COVID Confusion

[mtdjed]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.

[Dana1963]

Well you came to the right site for information/misinformation.

[Bay Kid]

Well you came to the right site for information/misinformation.

Ha ha ha. Does anyone really know? Maybe the lab where it was created can give us a legitimate answer???

[Papa_lecki]

Oh good, another covid thread.

[Dana1963]

Ha ha ha. Does anyone really know? Maybe the lab where it was created can give us a legitimate answer???
All what we think and know is an illusion. Nothing exists. Everything is an opinion.

[Love2Swim]

Well you came to the right site for information/misinformation. for misinformation, yes.

[Two Bills]

I blame the Snowbirds!:icon_wink:

[Love2Swim]

Not another post on herd immunity I hope. I read that immunity for viruses only lasts 3-9months, that's why they are considered seasonal viruses and require an annual vaccination or booster. Essentially for the "herd" to achieve immunity, 70% of the population would have to be infected every 9 months, making it impossible to achieve immunity through widespread transmission. Also, as we all should know, this particular virus is changing constantly, a lot is not known, and the scientists are learning as time goes on. As new information is gleaned, so do the recommended health practices change and adapt. At this point in time, we do know the vaccinations and masking are the only way we control the pandemic and minimize deaths. Those who think they can do their own thing and continue to be unvaccinated and expose others to the potentially deadly disease are going to to have to learn to adapt. They either follow the health rules set by their community and do what is best for society or face the consequences. They have a choice.

[JMintzer]

I blame the Snowbirds!:icon_wink:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/P6AA1sBL7N8/sddefault.jpg

[JMintzer]

Not another post on herd immunity I hope. I read that immunity for viruses only lasts 3-9months, that's why they are considered seasonal viruses and require an annual vaccination or booster. Essentially for the "herd" to achieve immunity, 70% of the population would have to be infected every 9 months, making it impossible to achieve immunity through widespread transmission. Also, as we all should know, this particular virus is changing constantly, a lot is not known, and the scientists are learning as time goes on. As new information is gleaned, so do the recommended health practices change and adapt. At this point in time, we do know the vaccinations and masking are the only way we control the pandemic and minimize deaths. Those who think they can do their own thing and continue to be unvaccinated and expose others to the potentially deadly disease are going to to have to learn to adapt. They either follow the health rules set by their community and do what is best for society or face the consequences. They have a choice.

No one (except you) has mentioned "herd immunity"...

And what you read is wrong...

[sshepard03]

Not another post on herd immunity I hope. I read that immunity for viruses only lasts 3-9months, that's why they are considered seasonal viruses and require an annual vaccination or booster. Essentially for the "herd" to achieve immunity, 70% of the population would have to be infected every 9 months, making it impossible to achieve immunity through widespread transmission. Also, as we all should know, this particular virus is changing constantly, a lot is not known, and the scientists are learning as time goes on. As new information is gleaned, so do the recommended health practices change and adapt. At this point in time, we do know the vaccinations and masking are the only way we control the pandemic and minimize deaths. Those who think they can do their own thing and continue to be unvaccinated and expose others to the potentially deadly disease are going to to have to learn to adapt. They either follow the health rules set by their community and do what is best for society or face the consequences. They have a choice.

It is my understanding, from the CDC (albeit quietly published) that fully vaccinated people can get Covid and transmit Covid. This is contrary to what our Administration stated 2 months ago. If ANYONE says they 'know about Covid,' that is a lie. No one knows. Some say it's safe. They 'think' it's safe but they don't know it's safe. I want to see the 20 year study on > 1 million people to determine, i.e. long-term effects.
No one knows - we are all in the dark.

[Mortal1]

strangely enough no one mentions asking your doctor. they know your personal health issues and would likely know what course of action that is right for you.

"do the recommended health practices change and adapt. At this point in time, we do know the vaccinations and masking are the only way we control the pandemic and minimize deaths(this statement is not true! those with an immune system that prevents them from getting the virus are just fine). Those who think they can do their own thing and continue to be unvaccinated and expose others to the potentially deadly disease are going to to have to learn to adapt(again not true.if you have had the vaccine you need not worry-as per the people you quote for most of your misinformation) They either follow the health rules set by their community and do what is best for society or face the consequences(how very socialist of you). They have a choice(the only part of your post that is true, but you suggest that they do not and must bear the burden of those that get infected....BOLLOCKS!). I have not received the vaccine and since none of the people have no idea as to my particular health situation in regards to that they should mind your own business until you can get the facts which at this present time mostly do not exist).so how can some folks be so judgmental when all the facts aren't out there? or do some people just like telling people what to do? If people are so afraid they should invest in a real filtered mask, order out for everything and wipe every single thing they come in contact with(wear rubber gloves as well). Since we all that now even those vaccinated can carry and transmit the virus to others already vaccinated.

[Michael G.]

There was just a segment on Sunday Morning on television this morning on how Facebook is spreading misinformation
about everything, especially the virus and how people believe Facebook is the bible for all information.

[Love2Swim]

No one (except you) has mentioned "herd immunity"...

And what you read is wrong...

The original poster appeared to refer to herd immunity when they questioned whether the actual occurrence of Covid was better than getting vaccinated. My information was from a government website. Where is yours from?

[drducat]

The original poster appeared to refer to herd immunity when they questioned whether the actual occurrence of Covid was better than getting vaccinated. My information was from a government website. Where is yours from?

EU finds J&J COVID shot possibly linked to another rare clotting condition | Reuters (https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/eu-finds-jj-covid-shot-possibly-linked-another-rare-clotting-condition-2021-10-01/)


Herd Immunity===Death by 1000 shots :spoken:


Still want to hear more about the long term issues coming.....will know if it is safe in 5 years or more.

[Byte1]

Doctors can't seem to agree on the virus or the vaccinations. The scientists can't seem to agree on either. The CDC did not recommend the vaccination for young children but the gov is pushing the shots for school attendance none the less. There are vaccine studies showing possible serious heart damage by the vaccines, but death by CV19 is about the same percentage of chance. An adult getting the vaccine has about the same chance of dying of infection as a young school age child, yet the system is mandating masks for children in school but the adults can opt out. Latest news says the infection rate has peaked and is going down again. We have folks on here that have gotten the Moderna "booster" shot even though it has not been approved yet, for a third shot. Scientists said that Moderna has a longer (longevity) than Pfizer or J&J so a third shot is not yet needed. But that doesn't hinder the hysterical on here that have already rushed out and gotten their third Moderna shot. After all, more is better...right? Let's all double up on medicines, since more is better.
Personally, I am not even considering a third shot at this time. I got my vaccinations ONLY for my spouse and now she is considering NOT getting a booster when offered. We know almost two dozen covid survivors that only suffered cold like symptoms, so the chance of having serious side effects from the vaccine seem to be about equal with dying from covid. Just our opinion, not to be construed as a suggestion or endorsement one way or another.
Confusion seems to abound on public information. No guarantees, of course.
But, keep the conversation going because maybe some of us will be convinced to change our views.

[JMintzer]

The original poster appeared to refer to herd immunity when they questioned whether the actual occurrence of Covid was better than getting vaccinated. My information was from a government website. Where is yours from?

A government website said that viral immunity only lasts 3-9 months?

Please cite that website, because it's simply not true...

The Polio vaccine, for example is considered to give a "lifetime immunity"...

Most others last many years to decades...

And my information came from the Infectious disease courses I took in Med School...

[Altavia]

A government website said that viral immunity only lasts 3-9 months?

Please cite that website, because it's simply not true...

The Polio vaccine, for example is considered to give a "lifetime immunity"...

Most others last many years to decades...

And my information came from the Infectious disease courses I took in Med School...

Some Vaccines Last a Lifetime. Here’s Why Covid-19 Shots Don’t. - WSJ (https://www.wsj.com/articles/some-vaccines-last-a-lifetime-heres-why-covid-19-shots-dont-11631266201)

Why don’t Covid-19 vaccinations last longer?

Measles shots are good for life, chickenpox immunizations protect for 10 to 20 years, and tetanus jabs last a decade or more. But U.S. officials are weighing whether to authorize Covid-19 boosters for vaccinated adults as soon as six months after the initial inoculation.

The goal of a vaccine is to provide the protection afforded by natural infection, but without the risk of serious illness or death.

“A really good vaccine makes it so someone does not get infected even if they are exposed to the virus,” said Rustom Antia, a biology professor at Emory University who studies immune responses. “But not all vaccines are ideal.”

The three tiers of defense, he said, include full protection against infection and transmission; protection against serious illness and transmission; or protection against serious illness only.

The effectiveness depends on the magnitude of the immune response a vaccine induces, how fast the resulting antibodies decay, whether the virus or bacteria tend to mutate, and the location of the infection.

The threshold of protection is the level of immunity that’s sufficient to keep from getting sick. For every bug, it’s different, and even how it’s determined varies.

Windows of immunity for selected vaccines


Hepatitis A
Human
Papillomavirus
Tetanus
Typhoid
Influenza
Covid-19
0 year
5
10
15
20
Sources: San Francisco Department of Public Health (hepatitis A); National Institutes of Health (human papillomavirus); Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (tetanus, typhoid, influenza, Covid-19)
“Basically, it’s levels of antibodies or neutralizing antibodies per milliliter of blood,” said Mark Slifka, a professor at Oregon Health & Science University.

(T-cells also contribute to protection, but antibodies are easier to measure.)

A threshold 0.01 international units per milliliter was confirmed for tetanus in 1942 when a pair of German researchers intentionally exposed themselves to the toxin to test the findings of previous animal studies.

“One of them gave himself two lethal doses of tetanus in his thigh, and monitored how well it went,” Dr. Slifka said. “His co-author did three lethal doses.”

Neither got sick.

A threshold for measles was pinned down in 1985 after a college dorm was exposed to the disease shortly after a blood drive. Researchers checked antibody concentrations in the students’ blood donations and identified 0.02 international units per milliliter as the level needed to prevent infection.

0:00 / 6:00
Covid Vaccine Efficacy Numbers, Explained
Covid Vaccine Efficacy Numbers, Explained
Recent studies have shown that the effectiveness of Covid-19 vaccines is decreasing, though experts say the shots still work well. WSJ explains what the numbers mean and why they don’t tell the full story. Photo illustration: Jacob Reynolds/WSJ
With these diseases, the magnitudes of response to the vaccines combined with the antibodies’ rates of decay produce durable immune responses: Measles antibodies decay slowly. Tetanus antibodies decay more quickly, but the vaccine causes the body to produce far more than it needs, offsetting the decline.

“We’re fortunate with tetanus, diphtheria, measles and vaccinia,” Dr. Slifka said. “We have identified what the threshold of protection is. You track antibody decline over time, and if you know the threshold of protection, you can calculate durability of protection. With Covid, we don’t know.”

Historically, the most effective vaccines have used replicating viruses, which essentially elicit lifelong immunity.

Measles and chickenpox vaccines use replicating viruses.

Non-replicating vaccines and protein-based vaccines (such as the one for tetanus) don’t last as long, but their effectiveness can be enhanced with the addition of an adjuvant—a substance that enhances the magnitude of the response.

Tetanus and hepatitis A vaccines use an adjuvant.

[lkagele]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.

Here's what I think I know.
1 - Research can be as simple as finding a trusted source(s) that turns out to be correct time after time.
2 - Masks don't work.
3 - The vaccines have a limited shelf life. Boosters forever.
4 - Vaccines aren't really vaccines but rather good therapeutics. If you get sick, it shouldn't be too bad.
5 - The vaccinated are getting sick.
6 - If you get sick, immediately seek an monoclonal antibody treatment.
7 - Natural immunity is better and longer lasting than vaccine.
8 - Just a prediction here, Merck's new drug will be eerily similar to Merck's Ivermectin. $7 vs. $0.50.

That's what I think I know.

[Malsua]

8 - Just a prediction here, Merck's new drug will be eerily similar to Merck's Ivermectin. $7 vs. $0.50.

That's what I think I know.

$700 not $7 for 5 days of treatment.

It also has fewer modes of action, mainly in that Merck's new offering is only a protease inhibitor similar to IVM. The difference is that IVM competitively binds to the spike protein as well and that is probably why IVM works so well as prophylaxis. There are also about 7 lesser methods that IVM uses, like the Importin alpha and beta channels but hey, at least they aren't using Merck's new offering in horses. Merckmectin also has about half the efficacy, but at least now all the pharma shills will be touting it to the skies, so a win is a win I guess.

[JoMar]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.

Plenty of informed instruction and communications available, it just may not be what you want to hear or investigate. What the airport is doing re masking has been out there and on the news for months and updated. Same with TV restaurants, although that can be solved with a phone call. All depends on how safe or unsafe you want to be and how you feel about helping keeping others safe.....personal choices.

[JMintzer]

Windows of immunity for selected vaccines

"Selected" Vaccines...

And none of that disproved what I stated...

[JMintzer]

$700 not $7 for 5 days of treatment.

Yup!

[Luggage]

I'm sorry you're not one of the few not carrying masks in your car. Where have you been the last 18 months, that people got to go out in public should be wearing masks?

[Luggage]

Yes it's a personal choice, but one with a lot of potential harm if you don't adhere to the status quo. In other words don't you wear your seatbelt in your car? I'm not wearing a mask is 10 times as bad as not wearing a seatbelt because it affects a lot of other people as well

[DaleDivine]

There was just a segment on Sunday Morning on television this morning on how Facebook is spreading misinformation
about everything, especially the virus and how people believe Facebook is the bible for all information.

And here I thought ToTV was the bible for all information.
:bigbow::bigbow:

[Rwirish]

Actually much of the information has been fairly clear. Relative to your first point regarding the mask requirement at airports, this requirement has been in place for almost 6 months. It has probably been covered over 100 times on the local and world news.

Never heard of the Phizor vaccine. Is this a new vaccine?

Vaccines lose there effectiveness over a period of time thus booster shots may be required.

[dewilson58]

And here I thought ToTV was the bible for all information.
:bigbow::bigbow:

Only if it's hairdresser confirmed.

[Altavia]

Reading comprehension check.

[Pamelah]

I blame the Snowbirds!:icon_wink:

Your attempt at humor failed. 😝

[Andyb]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.

Actually, Pfizer is not FDA approve. Correct, the natural antibody is far more effective than the vax. Lot of Fake news from our government, Fauci, FDA and CDC. Do the research, but they make it hard to find.

[JMintzer]

I'm sorry you're not one of the few not carrying masks in your car. Where have you been the last 18 months, that people got to go out in public should be wearing masks?

Who said they didn't have a mask in their car? Certainly not the OP...

And when did simply "going out in public" require a mask?

[golfing eagles]

Who said they didn't have a mask in their car? Certainly not the OP...

And when did simply "going out in public" require a mask?

Either when someone is grossly misinformed or excessively paranoid, but most likely both:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

Actually much of the information has been fairly clear. Relative to your first point regarding the mask requirement at airports, this requirement has been in place for almost 6 months. It has probably been covered over 100 times on the local and world news.

Never heard of the Phizor vaccine. Is this a new vaccine?

Vaccines lose there effectiveness over a period of time thus booster shots may be required.

But if you've not flown, nor thought about flying, that info is easily missed...

This past Summer, I took a trip to MCO with my neighbor, so he could renew his Global Entry Pass (and stop at a killer Pastrami food truck on the way back)...

Since FL had recently opened up, I didn't think to bring a mask...

When it was brought to my attention that I needed one to even enter the terminal, I simply waited for him, on a bench outside, 20 yards from the TSA office...

[golfing eagles]

But if you've not flown, nor thought about flying, that info is easily missed...

This past Summer, I took a trip to MCO with my neighbor, so he could renew his Global Entry Pass (and stop at a killer Pastrami food truck on the way back)...

Since FL had recently opened up, I didn't think to bring a mask...

When it was brought to my attention that I needed one to even enter the terminal, I simply waited for him, on a bench outside, 20 yards from the TSA office...

Forget about the mask----where's the pastrami truck??????

[JMintzer]

Never heard of the Phizor vaccine. Is this a new vaccine?

Going after spelling errors? That's your argument?

Vaccines lose there effectiveness over a period of time thus booster shots may be required.

No, really? I never heard that (yet, this morning, but it's only 7:30, but the day is young...)

Oh, and I think you meant *their... Since you're so concerned about spelling...

[JMintzer]

Either when someone is grossly misinformed or excessively paranoid, but most likely both:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Prezactly...

[JMintzer]

Forget about the mask----where's the pastrami truck??????

Home (http://www.pastramiproject.com/The%20Pastrami%20Project/Home.html)

The Pastrami Project (https://www.facebook.com/ThePastramiProject/)

[Buckeye Bob]

Trust the government???🤔🤔🤣🤣🤣🤣

[La lamy]

Reading comprehension check.

:a040: :clap2:

[Professor]

This is not complicated. Carry a mask in your pocket wherever you go so you can put one on when the situation warrants it. Masks are easy to transport, so you should never be without access to one in a public place, even if not wearing it at the time.

[tsmall22204]

All the covid experts are here on TOTV. One would think the world would consult these self proclaimed experts.

[Lindaws]

We know why

[Byte1]

This is not complicated. Carry a mask in your pocket wherever you go so you can put one on when the situation warrants it. Masks are easy to transport, so you should never be without access to one in a public place, even if not wearing it at the time.

Interesting that masks have never in the past been needed. Now suddenly we are receiving advice that we should ALWAYS have one available and should carry one in our pocket at all times:1rotfl: In the past, the "situation" never "warranted" it, but suddenly the media has everyone paranoid and hysterical.

You all need to try this one in the villages. Masks do come in handy...
Woman Picks up dog poop with face mask and puts mask back on. - YouTube (https://youtu.be/jSv2yK0qmVU)

[Aloha1]

Home (http://www.pastramiproject.com/The%20Pastrami%20Project/Home.html)

The Pastrami Project (https://www.facebook.com/ThePastramiProject/)

So, is it a truck at Magnolia Ave or the store front? If both, is the truck somewhere else? Salivating food glands want to know!

[golfing eagles]

Actually, Pfizer is not FDA approve. Correct, the natural antibody is far more effective than the vax. Lot of Fake news from our government, Fauci, FDA and CDC. Do the research, but they make it hard to find.

Yep, Fauci, the FDA, the CDC, and the government are all wrong or "lying", but YOUR "research" is the truth. Hmmmmm.....

[lkagele]

$700 not $7 for 5 days of treatment.

It also has fewer modes of action, mainly in that Merck's new offering is only a protease inhibitor similar to IVM. The difference is that IVM competitively binds to the spike protein as well and that is probably why IVM works so well as prophylaxis. There are also about 7 lesser methods that IVM uses, like the Importin alpha and beta channels but hey, at least they aren't using Merck's new offering in horses. Merckmectin also has about half the efficacy, but at least now all the pharma shills will be touting it to the skies, so a win is a win I guess.

Price was per pill.

[Jacob85]

Pfizer immunity does go down after 6 months and boosters have been approved for people over 65. I just was on a flight yesterday and it was good they are still taking this virus seriously by the mask mandates

[Waltdisney4life]

Numbers are coming way down because of the vaccination not because of the masks your paper mask or cloth mask does not stop vapors!!!

[JMintzer]

So, is it a truck at Magnolia Ave or the store front? If both, is the truck somewhere else? Salivating food glands want to know!

The truck is in the parking lot behind the restaurant. There is a folding stand-up sign pointing to it...

They share kitchen space with the restaurant, using their freezer/refrigerator space and they cover for each other at times...

[bp243]

There was just a segment on Sunday Morning on television this morning on how Facebook is spreading misinformation
about everything, especially the virus and how people believe Facebook is the bible for all information.
If you quote Facebook for information, please know that you have missed an opportunity to think critically.

[Wyseguy]

I blame the Snowbirds!:icon_wink:

Definitely the snowbirds, who are undoubtedly the ones who allow their dogs to urinate on other peoples lawns.

[golfing eagles]

Pfizer immunity does go down after 6 months and boosters have been approved for people over 65. I just was on a flight yesterday and it was good they are still taking this virus seriously by the mask mandates

It would be better if they took this virus seriously by mandating vaccinations to fly, and closed the middle seat to at least have some social distancing. Wearing a mask 2 feet away from the face of an unvaccinated person who is not wearing their mask properly and coughing/sneezing around it for 5 hours is a joke.

[Neils]

Not another post on herd immunity I hope. I read that immunity for viruses only lasts 3-9months, that's why they are considered seasonal viruses and require an annual vaccination or booster. Essentially for the "herd" to achieve immunity, 70% of the population would have to be infected every 9 months, making it impossible to achieve immunity through widespread transmission. Also, as we all should know, this particular virus is changing constantly, a lot is not known, and the scientists are learning as time goes on. As new information is gleaned, so do the recommended health practices change and adapt. At this point in time, we do know the vaccinations and masking are the only way we control the pandemic and minimize deaths. Those who think they can do their own thing and continue to be unvaccinated and expose others to the potentially deadly disease are going to to have to learn to adapt. They either follow the health rules set by their community and do what is best for society or face the consequences. They have a choice.

Correct. Those in communist led countries must follow the mandates or face the consequences.

[lennythenet]

Some Vaccines Last a Lifetime. Here’s Why Covid-19 Shots Don’t. - WSJ (https://www.wsj.com/articles/some-vaccines-last-a-lifetime-heres-why-covid-19-shots-dont-11631266201)

Why don’t Covid-19 vaccinations last longer?

Measles shots are good for life, chickenpox immunizations protect for 10 to 20 years, and tetanus jabs last a decade or more. But U.S. officials are weighing whether to authorize Covid-19 boosters for vaccinated adults as soon as six months after the initial inoculation.

The goal of a vaccine is to provide the protection afforded by natural infection, but without the risk of serious illness or death.

“A really good vaccine makes it so someone does not get infected even if they are exposed to the virus,” said Rustom Antia, a biology professor at Emory University who studies immune responses. “But not all vaccines are ideal.”

The three tiers of defense, he said, include full protection against infection and transmission; protection against serious illness and transmission; or protection against serious illness only.

The effectiveness depends on the magnitude of the immune response a vaccine induces, how fast the resulting antibodies decay, whether the virus or bacteria tend to mutate, and the location of the infection.

The threshold of protection is the level of immunity that’s sufficient to keep from getting sick. For every bug, it’s different, and even how it’s determined varies.

Windows of immunity for selected vaccines


Hepatitis A
Human
Papillomavirus
Tetanus
Typhoid
Influenza
Covid-19
0 year
5
10
15
20
Sources: San Francisco Department of Public Health (hepatitis A); National Institutes of Health (human papillomavirus); Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (tetanus, typhoid, influenza, Covid-19)
“Basically, it’s levels of antibodies or neutralizing antibodies per milliliter of blood,” said Mark Slifka, a professor at Oregon Health & Science University.

(T-cells also contribute to protection, but antibodies are easier to measure.)

A threshold 0.01 international units per milliliter was confirmed for tetanus in 1942 when a pair of German researchers intentionally exposed themselves to the toxin to test the findings of previous animal studies.

“One of them gave himself two lethal doses of tetanus in his thigh, and monitored how well it went,” Dr. Slifka said. “His co-author did three lethal doses.”

Neither got sick.

A threshold for measles was pinned down in 1985 after a college dorm was exposed to the disease shortly after a blood drive. Researchers checked antibody concentrations in the students’ blood donations and identified 0.02 international units per milliliter as the level needed to prevent infection.

0:00 / 6:00
Covid Vaccine Efficacy Numbers, Explained
Covid Vaccine Efficacy Numbers, Explained
Recent studies have shown that the effectiveness of Covid-19 vaccines is decreasing, though experts say the shots still work well. WSJ explains what the numbers mean and why they don’t tell the full story. Photo illustration: Jacob Reynolds/WSJ
With these diseases, the magnitudes of response to the vaccines combined with the antibodies’ rates of decay produce durable immune responses: Measles antibodies decay slowly. Tetanus antibodies decay more quickly, but the vaccine causes the body to produce far more than it needs, offsetting the decline.

“We’re fortunate with tetanus, diphtheria, measles and vaccinia,” Dr. Slifka said. “We have identified what the threshold of protection is. You track antibody decline over time, and if you know the threshold of protection, you can calculate durability of protection. With Covid, we don’t know.”

