The TRUTH about Herd Immunity

[Koapaka]

CDC backs away from its COVID-19 ‘herd immunity’ goal - mlive.com (https://www.mlive.com/news/2021/11/cdc-backs-away-from-its-covid-19-herd-immunity-goal.html)

[dewilson58]

:shrug:

[MDLNB]

"Vaccines have been quite effective at preventing cases of COVID-19 that lead to severe illness and death, but none has proved reliable at blocking transmission of the virus,..."
"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."

So, what they are saying is that the ONLY thing that the current vaccinations do toward Covid is to minimize the effects when you become infected. Does not prevent passing it on and it does not prevent you from becoming infected.

[Bill14564]

Nothing new, this has always been the case.

[John41]

CDC backs away from its COVID-19 ‘herd immunity’ goal - mlive.com (https://www.mlive.com/news/2021/11/cdc-backs-away-from-its-covid-19-herd-immunity-goal.html)

Very disappointing news. Like the flu there will be annual boosters. We just got our booster.

[Bill14564]

"Vaccines have been quite effective at preventing cases of COVID-19 that lead to severe illness and death, but none has proved reliable at blocking transmission of the virus,..."
"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."

So, what they are saying is that the ONLY thing that the current vaccinations do toward Covid is to minimize the effects when you become infected. Does not prevent passing it on and it does not prevent you from becoming infected.

Not what they are saying. Big difference between "not reliable" and "not effective."

But even if the ONLY thing the vaccines did were prevent death, that still seems like a success to me.

[Stu from NYC]

Very disappointing news. Like the flu there will be annual boosters. We just got our booster.

Agreed got our booster last month and looks like we will continue to get them.

[SkBlogW]

not what they are saying. Big difference between "not reliable" and "not effective."

but even if the only thing the vaccines did were prevent death, that still seems like a success to me.

91556

[Bogie Shooter]

There is/will be a natural thinning of the non-vaccinated which will eventually lead to full herd immunity.

[UpNorth]

There is/will be a natural thinning of the non-vaccinated which will eventually lead to full herd immunity.

Long term effects may eventually thin out the vaccinated from other diseases. Nobody knows, since the Vax was not tested on animals, and has been used on humans for less than a year.

[crash]

"Vaccines have been quite effective at preventing cases of COVID-19 that lead to severe illness and death, but none has proved reliable at blocking transmission of the virus,..."
"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."

So, what they are saying is that the ONLY thing that the current vaccinations do toward Covid is to minimize the effects when you become infected. Does not prevent passing it on and it does not prevent you from becoming infected.

But if we all had it little to no hospitalization or death, but hey freedom.

[Dan2020]

"Vaccines have been quite effective at preventing cases of COVID-19 that lead to severe illness and death, but none has proved reliable at blocking transmission of the virus,..."
"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."

So, what they are saying is that the ONLY thing that the current vaccinations do toward Covid is to minimize the effects when you become infected. Does not prevent passing it on and it does not prevent you from becoming infected.

Vaccinations drastically cut down the chances of becoming infected, and if you do become infected, if cuts down on the severity of symptoms along with the likelihood of being hospitalized.
Nearly all COVID-19 deaths in US are now among unvaccinated | Fox News (https://www.foxnews.com/health/nearly-all-covid-19-deaths-us-unvaccinated)

[jswirs]

"Vaccines have been quite effective at preventing cases of COVID-19 that lead to severe illness and death, but none has proved reliable at blocking transmission of the virus,..."
"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."

So, what they are saying is that the ONLY thing that the current vaccinations do toward Covid is to minimize the effects when you become infected. Does not prevent passing it on and it does not prevent you from becoming infected.

And so, does this not prove that those who refuse the vaccine are NOT part of the problem? It seems to me that all these months of folks wailing, complaining and pointing fingers at the unvaccinated have been unnecessary and unfounded.

[Altavia]

"Vaccines have been quite effective at preventing cases of COVID-19 that lead to severe illness and death, but none has proved reliable at blocking transmission of the virus,..."
"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."

So, what they are saying is that the ONLY thing that the current vaccinations do toward Covid is to minimize the effects when you become infected. Does not prevent passing it on and it does not prevent you from becoming infected.

The vaccinated lower viral loads and are infectious for a shorter period of time so risk of infecting others is reduced.

[danglanzsr]

CDC backs away from its COVID-19 ‘herd immunity’ goal - mlive.com (https://www.mlive.com/news/2021/11/cdc-backs-away-from-its-covid-19-herd-immunity-goal.html)

The cited source is not a pronouncement from the CDC. It is an LA Times news article quoting several "experts" as to their opinions. Read the article.

[Petersweeney]

Imagine everyone having to take a final exam and no one scoring above 50%….

[JMintzer]

YAY! Another Covid thread that will change exactly ZERO minds...

[donfey]

CDC backs away from its COVID-19 ‘herd immunity’ goal - mlive.com (https://www.mlive.com/news/2021/11/cdc-backs-away-from-its-covid-19-herd-immunity-goal.html)

The CDC is political, period. The "vaccines" have value but are not a sure thing. Talk to your doctor and manage your own health care.

[SkBlogW]

Nothing new, this has always been the case.

LOL Let's rewrite history.

WEDNESDAY, NOVEMBER 18, 2020

Today, Pfizer and BioNTech announced that their new experimental Covid-19 vaccine is 95% effective in preventing infections and causes no serious safety concerns, according to a final analysis of their clinical trial.

Pfizer and Moderna Covid vaccines 95% effective in clinical trials | NOVA | PBS (https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/article/pfizer-moderna-covid-vaccines-clinical-trials/)

[Marine1974]

Geez , how many times do we here the unvaccinated who catch Covid
and get really sick and possibly die
say they wish they would of been vaccinated .

[Byte1]

91556

That seems to indicate that one out of six vaccinated and hospitalized for Covid, DIE in the hospital. Seems like an awful high number. How many UN-vaccinated hospitalized for Covid die?

[davem4616]

I don't why, but every time I hear the phrase 'herd immunity' I'm reminded of Cliff sitting at the bar telling Norm about his Buffalo Theory on an old "Cheers" episode.....

""Well you see, Norm, it's like this . . . A herd of buffalo can only move as fast as the slowest buffalo. And when the heard is hunted, it is the slowest and weakest ones at the back that are killed first. This natural selection is good for the herd as a whole, because the general speed and health of the whole group keeps improving by the regular killing of the weakest members.

In much the same way, the human brain can only operate as fast as the slowest brain cells. Now, as we know, excessive intake of alcohol kills brain cells. But naturally, it attacks the slowest and weakest brain cells first. In this way, regular consumption of beer eliminates the weaker brain cells, making the brain a faster and more efficient machine. And that, Norm, is why you always feel smarter after a few beers."

[biker1]

No. They are reporting the percentage (15%) of hospitalized deaths that were vaccinated. That is much different than saying 15% of those who are vaccinated and enter the hospital die. That chart did not report the percentage of people, regardless of their vaccination status, who died after entering the hospital.

That seems to indicate that one out of six vaccinated and hospitalized for Covid, DIE in the hospital. Seems like an awful high number. How many UN-vaccinated hospitalized for Covid die?

[Byte1]

No. They are reporting the percentage (15%) of hospitalized deaths that were vaccinated. That is much different than saying 15% of those who are vaccinated and enter the hospital die.

Ah, isn't 15% about one out of six? Or, I can make it more accurate by saying 15 out of 100, if that makes it easier to understand. And we are only specifying these as being vaccinated that are hospitalized due to Covid.

[biker1]

I'll try again since you don't seem to understand. 15%, or about 1/6, of those who die in the hospital (and presumably entered the hospital because of having developed COVID-19) have been vaccinated. This is different than saying 15% of those who are hospitalized (and were vaccinate) actually die. This is what you asserted. Not everyone who enters the hospital dies. But, if you enter the hospital and do die, there is a 15% probability that you were vaccinated. From the referenced chart, we don't know what percentages of people who enter the hospital who actually die.

Ah, isn't 15% about one out of six? Or, I can make it more accurate by saying 15 out of 100, if that makes it easier to understand. And we are only specifying these as being vaccinated that are hospitalized due to Covid.

[A-2-56]

How many unvaccinated people crossing the border have died from this horrible pox that has besieged us?
Why has this plague not descimated all of those homeless that are occupying the lively Venice Beach and many cities in California?
Why has it not completely wiped out the Amish communities? When one Amish man was asked why, he simply stated that they don’t have TV.
Think for yourself, do your own research and turn off the nightly news, and open your Bible or Torah!

[Bogie Shooter]

No. They are reporting the percentage (15%) of hospitalized deaths that were vaccinated. That is much different than saying 15% of those who are vaccinated and enter the hospital die. That chart did not report the percentage of people, regardless of their vaccination status, who died after entering the hospital.

Ah, isn't 15% about one out of six? Or, I can make it more accurate by saying 15 out of 100, if that makes it easier to understand. And we are only specifying these as being vaccinated that are hospitalized due to Covid.

I'll try again since you don't seem to understand. 15%, or about 1/6, of those who die in the hospital (and presumably entered the hospital because of having developed COVID-19) have been vaccinated. This is different than saying 15% of those who are hospitalized (and were vaccinate) actually die. This is what you asserted. Not everyone who enters the hospital dies. But, if you enter the hospital and do die, there is a 15% probability that you were vaccinated. From the referenced chart, we don't know what percentages of people who enter the hospital who actually die.

There is a name for this kind of contest, just cannot seem to recall.:1rotfl:

[biker1]

What’s your problem?


There is a name for this kind of contest, just cannot seem to recall.:1rotfl:

[Bogie Shooter]

What’s your problem?

I’m not the one with a problem…

[Andyb]

60% of Americans are vaccinated, another 25%+- have natural immunity, (proven more effective than the vac), so that’s roughly 85%, way above the 70% threshold of herd immunity. Just saying.

[Altavia]

60% of Americans are vaccinated, another 25%+- have natural immunity, (proven more effective than the vac), so that’s roughly 85%, way above the 70% threshold of herd immunity. Just saying.

Delta is much more infectious than when those estimated were made


Heard immunity for Delta is estimated to be as high as the 90-95.

Delta Variant Pushes Herd Immunity Threshold Above 80% (https://sytech.co.zw/posts/delta-variant-pushes-herd-immunity-threshold-above-80/)

[Boffin]

91568

[Koapaka]

Yeah, keep on keepin on with your annual booster shots that train your immune system to take a break and not worry about stuff.....God Bless.

[jswirs]

Yeah, keep on keepin on with your annual booster shots that train your immune system to take a break and not worry about stuff.....God Bless.
BINGO!! Yes, that is correct, vacs and boosters may help somewhat, but only for a short period of time. So what you are left with is a weakened immune system.

[Altavia]

Byte1 - Nobel attempt. There are two kind of people in the world, those can learn, and those who won't.

[Byte1]

Geez , how many times do we here the unvaccinated who catch Covid
and get really sick and possibly die
say they wish they would of been vaccinated .

I've NEVER heard from any of the dead by covid say they wish they would have been vaccinated........:MOJE_whot::MOJE_whot::1rotfl::1 rotfl:

[John41]

Yeah, keep on keepin on with your annual booster shots that train your immune system to take a break and not worry about stuff.....God Bless.

Actually the booster tells your immune system to get busy.

[Koapaka]

Actually the booster tells your immune system to get busy.

ALL of the first 4 know victims of the new variant were fully vaccinated...Your next guess????

https://scontent-mia3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/261382661_201109505521074_8116708317292533917_n.jp g?_nc_cat=105&_nc_rgb565=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=JgdIygWZL-UAX-mL_H-&tn=X7UguLrjNiJI6U6N&_nc_ht=scontent-mia3-2.xx&oh=36695c95ee9eb107a87425cf8c15bcac&oe=61A70CFA

[Velvet]

ALL of the first 4 know victims of the new variant were fully vaccinated...Your next guess????https://scontent-mia3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/261382661_201109505521074_8116708317292533917_n.jp g?_nc_cat=105&_nc_rgb565=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=JgdIygWZL-UAX-mL_H-&tn=X7UguLrjNiJI6U6N&_nc_ht=scontent-mia3-2.xx&oh=36695c95ee9eb107a87425cf8c15bcac&oe=61A70CFA

Vaccination worked ok on the past variants. The new ones we don’t know about yet.

I take it that you are alluding to the fact that the vaccines don’t work because these guys were vaccinated. Well that’s like saying the light clothes you wore in the summer aren’t doing much for you in the winter. Next…

[Bogie Shooter]

Note to self: avoid this thread until June 1st.
:popcorn:

[DAVES]

And so, does this not prove that those who refuse the vaccine are NOT part of the problem? It seems to me that all these months of folks wailing, complaining and pointing fingers at the unvaccinated have been unnecessary and unfounded.

It is obvious, people will complain about anything. They do not need to be qualified to do so.
We tend to expect, demand perfection and that is rare in terms of reality.
I am not qualified. My OPINION the injections are the best plan, path for us to take.
Guinea pig? I've taken 3 shots of the Physer vaccine. Side effect-I continue to get older every day

[Altavia]

ALL of the first 4 know victims of the new variant were fully vaccinated...Your next guess????https://scontent-mia3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/261382661_201109505521074_8116708317292533917_n.jp g?_nc_cat=105&_nc_rgb565=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=JgdIygWZL-UAX-mL_H-&tn=X7UguLrjNiJI6U6N&_nc_ht=scontent-mia3-2.xx&oh=36695c95ee9eb107a87425cf8c15bcac&oe=61A70CFA

Source?

