This can't be good news.

[vintageogauge]

The West Coast Longshoreman and Warehouse workers contract covering 16,000 workers ends on July 1st and per a business news quote it is unlikely that a deal will be reached by then. This is a potential problem that we don't need at this time.

[Stu from NYC]

Their salaries are already outrageous and their work rules have really tied up unloading of ships and delaying of merchandise coming from outside the USA.

[manaboutown]

Sadly, it has been some time since I have heard or seen any good news.

[Stu from NYC]

Sadly, it has been some time since I have heard or seen any good news.

Well our kids and grandchildren are all doing well and we have both recovered from covid so this is the good news of the day.:icon_wink:

[Topspinmo]

Their salaries are already outrageous and their work rules have really tied up unloading of ships and delaying of merchandise coming from outside the USA.


What unions do. Throw out everything see what sticks. Then there the underground side of unions to get there way.

[Stu from NYC]

What unions do. Throw out everything see what sticks. Then there the underground side of unions to get there way.

Unfortunately too many businesses or public utilities forgot that they still have to sell their product and give in too outrageous demands.

[Keefelane66]

Good grief WalMart and the Dollar store’s shelves are empty. No useless junk to buy. I just can’t take it anymore.

[Papa_lecki]

Does that mean The Villages Costco will have empty shelves?

[Stu from NYC]

Does that mean The Villages Costco will have empty shelves?

Since the shelves come from overseas there will be no shelves all items on the floor.

[MrFlorida]

So, they can ship it to Florida instead.

[Worldseries27]

so, they can ship it to florida instead.
put elon in charge.
His space barge will be customs checked at point of origin and fly into the distribution centers to neet the trailers.
No more dock workers.
You say nay?
Prescriptions, packages being delivered by drones. Just the beginning of defeating the docks maginot line.

[ThirdOfFive]

Sadly, it has been some time since I have heard or seen any good news.
That doesn't necessarily mean there isn't any. Bad news sells papers, attracts viewers and generates hits. Good news doesn't.

[Blackbird45]

Last five years of my career I was the sole negotiated for my local. The one thing I leaned was if employers treated workers fairly unions would not exist. It's not only wages on the table, many times it's also the safety of the employees. I went against the 3 major networks, the Broadway League, the Major studios. You never sit across from a CEOs; you sit across from a group of hired guns who have a parameter they are locked to, and they secure their position by how low they can keep the cost. It doesn't matter if they are not offering a living wage, or they work their employees around the clock, they do what is best for themselves. I don't fault them, they have families and mouths to feed, but so do union members.

[barbnick]

put elon in charge.
His space barge will be customs checked at point of origin and fly into the distribution centers to neet the trailers.
No more dock workers.
You say nay?
Prescriptions, packages being delivered by drones. Just the beginning of defeating the docks maginot line.

Never happen

[Robbb]

Last five years of my career I was the sole negotiated for my local. The one thing I leaned was if employers treated workers fairly unions would not exist. It's not only wages on the table, many times it's also the safety of the employees. I went against the 3 major networks, the Broadway League, the Major studios. You never sit across from a CEOs; you sit across from a group of hired guns who have a parameter they are locked to, and they secure their position by how low they can keep the cost. It doesn't matter if they are not offering a living wage, or they work their employees around the clock, they do what is best for themselves. I don't fault them, they have families and mouths to feed, but so do union members..

Bull**** unions protect the weak we workers at the expense of the good workers

[Blackbird45]

.

Bull**** unions protect the weak we workers at the expense of the good workers

When a union representative sits down to negotiate a contract, they're not only negotiating for their members they are also negotiating for nonunion employees. When a union member's salary rises, and protections are put into place, nonunion employer in that field match or exceed that to keep their workers.

[jimkerr]

Unions are great for lazy people.

[Blackbird45]

The local I represented did not guarantee employment. If the employer was unsatisfied with the employee, they would just replace them. What are local did was place a base salary, working conditions and benefits.

[Stu from NYC]

Last five years of my career I was the sole negotiated for my local. The one thing I leaned was if employers treated workers fairly unions would not exist. It's not only wages on the table, many times it's also the safety of the employees. I went against the 3 major networks, the Broadway League, the Major studios. You never sit across from a CEOs; you sit across from a group of hired guns who have a parameter they are locked to, and they secure their position by how low they can keep the cost. It doesn't matter if they are not offering a living wage, or they work their employees around the clock, they do what is best for themselves. I don't fault them, they have families and mouths to feed, but so do union members.

There are some unions that also think of the company their members work for and want to help them to stay profitable.

The ones in the companies I worked for was only interested in keeping up the medical and retirement funds they managed and made it almost impossible to fire a worker who tried their best to do almost nothing all day.

NYC has a room for teachers who are not trusted to be in a room with students. Instead they are kept in one location where they sit and read all day while still getting paid.

[Blackbird45]

There are some unions that also think of the company their members work for and want to help them to stay profitable.

The ones in the companies I worked for was only interested in keeping up the medical and retirement funds they managed and made it almost impossible to fire a worker who tried their best to do almost nothing all day.

NYC has a room for teachers who are not trusted to be in a room with students. Instead they are kept in one location where they sit and read all day while still getting paid.

The problem is not the unions. When I sat down, I would ask for whatever ridiculous thing I could come up with. The expectation was that the negotiator on the other side of the table would do the same but in the opposite direction. If you have contracts where employers are forced to keep employee who are not doing their job, the fault falls on the employer's negotiators. I do not believe employers should be force to employ people who do not meet up to an agreed standard.

[Chi-Town]

Here is some news that may ease the angst:

Bloomberg - Are you a robot? (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-06-14/west-coast-ports-strike-unlikely-even-as-no-deal-seen-by-july)

[Keefelane66]

.

Bull**** unions protect the weak we workers at the expense of the good workers
Then you have a weak company. It’s called documentation of infractions of work rules many managers are lazy to follow the rules and contract and fail to document infractions. Then blame the unions.

[Blackbird45]

Not all unions are the same. The local's members I represented were basically freelance. What the local's contracts offered was a minimum salary, benefits retirement and health and working conditions. If the employee wanted to negotiate on their own for a hirer salary it was something they had the right to do. If the employer did not want to pay their rate and the employer did not have another worker to do the project, the union was obligated to supply someone that was capable of doing the job. The local also gave classes to keep the members up to date on what would make them more in demand and whatever new safety measures had to be adhered to. Again, any contract that forces employers to keep employees employed when they're not doing the agreed assignment is not the fault of the union, but that of the employer's negotiator

[Lea N]

That doesn't necessarily mean there isn't any. Bad news sells papers, attracts viewers and generates hits. Good news doesn't.

Here's a place to get happier news: Brighten the World and Spread Hope - InspireMore.com (https://www.inspiremore.com/) They have uplifting and cheerful stories.

[irishwonone]

Last five years of my career I was the sole negotiated for my local. The one thing I leaned was if employers treated workers fairly unions would not exist. It's not only wages on the table, many times it's also the safety of the employees. I went against the 3 major networks, the Broadway League, the Major studios. You never sit across from a CEOs; you sit across from a group of hired guns who have a parameter they are locked to, and they secure their position by how low they can keep the cost. It doesn't matter if they are not offering a living wage, or they work their employees around the clock, they do what is best for themselves. I don't fault them, they have families and mouths to feed, but so do union members.
Problems lie on both sides. Usually not union workers but union management.

[Blackbird45]

Problems lie on both sides. Usually not union workers but union management.

Obliviously you're not a union member or have no idea how unions work. I was elected twice to represent my local, after spending 35 years as a working member and left when I reached retirement age. All the union representatives I ever met tried to deliver whatever their members wanted within reason. The years I was the representative I spent more time away from home and was paid less. It's easy to attack unions and management when you know nothing about them.

[B.Kauffman]

Topspinmo: Your comments are typical of someone who has never felt the support of a well run union. And your knowledge of the English language is questionable. Their, there.

[RICH1]

Nationwide Strike … July 5-12, 2022

[vintageogauge]

My first job after high school was a mail clerk in a very large union factory. The individual that I replaced spent more time showing me where to go and who to talk with throughout the factory to waste time as once the mail was dropped off in the morning there was nothing else to do until delivery in the afternoon. A few weeks later another opening, this time a payroll clerk, the job was to drop off and pickup time cards in the various departments, once again a morning trip and a late afternoon trip with nothing to do in between. I got to know every foreman in the plant, new their life stories, what they ate what they didn't eat, etc., etc., This was the most boring job I had in my life. I was taught to work hard not to sit around smoking and drinking Coke all day. Occasionally I would help the lady in the payroll department get the cards ready until I got caught, this was a big no-no, not allowed to help anyone. From that point on I just sat in a chair and read junk mail until my route was ready for me. On my 89th day, the boss called me up to his office and gave me a list of about 200 numbers, told me to go over to the adding machine and add them all up, don't waste time checking the results, and bring the list with the total back to him. He looked at the total, said to me that is incorrect, I'm going to have to let you go, this was the last day of probation. I found out later that the list of numbers was used anytime they had someone that they wanted to get rid of. Getting kicked out of that union was the best thing that ever happened to me career wise, from that point on I got paid for working, not loafing. I got dozens of stories like this and even worse. There was a time for unions and probably some employers should have unions but for the most part I feel that those days of needing representation are in the past.

[Quixote]

How sad to see one group of working people being manipulated and pitted against another group of working people. Back in the day this was called 'divide and conquer.' It still is.

Many years ago I had a cousin who owned textile mills in New England and vehemently opposed the idea of a union. I asked him, 'How have you managed to avoid your workers forming a union when other companies like yours eagerly unionized?' He responded that he paid his workers more than the unions were getting the workers they represented, he gave them better benefits than the union were getting fortheir workers, and he provided better working conditions than the unions were getting for their membership.

There was no way he could see—nor did I even try to point out to him—that the unions were serving his workers very, very well and that his work force was costing him more than if they had been unionized! Back in the day this was called 'false pride and ego.' It still is....

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Last five years of my career I was the sole negotiated for my local. The one thing I leaned was if employers treated workers fairly unions would not exist. It's not only wages on the table, many times it's also the safety of the employees. I went against the 3 major networks, the Broadway League, the Major studios. You never sit across from a CEOs; you sit across from a group of hired guns who have a parameter they are locked to, and they secure their position by how low they can keep the cost. It doesn't matter if they are not offering a living wage, or they work their employees around the clock, they do what is best for themselves. I don't fault them, they have families and mouths to feed, but so do union members.

It depends on the union. My experience as a union worker in two different union jobs has been especially negative.

1. Was only hired because the person who was in the position was required to leave, because she wanted to go to part time, and the union wouldn't allow two part timers to occupy the position. I was not told this. It was a civil service job. Two weeks before my 6-month probabionary period was over, they fired me and hired her back. Turns out there was some kind of time window, and the coast was clear for her to return. I tried to fight it but the union said I was still on my first 6 months, so they wouldn't represent me. I reminded them I had been paying union dues since my first week there, and they still refused. I had to fight them to get a refund for the 5.5 months of union dues I paid without the right to representation.

2. Supermarket worker in a union shop. They actually -negotiated- for a first aid kit on every floor of the building. Clue as to why that's stupid: OSHA requires a first aid kit on every floor of the building. I wonder what the union gave up in exchange for something they were getting anyway. They also -required- me to pay full union dues which included a really BAD health insurance that I wasn't eligible to use anyway, because I already had free excellent health insurance through my husband's job. Law stated that I could pay just the monthly maintenance fee and opt out of union membership, but they refused to allow it. They weren't supposed to require that of me. But - Teamsters will be Teamsters. If you won't join the union, you can't work in that company. They will fight you tooth and nail, and they have the money to cover the expense - because everyone else is paying through the wahoo for things like first aid kits (translation - the Union President's bank account).

My husband worked for a union shop - they spoiled their employees like crazy. But the company didn't negotiate anything. They just said "this is what we're offering" and the union said "awesome." It was the company that was great (at the time), not the union. The union took his weekly bribe to do absolutely nothing other than sign some papers once a year. Eventually that local got taken over by an out-of-state regional union who tried to push for things that the employees didn't need, and made a fuss about everything, while actually not -doing- anything. Eventually the company said "y'know what - we're closing this department. You're all out of jobs, have a nice day."

So nah - not a fan of unions. They had their place. They abused their privilege and now they've just made it more difficult for everyone.

[Nordhagen]

Ah, I wonder why a lot of manufacturing jobs are now in foreign countries???

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Ah, I wonder why a lot of manufacturing jobs are now in foreign countries???

Because they're not dependent on union demands.

That said - some other countries are not very good to their workers. Poverty wages, no benefits, no time off, no breaks, mandatory overtime without overtime pay - some of them get paid the American equivalent of $100 per WEEK, for a 60-hour 6-day week. Those countries would benefit from unions. Until the unions get too full of themselves.

[Nucky]

The Longshoreman & Stevadores negotiated contracts to get their pay and benefits to where they are. Congratulations to them. I hope they do well with the negotiations they are presently conducting.

After a lifetime of ownership of small companies and being a manager at other jobs with Teamster employees under my watch now that I’m retired even though I did fine I could have come out way better as a union member unloading ships in Staten Island at Howland Hook. I could have slept instead of worrying how to get the job done. Being a Union Member must be awesome. When you leave work you don’t have to think about work at all until tomorrow. I rest my case!

[kcrazorbackfan]

The West Coast Longshoreman and Warehouse workers contract covering 16,000 workers ends on July 1st and per a business news quote it is unlikely that a deal will be reached by then. This is a potential problem that we don't need at this time.

Well, just another turd in the punch bowl of life. There’s something going one all the time.

[Stu from NYC]

The Longshoreman & Stevadores negotiated contracts to get their pay and benefits to where they are. Congratulations to them. I hope they do well with the negotiations they are presently conducting.

After a lifetime of ownership of small companies and being a manager at other jobs with Teamster employees under my watch now that I’m retired even though I did fine I could have come out way better as a union member unloading ships in Staten Island at Howland Hook. I could have slept instead of worrying how to get the job done. Being a Union Member must be awesome. When you leave work you don’t have to think about work at all until tomorrow. I rest my case!

Unfortunately the rest of us suffer when they slow down unloading and stores do not get the merchandise they ordered. Not to mention the huge salaries they make get passed on and the rest of us get to pay more for the stuff we buy.

[cypress]

And then there are companies that are only unionized so they can do business with companies that only use unionized companies. It forms a complete circle.

[Nucky]

Unfortunately the rest of us suffer when they slow down unloading and stores do not get the merchandise they ordered. Not to mention the huge salaries they make get passed on and the rest of us get to pay more for the stuff we buy.

You should really tell this to the Shop Stewart or one of the members may have a problem with their reputation being injured. Slow down? Doesn’t ever happen, just ask Vito & Rocko!

[Stu from NYC]

You should really tell this to the Shop Stewart or one of the members may have a problem with their reputation being injured. Slow down? Doesn’t ever happen, just ask Vito & Rocko!

Nucky do you really think that longshoreman have any interest in unloading ships as quickly as they can?

[Wyseguy]

Because they're not dependent on union demands.

That said - some other countries are not very good to their workers. Poverty wages, no benefits, no time off, no breaks, mandatory overtime without overtime pay - some of them get paid the American equivalent of $100 per WEEK, for a 60-hour 6-day week. Those countries would benefit from unions. Until the unions get too full of themselves.

My company eventually had a union (teamsters). I would put up our employees against any as far as production and quality. The problem is that we can not compete with countries that pay their employees pennies a day, if at all (prison labor). Of course companies like auto manufacturers run to Mexico when the cost of labor is 1/2 that of a US employee. We need to protect our US employees. Both parties seem fine with manufacturing jobs moving out of the country. We need to protect US workers.

[gatorbill1]

If not for unions in the past, all workers would be working 6 days a week, 10 hours a day in unfit conditions and making Florida minimum wage.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

My company eventually had a union (teamsters). I would put up our employees against any as far as production and quality. The problem is that we can not compete with countries that pay their employees pennies a day, if at all (prison labor). Of course companies like auto manufacturers run to Mexico when the cost of labor is 1/2 that of a US employee. We need to protect our US employees. Both parties seem fine with manufacturing jobs moving out of the country. We need to protect US workers.

The way to do that is to require companies to provide more for their employees, AND eliminate unions. The more employees have to pay into union dues, the more they expect the union to do for them and the more the unions will extort from companies. Eliminate the middle-man, mandate that companies provide a living wage, a contribution toward health care OR offer company self-insurance options, paid time off, all the things companies in other companies are required to provide their employees.

Except - that would be called socialism (even though the companies are still allowed to turn a profit, which means it's still capitalism).

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

If not for unions in the past, all workers would be working 6 days a week, 10 hours a day in unfit conditions and making Florida minimum wage.

As I've said - unions had their place in our history. They even have a place in new industries cropping up in the country.

Now, their place is strong-arming businesses and forcing employees to go on strike for things they might not even care about, resulting in no income during the strike, companies shutting down, violence against line-breakers, delays and even complete halts in the supply chain, some smaller businesses shutting down because they -can't- meet the demands of their extortioners, and departments or local stores of larger companies shutting down for the same reason.

[MartinSE]

Ah, I wonder why a lot of manufacturing jobs are now in foreign countries???

Has something to do with paying $2.50/hr.

[Stu from NYC]

Has something to do with paying $2.50/hr.

With 25% tariff on goods coming from China, insanely high freight rates and delays in transit quite a few manufacturing jobs are coming back to the US.

[Topspinmo]

Last five years of my career I was the sole negotiated for my local. The one thing I leaned was if employers treated workers fairly unions would not exist. It's not only wages on the table, many times it's also the safety of the employees. I went against the 3 major networks, the Broadway League, the Major studios. You never sit across from a CEOs; you sit across from a group of hired guns who have a parameter they are locked to, and they secure their position by how low they can keep the cost. It doesn't matter if they are not offering a living wage, or they work their employees around the clock, they do what is best for themselves. I don't fault them, they have families and mouths to feed, but so do union members.

That IMO maybe be true 80 plus years ago, but in today’s union you’re pricing yourselves out of the market and company just moved across southern borders or China with no repercussions, and CEO gets millions in bonus and stock option for eliminating high cost of labor in this country and gets near slave labor out of country and don’t have to deal with EPA.

[Topspinmo]

If not for unions in the past, all workers would be working 6 days a week, 10 hours a day in unfit conditions and making Florida minimum wage.

Agree, but greed started set in around late 60s 70’s, 80’s, 90’s 2000’s.

[Topspinmo]

It depends on the union. My experience as a union worker in two different union jobs has been especially negative.

1. Was only hired because the person who was in the position was required to leave, because she wanted to go to part time, and the union wouldn't allow two part timers to occupy the position. I was not told this. It was a civil service job. Two weeks before my 6-month probabionary period was over, they fired me and hired her back. Turns out there was some kind of time window, and the coast was clear for her to return. I tried to fight it but the union said I was still on my first 6 months, so they wouldn't represent me. I reminded them I had been paying union dues since my first week there, and they still refused. I had to fight them to get a refund for the 5.5 months of union dues I paid without the right to representation.

2. Supermarket worker in a union shop. They actually -negotiated- for a first aid kit on every floor of the building. Clue as to why that's stupid: OSHA requires a first aid kit on every floor of the building. I wonder what the union gave up in exchange for something they were getting anyway. They also -required- me to pay full union dues which included a really BAD health insurance that I wasn't eligible to use anyway, because I already had free excellent health insurance through my husband's job. Law stated that I could pay just the monthly maintenance fee and opt out of union membership, but they refused to allow it. They weren't supposed to require that of me. But - Teamsters will be Teamsters. If you won't join the union, you can't work in that company. They will fight you tooth and nail, and they have the money to cover the expense - because everyone else is paying through the wahoo for things like first aid kits (translation - the Union President's bank account).

My husband worked for a union shop - they spoiled their employees like crazy. But the company didn't negotiate anything. They just said "this is what we're offering" and the union said "awesome." It was the company that was great (at the time), not the union. The union took his weekly bribe to do absolutely nothing other than sign some papers once a year. Eventually that local got taken over by an out-of-state regional union who tried to push for things that the employees didn't need, and made a fuss about everything, while actually not -doing- anything. Eventually the company said "y'know what - we're closing this department. You're all out of jobs, have a nice day."

So nah - not a fan of unions. They had their place. They abused their privilege and now they've just made it more difficult for everyone.

The civil service job ( federal?) you was hired (probably on contract?) and on probation period which means that had the option to to keep ( based on need) or let you go ( based on not needed) and of course the union going to fight for the permanent employees.

[Topspinmo]

Ah, I wonder why a lot of manufacturing jobs are now in foreign countries???

Come on, you know why. Cost of labor and greed.

[MartinSE]

With 25% tariff on goods coming from China, insanely high freight rates and delays in transit quite a few manufacturing jobs are coming back to the US.

Yup, corporations are required by law to maximize profits over employees and customers (it's a good cover lie then tell). So, yeah, they go where they make the most money. Almost like Capitalism has run amuck, I mean why not, since they purchased our government.