Juneteenth Holiday. No Mail on June 20, 2022.

[Taltarzac725]

Juneteenth - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juneteenth)

No Federal mail today.

Juneteenth | National Museum of African American History and Culture (https://nmaahc.si.edu/juneteenth)

The Historical Legacy of Juneteenth | National Museum of African American History and Culture (https://nmaahc.si.edu/explore/stories/historical-legacy-juneteenth?fbclid=IwAR2G3q_WDf7nT7U34_rj_fmj6BI2dt MQ3YS29rcD7B1xfrQ9LIXAigrAm4U)

[Stu from NYC]

Well our mailman is very happy about this new holiday. Cannot quite say the same.

[manaboutown]

Banks closed, stock market closed

[alwann]

With all due respect to Juneteenth, just how many federal holidays annually are observed these days? Given nearly 3 million fed employees, those extra paid days off must cost tax payers a bundle. Are these days off in addition to vacation and religious holidays?

[retiredguy123]

With all due respect to Juneteenth, just how many federal holidays annually are observed these days? Given nearly 3 million fed employees, those extra paid days off must cost tax payers a bundle. Are these days off in addition to vacation and religious holidays?
There are now 11 Federal holidays. They are in addition to vacation time and sick leave. A Federal employee with at least 15 years of service gets 11 paid holidays, 13 days of sick leave, and 26 days of vacation time. But, in my opinion, they don't cost the taxpayer anything because most Federal offices are so overstaffed that days off don't have much effect on productivity. The largest issue for a Federal manager is sick leave, because an employee can accumulate 13 days per year with no limit. So, after 20 years, many Federal employees have enough sick leave to be absent from the job for more than a year, and the supervisor cannot replace them. This would never work in the private sector.

[manaboutown]

Also some states and their school systems now treat Juneteenth as a paid holiday, not Florida though.

I still celebrate George Washington's Birthday on February 22 and Abraham Lincoln's Birthday on February 12 separately. The creation of Presidents' Day was inane.

[ThirdOfFive]

Also some states and their school systems now treat Juneteenth as a paid holiday, not Florida though.

I still celebrate George Washington's Birthday on February 22 and Abraham Lincoln's Birthday on February 12 separately. The creation of Presidents' Day was inane.
When working I appreciated the paid holidays, but in truth, out of the 11, I really celebrated only three: Memorial Day, Independence Day, and Thanksgiving.

[Stu from NYC]

Also some states and their school systems now treat Juneteenth as a paid holiday, not Florida though.

I still celebrate George Washington's Birthday on February 22 and Abraham Lincoln's Birthday on February 12 separately. The creation of Presidents' Day was inane.

Washington and Lincoln both deserve their own dates for what they did for us.

[manaboutown]

Since this year June 20 is National Take Your Cat To Work Day some cats are going to miss out. Take Your Cat To Work Day | Holiday | Checkiday.com (https://www.checkiday.com/e1cdbac8cb3997c2a98458ba0f547e70/take-your-cat-to-work-day)

On the other hand June 20 is also National Ice Cream Soda Day so maybe the cats can celebrate at home. National Ice Cream Soda Day | Holiday | Checkiday.com (https://www.checkiday.com/e32b092b184de5b46a2870cbc5a613ac/national-ice-cream-soda-day)

[Stu from NYC]

There are now 11 Federal holidays. They are in addition to vacation time and sick leave. A Federal employee with at least 15 years of service gets 11 paid holidays, 13 days of sick leave, and 26 days of vacation time. But, in my opinion, they don't cost the taxpayer anything because most Federal offices are so overstaffed that days off don't have much effect on productivity. The largest issue for a Federal manager is sick leave, because an employee can accumulate 13 days per year with no limit. So, after 20 years, many Federal employees have enough sick leave to be absent from the job for more than a year, and the supervisor cannot replace them. This would never work in the private sector.

The inefficiencies of the fed govt get worse and worse

[Taltarzac725]

Something Paula Patton Paula Patton - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paula_Patton) posted on Facebook today--

This Juneteenth, we celebrate the legacy of Black Excellence! We celebrate our ancestors—those who embodied struggle and transcendence, fortitude, and resilience. We celebrate hope, and we embrace the strength gifted to us by those who came before to blaze trails and reach heights that, just a short time ago, society and this country tried to make us believe were unattainable.
I implore you all to keep defying the odds, to keep striving for greatness, to keep being our ancestors’ wildest dreams!
#Juneteenth

[Stu from NYC]

Something Paula Patton Paula Patton - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paula_Patton) posted on Facebook today--

Guess if another group would want their own day it would be racist.

[jdulej]

I know bashing Fed workers is lot of fun but the two I have worked with in the past few years did an excellent job
The SSA folks - wow, they walked me through that quagmire with care and patience
The Post Office - i occasionally buy and sell a lot of expensive photo gear. Yes, a couple items have been late but never lost or broken. Cant say the same for fed ex or ups

[Stu from NYC]

I know bashing Fed workers is lot of fun but the two I have worked with in the past few years did an excellent job
The SSA folks - wow, they walked me through that quagmire with care and patience
The Post Office - i occasionally buy and sell a lot of expensive photo gear. Yes, a couple items have been late but never lost or broken. Cant say the same for fed ex or ups

Just think that in the business world they would do their business with a lot less employees.

[retiredguy123]

I know bashing Fed workers is lot of fun but the two I have worked with in the past few years did an excellent job
The SSA folks - wow, they walked me through that quagmire with care and patience
The Post Office - i occasionally buy and sell a lot of expensive photo gear. Yes, a couple items have been late but never lost or broken. Cant say the same for fed ex or ups
None of the posts in this thread have bashed Federal employees. As far as I can tell, everything posted is completely factual. No bashing.

[Stu from NYC]

None of the posts in this thread have bashed Federal employees. As far as I can tell, everything posted is completely factual. No bashing.

Is it too late to do some bashing? Asking for a friend.

[Number 10 GI]

I believe I may have posted this story before, but here goes again. When I started working in civil service with the state of Tennessee, I went around introducing myself to the other workers in my department. One lady was reading a paperback book at her desk and I asked her what her job was and she said she was the assistant to a lady she pointed out to me. That person was the assistant to another lady who was the assistant to the department Commissioner.
In government a supervisor's importance is based on how many subordinates they have, more subordinates mean they are a very important person. It's called empire building. Most government offices are way overstaffed, except the driver's license offices.

[Topspinmo]

With all due respect to Juneteenth, just how many federal holidays annually are observed these days? Given nearly 3 million fed employees, those extra paid days off must cost tax payers a bundle. Are these days off in addition to vacation and religious holidays?

Well, at least the are working…….:D

[Topspinmo]

Juneteenth - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juneteenth)

No Federal mail today.

Juneteenth | National Museum of African American History and Culture (https://nmaahc.si.edu/juneteenth)

The Historical Legacy of Juneteenth | National Museum of African American History and Culture (https://nmaahc.si.edu/explore/stories/historical-legacy-juneteenth?fbclid=IwAR2G3q_WDf7nT7U34_rj_fmj6BI2dt MQ3YS29rcD7B1xfrQ9LIXAigrAm4U)


On darn, I was so looking forward to picking up the junk mail and bills. :sing:

[Topspinmo]

The inefficiencies of the fed govt get worse and worse


I agree, those GS employees come in and leave as they wish, it called flex time. A problem they solved cause They couldn’t get to work on time or back from long lunch break. Now in the other hand WG employees time accounted for down to minute.

[Topspinmo]

Also some states and their school systems now treat Juneteenth as a paid holiday, not Florida though.

I still celebrate George Washington's Birthday on February 22 and Abraham Lincoln's Birthday on February 12 separately. The creation of Presidents' Day was inane.

So far 18 states, more will join as years go by.

[Calisport]

Thank you Ms. Juneteenth for wasting 20 min. of my time to get the mail today.
This is the replacement for Independence day in some mindless people?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Thank you Ms. Juneteenth for wasting 20 min. of my time to get the mail today.
This is the replacement for Independence day in some mindless people?

Yes, it is the replacement for Independence day in some mindless people.

For everyone else, it's the celebration of the day officials from the east coast of the country went to Texas and informed everyone that the people living there hadn't been slaves for the past year and a half - because Texas chose not to inform them of it themselves.

[Stu from NYC]

Yes, it is the replacement for Independence day in some mindless people.

For everyone else, it's the celebration of the day officials from the east coast of the country went to Texas and informed everyone that the people living there hadn't been slaves for the past year and a half - because Texas chose not to inform them of it themselves.

Do we really need a national holiday now, 155 years later over this?

[SeaCros]

For most of the people who live in The Villages, I thought everyday was a holiday. So who cares? With the new federal holiday the challenge is to do some research and learn about some history. Step outside of yourself and or the bubble and remember there is a big world out there.

[me4vt]

Why not Labor Day?

[Deandd]

If we get enough juneteenth like holidays maybe we can get the federal government to intervene even less …..

[Mushkie]

Washington and Lincoln both deserve their own dates for what they did for us.

I want President Trump on Mount Rushmore!!!

[photo1902]

For most of the people who live in The Villages, I thought everyday was a holiday. So who cares? With the new federal holiday the challenge to to do some research and learn about some history. Step outside of yourself and or the bubble and remember there is a big world out there.

It’s just another hot button topic for grumpy old people to get their panties in a bunch about.

[MandoMan]

There are now 11 Federal holidays. They are in addition to vacation time and sick leave. A Federal employee with at least 15 years of service gets 11 paid holidays, 13 days of sick leave, and 26 days of vacation time. But, in my opinion, they don't cost the taxpayer anything because most Federal offices are so overstaffed that days off don't have much effect on productivity. The largest issue for a Federal manager is sick leave, because an employee can accumulate 13 days per year with no limit. So, after 20 years, many Federal employees have enough sick leave to be absent from the job for more than a year, and the supervisor cannot replace them. This would never work in the private sector.

If you could call in sick for a year and get paid, could you in good conscience do it? I couldn’t. Plus, wouldn’t the employer check to see if the employer is really sick? Taking the days without being sick would be fraud, wouldn’t it? I was a professor at a state university for 34 years. I accumulated over 450 days of sick time. If I’d become seriously ill, that sick leave would have been a life saver. I thought I’d simply lose it all when I retired, which is what usually happened. Instead, the state universities, wanting to get rid of those of us who were old and in the way, offered to pay us for one fourth of our sick days in a lump sum if we would retire at the end of the school year. A lot of us took that offer. That’s the only way I could afford to move to The Villages. The rest of those sick days went unused.

[Bay Kid]

Another man-made paid holiday created by the government. Doesn't pay anything to most hard workers in our country.

[Bill14564]

Do we really need a national holiday now, 155 years later over this?

It won't be the first paid holiday granted for an event that far in the past.

Washington's Birthday became a holiday in 1879 which was 147 years after he was born.

While Independence Day was a holiday in 1870 it wasn't a paid day off until 1938 or 1941 (different sources) both of which are more 160 years after the event it celebrates.

New Years Day, Christmas, Columbus Day and Thanksgiving did not become paid holidays in the US until hundreds, thousands, or millions of years after the event they celebrate, though that is mostly a technicality since the US didn't exist at that time.

[donassaid]

More "Wokism". What's next? National holiday for homosexuals, transgenders, and illegal immigrants?

[Bill14564]

If you could call in sick for a year and get paid, could you in good conscience do it? I couldn’t. Plus, wouldn’t the employer check to see if the employer is really sick? Taking the days without being sick would be fraud, wouldn’t it?
....


Yes, that would be fraud and could result in someone being fired (saw it happen). No, my conscience would not allow me to call in sick that many days.

[retiredguy123]

If you could call in sick for a year and get paid, could you in good conscience do it? I couldn’t. Plus, wouldn’t the employer check to see if the employer is really sick? Taking the days without being sick would be fraud, wouldn’t it? I was a professor at a state university for 34 years. I accumulated over 450 days of sick time. If I’d become seriously ill, that sick leave would have been a life saver. I thought I’d simply lose it all when I retired, which is what usually happened. Instead, the state universities, wanting to get rid of those of us who were old and in the way, offered to pay us for one fourth of our sick days in a lump sum if we would retire at the end of the school year. A lot of us took that offer. That’s the only way I could afford to move to The Villages. The rest of those sick days went unused.
I never used most of my sick leave. But, many use all of it. A Federal employee does not need to be sick to use sick leave. They can use the leave to take care of someone else, and that person does not even need to be a family member. As a supervisor, it is almost impossible to deny sick leave, or to verify that the reason is valid. They can just say that they are leaving town to care for a sick friend or relative in another state. It is considered an earned benefit, and is almost never refused. Another problem is that some employees use all of their sick leave by just calling in sick whenever they have earned 8 hours. So, how can you deny someone who wants to use it all at once without discriminating?

There were some employees who actually delayed their retirement for more than a year, so that they could use their sick leave and get full pay and benefits for an extra year or so at the end of their career. Everyone knew that they were never coming back to work. This was sick leave abuse, but there was really nothing they could do to stop it.

[retiredguy123]

Yes, that would be fraud and could result in someone being fired (saw it happen). No, my conscience would not allow me to call in sick that many days.
Federal employees can use sick leave to take care of someone else who is sick. The employee does not need to be sick to use the leave.

[Stu from NYC]

More "Wokism". What's next? National holiday for homosexuals, transgenders, and illegal immigrants?

Uh oh it might give someone an idea.:boom:

[Bill14564]

Federal employees can use sick leave to take care of someone else who is sick. The employee does not need to be sick to use the leave.

There are allowed uses for sick leave. Using sick leave for something other than an allowed use would be fraud and could result in the employee being fired.

I believe many (most?) companies allow their employees to use sick leave for FMLA absences to care for family members (though most Federal employees would not need to invoke FMLA for one or two days)

[retiredguy123]

There are allowed uses for sick leave. Using sick leave for something other than an allowed use would be fraud and could result in the employee being fired.

I believe many (most?) companies allow their employees to use sick leave for FMLA absences to care for family members (though most Federal employees would not need to invoke FMLA for one or two days)
You are correct. But, private companies have more flexibility and discretion than the Federal Government. The problem in the Government is that, if you don't treat everyone the same way, you can be accused of discrimination. So, how do you require one employee to prove that their need for sick leave is valid, when there are other employees who routinely call in sick whenever they feel like getting a day or two off?

I don't know what the FMLA law requires, but Federal employees do not invoke that law to use sick leave, and the person they are caring for does not need to be a family member.

[Bill14564]

You are correct. But, private companies have more flexibility and discretion than the Federal Government. The problem in the Government is that, if you don't treat everyone the same way, you can be accused of discrimination. So, how do you require one employee to prove that their need for sick leave is valid, when there are other employees who routinely call in sick whenever they feel like getting a day or two off?

I don't know what the FMLA law requires, but Federal employees do not invoke that law to use sick leave, and the person they are caring for does not need to be a family member.

You seem to have transitioned from what is allowed by the OPM and what is allowed by lenient supervisors. And, we both seem to have strayed far from the topic of this thread.

[retiredguy123]

You seem to have transitioned from what is allowed by the OPM and what is allowed by lenient supervisors. And, we both seem to have strayed far from the topic of this thread.
I agree

[Love2Swim]

I want President Trump on Mount Rushmore!!!

We all know you're kidding, but thanks for making us laugh, bless your heart. :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[airstreamingypsy]

Do we really need a national holiday now, 155 years later over this?

This is your fourth whiny post in this thread, and I just started page 2. Why do you care? Aren't you retired? How does this affect you other than annoying you?

[airstreamingypsy]

I want President Trump on Mount Rushmore!!!

Me too, hopefully after falling out of a plane.

[Love2Swim]

This is your fourth whiny post in this thread, and I just started page 2. Why do you care? Aren't you retired? How does this affect you other than annoying you?

We all know why certain people are whining about this holiday.

[The Chipster]

It is not a surprise that most posters here are not in favor of the new Juneteenth holiday. I am also not a fan of so many holidays, but sure as hell support this one. If any historical event in our country deserves a serious national holiday, the elimination of slavery should be near the top.

[manaboutown]

It is not a surprise that most posters here are not in favor of the new Juneteenth holiday. I am also not a fan of so many holidays, but sure as hell support this one. If any historical event in our country deserves a serious national holiday, the elimination of slavery should be near the top.

That would be The Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln on January 1, 1863. June 19, 1865 was merely the day news of it reached some folks in Galveston, Texas.

[Stu from NYC]

This is your fourth whiny post in this thread, and I just started page 2. Why do you care? Aren't you retired? How does this affect you other than annoying you?

First of all I am not retired still running a business.

As a taxpayer this is an additional cost to us. Govt wasting way to much money as it is and wish when they find a new way to spend they should find an equal way to save.

[airstreamingypsy]

We all know why certain people are whining about this holiday.

Yes we do, and it's really sad.

[Pgcacace]

Holidays are in addition to vacation time, etc. Yes, this new holiday probably costs millions in pay. But the govt. will just print more money to cover it. ☹️

[meme5x]

Agree… why can’t other cultures be recognized.. Asian, Indian to mention a couple… they certainly have been discriminated against!

[Topspinmo]

If you could call in sick for a year and get paid, could you in good conscience do it? I couldn’t. Plus, wouldn’t the employer check to see if the employer is really sick? Taking the days without being sick would be fraud, wouldn’t it? I was a professor at a state university for 34 years. I accumulated over 450 days of sick time. If I’d become seriously ill, that sick leave would have been a life saver. I thought I’d simply lose it all when I retired, which is what usually happened. Instead, the state universities, wanting to get rid of those of us who were old and in the way, offered to pay us for one fourth of our sick days in a lump sum if we would retire at the end of the school year. A lot of us took that offer. That’s the only way I could afford to move to The Villages. The rest of those sick days went unused.

Federal employees have very good union and the know who to back.

[Love2Swim]

That would be The Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln on January 1, 1863. June 19, 1865 was merely the day news of it reached some folks in Galveston, Texas.


In 1903, a Black man walked into an office in a small town in Texas, seeking any news about whether slavery had ended. The inquiry from the man, who had been forced to labor without pay, came more than 38 years after Major Gen. Gordon Granger landed on Galveston Island, Texas, with more than 2,000 federal soldiers to deliver the belated news of freedom to enslaved Black people in Texas. Word of the end of bondage for the more than 250,000 enslaved Black people in the state arrived on June 19, 1865 — two years after President Abraham Lincoln’s Emancipation Proclamation.
Despite the clear instructions in General Order No. 3 and the announcement that day by Granger’s men that “the people of Texas are informed that, in accordance with a proclamation from the Executive of the United States, all slaves are free,” not every enslaved Black person in Texas was freed with that proclamation.
Enslavers across the state resisted the general’s order, hiding the news from enslaved Black people. Many Black people were forced to continue to labor under the oppression of ruthless enslavers and unscrupulous plantation owners. In some cases, enslavers killed enslaved Blacks rather than give them their freedom.
Slavery formally ended on Dec. 6, 1865 with ratification of the 13th Amendment which banned the existence of slavery and involuntary servitude in all states.

[Bill14564]

In 1903, a Black man walked into an office in a small town in Texas,
...

You should give credit to the Washington Post article (https://www.washingtonpost.com/history/2022/06/19/juneteenth-texas-black-still-enslaved/) that this post seems to have been taken from.

[OhioBuckeye]

Can’t say I don’t agree with you but to make this a national holiday is a wasted day, for one reason or another!

[Rodneysblue]

Also some states and their school systems now treat Juneteenth as a paid holiday, not Florida though.

I still celebrate George Washington's Birthday on February 22 and Abraham Lincoln's Birthday on February 12 separately. The creation of Presidents' Day was inane.
They should return to the celebration of Washington’s and Lincoln’s birthdays separately.

[Bill14564]

I think a limit on the number of paid holidays would make sense. How about ten for a number? To have a different paid day off just decide which of the current holidays you will do without. Federal employees certainly are not overpaid but at the same time, we ought to get at least a certain amount of work for that pay.

[Geodyssey]

Washington and Lincoln both deserve their own dates for what they did for us.

You mean, "What Lincoln did TO us".

[Stu from NYC]

You mean, "What Lincoln did TO us".

Please do not try to put words in my mouth.

I think Lincoln was one of our greatest presidents and history would have been different if he lived to complete his second term.

[tvbound]

We all know why certain people are whining about this holiday.

Absolutely spot on. With the ultimate irony/hypocrisy being, that many of these same people are vehemently opposed to teaching our children the truth about the ugly parts of our country's history. Starting with the original big lie, that the Founding Fathers truly believed that: "All men are created equal."

[Michael G.]

More "Wokism". What's next? National holiday for homosexuals, transgenders, and illegal immigrants?


Don't forget Nancy Pelosi day, or Rev. Jesse Jackson Day??

[Michael G.]

Please do not try to put words in my mouth.

I think Lincoln was one of our greatest presidents and history would have been different if he lived to complete his second term.

He also kept more slaves then any other president in our time.

[Bill14564]

If also kept more slaves then any other president in our time.

If that sentence is supposed to imply that Lincoln owned slaves, please provide any reputable source for that.

"any other president in our time" Not sure who you include in "our." Lincoln died in 1865 which is about 100 years before *my* time.

[retiredguy123]

They should return to the celebration of Washington’s and Lincoln’s birthdays separately.
Lincoln's birthday was never a Federal holiday.

[golfing eagles]

Absolutely spot on. With the ultimate irony/hypocrisy being, that many of these same people are vehemently opposed to teaching our children the truth about the ugly parts of our country's history. Starting with the original big lie, that the Founding Fathers truly believed that: "All men are created equal."

Not a big lie.

First, the intention was that all men are created equal UNDER THE LAW, clearly not all men are equal

Second, at the time, the slaves were not considered "men"

Still, it does not obviate the lack of teaching the "ugly parts"

[Sherry8bal]

Juneteenth - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juneteenth)

No Federal mail today.

Juneteenth | National Museum of African American History and Culture (https://nmaahc.si.edu/juneteenth)

The Historical Legacy of Juneteenth | National Museum of African American History and Culture (https://nmaahc.si.edu/explore/stories/historical-legacy-juneteenth?fbclid=IwAR2G3q_WDf7nT7U34_rj_fmj6BI2dt MQ3YS29rcD7B1xfrQ9LIXAigrAm4U)

Another waste of taxpayer money giving a small minority group special treatment so all the government workers get another paid holiday. Ridiculous

[billethkid]

Another waste of taxpayer money giving a small minority group special treatment so all the government workers get another paid holiday. Ridiculous

Minority (race), minority groups (insignificant numerically) and special interest groups (also numerically insignificant) are the tail wagging the dog.

[Stu from NYC]

If also kept more slaves then any other president in our time.

Never heard that Abraham Lincoln owned slaves. Believe he was of relatively modest means.

[DaleDivine]

I want President Trump on Mount Rushmore!!!

I'm surprised Mount Rushmore hasn't been blown to bits the way they keep tearing all other statues down.....

:boom::boom::shocked::shocked:

[DonnaNi4os]

In 1903, a Black man walked into an office in a small town in Texas, seeking any news about whether slavery had ended. The inquiry from the man, who had been forced to labor without pay, came more than 38 years after Major Gen. Gordon Granger landed on Galveston Island, Texas, with more than 2,000 federal soldiers to deliver the belated news of freedom to enslaved Black people in Texas. Word of the end of bondage for the more than 250,000 enslaved Black people in the state arrived on June 19, 1865 — two years after President Abraham Lincoln’s Emancipation Proclamation.
Despite the clear instructions in General Order No. 3 and the announcement that day by Granger’s men that “the people of Texas are informed that, in accordance with a proclamation from the Executive of the United States, all slaves are free,” not every enslaved Black person in Texas was freed with that proclamation.
Enslavers across the state resisted the general’s order, hiding the news from enslaved Black people. Many Black people were forced to continue to labor under the oppression of ruthless enslavers and unscrupulous plantation owners. In some cases, enslavers killed enslaved Blacks rather than give them their freedom.
Slavery formally ended on Dec. 6, 1865 with ratification of the 13th Amendment which banned the existence of slavery and involuntary servitude in all states.

Your response is correct and the fact that enslaved people continued to be enslaved intentionally is something we should all find abhorrent. How sad so many people have missed that point.

[OhioBuckeye]

Isn’t Juneteenth a little stupid to be called a holiday, really, how you celebrate Juneteenth day. I’m still scratching my head!

[Bill14564]

Isn’t Juneteenth a little stupid to be called a holiday, really, how you celebrate Juneteenth day. I’m still scratching my head!

How do you celebrate Independence Day, Thanksgiving, or Memorial Day? Juneteenth is certainly similar to one of those.

[JMintzer]

That would be The Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln on January 1, 1863. June 19, 1865 was merely the day news of it reached some folks in Galveston, Texas.

Which was basically an Executive Order.

The proclamation ended slavery in the Confederate states, but it remained legal and it continued in two Union states (Delaware and Kentucky) until the 13th Amendment was ratified on December, 6, 1965, almost 2 years later...

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Do we really need a national holiday now, 155 years later over this?

Apparently we do, because after 155 years, people still think there shouldn't be one.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

If you could call in sick for a year and get paid, could you in good conscience do it? I couldn’t. Plus, wouldn’t the employer check to see if the employer is really sick? Taking the days without being sick would be fraud, wouldn’t it? I was a professor at a state university for 34 years. I accumulated over 450 days of sick time. If I’d become seriously ill, that sick leave would have been a life saver. I thought I’d simply lose it all when I retired, which is what usually happened. Instead, the state universities, wanting to get rid of those of us who were old and in the way, offered to pay us for one fourth of our sick days in a lump sum if we would retire at the end of the school year. A lot of us took that offer. That’s the only way I could afford to move to The Villages. The rest of those sick days went unused.

We weren't allowed to stack more than 2 years worth of sick time, and we got 1 day's pay for each month worked in sick days. That was back when I was still "of childbearing age" so once a month, like clockwork, I'd get a raging migraine and cramps. If that day was a weekday, you better believe I called in sick.

When I left that particular job after almost 5 years, I was not allowed to get paid for any sick days I'd earned and hadn't taken. That was a union job as a secretary for the phone company.

All my retail jobs allowed us to stack sick time for up to 18 months, depending on the company. But we only earned 1 hour's sick time for every 40 hours worked, whether you were full or part time. So if I worked 2 weeks at 20 hours per week, I earned 1 hour of sick time. But I had to fight for it in one of the jobs, where no one got any sick time at all, but the -state- mandated that they give it.

[Stu from NYC]

Apparently we do, because after 155 years, people still think there shouldn't be one.

Slavery was abhorrent and thankfully we got rid of it. Now after all these years do not see that we suddenly need a national holiday to celebrate this.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Slavery was abhorrent and thankfully we got rid of it. Now after all these years do not see that we suddenly need a national holiday to celebrate this.

There should've been a national holiday 154 years ago. Better late than never.

[mtdjed]

Technically, June 19, 1865 does not really represent the date that the slaves in Texas were legally free. The real date would seem to be the effective date of Amendment 13 to the US Constitution that was ratified in Dec 1865. The Emancipation Proclamation issued by Lincoln in 1862 and effective Jan 1, 1863 did not include Texas and several other areas oy the then USA.

It took Congress 6 months of arguing to agree to the Amendment 13. And like now, that arguing was all political. Another proud argument for our caring Congress.

It is hard to imagine how traumatic that freedom would have been to all parties. Joyous but difficult change.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Technically, June 19, 1865 does not really represent the date that the slaves in Texas were legally free. The real date would seem to be the effective date of Amendment 13 to the US Constitution that was ratified in Dec 1865. The Emancipation Proclamation issued by Lincoln in 1862 and effective Jan 1, 1863 did not include Texas and several other areas oy the then USA.

It took Congress 6 months of arguing to agree to the Amendment 13. And like now, that arguing was all political. Another proud argument for our caring Congress.

It is hard to imagine how traumatic that freedom would have been to all parties. Joyous but difficult change.

Effective January 1, 1863, the Emancipation Proclamation absolutely, positively did include Texas. It included ten states: South Carolina, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, Texas, Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina and he named each one in his speech.

It took a year and a half for Texan slaves to be informed that they were no longer slaves, and it took officials from New York and New Jersey to travel there and inform them of it because their own states' officials wouldn't tell them.

[Ele201]

It is not a surprise that most posters here are not in favor of the new Juneteenth holiday. I am also not a fan of so many holidays, but sure as hell support this one. If any historical event in our country deserves a serious national holiday, the elimination of slavery should be near the top.

I agree. It is a very important day for the African American community. They are a vital part of American history and its culture! It is right to respect and honor their community by making Juneteenth a national holiday. It’s their Independence Day.

[krick093]

They should have called it Emancipation Day which is more descriptive and appropriate than saddling it with an Ebonics-sounding name like Juneteenth.

[Love2Swim]

I agree. It is a very important day for the African American community. They are a vital part of American history and its culture! It is right to respect and honor their community by making Juneteenth a national holiday. It’s their Independence Day.

:agree:

[Keefelane66]

They should have called it Emancipation Day which is more descriptive and appropriate than saddling it with an Ebonics-sounding name like Juneteenth.
Someday you’ll learn about Tulsa Massacre and Ax Handle Saturday.

[Michael G.]

Look back in history, you'll find black people had white slaves also.

[Luggage]

When the government closed a few years back because of the budget debackle, very little really changed and you saw work still got done, as needed. Life goes on

[Luggage]

I'm not sure anyone could actually figure out the total wages paid by the government but the same amount of work gets done in one last day with a vacation whether or not they take off. If you run a business you surely know the work will be there the next day for you, the army Navy and Air Force are still there as well as the air traffic controllers and probably the parks and the Federal IRS and the various other departments that are not allowed to be off

[Luggage]

Honestly I would be more concerned with having more school days for our children and running it through the summer as they lose tremendous amount of knowledge for the 160 days they don't go to school during the year. I am approximating but I know Federal you must have about 215 days of schooling for the government to pay the states

[DeeCee Dubya]

You like Lincoln? Why?

[Stu from NYC]

You like Lincoln? Why?

For one he kept the union together but if you would like read a few of the many books written about him.

[Stu from NYC]

Look back in history, you'll find black people had white slaves also.

Not to mention the slave trade in Africa got its start from one tribe attacking another taking captives as slaves and selling them to Muslim slave traders.

[GOLFER54]

Funny how this holiday fell on Fathers Day.

[taruffi57]

It's simple pandering.

[mtdjed]

Effective January 1, 1863, the Emancipation Proclamation absolutely, positively did include Texas. It included ten states: South Carolina, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, Texas, Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina and he named each one in his speech.

It took a year and a half for Texan slaves to be informed that they were no longer slaves, and it took officials from New York and New Jersey to travel there and inform them of it because their own states' officials wouldn't tell them.

Yes, the Emancipation Proclamation was meant to include Texas, but it is said that Texas at that time did not believe that it was a part of the US and thus did nothing to free the slaves. Runaway slaves that made it to Union areas were considered free by the Union, but not by Texans. The EP did not legally abolish slavery. It basically was a war powers act that allowed the Union to free slaves in areas they controlled. It also allowed slavery to continue to exist in areas not in conflict i.e. border states that did not secede. Also, that EP was subject to cancellation by subsequent actions (Courts, Presidents, etc). That is where the 13th Amendment came into play. It legally abolished slavery. The US Senate approved it in 1864, the House in 1865, and required ratification of 3/4 of the states Dec 1865 .

[OhioBuckeye]

Come on man, you sure it wasn’t George Washington that did this to us!

[OhioBuckeye]

Come on your comparing Apples to Orange. Ask a 5 yr. old how we celebrate Independence Day. Now answer my question how do we or you celebrate Juneteenth Day? You can’t say can you! I didn’t think so!

[Bill14564]

Isn’t Juneteenth a little stupid to be called a holiday, really, how you celebrate Juneteenth day. I’m still scratching my head!

How do you celebrate Independence Day, Thanksgiving, or Memorial Day? Juneteenth is certainly similar to one of those.

Come on your comparing Apples to Orange. Ask a 5 yr. old how we celebrate Independence Day. Now answer my question how do we or you celebrate Juneteenth Day? You can’t say can you! I didn’t think so!

I misunderstood the question and gave you more credit than you seem to want.

How have *I* celebrated Juneteenth? The same way I have celebrated Hannukkah - it has not been part of my culture so I have not celebrated it. I imagine most 5 yr olds would have the same answer.

How *will* I celebrate/observe Juneteenth going forward? I am not sure. I need to learn if it is a day of celebration (Independence Day), a day of giving thanks (Thanksgiving), or a day of contemplation (Memorial Day). I will take my clue from those in the community who have had this day as part of their culture for many years. One thing I know I will not do is call it stupid.

[JMintzer]

Effective January 1, 1863, the Emancipation Proclamation absolutely, positively did include Texas. It included ten states: South Carolina, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, Texas, Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina and he named each one in his speech.

It took a year and a half for Texan slaves to be informed that they were no longer slaves, and it took officials from New York and New Jersey to travel there and inform them of it because their own states' officials wouldn't tell them.

You neglected to mention the Union States (Delaware & Kentucky) that were not covered by the Proclamation, and where Slavery remained legal until the 13th Amendment was ratified, almost TWO years later...

[Quixote]

Come on your comparing Apples to Orange. Ask a 5 yr. old how we celebrate Independence Day. Now answer my question how do we or you celebrate Juneteenth Day? You can’t say can you! I didn’t think so!

I could be wrong; it's been a long time since I've had occasion to ask this question of a 5-year-old. But I think he or she would answer something about barbecues and fireworks.

Ask adult Americans why we celebrate both Memorial Day in May and Veterans Day in November, and you may be surprised to learn how many are clueless. Unless, of course, the person asked is one who has no idea....

And speaking of Mount Rushmore mentioned earlier in this thread, check out its history:

"Built on sacred Native American land and sculpted by a man with ties to the Ku Klux Klan, Mount Rushmore National Memorial was fraught with controversy even before it was completed ... on October 31, 1941."

South Dakota’s Mount Rushmore has a strange, scandalous history (https://www.nationalgeographic.com/travel/article/the-strange-and-controversial-history-of-mount-rushmore#:~:text=Built%20on%20sacred%20Native%20Am erican,ago%20on%20October%2031%2C%201941).

[Taltarzac725]

Funny how this holiday fell on Fathers Day.

Father's Day in the US is the third Sunday in June--


2021 date June 20
2022 date June 19
2023 date June 18
2024 date June 16

From Wikipedia.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I agree. It is a very important day for the African American community. They are a vital part of American history and its culture! It is right to respect and honor their community by making Juneteenth a national holiday. It’s their Independence Day.

It's not their Independence Day and it's not their Emancipation Day. It's the "your own state wanted you to stay slaves so they refused to tell you what you should have known over a year ago: that you have been free all this time" day.

Emancipation day happened prior to this event. It just took a year and a half for slaves in Texas to be informed of it.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I think a limit on the number of paid holidays would make sense. How about ten for a number? To have a different paid day off just decide which of the current holidays you will do without. Federal employees certainly are not overpaid but at the same time, we ought to get at least a certain amount of work for that pay.

I'm all in favor of getting rid of Easter Sunday, Good Friday, and Christmas as federal holidays. Those are religious holidays and shouldn't be mandated as a paid day off for government employees or officials.

HOWEVER - I'm ALSO in favor of adding two PERSONAL RELIGIOUS days off to all federal employees -instead,- so that people of ALL faiths can be guaranteed that right to take their most holy/important day(s) off with pay, whether it's Christmas of Yom Kippur or the first day of Ramadan or the pagan Beltane afternoon, or the athiest "because everyone else gets their day off so this one's mine" day.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Father's Day in the US is the third Sunday in June--



From Wikipedia.

Yeah that means if it falls on a Sunday, those government employees won't get paid anyway since they don't work on Sundays.

But those who -do- work on Sundays, who are Black dads, get that added benefit of being Fathers' Day once or twice every decade. Now there's an awesome Fathers' Day present! The FREEDOM of not having to work on Fathers' Day, and getting paid for it.

[Bill14564]

I'm all in favor of getting rid of Easter Sunday, Good Friday, and Christmas as federal holidays. Those are religious holidays and shouldn't be mandated as a paid day off for government employees or officials.

HOWEVER - I'm ALSO in favor of adding two PERSONAL RELIGIOUS days off to all federal employees -instead,- so that people of ALL faiths can be guaranteed that right to take their most holy/important day(s) off with pay, whether it's Christmas of Yom Kippur or the first day of Ramadan or the pagan Beltane afternoon, or the athiest "because everyone else gets their day off so this one's mine" day.

Apparently, you are not aware that Easter Sunday and Good Friday are not Federal holidays. Christmas Day is, of course, but it's not going anywhere.

Federal employees already have sufficient leave to be able to take their religious holiday off. But if it's important to take something away then take away President's Day and MLKJ Day to make your two flex days.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Apparently, you are not aware that Easter Sunday and Good Friday are not Federal holidays. Christmas Day is, of course, but it's not going anywhere.

Federal employees already have sufficient leave to be able to take their religious holiday off. But if it's important to take something away then take away President's Day and MLKJ Day to make your two flex days.

Then eliminate just Christmas and swap it out with a "personal religious day." Christians should be able to take Christmas off with pay but have to work on Yom Kippur, Jews should be able to take Yom Kippur off with pay but have to work on Christmas, etc. etc.

The only reason that doesn't actually work, is because most people in this country are Christian, and you'd end up understaffed on Christmas. You would -not- be understaffed on Yom Kippur.

So rather than allow everyone to have their designated religious holiday off with pay in ADDITION to all the other days off their employer gives them, the country designated Christmas as a federal holiday. And Jews still have to use up one of their personal days to get THEIR holy day off with pay.

[Bill14564]

Yeah that means if it falls on a Sunday, those government employees won't get paid anyway since they don't work on Sundays.

But those who -do- work on Sundays, who are Black dads, get that added benefit of being Fathers' Day once or twice every decade. Now there's an awesome Fathers' Day present! The FREEDOM of not having to work on Fathers' Day, and getting paid for it.

WHAT??? What does the color of one's skin have to do with Father's day? How do you figure that Black dads will get a paid day off for Father's Day once or twice every decade?

Father's Day will ALWAYS fall on a Sunday and is unlikely to ever be a paid holiday.

Juneteenth ALWAYS falls on June 19 but, due to Federal regulations, if it falls on a weekend then it is observed on either Friday or Monday. Federal workers will always have a paid day off for Juneteenth.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You neglected to mention the Union States (Delaware & Kentucky) that were not covered by the Proclamation, and where Slavery remained legal until the 13th Amendment was ratified, almost TWO years later...

I didn't neglect to mention it. I was referring to the reason for this particular holiday known as Juneteenth. Juneteenth has nothing to do with the 13th Amendment, or Kentucky, or Delaware. It has to do with slaves in a state where slavery was technically abolished, being informed that slavery was abolished, 1.5 years after the president of the United States at the time proclaimed that it had been abolished.

It is a reminder that freedom prevails, whether you like it or not, and that free people WILL be informed about their freedom, whether you like it or not.

If you have a problem with that, then you are invited to live in a country where slaves are never told that they are free.

[golfing eagles]

I don't care for the name. Should we refer to 911 as Sepleventh?? Or independence Day as the Jurth???? Regardless, I would prefer that this holiday be the date on which the Emancipation Proclamation was signed. Due to the slow communications of the day, slaves were "freed" on different days throughout the US. In some ways their descendants aren't even free today. But the common date would be when Lincoln signed the EP, not when a small city in Texas got the word. (yes, I realize the news was deliberately withheld)

[Stu from NYC]

Why can we not be happy that slavery was ended without adding another national holiday to the mix?

[golfing eagles]

Why can we not be happy that slavery was ended without adding another national holiday to the mix?

Maybe. But you know there will be posts that follow that suggest we should be happy Christ was born without celebrating Christmas and that we're happy the pilgrims survived their first winter and that the Declaration of Independence was signed without celebrating their respective holidays.

[JMintzer]

I didn't neglect to mention it. I was referring to the reason for this particular holiday known as Juneteenth. Juneteenth has nothing to do with the 13th Amendment, or Kentucky, or Delaware. It has to do with slaves in a state where slavery was technically abolished, being informed that slavery was abolished, 1.5 years after the president of the United States at the time proclaimed that it had been abolished.

It is a reminder that freedom prevails, whether you like it or not, and that free people WILL be informed about their freedom, whether you like it or not.

If you have a problem with that, then you are invited to live in a country where slaves are never told that they are free.

Freedom prevails, unless you were a slave in Delaware or Kentucky...

Then, the Emancipation Proclamation meant bupkiss...

And please show me where I said or implied I was unhappy with anyone's freedom...

Or was that just a snarky insult aimed at me?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Why can we not be happy that slavery was ended without adding another national holiday to the mix?

Why can't Christians be happy some brown-skinned middle-eastern was born on the other side of the planet, and some Europeans on the other side of the planet turned him into a white guy with blue eyes and drew pictures of him hanging from a cross, and not add another national holiday into the mix?

Why can't Americans be happy that the settlers murdered the people who already lived here, brought them disease, raped their women, and then forced them to live on reservations, without it being a national holiday?

Why can't Americans be happy that Christopher Columbus did NOT come to what we know as the USA, he never set foot here, but that he DID spread disease to the Caribbean, which then spread to the North American continent. Why can't we not have a holiday to celebrate that?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Maybe. But you know there will be posts that follow that suggest we should be happy Christ was born without celebrating Christmas and that we're happy the pilgrims survived their first winter and that the Declaration of Independence was signed without celebrating their respective holidays.

Exactly. What is it about Christmas that makes it so uniquely and profoundly American that it must be a national holiday? And what is it about "thanksgiving" that should make us "proud" to be Americans deserving of a national holiday commemorating it? And what is it about Columbus, who never actually set foot on this continent, that makes him deserve his own national holiday in this country?

Answer: nothing. Not a darned thing. And yet, they get their national holidays. I see no problem with Juneteenth.

[Battlebasset]

I still work. Our company gave it to us as a "floating" holiday, meaning we could take it when we wanted. So the company remained open on June 19, and I got an extra day off. Win win, in my book.

[mtdjed]

I don't care for the name. Should we refer to 911 as Sepleventh?? Or independence Day as the Jurth???? Regardless, I would prefer that this holiday be the date on which the Emancipation Proclamation was signed. Due to the slow communications of the day, slaves were "freed" on different days throughout the US. In some ways their descendants aren't even free today. But the common date would be when Lincoln signed the EP, not when a small city in Texas got the word. (yes, I realize the news was deliberately withheld)
Slow communications were not a problem at that time, as Telegraph existed allowing for almost instant communication to central offices. EP did not abolish slavery. It was a step to free slaves in certain areas. Most of these areas were not under Union control and had to wait until they were under Union Control before actions to Free Slaves could be accomplished effectively. I saw one description that stated that the Unions issuance of the EP could be compared to Hitler telling opponents the lay down their arms and surrender.

Amendment 13 was the attempt to abolish Slavery (in almost all cases) in the USA.

[Bill14564]

Slow communications were not a problem at that time, as Telegraph existed allowing for almost instant communication to central offices. EP did not abolish slavery. It was a step to free slaves in certain areas. Most of these areas were not under Union control and had to wait until they were under Union Control before actions to Free Slaves could be accomplished effectively. I saw one description that stated that the Unions issuance of the EP could be compared to Hitler telling opponents the lay down their arms and surrender.

Amendment 13 was the attempt to abolish Slavery (in almost all cases) in the USA.

Not quite the way I understand it.

In 1862 Lincoln threatened/promised the Confederate States that if they did not rejoin the Union he would free their slaves at the beginning of 1863. The Emancipation Proclamation does just that - frees the slaves in the areas that were still fighting against the Union.

Obviously, the states that had decided to continue the conflict were not about to abide by the Proclamation voluntarily. Therefore, it was necessary for those states to come under Union control before the Proclamation could be enforced. In June, 1865 the Union army entered Texas to enforce the laws of the Union including the Emancipation Proclamation.

Slaves were freed in most of the Confederate States by the Emancipation Proclamation, the last being Texas in June, 1865. Slaves were freed in all remaining states and counties by the 13th amendment.

At least that's the way I read the history.

[Lindsyburnsy]

Well, let's try Christmas for starters.

[Bay Kid]

Only a holiday if you work for the govern, banks or stock market. Everybody else didn't get paid not to work.

[golfing eagles]

Why can we not be happy that slavery was ended without adding another national holiday to the mix?

Maybe. But you know there will be posts that follow that suggest we should be happy Christ was born without celebrating Christmas and that we're happy the pilgrims survived their first winter and that the Declaration of Independence was signed without celebrating their respective holidays.

Exactly. What is it about Christmas that makes it so uniquely and profoundly American that it must be a national holiday? And what is it about "thanksgiving" that should make us "proud" to be Americans deserving of a national holiday commemorating it? And what is it about Columbus, who never actually set foot on this continent, that makes him deserve his own national holiday in this country?

Answer: nothing. Not a darned thing. And yet, they get their national holidays. I see no problem with Juneteenth.

Prediction made and fulfilled. Not hard to be a psychic on this site :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[JMintzer]

Prediction made and fulfilled. Not hard to be a psychic on this site :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Stevie Wonder could have seen that coming... :1rotfl:

[Taltarzac725]

The Great Courses (https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/americas-long-struggle-against-slavery)

America's Long Struggle against Slavery
Richard Bell, PhD Professor, University of Maryland, College Park

This might be worth a look.

Many historical views of American slavery only look at small parts of this enormous struggle, focusing on single events or a small segment of famous figures. But to understand America—to fully understand our country today—one must examine the whole history of struggle, oppression, and resistance, not only by famous figures like Abraham Lincoln and Harriet Tubman, but also by an enormous and often unfamiliar cast of characters, including:

The “saltwater slaves” who revolted aboard slave ships and chose suicide over an unknown future;
Phibbah Thistlewood, a woman who made the best of her situation to bridge the gap between her master and her fellow slaves;
David Walker, Nat Turner, and other figures calling for immediate, urgent action; and
Northern Quakers, pamphleteers, preachers, and school teachers who changed the political tide.

[billethkid]

Wow.
Some folks hauling a helluva burden of dislike for way too much of which has been acceptable and part of most of our lives .....until now!?
Must be depressing!

[Wyseguy]

Something Paula Patton Paula Patton - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paula_Patton) posted on Facebook today--

So much can be said.

[Wyseguy]

I didn't neglect to mention it. I was referring to the reason for this particular holiday known as Juneteenth. Juneteenth has nothing to do with the 13th Amendment, or Kentucky, or Delaware. It has to do with slaves in a state where slavery was technically abolished, being informed that slavery was abolished, 1.5 years after the president of the United States at the time proclaimed that it had been abolished.

It is a reminder that freedom prevails, whether you like it or not, and that free people WILL be informed about their freedom, whether you like it or not.

If you have a problem with that, then you are invited to live in a country where slaves are never told that they are free.

Do you see at all that what we were taught growing up (people should be judged on the content of character not color of their skin) is now being criticized? In many ways the teaching of MLK is contrary to what is believed in the movement BLM.

[Wyseguy]

[quote=

[Wyseguy]

ddddddddddddddddddddd

[Stu from NYC]

Do you see at all that what we were taught growing up (people should be judged on the content of character not color of their skin) is now being criticized? In many ways the teaching of MLK is contrary to what is believed in the movement BLM.

Character counts. Wish George Floyd had some.

[Love2Swim]

Character counts. Wish George Floyd had some.
I wish some of the people posting on this thread had some. Shameful.

[MDLNB]

He also kept more slaves then any other president in our time.
And if I am not mistaken, Lincoln also shipped a bunch of blacks to Africa where the settlement became known as Liberia. There is a lot more to it than that, but still.....

[MDLNB]

A Texas holiday, not really relevant to the Whole U.S. of A. A federal holiday to show how lucky the slaves were in Texas to finally be recognized as free slaves? And the whole country celebrates the embarrassing screw up of Texas?

[golfing eagles]

And if I am not mistaken, Lincoln also shipped a bunch of blacks to Africa where the settlement became known as Liberia. There is a lot more to it than that, but still.....

You are. James Monroe. And that’s why the capital of Liberia is Monrovia