Deep Thinkers 3

[SHIBUMI]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

[fdpaq0580]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

For the fun of it? To deflect attention from something you are trying to hide?

[tophcfa]

Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

Because it’s a lot more fun than spending one’s time deep thinking.

[ThirdOfFive]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?
Early science had it that there were five planets (six, if you counted the moon). We didn't know that Uranus and Neptune existed--until we did.

Early science had it that the Earth was the center of everthing (I mean, the VISUAL proof was right before your eyes). We didn't know that the Earth was simply one of the planets that rotated around the sun--until we did.

Until quite recently, cutting-edge "science" had it that disease was spread by various things: poisoned wells, or taking too many baths, or by smelling bad smells, etc. etc. We didn't know that microscopic critters that we couldn't see but rode around in various media such as the fur of rats, the guts of mosquitoes or the legs of houseflies and spread often horrific diseases--until we did.

And so on. There are probably hundreds of examples of what "common sense" told us in the past, that turned out to be absolutely false.

I find it interesting, if a bit specious, to claim that "total consciousness" exists of nothing more than knowing that something doesn't exist, simply because we've not found proof positive that it does. We're built to perceive things on a very narrow spectrum and it is only as we develop methods of perception that expand that spectrum do we learn just how narrow our "vision" was. Telescopes, for example, showed us the wonders of the universe in ways that we never could have dreamed. Anton van Leeuwenhoek's invention of the microscope allowed us to see those little critters that spread the disease. For millennia we stood in awe of birds and how they could take to the air, having very little idea of just how--until a couple of brothers named Orville and Wilbur Wright came along and proved that it was not only possible but actually pretty easy--IF one understood the principles. Birds and fish cover thousands of miles to nest or lay their eggs where they themselves were hatched. We still don't really know how they do it but the fact that we don't know HOW they do it doesn't mean that their ability to do so doesn't exist.

I doubt that total consciousness--or total understanding, which is what is really being discussed here--will never be achieved. But that doesn't mean that it isn't a worthy goal. The route to expanding consciousness first begins with an open mind; what we accomplish after that is dependent only on the vision of the people who allow their minds to BE open.

I do know one thing. And that one thing that has been proven time and time again to be an absolute barrier AGAINST expanding our consciousness is "Common sense".

[Stu from NYC]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

Our understanding the world is constantly changing so who knows which of the above things you think are wrong are actually right.

[tophcfa]

Our understanding the world is constantly changing so who knows which of the above things you think are wrong are actually right.

After watching Dr. Seuss’ Horton Hears a Who and Men In Black, I got all the answers I need.

[Bill14564]

...
and we know that we have not been visited by aliens.
...

We cannot know that we have not been visited by aliens. We can know that we are not aware of being visited, we have no proof of the positive, but there is no way to prove the negative.

[ElDiabloJoe]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

Your posit to the deep thinkers is "Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?"

Everything your wrote before it is subjective, and a logical fallacy. We do not KNOW those things are untrue. You are using those examples to steer responses to your eventual inquiry. I believe it is an Argument of Ignorance fallacy, also known as Argumentum ex Silentio.

Ignoring the unproven claims with which your paragraph begins, and focusing on just the last sentence - the one that matters in this discourse, I offer the following:

We spend so much time trying to fool people (counter intel, psyops) for a variety of reasons. A few examples include:

1. To woo women. To make them think we are smarter, wealthier, stronger, more attractive than we are. For the opposite gender, they use make-up and flattering hair and clothing styles to "fool" men into think they are more attractive than they might otherwise be - so to woo men;

2. To save resources. If I fool an adversary into thinking I am stronger than I am, I do not actually have to build the hypersonic weapons he thinks I already have;

3. To create resources. To make money by convincing others (or fooling them) into thinking my product is the best one and the one they want to buy;

4. To influence society. If I can fool people into thinking the sky is falling, then I can get a majority to vote to increase funding to the "Sky Is Falling Agency" to hire more people (increasing the influence of that agency's administration), to spend on projects I prefer, and/or to direct money to studies or vendors of my choice.

I am certain there are more examples, but I wish to enjoy by coffee and peruse the web rather than type away with both hands.

[Stu from NYC]

They walk amongst us

[fdpaq0580]

They walk amongst us

Yes. We do.
👮👩👴👵👸👦👽👮👨👩

[BobnBev]

I know for a fact that I'm not the only one who has seen UFO's

[fdpaq0580]

We cannot know that we have not been visited by aliens. We can know that we are not aware of being visited, we have no proof of the positive, but there is no way to prove the negative.

According to the ancient aliens crowd there is tons of proof all.around the world. Much of it fun reading or watching.

[ThirdOfFive]

We cannot know that we have not been visited by aliens. We can know that we are not aware of being visited, we have no proof of the positive, but there is no way to prove the negative.
It is an interesting thing. Maybe 99.9999% of the reports of alien sightings or interactions are bogus. Overactive imaginations.

But if even ONE is true, then that 99.9999% doesn't matter.

[fdpaq0580]

It is an interesting thing. Maybe 99.9999% of the reports of alien sightings or interactions are bogus. Overactive imaginations.

But if even ONE is true, then that 99.9999% doesn't matter.

Unless you can identify that there is a real one and which one it is, better take them all seriously. Imagine a scenario where you are the head of secret service protecting the president. There is a report of 1000 enemy snipers. Infact, there are 999 fake snipers with blank ammo and only 1 real sniper with real ammo. You have no choice but to find them all. After all, you have not idea that there is only one. There might be more. The one you miss could change the course of history.
Every sighting is possibly real until it is proven not to be.

[Worldseries27]

it is an interesting thing. Maybe 99.9999% of the reports of alien sightings or interactions are bogus. Overactive imaginations.

But if even one is true, then that 99.9999% doesn't matter.
keep looking over my shoulder for the guy with the dreads and bad breath

[Worldseries27]

i know for a fact that i'm not the only one who has seen ufo's
didn't they just sort this all out in d.c.

[La lamy]

I know for a fact that I'm not the only one who has seen UFO's

Oooh, please expand on that...

[Bill14564]

It is an interesting thing. Maybe 99.9999% of the reports of alien sightings or interactions are bogus. Overactive imaginations.

But if even ONE is true, then that 99.9999% doesn't matter.

And when there finally is proof of even ONE then the world will change a little.

[Topgun 1776]

Since you're in deep thought, you might want to learn to spell. Your third word in your diatribe is misspelled. Have a great day!

[Bill14564]

Unless you can identify that there is a real one and which one it is, better take them all seriously. Imagine a scenario where you are the head of secret service protecting the president. There is a report of 1000 enemy snipers. Infact, there are 999 fake snipers with blank ammo and only 1 real sniper with real ammo. You have no choice but to find them all. After all, you have not idea that there is only one. There might be more. The one you miss could change the course of history.
Every sighting is possibly real until it is proven not to be.

You have that backwards, you are starting from a false conclusion. Just because you have a report of 1000 or enemy or snipers doesn't make any of it true. Instead of 1000 enemy snipers there could be five rooftop gardeners and whoever reported otherwise was simply wrong. The story isn't true until proven false, the story is a story until proven true.

Every sighting is possibly real - sure.
...until it is proven not to be - NO.

Every sighting is possibly real but probably not until it is proven to be true.

[Bill14564]

I know for a fact that I'm not the only one who has seen UFO's

Be careful of what you believe you "know" and what you are calling a "fact."

U.F.O.

Unidentified - sure, you saw something but you don't recognize it - it is unidentified

Flying - Do you really know it was flying? Since you aren't sure what it was, can you really know it was flying and not just falling? You saw it moving but a man without a parachute will also move and yet he would not be flying.

Object - Can you be sure it was an object and not just a glint in your eye or a reflection off a lens or some atmospheric condition? Cloud to cloud lightning can look like an object but isn't. A laser light show can look like objects but isn't. Even spot lights from a car dealership can look like something moving across the sky but is really just a reflection. Since whatever you saw was unidentified, can you really say it was an actual object and not just a trick of light?

I suspect it is likely you saw something you didn't recognize but you don't know that it was flying or that it was actually an object. Others may report seeing the same thing but they don't have any proof that it was flying or it was an object either. It was certainly Unidentified but you cannot know for a fact that it was an Unidentified Flying Object.

[PersonOfInterest]

Should our beliefs always be based on factual evidence or should we allow that simply having faith that something is out there is enough reason to believe?

[Sandy and Ed]

Because it’s a lot more fun than spending one’s time deep thinking.
Yeah but stirring the pot often produces interest (and amusing) responses

[Sandy and Ed]

Since you're in deep thought, you might want to learn to spell. Your third word in your diatribe is misspelled. Have a great day!
Oh, come on!! Really??

[donfey]

Early science had it that there were five planets (six, if you counted the moon). We didn't know that Uranus and Neptune existed--until we did.

Early science had it that the Earth was the center of everthing (I mean, the VISUAL proof was right before your eyes). We didn't know that the Earth was simply one of the planets that rotated around the sun--until we did.

Until quite recently, cutting-edge "science" had it that disease was spread by various things: poisoned wells, or taking too many baths, or by smelling bad smells, etc. etc. We didn't know that microscopic critters that we couldn't see but rode around in various media such as the fur of rats, the guts of mosquitoes or the legs of houseflies and spread often horrific diseases--until we did.

And so on. There are probably hundreds of examples of what "common sense" told us in the past, that turned out to be absolutely false.

I find it interesting, if a bit specious, to claim that "total consciousness" exists of nothing more than knowing that something doesn't exist, simply because we've not found proof positive that it does. We're built to perceive things on a very narrow spectrum and it is only as we develop methods of perception that expand that spectrum do we learn just how narrow our "vision" was. Telescopes, for example, showed us the wonders of the universe in ways that we never could have dreamed. Anton van Leeuwenhoek's invention of the microscope allowed us to see those little critters that spread the disease. For millennia we stood in awe of birds and how they could take to the air, having very little idea of just how--until a couple of brothers named Orville and Wilbur Wright came along and proved that it was not only possible but actually pretty easy--IF one understood the principles. Birds and fish cover thousands of miles to nest or lay their eggs where they themselves were hatched. We still don't really know how they do it but the fact that we don't know HOW they do it doesn't mean that their ability to do so doesn't exist.

I doubt that total consciousness--or total understanding, which is what is really being discussed here--will never be achieved. But that doesn't mean that it isn't a worthy goal. The route to expanding consciousness first begins with an open mind; what we accomplish after that is dependent only on the vision of the people who allow their minds to BE open.

I do know one thing. And that one thing that has been proven time and time again to be an absolute barrier AGAINST expanding our consciousness is "Common sense".

Well stated.

[Ptmckiou]

I think you need to look up the meaning of consciousness. Also, it’s not called total consciousness, but known as universal consciousness or collective consciousness.

If you are talking common sense, it is definitely common sense to know that we have UFO’s and we aren’t alone in the universe. Out of millions of galaxies, and trillions of stars with planets, it’s common sense we aren’t the only Beings, and they can be much more advanced than us, since we are still juveniles when it comes to knowledge and wisdom. Btw, I have photos taken with my telescope of plasma ships. They are undulating masses of colorful light, then change into a solid ship, then back into a ball of colorful light. I have a series of photos as one is changing from a light ball into a solid form ship. They are quite impressive.

[ThirdOfFive]

Should our beliefs always be based on factual evidence or should we allow that simply having faith that something is out there is enough reason to believe?
Great question.

Faith. Belief. Knowledge.

I might have FAITH that the majority of people are well-intentioned even though in this day and age the evidence is often contrary to that. I BELIEVE that when I get on that 737 Thursday it will take to the air in Orlando and land in Minneapolis a few hours later, because I've experienced it numerous times. But what do I, or any of us, really know?

Rene' Descartes said itbest. "Cogito, ergo sum". That is all I KNOW for certain. The rest of the world might be a side-effect of a psychotropic medication.

Ain't philosophy grand?

[jimmy o]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?
We really don’t know. Here is link to recently released Eisenhower Report from our government. https://majesticdocuments.com/pdf/eisenhower_briefing.pdf Very interesting read.

[rsibole]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

Here’s a deep thought . . . .

Is Reality a Hologram? a Social Agreement? or Just in Your Mind? Scientists Explain What Reality Really Is (https://www.theepochtimes.com/is-reality-a-hologram-a-social-agreement-or-just-in-your-mind-scientists-explain-what-reality-really-is_4673305.html?utm_source=morningbriefnoe-ai&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=mb-2022-08-21)

[YeOldeCurmudgeon]

Since you're in deep thought, you might want to learn to spell. Your third word in your diatribe is misspelled. Have a great day!

Thanks for your profound observation ...:ohdear:

[fdpaq0580]

You have that backwards, you are starting from a false conclusion. Just because you have a report of 1000 or enemy or snipers doesn't make any of it true. Instead of 1000 enemy snipers there could be five rooftop gardeners and whoever reported otherwise was simply wrong. The story isn't true until proven false, the story is a story until proven true.

Every sighting is possibly real - sure.
...until it is proven not to be - NO.

Every sighting is possibly real but probably not until it is proven to be true.

Guess I should have not said "report" and instead said "reliable intelligence" for my scenario. And, if you resided in the scenario and were not told by me the report was not accurate, you would not have known what was true or false. Due to the nature of the scenario it would be prudent to act as if it might be true until you can be certain it was or was not.

[DaveZ]

Good topic and conversation, thank you for the post.

We don’t have a working, scientific theory of human (or even animal) consciousness beyond I exist, therefore I am. It is under constant study though.

I’ve spent a good part of my life working with artificial intelligence so the concept of consciousness occasionally crosses my mind. (See how I did that?) Common sense is essential to AI and is developed in varieties. How an automated car interacts with a cat is different than a tank. Consciousness is something else entirely and, like humans, is sold like snake oil (albeit digital).

I agree with replies to this post saying that more science is welcome and with those for whom spiritually and faith is enough. We’ll know we’ve nailed the theory in either case when we not only understand consciousness in ourselves but recognize and relate to it in other people. AI seamlessly collaborates between digital entities (machines or other programs) using this common sense but that doesn’t happen as easily with conscious human beings largely because we haven’t developed much past “I exist”. It’s incredibly difficult and some even say impossible for a machine (the brain) to reliably study itself without bias that corrupts the output. Common sense is bias.

UFO’s absolutely exist but that doesn’t prove other intelligent species do. By definition, “UFO” is ambiguous to that which it labels. In science, most mathematical guesses presume that if species are capable of intergalactic travel, the odds are we would interact with at least one of them directly given the quantity of the universe. Kind of the opposite of thinking they must exist because the universe is so big.

One thing that seems certain from our existence is that a species capable of the enormous resources required for intergalactic travel are also masters of political science on their own planet. (Charles Krauthammer). That makes me think they’d be less like Predator and more like Captain Kirk.

[ex34449]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense.

Oh is it now? And you know this how??

[DOGSAREKEEPERS]

[QUOTE=ThirdOfFive;2127965]Early science had it that there were five planets (six, if you counted the moon). We didn't know that Uranus and Neptune existed--until we did.

Early science had it that the Earth was the center of everthing (I mean, the VISUAL proof was right before your eyes). We didn't know that the Earth was simply one of the planets that rotated around the sun--until we did.

Until quite recently, cutting-edge "science" had it that disease was spread by various things: poisoned wells, or taking too many baths, or by smelling bad smells, etc. etc. We didn't know that microscopic critters that we couldn't see but rode around in various media such as the fur of rats, the guts of mosquitoes or the legs of houseflies and spread often horrific diseases--until we did.


YOU SAID IT....I have a lot of common sense but even more so, the older I get the less I know. With age and additional knowledge/learning you realize there is so much more. You can make choices of what you believe but you still need to keep an open mind.:eclipsee_gold_cup:

[phousel]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?

Wait! Bigfoot is a "ruse"?

[fdpaq0580]

Oh is it now? And you know this how??

It's common sense! ☺

[fdpaq0580]

Wait! Bigfoot is a "ruse"?

I am not! I'm just shy. ☺

[RiderOnTheStorm]

Given that there are typically hundreds of billions of stars in a galaxy and hundreds of billions of galaxies in the universe, it is almost assured that intelligent "alien" life exists in at least one more place than earth.
That said, we will never know for certain because of the distances involved. It would take thousands of years, perhaps even tens or hundreds of thousands of years to traverse the distances, assuming life could even survive for so long in such a hostile environment as deep space. Furthermore, by the time the "signs" arrived, the sender would likely have long since gone extinct.
Be careful what you wish for. As Stephen Hawking once said (paraphrasing); "alien" life (i.e. European settlers) was not such a good thing for our Native Americans".

[BobnBev]

Oooh, please expand on that...

Someday I would love to, but not here. (Security issues still in affect). Breaking security issues is something you can't begin to imagine. That's as far as I can go.

[ElDiabloJoe]

While all this discussion on the existence (or not) of UFOs is of interest, it is a tangent to the originally posted question. The UFOs were just an example, as was Bigfoot and crop circles.

In an attempt to refocus the discussion to the primary objective, I re-posit the OP's sole inquiry:

"Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?"

[SHIBUMI]

thanks topgun, my theory was that no one would catch my error, I guess it too was a bad theory, only corrected by facts brought out into the light ...facts work, theories are just excuses for I don't really know

[SHIBUMI]

it is amazing that as billions of phone cameras have been purchased, the reported ufo rate has gone down to nil, the jig is up for ufo's,
we can be fooled no longer

[fdpaq0580]

it is amazing that as billions of phone cameras have been purchased, the reported ufo rate has gone down to nil, the jig is up for ufo's,
we can be fooled no longer

Oh, I think we definitely can be fooled. Not all the time, but often enough.

[YeOldeCurmudgeon]

it is amazing that as billions of phone cameras have been purchased, the reported ufo rate has gone down to nil, the jig is up for ufo's,
we can be fooled no longer

Actually, there have been more credible, unexplanable sightings. I met Betty Hill once; have to admit she seemed a bit looney but something did happen to her and her husband that no one has ever been able to explain.

[jimjamuser]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?
WHY? Why questions have ALWAYS been difficult to answer. The Area 51 situation may be about MORE than just trying to scare the Soviets. That IS just too simplistic of an answer. The Star Wars defense system may have been about making some US corporations rich and may have produced some usable research - it may have forced the Soviets to build more missiles and bombs and bankrupted the Soviet Union. The GREAT Star Wars defense system is a little bit like the GREAT WALL or China - they both were designed to make people feel more protected and they both now reside on a historical heap of minimal usefulness.

WHY do people INSIST on believing in something that is not real? Well, different people believe different realities and have differing ideas on what is MOST important. Reality is in the eye of the individual realist. It is easy to prove the point about different realities - just look around at the various churches and religions that humans believe in. The churches are REAL in the sense of they exist in brick and mortar. But, 100 % of all humans do NOT believe the ideas contained in the churches give reality to their lives - some do, some don't.

Why believe in something that is NOT real? It may be psychologically comforting. Some are comforted by the idea of life after death. Some are comforted by the idea that humans are NOT alone in the Universe, others are frightened by that concept. Humans have great variability!

[ThirdOfFive]

Wait! Bigfoot is a "ruse"?
Bigfoot is real. Ask any Northern Minnesotan.

I dated her in high school.

[jimjamuser]

Early science had it that there were five planets (six, if you counted the moon). We didn't know that Uranus and Neptune existed--until we did.

Early science had it that the Earth was the center of everthing (I mean, the VISUAL proof was right before your eyes). We didn't know that the Earth was simply one of the planets that rotated around the sun--until we did.

Until quite recently, cutting-edge "science" had it that disease was spread by various things: poisoned wells, or taking too many baths, or by smelling bad smells, etc. etc. We didn't know that microscopic critters that we couldn't see but rode around in various media such as the fur of rats, the guts of mosquitoes or the legs of houseflies and spread often horrific diseases--until we did.

And so on. There are probably hundreds of examples of what "common sense" told us in the past, that turned out to be absolutely false.

I find it interesting, if a bit specious, to claim that "total consciousness" exists of nothing more than knowing that something doesn't exist, simply because we've not found proof positive that it does. We're built to perceive things on a very narrow spectrum and it is only as we develop methods of perception that expand that spectrum do we learn just how narrow our "vision" was. Telescopes, for example, showed us the wonders of the universe in ways that we never could have dreamed. Anton van Leeuwenhoek's invention of the microscope allowed us to see those little critters that spread the disease. For millennia we stood in awe of birds and how they could take to the air, having very little idea of just how--until a couple of brothers named Orville and Wilbur Wright came along and proved that it was not only possible but actually pretty easy--IF one understood the principles. Birds and fish cover thousands of miles to nest or lay their eggs where they themselves were hatched. We still don't really know how they do it but the fact that we don't know HOW they do it doesn't mean that their ability to do so doesn't exist.

I doubt that total consciousness--or total understanding, which is what is really being discussed here--will never be achieved. But that doesn't mean that it isn't a worthy goal. The route to expanding consciousness first begins with an open mind; what we accomplish after that is dependent only on the vision of the people who allow their minds to BE open.

I do know one thing. And that one thing that has been proven time and time again to be an absolute barrier AGAINST expanding our consciousness is "Common sense".
I remember reading that humans use only a small % of their brains. So, maybe in the future, there will be opportunity to use more brain cells. There are stories or instances where a person has a stroke or gets hit by lightning and then suddenly, without prior training, can play a piano or a violin like a virtuoso.

i always wondered........dolphins and elephants have BIGGER sized brains than humans, so what has held them back? Humans have opposable thumbs and obviously, dolphins and elephants do NOT. I wonder how smart they could be if they had opposable thumbs. Also, it is a shame that elephants get hunted for ivory by poachers. For that matter, how smart would dog / wolves be with opposable thumbs. Or even raccoons? Perhaps these specie are also evolving? Just some food for thought.

[Whitley]

[QUOTE=DaveZ;2128338]Good topic and conversation, thank you for the post.

We don’t have a working, scientific theory of human (or even animal) consciousness beyond I exist, therefore I am. It is under constant study though.

"I Think, Therefore I Am" Descartes
used as the Archimedian Point

[DaveZ]

[QUOTE=DaveZ;2128338]Good topic and conversation, thank you for the post.

We don’t have a working, scientific theory of human (or even animal) consciousness beyond I exist, therefore I am. It is under constant study though.

"I Think, Therefore I Am" Descartes
used as the Archimedian Point

Touché! Thanks for the correction!

[Whitley]

i always wondered........dolphins and elephants have BIGGER sized brains than humans, so what has held them back? Humans have opposable thumbs and obviously, dolphins and elephants do NOT. I wonder how smart they could be if they had opposable thumbs. Also, it is a shame that elephants get hunted for ivory by poachers. For that matter, how smart would dog / wolves be with opposable thumbs. Or even raccoons? Perhaps these specie are also evolving? Just some food for thought.[/QUOTE]

Be it random, or by supreme design we all continue to evolve. There is one species I studied that seems to have a built in kill switch to evolving; the shrimp. (This was a long time ago, when I had the time to have such discussions over beer and pizza on York till all hours of the night).
The shrimps brain is located next to its airway. Should it grow, it will cut off oxygen. This may have been something I came up with to explain why there are different rates of evolution between species, or it may be factual.

[Whitley]

[QUOTE=Whitley;2128596]

Touché! Thanks for the correction!

I am sorry, I hated doing that. I know you just had a typo. It did change the meaning so I tried to nudge it back. Again, apologies.

[fdpaq0580]

I remember reading that humans use only a small % of their brains. So, maybe in the future, there will be opportunity to use more brain cells. There are stories or instances where a person has a stroke or gets hit by lightning and then suddenly, without prior training, can play a piano or a violin like a virtuoso.

i always wondered........dolphins and elephants have BIGGER sized brains than humans, so what has held them back? Humans have opposable thumbs and obviously, dolphins and elephants do NOT. I wonder how smart they could be if they had opposable thumbs. Also, it is a shame that elephants get hunted for ivory by poachers. For that matter, how smart would dog / wolves be with opposable thumbs. Or even raccoons? Perhaps these specie are also evolving? Just some food for thought.

Evolution goes on. Changes, mostly imperceptible over short timescales. Some things seem to be unchanged over many millennia. Animal and plant life caught in amber and fossils from the earliest times sometimes turn up something that appear unchanged. Still, for most living things, evolution goes on.

[fdpaq0580]

Bigfoot is real. Ask any Northern Minnesotan.

I dated her in high school.

And I remember how you stepped on my feet when we danced.

[ThirdOfFive]

And I remember how you stepped on my feet when we danced.
Those were your FEET?

[Eg_cruz]

Reaching total conscientious is nothing more than having common sense. We know that crop circles are man made, we know that Bigfoot is a ruse, we know the UFO's that have not been faked are secret military projects, and we know that we have not been visited by aliens. Area 51 was a ruse by the government to scare the Russians into thinking we had alien technology.
Star Wars defense system was the same. There are no alien creatures in the sea, in mountain caves, or in a government lab. Why do we spend so much time trying to fool people into believing something that is not real?
How can you be 100% sure we have not been visited by aliens. It would be foolish to think in an infinite universe we are the only living beings.

[fdpaq0580]

those were your feet?

surprise! 🙈

[fdpaq0580]

How can you be 100% sure we have not been visited by aliens. It would be foolish to think in an infinite universe we are the only living beings.

Never 100% sure. In the 90+% range that we have not been visited. Still, the possibility, if not probability, does raise some interesting "what ifs ".
As to other life in the cosmos? My guess is that the universe most certainly has life and lots of it. As to sentient beings alive during our time window? Far less, I guess. And sentient spacefaring being with capabilities to visit during our small window of existence? Few. Very, very few, if any. But there is the possibility I could be wrong. So, as Jack Horkheimer used to say, "Keep looking up!"