Historically, the most effective vaccines have used replicating viruses, which essentially elicit lifelong immunity.

Measles and chickenpox vaccines use replicating viruses.

Non-replicating vaccines and protein-based vaccines (such as the one for tetanus) don’t last as long, but their effectiveness can be enhanced with the addition of an adjuvant—a substance that enhances the magnitude of the response.

Tetanus and hepatitis A vaccines use an adjuvant.
Good info, thank you.

[golfing eagles]

Numbers are coming way down because of the vaccination not because of the masks your paper mask or cloth mask does not stop vapors!!!

But you will never convince those that STILL worship at the altar of the holy mask (or is that holey?:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:) Masks still have some use, like an airplane that crams passengers in like sardines, but overall not all that useful any more (unless you wear one when driving alone in your car, in which case you are protected from all manner of evil, including alien abduction (the aliens are looking for intelligent life, so they pass on that person:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:)

[Byte1]

But you will never convince those that STILL worship at the altar of the holy mask (or is that holey?:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:) Masks still have some use, like an airplane that crams passengers in like sardines, but overall not all that useful any more (unless you wear one when driving alone in your car, in which case you are protected from all manner of evil, including alien abduction (the aliens are looking for intelligent life, so they pass on that person:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:)

Or picking up dog poop........:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[Wyseguy]

Here's what I think I know.
1 - Research can be as simple as finding a trusted source(s) that turns out to be correct time after time.
2 - Masks don't work.
3 - The vaccines have a limited shelf life. Boosters forever.
4 - Vaccines aren't really vaccines but rather good therapeutics. If you get sick, it shouldn't be too bad.
5 - The vaccinated are getting sick.
6 - If you get sick, immediately seek an monoclonal antibody treatment.
7 - Natural immunity is better and longer lasting than vaccine.
8 - Just a prediction here, Merck's new drug will be eerily similar to Merck's Ivermectin. $7 vs. $0.50.

That's what I think I know.

Excellent post. You hit all of the points. Thank You.

[Wyseguy]

Yep, Fauci, the FDA, the CDC, and the government are all wrong or "lying", but YOUR "research" is the truth. Hmmmmm.....

You are so right. It is much better to let the government think for you. They care. I just hate when people think for themselves. They are selfish, and probably racist too.

[Gettingoutofdodge]

N95 masks are the only masks that protect you and they are uncomfortable and hard to breathe in.
There is not enough data to give us long term results of the efficacy or safety of the vaccine.
I had the Moderna Vaccine and the side effects were no picnic. I had a Covid19 immunity test a few weeks ago. My immunity was still high. A statement under the results say something like having immunity does not mean your immune. So what is the new version of immunity?

My Dr. said do a immunity test every 3 months. If it’s high, no booster needed. I wear an n95 mask in a place it makes sense to. Mostly I go unmasked.

Do what you feel comfortable with.

[JMintzer]

Price was per pill.

Still waaaay too low...

[JMintzer]

Pfizer immunity does go down after 6 months and boosters have been approved for people over 65. I just was on a flight yesterday and it was good they are still taking this virus seriously by the mask mandates

Sorry, but sitting shoulder to shoulder with people wearing cheap, ill fitting masks is not taking anything seriously.

I'll wear a mask, but I've no delusions that it's actually doing anything...

[JMintzer]

N95 masks are the only masks that protect you and they are uncomfortable and hard to breathe in.
There is not enough data to give us long term results of the efficacy or safety of the vaccine.
I had the Moderna Vaccine and the side effects were no picnic. I had a Covid19 immunity test a few weeks ago. My immunity was still high. A statement under the results say something like having immunity does not mean your immune. So what is the new version of immunity?

My Dr. said do a immunity test every 3 months. If it’s high, no booster needed. I wear an n95 mask in a place it makes sense to. Mostly I go unmasked.

Do what you feel comfortable with.

https://d35i5brrnx3uxo.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/25200817/StopMakingSense-Majestic-081019-Web.jpg

[cherylncliff]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.

The company is Pfizer. The Pfizer vaccine is still very effective at preventing hospitalization and death even at 6-9 months but the frequency of breakthrough infections does seem to be increasing more for the Pfizer vaccine than for Moderna. Note that the 2 vaccines are both mRNA based. The Pfizer vaccine contains somewhat less of the mRNA and the dosing regimen was a shorter interval between shots. This may be leading to the slight differences being seen The Pfizer vaccine has an emergency use approval for a "booster" shot. Moderna has submitted data for an EUA for a booster. The data to date suggests that infection by the virus does not provide good protection against future infection compared to getting the vaccine. Waiting to be infected carries a very high risk of severe illness and or death as well as 30% of hospitalized patients suffer long term, debilitating medical issues for weeks to months, assuming they recover. The need for future or annual boosters is still being evaluated and will depend on many factors including how many choose not to get vaccinated as well as future mutations. Note that mutations only occur if people get infected which means the higher the population of unvaccinated the more likely a future mutation will negate our current vaccines. Masking has been proven effective in minimizing your risk of catching communicable diseases.

1. Get vaccinated
2. Get a booster when available, especially if over 65 or immune compromised in some way
3. Wear a mask when inside in public or when in large group.
4. Wash your hands.

My background is 30 years in the pharmaceutical industry as a researcher including time at Upjohn, Pharmacia and Pfizer and I contnue to read the technical literature as well as reading CDC and FDA publications. I encourage you to do your own reading at sites like the CDC or FDA sites.

[JMintzer]

The data to date suggests that infection by the virus does not provide good protection against future infection compared to getting the vaccine.

Israeli studies (pretty much the gold standard) say otherwise...

They also say that Natural Immunity PLUS the Vaccination is MUCH better than either alone...

[coffeebean]

A government website source does not make it true. I believe this man over every government talking head including Fauci.

A Final Warning - Dr. Mike Yeadon | Planet Lockdown (https://www.bitchute.com/video/8YLXDB9aHRFj/)

This guy is a British pharmacologist who gained media attention for making false claims about Covid. He is a notorious anti-vaxxer.

[golfing eagles]

Excellent post. You hit all of the points. Thank You.

Too bad few if not none of them were correct.

[golfing eagles]

You are so right. It is much better to let the government think for you. They care. I just hate when people think for themselves. They are selfish, and probably racist too.

Res ipsa loquitur

[golfing eagles]

N95 masks are the only masks that protect you and they are uncomfortable and hard to breathe in.
There is not enough data to give us long term results of the efficacy or safety of the vaccine.
I had the Moderna Vaccine and the side effects were no picnic. I had a Covid19 immunity test a few weeks ago. My immunity was still high. A statement under the results say something like having immunity does not mean your immune. So what is the new version of immunity?

My Dr. said do a immunity test every 3 months. If it’s high, no booster needed. I wear an n95 mask in a place it makes sense to. Mostly I go unmasked.

Do what you feel comfortable with.

The problem is that the antibody test only measures one antibody, but there are several involved in immunity to the virus. We not even sure which ones they are yet. So yes, you can have a high "antibody" level according to the test used, but not be "immune". And no doctor should be suggesting that a high antibody level according the the test that is used is a criterion for not getting a booster.

As far as "Do what you feel comfortable with.", if everybody did that, we'd range from people hiding under their beds to those mowing down hundreds at a mall with an AK-47. How about do what they experts advise? (Except for those who have already posted on this thread that they think the experts are "lying":1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:)

[golfing eagles]

The company is Pfizer. The Pfizer vaccine is still very effective at preventing hospitalization and death even at 6-9 months but the frequency of breakthrough infections does seem to be increasing more for the Pfizer vaccine than for Moderna. Note that the 2 vaccines are both mRNA based. The Pfizer vaccine contains somewhat less of the mRNA and the dosing regimen was a shorter interval between shots. This may be leading to the slight differences being seen The Pfizer vaccine has an emergency use approval for a "booster" shot. Moderna has submitted data for an EUA for a booster. The data to date suggests that infection by the virus does not provide good protection against future infection compared to getting the vaccine. Waiting to be infected carries a very high risk of severe illness and or death as well as 30% of hospitalized patients suffer long term, debilitating medical issues for weeks to months, assuming they recover. The need for future or annual boosters is still being evaluated and will depend on many factors including how many choose not to get vaccinated as well as future mutations. Note that mutations only occur if people get infected which means the higher the population of unvaccinated the more likely a future mutation will negate our current vaccines. Masking has been proven effective in minimizing your risk of catching communicable diseases.

1. Get vaccinated
2. Get a booster when available, especially if over 65 or immune compromised in some way
3. Wear a mask when inside in public or when in large group.
4. Wash your hands.

My background is 30 years in the pharmaceutical industry as a researcher including time at Upjohn, Pharmacia and Pfizer and I contnue to read the technical literature as well as reading CDC and FDA publications. I encourage you to do your own reading at sites like the CDC or FDA sites.

Please post that 1,000 times for the _________(fill in the blank) who think it is better to get the disease.

[golfing eagles]

Israeli studies (pretty much the gold standard) say otherwise...

They also say that Natural Immunity PLUS the Vaccination is MUCH better than either alone...

I would think that goes without saying

[Wyseguy]

This guy is a British pharmacologist who gained media attention for making false claims about Covid. He is a notorious anti-vaxxer.

Can you tell me some of his false claims?

[Wyseguy]

Please post that 1,000 times for the _________(fill in the blank) who think it is better to get the disease.

They do so if you repeat a lie often enough those who let others think for them will believe it.

[Wyseguy]

Dr. Marty Makary, a professor at John Hopkins School of Medicine, said individuals formerly infected with COVID-19 are seven times more likely then vaccinated people to fight off the virus.

“It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body’s immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus,” Dr. Makary said. “Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system.”

Dr. Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.

“One of the great failures of our medical leadership has been ignoring the half of America with natural immunity.”

[golfing eagles]

They do so if you repeat a lie often enough those who let others think for them will believe it.

All I can say is that I applaud the individual who has the intelligence, education, and resources to do his own 5,000+ patient, multi-centered, double blinded, placebo controlled study and the facilities to correlate and interpret all the data so that he can "come to his own conclusions and think for himself" I have yet to meet that individual, but based on some of the posts on this thread, there must not only be people who think that person exists, but also think that they ARE that person.

[Wyseguy]

Res ipsa loquitur

Sapere aude

[golfing eagles]

Sapere aude

I already know.

[Wyseguy]

All I can say is that I applaud the individual who has the intelligence, education, and resources to do his own 5,000+ patient, multi-centered, double blinded, placebo controlled study and the facilities to correlate and interpret all the data so that he can "come to his own conclusions and think for himself" I have yet to meet that individual, but based on some of the posts on this thread, there must not only be people who think that person exists, but also think that they ARE that person.

Or someone can look at studies performed in the UK, Israel and the US, take that data, compare the results and if they differ use his own common sense to decide which is best for him. I know you realize the "experts" have not only contradicted each other, but themselves. Some are happy to follow the governments appointed leader, others like to read as much info as they can and decide what is best for their specific circumstance. It really is not that difficult to read several different studies and viewpoints. Even someone whose standard is to follow Fauci (Blessed be Fauci) reads the study (true only one) and decide to go with it. He/she does not actually duplicate the study.

[golfing eagles]

Or someone can look at studies performed in the UK, Israel and the US, take that data, compare the results and if they differ use his own common sense to decide which is best for him.

If they held at least a masters degree in mathematics, with a concentration in statistics and experience collating data from multiple scientific and medical studies, I would be inclined to give that person credibility.

Anyone relying on their own "common sense" is deluding themselves

PS: I can prescribe the appropriate medication for a person suffering from such a delusion:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

PPS: I have no idea why I get dragged into debates with rank amateurs

[Wyseguy]

If they held at least a masters degree in mathematics, with a concentration in statistics and experience collating data from multiple scientific and medical studies, I would be inclined to give that person credibility.

Anyone relying on their own "common sense" is deluding themselves

PS: I can prescribe the appropriate medication for a person suffering from such a delusion:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

PPS: I have no idea why I get dragged into debates with rank amateurs

Were you dragged? Seems like you charge in on your own will. I will not "hint" at my degrees, that is so common and sophomoric .

[kenoc7]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.
If you didn't know masks are required in airports you must have been living under a rock.

Booster is available for those over 65.