South Africa has currently fully vaccinated less than 36% of its adult population so that seems highly unlikely.

It's way to early to make any generalzations on the varient but wise to be cautious.

[Koapaka]

Source?

South Africa has currently fully vaccinated less than 36% of its adult population so that seems highly unlikely.

It's way to early to make any generalzations on the varient but wise to be cautious.

IF and when you can show me mortality rate for this new variant, then being "more transmissible" could be a HUGE issue....but it is not the case and the media is bending the headlines to scare people into submission. Our motto was "need vs greed". My choice was "need vs greed" medicine even that many years ago.....


Their own Gov officials...https://twitter.com/BWGovernment/status/1463874240130785280/photo/1

AGAIN, listen carefully to their "sales pitch"...much more "contagious"....ok, so how does the death rate from this new and improved strain compare ( especially given the huge number of unvaxed in that country)????? Seems these people "caught" were well enough to travel, given that is how they were "caught". Makes one wonder....if you feel well enough to travel internationally, just how sick are you??? Take a simple moment and look at the global picture every time one of these new strains are announced, and see what has shifted/changed/surfaced and ask yourself if there is a connection, a requirement for more control to distract. When you see people dying in droves, that is very different than NEW VARIANT, MUCH MORE CONTAGIOUS, MUST ISSUE MORE CONTROL ON MASSES. Here is the article from the Dr who discovered it.....South African Doctor Who Raised Alarm About Omicron Variant: 'Symptoms Were So Different And So Mild' (https://townhall.com/tipsheet/rebeccadowns/2021/11/27/south-african-doctor-who-raised-alarm-about-omicron-variant-symptoms-were-so-different-and-so-mild-n2599733)

Sad but true....FOLLOW THE MONEY! There are so many people making so much money off of this, the gravy train will be perpetuated in the name of "safety" long beyond our lifetime....

I believe in medicine for the sake of healing, NOTHING MORE. Certainly not for the reasons so many are milking this....for the sake of profit. How funny that the powers that be do not hold the country responsible for this plague upon the entire earth accountable....makes one wonder if they think at all...why would that be???? One of the main reasons I decided to go into military medicine, it was all based on needs and not profits. IF you need a test/procedure it is based on need and not ability to pay/insurance/income.....ONLY on need and without prejudice.


PS....spell check is your friend.

[jswirs]

It is obvious, people will complain about anything. They do not need to be qualified to do so.
We tend to expect, demand perfection and that is rare in terms of reality.
I am not qualified. My OPINION the injections are the best plan, path for us to take.
Guinea pig? I've taken 3 shots of the Physer vaccine. Side effect-I continue to get older every day
I get it Daves, I'm happy to hear you have not had any side effects. On the other hand, there are many who have not had the vaccinations, they also are continuing to get older. I would be very careful about getting these booster shots. There will always be new variants, so I guess there will always be new vaccinations, boosters. Be well!

[MDLNB]

Africa has suffered only about 4% of the world's covid deaths. Of course, they have a very low age average BUT, Africa also uses a whole lot of malaria Meds. Sound familiar? Not going to get into another argument regarding the use of those "forbidden" medications, but I thought it interesting.
I agree that there seems to be an abundance of over hype on the new covid variance. From what is reported at present, it does not seem to be anywhere as lethal as the earlier versions. Guess we will just have to wait and see. Seems like there is a big push going on in D.C. for everyone to get their boosters. "...it's the patriotic thing to do....blah,blah." Give me a break!

[Two Bills]

Seems to me all the anti's wont be happy until all the vaccinated are dead!

[MDLNB]

Seems to me all the anti's wont be happy until all the vaccinated are dead!


Why would that make the "anti's" happy?

Personally, I am glad that we still have some semblance of Freedom to make our own choices, good or bad. I had my vaccination but am still not sure whether or not I am going to get the booster and start that quarterly practice. Think I might welcome Covid, so that I can get the antibodies naturally. I doubt that will even happen, since I never get the flu either. I think that good hygiene practices probably protect some of us.

Not trying to convince anyone else. On the contrary, get your boosters so that the rest of us that may not, will be protected from you. :icon_wink: