Just in time for snowbirds arrival - a homeless encampment by Chitty Chatty Bridge

[LivingOnSunshine]

UPDATE: The Villages has now signed the no trespass order needed for local law enforcement.
In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood Police (who have been timely and compassionate in their responses) regarding ongoing sightings of homeless persons (with and without shopping carts ) crossing the Chitty Chatty bridge at various times of the day and night, wandering the streets of The Village as well as the MMP along Chitty Chatty and Bradford. Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets as well as frightening a woman walking her dog. Both law enforcement agencies have told residents that the area near the bridge where it appears the persons are camping is owned by The Villages and therefore is private property. By law, the authorities must have a no trespassing order on file from TV in order to take action. They do not currently possess such an order. Calls to Community Watch and Community Standards have ended with, “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. So for all those who paid a premium to live near the preserve, lucky you to get a front row seat of a homeless encampment as well as having these individuals who clearly need mental health support roam the streets of your Village making the residents and guests feel unsafe and (presently) twisting in the wind and unsupported by The Villages. Godspeed…

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Joined 2015 , posts 5 , hmmmmmmmmmm?

[LivingOnSunshine]

Joined 2015 , posts 5 , hmmmmmmmmmm?
Whatever. So not posting every day on every subject makes any post less true or less impactful? What’s your point? You want confirmation? Come sit at the base of the bridge.

[billethkid]

what does "...just in time for the snow bird arrival..." have to do with the "homeless encampment"?

__________________________________________________ __

:censored:

[Kenswing]

I can personally attest that there’s at least one. Saw an elderly gentleman pushing a shopping cart this morning along the MMP in Bradford while on my way to Lake Deaton Plaza.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

There are people camped behind strip malls , Walmarts and just about any place you can camp in woods , was he bothering anyone , was it just seeing him that scared someone , and stating we all paid a premium to live next to a homeless camp is a little over the top

[LivingOnSunshine]

There are people camped behind strip malls , Walmarts and just about any place you can camp in woods , was he bothering anyone , was it just seeing him that scared someone , and stating we all paid a premium to live next to a homeless camp is a little over the top
Wow. So, yes…someone having an animated, agitated conversation with themselves while pushing a stolen shopping cart over the bridge and stumbling through the community in the daylight is unnerving enough, but then in the dark - intoxicated and throwing empty liquor and pill bottles in the streets - and making someone out for a walk with their dog feel unsafe is definitely a legitimate concern regardless of the price of a home, but paying a premium for that is, as you said, over the top. Then being told law enforcement has their hands tied because they’ve not been provided the legal authority they require to take action to get violators out of a protected preserve and (hopefully) find them the mental healthcare they need… it’s unacceptable.

[Decadeofdave]

Homeless snowbirds......eh?

[Buckeyephan]

Interesting to read this. Around noon today, I was driving past Rohan and noticed a man pushing a shopping cart that appeared to contain personal belongings. Regrettably, if these folks are allowed to camp out in The Villages, word will certainly spread that it is being ignored.

[Garywt]

Homelessness is a terrible thing but unfortunately you can’t have them set up on private property. If nothing is done and something ever happens to a Village resident we will be kicking ourselves for doing nothing. Hopefully it can be solved quickly and quietly.

[LAFwUs]

We live in one of, if not the furthest village south of FL-44 as possible currently. Some here have nick-named it "the deserted island" cuz, well...thats how it looks & feels. We border the turnpike.
anyway, We get both homeless and vagrant types coming thru rather often, believe it or not.

Walking alone, in pairs, carrying backpacks, pushing broken down bicycles, dirty, disheveled and clearly not residents. I see them normally around dusk, ruling out that they could be workers/laborers here working.

Literally last week, wife & I were on the golf course, when we encountered an individual, clearly homeless, hiking it between the turn pike & the golf course path, tracing the turnpike. We spotted him pop up from the edge brush, inside of what constitutes a "fence" there, moving in gradually to the golf course itself - where I can only assume walking for him was easier. He saw us, but didn't care. We continued to observe him as he walked west until he was out of sight.
It would not surprise me if there were some camping out near the new bridge is being constructed, or squatting temporarily in all that new village construction that's being built along the turnpike, as it is easily accessible by foot without detection, from non-village areas.

Anyone whose been out this way or checked out Newell development in person, could easily see how that could take place without anyone really noticing.
I've seen exactly ONE village patrol vehicle come thru this area in the entire year we've lived here, yet see them everywhere when we travel north of FL-44. There is NO -ONE patrolling or even monitoring out here that I can determine. I'm absolutely sure that near total lack of patrolling, does not go un-noticed by those seeking temporary hiding where they shouldn't be.
:/

[bobeaston]

... “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. [snipped]

One feels the frustration of being shunned by several organizations operated by The Villages. How to get the attention of someone who cares is the challenge.

Suggestion: When this story becomes more widely known, it could affect sales. If as many people call their Villages sales reps as call the police, the word will soon get to someone in The Villages that can get something done. Call those reps and the word will travel "upward" pretty quickly.

[Cobullymom]

Joined 2015 , posts 5 , hmmmmmmmmmm?

In other words, if they don't camp out everyday on a subjective, chatty, social forum, they cannot be trustworthy?

[Normal]

Is it OK to be more afraid of SOME of the residents who are fortunate enough to live here than those less than lucky in life?

Yes, police will take care of what they need to as the law permits. And your ivory clean washed towers may stand as long as you are around. But be careful with your complaints, you could easily be the one someone calls the cops on someday.

[elevatorman]

Maybe someone could contact their church and ask for help. A shelter may be available for homeless in the area.

[dewilson58]

Maybe someone could contact their church and ask for help. A shelter may be available for homeless in the area.

:agree:

[dewilson58]

what does "...just in time for the snow bird arrival..." have to do with the "homeless encampment"?


:shrug:

[Normal]

:shrug:
A diluted rationalization to make the poster feel OK about posting an anonymous sensationalized rant for attention?

[ldovermiller]

Perhaps have 20/20, 60 minutes TV shows come in and have them do a story that will draw attention on a National basis. The Villages needs to start acting like they care about the monster they created. The police are just as bad. Find a reason NOT to do their job. However, why does Sumter County Sheriff have a patrol car parked at the new apartment complex on Rte 466 going toward Rolling 24/7? THEY SIT ON PROPERTYTHAT IS PRVIATE !!!!! Somebody is getting special attention .....WHY

[jim@jedward.com]

Correct. Just ask San Francisco how going soft on homelessness is working out.

[dschneider]

In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood Police (who have been timely and compassionate in their responses) regarding ongoing sightings of homeless persons (with and without shopping carts ) crossing the Chitty Chatty bridge at various times of the day and night, wandering the streets of The Village as well as the MMP along Chitty Chatty and Bradford. Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets as well as frightening a woman walking her dog. Both law enforcement agencies have told residents that the area near the bridge where it appears the persons are camping is owned by The Villages and therefore is private property. By law, the authorities must have a no trespassing order on file from TV in order to take action. They do not currently possess such an order. Calls to Community Watch and Community Standards have ended with, “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. So for all those who paid a premium to live near the preserve, lucky you to get a front row seat of a homeless encampment as well as having these individuals who clearly need mental health support roam the streets of your Village making the residents and guests feel unsafe and (presently) twisting in the wind and unsupported by The Villages. Godspeed…
What do snowbirds have to do with it?

[jonathanb]

Unfortunately as a society we have turned our backs on these people. What can be done to get these unfortunate souls the mental health care they need. Of course the answer is not what’s going on in big cities where homelessness is out of control by enabling their drug and alcohol addiction. Can they be legally ordered to undergo a mental health evaluation? It is a very delicate situation and I am not a trained mental health specialist but maybe a mission to take care of and train these folks to gain employment might be an answer? I just don’t know.

[hypart]

Correct. Just ask San Francisco how going soft on homelessness is working out.

I was in San Francisco for a week back in August, I barely saw any homeless people.

Not sure if they're cleared them away but it was very surprising considering all the footage.

[Dusty_Star]

Unfortunately as a society we have turned our backs on these people. What can be done to get these unfortunate souls the mental health care they need. Of course the answer is not what’s going on in big cities where homelessness is out of control by enabling their drug and alcohol addiction. Can they be legally ordered to undergo a mental health evaluation? It is a very delicate situation and I am not a trained mental health specialist but maybe a mission to take care of and train these folks to gain employment might be an answer? I just don’t know.

I agree with the first part of your post - we have as a society turned our backs. I think it started in the late 60s when court cases were won that made it very difficult to put people in mental institutions. Soon, states closed down mental institutions & now there is very little help or places for these people to go. The vast majority are either mentally ill or have addictions - pretty much unable to care for themselves. It is cruel, not enlightened to have removed support for these people; living rough is dangerous, unhealthy & these people would be better off in an institution. I acknowledge that some of the institutions had problems & needed improvement - but closing them altogether was a terrible mistake.

[charlie1]

In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood Police (who have been timely and compassionate in their responses) regarding ongoing sightings of homeless persons (with and without shopping carts ) crossing the Chitty Chatty bridge at various times of the day and night, wandering the streets of The Village as well as the MMP along Chitty Chatty and Bradford. Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets as well as frightening a woman walking her dog. Both law enforcement agencies have told residents that the area near the bridge where it appears the persons are camping is owned by The Villages and therefore is private property. By law, the authorities must have a no trespassing order on file from TV in order to take action. They do not currently possess such an order. Calls to Community Watch and Community Standards have ended with, “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. So for all those who paid a premium to live near the preserve, lucky you to get a front row seat of a homeless encampment as well as having these individuals who clearly need mental health support roam the streets of your Village making the residents and guests feel unsafe and (presently) twisting in the wind and unsupported by The Villages. Godspeed…

I do wish everyone would go to the CDD Orientation so that they understand the Responsibilities and Differences between the Developer and OUR Community Management. By understanding our Community Management setup, they would also understand who is responsible and who to call when an issue like this does pop up. If the property is owned by the Villages Developer, the CDD has no power! That being said, I am glad that the CDD is looking into who can solve the issue. I also understand the police can't arrest the homeless in this situation but do think they could have been a little more helpful.

[golfing eagles]

I do wish everyone would go to the CDD Orientation so that they understand the Responsibilities and Differences between the Developer and OUR Community Management. By understanding our Community Management setup, they would also understand who is responsible and who to call when an issue like this does pop up. If the property is owned by the Villages Developer, the CDD has no power! That being said, I am glad that the CDD is looking into who can solve the issue. I also understand the police can't arrest the homeless in this situation but do think they could have been a little more helpful.

Is stealing a shopping cart no longer a crime??????

[retiredguy123]

In my opinion, the best solution is for the police to make them leave. If you don't, more will come.

[DeeCee Dubya]

Money where you mouth is. Let these monsters into your own home.

[DiandJay]

Maybe someone could contact their church and ask for help. A shelter may be available for homeless in the area.

First Baptist Church in Leesburgh daily (and nightly) handles all types of difficult social issues; homeless care, counselling, released prisoner care, daily warm meals and clothing, help with groceries and medical/dental. This problem isn’t going to just go away.

[retiredguy123]

First Baptist Church in Leesburgh daily (and nightly) handles all types of difficult social issues; homeless care, counselling, released prisoner care, daily warm meals and clothing, help with groceries and medical/dental. This problem isn’t going to just go away.
Just to clarify, it is a church, but the services you mentioned are funded with taxpayer money.

[DeirdreFoster]

However, why does Sumter County Sheriff have a patrol car parked at the new apartment complex on Rte 466 going toward Rolling 24/7? THEY SIT ON PROPERTYTHAT IS PRVIATE !!!!! Somebody is getting special attention .....WHY[/QUOTE]

Churches pay for additional security all the time. It's not taking away from the deputy on duty. Normally the are providing the service on their off duty time.

[bobeaston]

Several posts suggest homeless people "camping in the woods." If you've seen the woods around the area where the homeless have been seen, you'd know that they are not welcoming camp lands.

More likely this man (or more) is holed up on someone's lanai. Most sightings have been in Ty Villas near the intersection of Morse and Rte 44. There are about 70 homes in that area, all villas, all with walls between them. We all know that new homes are built with no locks on the lanai screen doors. Where could be a better place to hide in relative comfort than a snowbird's lanai?

Would you want a "camper" on your lanai? Would you want both the police and The Villages saying "not my jurisdiction?"

[merrymini]

There are plenty of safety nets in our society but many of the people who live out on the streets are unwilling to use them. Mentally ill or drug addicted, they do not possess the right to impinge on everyone else. That is why California is having such a problem, they let them shoot up on the streets, no problem, so they are importing addicts.

[ThirdOfFive]

I agree with the first part of your post - we have as a society turned our backs. I think it started in the late 60s when court cases were won that made it very difficult to put people in mental institutions. Soon, states closed down mental institutions & now there is very little help or places for these people to go. The vast majority are either mentally ill or have addictions - pretty much unable to care for themselves. It is cruel, not enlightened to have removed support for these people; living rough is dangerous, unhealthy & these people would be better off in an institution. I acknowledge that some of the institutions had problems & needed improvement - but closing them altogether was a terrible mistake.
Bingo!

In Minnesota (with similar occurrences in most other states) the push began in the early 70's with a court case, Welsch v. Noot; Patty Welsch being a young disabled woman and Noot being the Minnesota Commissioner of Public Welfare. The gist of the case was that A) persons with mental and physical handicaps deserved to receive habilitative services; and B) that such people deserved to live in the least restrictive setting possible for their needs. Hard to argue with that, but as the years went by and people were moved from the large institutions ("State hospitals" in Minnesota; "Colonies" in neighboring Wisconsin) those large edifices, many approaching a century old, no longer had any use and were gradually consolidated and closed. The irony was that persons over 18 who were NOT under State or private guardianship or in the custody of corrections had the right to live where they pleased. Also, it was recognized somewhat vaguely that such people had the right to be mentally ill and as such, if they chose NOT to take their meds, it was completely up to them.

The result was inevitable. When it was recognized that some of these people could NOT be helped other than in an institution, the institutions either no longer existed or had been transformed into prisons. In Minnesota, particularly in the Minneapolis - St. Paul metro and first-ring suburbs, dozens of homeless encampments sprouted, mainly in the public parks but one in particular that caught everyone's eye was one on a hillside close to the St. Paul Cathedral. I saw it last about two years ago. It was huge; tents, chairs, people lying on the grass, people urinating (and assumedly defecating) in the open, etc. The Minnesota-based Wilder Foundation, back in 2018, stated that "An estimated 19,600 Minnesotans experienced homelessness on any given night in 2018. 50,600 people experienced homelessness over the course of the year." That was four years ago, and as I understand it, for a variety of reasons, the estimates are far beyond that today. Remember--this is Minnesota, where living outdoors might easily mean snow for six months of the year and temperatures on the coldest nights reaching -30 f. or even lower.

The impact on the communities has been far from just financial. Before our retirement my wife worked in downtown Minneapolis, riding the bus there from a suburban park-and-ride, and what she saw sometimes were beyond shocking. The homeless would come into the city from the parks and basically take over the bus stops particularly in the winter. My wife witnessed people doing their business completely in the open. There've been numerous instances of public masturbation and people having sex, again in the open. Panhandlers have gone from asking for money with a sad song-and-dance spiel to actively and aggressively demanding money from passers-by. There've been assaults, by homeless against one another and against passers-by. Drug use is rampant. Inner-city Minneapolis is going from a bustling city to, more and more, a deserted place as people who work there either find other jobs or take advantage of working from home. I know less about the situation in St. Paul, but last I heard things are pretty much paralleling Minneapolis over there. One particularly noisome and obnoxious practice over there is the homeless using the skywalks as toilets as well as sheltering in them at night. Though I cannot remember the particulars I recall an action over there that opposed closing the skywalks at the end of the business day because the homeless would be inconvenienced.

Yes. Our short-sighted policies created this monster (or actually "monsters" because most large cities probably have similar stories to tell). And yes. I have sympathy for these people. But how it is being handled, in all too many cases with kid gloves, is NOT working. If there is a growing homeless problem here in TV, then I will make it a point to crusade for the authorities to clean it up posthaste. I have seen firsthand what it can mushroom into. And I don't want to be anywhere near it.

[Djean1981]

Perhaps have 20/20, 60 minutes TV shows come in and have them do a story that will draw attention on a National basis. The Villages needs to start acting like they care about the monster they created. The police are just as bad. Find a reason NOT to do their job. However, why does Sumter County Sheriff have a patrol car parked at the new apartment complex on Rte 466 going toward Rolling 24/7? THEY SIT ON PROPERTYTHAT IS PRVIATE !!!!! Somebody is getting special attention .....WHY
Maybe the officer lives at the apartment. ..

[Bilyclub]

99% are homeless because they want to be for one reason or another. As Barney Fife said,
nip it in the bud.

[Larchap49]

In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood Police (who have been timely and compassionate in their responses) regarding ongoing sightings of homeless persons (with and without shopping carts ) crossing the Chitty Chatty bridge at various times of the day and night, wandering the streets of The Village as well as the MMP along Chitty Chatty and Bradford. Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets as well as frightening a woman walking her dog. Both law enforcement agencies have told residents that the area near the bridge where it appears the persons are camping is owned by The Villages and therefore is private property. By law, the authorities must have a no trespassing order on file from TV in order to take action. They do not currently possess such an order. Calls to Community Watch and Community Standards have ended with, “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. So for all those who paid a premium to live near the preserve, lucky you to get a front row seat of a homeless encampment as well as having these individuals who clearly need mental health support roam the streets of your Village making the residents and guests feel unsafe and (presently) twisting in the wind and unsupported by The Villages. Godspeed…

If you have a CC permit I suggest you be prepared in case you are assaulted. Play by the rules but if assaulted do what you must.

[pauld315]

Homeless snowbirds......eh?

You laugh, but it does happen. I knew a homeless guy once up near Raleigh NC and he would follow the warm weather south. These guys just want to spend the winter in "America's Friendliest Hometown" and enjoy all he amenities.

[TC_Arch]

In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood Police (who have been timely and compassionate in their responses) regarding ongoing sightings of homeless persons (with and without shopping carts ) crossing the Chitty Chatty bridge at various times of the day and night, wandering the streets of The Village as well as the MMP along Chitty Chatty and Bradford. Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets as well as frightening a woman walking her dog. Both law enforcement agencies have told residents that the area near the bridge where it appears the persons are camping is owned by The Villages and therefore is private property. By law, the authorities must have a no trespassing order on file from TV in order to take action. They do not currently possess such an order. Calls to Community Watch and Community Standards have ended with, “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. So for all those who paid a premium to live near the preserve, lucky you to get a front row seat of a homeless encampment as well as having these individuals who clearly need mental health support roam the streets of your Village making the residents and guests feel unsafe and (presently) twisting in the wind and unsupported by The Villages. Godspeed…
Are they paying their amenity fee?

[Michael 61]

99% are homeless because they want to be for one reason or another. As Barney Fife said,
nip it the bud.

I would say that describes most homeless men - in Colorado Springs when the temp went down below zero with snow and ice, social workers would try and coax these men into warm shelters, yet many refused, not wanting to play by their curfew rules, and not being able to smoke dope in the shelters.

[Normal]

There is plenty of unimproved private land north of 466. Their a few ranches that would love the visitors.

[GizmoWhiskers]

Where is Community Watch? I THINK I heard that Citizen's on Patrol is in Wildwood (?) and what about the Neighborhood Watch programs being implemented?

Private Property is just that. The cancer of no boundaries existing in society is spreading and people are fleeing the states that celebrate it. The name calling and shaming of people who desire basic order in the name of safety is part of the intentional cancer reaking havok and dividing the nation.

Compassion for PEOPLE and their situations a must on a human level. But the political use of people as pawns is as evil at its core as shaming tax paying people for wanting the safety they pay taxes and fees to have. If one can leave their front door unlocked and open to ALL then there would be no homelessness right? "What's mine is yours" will end crime right??

[KsJayhawkers]

However, why does Sumter County Sheriff have a patrol car parked at the new apartment complex on Rte 466 going toward Rolling 24/7? THEY SIT ON PROPERTYTHAT IS PRVIATE !!!!! Somebody is getting special attention .....WHY

Churches pay for additional security all the time. It's not taking away from the deputy on duty. Normally the are providing the service on their off duty time.[/QUOTE]

Because the officer lives there!!!

[birdawg]

There is plenty of unimproved private land north of 466. Their a few ranches that would love the visitors.so how about you open your door and invite these poor people in.

[Mortal1]

Is it OK to be more afraid of SOME of the residents who are fortunate enough to live here than those less than lucky in life?

Yes, police will take care of what they need to as the law permits. And your ivory clean washed towers may stand as long as you are around. But be careful with your complaints, you could easily be the one someone calls the cops on someday.

I wonder where we've heard this point of view before. These attitudes NEVER turn out well, but learning from the present isn't considered very nice.

[Byte1]

Oh, it's OK to be "empathic" toward the poor homeless that want to camp on your street corner, but heaven help any of your neighbors for putting up a tiny cross in their lawn or a bird ornament.
If these folks that are camping do not belong here, then they should not be allowed to camp out here, period. I care, but most homeless seem to be homeless by choice or are mentally inhibited (and that should also be addressed). I don't want homeless camping in my community and I don't want squatters living in vacant homes. I pay extra to live here when I could just as easily live cheaper elsewhere because I like this place. I will like it less if my neighbors tell me that they fear being accosted by "homeless." If that seems cold, then you all can invite them to stay with you and I won't have anything to say about it.

[jimbomaybe]

Bingo!

In Minnesota (with similar occurrences in most other states) the push began in the early 70's with a court case, Welsch v. Noot; Patty Welsch being a young disabled woman and Noot being the Minnesota Commissioner of Public Welfare. The gist of the case was that A) persons with mental and physical handicaps deserved to receive habilitative services; and B) that such people deserved to live in the least restrictive setting possible for their needs. Hard to argue with that, but as the years went by and people were moved from the large institutions ("State hospitals" in Minnesota; "Colonies" in neighboring Wisconsin) those large edifices, many approaching a century old, no longer had any use and were gradually consolidated and closed. The irony was that persons over 18 who were NOT under State or private guardianship or in the custody of corrections had the right to live where they pleased. Also, it was recognized somewhat vaguely that such people had the right to be mentally ill and as such, if they chose NOT to take their meds, it was completely up to them.

The result was inevitable. When it was recognized that some of these people could NOT be helped other than in an institution, the institutions either no longer existed or had been transformed into prisons. In Minnesota, particularly in the Minneapolis - St. Paul metro and first-ring suburbs, dozens of homeless encampments sprouted, mainly in the public parks but one in particular that caught everyone's eye was one on a hillside close to the St. Paul Cathedral. I saw it last about two years ago. It was huge; tents, chairs, people lying on the grass, people urinating (and assumedly defecating) in the open, etc. The Minnesota-based Wilder Foundation, back in 2018, stated that "An estimated 19,600 Minnesotans experienced homelessness on any given night in 2018. 50,600 people experienced homelessness over the course of the year." That was four years ago, and as I understand it, for a variety of reasons, the estimates are far beyond that today. Remember--this is Minnesota, where living outdoors might easily mean snow for six months of the year and temperatures on the coldest nights reaching -30 f. or even lower.

The impact on the communities has been far from just financial. Before our retirement my wife worked in downtown Minneapolis, riding the bus there from a suburban park-and-ride, and what she saw sometimes were beyond shocking. The homeless would come into the city from the parks and basically take over the bus stops particularly in the winter. My wife witnessed people doing their business completely in the open. There've been numerous instances of public masturbation and people having sex, again in the open. Panhandlers have gone from asking for money with a sad song-and-dance spiel to actively and aggressively demanding money from passers-by. There've been assaults, by homeless against one another and against passers-by. Drug use is rampant. Inner-city Minneapolis is going from a bustling city to, more and more, a deserted place as people who work there either find other jobs or take advantage of working from home. I know less about the situation in St. Paul, but last I heard things are pretty much paralleling Minneapolis over there. One particularly noisome and obnoxious practice over there is the homeless using the skywalks as toilets as well as sheltering in them at night. Though I cannot remember the particulars I recall an action over there that opposed closing the skywalks at the end of the business day because the homeless would be inconvenienced.

Yes. Our short-sighted policies created this monster (or actually "monsters" because most large cities probably have similar stories to tell). And yes. I have sympathy for these people. But how it is being handled, in all too many cases with kid gloves, is NOT working. If there is a growing homeless problem here in TV, then I will make it a point to crusade for the authorities to clean it up posthaste. I have seen firsthand what it can mushroom into. And I don't want to be anywhere near it.

The “homeless” lead miserable lives, there was a time when they would be institutionalized. They would have their freedom of movement taken away. Behavioral science could not and has not been able to have much success in helping them, they were required to take whatever drugs that were available to moderate their behavior. This was an unpopular situation for them, the ACLU came to the rescue, unless they were demonstrated to be a clear and present danger to themselves or others they could not be held against their will. The “homeless” preferred the freedom of the street where their behavior was not subject to any constraints other than whatever motivated them at any one time, they could take what drugs they wanted and could obtain. For the most part they are harmless but not necessarily so, how to predict the actions of individuals so unstable? Are they sane? Sometimes yes sometimes no, debatable definition, most ride the line and not sober if given any option. They are “homeless” because they have burnt out any family or friends network support, for the same reasons shelters are just a stop gap solution.

[coffeebean]

We live in one of, if not the furthest village south of FL-44 as possible currently. Some here have nick-named it "the deserted island" cuz, well...thats how it looks & feels. We border the turnpike.
anyway, We get both homeless and vagrant types coming thru rather often, believe it or not.

Walking alone, in pairs, carrying backpacks, pushing broken down bicycles, dirty, disheveled and clearly not residents. I see them normally around dusk, ruling out that they could be workers/laborers here working.

Literally last week, wife & I were on the golf course, when we encountered an individual, clearly homeless, hiking it between the turn pike & the golf course path, tracing the turnpike. We spotted him pop up from the edge brush, inside of what constitutes a "fence" there, moving in gradually to the golf course itself - where I can only assume walking for him was easier. He saw us, but didn't care. We continued to observe him as he walked west until he was out of sight.
It would not surprise me if there were some camping out near the new bridge is being constructed, or squatting temporarily in all that new village construction that's being built along the turnpike, as it is easily accessible by foot without detection, from non-village areas.

Anyone whose been out this way or checked out Newell development in person, could easily see how that could take place without anyone really noticing.
I've seen exactly ONE village patrol vehicle come thru this area in the entire year we've lived here, yet see them everywhere when we travel north of FL-44. There is NO -ONE patrolling or even monitoring out here that I can determine. I'm absolutely sure that near total lack of patrolling, does not go un-noticed by those seeking temporary hiding where they shouldn't be.
:/

That is lousy, for sure. I would be aghast. And to think.............we folks who live north of 44 have been told by more than one poster on this forum that WE are jealous of the folks who live down south. Hardly.

[Oldragbagger]

Maybe someone could contact their church and ask for help. A shelter may be available for homeless in the area.

On it’s face this sounds like a good and caring solution. But it’s not that simple when dealing with the homeless. I’m not taking about the person who suddenly finds themselves living in their car because of an economic downturn, or the person who has fled a bad home situation and finds themselves with nowhere to go. That’s a whole different subject and helping that person find temporary housing would be absolutely the right thing to help them turn their situation around. But the long term homeless are a whole different matter.

How do I know this? I have an alcoholic brother who has lived on the streets, by choice, for 15 years. I’ve had plenty of dealing over the years with him and his homeless friends. Everyone in the family has tried to help him, time and time again, but one by one we all had to give up at a point when it started to have toxic effects on our own lives and families .

My brother has been in and out of shelters so many times but never stays because they come with some expectations of acceptable behavior or even, god forbid, rules which he refuses to adhere to. Such as, most churches won’t tolerate you sitting on your bunk drinking yourself into oblivion, or being aggressive, or using constant foul language, or……fill in the blanks.

These folks usually have either substance abuse issues, mental problems, or both. Just finding them a place to sleep isn’t the answer, and honestly, as much as we’d like to believe differently, the vast majority of them have no desire to change their lifestyle. As hard as it is for those of us who live a normal life within society to understand, there is a freedom and a lack of expectations that comes with their life that they don’t want to relinquish in order to get “help.”

He has been in and out of rehab probably a dozen times over the years. Rarely makes it past a few days. And he has been banned from some shelters. He knows where to get a free meal if he needs it, and prefers to sleep in a tent wherever he can. He has been camping in someone’s back yard (with permission) for a couple of years now. If that should end he “knows” all the spots he can go where he is unlikely to be bothered by the law. What would be unfortunate would be for our local homeless population to start to realize that our neighborhoods are one of those places.

Are they all dangerous? I don’t know. I don’t personally believe my brother would intentionally hurt anyone. Although I do think that he might perceive a threat in a drunken state and respond in an unpredictable manner. Do I think he would steal from you if given an opportunity? You betcha. They even steal from each other. Their justification, survival.

[hamsterfay]

I guess this will make our northern end of the Villages more valuable! No encampment problems up here that I know of.

[villager7591]

It's not "lucky" to put yourself through school, work hard for 40+ years, then retire here... You are where you are in life because of the choices that you make.

[golfing eagles]

The “homeless” lead miserable lives, there was a time when they would be institutionalized. They would have their freedom of movement taken away. Behavioral science could not and has not been able to have much success in helping them, they were required to take whatever drugs that were available to moderate their behavior. This was an unpopular situation for them, the ACLU came to the rescue, unless they were demonstrated to be a clear and present danger to themselves or others they could not be held against their will. The “homeless” preferred the freedom of the street where their behavior was not subject to any constraints other than whatever motivated them at any one time, they could take what drugs they wanted and could obtain. For the most part they are harmless but not necessarily so, how to predict the actions of individuals so unstable? Are they sane? Sometimes yes sometimes no, debatable definition, most ride the line and not sober if given any option. They are “homeless” because they have burnt out any family or friends network support, for the same reasons shelters are just a stop gap solution.

Wow---please tell me you're not serious.

It was "unpopular" for the mentally ill to be in a mental institution???? I didn't realize that a vote was required or that it was a popularity contest.

"freedom of the streets without constraints"???? Seriously?????

We all have "constraints" on the streets---it's called THE LAW

Urinating or defecating public is against the law
Masturbation or sex in public is against the law
Drug use is against the law
Drunk and disorderly is against the law
Harassing passers-by for money is against the law

Or is it being suggested that the homeless and mentally ill be granted more rights than everyone else??????

[Oldragbagger]

Wow---please tell me you're not serious.

It was "unpopular" for the mentally ill to be in a mental institution???? I didn't realize that a vote was required or that it was a popularity contest.

"freedom of the streets without constraints"???? Seriously?????

We all have "constraints" on the streets---it's called THE LAW

Urinating or defecating public is against the law
Masturbation or sex in public is against the law
Drug use is against the law
Drunk and disorderly is against the law
Harassing passers-by for money is against the law

Or is it being suggested that the homeless and mentally ill be granted more rights than everyone else??????

Sorry to have to agree but he is absolutely right. See my post #52.

[Carlsondm]

Whatever. So not posting every day on every subject makes any post less true or less impactful? What’s your point? You want confirmation? Come sit at the base of the bridge.
He is probably looking for wisdom and solutions, not sarcasm.

[clouwho]

Just to clarify, it is a church, but the services you mentioned are funded with taxpayer money.

We happen to be paying for a formerly homeless ex-convict whom we have love deeply to go through the residential drug and alcohol rehab at Christian Care Center at First Baptist in Leesburg. He is our starfish (assuming you are familiar with the starfish “parable” that you can’t save them all, but you can surely save ONE—and what is EVERYONE saved just ONE?!)

The funding comes from the churchgoers both at First Baptist and other area churches and private donations from individuals and area businesses. They have great success rates with the myriad programs offered by this terrific church. This is a church that puts its money where the gospel lives and breathes and changes lives!

There is a good movie out with Dean Cain, Sean Young and T.C Stallings about this church and it’s ministries that I highly recommend.

This is the trailer: No Vacancy (2022) - IMDb (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt15196410/?ref_=fn_al_tt_2)

This is where you can order a DVD or stream it: No Vacancy | Kingstone Studios (https://watch.kingstonestudios.com/programs/streaming-screener-e14382)

If EVERY town had a church and community that had one of these Christian care villages with great holistic care we still couldn’t eradicate the problems of mental illness and drugs. We have decades of doing nothing to fix the problem and decades of CREATING the problem.

A complete breakdown of the foundations for building healthy children functional adults and societies (faith, family and community…all deeply broken structurally in this country starting in the late 60s) leaves us with the human and societal wreckage that keeps growing year by year.

It is heartbreaking.

As to the encampments that have GREATLY increased in the villages area in past two years, they WILL proliferate if the problem is not nipped in the bud ASAP. Crime will go up, safety will be at risk, and the ability to enjoy what you have worked and sacrificed to save for in retirement will be in jeopardy.

There are no easy or prolific solutions to the root issues of broken souls, addicted and mentally I’ll souls restlessly wandering the earth like zombies. The Ocala forest has a massive number of homeless people and provides a place where they can pitch a tent and create micro communities. Is that optimal? Nope. But it is doable.

These people DO need to be removed from our residential and commercial areas before a stronghold is created. St Augustine and myriad other cities that haven’t normally had much of a homeless issue; did not act quickly enough or strongly enough in the past couple of years to the new type of homeless (young, socially malformed, aggressive, mentally unstable and addicted people) moving into their city and it has created real issues for business and tourism.

[Oldragbagger]

That is lousy, for sure. I would be aghast. And to think.............we folks who live north of 44 have been told by more than one poster on this forum that WE are jealous of the folks who live down south. Hardly.

Don’t think you’re immune, because you’re not. The first homeless person I ever saw in The Villages was laying on the ground behind the shopping center next to the Villages Health at Pinellas. North or south doesn’t figure into it. If there is some imaginary line on the ground they don’t see it.

[clouwho]

That is lousy, for sure. I would be aghast. And to think.............we folks who live north of 44 have been told by more than one poster on this forum that WE are jealous of the folks who live down south. Hardly.

It is NOT just down south.
Twice in the past month I have seen the same clearly unstable and clearly homeless woman wandering on canal street and lurking at the postal stations. She slept at the Largo pool one night

[golfing eagles]

Don’t think you’re immune, because you’re not. The first homeless person I ever saw in The Villages was laying on the ground behind the shopping center next to the Villages Health at Pinellas. North or south doesn’t figure into it. If there is some imaginary line on the ground they don’t see it.

No, that was just a Villager hawking golf balls from #3 of Palmetto :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[golfing eagles]

It is NOT just down south.
Twice in the past month I have seen the same clearly unstable and clearly homeless woman wandering on canal street and lurking at the postal stations. She slept at the Largo pool one night

And as a non-resident that would be trespassing. The sheriff could haul her away.

[newgirl]

No, there are very few safety nets in this area for anyone..

[Fenster]

Whatever. So not posting every day on every subject makes any post less true or less impactful? What’s your point? You want confirmation? Come sit at the base of the bridge.

Exactly. Many of the people who post constantly usually contribute nothing useful.

[Altavia]

There were a couple of sheriff's cars in the area this morning.

[coffeebean]

Don’t think you’re immune, because you’re not. The first homeless person I ever saw in The Villages was laying on the ground behind the shopping center next to the Villages Health at Pinellas. North or south doesn’t figure into it. If there is some imaginary line on the ground they don’t see it.

The only homeless people I have ever seen, living in The Villages, are the people who stand on the corner of 441 outside of Walmart. They have signs asking for help. I have not seen any camps of any sort and do not wish to see them either. My bubble does not include homeless people camping anywhere.

[coffeebean]

It is NOT just down south.
Twice in the past month I have seen the same clearly unstable and clearly homeless woman wandering on canal street and lurking at the postal stations. She slept at the Largo pool one night

I was referring to camps where there are several homeless people taking up residence. That seems to be a problem along the Turnpike as I read this thread, not in the northern sections.

[Love2Swim]

There are plenty of safety nets in our society but many of the people who live out on the streets are unwilling to use them. Mentally ill or drug addicted, they do not possess the right to impinge on everyone else. That is why California is having such a problem, they let them shoot up on the streets, no problem, so they are importing addicts.

They are called mentally ill for a reason. Oftentimes they just aren't able to take advantage of safety nets, they are barely able to navigate their existence on this planet. :ohdear:

[golfing eagles]

I was referring to camps where there are several homeless people taking up residence. That seems to be a problem along the Turnpike as I read this thread, not in the northern sections.

I would think the turnpike, especially near the Okahumpka plaza would be an ideal location-----proximity to restrooms, food, plenty of foot traffic to panhandle, vehicles to steal from and best of all they provide security at night:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[manaboutown]

Homeless bums will go wherever they are tolerated and can beg and steal for alcohol, drugs and food without paying any consequences. If even a few are tolerated it will soon turn into a blight which at some point will be almost impossible to control and literally ruin the community for decent law-abiding taxpaying folk. I have seen it happen where I lived and worked.

[shut the front door]

Gather them up and have them congregate near Villages open houses. I bet that would motivate the developer to do something!

[vintageogauge]

There are plenty of homeless people living in the norther villages. Just recently a group was removed form a village home that is in foreclosure, they have camps off of Rolling Acres Road and I have also seen them camped along the road east of 301 across from where the new Dairy Queen was built. They usually stay on the fringes to avoid being hassled but are getting a little more brazen going into vacant homes or sleeping on lanais. There will be more now as cold weather sends them south.

[orchidlady22]

I suggest strongly that this matter be remedied FAST. Witnessed with my own eyes what can happen if ignored. It will grow into tent city. The American people need to see what is growing in California....from a few homeless to millions! with drugs, alcohol, crime, disease & filth! I am not exaggerating.

[Larchap49]

:shrug:

Well some of them may be snowbirds too. Follow the weather.

[Larchap49]

Perhaps have 20/20, 60 minutes TV shows come in and have them do a story that will draw attention on a National basis. The Villages needs to start acting like they care about the monster they created. The police are just as bad. Find a reason NOT to do their job. However, why does Sumter County Sheriff have a patrol car parked at the new apartment complex on Rte 466 going toward Rolling 24/7? THEY SIT ON PROPERTYTHAT IS PRVIATE !!!!! Somebody is getting special attention .....WHY

Off duty paid by the owner to guard her gate 24/7

[LAFwUs]

Homeless bums will go wherever they are tolerated and can beg and steal for alcohol, drugs and food without paying any consequences. If even a few are tolerated it will soon turn into a blight which at some point will be almost impossible to control and literally ruin the community for decent law-abiding taxpaying folk. I have seen it happen where I lived and worked.

Sadly, you are 100% correct.
Anyone who is under the delusion that they cannot set root here or on the edges of "the bubble" (which will effect the bubble) is completely delusional.
The more "help" that is extended, the more that will show up. Guaranteed. Its just how it is.
One only has to google / youtube search "homeless tent city" after typing in any given large city (San Francisco, CA., Portland, OR, Philly, PA, LA,CA, Seattle ,WA) the later of which we experienced 1st hand, to understand how fast and nearly insurmountable the problem can become, literally overnight, before anyone realizes it. This is to not even touch in the political aspect of it all, and the do-gooders that will sweep in to protect & harbor them, even if it goes against your rights, ,wishes or needs.

Also, it needs to be understood that there are "temporarily homeless" type (people just down on their luck who need/want help) and "career homeless" the later of which do not want help or cant/wont utilize any help provided due to lifelong drug/criminal/mental health issues and have no regard for the law, private property rights or anything else for that matter.

[ThirdOfFive]

I suggest strongly that this matter be remedied FAST. Witnessed with my own eyes what can happen if ignored. It will grow into tent city. The American people need to see what is growing in California....from a few homeless to millions! with drugs, alcohol, crime, disease & filth! I am not exaggerating.
I wholeheartedly agree. I saw Minneapolis' homeless problem turn much of the beautiful parkland of that city, once ideal family destinations, into places you'd never bring your family--or even go yourself unless you were armed. And as I mentioned in an earlier post, the issue has spilled over onto public lands in high-visibility areas. It is beyond ugly.

It's a sad state of affairs. The bleedingheart advocates care more about the "rights" of the homeless than they do about the WELFARE of the homeless.

[Taltarzac725]

Palm Bay is ‘first step’ in finding solution to homelessness | News | hometownnewsbrevard.com (https://www.hometownnewsbrevard.com/news/palm-bay-is-first-step-in-finding-solution-to-homelessness/article_74d46196-3ced-11e8-8bc0-23d2e73e9fb2.html)

I followed this man's journey into homelessness with great interest over 100 days or so back in 2014 on Facebook. He lived being homeless.

In 2014, he was voluntarily homeless for nearly 100 days as he embarked on a cross-country research project that was documented on Facebook.

“I have 23 years of experience as a naval officer, three degrees and I couldn’t get out of homelessness,” Mr. Rebman said.

Now, his mission is to educate the public on how “easily this can be solved.”

“Our system is broken and does not allow us to succeed,” Mr. Rebman said. “The secret is education and collaboration and affordable housing. It’s not all substance abuse like we think.”

Mr. Rebman’s mass education campaign started with Palm Bay and was met with a positive response from the city council.

“Palm Bay is the largest community in Brevard County with the least number of facilities for homeless people,” Mr. Rebman said. “For me, Palm Bay is the first step.”

Next, he’ll head to Cocoa and Titusville, and hopes to set up meetings with officials in each of Brevard County’s cities.

For Palm Bay, Mr. Redman proposed three action steps, including the opening of a cold-night shelter before the next cold season, identifying nonprofit and faith organizations in the area to assist with the effort, and consideration by the city to fund case managers like Orlando does.

“Your request is nothing out of the ordinary,” said Mayor William Capote.

And The Villages Daily Sun has done some very good articles on the people up in the Ocala Forest. The facts are often more complicated than people make them out to be.

[Larchap49]

Wow---please tell me you're not serious.

It was "unpopular" for the mentally ill to be in a mental institution???? I didn't realize that a vote was required or that it was a popularity contest.

"freedom of the streets without constraints"???? Seriously?????

We all have "constraints" on the streets---it's called THE LAW

Urinating or defecating public is against the law
Masturbation or sex in public is against the law
Drug use is against the law
Drunk and disorderly is against the law
Harassing passers-by for money is against the law

Or is it being suggested that the homeless and mentally ill be granted more rights than everyone else??????

Where have you been hiding. That post was right on the money. It was deemed against their civil rights to institutionalize these people against their will even if all they could say was no. It's gotten so out of hand because the -fill in the blank- do gooders controlling the cities and government agencies have let it. If it spreads here good luck getting it fixed.

[jimbomaybe]

Wow---please tell me you're not serious.

It was "unpopular" for the mentally ill to be in a mental institution???? I didn't realize that a vote was required or that it was a popularity contest.

"freedom of the streets without constraints"???? Seriously?????

We all have "constraints" on the streets---it's called THE LAW

Urinating or defecating public is against the law
Masturbation or sex in public is against the law
Drug use is against the law
Drunk and disorderly is against the law
Harassing passers-by for money is against the law

Or is it being suggested that the homeless and mentally ill be granted more rights than everyone else??????
I was not suggesting anything, the "law" means only what is does in the end, how it is enforced from an arrest on the street to what happens in court,, if anything, in many jurisdictions the the first court call is the overnighters, drunk/disorderly who are routinely just turned back to the street, would you show up to prosecute a drunk who took a dump in the doorway of your business? when in an mental institution they require a certain level of behavior, if it is impossible for you to comply they have drugs that will "calm you down" many inmates would rather live on the street than comply with the standard imposed "inside" advances in the law has given them the option of walking

[ex34449]

The homeless and the snowbirds come here for the same reasons. They prefer not to freeze their butts off.

[golfing eagles]

I was not suggesting anything, the "law" means only what is does in the end, how it is enforced from an arrest on the street to what happens in court,, if anything, in many jurisdictions the the first court call is the overnighters, drunk/disorderly who are routinely just turned back to the street, would you show up to prosecute a drunk who took a dump in the doorway of your business? when in an mental institution they require a certain level of behavior, if it is impossible for you to comply they have drugs that will "calm you down" many inmates would rather live on the street than comply with the standard imposed "inside" advances in the law has given them the option of walking

To which my first suggestion is CHANGE THE LAW!!!!

Enough of this woke BS, endangering the overwhelming majority so a few can run amok. I wonder if the emperor Honorius had the same problems after he watched the Visigoths come over the hills of Rome

[Aces4]

n 2014, he was voluntarily homeless for nearly 100 days as he embarked on a cross-country research project that was documented on Facebook.

“I have 23 years of experience as a naval officer, three degrees and I couldn’t get out of homelessness,” Mr. Rebman said.

Now, his mission is to educate the public on how “easily this can be solved.”

“Our system is broken and does not allow us to succeed,” Mr. Rebman said. “The secret is education and collaboration and affordable housing. It’s not all substance abuse like we think.”

Mr. Rebman’s mass education campaign started with Palm Bay and was met with a positive response from the city council.

“Palm Bay is the largest community in Brevard County with the least number of facilities for homeless people,” Mr. Rebman said. “For me, Palm Bay is the first step.”

Next, he’ll head to Cocoa and Titusville, and hopes to set up meetings with officials in each of Brevard County’s cities.

For Palm Bay, Mr. Redman proposed three action steps, including the opening of a cold-night shelter before the next cold season, identifying nonprofit and faith organizations in the area to assist with the effort, and consideration by the city to fund case managers like Orlando does.



Tal, from what I can see, Mr. Redman has proposed more handouts, no solutions.

[Aces4]

The homeless and the snowbirds come here for the same reasons. They prefer not to freeze their butts off.

As did all the other people living in The Villages now, geezzz.

[jimbomaybe]

To which my first suggestion is CHANGE THE LAW!!!!

Enough of this woke BS, endangering the overwhelming majority so a few can run amok. I wonder if the emperor Honorius had the same problems after he watched the Visigoths come over the hills of Rome
They are most certainly changing the laws, as of the first of the year Illinois will have the "Safety Act" that will do away with the cash bond requirement for many offences , in addition a "homeless "person living in your shed will be given a citation , not removed, the wind is blowing strongly in a "progressive direction friend

[golfing eagles]

They are most certainly changing the laws, as of the first of the year Illinois will have the "Safety Act" that will do away with the cash bond requirement for many offences , in addition a "homeless "person living in your shed will be given a citation , not removed, the wind is blowing strongly in a "progressive direction friend

"Progressive" is one term to describe it. The more accurate term is "anarchy"

[VApeople]

the wind is blowing strongly in a progressive direction friend

Maybe that is true in Illinois.

However, we are thrilled to live in Florida.

[Aces4]

They are most certainly changing the laws, as of the first of the year Illinois will have the "Safety Act" that will do away with the cash bond requirement for many offences , in addition a "homeless "person living in your shed will be given a citation , not removed, the wind is blowing strongly in a "progressive direction friend

Don’t you mean “backward” direction?

[jimbomaybe]

"Progressive" is one term to describe it. The more accurate term is "anarchy"
Heard some statistics that 4 out of 5 homeless have been homeless before, missing was the number of fist time and length of time homeless, they are doing something wrong, they have problems that no one can address,, coming to an area near you soon ? the bubble meets the real world ?

[golfing eagles]

Heard some statistics that 4 out of 5 homeless have been homeless before, missing was the number of fist time and length of time homeless, they are doing something wrong, they have problems that no one can address,, coming to an area near you soon ? the bubble meets the real world ?

Or maybe everyone would be better off if "the real world" patterned itself after "the bubble"

[Caymus]

They are most certainly changing the laws, as of the first of the year Illinois will have the "Safety Act" that will do away with the cash bond requirement for many offences , in addition a "homeless "person living in your shed will be given a citation , not removed, the wind is blowing strongly in a "progressive direction friend

The woke high crime cities have already eliminated cash bonds.

[ThirdOfFive]

To which my first suggestion is CHANGE THE LAW!!!!

Enough of this woke BS, endangering the overwhelming majority so a few can run amok. I wonder if the emperor Honorius had the same problems after he watched the Visigoths come over the hills of Rome
Absolutely!

How?

[bark4me]

Actually 7 posts and thanked on 5 of them. Get off your high horse pal

[ThirdOfFive]

"Progressive" is one term to describe it. The more accurate term is "anarchy"
"Anarchy" works. So do a few other words.

Unfortunately, with the Thought Police and all...

[Taltarzac725]

"Anarchy" works. So do a few other words.

Unfortunately, with the Thought Police and all...

There are always going to be people down and out for various reasons and in an open society it is hard to do much for them unless they accept the help.

[ThirdOfFive]

There are always going to be people down and out for various reasons and in an open society it is hard to do much for them unless they accept the help.
I agree.

But at what point does the good of the "open society" become more important than the "down and out" segment dragging it down?

[Smalley]

On it’s face this sounds like a good and caring solution. But it’s not that simple when dealing with the homeless. I’m not taking about the person who suddenly finds themselves living in their car because of an economic downturn, or the person who has fled a bad home situation and finds themselves with nowhere to go. That’s a whole different subject and helping that person find temporary housing would be absolutely the right thing to help them turn their situation around. But the long term homeless are a whole different matter.

How do I know this? I have an alcoholic brother who has lived on the streets, by choice, for 15 years. I’ve had plenty of dealing over the years with him and his homeless friends. Everyone in the family has tried to help him, time and time again, but one by one we all had to give up at a point when it started to have toxic effects on our own lives and families .

My brother has been in and out of shelters so many times but never stays because they come with some expectations of acceptable behavior or even, god forbid, rules which he refuses to adhere to. Such as, most churches won’t tolerate you sitting on your bunk drinking yourself into oblivion, or being aggressive, or using constant foul language, or……fill in the blanks.

These folks usually have either substance abuse issues, mental problems, or both. Just finding them a place to sleep isn’t the answer, and honestly, as much as we’d like to believe differently, the vast majority of them have no desire to change their lifestyle. As hard as it is for those of us who live a normal life within society to understand, there is a freedom and a lack of expectations that comes with their life that they don’t want to relinquish in order to get “help.”

He has been in and out of rehab probably a dozen times over the years. Rarely makes it past a few days. And he has been banned from some shelters. He knows where to get a free meal if he needs it, and prefers to sleep in a tent wherever he can. He has been camping in someone’s back yard (with permission) for a couple of years now. If that should end he “knows” all the spots he can go where he is unlikely to be bothered by the law. What would be unfortunate would be for our local homeless population to start to realize that our neighborhoods are one of those places.

Are they all dangerous? I don’t know. I don’t personally believe my brother would intentionally hurt anyone. Although I do think that he might perceive a threat in a drunken state and respond in an unpredictable manner. Do I think he would steal from you if given an opportunity? You betcha. They even steal from each other. Their justification, survival.
I am so sorry for the anguish that your brother has caused in your family. He is probably typical of the chronically homeless described here. If they want detoxification, it is available. Those with serious mental health problems are more difficult problems. We can't allow a tented homeless camp in The Villages. It brings degradation, filth and violence. Our homeowners deserve a safe environment. We came here for quality of life and many saved their earnings for years to be able to afford it.

[golfnut]

Why hasn't the developer issued a no trespass order for their property to neighboring police departments?

[Taltarzac725]

I agree.

But at what point does the good of the "open society" become more important than the "down and out" segment dragging it down?

Some homeless near a bridge in the Southern part of the Villages hardly is dragging down society. They have been around since I moved here in 2005. Panhandlers that is and sometimes they are anything but homeless. Just some more confidence men and women who probably make good money. Others are not so lucky nor so dishonest and might be on the street for reasons of PTSD or some other illness.

[ThirdOfFive]

Some homeless near a bridge in the Southern part of the Villages hardly is dragging down society. They have been around since I moved here in 2005. Panhandlers that is and sometimes they are anything but homeless. Just some more confidence men and women who probably make good money. Others are not so lucky nor so dishonest and might be on the street for reasons of PTSD or some other illness.
Maybe not here, maybe not yet, but there've been plenty of examples given, here and other places, of just how bad it can get if not nipped in the bud. I've posted about the Minneapolis problem. Someone else posted about the Los Angeles problem. Both of those, plus uncounted others, undoubtedly began small and were not seen as a major problem. Until they were.

Solving a problem while it is small is always the best way to go.

[Kenswing]

We moved here from Washington. What we saw in Seattle regarding homeless people was that you will never solve the homeless problem if you make your city a great place to be homeless.

[Rainger99]

The only homeless people I have ever seen, living in The Villages, are the people who stand on the corner of 441 outside of Walmart. They have signs asking for help.

I have seen people there also asking for money. However, almost every place that I walk into - Walmart, McDonalds, Home Depot, most restaurants - has help wanted signs where they are paying about $30,000 a year with benefits.

Years ago, a homeless counselor told me never to give money to pan handlers. He said that 9 times out of 10, they will use it for drugs or alcohol. He said that the best thing was to refer them to a social services where they would get help.

[Stu from NYC]

We moved here from Washington. What we saw in Seattle regarding homeless people was that you will never solve the homeless problem if you make your city a great place to be homeless.

Very true

[Oldragbagger]

I am so sorry for the anguish that your brother has caused in your family. He is probably typical of the chronically homeless described here. If they want detoxification, it is available. Those with serious mental health problems are more difficult problems. We can't allow a tented homeless camp in The Villages. It brings degradation, filth and violence. Our homeowners deserve a safe environment. We came here for quality of life and many saved their earnings for years to be able to afford it.

Thank you.

Absolutely agree! Once this community gets a reputation as a safe space the problem will grow quickly. Better to put a stop to it now before it gets to that point.

[manaboutown]

A problem unique to The Villages, and perhaps Florida in general, is that so many homes sit empty for months on end, especially during the hot, hotter and hottest months of the year. Sure, people check on them now and then but empty dwellings attract homeless and other undesirables. Also many of the people who reside here are over 70 years of age and likely more vulnerable in a multitude of ways than they were in their young days. If the criminal homeless get a foothold here Katy bar the door.

[Taltarzac725]

A problem unique to The Villages, and perhaps Florida in general, is that so many homes sit empty for months on end, especially during the hot, hotter and hottest months of the year. Sure, people check on them now and then but empty dwellings attract homeless and other undesirables. Also many of the people who reside here are over 70 years of age and likely more vulnerable in a multitude of ways than they were in their young days. If the criminal homeless get a foothold here Katy bar the door.


I really doubt that will happen. Most of the neighbors watch each other. Maybe out of boredom. And many are armed. And the police would find a way of removing squatters
as would the Villages' developers.

[DAVES]

There are people camped behind strip malls , Walmarts and just about any place you can camp in woods , was he bothering anyone , was it just seeing him that scared someone , and stating we all paid a premium to live next to a homeless camp is a little over the top

The reality, most subjects are not well explained in the typical website post. The writer forgets we do not know who they are. The reader is forced to fill in all the missing information for a valid opinion.

Personal, OPINION. I think, but for the grace of god goes I. What would I do, if in front of my home? Sad reality-no good deed goes unpunished was a headline for a news story during the great depression. If, I recall there was a dentist in Chicago who saw the starving people. He out of his own pocket put out food. That of course cased the word to spread and more people to gather. He was arrested for doing this act of goodwill-no good deed goes unpunished.

[billethkid]

A problem unique to The Villages, and perhaps Florida in general, is that so many homes sit empty for months on end, especially during the hot, hotter and hottest months of the year. Sure, people check on them now and then but empty dwellings attract homeless and other undesirables. Also many of the people who reside here are over 70 years of age and likely more vulnerable in a multitude of ways than they were in their young days. If the criminal homeless get a foothold here Katy bar the door.

only a few years it was the annual gathering of the "gypsies" invading the vulnerable residents.

And after that we had the "daily" break-in rush.

Statistically it turns out to be....there always something ....that loosens the sky!

_______________________________________________

:censored:

[ThirdOfFive]

There's a guy with a bushy black beard that I've seen maybe three times; twice at Publix (Spanish Plaines) and once at another time. He is a musician; plays an accordion and I think guitar too. Quite talented. He has a money collection box by him and the times I've seen him, he's had a woman with a child (woman and child change), with a sign that they need help. I enjoyed his music and put a few dollars into his box.

Pretty classy way to panhandle. I give the guy credit both for originality and for the (assumed) fact he's using his talent to help others.

[billethkid]

All we hear about every day is the shortages of available people to WORK in thousands of businesses across the USA.

It is obviously a conscious choice to remain homeless, not work and ask/pan handle other people's hard earned (WORK!!!) $$$.

__________________________________________________ __

:censored:

[joelfmi]

[I live in a major US city, and I frequently see homeless people in the streets with their pants down, talking gibberish to themselves, yelling at passersby's, and violently rocking back and forth sitting at a bus station.

They look like they need serious mental help and pose a threat to regular citizens. So, it would make sense to put them in some kind of mental institution, right?

What's preventing the city from putting them in mental institutions for treatment? To clarify, I'm not asking for all homeless people to be institutionalized, just the very obviously mentally unstable ones and the one's not mentally ill that able be able to work should live in public housing taking them off the streets
Unless one is an immediate danger to themselves or someone else, no one can make them do a thing. They have the right to refuse treatment, including medication. That is way the law is written this needs be changed and rewritten. I am in no way in agreement of letting these people live on the street they need care.

[Taltarzac725]

[I live in a major US city, and I frequently see homeless people in the streets with their pants down, talking gibberish to themselves, yelling at passersby's, and violently rocking back and forth sitting at a bus station.

They look like they need serious mental help and pose a threat to regular citizens. So, it would make sense to put them in some kind of mental institution, right?

What's preventing the city from putting them in mental institutions for treatment? To clarify, I'm not asking for all homeless people to be institutionalized, just the very obviously mentally unstable ones and the one's not mentally ill that able be able to work should live in public housing taking them off the streets
Unless one is an immediate danger to themselves or someone else, no one can make them do a thing. They have the right to refuse treatment, including medication. That is way the law is written this needs be changed and rewritten. I am in no way in agreement of letting these people live on the street they need care.

We live in a free country. More closed societies do and did put those their leaders deemed mentally ill or otherwise unwanted into places.

When l worked at the downtown Minneapolis public library there were often homeless on the benches in that library. They were sleeping. They were inside because it was freezing outside. They did have to wait for the library to open.

[manaboutown]

We live in a free country. More closed societies do and did put those their leaders deemed mentally ill or otherwise unwanted into places.

When l worked at the downtown Minneapolis public library there were often homeless on the benches in that library. They were sleeping. They were inside because it was freezing outside. They did have to wait for the library to open.

A few years ago I was acquainted with a woman in her 60s who was a librarian in Laguna Beach, CA. The verbal abuse and threatening gestures from homeless bums she was forced to endure daily were awful. Apparently the police could not or would not patrol the library or intervene as the bums had their"rights" although she apparently had none. She was close to retirement so could not just quit.

Public libraries in many cities have become for their legitimate users distasteful at best and dangerous at worst as alcoholic, druggie, filthy, stinking criminal homeless bums are allowed to spend their days lounging around on the couches sleeping it off inside. I would not dare enter the bathrooms of a public library in many communities today. When I was a child my mother took me at least weekly to the town's public library. I always felt safe there and never saw a vagrant (as they were called in those days) hanging around. How did it come to this?

[Koapaka]

You laugh, but it does happen. I knew a homeless guy once up near Raleigh NC and he would follow the warm weather south. These guys just want to spend the winter in "America's Friendliest Hometown" and enjoy all he amenities.

When we lived in Hawaii I volunteered at a methadone clinic on the weekends trying to be civil minded to the community. Plenty of folks that were addicts came in and said that they were asked from "northern states" in the US..."hey, do you want to freeze to death this winter here or do you want a one way ticket to Hawaii and enjoy the harsh weather there?". Heard it more than once, so feel there is an element of truth to it. If they will "entice" them to warmer weather in winter, FL is a LOT cheaper to send them to than HI. This was in the late 90's.

[pabotticelli]

TERRIBLE! The Villages MUST do something about this!

[Remembergoldenrule]

There are people camped behind strip malls , Walmarts and just about any place you can camp in woods , was he bothering anyone , was it just seeing him that scared someone , and stating we all paid a premium to live next to a homeless camp is a little over the top

I don’t care where you live - million dollar property to second hand trailer. You paid for the property or are paying for the property and taxes to the community. This is slippery slope that we have seen the outcome of cities don’t address it in the beginning. Think LA, Seattle, NYC, Chicago, Atlanta. By doing nothing and encouraging it you are saying you are ok with the same outcome. For the most (notice said most not all) part are people choosing to be homeless either because they like the not being responsible life style or are live the drug life style.
PS my family was homeless for a while due to job losses of both parents so yes I understand being homeless, but if you want out you can get out without setting up permanent tent cities and ruining the lives of hardworking people of all levels around you because of your nonconformist decisions.

[asianthree]

Sadly many mental health facilities no longer exist. Usually when a person in need ends up in any ED.. it’s days before a facility can accept them… so many will be on the streets without help for most of their lifetime

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Wow. So, yes…someone having an animated, agitated conversation with themselves while pushing a stolen shopping cart over the bridge and stumbling through the community in the daylight is unnerving enough, but then in the dark - intoxicated and throwing empty liquor and pill bottles in the streets - and making someone out for a walk with their dog feel unsafe is definitely a legitimate concern regardless of the price of a home, but paying a premium for that is, as you said, over the top. Then being told law enforcement has their hands tied because they’ve not been provided the legal authority they require to take action to get violators out of a protected preserve and (hopefully) find them the mental healthcare they need… it’s unacceptable.

The Villages is 2A NRA Fandom territory. Folks in this very forum will be the first to tell you about all the firearms they own, how often they practice on the range, how they learned in the military and know their way around this and that firearm, and no one should ever dare cross them because they are legally carrying and not afraid to protect themselves. Surely no one in our community would have reason to fear some random homeless guy.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

In my opinion, the best solution is for the police to make them leave. If you don't, more will come.

Yeah. That's the ticket. Oh by the way...

when they leave, where do you figure they'll GO? Because - they have to go somewhere. There's no mass transit around here, they don't have homes to go to, no one's mentioned sending them to any shelters or even any shelters available to receive them. They have no transportation of their own (they'd be sleeping in it if they did), so they can't go any further than they can walk.

No idea how they ended up there in the first place, but it's kinda a good idea to have a plan, before you implement a response.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Homeless bums will go wherever they are tolerated and can beg and steal for alcohol, drugs and food without paying any consequences. If even a few are tolerated it will soon turn into a blight which at some point will be almost impossible to control and literally ruin the community for decent law-abiding taxpaying folk. I have seen it happen where I lived and worked.

Judgmental cat judges.

I'm glad there isn't a big "visible" homeless population near my neighborhood. I know there are homeless people in the area - like coffeebean said - I see them on the corner of the 441 Walmart driveway. Haven't ever seen any come down my street, or hanging out in anyone's back yard. I'm thankful for that.

However, I've known a good amount of folks when they were homeless, as I used to hang out with them when I was a musician living in Boston and playing guitar in Harvard Square storefronts and the subway. Many of them were Vietnam vets suffering from PTSD and unable to succeed in living alone, with a spouse, with kids, or with their own parents (this was in the 1980's - most of their parents were still alive). Some of them had physical disabilities, combined with opiate addiction they ended up with as a direct result of requiring painkillers for the recovery of their injuries. A guy who had one leg cut off became a morphine addict. That kind of thing. Then there are the folks who have homes, but for whatever reason, don't go to them.

Like my friend Skip, who had what was -at the time - called paranoid schizophrenia. It has another name these days but you all know what I mean. He had a full 4-year scholarship to Harvard and spoke a few languages fluently. He was absolutely brilliant. But he also would often forget to take the meds. He'd go wandering off for a couple of weeks, sometimes even a couple of months. He'd disappear in early September and show up with plastic bags on his bare feet during the first snow fall, ranting and raving about how the Secret Service sent him on a special mission to protect the Harvard Square Constable from the infiltrators. Once he thought I was a princess and he was sent by the Secret Service to protect me. It was kinda sweet. When he was "sick" he reeked, because he had no understanding of his own hygiene needs. After a few days for him to decompress, we'd get him back to his parents' house so they could help him back onto his meds. He was considered homeless, because he had no home of his own. He would stay with his parents but he was 40 years old and the legal system wouldn't declare him incompetent, because he was 100% normal when he was taking his meds.

The other homeless folks would all look after each other. AND they looked after the entire neighborhood. They were part of the community and - though they often smelled bad because they didn't have regular access to showers, they all had generous spirits. Even the "sick" ones, and even the addicts.

In an environment like Harvard Square, where there's a LOT of culture, a LOT of diversity, and a LOT of very close-knit community members in a college setting, you'll see more tolerance. They still don't want them sleeping in their back yards, or blocking traffic, or walking up to people to beg. And that is an absolutely valid opinion and I share it.

But you STILL need to have a place to send them TO, when you send them away. WHERE are you sending them? Saying "I don't care as long as it's not near me" doesn't count. Because - they are where they are NOW - because someone said exactly that.

[manaboutown]

///

[tophcfa]

Answer me this. When I was driving back north last spring in my pickup truck I pulled over into an empty parking lot and crawled into the back of the enclosed cab to grab a few hours of shut eye. I was in my own legally registered and insured truck and wasn’t bothering a soul. A cop pulled in an told me if I didn’t leave immediately that I would be arrested. How does that reconcile with people squatting for days on private land, pushing around stolen shopping carts full of who knows what, drinking and probably doing illegal drugs, panhandling and disturbing local residents, and being beyond the reach of the law? Something doesn’t add up?

[manaboutown]

Judgmental cat judges.

I'm glad there isn't a big "visible" homeless population near my neighborhood. I know there are homeless people in the area - like coffeebean said - I see them on the corner of the 441 Walmart driveway. Haven't ever seen any come down my street, or hanging out in anyone's back yard. I'm thankful for that.

However, I've known a good amount of folks when they were homeless, as I used to hang out with them when I was a musician living in Boston and playing guitar in Harvard Square storefronts and the subway. Many of them were Vietnam vets suffering from PTSD and unable to succeed in living alone, with a spouse, with kids, or with their own parents (this was in the 1980's - most of their parents were still alive). Some of them had physical disabilities, combined with opiate addiction they ended up with as a direct result of requiring painkillers for the recovery of their injuries. A guy who had one leg cut off became a morphine addict. That kind of thing. Then there are the folks who have homes, but for whatever reason, don't go to them.

Like my friend Skip, who had what was -at the time - called paranoid schizophrenia. It has another name these days but you all know what I mean. He had a full 4-year scholarship to Harvard and spoke a few languages fluently. He was absolutely brilliant. But he also would often forget to take the meds. He'd go wandering off for a couple of weeks, sometimes even a couple of months. He'd disappear in early September and show up with plastic bags on his bare feet during the first snow fall, ranting and raving about how the Secret Service sent him on a special mission to protect the Harvard Square Constable from the infiltrators. Once he thought I was a princess and he was sent by the Secret Service to protect me. It was kinda sweet. When he was "sick" he reeked, because he had no understanding of his own hygiene needs. After a few days for him to decompress, we'd get him back to his parents' house so they could help him back onto his meds. He was considered homeless, because he had no home of his own. He would stay with his parents but he was 40 years old and the legal system wouldn't declare him incompetent, because he was 100% normal when he was taking his meds.

The other homeless folks would all look after each other. AND they looked after the entire neighborhood. They were part of the community and - though they often smelled bad because they didn't have regular access to showers, they all had generous spirits. Even the "sick" ones, and even the addicts.

In an environment like Harvard Square, where there's a LOT of culture, a LOT of diversity, and a LOT of very close-knit community members in a college setting, you'll see more tolerance. They still don't want them sleeping in their back yards, or blocking traffic, or walking up to people to beg. And that is an absolutely valid opinion and I share it.

But you STILL need to have a place to send them TO, when you send them away. WHERE are you sending them? Saying "I don't care as long as it's not near me" doesn't count. Because - they are where they are NOW - because someone said exactly that.

Why should I or anyone else be responsible for sending them anywhere?

Granted there are a few homeless who deserve help but the vast majority are homeless bums due to their own life choices to drink, drug and commit crimes for which I am not responsible. They are.

[ChrisTinaBruce]

correct. Just ask san francisco how going soft on homelessness is working out.

bingo!

[bobeaston]

Why hasn't the developer issued a no trespass order for their property to neighboring police departments?

Over on Nextdoor there is a post about the CDD doing exactly that. They supposedly have issued a no trespass order for Sumter County Sherriff to use in the area immediately north of the Chitty Chatty bridge and are working on one for the Wildwood Police who have jurisdiction immediately south of the bridge.

[BlueStarAirlines]

There's a guy with a bushy black beard that I've seen maybe three times; twice at Publix (Spanish Plaines) and once at another time. He is a musician; plays an accordion and I think guitar too. Quite talented. He has a money collection box by him and the times I've seen him, he's had a woman with a child (woman and child change), with a sign that they need help. I enjoyed his music and put a few dollars into his box.

Pretty classy way to panhandle. I give the guy credit both for originality and for the (assumed) fact he's using his talent to help others.

They are not playing....its a scam

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPc30uwXrTw

Police across America warn of scammers pretending to play the violin for money - Classic FM (https://www.classicfm.com/discover-music/instruments/violin/police-busking-scam-america/)

[Worldseries27]

maybe someone could contact their church and ask for help. A shelter may be available for homeless in the area.
in our various liturgical services how many times do we implore our lord and father to grant us mercy

[VickiF]

In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood Police (who have been timely and compassionate in their responses) regarding ongoing sightings of homeless persons (with and without shopping carts ) crossing the Chitty Chatty bridge at various times of the day and night, wandering the streets of The Village as well as the MMP along Chitty Chatty and Bradford. Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets as well as frightening a woman walking her dog. Both law enforcement agencies have told residents that the area near the bridge where it appears the persons are camping is owned by The Villages and therefore is private property. By law, the authorities must have a no trespassing order on file from TV in order to take action. They do not currently possess such an order. Calls to Community Watch and Community Standards have ended with, “it’s not our jurisdiction.” The CDD is now engaged and looking into who is responsible for the area around CC bridge and the woods/preserve. So for all those who paid a premium to live near the preserve, lucky you to get a front row seat of a homeless encampment as well as having these individuals who clearly need mental health support roam the streets of your Village making the residents and guests feel unsafe and (presently) twisting in the wind and unsupported by The Villages. Godspeed…

The way things are going economically it won’t be too long before some Villagers are in the encampment.

[retiredguy123]

Yeah. That's the ticket. Oh by the way...

when they leave, where do you figure they'll GO? Because - they have to go somewhere. There's no mass transit around here, they don't have homes to go to, no one's mentioned sending them to any shelters or even any shelters available to receive them. They have no transportation of their own (they'd be sleeping in it if they did), so they can't go any further than they can walk.

No idea how they ended up there in the first place, but it's kinda a good idea to have a plan, before you implement a response.
Are you saying that, if they are breaking the law, the police shouldn't make them leave?

[ThirdOfFive]

[I live in a major US city, and I frequently see homeless people in the streets with their pants down, talking gibberish to themselves, yelling at passersby's, and violently rocking back and forth sitting at a bus station.

They look like they need serious mental help and pose a threat to regular citizens. So, it would make sense to put them in some kind of mental institution, right?

What's preventing the city from putting them in mental institutions for treatment? To clarify, I'm not asking for all homeless people to be institutionalized, just the very obviously mentally unstable ones and the one's not mentally ill that able be able to work should live in public housing taking them off the streets
Unless one is an immediate danger to themselves or someone else, no one can make them do a thing. They have the right to refuse treatment, including medication. That is way the law is written this needs be changed and rewritten. I am in no way in agreement of letting these people live on the street they need care.
Three things.

1) The city cannot commit a person (which is what is being discussed here) to an institution for mental health treatment. Only the courts can do that, and then only after the person undergoes a mental health evaluation which can be involuntary but can last only a few days. Commitments must be court-ordered, recommended by appropriate professionals, and are reviewed on a regular basis for continued need (six months, I believe, here in Florida). The entire process needs to be set in motion by a petition to the court for commitment, and the person being committed (or not) has the right to counsel.

2) You'd have "advocates" up the wazoo milling around if you started rounding up the homeless, evaluating them, and sending them off to various institutions.

3) Many of those institutions no longer exist, being torn down or repurposed for other uses (often, prisons).

It is a very tough nut to crack, made so by shortsighted "advocates" who all too often are high on idealism but woefully lacking in knowledge.

[golfing eagles]

Three things.

1) The city cannot commit a person (which is what is being discussed here) to an institution for mental health treatment. Only the courts can do that, and then only after the person undergoes a mental health evaluation which can be involuntary but can last only a few days. Commitments must be court-ordered, recommended by appropriate professionals, and are reviewed on a regular basis for continued need (six months, I believe, here in Florida). The entire process needs to be set in motion by a petition to the court for commitment, and the person being committed (or not) has the right to counsel.

2) You'd have "advocates" up the wazoo milling around if you started rounding up the homeless, evaluating them, and sending them off to various institutions.

3) Many of those institutions no longer exist, being torn down or repurposed for other uses (often, prisons).

It is a very tough nut to crack, made so by shortsighted "advocates" who all too often are high on idealism but woefully lacking in knowledge.

Exactly!

All I could do is commit a person for 72 hours of observation, and I better have good cause or I'd be facing a civil suit. Only did it once in 35 years----and that was a person who claimed to be Jesus Christ and needed to "harvest" 6 units of AB neg blood to get back to heaven---seemed like it fit the definition of a threat to himself or others

[Altavia]

Over on Nextdoor there is a post about the CDD doing exactly that. They supposedly have issued a no trespass order for Sumter County Sherriff to use in the area immediately north of the Chitty Chatty bridge and are working on one for the Wildwood Police who have jurisdiction immediately south of the bridge.

Sheriff's were in the area yesterday morning.

[Boston-Sean]

A million plus people per year pouring over our southern border have to live somewhere.

How many tents do you think could fit on that polo field?

[Altavia]

In the last 72ish hours multiple calls have been made by residents to the Sumter Co. Sheriff’s office and Wildwood

Have you received any updates on the situation?

[Byte1]

The Villages is 2A NRA Fandom territory. Folks in this very forum will be the first to tell you about all the firearms they own, how often they practice on the range, how they learned in the military and know their way around this and that firearm, and no one should ever dare cross them because they are legally carrying and not afraid to protect themselves. Surely no one in our community would have reason to fear some random homeless guy.

I realize that you are using sarcasm, being facetious but anyone that has a CCW permit or has REAL experience with firearms and owns them, knows that even in Florida you won't just fire a weapon at an unarmed person, even if they are exhibiting irrational behavior. To suggest such an idea is ridiculous or just ignorant of the subject. Decent gun owners take firing a weapon at a human very seriously and always think of the repercussions both legally and mentally. I would venture to suggest that most of us take gun ownership very seriously would always prefer to find other venues of legal action before taking such drastic action as discharging a firearm at another human.
The subject being discussed is the possible deterioration of our community by vagrants. I've already read of recent problems of squatters in vacant homes in the Villages. If it happens in one area of the Villages, it is not a far fetched assumption that it can't happen in your neighborhood. I agree with those that suggest that these homeless need to be ushered on their way, and anyone with mental issues should be forced into some form of structured treatment if they cannot cope and refuse to find more suitable areas to populate than where they are not wanted. Freedom is fine as long as that freedom does not cost others that do not wish to participate in the activities of what is being forced upon them. Being homeless is unfortunate, but should not be a permanent issue. There is so much help available for those in need that one should never have to remain homeless or hungry very long in this country. Remember the old saying that "excuses are like *****s, everyone has one." If they ask for a handout, then they are enslaving themselves to someone else. If they ask for a hand UP, then it should be willingly provided even if it is nothing more than giving them directions to those that do that for a living. Villagers are constantly organizing food drives for local food banks and soup kitchens. Villagers are not bad for wishing to enjoy the fruits of their years of labor here in the Villages without worrying about those that wish to ride free. Philosophy does not better the situation. Reality and action works, even if it is not pretty. If they are ordered to move on, then they need to move on. No exceptions. If they are asking for help, then they should also be willing to take directions of those that are willing to take time to assist them.

[retiredguy123]

A million plus people per year pouring over our southern border have to live somewhere.

How many tents do you think could fit on that polo field?
If the homeless move to The Villages in significant numbers, I will be moving out of The Villages.

[Marine1974]

How do you know liquor bottles and prescription bottles are left by homeless people?

[GizmoWhiskers]

Every day I have passed by, a team of pan handlers have been at the corner where Cracker Barrel is heading toward Ocala. I have watched as the people's (look like a faimily) shifts change and they get into their cars and drive away. This is their tax free job. Paying pan handlers just feeds into the scams. It is a problem and further promotes the industry. Sure the police are aware. I wonder to what level they would protect their claim on that corner.

[GizmoWhiskers]

Every day I have passed by, a team of pan handlers have been at the corner of St Rd 484 where Cracker Barrel is heading toward Ocala. I have watched as their shifts change and they get into their cars and drive away. This is their tax free job. Paying pan handlers just feeds into the scams. It is a problem and further promotes the industry. Pretty sure the police must be aware and are allowing it. I wonder to what level they would protect their claim on that corner should some other family move it??

[Caymus]

Every day I have passed by, a team of pan handlers have been at the corner where Cracker Barrel is heading toward Ocala. I have watched as the people's (look like a faimily) shifts change and they get into their cars and drive away. This is their tax free job. Paying pan handlers just feeds into the scams. It is a problem and further promotes the industry. Sure the police are aware. I wonder to what level they would protect their claim on that corner.

It is amusing to watch them at "shift" change. They also appear to have a "supervisor" that brings them items during their shift.

Soon they will demand a union.

[Dusty_Star]

How do you know liquor bottles and prescription bottles are left by homeless people?

Last evening’s observations included one of the individuals discarding empty liquor bottles as well as an empty Rx bottle in the streets

LivingOnSunshine saw them.

[Babubhat]

So where are pictures documenting the issue.? Everyone has a cell phone

[vintageogauge]

So where are pictures documenting the issue.? Everyone has a cell phone

Strange that you said that. I too carry a cell phone but never think to take photos of anything good or bad and I'm sure I'm not alone.

[ThirdOfFive]

Every day I have passed by, a team of pan handlers have been at the corner where Cracker Barrel is heading toward Ocala. I have watched as the people's (look like a faimily) shifts change and they get into their cars and drive away. This is their tax free job. Paying pan handlers just feeds into the scams. It is a problem and further promotes the industry. Sure the police are aware. I wonder to what level they would protect their claim on that corner.
Best panhandling scam I ever saw was in Thailand a few years back. My wife and I were visiting her family and were taking the Bangkok skytrain to meet some friends. At the station where we got off there was a young woman lying in the grass with a child, maybe a year old, next to her. She had a jar for donations. I don't speak Thai much but my wife is ethnic Thai so they struck up a conversation. Turned out the woman was from Isaan (northeastern Thailand). She had been injured in an accident some months back and could no longer walk. She was collecting money so that she and her child could go back to Isaan where her plan was to live with her parents and hopefully find some kind of work.

I gave her some money (200 baht?) and we wished her well. We met our friends at a restaurant and got back to the skytrain station about 2 hours later. When we did, the woman and child were gone. A skytrain security guard was nearby, so we asked about the woman and her child. He laughed. Apparently the woman is there every morning, being replaced for the afternoon by another woman and child. The women are usually the same but the children are different. The women can walk (even ride motorbikes) and there are places in Bangkok where people can actually rent babies to perpetrate this scam! Their "handler" picks up the woman and child at a set time and replaces them with another set. Skytrain stations are particularly preferred as sites because there are always a lot of (gullible) foreigners taking the train.

I was completely taken in. I didn't even feel resentment when I found out it was a scam. I had been in the presence of greatness! And 200 baht was a cheap price for the performance.

[manaboutown]

Irvine City Council Candidate Caught Dropping Off Mom To Panhandle - CBS Los Angeles (https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/news/panhandling-irvine-laguna-beach-city-council-candidate-mom/)

[pdearmond]

I can personally attest that there’s at least one. Saw an elderly gentleman pushing a shopping cart this morning along the MMP in Bradford while on my way to Lake Deaton Plaza.

Nothing can be done as the roads are public.

[Taltarzac725]

Every day I have passed by, a team of pan handlers have been at the corner of St Rd 484 where Cracker Barrel is heading toward Ocala. I have watched as their shifts change and they get into their cars and drive away. This is their tax free job. Paying pan handlers just feeds into the scams. It is a problem and further promotes the industry. Pretty sure the police must be aware and are allowing it. I wonder to what level they would protect their claim on that corner should some other family move it??


They were doing this across the Walmart on US 441/27 years ago in Summerfield but do not know if they are doing it now.

I saw one man taking a lunch break from panhandling and then someone took his place in the same spot while he had his meal.

[Djean1981]

Every day I have passed by, a team of pan handlers have been at the corner of St Rd 484 where Cracker Barrel is heading toward Ocala. I have watched as their shifts change and they get into their cars and drive away. This is their tax free job. Paying pan handlers just feeds into the scams. It is a problem and further promotes the industry. Pretty sure the police must be aware and are allowing it. I wonder to what level they would protect their claim on that corner should some other family move it??
I've seen this elsewhere. Sometimes thet are undocumented people, dropped off and picked up later - and they don't get to keep the money..

[Dusty_Star]

Irvine City Council Candidate Caught Dropping Off Mom To Panhandle - CBS Los Angeles (https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/news/panhandling-irvine-laguna-beach-city-council-candidate-mom/)

"Laguna Beach police say that nothing that Dave Chey and his mother are doing is illegal." Bring back vagrancy/panhandling laws.

[Caymus]

I've seen this elsewhere. Sometimes thet are undocumented people, dropped off and picked up later - and they don't get to keep the money..

undocumented?

[retiredguy123]

As I understand it, panhandling is legal with some rules and exceptions. And, I don't think there is a wealth test required to become a panhandler. But, apparently, some people think that the panhandlers may not be poor enough to be engaging in panhandling. Maybe they should demand an audited financial statement from the panhandler before giving them money.

[golfing eagles]

A million plus people per year pouring over our southern border have to live somewhere.

How many tents do you think could fit on that polo field?

Absolutely they do----and that place is MEXICO, or Guatemala, or Honduras, or Nicaragua, etc.
Here's a tongue in cheek solution: Hire the North Korean border patrol---I suspect illegal crossings will drop precipitously:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[golfing eagles]

undocumented?

translated into English------ILLEGAL

[retiredguy123]

translated into English------ILLEGAL
I think that many of the people currently crossing the border cannot be considered illegal or undocumented. They have applied for asylum, and have been instructed to attend a court hearing at a later date. Doesn't that make them legal and documented residents?

[ThirdOfFive]

I think that many of the people currently crossing the border cannot be considered illegal or undocumented. They have applied for asylum, and have been instructed to attend a court hearing at a later date. Doesn't that make them legal and documented residents?
Not an accurate representation.

You can legally request Asylum in America ONLY at international bridges or ports of entry, basing your request on the fact that your life or well-being is in jeopardy in your country of origin based on one of the following four reasons:

- race,
- religion,
- nationality,
- membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.

Once you legally apply for asylum at an international bridge or port of entry, you are then a DOCUMENTED alien. A document exists attesting to the fact that you have legally applied for asylum in America.

But just wanting a better-paying job, or reuniting with family, would not be a legitimate reason to request asylum. Because of that, the vast majority crossing our southern border do NOT cross at the legal points, but instead choose to do it illegally, most often with the paid help of people who know how to smuggle people across, assuming that they can just sort of blend in, with people of their own nationality/ethnicity. In all too many cases, they do.

But they are aliens who are here illegally. Hence "Illegal Aliens". That "undocumented" bee ess is just another weary example of "wokeness" trying to deny the truth.

[Stu from NYC]

Not an accurate representation.

You can legally request Asylum in America ONLY at international bridges or ports of entry, basing your request on the fact that your life or well-being is in jeopardy in your country of origin based on one of the following four reasons:

- race,
- religion,
- nationality,
- membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.

Once you legally apply for asylum at an international bridge or port of entry, you are then a DOCUMENTED alien. A document exists attesting to the fact that you have legally applied for asylum in America.

But just wanting a better-paying job, or reuniting with family, would not be a legitimate reason to request asylum. Because of that, the vast majority crossing our southern border do NOT cross at the legal points, but instead choose to do it illegally, most often with the paid help of people who know how to smuggle people across, assuming that they can just sort of blend in, with people of their own nationality/ethnicity. In all too many cases, they do.

But they are aliens who are here illegally. Hence "Illegal Aliens". That "undocumented" bee ess is just another weary example of "wokeness" trying to deny the truth.

Well said. Our ancestors came here legally and got very little help but with hard work succeeded in building a better life for themselves and children.

Sad that people come here illegally and are eligible for all kinds of handouts.

[RedBaron]

One feels the frustration of being shunned by several organizations operated by The Villages. How to get the attention of someone who cares is the challenge.

Suggestion: When this story becomes more widely known, it could affect sales. If as many people call their Villages sales reps as call the police, the word will soon get to someone in The Villages that can get something done. Call those reps and the word will travel "upward" pretty quickly.
Maybe call the Daily Sun? I wonder if they would be interested.

[JMintzer]

Some homeless near a bridge in the Southern part of the Villages hardly is dragging down society. They have been around since I moved here in 2005. Panhandlers that is and sometimes they are anything but homeless. Just some more confidence men and women who probably make good money. Others are not so lucky nor so dishonest and might be on the street for reasons of PTSD or some other illness.

Many, if not most of the panhandlers you see are not homeless...

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Why should I or anyone else be responsible for sending them anywhere?

Granted there are a few homeless who deserve help but the vast majority are homeless bums due to their own life choices to drink, drug and commit crimes for which I am not responsible. They are.

Here's how the conversation goes:
Cop: You'll have to leave now.
A back and forth conversation ensues. Eventually...
Homeless: Where should I go?
Cop: Somewhere other than here.

Homeless picks up his stuff and walks a few blocks away, and sets his stuff down again.

Rinse, repeat.

Until you have a place for them to GO, they will continue to go wherever it's convenient for them to go. And if that means your back yard, then that's where they'll go. When they're ordered to go somewhere else, they'll end up in someone else's back yard. And so on and so forth, til they're back in your back yard again. I use "back yard" metaphorically - meaning - your part of the Villages, the dumpster behind the nearest Winn Dixie, the woods under the nearest bridge, by the edge of the river, wherever you consider "your turf" to be.

[JMintzer]

The Villages is 2A NRA Fandom territory. Folks in this very forum will be the first to tell you about all the firearms they own, how often they practice on the range, how they learned in the military and know their way around this and that firearm, and no one should ever dare cross them because they are legally carrying and not afraid to protect themselves. Surely no one in our community would have reason to fear some random homeless guy.

If you think that someone saying that they are prepared to defend themself is the same as thinking they are looking for "some random homeless person", you haven't a clue as to the tenets of self defense...

[JMintzer]

Yeah. That's the ticket. Oh by the way...

when they leave, where do you figure they'll GO? Because - they have to go somewhere. There's no mass transit around here, they don't have homes to go to, no one's mentioned sending them to any shelters or even any shelters available to receive them. They have no transportation of their own (they'd be sleeping in it if they did), so they can't go any further than they can walk.

No idea how they ended up there in the first place, but it's kinda a good idea to have a plan, before you implement a response.

Shelters have been mentioned several times in this thread...

You must have missed it...

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Are you saying that, if they are breaking the law, the police shouldn't make them leave?

I don't know what words you're reading - but no, I'm not saying that. Maybe someone else is but there's nothing in my post indicating that I think the police shouldn't make them leave.

What I said - and I've said it a few times, and I'll say it again:

Where are they supposed to GO, when they're made to leave? Leave for where, exactly? They're homeless. They have no specific destination awaiting their arrival.

Have you ever tried to force wasps out of a nest under your eaves? They come back and build on some other part of your eaves. Or they'll build under your next door neighbor's eaves. Or they'll build across the street from your house. There will be wasps in your neighborhood, until/unless you kill them all.

If I'm not mistaken, killing a person for the offense of being homeless is against the law. Killing all the homeless people just because they've chosen to squat in YOUR neighborhood - is also against the law.

So you need to ask yourself - where will these homeless people GO, if you make them leave wherever they are now? How will they get there? And when they get there, where will they go when the people THERE tell the homeless they have to leave THERE?

[JMintzer]

Judgmental cat judges.

I'm glad there isn't a big "visible" homeless population near my neighborhood. I know there are homeless people in the area - like coffeebean said - I see them on the corner of the 441 Walmart driveway. Haven't ever seen any come down my street, or hanging out in anyone's back yard. I'm thankful for that.

However, I've known a good amount of folks when they were homeless, as I used to hang out with them when I was a musician living in Boston and playing guitar in Harvard Square storefronts and the subway. Many of them were Vietnam vets suffering from PTSD and unable to succeed in living alone, with a spouse, with kids, or with their own parents (this was in the 1980's - most of their parents were still alive). Some of them had physical disabilities, combined with opiate addiction they ended up with as a direct result of requiring painkillers for the recovery of their injuries. A guy who had one leg cut off became a morphine addict. That kind of thing. Then there are the folks who have homes, but for whatever reason, don't go to them.

Like my friend Skip, who had what was -at the time - called paranoid schizophrenia. It has another name these days but you all know what I mean. He had a full 4-year scholarship to Harvard and spoke a few languages fluently. He was absolutely brilliant. But he also would often forget to take the meds. He'd go wandering off for a couple of weeks, sometimes even a couple of months. He'd disappear in early September and show up with plastic bags on his bare feet during the first snow fall, ranting and raving about how the Secret Service sent him on a special mission to protect the Harvard Square Constable from the infiltrators. Once he thought I was a princess and he was sent by the Secret Service to protect me. It was kinda sweet. When he was "sick" he reeked, because he had no understanding of his own hygiene needs. After a few days for him to decompress, we'd get him back to his parents' house so they could help him back onto his meds. He was considered homeless, because he had no home of his own. He would stay with his parents but he was 40 years old and the legal system wouldn't declare him incompetent, because he was 100% normal when he was taking his meds.

The other homeless folks would all look after each other. AND they looked after the entire neighborhood. They were part of the community and - though they often smelled bad because they didn't have regular access to showers, they all had generous spirits. Even the "sick" ones, and even the addicts.

In an environment like Harvard Square, where there's a LOT of culture, a LOT of diversity, and a LOT of very close-knit community members in a college setting, you'll see more tolerance. They still don't want them sleeping in their back yards, or blocking traffic, or walking up to people to beg. And that is an absolutely valid opinion and I share it.

But you STILL need to have a place to send them TO, when you send them away. WHERE are you sending them? Saying "I don't care as long as it's not near me" doesn't count. Because - they are where they are NOW - because someone said exactly that.

Such a lovely story... And you tell it so well!

But I fail to see what your "busking" in the subways has to do with the discussion at hand...

[Dusty_Star]

Such a lovely story... And you tell it so well!

But I fail to see what your "busking" in the subways has to do with the discussion at hand...


:bigbow:

[manaboutown]

Here's how the conversation goes:
Cop: You'll have to leave now.
A back and forth conversation ensues. Eventually...
Homeless: Where should I go?
Cop: Somewhere other than here.

Homeless picks up his stuff and walks a few blocks away, and sets his stuff down again.

Rinse, repeat.

Until you have a place for them to GO, they will continue to go wherever it's convenient for them to go. And if that means your back yard, then that's where they'll go. When they're ordered to go somewhere else, they'll end up in someone else's back yard. And so on and so forth, til they're back in your back yard again. I use "back yard" metaphorically - meaning - your part of the Villages, the dumpster behind the nearest Winn Dixie, the woods under the nearest bridge, by the edge of the river, wherever you consider "your turf" to be.

The problem is as it now stands they are allowed to leech off society with impunity. For years I have had problems with them hanging around a couple of my businesses in another state - now literally a couple hundred of them camp nearby my business. It feels like a plague of locusts has landed there. They have ruined the neighborhood and negatively impacted my business. The useless powers that be have been ineffective. Homeless druggies have taken over parks so decent folk cannot enjoy them. Parents have to comb ball game venues for needles so their kids can play little league or whatever. It now almost feels like I am in a third world country when I go there.

More homeless encampments pop up after Coronado Park closure (https://www.krqe.com/news/albuquerque-metro/more-homeless-encampments-pop-up-after-coronado-park-closure/)

New Mexico Little League park plagued by hypodermic needles (https://www.sltrib.com/news/nation-world/2019/05/20/new-mexico-little-league/)

A block from my business: Police find makeshift meth lab in a shopping cart – KRQE NEWS 13 – Breaking News, Albuquerque News, New Mexico News, Weather, and Videos (https://www.krqe.com/video/police-find-makeshift-meth-lab-in-a-shopping-cart/7619021/)

Do we want them here? I don't!

[manaboutown]

And homeless are blighting some very expensive areas with impunity.

Homeless population grows at Newport Beach bus station - Los Angeles Times (https://www.latimes.com/socal/daily-pilot/news/tn-dpt-me-newport-beach-homeless-tents-20190711-story.html)

[retiredguy123]

I don't know what words you're reading - but no, I'm not saying that. Maybe someone else is but there's nothing in my post indicating that I think the police shouldn't make them leave.

What I said - and I've said it a few times, and I'll say it again:

Where are they supposed to GO, when they're made to leave? Leave for where, exactly? They're homeless. They have no specific destination awaiting their arrival.

Have you ever tried to force wasps out of a nest under your eaves? They come back and build on some other part of your eaves. Or they'll build under your next door neighbor's eaves. Or they'll build across the street from your house. There will be wasps in your neighborhood, until/unless you kill them all.

If I'm not mistaken, killing a person for the offense of being homeless is against the law. Killing all the homeless people just because they've chosen to squat in YOUR neighborhood - is also against the law.

So you need to ask yourself - where will these homeless people GO, if you make them leave wherever they are now? How will they get there? And when they get there, where will they go when the people THERE tell the homeless they have to leave THERE?
I hate to be blunt, but I don't care where they go. I want the police to enforce the law and make them leave. If they don't, I will move somewhere else. I can live anywhere, but I won't live in an area where there are homeless people hanging around creating an uncomfortable situation.

[rpalumberi]

I can personally attest that there’s at least one. Saw an elderly gentleman pushing a shopping cart this morning along the MMP in Bradford while on my way to Lake Deaton Plaza.

I think I may have seen the same man, african american, pushing a shopping cart filled with some of his belongings.

Not something I want to see here or anywhere.

[PugMom]

in case you didn't know, there is an area on 301 past Coleman & Bushnell. this community is VERY, VERY poor, & i imagine, desperate. the new churches in our area help everyone, so is it possible these transient non-village folk are on their way to visit a church or outreach center? if so, do we then tell churches they must restrict their congregations, or accept only approved villagers as members? tough question to consider.

[vitacr]

Write a "Letter to the Editor" on the Daily Sun - They do NOT like negativity - it might stir up some corrective activity.

[manaboutown]

in case you didn't know, there is an area on 301 past Coleman & Bushnell. this community is VERY, VERY poor, & i imagine, desperate. the new churches in our area help everyone, so is it possible these transient non-village folk are on their way to visit a church or outreach center? if so, do we then tell churches they must restrict their congregations, or accept only approved villagers as members? tough question to consider.

Well, I can't speak for churches but several years ago the state of NM built a welfare office a couple blocks down the street from my business. Of course I had to pay for a two block long sidewalk so the deadbeats could walk past my business on their way from the bus stop to the welfare office. The day the welfare office opened the problems started. Now druggie, alcoholic, criminal worthless bums are crawling all over the neighborhood. If one parks in the neighborhood Walmart lot across the street from my business one gets aggressively panhandled by a plethora of bums while going from their vehicle into the store and back. Off duty police are stationed in the lot to walk vulnerable people to and from their cars but purses still get snatched and worse.

[coffeebean]

Gather them up and have them congregate near Villages open houses. I bet that would motivate the developer to do something!

GREAT suggestion.

[coffeebean]

There are plenty of homeless people living in the norther villages. Just recently a group was removed form a village home that is in foreclosure, they have camps off of Rolling Acres Road and I have also seen them camped along the road east of 301 across from where the new Dairy Queen was built. They usually stay on the fringes to avoid being hassled but are getting a little more brazen going into vacant homes or sleeping on lanais. There will be more now as cold weather sends them south.

Oh my. I had driven countless times on Rolling Acres Road and have never seen any sign of a homeless camp.

[JMintzer]

GREAT suggestion.

You want the developer to become an arm of law enforcement?

[coffeebean]

I hate to be blunt, but I don't care where they go. I want the police to enforce the law and make them leave. If they don't, I will move somewhere else. I can live anywhere, but I won't live in an area where there are homeless people hanging around creating an uncomfortable situation.

I'm with you. I don't give a ****** where they go. Just not here in The Villages. Get them out of there!!!!!!

[coffeebean]

You want the developer to become an arm of law enforcement?

No but they need to do what ever it takes for the proper enforcement to be done. The developer knows people in high places. They can get it done if they want to.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

The problem is as it now stands they are allowed to leech off society with impunity. For years I have had problems with them hanging around a couple of my businesses in another state - now literally a couple hundred of them camp nearby my business. It feels like a plague of locusts has landed there. They have ruined the neighborhood and negatively impacted my business. The useless powers that be have been ineffective. Homeless druggies have taken over parks so decent folk cannot enjoy them. Parents have to comb ball game venues for needles so their kids can play little league or whatever. It now almost feels like I am in a third world country when I go there.

More homeless encampments pop up after Coronado Park closure (https://www.krqe.com/news/albuquerque-metro/more-homeless-encampments-pop-up-after-coronado-park-closure/)

New Mexico Little League park plagued by hypodermic needles (https://www.sltrib.com/news/nation-world/2019/05/20/new-mexico-little-league/)

A block from my business: Police find makeshift meth lab in a shopping cart – KRQE NEWS 13 – Breaking News, Albuquerque News, New Mexico News, Weather, and Videos (https://www.krqe.com/video/police-find-makeshift-meth-lab-in-a-shopping-cart/7619021/)

Do we want them here? I don't!

I don't either. But you haven't proposed an answer to the one and only question I'm asking. Seems many of you agree with me - we don't want homeless people in our neighborhoods. That's great!! We agree! Amazing.

Now for the question - again.

When the police kick them out, where will they GO? On foot - without money to pay for bus fair or an uber.

Come up with a solution. Everyone already knows the problem.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I hate to be blunt, but I don't care where they go. I want the police to enforce the law and make them leave. If they don't, I will move somewhere else. I can live anywhere, but I won't live in an area where there are homeless people hanging around creating an uncomfortable situation.

If you don't care where they go, then I'll suggest to them that there's a lovely lanai they can sleep on, at your house.

What's that? You don't want them at your house? Okay - the next door neighbor. Or across the street. Or at the other end of your neighborhood. Or behind your rec center. As long as it's not "wherever they are at the moment" you don't care. So I'll not care either. As long as YOU don't live in MY neighborhood, the homeless can go ahead and live in YOUR neighborhood. There. Problem solved.

They have to go somewhere, and they don't have cars.

[Rainger99]

Until you have a place for them to GO, they will continue to go wherever it's convenient for them to go.

Looks like they could go to NYC.

I was watching the news this morning and saw the shelter that New York City is building for illegal immigrants. Looked pretty nice - three meals a day, a fancy popcorn machine, big screen tvs, free telephones, and the city gives them “Fluff & Fold” laundry service. I would think once word gets out that illegals can get these benefits, we may get a lot of people coming across the southern border.

[ScottGo]

Pinellas county sheriffs would drive them to Pasco county and let them know they were not welcome. Back in 2013.

[Rainger99]

The problem is that we have shelters for the homeless but many of them don’t want to go the shelters. And apparently, the government can’t force them to go to shelters because the homeless have rights.

If we had hungry people and they refused to go to food banks, what else can society do to feed them?

So I don’t know how to solve the problem. Maybe someone here has an idea.

[manaboutown]

I don't either. But you haven't proposed an answer to the one and only question I'm asking. Seems many of you agree with me - we don't want homeless people in our neighborhoods. That's great!! We agree! Amazing.

Now for the question - again.

When the police kick them out, where will they GO? On foot - without money to pay for bus fair or an uber.

Come up with a solution. Everyone already knows the problem.

answer: away.

[LAFwUs]

1st, the powers that be here, must realize this is a massively growing problem, not just here, but literally everywhere.
"The bubble" is not and will not be immune.
I can, (as others here probably can as well) tell you from my 1st hand experience living near Seattle and as a former LEO, just how badly this problem can explode when decisive, corrective & preventative action is not taken. The passive approach will not work. It never has.

This apparent lack of a preemptive plan &/or preventative action, leaves us - as a community - very ill prepared. This is not good.

I can say this much, (again):
There is clearly a breech/means of access on the far south end of the villages.
The perimeter fence that borders the turnpike and the many sections of golf courses in this area, is a complete joke and stops no one.
I am personally seeing too many transient types on foot, directly coming from that area - for it to just be random.
If they set root here, and word gets out among them (& it will) their numbers will grow substantially, so will random crime, a reduce feeling of safety and a whole host of other related unpleasantries.
It will take much more effort to correct it then...
This needs to get nipped in the bud ASAP.

[Bay Kid]

Looks like they could go to NYC.

I was watching the news this morning and saw the shelter that New York City is building for illegal immigrants. Looked pretty nice - three meals a day, a fancy popcorn machine, big screen tvs, free telephones, and the city gives them “Fluff & Fold” laundry service. I would think once word gets out that illegals can get these benefits, we may get a lot of people coming across the southern border.

It is a shame. Illegals treated better than our veterans. No wonder the illegals want to come here. Free stuff, paid for by working taxpayers.

[ThirdOfFive]

I hate to be blunt, but I don't care where they go. I want the police to enforce the law and make them leave. If they don't, I will move somewhere else. I can live anywhere, but I won't live in an area where there are homeless people hanging around creating an uncomfortable situation.
Absolutely!!!

The worst possible scenario would be that TV becomes known as a haven for homeless people. And word DOES get around. This, quoted from the KGW website:

“The services that they're offering here as opposed to other places are a lot better. There's probably a lot better food,” said Portlander Chris Blair. “People realizing this, see that this is an easy place to exist and they just flock here.”

Does anyone really want TV to be known the same way as Portland? I sure don't. And don't kid yourself--word is probably already out. We have everything: great weather, people who do give to panhandlers, a degree of sympathy for the plight of homeless people, etc.

Due to bleedingheart policies and "advocates" who are long on idealism but usually very short on knowledge of the subject, Parts of America resemble third-world countries. And more and more so all the time. Action needs to be taken NOW, while the problem here is still relatively small. The more it grows, the harder it will be to fix.

Just ask the people of Portland.

[ThirdOfFive]

Write a "Letter to the Editor" on the Daily Sun - They do NOT like negativity - it might stir up some corrective activity.
If said letter contains ANYTHING negative that might make readers decide not to move to TV, rest assured they won't print it.

[LAFwUs]

I don't think we want anything printed in any paper.
While that sounds like a great idea at first, its not.
That would be like advertising it. Homeless read newspapers & periodicals too. Some may see that as a challenge. Word maybe already out on the street. I think it is.

I also suspect that some may have been here already, and now as the villages are spreading out, particularly in the south end, new construction & expansion may well be flushing them up & out or otherwise displacing them from existing spots, which sends them on the hunt for new spots close by.

IMHO - this needs aggressive action by both CDD & resident's - starting yesterday (they are already coming in obviously) and a definitive plan of prevention going forward. Let the word get out that its not tolerated here - without exception and decisive legal action will be taken against any that try.
That's how you stop it. It requires real action & constant vigilance going forward, however uncomfortable that maybe for some who think we can hand them a sack lunch & a toothbrush and hope they stay in a shelter.
A strongly worded no trespassing sign, will not get this done!

[billethkid]

The tools are already in place.....simply enforce the laws currently in existence and cease all discussions about whose feelings might be hurt or organization that might not like it.

We are becoming a weaker/less safe society due to lack of enforcement or selective enforcement.

___________________________________________

:censored:

[golfing eagles]

The tools are already in place.....simply enforce the laws currently in existence and cease all discussions about whose feelings might be hurt or organization that might not like it.

We are becoming a weaker/less safe society due to lack of enforcement or selective enforcement.

___________________________________________

:censored:

And I would do it quickly before the do-gooders, the social crusaders, and other assorted agenda driven weenies show up

[ElDiabloJoe]

Bingo!

In Minnesota (with similar occurrences in most other states) the push began in the early 70's with a court case, Welsch v. Noot; Patty Welsch being a young disabled woman and Noot being the Minnesota Commissioner of Public Welfare. The gist of the case was that A) persons with mental and physical handicaps deserved to receive habilitative services; and B) that such people deserved to live in the least restrictive setting possible for their needs. Hard to argue with that, but as the years went by and people were moved from the large institutions ("State hospitals" in Minnesota; "Colonies" in neighboring Wisconsin) those large edifices, many approaching a century old, no longer had any use and were gradually consolidated and closed. The irony was that persons over 18 who were NOT under State or private guardianship or in the custody of corrections had the right to live where they pleased. Also, it was recognized somewhat vaguely that such people had the right to be mentally ill and as such, if they chose NOT to take their meds, it was completely up to them.

The result was inevitable. When it was recognized that some of these people could NOT be helped other than in an institution, the institutions either no longer existed or had been transformed into prisons. In Minnesota, particularly in the Minneapolis - St. Paul metro and first-ring suburbs, dozens of homeless encampments sprouted, mainly in the public parks but one in particular that caught everyone's eye was one on a hillside close to the St. Paul Cathedral. I saw it last about two years ago. It was huge; tents, chairs, people lying on the grass, people urinating (and assumedly defecating) in the open, etc. The Minnesota-based Wilder Foundation, back in 2018, stated that "An estimated 19,600 Minnesotans experienced homelessness on any given night in 2018. 50,600 people experienced homelessness over the course of the year." That was four years ago, and as I understand it, for a variety of reasons, the estimates are far beyond that today. Remember--this is Minnesota, where living outdoors might easily mean snow for six months of the year and temperatures on the coldest nights reaching -30 f. or even lower.

The impact on the communities has been far from just financial. Before our retirement my wife worked in downtown Minneapolis, riding the bus there from a suburban park-and-ride, and what she saw sometimes were beyond shocking. The homeless would come into the city from the parks and basically take over the bus stops particularly in the winter. My wife witnessed people doing their business completely in the open. There've been numerous instances of public masturbation and people having sex, again in the open. Panhandlers have gone from asking for money with a sad song-and-dance spiel to actively and aggressively demanding money from passers-by. There've been assaults, by homeless against one another and against passers-by. Drug use is rampant. Inner-city Minneapolis is going from a bustling city to, more and more, a deserted place as people who work there either find other jobs or take advantage of working from home. I know less about the situation in St. Paul, but last I heard things are pretty much paralleling Minneapolis over there. One particularly noisome and obnoxious practice over there is the homeless using the skywalks as toilets as well as sheltering in them at night. Though I cannot remember the particulars I recall an action over there that opposed closing the skywalks at the end of the business day because the homeless would be inconvenienced.

Yes. Our short-sighted policies created this monster (or actually "monsters" because most large cities probably have similar stories to tell). And yes. I have sympathy for these people. But how it is being handled, in all too many cases with kid gloves, is NOT working. If there is a growing homeless problem here in TV, then I will make it a point to crusade for the authorities to clean it up posthaste. I have seen firsthand what it can mushroom into. And I don't want to be anywhere near it.

^ Outstanding post!

I've dealt with homeless professionally many times. The vast majority are "homeless" because they do not wish to live by anyone else's rules or requirements. They are also very demanding - you offer them a dollar and they demand $5. You offer them food and they demand money. The vast majority of money people give panhandlers goes to alcohol and/or drugs.

A quick rule to live by: If you don't want pigeons around, don't feed them. That means no coins or dollars to panhandlers.

[ElDiabloJoe]

On it’s face this sounds like a good and caring solution. But it’s not that simple when dealing with the homeless. I’m not taking about the person who suddenly finds themselves living in their car because of an economic downturn, or the person who has fled a bad home situation and finds themselves with nowhere to go. That’s a whole different subject and helping that person find temporary housing would be absolutely the right thing to help them turn their situation around. But the long term homeless are a whole different matter.

How do I know this? I have an alcoholic brother who has lived on the streets, by choice, for 15 years. I’ve had plenty of dealing over the years with him and his homeless friends. Everyone in the family has tried to help him, time and time again, but one by one we all had to give up at a point when it started to have toxic effects on our own lives and families .

My brother has been in and out of shelters so many times but never stays because they come with some expectations of acceptable behavior or even, god forbid, rules which he refuses to adhere to. Such as, most churches won’t tolerate you sitting on your bunk drinking yourself into oblivion, or being aggressive, or using constant foul language, or……fill in the blanks.

These folks usually have either substance abuse issues, mental problems, or both. Just finding them a place to sleep isn’t the answer, and honestly, as much as we’d like to believe differently, the vast majority of them have no desire to change their lifestyle. As hard as it is for those of us who live a normal life within society to understand, there is a freedom and a lack of expectations that comes with their life that they don’t want to relinquish in order to get “help.”

He has been in and out of rehab probably a dozen times over the years. Rarely makes it past a few days. And he has been banned from some shelters. He knows where to get a free meal if he needs it, and prefers to sleep in a tent wherever he can. He has been camping in someone’s back yard (with permission) for a couple of years now. If that should end he “knows” all the spots he can go where he is unlikely to be bothered by the law. What would be unfortunate would be for our local homeless population to start to realize that our neighborhoods are one of those places.

Are they all dangerous? I don’t know. I don’t personally believe my brother would intentionally hurt anyone. Although I do think that he might perceive a threat in a drunken state and respond in an unpredictable manner. Do I think he would steal from you if given an opportunity? You betcha. They even steal from each other. Their justification, survival.

Wow! Your extensive first-hand experience mirrors my observations to a tee. I would like to add two things:

1. Wherever the homeless are "living," like someone's backyard or snowbird lanai, keep in mind they will not go far to go to the bathroom, preferably no more than 50 steps. Expect them to be ****ing and crapping in your sideyard. They also generate a phenomenal amount of garbage and trash - fast food wrappers, "salvaged finds" (stolen junk), etc. that they will never clean up. The flies, other insects, and vermin (mice and rats) will arrive shortly thereafter;

2. For those who believe the Sheriff will come and haul away trespassers or those that drink in public or steal shopping carts, etc. You are living in a dream land.

There is hardly enough jail space for people that commit violent crimes, much less crimes of life quality. They will get a ticket, if that, until they no show on enough of them that a warrant is issued. Then one day in court wipes all of them away, and the cycle repeats. You are kidding yourselves if you think the police will use ANY kind of force (even hands-on, guiding motions) to enforce these non-violent minor misdemeanors. Not from lack of willingness, but from lack of bureaucratic resolve. A simple push opens up a force investigation, and a supervisorial packet prepared - a lengthy and unpopular pastime. That packet often goes to the local District Attorney's office for review and possible criminal charges.

The end result will come all the way back to the Deputy or Officer with the question: Why was force utilized for such a minor crime? Unjustified. That will put them at risk of discipline at the lightest, all the way up to a civil lawsuit and being fired (putting income and family/housing/etc) at personal risk.

[ElDiabloJoe]

A few years ago I was acquainted with a woman in her 60s who was a librarian in Laguna Beach, CA. The verbal abuse and threatening gestures from homeless bums she was forced to endure daily were awful. Apparently the police could not or would not patrol the library or intervene as the bums had their"rights" although she apparently had none. She was close to retirement so could not just quit.

Public libraries in many cities have become for their legitimate users distasteful at best and dangerous at worst as alcoholic, druggie, filthy, stinking criminal homeless bums are allowed to spend their days lounging around on the couches sleeping it off inside. I would not dare enter the bathrooms of a public library in many communities today. When I was a child my mother took me at least weekly to the town's public library. I always felt safe there and never saw a vagrant (as they were called in those days) hanging around. How did it come to this?

I have been to that library, several times. It's on Glenneyre. I used to park in the adjacent two-story structure for my training runs up to "Top of the World." I would jump into the library pre-run to use their bathroom.

I have seen first-hand that which your librarian friend complained about.

[golfing eagles]

Wow! Your extensive first-hand experience mirrors my observations to a tee. I would like to add two things:

1. Wherever the homeless are "living," like someone's backyard or snowbird lanai, keep in mind they will not go far to go to the bathroom, preferably no more than 50 steps. Expect them to be ****ing and crapping in your sideyard. They also generate a phenomenal amount of garbage and trash - fast food wrappers, "salvaged finds" (stolen junk), etc. that they will never clean up. The flies, other insects, and vermin (mice and rats) will arrive shortly thereafter;

2. For those who believe the Sheriff will come and haul away trespassers or those that drink in public or steal shopping carts, etc. You are living in a dream land.

There is hardly enough jail space for people that commit violent crimes, much less crimes of life quality. They will get a ticket, if that, until they no show on enough of them that a warrant is issued. Then one day in court wipes all of them away, and the cycle repeats. You are kidding yourselves if you think the police will use ANY kind of force (even hands-on, guiding motions) to enforce these non-violent minor misdemeanors. Not from lack of willingness, but from lack of bureaucratic resolve. A simple push opens up a force investigation, and a supervisorial packet prepared - a lengthy and unpopular pastime. That packet often goes to the local District Attorney's office for review and possible criminal charges.

The end result will come all the way back to the Deputy or Officer with the question: Why was force utilized for such a minor crime? Unjustified. That will put them at risk of discipline at the lightest, all the way up to a civil lawsuit and being fired (putting income and family/housing/etc) at personal risk.

I realize you have extensive experience in these matters and I have none, but.....

I would think if there was a no trespassing restriction or even a court ordered restraining order (which "the developer" probably has enough clout to obtain), then the Sheriff would have an obligation and duty to enforce the law. That should go for stolen grocery carts and drinking in public as well.

As far a jail space, personally, I wouldn't bother. Just set up a WWII POW camp with barracks, triple razor wire fencing and machine gun towers, all surrounded by landmines. Then the homeless would have shelter, security, and could grow their own food. I'd even have an on-site trade school so they could learn to make a living on their own, as well as psychiatric treatment for those that need it. Those that won't co-operate can spend some time in "the cooler", ala Steve Mcqueen. And the bleeding hearts can go join them if they wish

[ElDiabloJoe]

Are you saying that, if they are breaking the law, the police shouldn't make them leave?

How? By force? Is the physical application of force by government agents warranted for a low-level non-violent crime? Do you think the officers don't realize the personal criminal and civil liability that the application of such force in these or similar circumstances would be? Not to mention the vilification in the media and by protest groups outside their homes.

Easy to say "Make the police make them do it or leave" because it seems that easy on television. Much more complex in the real world.

Law enforcement: The only job everyone in the world thinks they know how to do better than those that actually do it.

[golfing eagles]

How? By force? Is the physical application of force by government agents warranted for a low-level non-violent crime? Do you think the officers don't realize the personal criminal and civil liability that the application of such force in these or similar circumstances would be? Not to mention the vilification in the media and by protest groups outside their homes.

Easy to say "Make the police make them do it or leave" because it seems that easy on television. Much more complex in the real world.

Law enforcement: The only job everyone in the world thinks they know how to do better than those that actually do it.

IMHO, yes. I don't really consider invading a home (vacant), urinating and defecating there, leaving trash all around, attracting insects or maybe even Yogi Bear a "low level" crime. Jay walking is a low level crime. Parking illegally is a low level crime. Spitting on the sidewalk is a low level crime. What these people are doing is not low level to my mind.

[ElDiabloJoe]

Here's how the conversation goes:
Cop: You'll have to leave now.
A back and forth conversation ensues. Eventually...
Homeless: Where should I go?
Cop: Somewhere other than here.

Homeless picks up his stuff and walks a few blocks away, and sets his stuff down again.

Rinse, repeat.

Until you have a place for them to GO, they will continue to go wherever it's convenient for them to go. And if that means your back yard, then that's where they'll go. When they're ordered to go somewhere else, they'll end up in someone else's back yard. And so on and so forth, til they're back in your back yard again. I use "back yard" metaphorically - meaning - your part of the Villages, the dumpster behind the nearest Winn Dixie, the woods under the nearest bridge, by the edge of the river, wherever you consider "your turf" to be.

Exactly this. I used to have a regular I encountered, now deceased. Michael Armstrong. I actually liked the guy, even though he was a drunken homeless problem-causer. When called to deal with him, I always asked Mike, "Mike, what's the golden rule?" Mike would reply, "Out of sight - out of mind." Essentially, go somewhere where people won't call the police on you. Alleys, behind the library, behind grocery stores, wooded areas like freeway rights of way, etc.

There was little else I could do to help him, he had either abused and been refused social and religious services, or refused to utilize them.

[ThirdOfFive]

How? By force? Is the physical application of force by government agents warranted for a low-level non-violent crime? Do you think the officers don't realize the personal criminal and civil liability that the application of such force in these or similar circumstances would be? Not to mention the vilification in the media and by protest groups outside their homes.

Easy to say "Make the police make them do it or leave" because it seems that easy on television. Much more complex in the real world.

Law enforcement: The only job everyone in the world thinks they know how to do better than those that actually do it.
Heh. The inevitable and inescapable result of the machinations of numerous "agenda driven weenies" as another poster put it.

[retiredguy123]

How? By force? Is the physical application of force by government agents warranted for a low-level non-violent crime? Do you think the officers don't realize the personal criminal and civil liability that the application of such force in these or similar circumstances would be? Not to mention the vilification in the media and by protest groups outside their homes.

Easy to say "Make the police make them do it or leave" because it seems that easy on television. Much more complex in the real world.

Law enforcement: The only job everyone in the world thinks they know how to do better than those that actually do it.
Yes, by force.

That is why they call it law enFORCEment.

[ElDiabloJoe]

IMHO, yes. I don't really consider invading a home (vacant), urinating and defecating there, leaving trash all around, attracting insects or maybe even Yogi Bear a "low level" crime. Jay walking is a low level crime. Parking illegally is a low level crime. Spitting on the sidewalk is a low level crime. What these people are doing is not low level to my mind.

I agree, these are all crimes. They are the Broken Windows" of which James Q. Wilson wrote about in the criminology theory of the same name. However, society does consider them all to be "low level" because they are misdemeanors, which are inherently low level. Jay walking, illegal parking, spitting on a sidewalk are, as you rightfully pointed out, "Very" low level crimes, and are usually infractions in most jurisdictions, which is a crime level below misdemeanor.

However, misdemeanors are generally considered "Low level" crimes, and non-violent ones at that, which make them low level even for misdemeanors.

If I had it my way, they would all be jailable and finable offenses, however the current societal state of reality and "agenda driven weenies" (I really like that!) is quite different from the utopia I have heard envisioned by some (see my new thread on that separate topic).

[Boston-Sean]

I have been to that library, several times. It's on Glenneyre. I used to park in the adjacent two-story structure for my training runs up to "Top of the World." I would jump into the library pre-run to use their bathroom.

I have seen first-hand that which your librarian friend complained about.

The public single bathrooms in Mass General Hospital have cords hanging that can be pulled to summon help if someone needs it. Pre-covid when anyone could enter and wander around hospitals, MGH had problems with drug addicts using those bathrooms to shoot up. They would wrap the cord around one arm and shoot up in the other. If they happened to overdose and pass out the cord would get pulled and help would be on the way.

And BTW, if you want to see an excellent documentary on what happens when homelessness and drug addiction are ignored watch this from a Seattle news station:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpAi70WWBlw

All that "compassion" ends up killing people.

[golfing eagles]

You realize, of course, that these people aren not necessarily "illegals", they may be legally eligible for asylum. And fyi, New York City is unique in that it has a law that anyone who does not have a roof over their head can get one through the city-run homeless shelter system. That even applies to the newly arrived asylum seekers. NYC prides itself on a welcoming atmosphere and humanitarian treatment of these newly arrived people, rather than pulling a stunt like you know who, and flying them to Martha's Vineyard.

No comment.
Although I believe I already cited an appropriate term

[Caymus]

You realize, of course, that these people aren not necessarily "illegals", they may be legally eligible for asylum. And fyi, New York City is unique in that it has a law that anyone who does not have a roof over their head can get one through the city-run homeless shelter system. That even applies to the newly arrived asylum seekers. NYC prides itself on a welcoming atmosphere and humanitarian treatment of these newly arrived people, rather than pulling a stunt like you know who, and flying them to Martha's Vineyard.


Plenty more at the border. NYC should send their own buses to pick them up. It may reverse the population decline in the city.

[jdulej]

The public single bathrooms in Mass General Hospital have cords hanging that can be pulled to summon help if someone needs it. Pre-covid when anyone could enter and wander around hospitals, MGH had problems with drug addicts using those bathrooms to shoot up. They would wrap the cord around one arm and shoot up in the other. If they happened to overdose and pass out the cord would get pulled and help would be on the way.

And BTW, if you want to see an excellent documentary on what happens when homelessness and drug addiction are ignored watch this from a Seattle news station:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpAi70WWBlw

All that "compassion" ends up killing people.

A very creative use for those cords. Someone was thinking outside the box stoned or not

[LAFwUs]

UPDATE:
I spoke directly with both Community Watch and the Sheriff's dept today regarding this issue and about what I believe is happening on the south end of the villages. Under the premise that "You're either part of the problem or part of the solution."
I realize that there are other areas possibly being impacted, but I can only speak to the areas where I have observed a problem.

The Sheriff's dept is on it, including sending deputies out this afternoon, to try and locate any possible encampments and has added patrols inside the villages. I was reassured that this on their radar and is being dealt with properly as concerns come up.
Wildwood PD is also aware of this issue, but did not speak with them today.
I feel very good about our conversation and it was great to see such fast response!!

Community Watch also responded to me in excellent fashion. I am very appreciative of the time & effort they extended on this issue today.
They have recommended that should anyone see transient/homeless inside the villages, to contact the 24/7 Non-LE number
( 352-793-2621)
The villages as we know, spans multiple counties & several police jurisdictions. CW would be best to determine what agency should be contacted, if that is needed.
LaF

[jdulej]

The problem is that we have shelters for the homeless but many of them don’t want to go the shelters. And apparently, the government can’t force them to go to shelters because the homeless have rights.

If we had hungry people and they refused to go to food banks, what else can society do to feed them?

So I don’t know how to solve the problem. Maybe someone here has an idea.

There are solutions but they all involve lots and lots of money which would likely mean more and higher taxes. Thats ok with me as long as the solution is well-thought-out. First would be defining buckets to put each person/family in (like mentally ill, prior arrest record, etc). Define and implement a solution for each bucket and provide incentives to reward progress.
Not easy and certainly not cheap but just pushing these people to the next city/county/state does nothing to address the issue

[golfing eagles]

UPDATE:
I spoke directly with both Community Watch and the Sheriff's dept today regarding this issue and about what I believe is happening on the south end of the villages. Under the premise that "You're either part of the problem or part of the solution."
I realize that there are other areas possibly being impacted, but I can only speak to the areas where I have observed a problem.

The Sheriff's dept is on it, including sending deputies out this afternoon, to try and locate any possible encampments and has added patrols inside the villages. I was reassured that this on their radar and is being dealt with properly as concerns come up.
I feel very good about our conversation and it was great to see such fast response!!

Community Watch also responded to me in excellent fashion. I am very appreciative of the time & effort they extended on this issue today.
They have recommended that should anyone see transient/homeless inside the villages, to contact the 24/7 Non-LE number
( 352-793-2621)
The villages as we know, spans multiple counties & several police jurisdictions. CW would be best to determine what agency should be contacted, if that is needed.
LaF

Thank you for going out and getting some real info while the rest of us debated it. Kudos!!!!

[golfing eagles]

There are solutions but they all involve lots and lots of money which would likely mean more and higher taxes. Thats ok with me as long as the solution is well-thought-out. First would be defining buckets to put each person/family in (like mentally ill, prior arrest record, etc). Define and implement a solution for each bucket and provide incentives to reward progress.
Not easy and certainly not cheap but just pushing these people to the next city/county/state does nothing to address the issue

Maybe not, but I'd take that for now, then tackle the longer-term problem (from elsewhere)

[jimbomaybe]

There are solutions but they all involve lots and lots of money which would likely mean more and higher taxes. Thats ok with me as long as the solution is well-thought-out. First would be defining buckets to put each person/family in (like mentally ill, prior arrest record, etc). Define and implement a solution for each bucket and provide incentives to reward progress.
Not easy and certainly not cheap but just pushing these people to the next city/county/state does nothing to address the issue

From the posts here it would seem the people with the most experience and contact with the "homeless" see little hope in changing them, their mental problems/personality disorders are not reachable, "incentives" ? to my mind not living as they do is all the incentive one would need to do something other, what sort of incentives would you offer for simply taking care of yourself to the extent of not living a feral life ?

[manaboutown]

A friend since college is an engineer who worked for a large corporation his whole career. His grandfather had been a policemen in NYC back in the day, my friend had an interest in police work and so he became a reserve police officer and stuck by it for over 35 years. I guess he did not need much sleep! He wrote a book on policing and the criminal justice system in his community. Anyway, I asked him about the homeless he had encountered. He told me they had chosen the lifestyle, told him they enjoyed sleeping under the stars and did not want to be reformed or change their ways.

ABQ Crime Blues (https://abqcrimeblues.com)

[Caymus]

There are solutions but they all involve lots and lots of money which would likely mean more and higher taxes. Thats ok with me as long as the solution is well-thought-out. First would be defining buckets to put each person/family in (like mentally ill, prior arrest record, etc). Define and implement a solution for each bucket and provide incentives to reward progress.
Not easy and certainly not cheap but just pushing these people to the next city/county/state does nothing to address the issue

Are you one of the people who left a high tax state for a low tax state?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Maybe not, but I'd take that for now, then tackle the longer-term problem (from elsewhere)

That's probably how they ended up where they are now. Settling for pushing them out of wherever they are now, and not trying to tackle the actual problem, is like putting your finger in the hole in the dyke.

There comes a point in time where the people with the loudest complaints need to actually SOLVE the problem - or stop complaining.

[jimbomaybe]

That's probably how they ended up where they are now. Settling for pushing them out of wherever they are now, and not trying to tackle the actual problem, is like putting your finger in the hole in the dyke.

There comes a point in time where the people with the loudest complaints need to actually SOLVE the problem - or stop complaining.
See post 205

[golfing eagles]

Maybe not, but I'd take that for now, then tackle the longer-term problem (from elsewhere)

That's probably how they ended up where they are now. Settling for pushing them out of wherever they are now, and not trying to tackle the actual problem, is like putting your finger in the hole in the dyke.

There comes a point in time where the people with the loudest complaints need to actually SOLVE the problem - or stop complaining.

Let me see if I understand that post. Is it being suggested that the "shuffle them off to Buffalo" game end here, in The Villages, and we harbor them while "tackling the problem"?????

NO THANK YOU!!!!!!

We would attract thousands more for years and years, especially since there is no clear way to solve the issue. Heck, they could be like downtown Seattle and declare their own country.

[Boomer]

Guess what. We are waaaaay “down the road”………….

Sweeping legislation, decades ago, with no backup plan…….now, here we are.

What would Ronald Reagan say if he could see what is happening all these years later?

Boomer

[Byte1]

If you don't care where they go, then I'll suggest to them that there's a lovely lanai they can sleep on, at your house.

What's that? You don't want them at your house? Okay - the next door neighbor. Or across the street. Or at the other end of your neighborhood. Or behind your rec center. As long as it's not "wherever they are at the moment" you don't care. So I'll not care either. As long as YOU don't live in MY neighborhood, the homeless can go ahead and live in YOUR neighborhood. There. Problem solved.

They have to go somewhere, and they don't have cars.

Why do you feel it is anyone else's responsibility to provide a place for them to go? I don't know about now, but years ago we had a Loitering and Vagrancy law. A cop could move you along or arrest you if they wished if you were hanging out around someone's private property.

[golfing eagles]

Why do you feel it is anyone else's responsibility to provide a place for them to go? I don't know about now, but years ago we had a Loitering and Vagrancy law. A cop could move you along or arrest you if they wished if you were hanging out around someone's private property.

There may still be loitering laws, especially if a "no loitering" sign is posted. I think the vagrancy laws were abolished during the civil rights movement. Small Southern towns would pass a law that anyone found on the street with less than $50 in their pocket could be arrested for vagrancy. This, of course, was just another form of racial discrimination since that group at that time probably didn't have $50. Most other people probably didn't carry $50 on them either, but they wouldn't be stopped by local police.

However, I wouldn't be opposed to similar law as long as it was equally enforced on all races and religions----but it probably wouldn't be needed---we could just enforce the trespassing laws.

[gobuck827]

Not an accurate representation.

You can legally request Asylum in America ONLY at international bridges or ports of entry, basing your request on the fact that your life or well-being is in jeopardy in your country of origin based on one of the following four reasons:



Also not accurate. From the USCIS web site;

"To obtain asylum through the affirmative asylum process you must be physically present in the United States. You may apply for asylum regardless of how you arrived in the United States or your current immigration status."

Obtaining Asylum in the United States | USCIS (https://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/refugees-and-asylum/asylum/obtaining-asylum-in-the-united-states)

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Why do you feel it is anyone else's responsibility to provide a place for them to go? I don't know about now, but years ago we had a Loitering and Vagrancy law. A cop could move you along or arrest you if they wished if you were hanging out around someone's private property.

I don't think it's anyone else's responsibility. It was a question of logistics, not of morals. I wasn't asking where the police will drop them off. I wasn't asking where we feel they /should/ go.

I'm asking - in the most literal sense possible - where do you think they WILL go, if they are ordered to leave the place they currently occupy? Where do you expect them to show up? Are you okay with them showing up in your back yard? Because - if they're not in "location A" they will certainly need to go to "location B." And if those homeless people decide that your back yard is a perfect "location B" to be, then that's where they'll show up next.

My question is because - they are in "Location A." They weren't born there. They weren't raised in the woods by wild boars or whatever else you think is in those woods. They WENT there. That means they CAME FROM somewhere else.

If you kick them out of there, they will need to go - somewhere else.

My question is - where do people presume these homeless people will go, once they are no longer to be where they currently are?

[Aces4]

I don't think it's anyone else's responsibility. It was a question of logistics, not of morals. I wasn't asking where the police will drop them off. I wasn't asking where we feel they /should/ go.

I'm asking - in the most literal sense possible - where do you think they WILL go, if they are ordered to leave the place they currently occupy? Where do you expect them to show up? Are you okay with them showing up in your back yard? Because - if they're not in "location A" they will certainly need to go to "location B." And if those homeless people decide that your back yard is a perfect "location B" to be, then that's where they'll show up next.

My question is because - they are in "Location A." They weren't born there. They weren't raised in the woods by wild boars or whatever else you think is in those woods. They WENT there. That means they CAME FROM somewhere else.

If you kick them out of there, they will need to go - somewhere else.

My question is - where do people presume these homeless people will go, once they are no longer to be where they currently are?

Portland, San Francisco???

[Babubhat]

215 replies and no pictures or visual documentation. Really?

[YvonneandScott]

We ate at Giovanni’s tonight. There was a man with a buggy full of all of his belongings resting on the sidewalk. He was homeless and overweight. For some reason when I think homeless I always thought of malnutrition. Not the case today at 5 pm. Looked like a tent in his buggy with his belongings. IDK, but that’s on Wedgewood down from Ace Hardware. So it’s not just south.

[Mrs.Guy]

215 replies and no pictures or visual documentation. Really?

:popcorn: 219

[tophcfa]

I don't think it's anyone else's responsibility.
I'm asking - in the most literal sense possible - where do you think they WILL go, if they are ordered to leave the place they currently occupy?

Easy answer, they will follow the path of least resistance that supports their lifestyle. On to the next spot, looking for handouts and/or lack of law enforcement.

If the laws are enforced everywhere, and the hand outs dry up, guess what, maybe they will actually apply for one of the many jobs that are currently available and get a legitimate place to live? Wouldn’t that be nice!

[Sabella]

Normal?

[Love2Swim]

Guess what. We are waaaaay “down the road”………….

Sweeping legislation, decades ago, with no backup plan…….now, here we are.

What would Ronald Reagan say if he could see what is happening all these years later?

Boomer

He would probably say he wished he hadn't de-regulated the the financial services industry, which led to the Savings and Loan Crisis and financial collapse of 2008. Oh, and his trickle down philosophy of cutting taxes on the wealthy, didn't work then, and doesn't work now. Just sayin'....

[golfing eagles]

He would probably say he wished he hadn't de-regulated the the financial services industry, which led to the Savings and Loan Crisis and financial collapse of 2008. Oh, and his trickle down philosophy of cutting taxes on the wealthy, didn't work then, and doesn't work now. Just sayin'....

And I thought it led to the greatest economic boom of the last 50 years---silly me :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
And 1982 caused 2008????? Hmmm......... May make sense since 2022 is causing "1984"

[Love2Swim]

Easy answer, they will follow the path of least resistance that supports their lifestyle. On to the next spot, looking for handouts and/or lack of law enforcement.

If the laws are enforced everywhere, and the hand outs dry up, guess what, maybe they will actually apply for one of the many jobs that are currently available and get a legitimate place to live? Wouldn’t that be nice!

Um, how would they do that if they are battling diseases like alcoholism and drug addiction, and mental illness? Many cities just don't offer sufficient needed services to treat these conditions. Estimates are that about 40% of homeless men are veterans. Do we just turn our backs on these people?

[Two Bills]

Um, how would they do that if they are battling diseases like alcoholism and drug addiction, and mental illness? Many cities just don't offer sufficient needed services to treat these conditions. Estimates are that about 40% of homeless men are veterans. Do we just turn our backs on these people?

Diseases? Don't think you can catch any of the conditions you mentioned.
I can't understand why all the God fearing, Bible quoting Super Christians from the "What happens when I die" thread" are not down at the bridge offering comfort and shelter.
Many are on this thread looking for ways to kick them out.
Not very Christian! :shrug:

[Babubhat]

It’s why we pay absurd amount taxes and get little in return

[golfing eagles]

Diseases? Don't think you can catch any of the conditions you mentioned.
I can't understand why all the God fearing, Bible quoting Super Christians from the "What happens when I die" thread" are not down at the bridge offering comfort and shelter.
Many are on this thread looking for ways to kick them out.
Not very Christian! :shrug:

They ARE offered shelter----they REFUSE
And feel free to offer them "comfort"----somewhere else

You don't rid a community of a herd of feral cats by feeding them.

[Altavia]

215 replies and no pictures or visual documentation. Really?


All this over one homeless dude...

[golfing eagles]

All this over one homeless dude...

If only it were just one

[Two Bills]

They ARE offered shelter----they REFUSE
And feel free to offer them "comfort"----somewhere else

You don't rid a community of a herd of feral cats by feeding them.

Offer them a room and a Guest Pass in your house. They'll take it.
Not sure about feeding them, but I'd lock the drinks cabinet.

[golfing eagles]

Offer them a room and a Guest Pass in your house. They'll take it.
Not sure about feeding them, but I'd lock the drinks cabinet.

I'd rather offer them a guest pass to San Francisco, and give them a drink cabinet as a roadie

[jimbomaybe]

I'd rather offer them a guest pass to San Francisco, and give them a drink cabinet as a roadie
Great idea, bus them to localities where there are more kindred spirits, a more open and welcoming environment, make everyone happy,same obvious logic applies to illegal aliens.

[jimbomaybe]

I don't think it's anyone else's responsibility. It was a question of logistics, not of morals. I wasn't asking where the police will drop them off. I wasn't asking where we feel they /should/ go.

I'm asking - in the most literal sense possible - where do you think they WILL go, if they are ordered to leave the place they currently occupy? Where do you expect them to show up? Are you okay with them showing up in your back yard? Because - if they're not in "location A" they will certainly need to go to "location B." And if those homeless people decide that your back yard is a perfect "location B" to be, then that's where they'll show up next.

My question is because - they are in "Location A." They weren't born there. They weren't raised in the woods by wild boars or whatever else you think is in those woods. They WENT there. That means they CAME FROM somewhere else.

If you kick them out of there, they will need to go - somewhere else.

My question is - where do people presume these homeless people will go, once they are no longer to be where they currently are?
Where they go is up to them, unless they are on your property, you may not like the decisions someone else make about who they allow on their property but that is their choice just as the "homeless" make decisions on how and where they live, I have property rights they have freedom of movement, I will not interfere with their rights they have no right to interfere with my rights,, what's your complaint??

[golfing eagles]

Great idea, bus them to localities where there are more kindred spirits, a more open and welcoming environment, make everyone happy,same obvious logic applies to illegal aliens.

EXACTLY!!!!

That's not to say homelessness is a great way of life, that it isn't a problem, and that shuffling them off elsewhere is a solution.
But.......while we as a society figure out what to do, let's figure it out ELSEWHERE. I wonder how long the illegal aliens were allowed to stay at Marth's Vineyard. Would the homeless be welcome in Key Biscayne or get to stay there very long???? How about Hyannisport? Beverly Hills?

[manaboutown]

EXACTLY!!!!

That's not to say homelessness is a great way of life, that it isn't a problem, and that shuffling them off elsewhere is a solution.
But.......while we as a society figure out what to do, let's figure it out ELSEWHERE. I wonder how long the illegal aliens were allowed to stay at Marth's Vineyard. Would the homeless be welcome in Key Biscayne or get to stay there very long???? How about Hyannisport? Beverly Hills?

Martha's Vineyard would not have the 50 or so Venezuelan illegals flown there from San Antonio, TX and ASAP shipped them to Joint Base Cape Cod. lol

[golfing eagles]

Martha's Vineyard would not have the 50 or so Venezuelan illegals flown there from San Antonio, TX and ASAP shipped them to Joint Base Cape Cod. lol

My point exactly. I like to think of The Villages as closer to Martha's Vineyard than Haight-Ashbury

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Easy answer, they will follow the path of least resistance that supports their lifestyle. On to the next spot, looking for handouts and/or lack of law enforcement.

If the laws are enforced everywhere, and the hand outs dry up, guess what, maybe they will actually apply for one of the many jobs that are currently available and get a legitimate place to live? Wouldn’t that be nice!

Yes. The next spot. Do you know where that next spot will be? This all stems from the mentality of "I don't care where they go, as long as they leave where they are."

That is a common thread, in this thread. They just want them gone from Location1. They don't care where Location 2 is.

And my argument is that it's a really really myopic perception that leads them to this opinion.

No, they won't be going to Portland. They can't afford it. If they could afford the trip to Portland they'd be living in a rented apartment right here, and not be homeless.

They will go wherever their feet can carry them. In Location 1, and even at the local police department where they're let out of jail and told to seek residency elsewhere, there is no mass transit. There's no Greyhound, there's no city bus, there's no airport, there's no shuttle. They don't have their own cars.

They will be staying in the area, whether they're in Location 1 or Location 2, or Locations 5-27.

They'll go somewhere local, stay a few days til they're kicked out, and move to ANOTHER somewhere local.

As long as people continue to insist that they don't care where they are, as long as it's not "here." - the homeless will continue to do that. At some point in time, that "Location X" will be in your neighborhood. Right now they're in the Chitty Chatty area. Next, they'll be in Fenny. After that, maybe they'll move northeast and end up in the Rohan area. Could be this time next year they'll be hanging out under the water oaks at Lopez Legacy CC.

And that's all because people "don't care where they go, as long as it isn't here." I care where they go. I don't want them in MY neighborhood. I'm willing to help, in my limited budget way, to get them some SPECIFIC place where they can be safe, not a nuisance to anywhere else, with the ability to shower, find clothing, food, shelter, SAFETY (remember a lot of these homeless are stark raving bonkers - if you were one of the unfortunate sane people who ended up on the streets, would YOU want to shelter with the dangerous addicts? Or would you rather take your chances in the woods?), and resources to get themselves back up on their feet and contributing to society again, getting jobs, paying rent, buying things with earned money, and thus improving the economy.

Even converting one of the older motels in the general area into some kind of halfway home, with a social worker on premises, would be better than forcing them into shelters or to some wooded area down the road from where they were kicked out.

[retiredguy123]

The problem with providing the homeless with a nice shelter or hotel room, and food, etc., is that it will attract more homeless people to come here. They may sleep in the shelter, but they will be roaming the streets during the day. This would cause a lot of people who came here for a quiet retirement to feel uncomfortable and unsafe. If that situation were to happen in The Villages, I, for one, would move somewhere else. I have a lot of options as to where I can live. But, I am not in favor of making The Villages area a homeless friendly place.

[golfing eagles]

Yes. The next spot. Do you know where that next spot will be? This all stems from the mentality of "I don't care where they go, as long as they leave where they are."

That is a common thread, in this thread. They just want them gone from Location1. They don't care where Location 2 is.

And my argument is that it's a really really myopic perception that leads them to this opinion.

No, they won't be going to Portland. They can't afford it. If they could afford the trip to Portland they'd be living in a rented apartment right here, and not be homeless.

They will go wherever their feet can carry them. In Location 1, and even at the local police department where they're let out of jail and told to seek residency elsewhere, there is no mass transit. There's no Greyhound, there's no city bus, there's no airport, there's no shuttle. They don't have their own cars.

They will be staying in the area, whether they're in Location 1 or Location 2, or Locations 5-27.

They'll go somewhere local, stay a few days til they're kicked out, and move to ANOTHER somewhere local.

As long as people continue to insist that they don't care where they are, as long as it's not "here." - the homeless will continue to do that. At some point in time, that "Location X" will be in your neighborhood. Right now they're in the Chitty Chatty area. Next, they'll be in Fenny. After that, maybe they'll move northeast and end up in the Rohan area. Could be this time next year they'll be hanging out under the water oaks at Lopez Legacy CC.

And that's all because people "don't care where they go, as long as it isn't here." I care where they go. I don't want them in MY neighborhood. I'm willing to help, in my limited budget way, to get them some SPECIFIC place where they can be safe, not a nuisance to anywhere else, with the ability to shower, find clothing, food, shelter, SAFETY (remember a lot of these homeless are stark raving bonkers - if you were one of the unfortunate sane people who ended up on the streets, would YOU want to shelter with the dangerous addicts? Or would you rather take your chances in the woods?), and resources to get themselves back up on their feet and contributing to society again, getting jobs, paying rent, buying things with earned money, and thus improving the economy.

Even converting one of the older motels in the general area into some kind of halfway home, with a social worker on premises, would be better than forcing them into shelters or to some wooded area down the road from where they were kicked out.

While I applaud your empathy for these people, I still think The Villages cannot be the place where society figures out how to handle the problem. By doing so it would create a Mecca for the homeless. Personally, I am in favor of dumping them on the doorstep of those who created the problem, but naturally I cannot state who they are on this forum. I also think that as a group they are a LOT more mobile than you think----Many migrate north-south with the seasons. Just think how many gathered in Denver or Portland with changes in the marijuana laws.

I am not referring to those who are temporarily homeless, had jobs that they lost, and are looking to find another and re-enter normal society. I am referring to the hardcore professionally homeless who embrace their lifestyle. And the last thing we need here are a gaggle of social workers, do-gooders, and other assorted bleeding hearts.

[Altavia]

If only it were just one

Maybe I missed more than one being reported?

Certainly no evidence of an encampment as sensationalized by the OP.

I saw law enforcement at the bridge two days later and no reports since.

[golfing eagles]

Maybe I missed more than one being reported?

Certainly no evidence of an encampment as sensationalized by the OP.

I saw law enforcement at the bridge two days later and no reports since.

Let's hope you're right.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

While I applaud your empathy for these people, I still think The Villages cannot be the place where society figures out how to handle the problem. By doing so it would create a Mecca for the homeless. Personally, I am in favor of dumping them on the doorstep of those who created the problem, but naturally I cannot state who they are on this forum. I also think that as a group they are a LOT more mobile than you think----Many migrate north-south with the seasons. Just think how many gathered in Denver or Portland with changes in the marijuana laws.

I am not referring to those who are temporarily homeless, had jobs that they lost, and are looking to find another and re-enter normal society. I am referring to the hardcore professionally homeless who embrace their lifestyle. And the last thing we need here are a gaggle of social workers, do-gooders, and other assorted bleeding hearts.

I don't think they need to be housed in the Villages. I was actually thinking more on the order of the Ocala Forest, where there's already a large community of homeless people. I think that community should be better supported. Taught how to be self-sustaining, provided minimal provisions - solar showers, timber and other materials to build their own modest homes, social workers and basic medical care to prevent the spread of disease, maybe dentists who typically do pro-bono work every year could target the Forest as a rotating service destination. The ones who show interest can be taught agricultural techniques to grow their own fruits, vegetables, legumes, using water barrels, rain water and koi ponds to create fertilizer and more food. This is mostly prepper stuff, but it would work great for *organized* homeless encampments.

They could ultimately create their own self-sustaining village, an eco-village. There are such communities in the country, some work better than others.

But I think the concept is great and it'd get these homeless folks away from us, without pushing them into the gutters (or your neighbor's back yard).

[jimbomaybe]

Yes. The next spot. Do you know where that next spot will be? This all stems from the mentality of "I don't care where they go, as long as they leave where they are."

That is a common thread, in this thread. They just want them gone from Location1. They don't care where Location 2 is.

And my argument is that it's a really really myopic perception that leads them to this opinion.

No, they won't be going to Portland. They can't afford it. If they could afford the trip to Portland they'd be living in a rented apartment right here, and not be homeless.

They will go wherever their feet can carry them. In Location 1, and even at the local police department where they're let out of jail and told to seek residency elsewhere, there is no mass transit. There's no Greyhound, there's no city bus, there's no airport, there's no shuttle. They don't have their own cars.

They will be staying in the area, whether they're in Location 1 or Location 2, or Locations 5-27.

They'll go somewhere local, stay a few days til they're kicked out, and move to ANOTHER somewhere local.

As long as people continue to insist that they don't care where they are, as long as it's not "here." - the homeless will continue to do that. At some point in time, that "Location X" will be in your neighborhood. Right now they're in the Chitty Chatty area. Next, they'll be in Fenny. After that, maybe they'll move northeast and end up in the Rohan area. Could be this time next year they'll be hanging out under the water oaks at Lopez Legacy CC.

And that's all because people "don't care where they go, as long as it isn't here." I care where they go. I don't want them in MY neighborhood. I'm willing to help, in my limited budget way, to get them some SPECIFIC place where they can be safe, not a nuisance to anywhere else, with the ability to shower, find clothing, food, shelter, SAFETY (remember a lot of these homeless are stark raving bonkers - if you were one of the unfortunate sane people who ended up on the streets, would YOU want to shelter with the dangerous addicts? Or would you rather take your chances in the woods?), and resources to get themselves back up on their feet and contributing to society again, getting jobs, paying rent, buying things with earned money, and thus improving the economy.

Even converting one of the older motels in the general area into some kind of halfway home, with a social worker on premises, would be better than forcing them into shelters or to some wooded area down the road from where they were kicked out.

You keep coming back to solutions that people who have had the closest contact and experience with the problem have said it doesn't work, their problems, mental, personality disorders, drug dependence are beyond the ability to change, they have burnt out help from family and friends.

[golfing eagles]

I don't think they need to be housed in the Villages. I was actually thinking more on the order of the Ocala Forest, where there's already a large community of homeless people. I think that community should be better supported. Taught how to be self-sustaining, provided minimal provisions - solar showers, timber and other materials to build their own modest homes, social workers and basic medical care to prevent the spread of disease, maybe dentists who typically do pro-bono work every year could target the Forest as a rotating service destination. The ones who show interest can be taught agricultural techniques to grow their own fruits, vegetables, legumes, using water barrels, rain water and koi ponds to create fertilizer and more food. This is mostly prepper stuff, but it would work great for *organized* homeless encampments.

They could ultimately create their own self-sustaining village, an eco-village. There are such communities in the country, some work better than others.

But I think the concept is great and it'd get these homeless folks away from us, without pushing them into the gutters (or your neighbor's back yard).

That’s fine. Far enough away

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You keep coming back to solutions that people who have had the closest contact and experience with the problem have said it doesn't work, their problems, mental, personality disorders, drug dependence are beyond the ability to change, they have burnt out help from family and friends.

Well then the only solution is to shoot them. Clearly you won't want taxpayer dollars helping them, you don't want them in your neighborhood, no one else wants them in their neighborhood, and jails = taxpayer dollars so that's out too. All those undesirables. The infirm, the addicted, the drunk, the unwashed, the insane, the old folks living off social security and medicare, anyone on food stamps, and hey - get rid of the senior discounts while we're at it. We need to stop mollycoddling each other. You work for what you have, or you have nothing and can just die. But not in the graveyard, that's for people who can afford to PAY for the hole in the ground.

There ya go. Problem solved. Just shoot everyone who doesn't measure up to your expectations. I'm sure you'll end up with only the finest, highest-quality servers at McDonald's in no time.

[PugMom]

i wonder if a tiny-home community would work

[golfing eagles]

Well then the only solution is to shoot them. Clearly you won't want taxpayer dollars helping them, you don't want them in your neighborhood, no one else wants them in their neighborhood, and jails = taxpayer dollars so that's out too. All those undesirables. The infirm, the addicted, the drunk, the unwashed, the insane, the old folks living off social security and medicare, anyone on food stamps, and hey - get rid of the senior discounts while we're at it. We need to stop mollycoddling each other. You work for what you have, or you have nothing and can just die. But not in the graveyard, that's for people who can afford to PAY for the hole in the ground.

There ya go. Problem solved. Just shoot everyone who doesn't measure up to your expectations. I'm sure you'll end up with only the finest, highest-quality servers at McDonald's in no time.

That's more hyperbole than usual for you. I do hope you're not seriously comparing 10% off for seniors at Wendy's with a homeless person defecating at a town square.

[PugMom]

Are you one of the people who left a high tax state for a low tax state?

excellent comment. i'm one of those, & while i truly care about the very poor & homeless, you simply cannot 'throw' $$ into the problem because it almost never works. maybe it's because i came from a state rife with corruption throughout that gave me such a view, but i saw average people doing whatever they could do & those who really wanted to help themselves accepted the offers. groups like the local Rotarians do far more than any gov't program could, & helped construct a small community not but miles away. the grateful accepted & were able to find jobs (usually working for a Rotarian's small businesses!)& find their own place in the community. i'm not talking about the chronic homeless who support themselves by crime & undeserved handouts then using that $$ on drugs, i mean the homeless driven out by rising rent costs matched with low wages & skyrocketing food prices.

[jimbomaybe]

Well then the only solution is to shoot them. Clearly you won't want taxpayer dollars helping them, you don't want them in your neighborhood, no one else wants them in their neighborhood, and jails = taxpayer dollars so that's out too. All those undesirables. The infirm, the addicted, the drunk, the unwashed, the insane, the old folks living off social security and medicare, anyone on food stamps, and hey - get rid of the senior discounts while we're at it. We need to stop mollycoddling each other. You work for what you have, or you have nothing and can just die. But not in the graveyard, that's for people who can afford to PAY for the hole in the ground.

There ya go. Problem solved. Just shoot everyone who doesn't measure up to your expectations. I'm sure you'll end up with only the finest, highest-quality servers at McDonald's in no time.
Before this was a problem the terrible issue of , people who were not any clear and present danger to themselves or others, people being held in institutions against their will, so that was solved by a much more enlightened approach to their "outlook" . Perhaps a somewhat different view of what behaviour would need to be institutionalized, even as problematic as that could be, no one here has suggested shooting anyone, accept you, as to my expectations they have done that , in a manner that is informative of human capabilities but not inspirational

[manaboutown]

Well then the only solution is to shoot them. Clearly you won't want taxpayer dollars helping them, you don't want them in your neighborhood, no one else wants them in their neighborhood, and jails = taxpayer dollars so that's out too. All those undesirables. The infirm, the addicted, the drunk, the unwashed, the insane, the old folks living off social security and medicare, anyone on food stamps, and hey - get rid of the senior discounts while we're at it. We need to stop mollycoddling each other. You work for what you have, or you have nothing and can just die. But not in the graveyard, that's for people who can afford to PAY for the hole in the ground.

There ya go. Problem solved. Just shoot everyone who doesn't measure up to your expectations. I'm sure you'll end up with only the finest, highest-quality servers at McDonald's in no time.

Really now. I believe nearly everyone is sufficiently altruistic to want to assist the truly needy who for whatever reason have fallen on hard times and are unable to support themselves temporarily or for the remainder of their lives. IMHO this group comprises a relatively small fraction of the current homeless population.

The vast majority of the homeless in today's America are people who choose of their own free will to live parasitic lifestyles leeching off the resources of responsible citizens through multiple means. Frankly, I have no sympathy for them.