mention my name.

[spk7951]

If you are pulled over by the police in your golf cart simply tell them that you post on Talk of The Villages and you won't get a ticket since in the privious 90 posts 5,337 views not one person has stated that they have received a ticket. They all know of someone, saw someone or heard of someone. The story of the amount or type of ticket is also much varried. I would like to hear from someone who has received a ticket I just hope it won't be me.

I also notice that Lady Lake police are putting empty police cars at busy intersections. Perhaps the Sumter County Sherrif has put mannequins by a motorcycle and mannequins next to a golf cart and it looks like they are writting tickets.


Really not sure how to interpret this, but I will have to tell my neighbor about this so maybe she now does not have to pay that ticket she showed me last week or perhaps can forget about going to court this week to try to contest it. Seemed very real to me when I saw it.

Did notice today that Sumter County Sheriff has put up one of those signs that tell you how fast you are going on Barnsdale Run in Hadley. Rather strange location to choose unless there is more to this than I know.

[tkret]

Okay... you got me. I confess... I was the Sumter County mannequin standing next to the golf cart that wasn't giving out tickets to speeders. You guys are just too sharp for me. Therefore, TOTV posters are hereby exempt. Just mention my name.

FANTASTIC, logdog. Now I REALLY DO appreciate your "icon".:clap2::1rotfl:

[Rag Bagger]

20 mph cart gets passed by a 30 mph cart equals. 50% faster.

70 mph car gets passed by a 105 mph car equals the same 50% faster.

Get the picture?


That's stupid to be going that much faster than the normal traffic. Why? because the speeding cart will come up on the slower cart faster than normal and potentially slam into the slower cart or sideswipe the slower cart. And for what? to get to the golf course three minutes quicker. Please people use some reasonable sense about cart speeds.

[cartwheel]

Okay... you got me. I confess... I was the Sumter County mannequin standing next to the golf cart that wasn't giving out tickets to speeders. You guys are just too sharp for me. Therefore, TOTV posters are hereby exempt. Just mention my name.

Those were real police officers I saw today on Davenport Drive in Summerhill. They were hiding behind a big oak tree and aiming their radar gun at golf carts.

[laryb]

Personally, I think common sense goes both ways. Going to fast is dangerous, but going too slow can cause accidents too. People forget things, get tied up or for some reason can't leave earlier. When they come up on someone driving really slow while their driving at a reasonable speed, it's kind of hard to not want to pass. I think we all have to use a little common sense and courtesy, the slow driver and the lead footed one like me. Not there full time yet, but we love getting around on a cart, and having police hiding in the weeds, behind trees and signs takes some of the fun out of it for me. Makes me a little paranoid :police:

[hunt9791]

My friend received a ticket in his gas cart for going 25 [not street legal]. Went to court with a letter from his cart store saying the cart was de-tuned down to 20MPH. Had the ticket suspended, court costs were $250 bucks. Spoke to the Sumter county Sheriff [Bennett] today and he said they ticket for anyone 25MPH and over non street legal. The judge decides the fine....it varies. The sheriff still cannot ticket you on the cart path for speeding when it is on CDD private property. That would be off the main road.

[ajbrown]

My friend received a ticket in his gas cart for going 25 [not street legal]. Went to court with a letter from his cart store saying the cart was de-tuned down to 20MPH. Had the ticket suspended, court costs were $250 bucks. Spoke to the Sumter county Sheriff [Bennett] today and he said they ticket for anyone 25MPH and over non street legal. The judge decides the fine....it varies. The sheriff still cannot ticket you on the cart path for speeding when it is on CDD private property. That would be off the main road.

I did a test the other day with my 2000 Par Car cart after reading all of this as I was curious. My cart goes 27MPH down the hills of Odell by Mallory. That is with my foot OFF the "go" pedal, just coasting. All you series cart owners watch out for them hills. I wonder how coasting is interpretted by the law, If I showed him the cart going up that hill he would probably rip up the ticket :)

[dlswriter]

You got that right. Wait till the gate laws go into effect. The people may think it will not effect them but if they ride a golf cart, motorcycle, or bicycle. So not only are they going to get you for speeding but going around the gates will get you a big TICKET.

[zcaveman]

I did a test the other day with my 2000 Par Car cart after reading all of this as I was curious. My cart goes 27MPH down the hills of Odell by Mallory. That is with my foot OFF the "go" pedal, just coasting. All you series cart owners watch out for them hills. I wonder how coasting is interpretted by the law, If I showed him the cart going up that hill he would probably rip up the ticket :)

I ride with some people whose carts go faster downhill than on level ground or uphills.

Both of my carts (2003 Club Car and 2008 EZGO) have an "electronic governer" on them that slows me down to 19 MPH going downhill. When I asked the Club car mechanic if he could get rid of that governer when the cart gets out of warranty, he said no. This makes it easier for me to not get a ticket.

[eyegirl]

I was told that if your cart is street legal, you can drive on the ROAD faster than 20 mph and be okay...is this true? (my cart goes 33 mph)

[gary42651]

With all the talk about patrols giving golf carts speeding tickets, just once I would rather see a patrol car ride past my house, I have been in the villages for over 2 years and have never seen a patrol car on my street. I feel its more important than spending the time giving someone a ticket for doing 25mph.

[iandwk]

To me, the main point is that if you have a modified cart you are not covered by insurance. You may think you are since you paid the premium, but you pay for golf cart insurance. If it is modified, it's no longer a golf cart under Florida law and your insurer will not pay the claims. This is not something I have imagined. It came directly from an Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified. If it has, they stop their investigation right there and will not pay anything. The speed the cart was going when the accident occurred is irrelevant. The modification nullifies the policy even though the cart may only have been traveling 10mph. End of story. If you are involved in an accident and it is determined to be your fault, it will come out of your pocket. If there are injuries, it can cost you dearly. Your retirement could even be in jeopardy due to medical expenses for the injured party, not to mention the lawsuit that is bound to follow.

I was seriously thinking about modifying my cart before I went to this seminar. Once I got this information, I decided to stay legal. I enjoy my retirement too much to risk losing it so I can drive a golf cart 25mph.

[ajdeck]

Sounds to me that people just won't be happy with their cart speed until they push so far that this 'PREVILIGE' is taken away from The Villages.

Then quess what they will complain about - "we can't use our golf carts anymore".

Retire, slow down and enjoy the last few years we have.

[Talk Host]

To me, the main point is that if you have a modified cart you are not covered by insurance. You may think you are since you paid the premium, but you pay for golf cart insurance. If it is modified, it's no longer a golf cart under Florida law and your insurer will not pay the claims. This is not something I have imagined. It came directly from an Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified. If it has, they stop their investigation right there and will not pay anything. The speed the cart was going when the accident occurred is irrelevant. The modification nullifies the policy even though the cart may only have been traveling 10mph. End of story. If you are involved in an accident and it is determined to be your fault, it will come out of your pocket. If there are injuries, it can cost you dearly. Your retirement could even be in jeopardy due to medical expenses for the injured party, not to mention the lawsuit that is bound to follow.




I think this is the single most important post in this 104 post thread.

[JenAjd]

To me, the main point is that if you have a modified cart you are not covered by insurance. You may think you are since you paid the premium, but you pay for golf cart insurance. If it is modified, it's no longer a golf cart under Florida law and your insurer will not pay the claims. This is not something I have imagined. It came directly from an Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified. If it has, they stop their investigation right there and will not pay anything. The speed the cart was going when the accident occurred is irrelevant. The modification nullifies the policy even though the cart may only have been traveling 10mph. End of story. If you are involved in an accident and it is determined to be your fault, it will come out of your pocket. If there are injuries, it can cost you dearly. Your retirement could even be in jeopardy due to medical expenses for the injured party, not to mention the lawsuit that is bound to follow.

I was seriously thinking about modifying my cart before I went to this seminar. Once I got this information, I decided to stay legal. I enjoy my retirement too much to risk losing it so I can drive a golf cart 25mph.

This explains it pretty clearly for me...don't know what the "kick" is about modifying a cart anyway. It truly makes me nervous to see the "road-ready" carts out amongst traffic. NOT a safe prospect in my view. PLUS if you want "fast"...drive your car!!!

[mrdills]

Have you ever tried to stop a regular golf car going 20MPH...............

[red tail]

Have you ever tried to stop a regular golf car going 20MPH...............

i agree with mr dills.......if you want to go fast get a lsv......they are safe and the purchase price is comparable to a golf cart. insurance is more but the added safety is worth it!

[Barefoot]

It came directly from an Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified. If it has, they stop their investigation right there and will not pay anything. The modification nullifies the policy even though the cart may only have been traveling 10mph. End of story.

I hope that this important piece of information is read and understood by all golf cart drivers.

Modifying your golf cart could cost you your happy retirement.

[downeaster]

To me, the main point is that if you have a modified cart you are not covered by insurance. You may think you are since you paid the premium, but you pay for golf cart insurance. If it is modified, it's no longer a golf cart under Florida law and your insurer will not pay the claims. This is not something I have imagined. It came directly from an Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified. If it has, they stop their investigation right there and will not pay anything. The speed the cart was going when the accident occurred is irrelevant. The modification nullifies the policy even though the cart may only have been traveling 10mph. End of story. If you are involved in an accident and it is determined to be your fault, it will come out of your pocket. If there are injuries, it can cost you dearly. Your retirement could even be in jeopardy due to medical expenses for the injured party, not to mention the lawsuit that is bound to follow.

I was seriously thinking about modifying my cart before I went to this seminar. Once I got this information, I decided to stay legal. I enjoy my retirement too much to risk losing it so I can drive a golf cart 25mph.

These points have been made before and can't be repeated too often. Any one who reads iandwk's message and does not heed it is taking a great risk. It would be like buying a new car and not insuring it. The loss could be catastrophic.

I want to emphasis one of iandwks comments. "Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified.". An insurance adjusters job is to make sure the company does not pay any claims that they do not have to.

[Indydealmaker]

I was told that if your cart is street legal, you can drive on the ROAD faster than 20 mph and be okay...is this true? (my cart goes 33 mph)

eyegirl, a legal street vehicle is not supposed to exceed 25 mph.

[memason]

"Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified.". .

While this seems an intuitive statement and I have no doubt an agent stated this, I'm not sure it would be legal for them to refuse coverage, based upon a speed modification. If it isn't written in the policy, it would be hard to enforce. This would be the same as you changing the type of tire on your car and then your agent telling you the tires were not as safe as the original equipment; therefore, no coverage....or more specifically, you modify your cars performance in one way or another and then your insurance is voided.

Just my thinking and that's why there are exclusions on your policy...

[Talk Host]

While this seems an intuitive statement and I have no doubt an agent stated this, I'm not sure it would be legal for them to refuse coverage, based upon a speed modification. If it isn't written in the policy, it would be hard to enforce. This would be the same as you changing the type of tire on your car and then your agent telling you the tires were not as safe as the original equipment; therefore, no coverage....or more specifically, you modify your cars performance in one way or another and then your insurance is voided.

Just my thinking and that's why there are exclusions on your policy...


If you insure your private car, then use it for drag racing or rental or livery or a thrill show or stock car racing or target practice, your insurance company will not pay. Speed control equipment is considered safety equipment. If you alter the safety equipment to allow speed faster than that which is legal, I'm sure your insurance company will have a good case. I'll bet that that exclusion is in the policy.

[Ohiogirl]

While this seems an intuitive statement and I have no doubt an agent stated this, I'm not sure it would be legal for them to refuse coverage, based upon a speed modification. If it isn't written in the policy, it would be hard to enforce. This would be the same as you changing the type of tire on your car and then your agent telling you the tires were not as safe as the original equipment; therefore, no coverage....or more specifically, you modify your cars performance in one way or another and then your insurance is voided.

Just my thinking and that's why there are exclusions on your policy...

Oh yes, it WOULD be legal to deny coverage - because it would no longer meet the Definition of the covered vehicle. I'm a former auto insurance claims adjuster, and believe me, we were trained to look for these things and deny coverage when it is appropriate - and it is appropriate if it doesn't meet the definition.

Please note there is a DIFFERENCE between an insurance agent (who sells policies) and an insurance adjuster (who handles claims on policies). Just because an agent told you something was covered does NOT mean that it actually is. Trust me on this one.

Some coverage exclusions are spelled out - but not all. There is a lot of gray area, but normally courts (where policy language is tested regularly) always go back to the Definitions. Of course, juries can mostly decide anything they want, but insurance companies have the means to pursue an unfavorable judgment further (by appealing). I personally wouldn't want to take the chance.

[iandwk]

Oh yes, it WOULD be legal to deny coverage - because it would no longer meet the Definition of the covered vehicle. I'm a former auto insurance claims adjuster, and believe me, we were trained to look for these things and deny coverage when it is appropriate - and it is appropriate if it doesn't meet the definition.

Please note there is a DIFFERENCE between an insurance agent (who sells policies) and an insurance adjuster (who handles claims on policies). Just because an agent told you something was covered does NOT mean that it actually is. Trust me on this one.

Some coverage exclusions are spelled out - but not all. There is a lot of gray area, but normally courts (where policy language is tested regularly) always go back to the Definitions. Of course, juries can mostly decide anything they want, but insurance companies have the means to pursue an unfavorable judgment further (by appealing). I personally wouldn't want to take the chance.

This is pretty much what the agent said at the seminar. You buy coverage for a golf cart. If it has been modified, it no longer meets the state's definition of a golf cart and the agency will not cover it, since you either fraudulently obtained the policy with the claim that it was a golf cart or fraudulently maintained the policy after altering it. Ignorance of the terms of the policy is no excuse. If I had any doubts I would contact an attorney. Like the quote above, I wouldn't just trust the agent.

I think all of us have been around long enough to know that it will be hard enough to get an adjuster to properly pay a claim if you are completely legal.

[Bogie Shooter]

eyegirl, a legal street vehicle is not supposed to exceed 25 mph.

The exception would be if you are on Buena Vista or Morse Blvd.

[Yoda]

To me, the main point is that if you have a modified cart you are not covered by insurance. You may think you are since you paid the premium, but you pay for golf cart insurance. If it is modified, it's no longer a golf cart under Florida law and your insurer will not pay the claims. This is not something I have imagined. It came directly from an Allstate agent at a golf cart safety seminar at Savannah Center. She stated that when one of their insured carts is in an accident the first thing they do is check to see if it has been modified. If it has, they stop their investigation right there and will not pay anything. The speed the cart was going when the accident occurred is irrelevant. The modification nullifies the policy even though the cart may only have been traveling 10mph. End of story. If you are involved in an accident and it is determined to be your fault, it will come out of your pocket. If there are injuries, it can cost you dearly. Your retirement could even be in jeopardy due to medical expenses for the injured party, not to mention the lawsuit that is bound to follow.

I was seriously thinking about modifying my cart before I went to this seminar. Once I got this information, I decided to stay legal. I enjoy my retirement too much to risk losing it so I can drive a golf cart MPH.

Nice quote, but...

Define modified. In my opinion and for your information our carts are modified. Prior to modification, they would only do about 12 mph. Gears have been changed (modified). Tire size increased for the purpose of speed. (modified). I am sure that that's not all. My cart is as it came from the show room. For the most part, it'll bounce between 19 and 20 mph. If I keep the peddle to the metal for some distance it can hit 22 but that takes a lot of "ideal" conditions. I had it in for annual service last week. I rechecked the speed. It hit 23 (for less than a second) on a steep down grade, "floored". I asked about this and was told "that's about right. These things can't be adjusted that accurately and speed changes with time." So, just what is "modified?" Am I going to jail? Are the speed traps for "revenue enhancement"? Do the insurance companies plan to use these "modifications" as an out if the claim gets too big?

I never intend to brake the law. Do I speed? No but I bet that on occasion my golf cart does.

Maybe I need to get rid of my golf cart and get a bike. Where do I put my clubs? If I have to stop too often I loose my balance but I guess that's what helmets are for. Can I get a ticket for running a stop signe on a bike? What if I speed going down hill?

Oh CRAP. I thought retirement was going to be fun.

Just some thoughts

Yoda

[downeaster]

While this seems an intuitive statement and I have no doubt an agent stated this, I'm not sure it would be legal for them to refuse coverage, based upon a speed modification. If it isn't written in the policy, it would be hard to enforce. This would be the same as you changing the type of tire on your car and then your agent telling you the tires were not as safe as the original equipment; therefore, no coverage....or more specifically, you modify your cars performance in one way or another and then your insurance is voided.

Just my thinking and that's why there are exclusions on your policy...

It is written in my policy in very clear terms. I could dig out that section of the policy and post the actual wording here but, trust me, it's there.

It has already been said here that there is a difference between an agent and an adjuster. An agent is trying to earn a commission and an adjuster is paid to determine the validity of the claim and they are well trained in their art.

[iandwk]

Nice quote, but...

Define modified. In my opinion and for your information our carts are modified. Prior to modification, they would only do about 12 mph. Gears have been changed (modified). Tire size increased for the purpose of speed. (modified). I am sure that that's not all. My cart is as it came from the show room. For the most part, it'll bounce between 19 and 20 mph. If I keep the peddle to the metal for some distance it can hit 22 but that takes a lot of "ideal" conditions. I had it in for annual service last week. I rechecked the speed. It hit 23 (for less than a second) on a steep down grade, "floored". I asked about this and was told "that's about right. These things can't be adjusted that accurately and speed changes with time." So, just what is "modified?" Am I going to jail? Are the speed traps for "revenue enhancement"? Do the insurance companies plan to use these "modifications" as an out if the claim gets too big?

I never intend to brake the law. Do I speed? No but I bet that on occasion my golf cart does.

Maybe I need to get rid of my golf cart and get a bike. Where do I put my clubs? If I have to stop too often I loose my balance but I guess that's what helmets are for. Can I get a ticket for running a stop signe on a bike? What if I speed going down hill?

Oh CRAP. I thought retirement was going to be fun.

Just some thoughts

Yoda
I thought it was obvious that "modified" as used in this context refers to a golf cart that has been modified so that it no longer fits the state's definition of a golf cart, instead being made fast enough to be an lsv. In case you haven't noticed there are many many carts running around in TV that are not street legal, yet go at least 25mph. One doesn't have to agree with it, and one can protest by modifying his or her golf cart without ever being caught. Just be ready to pay if something happens.

If you are in doubt about your cart, find the deputy at Spanish Springs and he will check the speed of your cart and tell you if you are in compliance. He said any night but Friday and Saturday because he is too busy with teenagers. He will take you to a parking lot in the area and test with his radar. He promised no tickets if you are too fast, but if you are too fast he said he will strongly urge you to get it fixed. He was at the same seminar as the Allstate agent, and he said that they are really watching for golf carts that have been modified to do 25 mph or more. He said they caught one guy doing 36 mph.

I know myself well enough to know that if my cart will do 30, I will drive it at 30. Maybe not all the time, but the temptation will be too great to avoid. Couple that with no insurance coverage and it has the potential for financial disaster.

[golfnut]

there has been a lot of discussion about policies that will not pay if a cart exceeds certain limits, it would be nice if someone could post the actual language in their policy and the name of the insurer so we could all be more informed instead of a lot of hearsay...gn

[Indydealmaker]

The exception would be if you are on Buena Vista or Morse Blvd.

It is my understanding that the speed limit of the road does not change the fact that an LSV cannot legally exceed 25 mph. Go to this link of the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety: [URL="http://www.iihs.org/laws/lowspeedvehicles.aspx"]

They also cannot motor on streets where the speed limit is higher than 35, but they can cross those streets.

[bimmertl]

there has been a lot of discussion about policies that will not pay if a cart exceeds certain limits, it would be nice if someone could post the actual language in their policy and the name of the insurer so we could all be more informed instead of a lot of hearsay...gn

Contrary to a prior post by Talk Host, this is actually the single most important post on this topic.

Having spent over 33 years involved in insurance claims I marvel at all the insurance "experts" who post on this issue. I've written policy language and litigated thousands of coverage and assorted claim related issues over the years. The bottom line is, show me the specific policy language that strips coverage for a "modified" golf cart.

As TH correctly points, there isn't coverage for insured vehicles rented out to others, or those involved in races etc. There are specific livery and race and speed exclusions in many policies, although, unlike others, I know better than to speak for all policies issued by all insurers. It's fairly common to have these specfic exclusions in most policies. Apparently the Allstate "agent" is able to speak expertly for every insurance company. I personally doubt she knows what the Allstate policy is.

There isn't an exclusion that I have ever seen that says, "If the vehicle described in this policy is modified, this policy will not apply". There is also no definition of "modified" that I have ever seen. So it would read something like "modified means any alteration that changes or alters the vehicle with the intent of enhancing performance or appearance to other than was intended by the manufacturer of the vehicle". So where is that in the policy?

If you increase the speed of the golf cart to that meeting the states definition of an LSV, you need to follow the state mandated licensing and safety rules. However, it's still a 2009 Yahmaha golf cart for insurance purposes absent any specific policy language affecting coverage.

If you insure your golf cart, modify it to LSV and advise your agent, you'll get the exact same policy. However, the rating class will be different and the coverages will change to comply with the state regs. But it still meets the definition of your described and insured vehicle for policy purposes, unless excluded.

Lot's of confusion between being in the proper rating class and what's covered. Most of us have policies "rated" for all drivers over 55 and no youthful drivers. Some even have ratings for travels to and from work less than 7,500 miles per year. Premiums are based upon these factors. If you drive 15,000 miles a year, have an accident, the company doesn't deny coverage for a claim, no more than if you forgot to mention your 30 year old son moved in and now drives the car. An LSV is rated differently than a low speed cart, but it's still a golf cart.

So for all the "experts" out there with statements like "I know it's in there" etc "show me the money"

The most laughable post of all is the statement that not all exclusions are in the policy. Oh really? It's those "secret" exclusions that always cause insurers problems.

[Talk Host]

He said any night but Friday and Saturday because he is too busy with teenagers.

I find this to be an interesting quote. I wonder what keeps him so busy. Perhaps it needs its own thread.

JLK

[iandwk]

I find this to be an interesting quote. I wonder what keeps him so busy. Perhaps it needs its own thread.

JLK

I think there is a thread named "Teenagers" or something like that already going on in one of the forums.

[iandwk]

there has been a lot of discussion about policies that will not pay if a cart exceeds certain limits, it would be nice if someone could post the actual language in their policy and the name of the insurer so we could all be more informed instead of a lot of hearsay...gn
This was addressed 2 or 3 weeks ago in another of these threads. At that time I posted the exact language from my Allstate policy. It was also in answer to a similar question from Golfnut, the same person who asked it on this thread. No one commented on it at that time, so I assumed it was understood to have been a valid answer to the question. Here's the link to that post: https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/showthread.php?p=301065#post301065

Here is the quote from my Allstate policy:

This policy shall be deemed void from its inception if it was obtained through material misrepresentation, fraud, or concealment of material fact. This means that we will not be liable for any claims or damages which would otherwise be covered.

We may deny coverage for an accident or loss if you or an insured person have knowingly concealed or misrepresented any material fact or circumstance or engaged in fraudulent conduct in connection with the presentation or settlement of a claim.

The premium for each off-road vehicle is based on information we have received from you or other sources. You agree to cooperate with us in determining if this information is correct, if it is complete, and if it changes during the policy period. You agree that if this information changes or is incorrect, we may adjust your premium accordingly or take other appropriate action.

This doesn't say word for word what we have been discussing, but it is written in language that will allow the insurance agency to deny coverage if they can show that your golf cart has been modified to increase its speed capabilities. At least that's the way I see it. Are there any lawyers out there who agree or disagree?

I don't expect anyone to take anything said by anybody on this forum as absolute truth. As far as this thread is concerned, if you think that all that is said about insurance and the penalties and the law is hearsay and you are concerned about the truth, it's really easy to call your insurance agent and the sheriff's department and find out. This was all covered in a previous thread and a lot of good information was made available then by people who talked to police and insurance agents.

As far as having a golf cart that will do 25 mph, have at it. You won't be alone as there are many more out there. I strongly suggest speaking to the Sumter County sheriff's office first and asking them if they know of anyone who has been denied coverage because of this and what the results of their being involved in an accident were. They have the statistics. Make your choices based on solid information.

[memason]

We may deny coverage for an accident or loss if you or an insured person have knowingly concealed or misrepresented any material fact or circumstance or engaged in fraudulent conduct in connection with the presentation or settlement of a claim.
.

Not trying to split hairs here, but I perceive a "material fact" or "have knowingly concealed or misrepresented..." to be IF [for example] they asked if my golf cart would go faster than 20 MPH and I said no, when in fact it would do 30, then I would have misrepresented or concealed a fact. It might only be a "material fact" if there is premium rates involved. A material fact is rather specific, whether it's insurance or insider trading.

A cart going 25 or 30 isn't an issue for me personally, since I don't believe that to really be unsafe anyway. Doesn't mean it's right or wrong, it's just the way I feel.

[bimmertl]

Standard policy rescision language.

They issue you a policy based upon your statements on the application. If you have mislead them regarding your eligibility and if the facts you mislead them about would have caused them to not issue a policy, they may void the policy. Changing the speed on your golf cart isn't going to do that. And the fact you should have been in a different rating class isn't a material fact either. When you child turns 16 and starts driving and has an accident, the rating changes. But if you don't call your agent for 6 months they still get coverage for the accident whether or not the company knew of the change in class.

Why would you ask the sheriff any question about insurance policy coverage? Or for that matter, the Allstate agent who speaks for all insurance companies in existence?

My neighbor just put on expensive wheels and larger tires on his cart along with a radio, fan and even a heater. I guess he's screwed if he has an accident since he "modified" his cart.

Can't wait for the next expert opinion!

[iandwk]

Standard policy rescision language.

They issue you a policy based upon your statements on the application. If you have mislead them regarding your eligibility and if the facts you mislead them about would have caused them to not issue a policy, they may void the policy. Changing the speed on your golf cart isn't going to do that. And the fact you should have been in a different rating class isn't a material fact either. When you child turns 16 and starts driving and has an accident, the rating changes. But if you don't call your agent for 6 months they still get coverage for the accident whether or not the company knew of the change in class.

Why would you ask the sheriff any question about insurance policy coverage? Or for that matter, the Allstate agent who speaks for all insurance companies in existence?

My neighbor just put on expensive wheels and larger tires on his cart along with a radio, fan and even a heater. I guess he's screwed if he has an accident since he "modified" his cart.

Can't wait for the next expert opinion!

I said ask the sheriff's department about it because they were the ones who said at the safety seminar what has happened to golf cart owners in the past. If they were lying about it I can't say. That is why I said to ask them. They gave a bunch of statistics about tickets and accidents at the seminar, and they also stated that people have lost their retirement income due to having a modified cart that the insurers wouldn't allow coverage on.

The Allstate agent stated that when one of their carts was in an accident that they checked first to see if it had been modified. She of course didn't mean radios and fans. I think most of us can easily understand the meaning to be modified for extra speed. The man who manages Cart World was there, and he stated that they get them brought in by adjusters pretty regularly to have them check to see if they have been modified.

My question here is, why is everyone doubting the veracity of all this? If you think these people were lying, call them and ask them for the truth. If you think I am making all of it up, go to the next golf cart safety seminar. There were about 100 people at the one I attended, and I think they would all verify that what I posted is in fact what was said. Am I a fool for believing them over a bunch of TOTV lawyers?

[Indydealmaker]

In a True Paradise, one could premise that laws and regulations regarding speed limits would be redundant because every individual would be uniquely concerned with the safety and well-being of their Neighbors in Paradise.

[downeaster]

There has been a lot of rationalizing in this thread. It is obvious some seem to feel there is no basis for the argument against souped up golf carts. They assure you your insurance coverage is not in jeopardy. They scoff at comments from insurance people and Law Officers. They are the "experts" and those who do not agree with them are the "so called experts".

My advice? Read your insurance policy carefully. Read the Florida statutes carefully. Talk to someone who has made the trip to Bushnell to face a judge on a charge of operating an unlicensed vehicle (golf cart modified, altered, souped up or whatever you prefer to call it) and came away a few hundred dollars poorer.

I have done all three and made my decision accordingly. 19.6 MPH top speed is good enough for me.

[LI SNOWBIRD]

I'm with ya downeaster! I'm retired I don't have to speed, but can go at a pace that lets me enjoy the ride.

[EdV]

... The bottom line is, show me the specific policy language that strips coverage for a "modified" golf cart...

You are completely missing the point here. It’s not the fact that modifications were made to the golf cart that can be the basis for denial of coverage. It’s the fact that the vehicle was altered in such a way that it no longer meets Florida’s definition of a golf cart (regardless of what the bill of sale says it is). Here’s the definition:

FS 320.01(22) “Golf cart” means a motor vehicle that is designed and manufactured for operation on a golf course for sporting or recreational purposes and that is not capable of exceeding speeds of 20 miles per hour.

So if you alter your vehicle in such a way (whether you informed them or not), your golf cart insurance policy is no longer valid any more than your automobile policy would be for a vehicle that turned out to actually be a tractor trailer.

And as further evidence, I submit that the Sheriff’s department is regularly issuing tickets here to those owners of those altered carts for “driving an unregistered motor vehicle” and it’s being upheld in the courts. So likewise, an insurance adjuster will deny a claim for such a vehicle in the blink of an eye.

[iandwk]

Thank you downeaster and EdVinMass, for being voices of reason.
I was beginning to think everyone thought I was putting out false information.

[downeaster]

Thank you downeaster and EdVinMass, for being voices of reason.
I was beginning to think everyone thought I was putting out false information.

It is unfortunate that a lot of these posters still think we are wrong and I guess that is okay. However, if I owned a cart that was capable of exceeding 20 MPH and learned it was not really a golf cart but an unregistered vehicle I might be a little upset. I had paid to have it exceed the limit now I must pay to have it not be capable of exceeding 20 MPH. I might even talk myself into thinking I had no problem after reading some of the input here.

[IAMDMRAE]

Very ,very highly unlikely if not next to impossible. Maybe if she threatens the judge or cuts the judge off in traffic in her golf cart on the way to the hearing.

[bimmertl]

You are completely missing the point here. It’s not the fact that modifications were made to the golf cart that can be the basis for denial of coverage. It’s the fact that the vehicle was altered in such a way that it no longer meets Florida’s definition of a golf cart (regardless of what the bill of sale says it is). Here’s the definition:

FS 320.01(22) “Golf cart” means a motor vehicle that is designed and manufactured for operation on a golf course for sporting or recreational purposes and that is not capable of exceeding speeds of 20 miles per hour.

So if you alter your vehicle in such a way (whether you informed them or not), your golf cart insurance policy is no longer valid any more than your automobile policy would be for a vehicle that turned out to actually be a tractor trailer.

And as further evidence, I submit that the Sheriff’s department is regularly issuing tickets here to those owners of those altered carts for “driving an unregistered motor vehicle” and it’s being upheld in the courts. So likewise, an insurance adjuster will deny a claim for such a vehicle in the blink of an eye.

The "Florida definition of a golf cart" is not relevant to the insurance definition of a golf cart. It's still a golf cart under the policy. It merely is not a golf cart that qualifies as a low speed vehicle under the Florida motor vehicle statutes. Florida could define a golf cart going over 20mph as a high speed train, but that doesn't affect the policy language.

The insurance policy defines the parameters of the coverage under the insurance policy and the Florida statutory language doesn't exist in the insurance policy. The insured and insurer are bound by the language in the insurance policy, not the statutory definition of the state.

Obviously this is way beyond your limited knowledge and understanding of contractual and insurance law.

[Indydealmaker]

If a poster on this forum feels comfortable denigrating the well-intentioned opinions of others, then that poster should, at minimum, establish his credentials. If not, then just agree to disagree, but politely.

[downeaster]

The "Florida definition of a golf cart" is not relevant to the insurance definition of a golf cart. It's still a golf cart under the policy. It merely is not a golf cart that qualifies as a low speed vehicle under the Florida motor vehicle statutes. Florida could define a golf cart going over 20mph as a high speed train, but that doesn't affect the policy language.

The insurance policy defines the parameters of the coverage under the insurance policy and the Florida statutory language doesn't exist in the insurance policy. The insured and insurer are bound by the language in the insurance policy, not the statutory definition of the state.

Obviously this is way beyond your limited knowledge and understanding of contractual and insurance law.

EdVinMass has made many contributions to this forum. He does not deserve such put downs. More respect is lost than gained by such remarks.

Keep on posting, Ed.

[iandwk]

You are completely missing the point here. It’s not the fact that modifications were made to the golf cart that can be the basis for denial of coverage. It’s the fact that the vehicle was altered in such a way that it no longer meets Florida’s definition of a golf cart (regardless of what the bill of sale says it is). Here’s the definition:

FS 320.01(22) “Golf cart” means a motor vehicle that is designed and manufactured for operation on a golf course for sporting or recreational purposes and that is not capable of exceeding speeds of 20 miles per hour.

So if you alter your vehicle in such a way (whether you informed them or not), your golf cart insurance policy is no longer valid any more than your automobile policy would be for a vehicle that turned out to actually be a tractor trailer.

And as further evidence, I submit that the Sheriff’s department is regularly issuing tickets here to those owners of those altered carts for “driving an unregistered motor vehicle” and it’s being upheld in the courts. So likewise, an insurance adjuster will deny a claim for such a vehicle in the blink of an eye.

This should be enough to convince anyone. Instead of sniping at others, perhaps the naysayers on this thread would profit by simply checking with the sheriff's department to either verify this statement or find out if they are right in their surmising. It would also be very easy to call two or three insurance providers and ask them about this issue. If they find out they have been wrong, perhaps they will have the good manners to come back to the thread and post apologies.

Here's a quote from an older thread from a couple of weeks ago:


Sumter county golf cart citations 8/1-10/11
Received this from a person who was at the meeting.


I just came from a District 6 meeting at which the Sumter County Sherriff’s Dept. presented the golf cart citations issued between Aug 11th and Oct 11th. There were 64 citations in all, 9 for Ran Stop Sign, 1 for Possession of Open Container – Driver, and 56 for No Motor Vehicle Registration. The No Motor Vehicle Registration meant that the non-street legal golf cart was operated in excess of 20mph while on public road – path portion or otherwise. The citation requires a court appearance. In general, offenders are required to demonstrate to the judge that repairs have been made to limit the cart’s speed to 20mph and pay court costs of $250. At the judge’s discretion, the several hundred dollar fine is waived.

I went to the safety seminar about the time this thread started. The sheriff's deputies there gave the same statistics. People at the seminar were upset about it just like the people on this forum. The deputies stated that if a golf cart is altered to go more than 20 mph, it is no longer a golf cart, but an lsv. The insurance agent and the golf cart dealership owner there confirmed this and said coverage would be denied for an accident caused by an altered golf cart. We can argue about this on and on, but the facts are very simple to obtain. Instead of insulting one another because we don't agree, why not search for the truth? Here's the number for a local Allstate agent: 352-753-4340. I go by what they say because that is who I insure with. I recommend calling one's own agent and finding out their policy.
__________________

[EdV]

The "Florida definition of a golf cart" is not relevant to the insurance definition of a golf cart....

That’s hogwash and you know it.

But wait a minute, come to think of it I guess I can’t blame a person for laying out a little chum to drum up some business. After all, if we follow your advice and the insurance company denies our claim we would need to sue them. And to do that, we would need an attorney, like maybe you, right?

[Talk Host]

I recommend calling one's own agent and finding out their policy.
__________________

While your advise is completely sound, I'll bet not one of the readers of this thread will do that.

[iandwk]

While your advise is completely sound, I'll bet not one of the readers of this thread will do that.
It seems sniping is the preferred method of settling differences. "Don't confuse me with facts," my father always said.

[EdV]

....The bottom line is, show me the specific policy language that strips coverage for a "modified" golf cart......

On the first page of Allstate's policy is the following statement:

Conformity To State Statutes
When any policy provision is in conflict with the statutes of the state in which the policy was issued, the provisions are amended to conform to such statutes.

Therefore the policy is ammended to be for a vehicle that is not capable of exceeding 20mph.

[bimmertl]

On the first page of Allstate's policy is the following statement:

Conformity To State Statutes
When any policy provision is in conflict with the statutes of the state in which the policy was issued, the provisions are amended to conform to such statutes.

Therefore the policy is ammended to be for a vehicle that is not capable of exceeding 20mph.

Your continuing posts reaffirm the last sentence in my previous post.

Thanks for the reassurance!

[EdV]

Councilor, you asked for evidence and I provided it. Why not focus on the facts instead of trying to invalidate me.

[Indydealmaker]

I wonder if the point that "the councilor" is trying to make, exhibiting much pride in doing so, is that most legal contracts prepared by an attorney are not the black and white documents that the clients are led to believe. In fact the gray areas virtually guarantee litigation primarily to the benefit of the lawyers.

[iandwk]

Councilor, you asked for evidence and I provided it. Why not focus on the facts instead of trying to invalidate me.

Are you familiar with the internet term "Troll?" It refers to someone who posts inflammatory remarks just to get a rise out of others. The more you say, the more insulting they tend to get. I think they receive what Buddy Hackett once called "that fleeting moment of connubial bliss" from this type of exchange.

[EdV]

..... I recommend calling one's own agent and finding out their policy.

Unfortunately, that doesn’t always work out either. Two years ago, an Allstate agent in Leesburg was issuing off-road vehicle insurance policies to owners of low speed vehicles that were in fact being registered. How that slipped by the DMV is a mystery to me but once Allstate found out, they put an immediate stop to it. Those LSV’s (which can legally go up to 25mph must now be insured and registered with a standard auto policy to the tune of $500.

I ought to know because I was one of those customers.

[red tail]

Unfortunately, that doesn’t always work out either. Two years ago, an Allstate agent in Leesburg was issuing off-road vehicle insurance policies to owners of low speed vehicles that were in fact being registered. How that slipped by the DMV is a mystery to me but once Allstate found out, they put an immediate stop to it. Those LSV’s (which can legally go up to 25mph must now be insured and registered with a standard auto policy to the tune of $500.

I ought to know because I was one of those customers.

and i might add our tomberlins are worth it!!!!!

[Bill-n-Brillo]

:popcorn:

Bill :)

[iandwk]

Unfortunately, that doesn’t always work out either. Two years ago, an Allstate agent in Leesburg was issuing off-road vehicle insurance policies to owners of low speed vehicles that were in fact being registered. How that slipped by the DMV is a mystery to me but once Allstate found out, they put an immediate stop to it. Those LSV’s (which can legally go up to 25mph must now be insured and registered with a standard auto policy to the tune of $500.

I ought to know because I was one of those customers.
No way of knowing, but one wonders what would have happened if you had an accident.

[Talk Host]

Your continuing posts reaffirm the last sentence in my previous post.

Thanks for the reassurance!

I'm wondering why it's necessary to be so acerbic. Sounds like you think that after YOU post, no one else should dare to voice an opinion.

I'm hoping I'm wrong.

[Jody Fisher]

to have read about altering golf cart speed & the Allstate agent's remark! I only wanted to go 18 MPH instead of 16 MPH, but would rather go slower than to negate my insurance! :agree:

[iandwk]

Perhaps another way to look at this is that we all drive golf carts that have been altered to go faster. I think standard golf cart speed is 14 mph or thereabouts. Most of the ones converted and sold in TV have had high speed gears installed and the governors adjusted (or whatever it is they do) to bring the speed up to just under 20mph in order for them to still be in compliance with state law. If they are capable of going faster than that, regardless of whether or not you drive them faster, they are no longer considered to be golf carts, which is why they are governed at just under 20 mph.

I know this won't help convince the naysayers, but for those of us who are just trying to conform with the law, maybe it will help a bit.

[hadawayj]

To answer your question as to why we use multi mogul paths is simple. We do it to get where we want to go. For example the one along 466. No other reasonable way to get west of Morse Road.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

This thread is over 10 months old, hadawayj.

Bill :)

[Jim007]

You cannot access it on line. It's a publication of TV Homeowners Association. It was inserted into todays paper. (I don't think they have on line access)

You can access "The Village Voice" here: http://www.thevha.net/Village_Voice/oct2011.pdf. It's part of "The Homeowners Association" web site.

[rubicon]

How did this thread get resurrected with this previous post?

[daca55]

Maybe that last golf cart wreck prompted this clampdown.

"Back to the other hand, I would also like them to hand out tickets for carts that can only go 13 MPH" I wonder if there is a lower limit at which they can ticket you. If not, "merrily ? we creep along. :ohdear:

I have rented golf carts at the golf cart store downtown and those rental carts are very slow and that is not the drivers fault. To give someone a ticket because he is driving a rental cart which is slow by design would be totally unfair. :ho:

[The Villager II]

I had a motor go bad in my 27 MPH cart and had it replaced with one that gos about 20 to 22 wide open. I must say that I truly enjoy it more at the slower speed. I get passed allot now, but can smell the roses better.

[J & J plus M]

After reading all of the above comments, as well as other topics in "Talk of the Villages" I realize what a wise man (my dad) once told me...." Never get in a discussion about politics or religion... you'll never change the other person's opinion" BUT I would like to add three more topics that pertain to The Villages. GOLF CARTS :gc:... DOGS :doggie:... AND GUNS. :boom: It would be nice if we could agree to disagree in a more civil manner...... we don't have much time left folks, wouldn't it be nicer if it was spent in harmony. I thought The Villages was supposed to be "Florida's Friendliest Hometown"

[rubicon]

I had a motor go bad in my 27 MPH cart and had it replaced with one that gos about 20 to 22 wide open. I must say that I truly enjoy it more at the slower speed. I get passed allot now, but can smell the roses better.

VII: I had the same experience. In fact with two people in the cart, could the motor would overheat and come to an abrupt halt after. Replaced it with a new motor, stay within the speed limit and can travel 20 or so miles without the voltage meter leaving the charged portion of the meter .

So let them pass me I meet them at the next stop.:clap2: