Flight Cancellations

[retiredguy123]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?

[golfing eagles]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?

If only they had all those in the same place at the same time

Yet, yesterday, 1200 pilots had the spare time to protest/picket for more money, less hours, more benefits, "job security" (figure that one) and "better working conditions" (luxury cockpits???).

[MartinSE]

There are a lot of reasons, I assume you know them, and are just upset they do it.

Weather, not enough seats sold to pay for the fuel, COVID, etc etc etc.

[manaboutown]

The pilots are too busy to fly as they are shaking down their employers for more pay for less work. More than 1,200 Delta pilots picket at 7 major airports to call for higher pay : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1109137857/delta-pilots-picket-major-airports-call-for-higher-pay)

Southwest Airlines pilots picket, say they'''re tired of being understaffed and overworked (https://www.fox4news.com/news/southwest-airlines-pilots-say-theyre-understaffed-and-overworked)

Year ago I used to fly AmericaWest (known as AmericaWorst to flight crews as well as passengers). For quite a while the pilots were having flights delayed and canceled for any trivial excuse they could imagine. For months it was a nightmare of missed connections, losing great upgrade seats when they canceled my flights and crammed me into middle seats of other flights, getting stuck overnight in connecting cities and so on. One day I was up in first class and the pilot was pulling some stunt about why he could not take off due to a light on the console not working properly. A guy near me pulled out his FAA credentials and waved them at the pilot and told him to get the plane in the air or he would get written up. We took off in minutes.

[Babubhat]

FAA Jacksonville horrendously understaffed. Fouls up the East Coast, especially Florida. Inexcusable.

The FAA has admitted that it too is understaffed, particularly at a key air traffic control center in Florida.

Calio said that facility, near Jacksonville, Florida, has been understaffed for 27 of the last 30 days, “which is crippling to the entire East Coast traffic flows.”

[rjm1cc]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?

Because they do not have all of these resources at the time needed. My assumption is not flying the trip costs them money and if they could fly the trip they would make a profit.

[MartinSE]

The pilots are too busy to fly as they are shaking down their employers for more pay for less work. More than 1,200 Delta pilots picket at 7 major airports to call for higher pay : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1109137857/delta-pilots-picket-major-airports-call-for-higher-pay)

Southwest Airlines pilots picket, say they'''re tired of being understaffed and overworked (https://www.fox4news.com/news/southwest-airlines-pilots-say-theyre-understaffed-and-overworked)

Year ago I used to fly AmericaWest (known as AmericaWorst to flight crews as well as passengers). For quite a while the pilots were having flights delayed and canceled for any trivial excuse they could imagine. For months it was a nightmare of missed connections, losing great upgrade seats when they canceled my flights and crammed me into middle seats of other flights, getting stuck overnight in connecting cities and so on. One day I was up in first class and the pilot was pulling some stunt about why he could not take off due to a light on the console not working properly. A guy near me pulled out his FAA credentials and waved them at the pilot and told him to get the plane in the air or he would get written up. We took off in minutes.

Cool, so some guy that worked at the FAA (clerk?) waves his badge and all the lives on that plane are put in jeopardy. Let me know when you fly so I can avoid that flight.

[MartinSE]

FAA Jacksonville horrendously understaffed. Fouls up the East Coast, especially Florida. Inexcusable.

The FAA has admitted that it too is understaffed, particularly at a key air traffic control center in Florida.

Calio said that facility, near Jacksonville, Florida, has been understaffed for 27 of the last 30 days, “which is crippling to the entire East Coast traffic flows.”

Sounds about right. I wonder why they are understaffed?

[tophcfa]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?

Boy do we miss the pre-pandemic airline industry. Multiple daily non stop round trip options from up north (BDL) to Orlando were always available for under $300 and the flights were typically reliable and on time. Now most carriers have one flight per day, leaving either very early or very late, the cost has more than doubled, cancellations and delays are the norm, and rebooking options are severely limited. Looks like we will continue to be forced to make the 2,720 mile round trip drive three or four times per year and suck up the close to $5 per gallon cost for gas.

On another note, I feel sorry for the private drivers who used to be able to show up for a flight arrival and the plane was there and on time. Flight cancellations and delays (not to mention the cost of fuel) have made their jobs a nightmare.

[manaboutown]

Cool, so some guy that worked at the FAA (clerk?) waves his badge and all the lives on that plane are put in jeopardy. Let me know when you fly so I can avoid that flight.

Nope. He was a high up FAA official and he KNEW the pilot was pulling a fast one. It was a time of pilot unrest in that airline.

I flew that airline extensively and was in the Chairman's Club, their top level frequent flier category requiring 100,000 miles flown per year. I knew several pilots, flight attendants and even gate agents in three airports well. Several of them had confided in me what was going on within the ranks. This time it was the pilots; other times it was flight attendants. The airline was not well run. It consequently merged into US Airways (Useless Airways) and then into American Airlines.

I was on this flight. Fortunately the pilot and crew were top drawer! Smoke Detected in lavatory; US Airways Express Flight Makes Emergency Landing | George Hatcher's Air Flight Disaster (https://airflightdisaster.com/smoke-detected-in-lavatory-us-airways-express-flight-makes-emergency-landing/)

Growing up near Kirtland Air Force Base early on I developed an interest in aviation. I recall on my first ride as a passenger in a private plane from Ruidoso to ABQ the pilot who was giving me a free hop home told me that he needed to wait until the weather cleared at ABQ before we could take off. We waited a couple hours, got the clearance and took off. He explained to me "There are old pilots and there are bold pilots but there are no old bold pilots." I took that advice, unlike JFK Jr! 10 mistakes JFK Jr. made - AOPA (https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2010/july/pilot/10-mistakes-jfk-jr-made)

[Michael G.]

I and some golfing buddies were flying out of state to golf, and our flight was cancelled until the next day
because of plane malfunction.

We took a taxi to a motel that night and was telling the taxi driver what happen.

He laughed out loud and told us many times the pilots show up at the airport drunk. :plane:

This is truly a sad world

[manaboutown]

I and some golfing buddies were flying out of state to golf, and our flight was cancelled until the next day
because of plane malfunction.

We took a taxi to a motel that night and was telling the taxi driver what happen.

He laughed out loud and told us many times the pilots show up at the airport drunk. :plane:

This is truly a sad world

Two America West Pilots Sent to Prison for Drunkenness | Aviation Pros (https://www.aviationpros.com/home/news/10433618/two-america-west-pilots-sent-to-prison-for-drunkenness)

For a brief period about 15 years ago I dated a United Airlines pilot I met at the Daily Grill in the Bradley terminal at LAX. She was British, flew 777s to and from Heathrow. I soon quit dating her due to her very heavy drinking habits and turned her name into a United Airlines flight surgeon I knew well. Never asked what happened but last time I checked she was still flying for United!

[Babubhat]

Don’t forget the weather. For every lightning strike baggage handlers take 20 minutes off.

Around 4:30 p.m. on Friday, FAA’s website showed ground stops in place – meaning no planes could take off or land – at all three major New York airports, all three major Washington, D.C., airports, along with Atlanta (ATL), Charlotte (CLT), Orlando (MCO), Philadelphia (PHL) and Chicago-O’Hare (ORD).

[Keefelane66]

If only they had all those in the same place at the same time

Yet, yesterday, 1200 pilots had the spare time to protest/picket for more money, less hours, more benefits, "job security" (figure that one) and "better working conditions" (luxury cockpits???).
The Delta Pilot were off duty and scheduled an informational picket between 10am-12noon. They have been in protracted contract negotiations for 5 years.

[manaboutown]

American Airlines glitch leaves thousands of flights without key crew | Fox Business (https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/american-airlines-glitch-thousands-flight-without-crew?intcmp=fb_fnc&fbclid=IwAR3zK5O_5HJgwz8BOLb12t9aAvhkOatRtgj7hl3n2 dgWreyngv5fXtWNgBg)

[bobeaston]

It seems no one remembers that all of the airlines, being obedient to Saint Fauci, fired people for not getting the jab. The combination of firings, layoffs, and voluntary retirements due to government pressures have left the airlines (and many other industries) very short of staff.

[crash]

Sounds about right. I wonder why they are understaffed?

Because they under pay those starting out so the supply of new pilots dwindles. My son started at $23,000 a year with $100,000 of student loans. In his class was a air force pilot with 20 years experience being paid that and being on call he quit and went and did something else.

[Villages Kahuna]

Where did you get all those “facts”? Looks like more Fake News.

[Larchap49]

Two America West Pilots Sent to Prison for Drunkenness | Aviation Pros (https://www.aviationpros.com/home/news/10433618/two-america-west-pilots-sent-to-prison-for-drunkenness)

For a brief period about 15 years ago I dated a United Airlines pilot I met at the Daily Grill in the Bradley terminal at LAX. She was British, flew 777s to and from Heathrow. I soon quit dating her due to her very heavy drinking habits and turned her name into a United Airlines flight surgeon I knew well. Never asked what happened but last time I checked she was still flying for United!

Motto used to be 24 hrs bottle to throttle, now it's 12 hrs. That's progress I guess

[talonip]

I and some golfing buddies were flying out of state to golf, and our flight was cancelled until the next day
because of plane malfunction.

We took a taxi to a motel that night and was telling the taxi driver what happen.

He laughed out loud and told us many times the pilots show up at the airport drunk. :plane:

This is truly a sad world
I was an airline pilot for 33 years. Only once did I have a questionable pilot. It turns out he was ok. That is a false statement against a very honorable profession. This thread ignores the reality of the political environment we are in. When jet fuel goes through the roof it decimates the airlines and you become the victim of hard choices the airlines have to make. Airline operations are one of the most complex operations that you can’t imagine. Please hold your tongue.

[GizmoWhiskers]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?

Bought plane tickets yesterday... an interesting experience... is it possible that A A is becoming the socialist/communist choice takeover for travel in the US?

When I was in my first Walmart many many moons ago and saw the 20 or more registers with only 3 open with a swarm of waiting shoppers with melting frozen food... my eyes were opened. It's coming... AA the Walmart of the sky...

Perhaps the pilots picketing is the last line of defense attempting to preserve freedom in travel?

Ticket on AA to DC from Orlando $105 plus the b s sticker bumps. AA from PA back to here 1 wk later... over $300 to $600 before the b s sticker bumps.

Pawns in a game...

[SandyPd56]

Sounds about right. I wonder why they are understaffed?

When Covid hit, a lot of pilots decided to take their retirement early, so there is now a shortage and most airlines have had to cut a lot of flights. I know that some airlines do not pay their flight crews for the time they spend getting the aircraft ready and during boarding. They only get paid once the flights are in the air. I'm guessing that may be why they are picketing? Can't say for sure!

[Dusty_Star]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?
I would rather be safe than sorry.

[Vikingjunior]

Hey nobody wants to hear the truth around here. We just want lies to justify our opinions.

[Captainpd]

Once again, stupidity raises its ugly head. People who know absolutely nothing about how airlines work are now experts. They acquired this knowledge because their flight was canceled. Airlines are in the business of moving people. When airplanes don't fly, they don't make money. Flight crews are paid by the "moving" minutes. Brake release starts their pay, brakes set at the gate ends their pay. Absolutely dozens of outside events that are out of they airlines control effect their business model. Pilots get time off and if they want to spend that time protesting their job conditions, it's their right. Pilots have the lowest % of alcohol related work problems. Somebody quotes a cab driver about his "experience" with pilots and this person thinks that that is a reliable source. Get a grip people, pilots aren't the problem.

[Manders]

The pilots are too busy to fly as they are shaking down their employers for more pay for less work. More than 1,200 Delta pilots picket at 7 major airports to call for higher pay : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1109137857/delta-pilots-picket-major-airports-call-for-higher-pay)

Southwest Airlines pilots picket, say they'''re tired of being understaffed and overworked (https://www.fox4news.com/news/southwest-airlines-pilots-say-theyre-understaffed-and-overworked)

Year ago I used to fly AmericaWest (known as AmericaWorst to flight crews as well as passengers). For quite a while the pilots were having flights delayed and canceled for any trivial excuse they could imagine. For months it was a nightmare of missed connections, losing great upgrade seats when they canceled my flights and crammed me into middle seats of other flights, getting stuck overnight in connecting cities and so on. One day I was up in first class and the pilot was pulling some stunt about why he could not take off due to a light on the console not working properly. A guy near me pulled out his FAA credentials and waved them at the pilot and told him to get the plane in the air or he would get written up. We took off in minutes.

100% BS…. Your interpretation of what happened is skewed and misinformed. As a actual professional pilot that story NEVER happen. The FAA,pilot, and airline would all be fined if the events happened as you described. Please, quit spreading false and misleading information.

I’ve found through the years the public interpretation of events wildly varies from facts.

[airstreamingypsy]

Over a million people have died of Covid, maybe some were pilots?

[Andyb]

A good question for our Secretary of Transportation. Seems he won’t or can’t answer the question.

[BlackHarley]

Pilot in Command always has the final say in whether a flight will happen or not. FAA, ATC or whomever does not have the authority to over ride the PIC. Now if he was drunk as a skunk from hanging in the lounge a little too late, that's a direct violation of FAA rules and regs and he will be relieved of command in a heart beat.

[Tadpole]

I am so thankful my flying days are over! I flew to over 100 countries as a tourist from 1970 to 2000. Easy boarding, no body searches, rarely any inconveniences. Even the coach lounges had a bar area setup where people could gather and have a party. Those were the days when flying was actually an enjoyable part of the trip. I wouldn't get on a plane now if they paid me.

[ThirdOfFive]

Motto used to be 24 hrs bottle to throttle, now it's 12 hrs. That's progress I guess
The rule for American pilots is eight hours, bottle-to-throttle; at least it was in 2019, unless it has changed:

14 CFR § 91.17

a) No person may act or attempt to act as a crewmember of a civil aircraft –
(1) Within 8 hours after the consumption of any alcoholic beverage;
(2) While under the influence of alcohol;
(3) While using any drug that affects the person’s faculties in any way contrary to safety; or
(4) While having an alcohol concentration of 0.04 or greater in a blood or breath specimen. Alcohol concentration means grams of alcohol per deciliter of blood or grams of alcohol per 210 liters of breath

The above was issued to clarify the rule in question which was deemed confusing. The new revision was issued, it was rumored, so that even the drunkest pilot could understand it. It takes the average-sized male about 5 hours to completely sober up from .08 BAC but if you're an habitually heavy drinker, a binge of even up to .20 is not uncommon, and then sobering up could take time well into the next day.

Scary. For my part I think every ATP pilot should be subject to a breathalyzer test before he or she boards the aircraft. They're not the most accurate way of measuring BAC but even the reality of having to face such a test the morning after would be enough, I would think, to alert Mr. or Ms. Pilot to the fact that they should practice moderation the night before.

[kendi]

I and some golfing buddies were flying out of state to golf, and our flight was cancelled until the next day
because of plane malfunction.

We took a taxi to a motel that night and was telling the taxi driver what happen.

He laughed out loud and told us many times the pilots show up at the airport drunk. :plane:

This is truly a sad world

Best not to take the driver’s comment as absolute fact. Gossip runs rampant esp when the content is shocking.

[Jsan143]

You’re clueless, luxury cockpits? Try being away from your family four days a week in crappy hotel rooms. Eating airport fast food in between flights, navigate around the weather, missing the holidays, by the way, hope you enjoy the Fourth of July! I can go on and on this from a retired airbus captain telling you If you think it’s as glorious as in the movies see if you can catch a ride with a crew for a month! By the way they’ve been negotiating a contract for seven years now with the inability to strike because of the Railway labor act which BENEFITS guess who the company. If you want to know what my pension is after 40 years at one of the top three major airlines, I’ll give you a hint it might’ve covered the car payment for a pinto back in the 70s! And that’s thanks to the bankruptcy back in 2012. They kick the can when times are good and then negotiate when times are bad and there’s no retro thanks to Railway labor act this is what they all do and the employees have to seek relief to strike which they never get. And when you’re in the airplane in the crews have been out there for over 10 hours still trying to get you to your Disney vacation I think they’re worth every penny and then 1000 time more! Safe travels, well you can always go on one of those low budget airlines, enjoy!

[coconutmama]

You’re clueless, luxury cockpits? Try being away from your family four days a week in crappy hotel rooms. Eating airport fast food in between flights, navigate around the weather, missing the holidays, by the way, hope you enjoy the Fourth of July! I can go on and on this from a retired airbus captain telling you If you think it’s as glorious as in the movies see if you can catch a ride with a crew for a month! By the way they’ve been negotiating a contract for seven years now with the inability to strike because of the Railway labor act which BENEFITS guess who the company. If you want to know what my pension is after 40 years at one of the top three major airlines, I’ll give you a hint it might’ve covered the car payment for a pinto back in the 70s! And that’s thanks to the bankruptcy back in 2012. They kick the can when times are good and then negotiate when times are bad and there’s no retro thanks to Railway labor act this is what they all do and the employees have to seek relief to strike which they never get. And when you’re in the airplane in the crews have been out there for over 10 hours still trying to get you to your Disney vacation I think they’re worth every penny and then 1000 time more! Safe travels, well you can always go on one of those low budget airlines, enjoy!

Great response.

[ElDiabloJoe]

I know someone who is very risk averse. They told me recently, "If there aren't enough pilots, etc. to fly the plane, what makes you think they have enough mechanics to keep them airworthy?"

Yeaaaaaah, I don't fly as much anymore. She made sense.

[Heytubes]

Remember, truck drivers have to be off so many hours, so do pilots.

[manaboutown]

Remember, truck drivers have to be off so many hours, so do pilots.

Yes, over the years I experienced flight cancellations from time to time as the incoming flight was so late the pilots booked for my flight ran out of time left in their shift to operate my flight and no other crews were available. This happened too frequently for me on the last AA flight of the day (night) from PHX to ABQ. At least I received a voucher to overnight in PHX. Better safe than dead. Nevertheless I tried to avoid booking this iffy flight whenever I could although occasionally my earlier connecting flight was canceled and I was stuck with it.

[waterflower]

Maybe they are tired of being forced to partake in pharmaceutical experiments. How many pilots have died in the past 2 years. Is it below or above average. Interview the group of pilots instead of believing the TELL-A-VISION.

[Serendipatti]

I just keep wondering what they did with the gazzilions of dollars of Covid relief money they took.

[Kenswing]

I just keep wondering what they did with the gazzilions of dollars of Covid relief money they took.
They stayed in business.
When my wife’s parents were sick she was flying twice a month to help take care of them. Many of the flights she was on had fewer than 10 people onboard.
The government mandated that the airlines continue to fly. Without being subsidized they would have gone out of business and we would have been in worse shape than we are now.

[skarra]

It seems no one remembers that all of the airlines, being obedient to Saint Fauci, fired people for not getting the jab. The combination of firings, layoffs, and voluntary retirements due to government pressures have left the airlines (and many other industries) very short of staff.


Many people left the industry - early retirement, packages. The airlines were preparing for a long downturn which has turned out not to be the case thanks to the heroes like Fauci and team for educating us as to the benefits of masks and vaccines.

Sadly we have forgotten all that we learnt about remaining safe and Covid is making a regurgence, although luckily no longer deadly.

[rothbear]

the pilots; other times it was flight attendants. The airline was not well run. It consequently merged into US Airways (Useless Airways) and then into American Airlines.


I thought I was the only one that referred to them as "Useless Air". I flew out of Pittsburgh when it was a hub for them for 10 years in the 80s and 90s. At least once a week and sometimes twice. Security, before 9/11, knew me by sight and name and usually just waved me through. I can remember a lot of delays and many cancellations with ridiculous re-routes. Had to go from Pgh to Lexington, KY via Buffalo, back to Pgh, then to Louisville and then drive to Lexington arriving at 3am to my hotel all due to cancellations.

[Hardlyworking]

Anyone remember Peoples Express? We’d fly from Dulles to Newark pretty regular. You paid for your ticket in flight.

[Siegfried]

Filled with the logical fallacy "appeal to authority" and crammed with anecdotal information, this is one of the most grotesque postings I have had the misfortune of reading.

Airlines flying is a complex business depending on a large number of job descriptions to all perform their tasks in a timely and efficient manner. They are regularly graded on their efficiency.

Flights that do not leave the gate, lose money for their airline. They also garner heat from the FAA. Pilots who do not fly, do not get paid. If they do not fly their maximum number of hours for the month, that money is lost forever.

What a business: Airlines have no control over the cost of jet fuel in the future. They order new aircraft 10 years in advance. They depend on Air Traffic Control to be fully staffed and operating at peak efficiency. Government hiring agendas have embraced a philosophy of quota hiring in order to level the pigmentation and sexual preference playing field.

Would you invest in such an industry?

[Two Bills]

It's the same all over Europe.
Baggage handling, not enough flight crews, and overbooking the main cause of cancellations and holdups.
Two weeks ago, son in law and I had to drive from UK to Geneva Switzerland to fetch grandson back after flight cancelled and told by airline they would have nothing to get him back for two days.
All other flights were fully booked.
He had important end of school exams, which basically would decide his entrance to Air Force, hopefully for pilot training, and that was our only option.
Done it with 10 hours to spare for a nights sleep, and now hold our breath until August when results are published.
At 82 yoa I do not need all this excitement!!

[zigzag]

On June 27 our American LGA to CLT flight failed to push back on time due to gate agents who started the boarding process late and were very slow in loading passengers (the equipment and crew were on board and ready). As a result, we sat on the ramp after pushback and lost our ATC take off slot. Then we had to go back to the gate to refuel. Missed our CLT connection and rebooked on a 6 PM departure. Waited on a First Officer and Flight Attendants. At 9 PM the FA's arrived and boarded. At 10 PM the FO arrived to cheers from waiting passengers. As soon as he punched in the flight was cancelled. I asked him why and he replied that the FA's had run out of hours. After a two hour wait we rebooked for the next morning. The hotel then sold our pre-paid guaranteed room and we slept in the lobby.
Point is, why would American operations not know in advance that on a projected 10 PM departure the FA's would go out of hours and cancel us hours earlier, giving us a chance to rebook to what became the last flight to MCO, a 9 PM departure?
Pure incompetence on the part of operations and management.
Where did the $54 billion we gave the airlines for COVID relief end up? Not in training or replacing laid off personnel/crews!

[xcaligirl]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?
They laid off many employees during the pandemic and if a pilot doesn’t have hours of flight time, he can’t fly! I think the biggest problem is the “shortage” of pilots. Simple fix..they shouldn’t be selling more tickets until the problem is under control!!

[tibbetts]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?
No Jet fuel.

[manaboutown]

On June 27 our American LGA to CLT flight failed to push back on time due to gate agents who started the boarding process late and were very slow in loading passengers (the equipment and crew were on board and ready). As a result, we sat on the ramp after pushback and lost our ATC take off slot. Then we had to go back to the gate to refuel. Missed our CLT connection and rebooked on a 6 PM departure. Waited on a First Officer and Flight Attendants. At 9 PM the FA's arrived and boarded. At 10 PM the FO arrived to cheers from waiting passengers. As soon as he punched in the flight was cancelled. I asked him why and he replied that the FA's had run out of hours. After a two hour wait we rebooked for the next morning. The hotel then sold our pre-paid guaranteed room and we slept in the lobby.
Point is, why would American operations not know in advance that on a projected 10 PM departure the FA's would go out of hours and cancel us hours earlier, giving us a chance to rebook to what became the last flight to MCO, a 9 PM departure?
Pure incompetence on the part of operations and management.
Where did the $54 billion we gave the airlines for COVID relief end up? Not in training or replacing laid off personnel/crews!

Pre-pandemic over the years I experienced the type of situation you described more times than I can count on AmericaWest, US Airways and American Airlines.

Post pandemic I can understand pilot shortages and other issues. Yet airlines currently are deliberately overbooking heinously. Pre-pandemic they typically overbooked flights by a few passengers and paid a few bucks for them to take later flights but they have gone ridiculously overboard with thousands of cancellations, especially over holiday weekends.

[Otis64]

I and some golfing buddies were flying out of state to golf, and our flight was cancelled until the next day
because of plane malfunction.

We took a taxi to a motel that night and was telling the taxi driver what happen.

He laughed out loud and told us many times the pilots show up at the airport drunk. :plane:

This is truly a sad world
My son works for Southwest. One morning he was notified by TSA that a SW pilot just breezed thru smelling of alcohol. When the pilot showed up at his counter to pick up some flight info, my son said, "Sorry, sir, but you're taking out this flight." Pilot said distainfully, "Oh yeah? Who's going to stop me?" Son replied, "Those 2 gentlemen behind you." Pilot escorted away; son had to appear at a hearing in Dallas; pilot lost his license. One less dangerous pilot, thankfully!

[Otis64]

My son works for Southwest. One morning he was notified by TSA that a SW pilot just breezed thru smelling of alcohol. When the pilot showed up at his counter to pick up some flight info, my son said, "Sorry, sir, but you're taking out this flight." Pilot said distainfully, "Oh yeah? Who's going to stop me?" Son replied, "Those 2 gentlemen behind you." Pilot escorted away; son had to appear at a hearing in Dallas; pilot lost his license. One less dangerous pilot, thankfully!
Sorry -- Son told pilot he was NOT taking that flight out.

[coralway]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?





Living is easy with eyes closed

[rogerrice60]

The pilots are too busy to fly as they are shaking down their employers for more pay for less work. More than 1,200 Delta pilots picket at 7 major airports to call for higher pay : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1109137857/delta-pilots-picket-major-airports-call-for-higher-pay)

Southwest Airlines pilots picket, say they'''re tired of being understaffed and overworked (https://www.fox4news.com/news/southwest-airlines-pilots-say-theyre-understaffed-and-overworked)

Year ago I used to fly AmericaWest (known as AmericaWorst to flight crews as well as passengers). For quite a while the pilots were having flights delayed and canceled for any trivial excuse they could imagine. For months it was a nightmare of missed connections, losing great upgrade seats when they canceled my flights and crammed me into middle seats of other flights, getting stuck overnight in connecting cities and so on. One day I was up in first class and the pilot was pulling some stunt about why he could not take off due to a light on the console not working properly. A guy near me pulled out his FAA credentials and waved them at the pilot and told him to get the plane in the air or he would get written up. We took off in minutes.
Amen, these unions are destroying our country $15 for entry level positions tossing burgers that should be $6 hr

[Captainpd]

Anyone remember Peoples Express? We’d fly from Dulles to Newark pretty regular. You paid for your ticket in flight.

Yep, and People's Express lasted 2 years.

[Captainpd]

On June 27 our American LGA to CLT flight failed to push back on time due to gate agents who started the boarding process late and were very slow in loading passengers (the equipment and crew were on board and ready). As a result, we sat on the ramp after pushback and lost our ATC take off slot. Then we had to go back to the gate to refuel. Missed our CLT connection and rebooked on a 6 PM departure. Waited on a First Officer and Flight Attendants. At 9 PM the FA's arrived and boarded. At 10 PM the FO arrived to cheers from waiting passengers. As soon as he punched in the flight was cancelled. I asked him why and he replied that the FA's had run out of hours. After a two hour wait we rebooked for the next morning. The hotel then sold our pre-paid guaranteed room and we slept in the lobby.
Point is, why would American operations not know in advance that on a projected 10 PM departure the FA's would go out of hours and cancel us hours earlier, giving us a chance to rebook to what became the last flight to MCO, a 9 PM departure?
Pure incompetence on the part of operations and management.
Where did the $54 billion we gave the airlines for COVID relief end up? Not in training or replacing laid off personnel/crews!

There isn't any such thing as a "takeoff slot". Only slots are for landing. Lots of outside influences with the airlines. But are constantly looking for people like you that can predict the future.

[Calisport]

My flights were usually delayed due to not enough ground crew and probably covid sick days. One flight was cancelled so Southwest gave me a $100 voucher so I was happy about that. Got on a plane an hour later than the cancelled one.

[CFrance]

The Delta Pilot were off duty and scheduled an informational picket between 10am-12noon. They have been in protracted contract negotiations for 5 years.
Try not to confuse people with facts!:BigApplause:

[Dreah]

I and some golfing buddies were flying out of state to golf, and our flight was cancelled until the next day
because of plane malfunction.

We took a taxi to a motel that night and was telling the taxi driver what happen.

He laughed out loud and told us many times the pilots show up at the airport drunk. :plane:

This is truly a sad world
So many experts complaining about Airline pilots that know nothing of the job. These professionals are responsible for the lives of everyone on board. I guess it's more about you than everyone else.

[Dreah]

Posting a comment about Pilots being drunks is really low.
I guess that says more about your character than that of the Pilots.

[Dreah]

Nope. He was a high up FAA official and he KNEW the pilot was pulling a fast one. It was a time of pilot unrest in that airline.

I flew that airline extensively and was in the Chairman's Club, their top level frequent flier category requiring 100,000 miles flown per year. I knew several pilots, flight attendants and even gate agents in three airports well. Several of them had confided in me what was going on within the ranks. This time it was the pilots; other times it was flight attendants. The airline was not well run. It consequently merged into US Airways (Useless Airways) and then into American Airlines.

I was on this flight. Fortunately the pilot and crew were top drawer! Smoke Detected in lavatory; US Airways Express Flight Makes Emergency Landing | George Hatcher's Air Flight Disaster (https://airflightdisaster.com/smoke-detected-in-lavatory-us-airways-express-flight-makes-emergency-landing/)

Growing up near Kirtland Air Force Base early on I developed an interest in aviation. I recall on my first ride as a passenger in a private plane from Ruidoso to ABQ the pilot who was giving me a free hop home told me that he needed to wait until the weather cleared at ABQ before we could take off. We waited a couple hours, got the clearance and took off. He explained to me "There are old pilots and there are bold pilots but there are no old bold pilots." I took that advice, unlike JFK Jr! 10 mistakes JFK Jr. made - AOPA (https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2010/july/pilot/10-mistakes-jfk-jr-made)
My next door neighbors' best friends' cousin used to know a coworker that met a pilot once.
All the experts here are laughable.

[Dreah]

I agree 110%. Thank you for sharing your knowledge to the majority of those that love to complain about something they know nothing about.

[Dreah]

A good question for our Secretary of Transportation. Seems he won’t or can’t answer the question.

Questioning the character of a Pilot from those that drive a golf cart around all day. Yup, got it!

[donassaid]

Not enough seats sold? Seriously? Have you looked at the screen shots of the mobs at airports? More likely a shortage of pilots due to health issues brought on by being forced to take the vaccine.

[Dreah]

You’re clueless, luxury cockpits? Try being away from your family four days a week in crappy hotel rooms. Eating airport fast food in between flights, navigate around the weather, missing the holidays, by the way, hope you enjoy the Fourth of July! I can go on and on this from a retired airbus captain telling you If you think it’s as glorious as in the movies see if you can catch a ride with a crew for a month! By the way they’ve been negotiating a contract for seven years now with the inability to strike because of the Railway labor act which BENEFITS guess who the company. If you want to know what my pension is after 40 years at one of the top three major airlines, I’ll give you a hint it might’ve covered the car payment for a pinto back in the 70s! And that’s thanks to the bankruptcy back in 2012. They kick the can when times are good and then negotiate when times are bad and there’s no retro thanks to Railway labor act this is what they all do and the employees have to seek relief to strike which they never get. And when you’re in the airplane in the crews have been out there for over 10 hours still trying to get you to your Disney vacation I think they’re worth every penny and then 1000 time more! Safe travels, well you can always go on one of those low budget airlines, enjoy!
The experts here love to complain and degrade the courageous and incredible Airline pilots that have gotten them to their destinations all their lives. Sad that this post encourages many to degrade our brave Pilots than to educate themselves on what is really happening. Welcome to America's friendliest town.

[Jsan143]

There isn't any such thing as a "takeoff slot". Only slots are for landing. Lots of outside influences with the airlines. But are constantly looking for people like you that can predict the future.

You’re wrong there are actually slots for departures depending on the destinations.
Pilots have to endure Medical exams every 6 or 12 months depending on whether they are captains of first officers. Captains have to take EKG’s every 12 months, which FAA has been monitoring for your whole career. Then you have the mandatory retirement age of 65 no matter what. This is one of the only careers that still has age discrimination with no recourse. It’s all about the dollars they wanna get the top $$$$’s off the payroll. Now there’s a pilot shortage that they’ve created and unwilling to fix. As I stated before 40 years in the industry, wasn’t ready to retire! I’m with those who say they will not fly, the only exception is in an emergency.
Safe travels to all!

One last note, anybody know of a corporate job? You have a willing able body ready to go! Still love flying nothing like it in the world!

[Captainpd]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?

ORD-FLL this am. 90min flow for lack of controllers JAX Center

[GmaLisaG]

It's thunderstorm season and that has ALWAYS caused backups and cancellations. I'm pretty sure pilots picket on their time off. If things are broken they need them fixed. It's ALWAYS been this way. Be grateful your flight was delayed or cancelled rather than flying through bad weather.. better to be late or miss it than dead .

[Notsocrates]

The pilots are too busy to fly as they are shaking down their employers for more pay for less work. More than 1,200 Delta pilots picket at 7 major airports to call for higher pay : NPR (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1109137857/delta-pilots-picket-major-airports-call-for-higher-pay)

Southwest Airlines pilots picket, say they'''re tired of being understaffed and overworked (https://www.fox4news.com/news/southwest-airlines-pilots-say-theyre-understaffed-and-overworked)

Year ago I used to fly AmericaWest (known as AmericaWorst to flight crews as well as passengers). For quite a while the pilots were having flights delayed and canceled for any trivial excuse they could imagine. For months it was a nightmare of missed connections, losing great upgrade seats when they canceled my flights and crammed me into middle seats of other flights, getting stuck overnight in connecting cities and so on. One day I was up in first class and the pilot was pulling some stunt about why he could not take off due to a light on the console not working properly. A guy near me pulled out his FAA credentials and waved them at the pilot and told him to get the plane in the air or he would get written up. We took off in minutes.


Either you left something out, altered the story, do not undrtstand FAA regulatio, or it did not happen.

[nhtexasrn]

So, the airline has a plane, a pilot, a co-pilot, flight attendants, and everything else needed to take a trip. They sell tickets to the passengers. They have been doing this for years. But now, when the passengers come to the airport, they are told that the flight is cancelled. WHY?
Just another federal government screw up. Shortage of air traffic controllers. What is the FAA doing? What is the Secretary of Transportation doing? Can't blame it on Covid anymore.

[Holly Jane]

I’m a former AA flight attendant and my husband is a very senior Delta pilot. The public is clueless. Major major shortage of pilots. Too many took the early out with Covid that was offered. The companies panicked and now there is a major shortage.

[Glowfromminnesota]

If only they had all those in the same place at the same time

Yet, yesterday, 1200 pilots had the spare time to protest/picket for more money, less hours, more benefits, "job security" (figure that one) and "better working conditions" (luxury cockpits???).

Our neighbor here has been a pilot for 34 years with Delta. His wife just tested positive for covid and they suggested he gets tested as well. Yup, he has covid and has to follow policies of the airline and cannot fly. This is pretty common. Plus they are capped on the hours they can fly due to fatigue. Lots of moving parts in the airline business today. Bless my girl who just graduated from college in aviation to be a pilot. She is a trainer at the college to obtain hours to be a commercial pilot.

[Geodyssey]

Posting a comment about Pilots being drunks is really low.
I guess that says more about your character than that of the Pilots.

"pilots" is not capitalized. They are not Gods.

Of course pilots show up drunk on occasion.

[nsantelli]

Just got back from 2 weeks in Europe. Same issues there with pilot shortages. Some things are worse. Lufthansa misdirected the bags of one member of our tour and he could not retrieve them until they were inspected by the police in Berlin. We were already in Prague so after the inspection he tried to get them sent to our next destination in Austria. No go. Bottom line - his bags finally caught up with him in Frankfurt. Our last stop.
Side note. A few days after returning home we found out 4 members of out tour group tested positive for COVID.

[retiredguy123]

I’m a former AA flight attendant and my husband is a very senior Delta pilot. The public is clueless. Major major shortage of pilots. Too many took the early out with Covid that was offered. The companies panicked and now there is a major shortage.
That doesn't explain why the airlines are selling tickets for flights that they cannot make.

[Rainger99]

If I booked and PAID for a hotel room and when I showed up was told that the room was not available because of staff shortages, I would be very annoyed. And I would be even more upset if I couldn’t get a room at another hotel.

[Stu from NYC]

It's thunderstorm season and that has ALWAYS caused backups and cancellations. I'm pretty sure pilots picket on their time off. If things are broken they need them fixed. It's ALWAYS been this way. Be grateful your flight was delayed or cancelled rather than flying through bad weather.. better to be late or miss it than dead .

The airlines do not care about giving their customers good customer service. If a flight is inconvenient to the airline they have no compunction about cancelling. Once upon a time airlines got us to our destination now on time.

If our cruise left on Saturday we flew to that port that day, now always get there a day ahead of time as who can trust them to be on time.

[kkingston57]

I know someone who is very risk averse. They told me recently, "If there aren't enough pilots, etc. to fly the plane, what makes you think they have enough mechanics to keep them airworthy?"

Yeaaaaaah, I don't fly as much anymore. She made sense.

In meantime, how many people in the US have died or were injured in recent memory? Flying has become worse but still is much more safe than driving. As I write this new came out that 6 people died in a mult vehicle accident in Montana. Part of the problems which are happening are from rules that are designed to protect the flying public.

[Michael G.]

It's amazing if half of these stories are true, there isn't more planes dropping out of the sky.