A Mail Box Observation

[bigalibaba]

Every day at this time of year the Trash Can at my (and Yours) Mailbox is loaded to the brim with unwanted junk sent by political candidates. (Party affiliation has nothing to do with this issue). Seeing the Political Ads climb higher and higher in the Trash Can can be likened to watching your last Political contribution being flushed down the drain. Most of these brochures are full color glossy creations that cost lots of money; our money) My bet is that those that make it out of the Post Office area end up in a kitchen Trash Can. Would any of us flush our money down the toilet? Seems like the Political Wanabbes don't care.

[redwitch]

I'm not sure what the point is. I imagine that probably one in a thousand reads the ads, the rest trash them. This has pretty much always been the case, including the waste of money to print and mail them. Today, you can pretty much say the same for political ads on TV -- we can quickly skim through them with our DVDs and DVRs.

Is it a waste of money? Yes and no. Most have pretty much made up their minds how they will vote (if it at all) long before the candidates are known or shortly after. A few, however, do read anything and everything they can about the candidates -- those are the ones targeted by the brochures. So, they can make a difference.

Personally, I'm more upset that the ads end up in the trash rather than in recycling.

[golf2140]

I'm more upset with the folks who take their dogs to the postal stations and let them do their business. They don't pick up their trash!!!:police:

[BogeyBoy]

I have been watching the political ads on TV, in the newspaper, and through direct mail. It's not that they influence me, they just amaze me. (Not content - volume.)

Can any regular business get any TV time for ads? It seems like every break is one political ad after another. I wonder if they shorten the news broadcasts by a couple of minutes to fit in more ads?

I can't begin to guess how much money goes into these campaigns.

Back to the original question about them being dumped at the mail stations. Direct advertising mail is and always has been very wasteful - but it also employs a lot of people. Direct mail response rates run from under 1% to maybe 2% in a well planned target market. This goes on day after day, it's just more obvious when it is something out of the ordinary - like the political mailings.

Hang in there, a few more weeks and it will be over. (For now.)

[Talk Host]

Let's not be too hard on political campaigning. It is the purest form of freedom of speech and the very thing that our troops have fought and died for over the centuries.

We all want to elect candidates that best reflect our own philosophical view. Without campaigning, how will be know who that candidate is? After all, candidates have a very small window, about 90 days in which to convince you that they are the best one to represent you. (This is a representative form of government.)

People object to door to door campaigning.

People object to television and radio campaigning.

People object to direct mail campaigning.

People object to yard and billboard signs.

Yet, this is the single most important patriotic decision we all make in a years time.

These thousands of dollars are not spent to get you to vote, they are spent to get the people who are already going to vote, to vote for that particular candidate.

I think it is sad that people don't take the campaign mail home and read it in order to make a more educated decision on election day.

Radio and television stations hate political advertisements. They are required by federal law to sell the ads to the candidates at the lowest unit rate offered over the course of a year. They are forced to bump a $500 Ford ad for a $75 political ad, that most people complain about anyway.

Let's assume for a moment that all campaigning was made illegal. Then what?

[mulligan]

The cold war Soviet Union?? Thanx to all the vets for the way it is!!!!!!

[BogeyBoy]

I think it is sad that people don't take the campaign mail home and read it in order to make a more educated decision on election day.



I am not convinced that reading the campaign mail will help me to make a more educated decision. What they print and send out is what they want you to read, not necessarily what their real life record is - in or out of politics.

Let's get back to that auto ad that got bumped - "Buy Hyundai, Buy Today!" Are you going to base your decision to buy a new auto on that?

[Talk Host]

I am not convinced that reading the campaign mail will help me to make a more educated decision. What they print and send out is what they want you to read, not necessarily what their real life record is - in or out of politics.

Let's get back to that auto ad that got bumped - "Buy Hyundai, Buy Today!" Are you going to base your decision to buy a new auto on that?


How do you find out about their "real life" record? I think we have come to distrust everybody who is running for office.

Any, yes, "top of the mind awareness" will cause people to go into the Hyundai store. That's why they advertise. If it didn't return results, they wouldn't do it.

[Pturner]

Let's not be too hard on political campaigning. It is the purest form of freedom of speech and the very thing that our troops have fought and died for over the centuries.

We all want to elect candidates that best reflect our own philosophical view. Without campaigning, how will be know who that candidate is? After all, candidates have a very small window, about 90 days in which to convince you that they are the best one to represent you. (This is a representative form of government.)

People object to door to door campaigning.

People object to television and radio campaigning.

People object to direct mail campaigning.

People object to yard and billboard signs.