Crossing the border from Canada to the USA is like being in two different worlds - masks in Canada, few masks in the USA. I know the world I prefer!

[Two Bills]

Can you tell me some of his false claims?

World depopulation plot springs to mind.

[golfing eagles]

Were you dragged? Seems like you charge in on your own will. I will not "hint" at my degrees, that is so common and sophomoric .

Oh please, be common and sophomoric. I'm sure most of those who posted on this thread would be interested in the qualifications needed to make some of the statements that were made. Or is it all "common sense"?????:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

Please post that 1,000 times for the _________(fill in the blank) who think it is better to get the disease.

I don't think it's better to get the disease, even though I contracted Covid (from a patient), some 20 months ago... When the vaccine came out (almost a year later), after consulting with my physician, I went ahead and had the two shots (Moderna).

But I do think my natural antibodies will last longer and be more effective than the vaccine (per the Israeli studies)...

I was luck. I had an EXTREMELY mild case (only 36 hrs of a low grade (99.5°) fever, mild body aches, chills and a slight cough). I was tired for a few days afterwards.

Even with that, I would never suggest that it's better to roll the dice and get Covid, rather than get the vaccine...

Will I get a booster? I dunno'... I'll see what the literature shows when and if Moderna is approved for a booster shot...

[JMintzer]

Res ipsa loquitur

Sapere aude

In Vino Veratis

But what do I know? It's all Greek to me... :icon_wink:

[golfing eagles]

In Vino Veratis

But what do I know? It's all Greek to me... :icon_wink:

Latin:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

(I know you knew that)

[JMintzer]

If they held at least a masters degree in mathematics, with a concentration in statistics and experience collating data from multiple scientific and medical studies, I would be inclined to give that person credibility.

Anyone relying on their own "common sense" is deluding themselves

PS: I can prescribe the appropriate medication for a person suffering from such a delusion:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

PPS: I have no idea why I get dragged into debates with rank amateurs

Please, I am a "Commisioned" Amateur! I have the stripes and the hardware to prove it! :1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

Latin:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

(I know you knew that)

But did I? :highfive:

[Wyseguy]

Oh please, be common and sophomoric. I'm sure most of those who posted on this thread would be interested in the qualifications needed to make some of the statements that were made. Or is it all "common sense"?????:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

My experience has shown me degrees do not automatically give one common sense. Some of the most foolish people I ever met were in my post graduate studies, while my greatest influence had only a HS diploma. You can have all of the education in the world, but without sense you can end up being a danger to yourself and others. I will leave out the basic silly memes.

[golfing eagles]

Please, I am a "Commisioned" Amateur! I have the stripes and the hardware to prove it! :1rotfl:

And you're a surgeon with a doctorate. I think that trumps some of the rather ignorant posts that some have made.

[golfing eagles]

My experience has shown me degrees do not automatically give one common sense. Some of the most foolish people I ever met were in my post graduate studies, while my greatest influence had only a HS diploma. You can have all of the education in the world, but without sense you can end up being a danger to yourself and others. I will leave out the basic silly memes.

So, in other words, its all "common sense" Thought so:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

And you're a surgeon with a doctorate. I think that trumps some of the rather ignorant posts that some have made.

Hey! Leave the "Orange Guy" out of this! :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Oh, I almost forgot... My original reply was "No, I am an EXCEPTIONAL Amateur!" (A nod to Hand Gruber in "Die Hard"...)

[golfing eagles]

Hey! Leave the "Orange Guy" out of this! :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Oh, I almost forgot... My original reply was "No, I am an EXCEPTIONAL Amateur!" (A nod to Hand Gruber in "Die Hard"...)

I hope not. He was "Eurotrash":1rotfl:

[Altavia]

+++1

[Wyseguy]

So, in other words, its all "common sense" Thought so:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Reading comprehension must not be required for a "Surgeon" with a doctorate .

[golfing eagles]

Reading comprehension must not be required for a "Surgeon" with a doctorate .

I don't know, you'd have to ask that poster who is a surgeon, since I am not one. But I would imagine it is.

[JMintzer]

I hope not. He was "Eurotrash":1rotfl:

Yeah, according to that cokehead Ellis... Look at what happened to him!

[JMintzer]

Reading comprehension must not be required for a "Surgeon" with a doctorate .

Hey, leave me out of this!

[Malsua]

Yeah, according to that cokehead Ellis... Look at what happened to him!

Yeah, I read about it last week in Forbes.

[golfing eagles]

Yeah, I read about it last week in Forbes.

Wasn't that "Asian Dawn"???????

[jimjamuser]

My eyes were opened today as I picked up my son at Orlando's MCO airport. We entered the airport unaware that masks are required. We were among the few that were unmasked. No one challenged us but we honestly did not know. Last time we were there in April that requirement did not exist.

We then went to Mallory country club for dinner and no one was wearing a mask.

Today I read that the Phizor Covid vaccination are quickly losing their effectiveness after 6 months Wasn't the delay in getting approval due to FDA requirements to insure that longer range effectiveness was achieved? Is this the same as Moderna and J & J?

Is the Booster shot approved by FDA? How long is it effective.

Is actual occurrence of COVID 19 providing better protection than the inoculations? If so , why does that not allow for continuance of work rather than firing for not getting inoculation?

Not a lot of clear informed instruction and communication.
The FDA has approved the Pfizer booster shot. How long it IS effective for is yet to be determined. It COULD become an every 6-month thing (?). if that would bother some people (in the US, not Portugal with a 98% vaccine rate) - then they need to blame the anti-vaxxers (I say put them all in a separate prison)!
And NO ! Having gotten CV you should also get a vaccine. Because only a very FEW vaccinated people have virus quantity in their nose similar to that of Unvaccinated ex-covid-recovered people. Normally, the covid-recovered have more virus. And THEY are going around society willy-nilly (whatever that means) and smiling at you as they give you CV. Happy days, they say, as the give an Unvaccinated person the disease. And the UNvaccinated CV-recovered don't wear special shirts that say "stay 10 feet away from me", I have CV in my nose and I don't give a damn!
......The CV-recovered often THEMSELVES lose protection rapidly after 2 months - the idea about lifetime CV immunity is a DREAM-MYTH. I don't know who or where THAT BS started. Bottom line ......get your CV vaccinations people! Please!

[golfing eagles]

The FDA has approved the Pfizer booster shot. How long it IS effective for is yet to be determined. It COULD become an every 6-month thing (?). if that would bother some people (in the US, not Portugal with a 98% vaccine rate) - then they need to blame the anti-vaxxers (I say put them all in a separate prison)!
And NO ! Having gotten CV you should also get a vaccine. Because only a very FEW vaccinated people have virus quantity in their nose similar to that of Unvaccinated ex-covid-recovered people. Normally, the covid-recovered have more virus. And THEY are going around society willy-nilly (whatever that means) and smiling at you as they give you CV. Happy days, they say, as the give an Unvaccinated person the disease. And the UNvaccinated CV-recovered don't wear special shirts that say "stay 10 feet away from me", I have CV in my nose and I don't give a damn!
......The CV-recovered often THEMSELVES lose protection rapidly after 2 months - the idea about lifetime CV immunity is a DREAM-MYTH. I don't know who or where THAT BS started. Bottom line ......get your CV vaccinations people! Please!

Probably your best post ever!!!!!:bigbow::bigbow::bigbow:

[jimjamuser]

It is my understanding, from the CDC (albeit quietly published) that fully vaccinated people can get Covid and transmit Covid. This is contrary to what our Administration stated 2 months ago. If ANYONE says they 'know about Covid,' that is a lie. No one knows. Some say it's safe. They 'think' it's safe but they don't know it's safe. I want to see the 20 year study on > 1 million people to determine, i.e. long-term effects.
No one knows - we are all in the dark.
In general, NOT true! And as far as "fully vaccinated' people getting CV and transmitting CV......that IS TRUE....BUT only for a SMALL number of people. And the vaccinated ones that get CV have lessor symptoms and don't DIE! Not dying IS CERTAINLY advantageous to the individual and it DENIES the Virus additional opportunities to MUTATE - thus benefiting all of society and mankind! (or mancruel in the US) (NOT Portugal with 98 % vaccine rate) So, now tell me to move to Portugal - that is SSSSOOOO original.
The CV virus IS in decline right now, some experts say it will continue that way. Some say NO, CV is in a 2-month cycle up and down. Others say it will rise due to the school children being back. So, this last part IS actually NOT certain yet. But, there are many certainties NOW KNOWN and the superiority of getting vaccinated is one of them. To be informed one must stay off of Facebook and avoid Russian propaganda sites and TV channels pushing dark misinformation! And stay on normal, traditional ABC, CBS, NPR, CNN, and MSNBC.

[jimjamuser]

Your attempt at humor failed. 😝
I laughed, I'm easy...... like Sunday morning.

[SkBlogW]

The FDA has approved the Pfizer booster shot. How long it IS effective for is yet to be determined. It COULD become an every 6-month thing (?). if that would bother some people (in the US, not Portugal with a 98% vaccine rate) - then they need to blame the anti-vaxxers (I say put them all in a separate prison)!
And NO ! Having gotten CV you should also get a vaccine. Because only a very FEW vaccinated people have virus quantity in their nose similar to that of Unvaccinated ex-covid-recovered people. Normally, the covid-recovered have more virus. And THEY are going around society willy-nilly (whatever that means) and smiling at you as they give you CV. Happy days, they say, as the give an Unvaccinated person the disease. And the UNvaccinated CV-recovered don't wear special shirts that say "stay 10 feet away from me", I have CV in my nose and I don't give a damn!
......The CV-recovered often THEMSELVES lose protection rapidly after 2 months - the idea about lifetime CV immunity is a DREAM-MYTH. I don't know who or where THAT BS started. Bottom line ......get your CV vaccinations people! Please!

LOL

Maybe that natural immunity myth started at the NIH

"The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection."

Lasting immunity found after recovery from COVID-19 | National Institutes of Health (NIH) (https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/lasting-immunity-found-after-recovery-covid-19)

Or maybe the Israeli Department of Health started it

A new Israeli study on coronavirus immunity suggests that people who were previously infected with the virus benefit from significantly stronger and longer-lasting immunity than the immunity provided by vaccination alone.

This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity. Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant..

91048

[jimjamuser]

Correct. Those in communist led countries must follow the mandates or face the consequences.
But, which communist country are we supposed to hate. About 6 years ago it was Russian - now it is China. Russia MUST have turned democratic when I wasn't looking! Maybe I am supposed to hate California, but not Texas? Goodness, make up MY mind please!

[jimjamuser]

If you didn't know masks are required in airports you must have been living under a rock.

Booster is available for those over 65.

Crossing the border from Canada to the USA is like being in two different worlds - masks in Canada, few masks in the USA. I know the world I prefer!
I agree with the excellent content of this post!

[JMintzer]

Probably your best post ever!!!!!:bigbow::bigbow::bigbow:

Shirley you jest!

[golfing eagles]

Shirley you jest!

Stop calling me Shirley:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

And stay on normal, traditional ABC, CBS, NPR, CNN, and MSNBC.

:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl: Deep breath:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

LOL

Maybe that natural immunity myth started at the NIH

"The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection."

Lasting immunity found after recovery from COVID-19 | National Institutes of Health (NIH) (https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/lasting-immunity-found-after-recovery-covid-19)

Or maybe the Israeli Department of Health started it

A new Israeli study on coronavirus immunity suggests that people who were previously infected with the virus benefit from significantly stronger and longer-lasting immunity than the immunity provided by vaccination alone.

This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity. Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant..

91048

Do you know the reason they stated 8 months?

It was because they ONLY HAD 8 MONTHS OF DATA!

[SkBlogW]

Do you know the reason they stated 8 months?

It was because they ONLY HAD 8 MONTHS OF DATA!

Yep, Israel data showing strong protection 18 months after infection.

[Malsua]

Yep, Israel data showing strong protection 18 months after infection.

So the data I'd like to see, and that which is not knowable at this time is how robust is the immune response for people who get a the monoclonal antibody treatment? Then further break that response out to the three different shots and unvaxxed.

It'd be great if there is long lasting protection after infection for anyone who gets symptomatic infection even if they get a MAT or pill version of an anti-viral. I.e. just ramp up the therapeutics and treat to get a solid sterilizing immunity in the widest possible cohort. Not saying vaccines don't have a place, just saying it's not the way out since the immune response is inferior.

[jimjamuser]

Oh please, be common and sophomoric. I'm sure most of those who posted on this thread would be interested in the qualifications needed to make some of the statements that were made. Or is it all "common sense"?????:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
Yes, by all means, let us get into a MACHO debate about whose credentials are BIGGER than the others. Que es MAS macho? Hombres! That would be a GREAT learning experience for us in terms of current CRITICAL events.

[SkBlogW]

So the data I'd like to see, and that which is not knowable at this time is how robust is the immune response for people who get a the monoclonal antibody treatment? Then further break that response out to the three different shots and unvaxxed.

It'd be great if there is long lasting protection after infection for anyone who gets symptomatic infection even if they get a MAT or pill version of an anti-viral. I.e. just ramp up the therapeutics and treat to get a solid sterilizing immunity in the widest possible cohort. Not saying vaccines don't have a place, just saying it's not the way out since the immune response is inferior.

Yes that would be interesting. The Israeli data on protection levels for vaxed unvaxed and covid survivors is quite interesting. The only categories with 90% plus risk prevention are vaxed plus booster, covid survivor, and covid survivor with one shot.

I'd much rather get on a plane with people in those three categories than those vaxed more than 6 months ago or the unvaxed.

91058

[jimjamuser]

My experience has shown me degrees do not automatically give one common sense. Some of the most foolish people I ever met were in my post graduate studies, while my greatest influence had only a HS diploma. You can have all of the education in the world, but without sense you can end up being a danger to yourself and others. I will leave out the basic silly memes.
I agree and wasn't that guy Jesus of Nazzatith without a degree? And he was pretty popular once. And yes, I agree that the 3rd-grade children get restless before lunch and ONLY a few good memes can command their attention. The poor kids are starved for something......confidence.....need for distractions......maturity......self-image.....narcism.......father figure .......whatever......anybody?......anybody?

Always remember, "THIS train I'll stop in Took_cum_car_ree !"

[jimjamuser]

And you're a surgeon with a doctorate. I think that trumps some of the rather ignorant posts that some have made.
Now you have done it - I will forever have Hospiphobia (the fear of hospitals and surgery). One must remember words have consequences! If I need surgery, I think I might just do it myself. Must be pretty easy if we have an example - I'll bet I can find some do-it-yourself surgery videos on Youtube! If I am unsuccessful please get out that RIP stone to MEMORIALIZE me! Sing along boys.....and girlies....." you KNOW you're gonna miss me when I'm gone".
.....better to die from the self-scalpel than after a long bout in the hospital from CV - that sounds like the ultimate painful experience......right up there with spending an eternity in Hell and seeing reruns of the Trucker Ralston destroy freedom show.

[jimjamuser]

Reading comprehension must not be required for a "Surgeon" with a doctorate .
I agree with the content of this post!

[jimjamuser]

I don't know, you'd have to ask that poster who is a surgeon, since I am not one. But I would imagine it is.
Sounds to me like there is a Doctor's union or club for some needed emotional growth. A pretty esoteric group!!!!!!

[jimjamuser]

Hey, leave me out of this!
If ONLY? My prayers would be answered and I am an atheist.

[Malsua]

Yes that would be interesting. The Israeli data on protection levels for vaxed unvaxed and covid survivors is quite interesting. The only categories with 90% plus risk prevention are vaxed plus booster, covid survivor, and covid survivor with one shot.

I'd much rather get on a plane with people in those three categories than those vaxed more than 6 months ago or the unvaxed.

91058

All that is definitely showing that covid + a vax is gold star immunity.

What I'd like to know is how attenuating to the immune response are the therapies? One would think that if the body clears the virus early, the immune response may not be as complete.

Is there any data suggesting that people who've had the MAT that have had to go back for seconds at some point in the future? That's no something I've seen and it may be a great sign that you get a strong response. That's much preferred to that pesky risk of going into a hospital and getting pumped full of kidney failure and liver insult, a.k.a Remdesivir.

[jimjamuser]

Wasn't that "Asian Dawn"???????
Judging by the current state of American influence, chaos, mental toughness, togetherness and teamwork, cooperation, states engaging in cooperation and just overall PATRIOTISM, we may be inviting an "Asian Dawn" similar to the movie, "Red Dawn"! WE have the GREATEST wealth disparity in US history and the GREATEST of all free Western nations.
WE destroyed the world's greatest threat to FREEDOM in WW2. AND now today we can't beat back a little, could be (?) insignificant Virus because of our stupidity at believing in the false gods of Facebook and dark media disinformation and Russian propaganda about Covid - thus causing MASS Covid Confusion! Portugal started later than the US, but they now have a 98% CV vaccination rate. And WE are toast! WE probably can NOT even keep the schools open all year. And, I know cases are decreasing but there IS this unknown 2month CV cycle to consider.

[Malsua]

we may be inviting an "Asian Dawn" similar to the movie, "Red Dawn"!

Wow, that reference to the greatest Christmas movie of all time went flying over your head at supersonic speeds.

[JMintzer]

I agree and wasn't that guy Jesus of Nazzatith without a degree? And he was pretty popular once. And yes, I agree that the 3rd-grade children get restless before lunch and ONLY a few good memes can command their attention. The poor kids are starved for something......confidence.....need for distractions......maturity......self-image.....narcism.......father figure .......whatever......anybody?......anybody?

Always remember, "THIS train I'll stop in Took_cum_car_ree !"

Now you have done it - I will forever have Hospiphobia (the fear of hospitals and surgery). One must remember words have consequences! If I need surgery, I think I might just do it myself. Must be pretty easy if we have an example - I'll bet I can find some do-it-yourself surgery videos on Youtube! If I am unsuccessful please get out that RIP stone to MEMORIALIZE me! Sing along boys.....and girlies....." you KNOW you're gonna miss me when I'm gone.
.....better to die from the self-scalpel than after a long bout in the hospital from CV - that sounds like the ultimate painful experience......right up there with spending an eternity in Hell and seeing reruns of the Trucker Ralston destroy freedom show.

I agree with the content of this post!

Sounds to me like there is a Doctor's union or club for some needed emotional growth. A pretty esoteric group!!!!!!

If ONLY? My prayers would be answered and I am an atheist.

More passive/aggressive musings...

[JMintzer]

Judging by the current state of American influence, chaos, mental toughness, togetherness and teamwork, cooperation, states engaging in cooperation and just overall PATRIOTISM, we may be inviting an "Asian Dawn" similar to the movie, "Red Dawn"! WE have the GREATEST wealth disparity in US history and the GREATEST of all free Western nations.
WE destroyed the world's greatest threat to FREEDOM in WW2. AND now today we can't beat back a little, could be (?) insignificant Virus because of our stupidity at believing in the false gods of Facebook and dark media disinformation and Russian propaganda about Covid - thus causing MASS Covid Confusion! Portugal started later than the US, but they now have a 98% CV vaccination rate. And WE are toast! WE probably can NOT even keep the schools open all year. And, I know cases are decreasing but there IS this unknown 2month CV cycle to consider.

Portugal is no where near 98%. Your repetition of false info is harmful...

As to your other musing... Huh?

[golfing eagles]

Sounds to me like there is a Doctor's union or club for some needed emotional growth. A pretty esoteric group!!!!!!

Yes, and you're not invited:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[Nucky]

Forget about the mask----where's the pastrami truck??????

Hey Doc, if you were going to pick up a loaner car at any car dealership and you saw a real schifoosa drop off the car 5 minutes before you could be the next driver, are you crazy for masking up or wearing gloves? Just wondering. All those dirty azz chromosomes all over the car.

Conversely you could wait for the car to be washed up by a reputable looking non schfoosa type person and feel comfortable to not wear a mask or gloves and still get sick?

Send the bill to Barefoot, :1rotfl: Thanks.

[jimjamuser]

Wow, that reference to the greatest Christmas movie of all time went flying over your head at supersonic speeds.
Never saw it. The only Xmas story that I ever watched involved Scrooge and, "God bless us all", said tiny dude. And the about, "you'll shoot your eye out" and " I got a major award"!

[jimjamuser]

.....Catch a flying reference
put it in your pocket
and save it for a rainy day
......True love will come
and slap away your deference

[jimjamuser]

OK, iI thought of a good one, actually 2. Billy Bob Bad boy good actor Thorton in, "Bad Santa #1 and #2.

[jimjamuser]

Wow, that reference to the greatest Christmas movie of all time went flying over your head at supersonic speeds.
Sorry, my bad for being xmas movie illiterate. I remember the rich guy Scrooge (he liked shifting taxes onto the poor) and a Tiny boy that said "God bless us all". And the one about, "you'll shoot your eye out" and it's beautiful, it's a MAJOR AWARD!. And the Bumpasse's dogs.

[jimjamuser]

More passive/aggressive musings...
What no meme or inane photo? I'm not deserving of even that? I will put on my surgeon's mask against CV - can I join the Doctor's Club? Maybe like the "Breakfast Club"? I am NOT trying to be MEME - it just comes naturally!
I am the meme
that's on the beam
That's Jim Beam
no wonder I am always laughing
and rolling around !

[Malsua]

Sorry, my bad for being xmas movie illiterate. I remember the rich guy Scrooge (he liked shifting taxes onto the poor) and a Tiny boy that said "God bless us all". And the one about, "you'll shoot your eye out" and it's beautiful, it's a MAJOR AWARD!. And the Bumpasse's dogs.

Well, I'm somewhat facetiously referring to Die Hard, the 1986 action movie that changed the action genre as a Christmas movie. It _is_ a Christmas movie in that it takes place at Christmas time, it has a Christmas party as a major part of it and there's plenty of Christmas music in it. It is of course, a hotly debated topic as to it's Christmas cred.

Who can forget "Now I have a machine gun, Ho Ho Ho" complete with a dead terrorist wearing a Santa hat? Or maybe Ellis giving Holly Genero(Holly another reference) a Rolex as a present?

Even at the end, John uses Christmas ribbons to hold his gun, as if he's waiting to give a present to Hans. He does of course, a Christmas eve plummet about 30 stories. A free ride you might say, his final gift to Hans, the best terrorist of all time and an exceptional thief.

[jimjamuser]

Portugal is no where near 98%. Your repetition of false info is harmful...

As to your other musing... Huh?
au contraire! 98% CV vaccination rate. Highest in the world. Also, Sudia Arabia is 98%. Check it out and weep.....anyone anyway. And DO "cry for me Argentina" because they are dying at a rate in line with the US....BAD
.......I stand by my posts! Like a Foreign Legion Soldier.

[golfing eagles]

Hey Doc, if you were going to pick up a loaner car at any car dealership and you saw a real schifoosa drop off the car 5 minutes before you could be the next driver, are you crazy for masking up or wearing gloves? Just wondering. All those dirty azz chromosomes all over the car.

Conversely you could wait for the car to be washed up by a reputable looking non schfoosa type person and feel comfortable to not wear a mask or gloves and still get sick?

Send the bill to Barefoot, :1rotfl: Thanks.

Probably. Surface to human transmission is just about zero, so unless the "schifoosa" spit all over the car and it was still wet, gloves would not be needed. Likewise, any droplets that he might have spewed out in the car will drop out of suspension pretty quick, so a mask is also unnecessary. But it's probably a moot point since the rental company won't sent a car out until it has been "disinfected"

Now Barefoot owes me two lobsters:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[jimjamuser]

Yes, and you're not invited:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
Darn and I have been brushing up on my Latin and other dead languages. And I have been practicing........while singing the song...."I've been working on my 9 iron
all the livelong day
I've been working on my nine iron
just to pass the time away
complaining about rough fairways
and mostly my scorecard lies
my golf car exhaust stinks
as does my score on the links
and we hate those liberals
we call them all RAT-FINKS

[golfing eagles]

Darn and I have been brushing up on my Latin and other dead languages. And I have been practicing........while singing the song...."I've been working on my 9 iron
all the livelong day
I've been working on my nine iron
just to pass the time away
complaining about rough fairways
and mostly my scorecard lies
my golf car exhaust stinks
as does my score on the links
and we hate those liberals
we call them all RAT-FINKS

OK, you can be a provisional member:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

But you'll have to wear a beanie hat with a propeller :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[jimjamuser]

Well, I'm somewhat facetiously referring to Die Hard, the 1986 action movie that changed the action genre as a Christmas movie. It _is_ a Christmas movie in that it takes place at Christmas time, it has a Christmas party as a major part of it and there's plenty of Christmas music in it. It is of course, a hotly debated topic as to it's Christmas cred.

Who can forget "Now I have a machine gun, Ho Ho Ho" complete with a dead terrorist wearing a Santa hat? Or maybe Ellis giving Holly Genero(Holly another reference) a Rolex as a present?

Even at the end, John uses Christmas ribbons to hold his gun, as if he's waiting to give a present to Hans. He does of course, a Christmas eve plummet about 30 stories. A free ride you might say, his final gift to Hans, the best terrorist of all time and an exceptional thief.
OK yes, I liked his 1st couple of Die Hard movies - then for me they started to become mediocre and repetitive. Many a movie series becomes its own worst enemy due to its initial success, which it can then, in the future, never surpass.
If you have Amazon Prime a sure thing is "Leave No Trace". A great mystery genre movie recently out is, "Knives Out" with Daniel Craig. And great sleeper movie that IS NOT for everybody is, "Attack the Block" a very English type of movie. Not the usual fare for most Americans, but GREAT for those that can find appreciation in it!
Billy Bob Thorton's Goliath 4th year series about cocaine-based pharmacy-sold legal pain pills is GREAT! Pretty soon there should be some CV movies coming out - and they may even focus-in on the confusion associated with it in the US. And maybe even reference the 98% CV vaccination rate of Portugal. I would love to see that one!

[NoMoSno]

au contraire! 98% CV vaccination rate. Highest in the world. Also, Sudia Arabia is 98%. Check it out and weep.....anyone anyway. And DO "cry for me Argentina" because they are dying at a rate in line with the US....BAD
.......I stand by my posts! Like a Foreign Legion Soldier.
You are misinformed.
Portugal 84.1%
Saudi Arabia 54.9%
as of yesterday:
portugal vaccination rate - Google Search (https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=portugal+vaccination+rate)
You must be watching those Russian propaganda news shows.

[jimjamuser]

OK, you can be a provisional member:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

But you'll have to wear a beanie hat with a propeller :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
Gladly, just to get my foot in the door. Beanie One so true, I love you. You're like a cat in my hat. a softball for my bat, Beanie One so true I love you!.............................who put that furball in my hat......that's NOT funny!

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

au contraire! 98% CV vaccination rate. Highest in the world. Also, Sudia Arabia is 98%. Check it out and weep.....anyone anyway. And DO "cry for me Argentina" because they are dying at a rate in line with the US....BAD
.......I stand by my posts! Like a Foreign Legion Soldier.
We are called legionnaires, member First Foreign Parachute Battalion , Vietnam/ Algeria First Foreign parachute Regiment Algeria

[jaj523]

If two experts disagree, the problem is deciding which one to believe. It doesn't mean one is a liar, and the other is telling the truth. The citizenry should be able to listen to the arguments of experts who disagree and make up their own minds. Maybe both scientists have found a truth. The government/Big Brother should NOT be the one to decide which one is legitimate and which one isn't. There is no such thing as "the science." Scientific truth evolves as time passes. (Are masks helpful or not? Do COVID survivors need to be vaccinated? Which vaccine is better.? etc. etc.) In the meantime, we need for the scientists to continue to research and to report on what they find to the scientific community and the public. And ALL of that research needs to be available to the public.

[golfing eagles]

If two experts disagree, the problem is deciding which one to believe. It doesn't mean one is a liar, and the other is telling the truth. The citizenry should be able to listen to the arguments of experts who disagree and make up their own minds. Maybe both scientists have found a truth. The government/Big Brother should NOT be the one to decide which one is legitimate and which one isn't. There is no such thing as "the science." Scientific truth evolves as time passes. (Are masks helpful or not? Do COVID survivors need to be vaccinated? Which vaccine is better.? etc. etc.) In the meantime, we need for the scientists to continue to research and to report on what they find to the scientific community and the public. And ALL of that research needs to be available to the public.

And on what basis is the average person supposed to "make up their own mind"?

I believe there are 2 competing versions of string theory---one has 13 spatial and one temporal dimension, the other 27 spatial and 2 temporal dimensions. I could read everything ever written by the experts that "disagree" on which is correct, and not have a clue, because I don't have the background or education in quantum physics and the math that goes with it. So trying to "make up my own mind" would be useless.

Same thing with all the COVID research. Non-professionals have some familiarity with medical issues usually through an experience or two, but in no way does that make them any more qualified to "make up their own mind" than it would for string theory.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

[JMintzer]

Wow, that reference to the greatest Christmas movie of all time went flying over your head at supersonic speeds.

:bigbow::bigbow::bigbow:

[JMintzer]

What no meme or inane photo? I'm not deserving of even that? I will put on my surgeon's mask against CV - can I join the Doctor's Club? Maybe like the "Breakfast Club"? I am NOT trying to be MEME - it just comes naturally!
I am the meme
that's on the beam
That's Jim Beam
no wonder I am always laughing
and rolling around !

https://c.tenor.com/KXTPLQvQRPoAAAAC/caddyshack-judge.gif

[JMintzer]

au contraire! 98% CV vaccination rate. Highest in the world. Also, Sudia Arabia is 98%. Check it out and weep.....anyone anyway. And DO "cry for me Argentina" because they are dying at a rate in line with the US....BAD
.......I stand by my posts! Like a Foreign Legion Soldier.

I did check it out. And you're wrong (again)... It's 84%

potrugal vaccination rate - Google Search (https://www.google.com/search?q=potrugal+vaccination+rate&rlz=1C5CHFA_enUS873US874&oq=potrugal+vaccination+rate&aqs=chrome..69i57j0i13l7j0i22i30j0i10i22i30.12336j 0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8)

[JMintzer]

OK yes, I liked his 1st couple of Die Hard movies - then for me they started to become mediocre and repetitive. Many a movie series becomes its own worst enemy due to its initial success, which it can then, in the future, never surpass.
If you have Amazon Prime a sure thing is "Leave No Trace". A great mystery genre movie recently out is, "Knives Out" with Daniel Craig. And great sleeper movie that IS NOT for everybody is, "Attack the Block" a very English type of movie. Not the usual fare for most Americans, but GREAT for those that can find appreciation in it!
Billy Bob Thorton's Goliath 4th year series about cocaine-based pharmacy-sold legal pain pills is GREAT! Pretty soon there should be some CV movies coming out - and they may even focus-in on the confusion associated with it in the US. And maybe even reference the 98% CV vaccination rate of Portugal. I would love to see that one!

So now you admit you DID see the movie...

Man, you're all over the place... No wonder all of your stats are wrong...

[Byte1]

So now you admit you DID see the movie...

Man, you're all over the place... No wonder all of your stats are wrong...

Me thinks that an alcoholic beverage might be at work. I don't think I have seen such a display of blindly bumping into solid objects since watching Mr. Magoo as a kid. :1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

au contraire! 98% CV vaccination rate. Highest in the world. Also, Sudia Arabia is 98%. Check it out and weep.....anyone anyway. And DO "cry for me Argentina" because they are dying at a rate in line with the US....BAD
.......I stand by my posts! Like a Foreign Legion Soldier.

And btw, I just checked in the Saudi Vaccination rate... No where near your claimed 98%...

As of 10/5, it's 55.2% (fully vaccinated)...

So, I'm not weeping, I'm laughing...

[jimjamuser]

We are called legionnaires, member First Foreign Parachute Battalion , Vietnam/ Algeria First Foreign parachute Regiment Algeria
OK, I am now corrected. Now I don't stand by my post about standing by my post. I was just going by the layman's understanding of the French Foreign Legion, which I got from a few movies that mentioned them. My sorry!!!!!!!

[jimjamuser]

If two experts disagree, the problem is deciding which one to believe. It doesn't mean one is a liar, and the other is telling the truth. The citizenry should be able to listen to the arguments of experts who disagree and make up their own minds. Maybe both scientists have found a truth. The government/Big Brother should NOT be the one to decide which one is legitimate and which one isn't. There is no such thing as "the science." Scientific truth evolves as time passes. (Are masks helpful or not? Do COVID survivors need to be vaccinated? Which vaccine is better.? etc. etc.) In the meantime, we need for the scientists to continue to research and to report on what they find to the scientific community and the public. And ALL of that research needs to be available to the public.
With respect to "the Government/Big Brother should not get to decide which one is legitimate". WWWEEEELLLLLL, WE, here in the US of A do pledge allegiance to America every day in grade and high school. And we are required to register for a possible military call to arms. And we do vote every 4 years for President. And the Federal Government defends our stupid as*es from ALL enemies, foreign or DOMESTIC. So, YES....BIG YES the government DOES GET TO DECIDE which one is legitimate. To FEEL and THINK otherwise is subjective ANARCHY!!!!!!

[jimjamuser]

And on what basis is the average person supposed to "make up their own mind"?

I believe there are 2 competing versions of string theory---one has 13 spatial and one temporal dimension, the other 27 spatial and 2 temporal dimensions. I could read everything ever written by the experts that "disagree" on which is correct, and not have a clue, because I don't have the background or education in quantum physics and the math that goes with it. So trying to "make up my own mind" would be useless.

Same thing with all the COVID research. Non-professionals have some familiarity with medical issues usually through an experience or two, but in no way does that make them any more qualified to "make up their own mind" than it would for string theory.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
Exactly, best, most logical post ever. .....and a better analogy than I could EVER dream of.....Kudos!!!!!!

[jimjamuser]

And on what basis is the average person supposed to "make up their own mind"?

I believe there are 2 competing versions of string theory---one has 13 spatial and one temporal dimension, the other 27 spatial and 2 temporal dimensions. I could read everything ever written by the experts that "disagree" on which is correct, and not have a clue, because I don't have the background or education in quantum physics and the math that goes with it. So trying to "make up my own mind" would be useless.

Same thing with all the COVID research. Non-professionals have some familiarity with medical issues usually through an experience or two, but in no way does that make them any more qualified to "make up their own mind" than it would for string theory.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
Now if the question or subject were - "do you approve of twerking, yes or no" or "do you believe that the earth is ruled by God or the Devil?" Yes or no. Then, since those are ambiguous, gray areas, each person's opinion carries about the same weight. But, in our original discussion, we have thousands and thousands of worldwide medical experts whose opinion when synthesized together represent one SOLID point of view VERSUS some random cowboy's opinion somewhere - I choose the Science and the Federal Government (knowing that nothing is perfectly-perfect!

[jimjamuser]

And on what basis is the average person supposed to "make up their own mind"?

I believe there are 2 competing versions of string theory---one has 13 spatial and one temporal dimension, the other 27 spatial and 2 temporal dimensions. I could read everything ever written by the experts that "disagree" on which is correct, and not have a clue, because I don't have the background or education in quantum physics and the math that goes with it. So trying to "make up my own mind" would be useless.

Same thing with all the COVID research. Non-professionals have some familiarity with medical issues usually through an experience or two, but in no way does that make them any more qualified to "make up their own mind" than it would for string theory.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
Yes, I ALWAYS rely on "string theory" and contemplate it as I play tennis. Tennis anyone? Anyone?

[jimjamuser]

https://c.tenor.com/KXTPLQvQRPoAAAAC/caddyshack-judge.gif
Help!!!!!! Stop I'm getting dizzy and I had a great lunch!

[golfing eagles]

Yes, I ALWAYS rely on "string theory" and contemplate it as I play tennis. Tennis anyone? Anyone?

As long as you get your racket "restrung" on a regular basis:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

But , as you know, and I can think of 4 or 5 posters off the top of my head, there are those that will argue "they do their own research and make up their own minds" These are the people that will be sitting at their PC googling "cat 5 hurricane" or "nuclear detonation radius" while all their neighbors have evacuated on the advice of the "experts":1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[golfing eagles]

Exactly, best, most logical post ever. .....and a better analogy than I could EVER dream of.....Kudos!!!!!!

TY. You're not so bad after all:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:, so don't move to Portugal.

[JMintzer]

TY. You're not so bad after all:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:, so don't move to Portugal.

Why not? I hear their vaccination rates are 98%! :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[fishon]

If the Secretary for Heath can identify as a female, I’ll identify as vaccinated.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

My brother-in-law just got out of rehab yesterday, he has been hospitalized since late January with Covid most of the time in intensive care with Covid , he was a very healthy man who would have loved to get vaccinated if he had had the chance , I choose to follow the mainstream large group of scientists and got my shots in late January and now I’ve had booster with no side effects at 82 please get your shots

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

It is my understanding, from the CDC (albeit quietly published) that fully vaccinated people can get Covid and transmit Covid. This is contrary to what our Administration stated 2 months ago. If ANYONE says they 'know about Covid,' that is a lie. No one knows. Some say it's safe. They 'think' it's safe but they don't know it's safe. I want to see the 20 year study on > 1 million people to determine, i.e. long-term effects.
No one knows - we are all in the dark.

I can't imagine that anyone in any administration said something like that. It has been well known and well publicized for over a year that these types of vaccines do not prevent anyone from getting Covid-19. It was thought at one time that the vaccines could prevent those vaccinated from transmitting it but that was also contradicted and highly publicized many months ago.

What the vaccine does it ensure that the severity of the symptoms will be less in vaccinated people than in unvaccinated people.That has been pretty much common knowledge for a long time.

In fact it is possible to get the flu after being vaccinated with the annual influenza vaccine.

I had a very severe case of Covid-19. I was hospitalized for 12 days and still have minor symptoms over two months after the onset of the disease.
Every doctor that I've seen has told me that if I had not been fully vaccinated, I would not have survived.

My better half also got Covid-19 while I was in the hospital. She is also fully vaccinated and had a relatively mild case.

Whatever your symptoms are, they will be less severe if you are vaccinated. I don't recall at any time anyone stating that these vaccines would prevent a person from contracting the virus.

What so many people fail to understand is that this is a very unique virus. It is different than any other virus that we've ever seen. There has been and will continue to be a huge learning curve. I've asked my doctors many questions and they have answered many of them. But in some cases, I've been told that "honestly, we just don't know". That is why we hear information one day and it changes a week or a month later. Testing shows one thing and later a different testing shows different results.

The medical community is giving us the best information that they have at the time. That is always subject to change.

Three hundred years ago bleeding and leeches were universally accepted treatments for many conditions. Does anyone question that the sincerity of those doctors?

What I can't seem to find and answer to and haven't had the opportunity to ask a doctor is, is the amount of antibodies related to the severity of the symptoms? In other words, do I have more antibodies than a person that has a mild case?

I've tried googling and every response seems to be a long scientific paper where I have to look up every other word and do not understand even after that.

Has anyone heard anything about that?

[Byte1]

My brother-in-law just got out of rehab yesterday, he has been hospitalized since late January with Covid most of the time in intensive care with Covid , he was a very healthy man who would have loved to get vaccinated if he had had the chance , I choose to follow the mainstream large group of scientists and got my shots in late January and now I’ve had booster with no side effects at 82 please get your shots

82% vaccinated in The Villages. And a bunch of folks that survived the virus that are just as protected now as the vaccinated.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Whatever you say is true , I’m sure you have all the facts that’s why I read your posts hmmm

[jimjamuser]

As long as you get your racket "restrung" on a regular basis:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

But , as you know, and I can think of 4 or 5 posters off the top of my head, there are those that will argue "they do their own research and make up their own minds" These are the people that will be sitting at their PC googling "cat 5 hurricane" or "nuclear detonation radius" while all their neighbors have evacuated on the advice of the "experts":1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
Yes, I agree! And I have my very own personal, very small, and inexpensive portable stringer. So, I can put the best string in my racket (even natural gut which has problems with the humidity and quick rainstorms of Florida). And I can string it to MY very own preference for string tension and use special dampening materials on each string, which takes care and time (4 hours) to finish a racket. I only string for myself.

[jimjamuser]

Why not? I hear their vaccination rates are 98%! :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
True that! Now you are talking and getting WITH the program. Keep up the good work and always remember to give dogs de-worming pills regularly and watch out for heartworms in Florida. put sandwich bags around each paw when they are walked because the ground is where the worm eggs are. (just kidding about the sandwich bags, maybe make a tough cloth barrier with velcro quick closures or invent something better). And avoid horse worming ivermectin for dogs and other ones that you love!

[jimjamuser]

I can't imagine that anyone in any administration said something like that. It has been well known and well publicized for over a year that these types of vaccines do not prevent anyone from getting Covid-19. It was thought at one time that the vaccines could prevent those vaccinated from transmitting it but that was also contradicted and highly publicized many months ago.

What the vaccine does it ensure that the severity of the symptoms will be less in vaccinated people than in unvaccinated people.That has been pretty much common knowledge for a long time.

In fact it is possible to get the flu after being vaccinated with the annual influenza vaccine.

I had a very severe case of Covid-19. I was hospitalized for 12 days and still have minor symptoms over two months after the onset of the disease.
Every doctor that I've seen has told me that if I had not been fully vaccinated, I would not have survived.

My better half also got Covid-19 while I was in the hospital. She is also fully vaccinated and had a relatively mild case.

Whatever your symptoms are, they will be less severe if you are vaccinated. I don't recall at any time anyone stating that these vaccines would prevent a person from contracting the virus.

What so many people fail to understand is that this is a very unique virus. It is different than any other virus that we've ever seen. There has been and will continue to be a huge learning curve. I've asked my doctors many questions and they have answered many of them. But in some cases, I've been told that "honestly, we just don't know". That is why we hear information one day and it changes a week or a month later. Testing shows one thing and later a different testing shows different results.

The medical community is giving us the best information that they have at the time. That is always subject to change.

Three hundred years ago bleeding and leeches were universally accepted treatments for many conditions. Does anyone question that the sincerity of those doctors?

What I can't seem to find and answer to and haven't had the opportunity to ask a doctor is, is the amount of antibodies related to the severity of the symptoms? In other words, do I have more antibodies than a person that has a mild case?

I've tried googling and every response seems to be a long scientific paper where I have to look up every other word and do not understand even after that.

Has anyone heard anything about that?
You can be tested for antibodies, but it is expensive in the US. I heard that Germany does give those tests regularly and relied on them as much as a vaccine. Whoever gives them around here should know the answers to those questions. i am glad that you got out of the hospital.

[jimjamuser]

82% vaccinated in The Villages. And a bunch of folks that survived the virus that are just as protected now as the vaccinated.
Some of those that survive lose their immunity in as short of a time as 2 months. IMO the medical experts do NOT know why it lasts longer for some people, maybe genetics??????

[Swoop]

Some of those that survive lose their immunity in as short of a time as 2 months. IMO the medical experts do NOT know why it lasts longer for some people, maybe genetics??????

Per the National Institutes of Health: “The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection.”

[NoMoSno]

You can be tested for antibodies, but it is expensive in the US. I heard that Germany does give those tests regularly and relied on them as much as a vaccine. Whoever gives them around here should know the answers to those questions. i am glad that you got out of the hospital.
Why do you think it's expensive in the US?
You can get tested at Quest for $69.
The test is FREE if you give blood through One Blood.

[JMintzer]

True that! Now you are talking and getting WITH the program. Keep up the good work and always remember to give dogs de-worming pills regularly and watch out for heartworms in Florida. put sandwich bags around each paw when they are walked because the ground is where the worm eggs are. (just kidding about the sandwich bags, maybe make a tough cloth barrier with velcro quick closures or invent something better). And avoid horse worming ivermectin for dogs and other ones that you love!

Except it's a lie...

And I'm sure you're aware that the inventor of Invermectin won the Nobel Prize for his developement of that medication FOR HUMANS, there it is still used today...

But please, keep spreading your misinformation...

[JMintzer]

Some of those that survive lose their immunity in as short of a time as 2 months. IMO the medical experts do NOT know why it lasts longer for some people, maybe genetics??????

More misinformation...

[coffeebean]

Please post that 1,000 times for the _________(fill in the blank) who think it is better to get the disease.

There is recent data that says Covid survivors have damage to their hearts a year after having Covid. That includes people who had minimal symptoms and were not hospitalized at the time of their infection.

There are several news stories about this. I won't bother to post links because I'm tired of being told my sources are not reliable. I do not buy into those conspiracy theory sites or conspiracy theory "experts" so make your own conclusions to the findings.

[coffeebean]

Can you tell me some of his false claims?

I cannot as I have not read any of his claims and am not interested to read them. His reputation precedes him. Nope, not interested in what he has to say. I'll stick with the CDC and our government for information.

[Byte1]

There is recent data that says Covid survivors have damage to their hearts a year after having Covid. That includes people who had minimal symptoms and were not hospitalized at the time of their infection.

There are several news stories about this. I won't bother to post links because I'm tired of being told my sources are not reliable. I do not buy into those conspiracy theory sites or conspiracy theory "experts" so make your own conclusions to the findings.

Other illnesses have had long term or even permanent effects. Thanks for the fear mongering.

"The flu isn’t just a health risk for the seven days or so that you’re physically sick with the virus—it can also have some lasting effects that could affect your health for weeks, months, or even permanently. Here are some of the ways the flu can be a risk factor for health issues, even after you’re feeling better.

A number of studies have linked influenza to an increased risk of heart attack and stroke, and scientists have theorized that the inflammatory response triggered by the flu can fuel the development of atherosclerosis, a contributor to heart and artery disease. "

[MDLNB]

There is recent data that says Covid survivors have damage to their hearts a year after having Covid. That includes people who had minimal symptoms and were not hospitalized at the time of their infection.

There are several news stories about this. I won't bother to post links because I'm tired of being told my sources are not reliable. I do not buy into those conspiracy theory sites or conspiracy theory "experts" so make your own conclusions to the findings.


So, you are suggesting that 44 million covid survivors probably have damaged hearts? Interesting. Guess the donor list will get pretty full pretty soon.

[golfing eagles]

So, you are suggesting that 44 million covid survivors probably have damaged hearts? Interesting. Guess the donor list will get pretty full pretty soon.

I very much doubt that the person who posted that was suggesting 44 million covid survivors will have chronic "heart disease". And there is no way anyone with 2 functioning neurons would interpret her comment in that fashion. But.....if only 1% had long term cardiac impairment, that's still 440,000 people.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Except it's a lie...

And I'm sure you're aware that the inventor of Invermectin won the Nobel Prize for his developement of that medication FOR HUMANS, there it is still used today...

But please, keep spreading your misinformation... to those scientists for there work on ivermectin to be used against parasitic infections only not for Covid

[biker1]

The last time I gave blood via One Blood, they weren't doing the Antibody tests anymore (or they were doing the test but not sending out the result).

Why do you think it's expensive in the US?
You can get tested at Quest for $69.
The test is FREE if you give blood through One Blood.

[JMintzer]

I very much doubt that the person who posted that was suggesting 44 million covid survivors will have chronic "heart disease". And there is no way anyone with 2 functioning neurons would interpret her comment in that fashion. But.....if only 1% had long term cardiac impairment, that's still 440,000 people.

Well, Mr Bean didn't claim "some", nor did he say "1%", so the response is apropos to his claim...

[JMintzer]

to those scientists for there work on ivermectin to be used against parasitic infections only

And, once again, medicines are quite often used "off label" for things they were not originally designed for...

For example: "Anakinra (Kineret®) and canakinumab (Ilaris®) are being used by some rheumatologists as an “off label” treatment for severe gout attacks"...

[golfing eagles]

Well, Mr Bean didn't claim "some", nor did he say "1%", so the response is apropos to his claim...

Well, you and I both know, and I'm pretty sure MRS. Bean knows as well, that "side effects" are not something that affects 100% of those that take a medication, usually less than 1-2 %, unless the "side effect" is somatic, such as headache or fatigue, in which case it generally runs about 15%, which is the same rate as the placebo arm of the studies.

[MDLNB]

to those scientists for there work on ivermectin to be used against parasitic infections only not for Covid


Sulfur was once used in the creation of black powder and then someone started using it as an antibiotic.

What was the point again?

[MDLNB]

I very much doubt that the person who posted that was suggesting 44 million covid survivors will have chronic "heart disease". And there is no way anyone with 2 functioning neurons would interpret her comment in that fashion. But.....if only 1% had long term cardiac impairment, that's still 440,000 people.


Didn't he/she say: "There is recent data that says Covid survivors have damage to their hearts a year after having Covid. That includes people who had minimal symptoms and were not hospitalized at the time of their infection."

I didn't see anywhere that it was stated that SOME or a FEW or there were incidents of, etc.

I am not an expert or a professional with intimate information on the subject, but I have a few "functioning neurons" enough to read. Maybe I should have read it as a scare tactic?

[golfing eagles]

Didn't he/she say: "There is recent data that says Covid survivors have damage to their hearts a year after having Covid. That includes people who had minimal symptoms and were not hospitalized at the time of their infection."

I didn't see anywhere that it was stated that SOME or a FEW or there were incidents of, etc.

I am not an expert or a professional with intimate information on the subject, but I have a few "functioning neurons" enough to read. Maybe I should have read it as a scare tactic?

You really have to be joking, right?

If I were to state that COVID survivors get into an auto accident 5 years after recovery, would one take that to mean every single one of 44 million survivors were going to be in a crash??? When my son was a teenager, he tried playing that same semantic game with me. It didn't work for him then, it doesn't work now. At least he grew up.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Sulfur was once used in the creation of black powder and then someone started using it as an antibiotic.

What was the point again? the Nobel prize winners of this use and it’s not true you can google many articles and statements from quack doctors or health gurus telling people that that’s what it was for and people will take all kinds of dangerous cures for Covid but won’t take a shot mind boggling

[golfing eagles]

Sulfur was once used in the creation of black powder and then someone started using it as an antibiotic.

What was the point again?

Typical amateur/non-professional mistake----

Big difference between the element SULPHUR used in gunpowder among other things, and SULFA antibiotics. HUGE DIFFERENCE!!!

But just for a short teaching moment, from the NIH-------

"Researchers have finally found out how sulfa drugs—the first class of antibiotics ever discovered—work at the molecular level. The finding offers insights into designing more robust antibiotic therapies.

Sulfa antibiotics were first used in the 1930s, and they revolutionized medicine. After a few years, bacteria started to develop resistance to the drugs, and eventually penicillin replaced them as a first-line treatment. While antibiotic resistance remains a problem for this class of antibiotics, sulfa drugs are still commonly used to treat a variety of bacterial infections.

Sulfa drugs work by binding and inhibiting a specific enzyme called dihydropteroate synthase (DHPS). This enzyme is critical for the synthesis of folate, an essential nutrient. Mammals get folate from their diet, but bacteria must synthesize this vitamin. Folate synthesis requires a chemical reaction between 2 molecules, DHPP and PABA, that is catalyzed by DHPS.

Bacteria resistant to sulfa drugs often have mutations in the DHPS enzyme. These mutations occur on 2 floppy loops that sit near the enzyme's active site. Previous research had described most of the structure of DHPS, but the structure of the floppy, highly conserved loops remained elusive. Moreover, researchers didn't know how the chemical reaction occurs between DHPP and PABA."

[MDLNB]

Typical amateur/non-professional mistake----

Big difference between the element SULPHUR used in gunpowder among other things, and SULFA antibiotics. HUGE DIFFERENCE!!!

But just for a short teaching moment, from the NIH-------

"Researchers have finally found out how sulfa drugs—the first class of antibiotics ever discovered—work at the molecular level. The finding offers insights into designing more robust antibiotic therapies.

Sulfa antibiotics were first used in the 1930s, and they revolutionized medicine. After a few years, bacteria started to develop resistance to the drugs, and eventually penicillin replaced them as a first-line treatment. While antibiotic resistance remains a problem for this class of antibiotics, sulfa drugs are still commonly used to treat a variety of bacterial infections.

Sulfa drugs work by binding and inhibiting a specific enzyme called dihydropteroate synthase (DHPS). This enzyme is critical for the synthesis of folate, an essential nutrient. Mammals get folate from their diet, but bacteria must synthesize this vitamin. Folate synthesis requires a chemical reaction between 2 molecules, DHPP and PABA, that is catalyzed by DHPS.

Bacteria resistant to sulfa drugs often have mutations in the DHPS enzyme. These mutations occur on 2 floppy loops that sit near the enzyme's active site. Previous research had described most of the structure of DHPS, but the structure of the floppy, highly conserved loops remained elusive. Moreover, researchers didn't know how the chemical reaction occurs between DHPP and PABA."


Apparently, you missed the point. But, thanks for the lesson anyway. I just read the cliff notes, but I have decided not to make black powder or use it for an antibiotic...........:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[MDLNB]

You really have to be joking, right?

If I were to state that COVID survivors get into an auto accident 5 years after recovery, would one take that to mean every single one of 44 million survivors were going to be in a crash??? When my son was a teenager, he tried playing that same semantic game with me. It didn't work for him then, it doesn't work now. At least he grew up.


I don't know your son, and I am relieved to know that he grew up.:coolsmiley:
You seem to be acquainted with stipulating "semantics" on many topics so I presumed that my use was permitted. Now that I know better, I will bow to those that are All Knowing. :bigbow:

Have a great day
I still consider the statement as "scare tactics" since there was no limiting terms used such as "some, instances, percentage, etc."

[Byte1]

Typical amateur/non-professional mistake----

Big difference between the element SULPHUR used in gunpowder among other things, and SULFA antibiotics. HUGE DIFFERENCE!!!

But just for a short teaching moment, from the NIH-------

"Researchers have finally found out how sulfa drugs—the first class of antibiotics ever discovered—work at the molecular level. The finding offers insights into designing more robust antibiotic therapies.

Sulfa antibiotics were first used in the 1930s, and they revolutionized medicine. After a few years, bacteria started to develop resistance to the drugs, and eventually penicillin replaced them as a first-line treatment. While antibiotic resistance remains a problem for this class of antibiotics, sulfa drugs are still commonly used to treat a variety of bacterial infections.

Sulfa drugs work by binding and inhibiting a specific enzyme called dihydropteroate synthase (DHPS). This enzyme is critical for the synthesis of folate, an essential nutrient. Mammals get folate from their diet, but bacteria must synthesize this vitamin. Folate synthesis requires a chemical reaction between 2 molecules, DHPP and PABA, that is catalyzed by DHPS.

Bacteria resistant to sulfa drugs often have mutations in the DHPS enzyme. These mutations occur on 2 floppy loops that sit near the enzyme's active site. Previous research had described most of the structure of DHPS, but the structure of the floppy, highly conserved loops remained elusive. Moreover, researchers didn't know how the chemical reaction occurs between DHPP and PABA."

I'm not an expert or a medical professional such as you, but I think that sulfur is or has been used for dermatological purposes and does work as sort of an antibiotic, if I am not mistaken. I was "told" that folks that are allergic to sulfa drugs are probably not allergic to sulfur. But, I think we have strayed off the subject..

[golfing eagles]

Apparently, you missed the point. But, thanks for the lesson anyway. I just read the cliff notes, but I have decided not to make black powder or use it for an antibiotic...........:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

but are you going to inject bleach or lysol??????:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[golfing eagles]

I don't know your son, and I am relieved to know that he grew up.:coolsmiley:
You seem to be acquainted with stipulating "semantics" on many topics so I presumed that my use was permitted. Now that I know better, I will bow to those that are All Knowing. :bigbow:

Have a great day
I still consider the statement as "scare tactics" since there was no limiting terms used such as "some, instances, percentage, etc."

As a knight of the round table, I was honor bound by the code of chivalry to defend her:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[coffeebean]

Other illnesses have had long term or even permanent effects. Thanks for the fear mongering.

"The flu isn’t just a health risk for the seven days or so that you’re physically sick with the virus—it can also have some lasting effects that could affect your health for weeks, months, or even permanently. Here are some of the ways the flu can be a risk factor for health issues, even after you’re feeling better.

A number of studies have linked influenza to an increased risk of heart attack and stroke, and scientists have theorized that the inflammatory response triggered by the flu can fuel the development of atherosclerosis, a contributor to heart and artery disease. "

Why does information regarding the damaging effects of Covid become "fear mongering"? The information is there to inform, not to cause fear. Why is it being informed is referred to as "fear mongering". I just do not understand that mantra and I'm truly tired of hearing it. I've heard it so much, I have become numb to the silly term, "fear mongering".

[coffeebean]

So, you are suggesting that 44 million covid survivors probably have damaged hearts? Interesting. Guess the donor list will get pretty full pretty soon.

Sorry if my comments were not clear but I did not mean to imply that every single person who has had Covid would suffer heart damage. That just does not seem feasible, actually. Wouldn't that have been major headlines by now?

[coffeebean]

Well, Mr Bean didn't claim "some", nor did he say "1%", so the response is apropos to his claim...

Who is "Mr. Bean"?

[coffeebean]

You really have to be joking, right?

If I were to state that COVID survivors get into an auto accident 5 years after recovery, would one take that to mean every single one of 44 million survivors were going to be in a crash??? When my son was a teenager, he tried playing that same semantic game with me. It didn't work for him then, it doesn't work now. At least he grew up.

GE......you are my hero. Thank you.

[coffeebean]

I don't know your son, and I am relieved to know that he grew up.:coolsmiley:
You seem to be acquainted with stipulating "semantics" on many topics so I presumed that my use was permitted. Now that I know better, I will bow to those that are All Knowing. :bigbow:

Have a great day
I still consider the statement as "scare tactics" since there was no limiting terms used such as "some, instances, percentage, etc."

Mrs. Bean here. I did not get into specifics as I just reiterated a headline I read. I did invite anyone who was interested to do the research and find articles on the subject. It was quite interesting to find that heart damage shows up a year later in Covid survivors; I never said all Covid survivors. I left it up to anyone interested in the findings to read about it themselves.

[coffeebean]

As a knight of the round table, I was honor bound by the code of chivalry to defend her:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

I'm happy to say it again........GE, you are my hero!

[kkingston57]

Well you came to the right site for information/misinformation.

Agree 100%

[Byte1]

Why does information regarding the damaging effects of Covid become "fear mongering"? The information is there to inform, not to cause fear. Why is it being informed is referred to as "fear mongering". I just do not understand that mantra and I'm truly tired of hearing it. I've heard it so much, I have become numb to the silly term, "fear mongering".

Then I guess if someone was to put this article on here, and say that folks should not wear a mask because of.....................

Is a Mask That Covers the Mouth and Nose Free from Undesirable Side Effects in Everyday Use and Free of Potential Hazards? (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8072811/)

[JMintzer]

Well, you and I both know, and I'm pretty sure MRS. Bean knows as well, that "side effects" are not something that affects 100% of those that take a medication, usually less than 1-2 %, unless the "side effect" is somatic, such as headache or fatigue, in which case it generally runs about 15%, which is the same rate as the placebo arm of the studies.

How dare you resume their gender! :icon_wink:

[JMintzer]

Well, you and I both know, and I'm pretty sure MRS. Bean knows as well, that "side effects" are not something that affects 100% of those that take a medication, usually less than 1-2 %, unless the "side effect" is somatic, such as headache or fatigue, in which case it generally runs about 15%, which is the same rate as the placebo arm of the studies.

And while on the subject, "Person Bean" should be more precise in their language.

If you read these threads (and I know that you do), you will see that people are constantly using incorrect statistics to try to back up their claims...

Simply saying "some", or "a few", or "studies show the XX%" would go a long way in substantiating a claim...

[JMintzer]

Who is "Mr. Bean"?

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BYjU2YzY5NDEtM2M3NC00NGM0LTg3MmItNWQ1OWY2ZmNkZT U0XkEyXkFqcGdeQXVyNTIzOTk5ODM@._V1_.jpg

[JMintzer]

Mrs. Bean here. I did not get into specifics as I just reiterated a headline I read. I did invite anyone who was interested to do the research and find articles on the subject. It was quite interesting to find that heart damage shows up a year later in Covid survivors; I never said all Covid survivors. I left it up to anyone interested in the findings to read about it themselves.

And that is the problem...

Headlines.... They are meant to elicit a reaction, not give information (in most cases)...

[coffeebean]

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BYjU2YzY5NDEtM2M3NC00NGM0LTg3MmItNWQ1OWY2ZmNkZT U0XkEyXkFqcGdeQXVyNTIzOTk5ODM@._V1_.jpg

Well......he is not me. Just sayin'. LOL.