Yet, this is the single most important patriotic decision we all make in a years time.

These thousands of dollars are not spent to get you to vote, they are spent to get the people who are already going to vote, to vote for that particular candidate.

I think it is sad that people don't take the campaign mail home and read it in order to make a more educated decision on election day.

Radio and television stations hate political advertisements. They are required by federal law to sell the ads to the candidates at the lowest unit rate offered over the course of a year. They are forced to bump a $500 Ford ad for a $75 political ad, that most people complain about anyway.

Let's assume for a moment that all campaigning was made illegal. Then what?

Good points.

[Larryandlinda]

I'm not sure what the point is. I imagine that probably one in a thousand reads the ads, the rest trash them. This has pretty much always been the case, including the waste of money to print and mail them. Today, you can pretty much say the same for political ads on TV -- we can quickly skim through them with our DVDs and DVRs.

Is it a waste of money? Yes and no. Most have pretty much made up their minds how they will vote (if it at all) long before the candidates are known or shortly after. A few, however, do read anything and everything they can about the candidates -- those are the ones targeted by the brochures. So, they can make a difference.

Personally, I'm more upset that the ads end up in the trash rather than in recycling.

Excellent points Red
Today we biked over to the mailbox, been a month since last visit.
Because we didn't bring the backpack nor rack, we were tempted to chuck the 10# of junk mail in the can.
We brought it home to recycle- the can was already over flowing (Bel Aire)
And we don't ever throw paper 'away'
So we stuffed it in our shorts and brought it home to recycle

By virtue of stuffing mailboxes with overly slick that is an automatic 'con' for any candidate's pro/con balance

An Ocala car dealer and Television hearing aid product were huge culprits this
week.
With a little respect for some of the commentary and straying topicality of
troops and freedom,
It would be more responsible to save the billions that get very wasted on
paper consumption, deforestation, fuel costs for delivery, and associated
cost...and put it into more responsible usage.
In TV alone we estimate tons and tons of paper tossed into landfill weekly.

We were glad to see the Lions Club aluminum recycling receptacles at the mail center. But there were no can dispensing machines nearby, but hundreds of mailboxes churning out enough paper to save more trees than most might imagine.
http://www.astc.org/exhibitions/rotten/away.htm

A simple receptacle would be a great place to start.


We noticed a POA article about The Village Greens, perhaps they could include this in an agenda item, and hopefully help.

Like them we like trees and more of them.


L and L

[Indydealmaker]

Let's not be too hard on political campaigning. It is the purest form of freedom of speech and the very thing that our troops have fought and died for over the centuries.

We all want to elect candidates that best reflect our own philosophical view. Without campaigning, how will be know who that candidate is? After all, candidates have a very small window, about 90 days in which to convince you that they are the best one to represent you. (This is a representative form of government.)

People object to door to door campaigning.

People object to television and radio campaigning.

People object to direct mail campaigning.

People object to yard and billboard signs.

Yet, this is the single most important patriotic decision we all make in a years time.

These thousands of dollars are not spent to get you to vote, they are spent to get the people who are already going to vote, to vote for that particular candidate.

I think it is sad that people don't take the campaign mail home and read it in order to make a more educated decision on election day.

Radio and television stations hate political advertisements. They are required by federal law to sell the ads to the candidates at the lowest unit rate offered over the course of a year. They are forced to bump a $500 Ford ad for a $75 political ad, that most people complain about anyway.

Let's assume for a moment that all campaigning was made illegal. Then what?

Political ads could potentially have some redeeming value if the originators of the ads were legally obligated to keep their promises as well as be liable for misdirections. Political advertisements that simply say what their target audiences want to hear instead of revealing working strategies are useless to all but the politicians.

[Larryandlinda]

<snip>

Back to the original question about them being dumped at the mail stations. Direct advertising mail is and always has been very wasteful - but it also employs a lot of people. Direct mail response rates run from under 1% to maybe 2% in a well planned target market. This goes on day after day, it's just more obvious when it is something out of the ordinary - like the political mailings.

Hang in there, a few more weeks and it will be over. (For now.)

yes it does employ millions
And feeds the delivery and transportation, and other peripheral industries a

So do industries like tobacco, liquor, and illegal industries like illegal drugs,
organized crime, and the like

Over in the political forum ( where this might go) some might even mention
that our operations abroad are employing hundreds of thousands in the military and private sectors - including a large amount of non US citizens.

The fact that something provides employment is not virtuous in itself

Waste is waste, there are far better ways to get messages across than millions of tons weekly of placemat-style posters

There are only so msny birdcages to line in this world

Respectfully

L and L

[Larryandlinda]

I'm not sure what the point is. I imagine that probably one in a thousand reads the ads, the rest trash them. This has pretty much always been the case, including the waste of money to print and mail them. Today, you can pretty much say the same for political ads on TV -- we can quickly skim through them with our DVDs and DVRs.

Is it a waste of money? Yes and no. Most have pretty much made up their minds how they will vote (if it at all) long before the candidates are known or shortly after. A few, however, do read anything and everything they can about the candidates -- those are the ones targeted by the brochures. So, they can make a difference.

Personally, I'm more upset that the ads end up in the trash rather than in recycling.

We went in the Village Greens www and discovered this:

http://emssdi.com/TVG/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/TVRecycling.pdf (http://emssdi.com/TVG/wp-
content/uploads/2010/03/TVRecycling.pdf)

While it seems like a "how can they possibly do that?"
Endeavor, if they do, we applaud them as much as we do for recycling drainage water

Another great move by the developer,

But ...." how can they do it?"

L and L

[BogeyBoy]

How do you find out about their "real life" record? I think we have come to distrust everybody who is running for office.

Any, yes, "top of the mind awareness" will cause people to go into the Hyundai store. That's why they advertise. If it didn't return results, they wouldn't do it.

I look for the news articles that describe the candidates positions on various topics and if they are or have been an elected official I look at how they voted, etc.

I totally agree that those ads will get people into the dealership, but I think driving the vehicle and looking at the options first hand will sell the car. But then again, you can order a car on the phone and they will deliver it to you, not much hands on research there.

[BogeyBoy]

yes it does employ millions
And feeds the delivery and transportation, and other peripheral industries a

So do industries like tobacco, liquor, and illegal industries like illegal drugs,
organized crime, and the like

Over in the political forum ( where this might go) some might even mention
that our operations abroad are employing hundreds of thousands in the military and private sectors - including a large amount of non US citizens.

The fact that something provides employment is not virtuous in itself

Waste is waste, there are far better ways to get messages across than millions of tons weekly of placemat-style posters

There are only so msny birdcages to line in this world

Respectfully

L and L

You're comparing industries that kill people to the paper industry?

[Talk Host]

With a little respect for some of the commentary and straying topicality of
troops and freedom,

L and L

"straying topicality?" I'm not sure what this means, but I think you might be saying that the fight for freedom doesn't include the right to free and open elections, and that this isn't a salient point. I certainly hope that isn't what you are saying here.

[Larryandlinda]

You're comparing industries that kill people to the paper industry?

Whether an industry kills or harms people, animals, the ecology, is not the issue.
Our comparison aims to show that just because an activity or business creates jobs does not mean it's 'good for' whatever.

When the plastic bottle and can makers won out over the glass container folk they cited all kinds of new jobs and though fuel costs did go down, sizes and consumption went up so now the fuel cost card is moot and we are left with tons more 'throw away' items, litter, compromised taste, and jobs, too!

Remember picking up two cent bottles and cashing them in?
That was a first job for many of us.

And our flip flop on the "Kudos to TV" for the single stream recycling?
We just flopped - seems the recycling is just for what residents separate into large clear bags - not what goes into the 40 gallon cans at the mail stations- while it would be a simple no-brainer to place a paper-only receptacle there, it's not the case.

Lastly, as far as TH's reaction to our reference to voting and freedom, you are correct and we agree that the right to campaign and vote are most necessary, and we have traveled throughout the mid Atlantic to spread those messages to voters and potential voters who might otherwise miss out, but we prefer means that are less impactful to our respectful environment.

Vote early

l and L

[BogeyBoy]

Whether an industry kills or harms people, animals, the ecology, is not the issue.
Our comparison aims to show that just because an activity or business creates jobs does not mean it's 'good for' whatever.


l and L

But like it or not things that are 'good for' or 'not good for' are the invention of how our society and world have evolved. You go to a fast food place and your expectation is to be served food in disposable wrappers. I doubt that paper gets recycled. When I was a kid we went to the snack shop for a burger and it was served on a plate. McDonalds came along and mass marketed food served on paper. Society accepted it and here we are billions of burgers - and billions of burger wrappers - later.

So is direct mail good or bad? A company sends out 100,000 direct mail ads. They get a 1% response and sell 1000 items. They stay in business. They ship them out UPS, the UPS driver keeps his job. They deposit the funds, the bank stays open. The bank sends out statements, the post office stays afloat. The employees, the UPS driver, the bank teller, and the postal employee all go out shopping, more jobs. But still 99,000 pieces of that mailing are in the trash. Oh wait, here comes the trash man in his new car!