How much screaming is too much screaming?

[Aviator1211]

Certainly, if an individual stood in front of a performance stage and continuously screamed over the performers, that individual would be quickly ushered out of the venue. So, how many screams is acceptable? 200 per hour, 100 per hour? 50 per hour? Of course, out of respect for the band and the audience, the only acceptable and enforceable number is zero screams per hour.

We tried Spanish Springs again last night, unfortunately, the Screamer was there showing his disrespect worse than ever. If The Villages wants to revitalize Spanish Springs, perhaps they should begin by silencing the Screamer.

If you agree that zero screams per hour is the correct limit, please let the officials at the square know your feelings.

[Get real]

Certainly, if an individual stood in front of a performance stage and continuously screamed over the performers, that individual would be quickly ushered out of the venue. So, how many screams is acceptable? 200 per hour, 100 per hour? 50 per hour? Of course, out of respect for the band and the audience, the only acceptable and enforceable number is zero screams per hour.

We tried Spanish Springs again last night, unfortunately, the Screamer was there showing his disrespect worse than ever. If The Villages wants to revitalize Spanish Springs, perhaps they should begin by silencing the Screamer.

If you agree that zero screams per hour is the correct limit, please let the officials at the square know your feelings.

Who is the screamer?

[Davonu]

Who is the screamer?
I’m guessing the ‘baton guy’.

[Aviator1211]

Who is the screamer?

Go to Spanish Springs and it will be painfully obvious. I have also heard him called the conductor, and the village idiot.

[rustyp]

Certainly, if an individual stood in front of a performance stage and continuously screamed over the performers, that individual would be quickly ushered out of the venue. So, how many screams is acceptable? 200 per hour, 100 per hour? 50 per hour? Of course, out of respect for the band and the audience, the only acceptable and enforceable number is zero screams per hour.


Whatever the right answer is it also should apply to the number of barks per hour in the same venue.

[D&BSmith]

His name is Mark. Have been told he has Aspergers. Gentle and kind person. Normally he moves about the square, not standing in one place. He brings his mother on occasion, pushing her in a wheelchair.

Asperger's Syndrome, a form of Autism Spectrum Disorder, is a developmental disorder. Young people with Asperger's Syndrome have a difficult time relating to others socially and their behavior and thinking patterns can be rigid and repetitive.

I have seen people complain to the staff. They would direct Mark to the area outside of the dance floor.

[DrHitch]

Yes, his name is Mark and yes, in person, he's a nice quiet gentle guy.

In fact, he's told me that he's been quite upset by the snarky looks, comments and actions of some people.

We are snowbirds and hang at Spanish Springs. This guy is part of the fun and ambience and certainly isn't harming anyone although he may be loud sometimes (vocally and visually)...sigh!

[Aviator1211]

His name is Mark. Have been told he has Aspergers. Gentle and kind person. Normally he moves about the square, not standing in one place. He brings his mother on occasion, pushing her in a wheelchair.

Asperger's Syndrome, a form of Autism Spectrum Disorder, is a developmental disorder. Young people with Asperger's Syndrome have a difficult time relating to others socially and their behavior and thinking patterns can be rigid and repetitive.

I have seen people complain to the staff. They would direct Mark to the area outside of the dance floor.

I would like to see that doctors diagnosis. He is in full control of his faculties. He used to stay near the fountain with no screaming. He just craves attention and has become much bolder over the years. Clearly, not Asperger's.

[Aviator1211]

Yes, his name is Mark and yes, in person, he's a nice quiet gentle guy.

In fact, he's told me that he's been quite upset by the snarky looks, comments and actions of some people.

We are snowbirds and hang at Spanish Springs. This guy is part of the fun and ambience and certainly isn't harming anyone although he may be loud sometimes (vocally and visually)...sigh!

He can easily avoid the snarky looks and comments by not screaming at us. There are plenty of interesting and fun characters at the squares that don't scream.

[Taltarzac725]

Yes, his name is Mark and yes, in person, he's a nice quiet gentle guy.

In fact, he's told me that he's been quite upset by the snarky looks, comments and actions of some people.

We are snowbirds and hang at Spanish Springs. This guy is part of the fun and ambience and certainly isn't harming anyone although he may be loud sometimes (vocally and visually)...sigh!

Asperger's Syndrome: Symptoms, Diagnosis and Treatment (https://www.nationwidechildrens.org/conditions/aspergers-syndrome#:~:text=Asperger's%20Syndrome%2C%20a%20fo rm%20of,can%20be%20rigid%20and%20repetitive).

Sounds like Mark has this disease. My mother was a Special Ed. teacher in Reno, Nevada and with some adults here in the Villages through a program at one of the local Catholic Churches.

I did meet a number of her students in Reno and also here in the Villages. One of them lives close by to us.

[Aviator1211]

Asperger's Syndrome: Symptoms, Diagnosis and Treatment (https://www.nationwidechildrens.org/conditions/aspergers-syndrome#:~:text=Asperger's%20Syndrome%2C%20a%20fo rm%20of,can%20be%20rigid%20and%20repetitive).

Sounds like Mark has this disease. My mother was a Special Ed. teacher in Reno, Nevada and with some adults here in the Villages through a program at one of the local Catholic Churches.

I did meet a number of her students in Reno and also here in the Villages. One of them lives close by to us.

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

He has grown much bolder over time. Just as would be expected from an attention seeker.

[Taltarzac725]

His name is Mark. Have been told he has Aspergers. Gentle and kind person. Normally he moves about the square, not standing in one place. He brings his mother on occasion, pushing her in a wheelchair.

Asperger's Syndrome, a form of Autism Spectrum Disorder, is a developmental disorder. Young people with Asperger's Syndrome have a difficult time relating to others socially and their behavior and thinking patterns can be rigid and repetitive.

I have seen people complain to the staff. They would direct Mark to the area outside of the dance floor.

This seems to show that Mark has Asperger's.

[Aviator1211]

This seems to show that Mark has Asperger's.

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

My neighbor met him at Walmart and struck up a conversation. According to my neighbor, his response made reference to living with a relative and smoking a controlled substance all day.

As long as we are making armchair diagnoses, the controlled substance is a much more likely diagnosis than Asperger's. He has grown much bolder over time. Just as would be expected from an attention seeker. Feigning a medical condition is no excuse for disrespecting the band and audience members.I’ve been smoking that controlled substance since I was a teenager ,I’m now 84 . I can tell you that screaming is not one of the byproducts of that controlled substance .

[Taltarzac725]

I’ve been smoking that controlled substance since I was a teenager ,I’m now 84 . I can tell you that screaming is not one of the byproducts of that controlled substance .

I have a kind of friend who used to come to the house for about 6 months for almost daily 7 hour stretches; she would smoke a few small cigars on the back porch. She seemed to need that fix. But she is one of the calmest people in every kind of situation. Nothing seemed to get her goat so to speak.

[Kelevision]

Certainly, if an individual stood in front of a performance stage and continuously screamed over the performers, that individual would be quickly ushered out of the venue. So, how many screams is acceptable? 200 per hour, 100 per hour? 50 per hour? Of course, out of respect for the band and the audience, the only acceptable and enforceable number is zero screams per hour.

We tried Spanish Springs again last night, unfortunately, the Screamer was there showing his disrespect worse than ever. If The Villages wants to revitalize Spanish Springs, perhaps they should begin by silencing the Screamer.

If you agree that zero screams per hour is the correct limit, please let the officials at the square know your feelings.

Go to Sumter Landing.

[roob1]

After he leaves the square, the degree of visual and auditory stimulation is greatly reduced. Possibly that is why his behavior changes.

Concluding he can turn it on and off at will is a naive conclusion.

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

[Aviator1211]

I’ve been smoking that controlled substance since I was a teenager ,I’m now 84 . I can tell you that screaming is not one of the byproducts of that controlled substance .

Wonderful you have avoided the common long-term effects. Others have not been so lucky.

Long-Term Risks of Cannabis Use | Health | Province of Manitoba (https://www.gov.mb.ca/health/cannabis/ltr.html)

[Aviator1211]

Go to Sumter Landing.

Why should audience members who respect others desire to listen to the entertainment be chased away by one disrespectful person?

[Aviator1211]

After he leaves the square, the degree of visual and auditory stimulation is greatly reduced. Possibly that is why his behavior changes.

Concluding he can turn it on and off at will is a naive conclusion.

If the visual and auditory stimulation is so disturbing, why does he go to the square? Much more likely just seeking attention ... at others expense.

[Bill14564]

Wonderful you have avoided the common long-term effects. Others have not been so lucky.

Long-Term Risks of Cannabis Use | Health | Province of Manitoba (https://www.gov.mb.ca/health/cannabis/ltr.html)

Interesting article. Reading carefully, it seems safer than cigarettes and alcohol with a possible effect on memory, concentration, and motivation which could result in poor grades or poor work performance. As a retired person who is not taking classes, there isn't much risk to me.

[Aviator1211]

Interesting article. Reading carefully, it seems safer than cigarettes and alcohol with a possible effect on memory, concentration, and motivation which could result in poor grades or poor work performance. As a retired person who is not taking classes, there isn't much risk to me.

Not sure about safer than smoking, but I suspect you are right about alcohol. Definitely shouldn't be a controlled substance. But, that's a subject for a different thread. :laugh:

[JMintzer]

It seems that TV crack medical team has this figured out...

Wait, what? None of them are actual doctors?

https://media.tenor.com/N910WJzMADQAAAAC/nevermind-ignore-it.gif

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Wonderful you have avoided the common long-term effects. Others have not been so lucky.

Long-Term Risks of Cannabis Use | Health | Province of Manitoba (https://www.gov.mb.ca/health/cannabis/ltr.html)hmmmm less dangerous then all the pizza and big steaks eaten by many here , everything in moderation , I was smart enough and quick enough to last 40 years in some of the worst places in the world and collecting a 6 figure pension for 24 years , so a little weed and little Miles , Coltrane and Ahmad Jamal makes Charlie a happy guy

[fdpaq0580]

Yes, his name is Mark and yes, in person, he's a nice quiet gentle guy.

In fact, he's told me that he's been quite upset by the snarky looks, comments and actions of some people.

We are snowbirds and hang at Spanish Springs. This guy is part of the fun and ambience and certainly isn't harming anyone although he may be loud sometimes (vocally and visually)...sigh!

"Mark" may seem a very nice, but his actions can be very startling and disrupting. Certainly he knows that his "antics" (for lack of a better word) are what brings him the looks and comments that upset him. Like an alcoholic or a drug addict who knows their triggers, if they want to avoid negative effects they need to find alternative activities and entertainment to the ones that trigger the negative behavior.
So, if "Mark" is at the square and acting out, he is fully aware that he is doing it (startling people and being disruptive).

[Taltarzac725]

"Mark" may seem a very nice, but his actions can be very startling and disrupting. Certainly he knows that his "antics" (for lack of a better word) are what brings him the looks and comments that upset him. Like an alcoholic or a drug addict who knows their triggers, if they want to avoid negative effects they need to find alternative activities and entertainment to the ones that trigger the negative behavior.
So, if "Mark" is at the square and acting out, he is fully aware that he is doing it (startling people and being disruptive).

I got the impression he was screaming because he is enjoying the music not to upset other people.

[fdpaq0580]

hmmmm less dangerous then all the pizza and big steaks eaten by many here , everything in moderation , I was smart enough and quick enough to last 40 years in some of the worst places in the world and collecting a 6 figure pension for 24 years , so a little weed and little Miles , Coltrane and Ahmad Jamal makes Charlie a happy guy

Good for you!

Now, back to our regularly scheduled discussion, "The Screamer".

[fdpaq0580]

I got the impression he was screaming because he is enjoying the music not to upset other people.

He may be. But he does upset others and is obviously aware of the responses he receives. So?

[Taltarzac725]

He may be. But he does upset others and is obviously aware of the responses he receives. So?

So. We have to put up with the eccentricities of others in public places like the Villages' Squares.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Good for you!

Now, back to our regularly scheduled discussion, "The Screamer". just don’t blame it on the weed

[fdpaq0580]

So. We have to put up with the eccentricities of others in public places like the Villages' Squares.

No, we don't! We all can choose to get up and go elsewhere. Except, of course, the poor band that has to play for one person who is screaming at them.
It is said that music can sooth the savage breast. Maybe if the band played a lullaby.

[Taltarzac725]

No, we don't! We all can choose to get up and go elsewhere. Except, of course, the poor band that has to play for one person who is screaming at them.
It is said that music can sooth the savage breast. Maybe if the band played a lullaby.

Bands in the Villages are probably used to odd people being in their audiences as would most of the Villagers I have met. There are many people in the Villages with memory care problems of varying degrees of severity. Look up sundowning for instance in which a patient with dementia or some other mental problem starts yelling.

[fdpaq0580]

just don’t blame it on the weed

Weed? You mean dandelions, righr?

[manaboutown]

This is now a world without common sense. Allow some screaming screwball to disrupt the enjoyment of music by hundreds of law abiding folks, night after night; place a (silent) plastic flamingo in your front yard and the authorities are all over it like a bad rash.

[fdpaq0580]

Bands in the Villages are probably used to odd people being in their audiences as would most of the Villagers I have met. There are many people in the Villages with memory care problems of varying degrees of severity. Look up sundowning for instance in which a patient with dementia or some other mental problem starts yelling.

Hey! Who you callin' odd people?

[Taltarzac725]

This is now a world without common sense. Allow some screaming screwball to disrupt the enjoyment of music by hundreds of law abiding folks, night after night; place a (silent) plastic flamingo in your front yard and the authorities are all over it like a bad rash.

He is hardly a "screaming screwball". And the Squares are a public place. A flamingo on your yard is a violation of property agreements.

[Taltarzac725]

Bands in the Villages are probably used to odd people being in their audiences as would most of the Villagers I have met. There are many people in the Villages with memory care problems of varying degrees of severity. Look up sundowning for instance in which a patient with dementia or some other mental problem starts yelling.

A note about sundowning by seniors. This is probably a lot more common problem for nightly entertainment than some man with Asperger's trying to enjoy himself in a public place.

How to Deal With Sundowners: Advice From Caregivers | CaringBridge (https://www.caringbridge.org/resources/how-to-deal-with-sundowners/?psafe_param=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIjMHMhfvC_gIVWSSzAB3-HAiaEAAYAiAAEgJyCfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds)

Sundowning and dementia | Alzheimer's Society (https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/about-dementia/symptoms-and-diagnosis/symptoms/sundowning)

[Aviator1211]

A note about sundowning by seniors. This is probably a lot more common problem for nightly entertainment than some man with Asperger's trying to enjoy himself in a public place.

How to Deal With Sundowners: Advice From Caregivers | CaringBridge (https://www.caringbridge.org/resources/how-to-deal-with-sundowners/?psafe_param=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIjMHMhfvC_gIVWSSzAB3-HAiaEAAYAiAAEgJyCfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds)

Sundowning and dementia | Alzheimer's Society (https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/about-dementia/symptoms-and-diagnosis/symptoms/sundowning)

Its very generous of you to attribute his behavior to a medical condition. But, I believe your compassion is misguided. He does not scream off the square or at Walmart. More likely he is just an attention seeker gaining his attention at the expense of the band and everyone else trying to enjoy the music on the square.

[Aviator1211]

He is hardly a "screaming screwball". And the Squares are a public place. A flamingo on your yard is a violation of property agreements.
So I could take an airhorn down to the square and start blasting it with impunity? There are limits. And zero screaming over the band is the only reasonable and enforceacble limit.

[Aviator1211]

Bands in the Villages are probably used to odd people being in their audiences as would most of the Villagers I have met. There are many people in the Villages with memory care problems of varying degrees of severity. Look up sundowning for instance in which a patient with dementia or some other mental problem starts yelling.

I'm sure no one would fault someone with dementia (and I suspect their caretakers would seat them towards the back). But, there is no excuse for an attention seeker getting their attention at the expense of the band and everyone else trying to enjoy the band.

[Aviator1211]

No, we don't! We all can choose to get up and go elsewhere. Except, of course, the poor band that has to play for one person who is screaming at them.
It is said that music can sooth the savage breast. Maybe if the band played a lullaby.
No use. He screams over quite ballads and even Christmas carols.

[Taltarzac725]

So I could take an airhorn down to the square and start blasting it with impunity? There are limits. And zero screaming over the band is the only reasonable and enforceacble limit.

That is a deliberate attempt to distract from the musicians' work. A man with a mental condition-- Asperger's-- who gets excited because of he music is a different matter entirely. And I doubt if the band has any problem with him at all. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTKHZeP-IZQ

[Taltarzac725]

I'm sure no one would fault someone with dementia (and I suspect their caretakers would seat them towards the back). But, there is no excuse for an attention seeker getting their attention at the expense of the band and everyone else trying to enjoy the band.

What makes you assert he is an attention seeker? He is there to enjoy the music along with others.

If I have a man or woman loudly talking to the screen when I am at a movie theater, I usually just leave the theater. If others have to endure this I would get an attendant if there is one around and have her ask them to be quiet.

This man with Asperger's though is at a band playing at a Villages' Square. He has a right to be there.

[manaboutown]

That is a deliberate attempt to distract from the musicians' work. A man with a mental condition-- Asperger's-- who gets excited because of he music is a different matter entirely. And I doubt if the band has any problem with him at all. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTKHZeP-IZQ

Having played music professionally back in the day I can assure you no band welcomes a banshee disrupting its performance.

[Taltarzac725]

Having played music professionally back in the day I can assure you no band welcomes a banshee disturbing its performance.

That is quite an overstatement.

[Gpsma]

What makes you assert he is an attention seeker? He is there to enjoy the music along with others.

If I have a man or woman loudly talking to the screen when I am at a movie theater, I usually just leave the theater. If others have to endure this I would get an attendant if there is one around and have her ask them to be quiet.

This man with Asperger's though is at a band playing at a Villages' Square. He has a right to be there.

His right to enjoy the music ends when he deprives others of their enjoyment.

[Taltarzac725]

His right to enjoy the music ends when he deprives others of their enjoyment.

Why does he keep coming then if the bands have a problem with him? My guess is that he has a legal right to be there unless he breaks a law. And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling.

I would not enjoy music if someone were yelling a lot but I would just go home or to another square. We live in an open society.

[Gpsma]

Why does he keep coming then if the bands have a problem with him? My guess is that he has a legal right to be there unless he breaks a law. And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling.

I would not enjoy music if someone were yelling a lot but I would just go home or to another square. We live in an open society.

No one should be forced to leave because another person is disruptive.

There have been a number of threads about him. Seems his screaming goes above just being enthusiastic about the music.

[fdpaq0580]

That is a deliberate attempt to distract from the musicians' work. A man with a mental condition-- Asperger's-- who gets excited because of he music is a different matter entirely. And I doubt if the band has any problem with him at all. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTKHZeP-IZQ

A disturbance of any kind and for any reason is not universally accepted or appreciated. What if he was similarly demonstrative at the Sharon for a performance of Swan Lake. He screams, the swan hits the floor with a broken ankle. It could be a scream at the square that causes a new visitor to lose their balance, trip and end up with a broken hip.

[manaboutown]

He is hardly a "screaming screwball". And the Squares are a public place. A flamingo on your yard is a violation of property agreements.

screaming

adjective: screaming
1.
giving a long, loud, piercing cry or cries.
"a harassed parent with a screaming child"

screaming definition - Google Search (https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=screaming+definition&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8)


"screwball noun [C] (PERSON)


mainly US informal
a person who behaves in a strange and funny way"

SCREWBALL | definition in the Cambridge English Dictionary (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/screwball)

Screaming screwball is not misdescriptive of this individual but apt.

The squares are indeed "open to the public" and in that sense are a "public place".

Most Villagers are aware the landscaping rights of owners are subject to restrictive covenants.

[Taltarzac725]

No one should be forced to leave because another person is disruptive.

There have been a number of threads about him. Seems his screaming goes above just being enthusiastic about the music.

No one is being forced to leave. But someone in the Villages has a right to enjoy the music at a Square even if they have Asperger's and they yell too much.

[Taltarzac725]

A disturbance of any kind and for any reason is not universally accepted or appreciated. What if he was similarly demonstrative at the Sharon for a performance of Swan Lake. He screams, the swan hits the floor with a broken ankle. It could be a scream at the square that causes a new visitor to lose their balance, trip and end up with a broken hip.


Different matter. I would hope that anyone who goes to a ballet would have sense enough not to start yelling.

Also that is usually a person who has bought a ticket to an event.

[fdpaq0580]

Different matter. I would hope that anyone who goes to a ballet would have sense enough not to start yelling.

Also that is usually a person who has bought a ticket to an event.

You didn't read my last sentence or chose to ignore it.
Also, what prevents a person with Asperger's from buying a ticket? Or attending a chess or golf or shooting tournament?

[Bill14564]

No one should be forced to leave because another person is disruptive.

There have been a number of threads about him. Seems his screaming goes above just being enthusiastic about the music.

Is he disruptive or does he dance around and occasionally make some noise? When I saw him last fall he danced his dance and didn't disrupt anything. Others have accused him of seeking attention but at that time he didn't acknowledge any attention at all, he just kept dancing. I don't recall any of those threads stating anything different.

I find it distracting and it affects my enjoyment to see people dancing poorly - should all the non-professional dancers be asked to leave because they deprive me of my enjoyment?

I find my enjoyment of the entertainment considerably lessened by seeing unattractive old people on the dance floor - should it be a requirement that you have to be young and fit to dance at the squares because otherwise someone is deprived of their enjoyment?

People talking behind me or walking in front of me while fetching their drinks detracts from my enjoyment - can anyone practicing those behaviors be kicked out?

I don't know where the line is that separates uncommon behavior and disruptive behavior or if legally there is one. I haven't seen this individual in several months so perhaps his behavior has changed but to me it did not seem disruptive last fall. Of course, without a legal definition, "disruptive" becomes very subjective and as a society we've become very intolerant of those who are not like us.

[Whitley]

This is now a world without common sense. Allow some screaming screwball to disrupt the enjoyment of music by hundreds of law abiding folks, night after night; place a (silent) plastic flamingo in your front yard and the authorities are all over it like a bad rash.

Calling this autistic gentleman a "screaming screwball" may be a bit too much.

[Whitley]

QUOTE " find my enjoyment of the entertainment considerably lessened by seeing unattractive old people on the dance floor - should it be a requirement that you have to be young and fit to dance at the squares because otherwise someone is deprived of their enjoyment?"

And scantily dressed. DO NOT forget, scantily dressed.

[thelegges]

I'm sure no one would fault someone with dementia (and I suspect their caretakers would seat them towards the back). But, there is no excuse for an attention seeker getting their attention at the expense of the band and everyone else trying to enjoy the band.

Have you spent any time with a dementia human? They can become very violent, screaming, hitting, attacking. Once you have been attacked by what seemed like a very calm person, Mark is a piece of cake.

If you truly think the caregiver of a dementia human can control them when something sets them off, you so lack first hand experience.

Try dealing with that 24/7. You have the ability to try entertainment elsewhere, makes your life so much easier than other's. Even though your night may not be perfect, I guarantee someone else is much worse

[TraceJustice]

Asperger's Syndrome: Symptoms, Diagnosis and Treatment (https://www.nationwidechildrens.org/conditions/aspergers-syndrome#:~:text=Asperger's%20Syndrome%2C%20a%20fo rm%20of,can%20be%20rigid%20and%20repetitive).

Sounds like Mark has this disease. My mother was a Special Ed. teacher in Reno, Nevada and with some adults here in the Villages through a program at one of the local Catholic Churches.

I did meet a number of her students in Reno and also here in the Villages. One of them lives close by to us.

I have an Asperger's child. Screaming like that has nothing to do with Asperger's. They do have aggression issues sometimes if things don't go their way or you make them mad (melt downs). If this guy is just sitting there screaming for no reason (such as in a fit) then it's not Asperger's.

[I'm Popeye!]

They can become very violent, screaming, hitting, attacking. Once you have been attacked by what seemed like a very calm person, Mark is a piece of cake.


Yes, THEY can...

[Aviator1211]

What makes you assert he is an attention seeker? He is there to enjoy the music along with others.

If I have a man or woman loudly talking to the screen when I am at a movie theater, I usually just leave the theater. If others have to endure this I would get an attendant if there is one around and have her ask them to be quiet.

This man with Asperger's though is at a band playing at a Villages' Square. He has a right to be there.

Umm ... because he seeks attention.

You seem very conflicted, you are ok with someone disrupting the music on the square, but you report someone disrupting a movie?

He definitely has a right to be there. But just like those that disrupt a movie, he has no right to disrupt the performance.

[Aviator1211]

I have an Asperger's child. Screaming like that has nothing to do with Asperger's. They do have aggression issues sometimes if things don't go their way or you make them mad (melt downs). If this guy is just sitting there screaming for no reason (such as in a fit) then it's not Asperger's.

Thank you for bringing some sense to this issue. I'm sure those that attribute his behavior to a medical issue are very compassionate. But, in this case I believe their compassion is misplaced ... and, does a disservice to those who really suffer Asperger's.

[Taltarzac725]

You didn't read my last sentence or chose to ignore it.
Also, what prevents a person with Asperger's from buying a ticket? Or attending a chess or golf or shooting tournament?

They are invited to these events and the invitation can be rescinded. The Squares are public spaces with some limitations placed on them by the developer.

[Taltarzac725]

And no two Alzheimer's patients are alike as are no two Asperger's patients.

Autism Management- Concerts – A Is For Aoife Not Autism (https://aisforaoifenotautism.com/2017/07/04/autism-management-concerts/)

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

1. His name is Mark.
2. He is on the autism spectrum as high functioning.
3. He is caretaker for his mom.
4. He doesn't have a cart. He walks from one of the villa areas nearby.
5. His yelling lasts around 20 minutes in total, out of the 4-hour performance.
6. Usually it's a beat count "One Two Three Four!" and then he dances around for awhile before his next one. Sometimes he gets so into the music he shouts again inbetween his counts.
7. He gives amazing hugs and smells of patchouli.
8. He carries a backpack with him, filled mostly with water in a jug from which he hydrates often. This is good, because he sweats a LOT while dancing around the square like that.
9. Whenever I see him out and about during the day, I always stop to say hello and get one of his hugs. He - always thanks me for taking a moment to stop and communicate with him, and has mentioned that many people are afraid of him. This makes him very sad, because he is who he is. Just like people with tourettes' syndrome have ticks and twitches and sometimes blurt out inappropriate words, he has that reaction when he's really into music. He gets lost in the sounds, and it makes him feel alive and energized, and shouting is how he expresses it.
10. He also sometimes goes on "twirling" binges, where he'll actually twirl even while he's walking to the square from his mom's house. This is a self-soothing activity for some people with autism. What's amazing is he never gets dizzy doing it and can maintain a twirl for many minutes without stopping.
11. If you don't like noise, don't go to the square and be sure to pad your home with plenty of soundproofing.

[Taltarzac725]

1. His name is Mark.
2. He is on the autism spectrum as high functioning.
3. He is caretaker for his mom.
4. He doesn't have a cart. He walks from one of the villa areas nearby.
5. His yelling lasts around 20 minutes in total, out of the 4-hour performance.
6. Usually it's a beat count "One Two Three Four!" and then he dances around for awhile before his next one. Sometimes he gets so into the music he shouts again inbetween his counts.
7. He gives amazing hugs and smells of patchouli.
8. He carries a backpack with him, filled mostly with water in a jug from which he hydrates often. This is good, because he sweats a LOT while dancing around the square like that.
9. Whenever I see him out and about during the day, I always stop to say hello and get one of his hugs. He - always thanks me for taking a moment to stop and communicate with him, and has mentioned that many people are afraid of him. This makes him very sad, because he is who he is. Just like people with tourettes' syndrome have ticks and twitches and sometimes blurt out inappropriate words, he has that reaction when he's really into music. He gets lost in the sounds, and it makes him feel alive and energized, and shouting is how he expresses it.
10. He also sometimes goes on "twirling" binges, where he'll actually twirl even while he's walking to the square from his mom's house. This is a self-soothing activity for some people with autism. What's amazing is he never gets dizzy doing it and can maintain a twirl for many minutes without stopping.
11. If you don't like noise, don't go to the square and be sure to pad your home with plenty of soundproofing.

Thanks for that. Maybe some people will get that we are on earth with many other people of all kinds and in public spaces you just have to deal with it.

[Aces4]

1. His name is Mark.
2. He is on the autism spectrum as high functioning.
3. He is caretaker for his mom.
4. He doesn't have a cart. He walks from one of the villa areas nearby.
5. His yelling lasts around 20 minutes in total, out of the 4-hour performance.
6. Usually it's a beat count "One Two Three Four!" and then he dances around for awhile before his next one. Sometimes he gets so into the music he shouts again inbetween his counts.
7. He gives amazing hugs and smells of patchouli.
8. He carries a backpack with him, filled mostly with water in a jug from which he hydrates often. This is good, because he sweats a LOT while dancing around the square like that.
9. Whenever I see him out and about during the day, I always stop to say hello and get one of his hugs. He - always thanks me for taking a moment to stop and communicate with him, and has mentioned that many people are afraid of him. This makes him very sad, because he is who he is. Just like people with tourettes' syndrome have ticks and twitches and sometimes blurt out inappropriate words, he has that reaction when he's really into music. He gets lost in the sounds, and it makes him feel alive and energized, and shouting is how he expresses it.
10. He also sometimes goes on "twirling" binges, where he'll actually twirl even while he's walking to the square from his mom's house. This is a self-soothing activity for some people with autism. What's amazing is he never gets dizzy doing it and can maintain a twirl for many minutes without stopping.
11. If you don't like noise, don't go to the square and be sure to pad your home with plenty of soundproofing.

What a fine response, OB, to the miserable complaining. You people have a problem with that disability, work in a hospital or facility with advanced dementia patients. I’ll never forget the dear, elderly lady and her passion for singing J-E-L-L-O at the top of her lungs anytime the urge struck. It echoed up and down the hallway but she was treated with respect. Eventually, her ability to speak was gone. There by the grace of God go I.

[Pairadocs]

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

That definitely reflects Asperger's syndrome. It would be very rare for an individual with Asperger's to display any of the neurological manifestations in the absence of stimulation factors such as light(s), sound, crowds, and in some cases, even very strong smells. The individual has no control over his /her responses. Don't know if you are familiar with Tourette's syndrome and coprophenomen (coprolalia and copropraxia), but while Asperger's is a separate condition, if you are familiar with coprophenomen, that might help you make sense of the uncontrolled physical and auditory outbursts..it's the same principal, the difficulty that results from being in public places. It is difficult for some people to tolerate an individual with this disability, of course, there are those who are unable to look directly at a paraplegic, or turn away from those with massive facial disfigurements also, but it's a fact of life that some of us are extremely fortunate, and others not so much. An individual with Asperger's can be very annoying of course, but, the alternative is to ban individual's with such a disability from public places and gatherings ! ? Not a choice most would chose. By the way, for those wondering how/why/if such an individual should be "in charge" of a parent, you may be surprises to learn the mental ability of those with Asperger's is generally above the average person's, and in a great many cases actually, extremely intellectually gifted. A quiet conversation away from all sensory stimulation can confirm this for you. Very often gentle and most engaging individuals, high capacity for kindness, caring, and understanding, not at all prone to violence. Hope this helps you a bit, I know it is difficult. Have you ever witnessed someone talking to a person with cerebral palsy in a manner which would make one think the person had a MENTAL DEFICIENCY, not a physical disability ? This situation is similar, what YOU SEE, in definitely not the mental acuity or person "inside".

[Pairadocs]

[QUOTE=Bill14564;2211021]Is he disruptive or does he dance around and occasionally make some noise? When I saw him last fall he danced his dance and didn't disrupt anything. Others have accused him of seeking attention but at that time he didn't acknowledge any attention at all, he just kept dancing. I don't recall any of those threads stating anything different.

I find it distracting and it affects my enjoyment to see people dancing poorly - should all the non-professional dancers be asked to leave because they deprive me of my enjoyment?

I find my enjoyment of the entertainment considerably lessened by seeing unattractive old people on the dance floor - should it be a requirement that you have to be young and fit to dance at the squares because otherwise someone is deprived of their enjoyment?

People talking behind me or walking in front of me while fetching their drinks detracts from my enjoyment - can anyone practicing those behaviors be kicked out?

I don't know where the line is that separates uncommon behavior and disruptive behavior or if legally there is one. I haven't seen this individual in several months so perhaps his behavior has changed but to me it did not seem disruptive last fall. Of course, without a legal definition, "disruptive" becomes very subjective and as a society we've become very intolerant of those who are not like us.
Are we to "hide away" individuals with disabilities that make US feel uncomfortable (Asperger's, Tourette's, mandibulofacial dysostosis, cerebral palsy, paraplegia, and many other conditions seem to make those fortunate enough to have no such affliction, very uncomfortable. But why people go further into intolerance, and even cruelty in some cases is perplexing. Perhaps (?) considered children of a lesser god ? Anyone remember that movie ? Or Cher in The Mask ? Showing the pain a mother endures just trying to give her son with mandibulofacial dysostosis a normal life.

[asianthree]

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

He has grown much bolder over time. Just as would be expected from an attention seeker.

So it been posted he doesn’t have a cart, and walks to and from his mother’s house, sometimes twirling, from a poster who is very familiar with Mark.

So who exactly are you following to their cart, and no screaming and the person is perfectly normal, turn on and off behavior.
Are You following the wrong person leaving the square.

That’s a little scary, the need embellish your post to influence others, or keeping tabs on the wrong person

[Pairadocs]

Is he disruptive or does he dance around and occasionally make some noise? When I saw him last fall he danced his dance and didn't disrupt anything. Others have accused him of seeking attention but at that time he didn't acknowledge any attention at all, he just kept dancing. I don't recall any of those threads stating anything different.

I find it distracting and it affects my enjoyment to see people dancing poorly - should all the non-professional dancers be asked to leave because they deprive me of my enjoyment?

I find my enjoyment of the entertainment considerably lessened by seeing unattractive old people on the dance floor - should it be a requirement that you have to be young and fit to dance at the squares because otherwise someone is deprived of their enjoyment?

People talking behind me or walking in front of me while fetching their drinks detracts from my enjoyment - can anyone practicing those behaviors be kicked out?

I don't know where the line is that separates uncommon behavior and disruptive behavior or if legally there is one. I haven't seen this individual in several months so perhaps his behavior has changed but to me it did not seem disruptive last fall. Of course, without a legal definition, "disruptive" becomes very subjective and as a society we've become very intolerant of those who are not like us.

Intolerant for sure ! What are we to, "hide away" individuals with disabilities that make US feel uncomfortable ? That's what I found when on a professorial exchange in China. Asperger's, Tourette's, mandibulofacial dysostosis, cerebral palsy, paraplegia, and many other conditions seem to make those fortunate enough to have no such affliction, very uncomfortable. But why people go further into intolerance, and even to the point of cruelty in some cases, is perplexing. Perhaps (?) they are considered children of a lesser god ? Anyone remember that movie ? Or Cher in the film The Mask ? Showing the pain a mother endures just trying to give her son with mandibulofacial dysostosis a normal life. Very upsetting also is the assumption so many make, that such individuals are also mentally "deficient" ! ! !

[kcrazorbackfan]

Why does he keep coming then if the bands have a problem with him? My guess is that he has a legal right to be there unless he breaks a law. And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling.

I would not enjoy music if someone were yelling a lot but I would just go home or to another square. We live in an open society.

“And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling”. Most people are sheeple and will not say anything, no matter what is happening.

[Taltarzac725]

“And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling”. Most people are sheeple and will not say anything, no matter what is happening.


I have not found that true at all.

[manaboutown]

“And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling”. Most people are sheeple and will not say anything, no matter what is happening.

They are fearful of the PC police.

[fdpaq0580]

So. We have to put up with the eccentricities of others in public places like the Villages' Squares.

Totally avoided the question. Nice side step.
But, back to my question. Mark has a "condition" that he can't control. He acts out in certain ways that bring him unwanted attention. He is (we assume) aware that the stimuli of the sights and sounds at the music venues trigger his actions that elicit the looks and comments that make him unhappy. Knowing all this, one wonders why he continues to choose to expose himself to stimuli that will trigger his episodes and, ultimately, make him unhappy? Is it like a drug that gives you a temporary high that you know is ultimately let you down? I know that after my third trip to emergency one hockey season, the doctor suggested I might want to quit hockey and take up a less painful game, like checkers. When I said, "or chess",she remarked that after three trips to emergency it was obvious I wasn't smart enough for chess.
So, why the need to go to a place where he doesn't want the looks or comments?

[jiiiiimmmm]

I’ve never seen the man drive a cart, and he should be looked at with compassion, not contempt. It’s not all about you.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

I would like to see that doctors diagnosis. He is in full control of his faculties. He used to stay near the fountain with no screaming. He just craves attention and has become much bolder over the years. Clearly, not Asperger's.

Is that your qualified medical opinion?

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

I've seen him walking back to his cart. After he leaves the square there is no screaming, no odd behavior. Perfectly normal. He can clearly turn it on and off at will.

He has grown much bolder over time. Just as would be expected from an attention seeker.

You mean the same way anonymous posters are bold about thinking they are qualified to medically diagnose and talk about someone’s health publicly?

[Aviator1211]

Totally avoided the question. Nice side step.
But, back to my question. Mark has a "condition" that he can't control. He acts out in certain ways that bring him unwanted attention. He is (we assume) aware that the stimuli of the sights and sounds at the music venues trigger his actions that elicit the looks and comments that make him unhappy. Knowing all this, one wonders why he continues to choose to expose himself to stimuli that will trigger his episodes and, ultimately, make him unhappy? Is it like a drug that gives you a temporary high that you know is ultimately let you down? I know that after my third trip to emergency one hockey season, the doctor suggested I might want to quit hockey and take up a less painful game, like checkers. When I said, "or chess",she remarked that after three trips to emergency it was obvious I wasn't smart enough for chess.
So, why the need to go to a place where he doesn't want the looks or comments?

Bad premise. He is in complete control of his behavior. Off the square and at Walmart he does not scream. He is an attention seeker who is using the compassion of others to obtain the attention he is seeking.

[Aviator1211]

You mean the same way anonymous posters are bold about thinking they are qualified to medically diagnose and talk about someone’s health publicly?

Have you seen his medcal report? Aren't you making assumptions? The fact is, off the square and at Walmart he is in perfect control of his faculties. He does not scream. He is an attention seeker who is enabled by well-meaning but terribly misguided compassionate people.

[Aviator1211]

Is that your qualified medical opinion?

Where is yours?

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

I’ve been smoking that controlled substance since I was a teenager ,I’m now 84 . I can tell you that screaming is not one of the byproducts of that controlled substance .

He can control Asperger’s about as well as people on this thread can control their judgy comments. Judgement is a terrible disease. It’s also on public display on this thread, the Villages online square. I can picture all of the judgy posters holding their pointing sticks while they make thei judgy comments. Looks like we have a lot of town square screamers.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

Go to Spanish Springs and it will be painfully obvious. I have also heard him called the conductor, and the village idiot.

There should be a separate thread that publicly roasts each person on here who name calls. Even if you heard it, there is no reason to repeat it publicly. Anonymous posting is dangerous because people feel invisible to do whatever they want with no repercussions. #uglybehavior

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

hmmmm less dangerous then all the pizza and big steaks eaten by many here , everything in moderation , I was smart enough and quick enough to last 40 years in some of the worst places in the world and collecting a 6 figure pension for 24 years , so a little weed and little Miles , Coltrane and Ahmad Jamal makes Charlie a happy guy

Wel, toot toot! Your horn is working!

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

So. We have to put up with the eccentricities of others in public places like the Villages' Squares.

Yes! God forbid. I have to put up with all the snarky judgy people who complain about every little thing that offends their sensibilities on this public forum!

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

Bands in the Villages are probably used to odd people being in their audiences as would most of the Villagers I have met. There are many people in the Villages with memory care problems of varying degrees of severity. Look up sundowning for instance in which a patient with dementia or some other mental problem starts yelling.

There are also lots of judgy snarky TOV people who “yell” online. They seek a lot of attention by posting controversial posts that publicly sacrifice human beings for their own gain. Can we talk about them for awhile instead?

[msilagy]

God Bless Mark.

[Debra.t.robinson]

We are full time and look forward to seeing Mark when we go to the square, which is quite often. His passion and enjoyment of the music is a joy to watch and his screams are always on beat and appropriately timed to the lyrics.

One of the best things about TV IMO is the tolerance shown towards others and the wide array of humanity that exists here.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

This is now a world without common sense. Allow some screaming screwball to disrupt the enjoyment of music by hundreds of law abiding folks, night after night; place a (silent) plastic flamingo in your front yard and the authorities are all over it like a bad rash.

I’m sorry you are so upset about your plastic flamingos. Don’t take it out on people with disabilities tho. The two things are not related. He didn’t ask to be made the way he is; the same way you didn’t ask to be made….well you get the point. We are who we are with or without our flamingos.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

A note about sundowning by seniors. This is probably a lot more common problem for nightly entertainment than some man with Asperger's trying to enjoy himself in a public place.

How to Deal With Sundowners: Advice From Caregivers | CaringBridge (https://www.caringbridge.org/resources/how-to-deal-with-sundowners/?psafe_param=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIjMHMhfvC_gIVWSSzAB3-HAiaEAAYAiAAEgJyCfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds)

Sundowning and dementia | Alzheimer's Society (https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/about-dementia/symptoms-and-diagnosis/symptoms/sundowning)

Good info. Do you have any regarding online bullies who fixate on people with a disability?

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

His right to enjoy the music ends when he deprives others of their enjoyment.

Well you can always enjoy TV at home. I personally enjoy him so not everyone finds him unenjoyable.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

No one should be forced to leave because another person is disruptive.

There have been a number of threads about him. Seems his screaming goes above just being enthusiastic about the music.

A number of threads? Who says only teenagers participate in cyber bullying? I’m so embarrassed for all of you who can’t get over your feelings without taking a man down anonymously online. The fact he still leaves his home and goes to the square after all the negative slander is the most amazing thing about this post. Grow up people!

[msilagy]

God Bless Mark.

[mikeycereal]

A number of threads? Who says only teenagers participate in cyber bullying? I’m so embarrassed for all of you who can’t get over your feelings without taking a man down anonymously online. The fact he still leaves his home and hides to the square after all the negative slander is the most amazing thing about this post. Grow up people!

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

screaming

adjective: screaming
1.
giving a long, loud, piercing cry or cries.
"a harassed parent with a screaming child"

screaming definition - Google Search (https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=screaming+definition&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8)


"screwball noun [C] (PERSON)


mainly US informal
a person who behaves in a strange and funny way"

SCREWBALL | definition in the Cambridge English Dictionary (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/screwball)

Screaming screwball is not misdescriptive of this individual but apt.

The squares are indeed "open to the public" and in that sense are a "public place".

Most Villagers are aware the landscaping rights of owners are subject to restrictive covenants.

You are getting good at name calling. The definitions really help make your point in case just calling him names was not enough.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

A disturbance of any kind and for any reason is not universally accepted or appreciated. What if he was similarly demonstrative at the Sharon for a performance of Swan Lake. He screams, the swan hits the floor with a broken ankle. It could be a scream at the square that causes a new visitor to lose their balance, trip and end up with a broken hip.

Ya but that didn’t happen so we can’t discuss what ifs. That’s just trying to turn the situation something it isn’t because of personal fear and discomfort.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

1. His name is Mark.
2. He is on the autism spectrum as high functioning.
3. He is caretaker for his mom.
4. He doesn't have a cart. He walks from one of the villa areas nearby.
5. His yelling lasts around 20 minutes in total, out of the 4-hour performance.
6. Usually it's a beat count "One Two Three Four!" and then he dances around for awhile before his next one. Sometimes he gets so into the music he shouts again inbetween his counts.
7. He gives amazing hugs and smells of patchouli.
8. He carries a backpack with him, filled mostly with water in a jug from which he hydrates often. This is good, because he sweats a LOT while dancing around the square like that.
9. Whenever I see him out and about during the day, I always stop to say hello and get one of his hugs. He - always thanks me for taking a moment to stop and communicate with him, and has mentioned that many people are afraid of him. This makes him very sad, because he is who he is. Just like people with tourettes' syndrome have ticks and twitches and sometimes blurt out inappropriate words, he has that reaction when he's really into music. He gets lost in the sounds, and it makes him feel alive and energized, and shouting is how he expresses it.
10. He also sometimes goes on "twirling" binges, where he'll actually twirl even while he's walking to the square from his mom's house. This is a self-soothing activity for some people with autism. What's amazing is he never gets dizzy doing it and can maintain a twirl for many minutes without stopping.
11. If you don't like noise, don't go to the square and be sure to pad your home with plenty of soundproofing.

You are my new favorite person! Thanks for standing up for the voiceless and defenseless! Xoxo

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

“And most of the people also watching do not have a problem with his yelling”. Most people are sheeple and will not say anything, no matter what is happening.

Ya they won’t say anything publicly, but they will under the invisible cloak of anonymous posting.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

They are fearful of the PC police.

They are fearful of the PC police? How do you know this? What data (besides your opinion, which isn’t data) do you have to back up this claim?

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

Totally avoided the question. Nice side step.
But, back to my question. Mark has a "condition" that he can't control. He acts out in certain ways that bring him unwanted attention. He is (we assume) aware that the stimuli of the sights and sounds at the music venues trigger his actions that elicit the looks and comments that make him unhappy. Knowing all this, one wonders why he continues to choose to expose himself to stimuli that will trigger his episodes and, ultimately, make him unhappy? Is it like a drug that gives you a temporary high that you know is ultimately let you down? I know that after my third trip to emergency one hockey season, the doctor suggested I might want to quit hockey and take up a less painful game, like checkers. When I said, "or chess",she remarked that after three trips to emergency it was obvious I wasn't smart enough for chess.
So, why the need to go to a place where he doesn't want the looks or comments?

Have you seen the complete joy that fills him? His whole self responds to the stimuli. He obviously gets something out of it. He’s smarter than all of us because he has had a lifetime of dealing with people who judge and stare, yet somehow he has learned to still get out and enjoy the square fully. He is the one who should be on here complaining about all the rude people, but there he stands conducting, dancing and being.

[Marmaduke]

Really?

You're a very special advocate. You won't like my response either.

Think about it! Under ADA, current college professors now have to deal with Asperger's in their classrooms.

It's something I would find extremely disturbing when trying to enjoy an evening out, let alone while teaching a college level subject during a semester of 16 weeks.
Disruptions of barking and yelling throughout the fifty minute class session X 3 days a week, over the 16 weeks is the way a colleague described it.

Students ponder their fate in the new mainstream classroom where their work is 'expected' to be complete, but the Asperger's student has an 'advocate' to 'challenge' the professor all along the way.

Put into perspective- A professor friend had a son who was adopted. He has many abilities and he had Asperger's. The family realizes the need to adapt to the very specific needs of their son to enable him to live and enjoy life.

This distinguished professor started that she would never enroll her son in a college level class even though he was protected under ADA.

Too bad Mark doesn't have an advocate like that.

Is Mark the ONLY person with Aspergers in TV? Or are their advocates fully committed, like my dedicated and knowledgeable friend and her family?

[Santiagogirl]

There are a several offbeat 'regulars' who enjoy Spanish Springs Square. I consider that part of its charm. Mark seems to get carried away at times, but when he has spoken to us he has invariably been kind & polite. I am more annoyed by people allowing their small children to run around underfoot where adults are dancing - however, I don't rant about them. It's a public place. Live and let live.

[sajoe]

Whatever most people want to do about Mark I would also like to see be done to all the people who arrive at the squares in small groups that want to talk to each other over the music. Wouldn't it be more pleasant r to go to any of the parks and talk there instead of sitting behind me?

[happehart]

The people who mention Mark's golf cart are not being honest. He doesn't have a golf cart & lives within walking distance of the square. I understand that some people are annoyed by his actions but when one mis-states factual information that makes me question the entire entry.

[kendi]

After he leaves the square, the degree of visual and auditory stimulation is greatly reduced. Possibly that is why his behavior changes.

Concluding he can turn it on and off at will is a naive conclusion.

Thank you roob. The intolerance and disrespect shown through some of these comments is very sad. People choose to criticize rather than choosing to enjoy seeing another having fun. There is certainly a lot public ignorance of the Spectrum disorders.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Wel, toot toot! Your horn is working! ha ha hey I was on your side I brought up that it wasn’t the weed making him do that , but I should have also added something about his disability , , but please excuse my toot I get little tight when people start demonizing weed , it’s far better for you then many other vices , FYI I never smoked cigarettes

[Davonu]

There are many unique characters at the squares. Almost all are enjoyable to watch or easily ignored. But in my opinion, this character crosses the line. If you’ve ever seen him let out one of his blood curdling screams right behind an unsuspecting audience member, you should understand why. One person’s startled reaction right near another person swinging a wand. An incident waiting to happen.

But even just imposing that scream on others there to enjoy the square is not right. None of those other unique characters I mentioned impose themselves on the audience the way this guy does.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I have an Asperger's child. Screaming like that has nothing to do with Asperger's. They do have aggression issues sometimes if things don't go their way or you make them mad (melt downs). If this guy is just sitting there screaming for no reason (such as in a fit) then it's not Asperger's.

He isn't doing that. He's shouting out a countdown to the beat. And then on occasion he'll shout a "ah! ah! ah! ah!" instead of the countdown. And then, when the song is over, he'll shout exactly the way someone shouts when they're at a concert of their favorite band that just finished a kick-butt rendition of their favorite song. He doesn't do it for every song, he doesn't do it all night, he isn't even THERE all night. He usually gets there somewhere around 7, and leaves before 8:30, most nights. He doesn't do it at all when the band is on their break.

He also isn't there every night, some bands just don't attract his attention that others do.

What bothers me much MUCH more are the ones who sit directly behind me and talk non-stop for the entire time they're there, their voices raised so that they can hear each other over the sound of the music. We usually move, when that happens.

The seat-savers too. For THOSE folks - I'll sit down anyway and tell their "sister" that when her sibling and wife and neighbors and everyone else shows up, I'll gladly return the seat to them.

[Bob.Betty]

Certainly, if an individual stood in front of a performance stage and continuously screamed over the performers, that individual would be quickly ushered out of the venue. So, how many screams is acceptable? 200 per hour, 100 per hour? 50 per hour? Of course, out of respect for the band and the audience, the only acceptable and enforceable number is zero screams per hour.

We tried Spanish Springs again last night, unfortunately, the Screamer was there showing his disrespect worse than ever. If The Villages wants to revitalize Spanish Springs, perhaps they should begin by silencing the Screamer.

If you agree that zero screams per hour is the correct limit, please let the officials at the square know your feelings.

They should also not allow dogs, children and non-villagers inside the squares. And while we're at it no more line dancers. They just get in the way of those of us who just want to dance.

[fdpaq0580]

Have you seen the complete joy that fills him? His whole self responds to the stimuli. He obviously gets something out of it. He’s smarter than all of us because he has had a lifetime of dealing with people who judge and stare, yet somehow he has learned to still get out and enjoy the square fully. He is the one who should be on here complaining about all the rude people, but there he stands conducting, dancing and being.

So, if I understand correctly, Mark is able to do what none of us can do, consider the source and file it under "meaningless" and continue on his way.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Totally avoided the question. Nice side step.
But, back to my question. Mark has a "condition" that he can't control. He acts out in certain ways that bring him unwanted attention. He is (we assume) aware that the stimuli of the sights and sounds at the music venues trigger his actions that elicit the looks and comments that make him unhappy. Knowing all this, one wonders why he continues to choose to expose himself to stimuli that will trigger his episodes and, ultimately, make him unhappy? Is it like a drug that gives you a temporary high that you know is ultimately let you down? I know that after my third trip to emergency one hockey season, the doctor suggested I might want to quit hockey and take up a less painful game, like checkers. When I said, "or chess",she remarked that after three trips to emergency it was obvious I wasn't smart enough for chess.
So, why the need to go to a place where he doesn't want the looks or comments?

MOST of us who go to the square regularly, know Mark. All the bands know him. The bartenders in the tikki huts know him. Mark is a regular. When he's not around for a whole week at a time, we check with each other to see if any of us have seen him, because we worry for him. Just like the two folks in the cowboy hats and matching outfits who come from the Historic Side and do their couples line dance stuff for a set. The woman gets up when the canned announcement starts, and mimes out the announcement. Now, someone new to the square who doesn't realize she's a regular and LOVES the experience of being there, would say "yeah that's just a drama hog who wants the attention, she's disrupting the announcement that people should listen to, she's making fun of it, she shouldn't be allowed."

But everyone else - and by that I mean EVERYONE else - looks forward to her little performance, because it enhances the announcement and injects a little humor into it. She's not paid to do this, she just took it upon herself to do it one day, people thought it was great, so she's been doing it ever since.

Then there are those "hoppers" - the people with the spring boots that jump around. There's one woman with a pair of hoppers who looks like maybe once upon a time she knew ballet. She spins around with those things, and does kicks - and you have to be VERY careful when you're walking around, first showing up for your evening, if she's got those things on and is dancing. Otherwise you might get a leg in your face. That can be pretty disruptive too. In fact, the group of hoppers is pretty distracting - it takes our attention off the music and puts it on them. How rude and disrespectful!

And yet - they're getting their exercise and having a great time, and nothing they're doing is a barrier to the band continuing to play, and be heard, and to attract others to dancing and enjoying the music.

Mark is no different. He's not screaming, he's shouting, and he's doing it to the beat of the music. Oh and that conductor's baton? It was a gift from one of the other regulars who hangs out there. MOST people who go there, who've experienced Mark at least a few times, eventually realize he's reacting to music that fills him with joy.

For those "Christians" on this forum who might think otherwise, remember your Psalms:

"Make a joyful noise unto the LORD, all the earth: make a loud noise, and rejoice, and sing praise."

Mark is filled with joy. Maybe you should learn to be joyful with him. It'll do you some good.

[I'm Popeye!]

Is that your qualified medical opinion?

Is that your echo-human observation of someone just making a comment?

[Joe C.]

Wow! What a bunch of complainers. People should learn to give it a break. I go to the square quite often, and when I see Mark doing "his thing", all I can do is watch him until he disppears into the crowd. He is totally immersed in his own world, and enjoying himself.
As far as his screaming, well, that's what a lot of the performing bands do. He's nowhere as "loud" as most of the bands.
Good thing that there's not a gallows in the square, because it seems that lots of Villagers would like to use it. They would do well to pause and reflect that "There for the grace of God, go I".

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Really?

You're a very special advocate. You won't like my response either.

Think about it! Under ADA, current college professors now have to deal with Asperger's in their classrooms.

It's something I would find extremely disturbing when trying to enjoy an evening out, let alone while teaching a college level subject during a semester of 16 weeks.
Disruptions of barking and yelling throughout the fifty minute class session X 3 days a week, over the 16 weeks is the way a colleague described it.

Students ponder their fate in the new mainstream classroom where their work is 'expected' to be complete, but the Asperger's student has an 'advocate' to 'challenge' the professor all along the way.

Put into perspective- A professor friend had a son who was adopted. He has many abilities and he had Asperger's. The family realizes the need to adapt to the very specific needs of their son to enable him to live and enjoy life.

This distinguished professor started that she would never enroll her son in a college level class even though he was protected under ADA.

Too bad Mark doesn't have an advocate like that.

Is Mark the ONLY person with Aspergers in TV? Or are their advocates fully committed, like my dedicated and knowledgeable friend and her family?

He doesn't demonstrate /most/ of the symptoms of Asperger syndrome. He demonstrates SOME symptoms of high-functioning non-specific autism.

He has empathy. He will look you in the eye when he's talking to you. While he is not "touchy-feely" he is open to affection and sincere welcoming of touch as a method of communicating emotion (hugs, fist bumps, a pat on the shoulder, etc). People with Asperger Syndrome tend to not be responsive to any of that, and some will actively avoid it.

This "barking and shouting" you refer to sounds more like Tourette Syndrome, not Asperger Syndrome. People with Asperger, as long as they aren't in a situation where a lot of noise, stress, or crowding triggers a behavioral shift, will generally be very quiet, keep to themselves, and not make much noise at all. People with Tourette Syndrome will "bark and shout" randomly, often using vulgar words without any control at all. Medication can help but usually only reduces the severity or frequency of the outbursts. It doesn't stop it completely.

Mark is responding joyfully to music. That's all it is.

[jminnis]

He's a faker. The 'tell' is that he glances backward to see who's watching him. He is annoying. He has a milk carton of water to douse himself with. He is calm and polite, though, when pushing his mother in her wheelchair....

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

He's a faker. The 'tell' is that he glances backward to see who's watching him. He is annoying. He has a milk carton of water to douse himself with. He is calm and polite, though, when pushing his mother in her wheelchair....

He glances backward to make sure he doesn't bump into anyone. He is VERY aware of his surroundings.

It's not a milk carton. It's a gallon water jug. He mostly drinks from it. He's also calm and polite when the band takes a break, though sometimes he'll just continue twirling quietly.

[Gator_Girl]

If you pretend you are recording him on your phone he will move away, this has worked for me a few times.

[Taltarzac725]

MOST of us who go to the square regularly, know Mark. All the bands know him. The bartenders in the tikki huts know him. Mark is a regular. When he's not around for a whole week at a time, we check with each other to see if any of us have seen him, because we worry for him. Just like the two folks in the cowboy hats and matching outfits who come from the Historic Side and do their couples line dance stuff for a set. The woman gets up when the canned announcement starts, and mimes out the announcement. Now, someone new to the square who doesn't realize she's a regular and LOVES the experience of being there, would say "yeah that's just a drama hog who wants the attention, she's disrupting the announcement that people should listen to, she's making fun of it, she shouldn't be allowed."

But everyone else - and by that I mean EVERYONE else - looks forward to her little performance, because it enhances the announcement and injects a little humor into it. She's not paid to do this, she just took it upon herself to do it one day, people thought it was great, so she's been doing it ever since.

Then there are those "hoppers" - the people with the spring boots that jump around. There's one woman with a pair of hoppers who looks like maybe once upon a time she knew ballet. She spins around with those things, and does kicks - and you have to be VERY careful when you're walking around, first showing up for your evening, if she's got those things on and is dancing. Otherwise you might get a leg in your face. That can be pretty disruptive too. In fact, the group of hoppers is pretty distracting - it takes our attention off the music and puts it on them. How rude and disrespectful!

And yet - they're getting their exercise and having a great time, and nothing they're doing is a barrier to the band continuing to play, and be heard, and to attract others to dancing and enjoying the music.

Mark is no different. He's not screaming, he's shouting, and he's doing it to the beat of the music. Oh and that conductor's baton? It was a gift from one of the other regulars who hangs out there. MOST people who go there, who've experienced Mark at least a few times, eventually realize he's reacting to music that fills him with joy.

For those "Christians" on this forum who might think otherwise, remember your Psalms:

"Make a joyful noise unto the LORD, all the earth: make a loud noise, and rejoice, and sing praise."

Mark is filled with joy. Maybe you should learn to be joyful with him. It'll do you some good.

Good to see that information posted.

[Kittycat2]

So nice to get your diagnosis Dr aviator1211. Why condemn and criticize those who do not fit the cookie cutter mold.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

Really?

You're a very special advocate. You won't like my response either.

Think about it! Under ADA, current college professors now have to deal with Asperger's in their classrooms.

It's something I would find extremely disturbing when trying to enjoy an evening out, let alone while teaching a college level subject during a semester of 16 weeks.
Disruptions of barking and yelling throughout the fifty minute class session X 3 days a week, over the 16 weeks is the way a colleague described it.

Students ponder their fate in the new mainstream classroom where their work is 'expected' to be complete, but the Asperger's student has an 'advocate' to 'challenge' the professor all along the way.

Put into perspective- A professor friend had a son who was adopted. He has many abilities and he had Asperger's. The family realizes the need to adapt to the very specific needs of their son to enable him to live and enjoy life.

This distinguished professor started that she would never enroll her son in a college level class even though he was protected under ADA.

Too bad Mark doesn't have an advocate like that.

Is Mark the ONLY person with Aspergers in TV? Or are their advocates fully committed, like my dedicated and knowledgeable friend and her family?

Your distinguished professor friend might have been concerned about how her son would emotionally manage all the unkind behavior he would deal with. She might have also been concerned for her own career as a professor, not wanting to experience the embarrassment of colleagues’ commentary. Ultimately, we don’t really know the whole story because it’s her story. I don’t think it’s fair to assume that people with disabilities don’t deserve education and to say that is being an advocate for them. Some on the spectrum graduate valedictorian of the college class as did one of my own.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

Whatever most people want to do about Mark I would also like to see be done to all the people who arrive at the squares in small groups that want to talk to each other over the music. Wouldn't it be more pleasant r to go to any of the parks and talk there instead of sitting behind me?

I don’t think “most” people wish Mark harm. Maybe it’s just a few bad apples.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

ha ha hey I was on your side I brought up that it wasn’t the weed making him do that , but I should have also added something about his disability , , but please excuse my toot I get little tight when people start demonizing weed , it’s far better for you then many other vices , FYI I never smoked cigarettes

Ah shucks. Well, let’s make peace. Got a toke? Jk I’ll take a good cigar tho.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

Is that your echo-human observation of someone just making a comment?

It was a question, no observation was provided. My advice and observation is this, however: If you are going to make medical statements about another person’s medical condition, without being a certified medical provider, you could perhaps be seen as someone who is lacking in credibility and basis. To get people to care about an opinion, one needs to build a fact base to support that idea. For instance, identifying 15 comments on this thread as biased statements that lack facts is a way for someone to prove that 15 trolls are attacking an innocent man.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

There are many unique characters at the squares. Almost all are enjoyable to watch or easily ignored. But in my opinion, this character crosses the line. If you’ve ever seen him let out one of his blood curdling screams right behind an unsuspecting audience member, you should understand why. One person’s startled reaction right near another person swinging a wand. An incident waiting to happen.

But even just imposing that scream on others there to enjoy the square is not right. None of those other unique characters I mentioned impose themselves on the audience the way this guy does.

You are warming my heart today Joe! Thanks for standing up. You did your good deed for today.

[Aces4]

I find this to be one of the most disturbing threads I’ve read on TOTV.

Hats off to the compassionate people who have supported this disabled gentleman and treated him kindly. For the other self-serving, navel inspecting crowd.. there is Karma.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

If you pretend you are recording him on your phone he will move away, this has worked for me a few times.

That feels invasive.I would also recoil. Perhaps you could just walk away from him instead?

[asianthree]

A disturbance of any kind and for any reason is not universally accepted or appreciated. What if he was similarly demonstrative at the Sharon for a performance of Swan Lake. He screams, the swan hits the floor with a broken ankle. It could be a scream at the square that causes a new visitor to lose their balance, trip and end up with a broken hip.

So I am guessing you have little knowledge of professional performers. Our Granddaughter, while performing solo point, with an audience of 500, during a 5’ high leap broke her point shoe at landing. Did she break an ankle no, but continued to finish her performance with a broken shoe. If someone is performing Swan, a light crash down on the stage , and they would still continue, just avoid the mess:clap2: Have seen that happen couple times.

A visitor has a better percentage of falling from a child, or trip walking up the stairs, or catch their foot on a chair, than Mark, or a screaming child causing them to fall. And one would not have to be “New” to do so.

[JMintzer]

I have not found that true at all.

It's very true. It's human nature...

Murder of Kitty Genovese - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Kitty_Genovese)

[JMintzer]

Is that your qualified medical opinion?

Just as qualified as most of the other "medical" opinions...

[JMintzer]

You mean the same way anonymous posters are bold about thinking they are qualified to medically diagnose and talk about someone’s health publicly?

You mean pretty much everyone on this thread?

[JMintzer]

He can control Asperger’s about as well as people on this thread can control their judgy comments. Judgement is a terrible disease. It’s also on public display on this thread, the Villages online square. I can picture all of the judgy posters holding their pointing sticks while they make thei judgy comments. Looks like we have a lot of town square screamers.

That's very judgmental of you...

[JMintzer]

Yes! God forbid. I have to put up with all the snarky judgy people who complain about every little thing that offends their sensibilities on this public forum!

https://learnenglishwithdemi.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/88aa5a9708fe10faa3529b8420fc07aa.jpg

[Escape Artist]

It seems that half the commenters here think Mark is just fine and his screaming is a normal expression of who he is as a man on the ASD spectrum.The other half are irritated and upset by his presence and actions as they can’t have an enjoyable evening listening to music and relaxing if there are loud shouts and screams. Both arguments have merit so maybe there should be a middle ground approach on this.

Also, there have been other threads about disruptive or odd people at the squares that upset some people and delight others. I guess this is just the inevitable byproduct of the “village square” concept in a community of over 100,000 people in a free and heterogeneous society.

[Dlpdo]

I would like to see that doctors diagnosis. He is in full control of his faculties. He used to stay near the fountain with no screaming. He just craves attention and has become much bolder over the years. Clearly, not Asperger's.

I would like to see your medical degree that might indicate you are competent to have an opinion.

[sandyblanquera@gmail.com]

https://learnenglishwithdemi.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/88aa5a9708fe10faa3529b8420fc07aa.jpg

You continue to make it personal, attacking me nonstop. First you copied all my posts into a thread and shared it…except the posts you didn’t like. I was lighthearted about it. Then you called me a troll for standing up to bullies. Again I kept it light. Then you posted about five more personal attacks. You are such a stalker dude. Not cool. Back off.

[JMintzer]

You continue to make it personal, attacking me nonstop. First you copied all my posts into a thread and shared it…except the posts you didn’t like. I was lighthearted about it. Then you called me a troll for standing up to bullies. Again I kept it light. Then you posted about five more personal attacks. You are such a stalker dude. Not cool. Back off.

Sage advice, you should take it...

[Taltarzac725]

People should watch Rain Man again if they have not seen it before.

Rain Man - Rotten Tomatoes (https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/rain_man)

I do think watching movies especially good ones like Rain Man creates empathy.

[Whitley]

https://learnenglishwithdemi.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/88aa5a9708fe10faa3529b8420fc07aa.jpg

When did this go off the rails.

[bark4me]

I would like to see that doctors diagnosis. He is in full control of his faculties. He used to stay near the fountain with no screaming. He just craves attention and has become much bolder over the years. Clearly, not Asperger's.
I'd like to see your doctors diagnosis to see what your major malfunction is.

[Whitley]

I'd like to see your doctors diagnosis to see what your major malfunction is.

Never put much credit to any argument that suggests one need a medical license to have an opinion on a case. As a parent who can read, I know fever, dry cough, runny nose, light sensitivity, brownish red patches or dots that start by the head/neck and move down the body would be indicative of measles. No medical degree.
Have fun everyone. Life is short.

[fdpaq0580]

Ah shucks. Well, let’s make peace. Got a toke? Jk I’ll take a good cigar tho.

No such thing, imho.

[fdpaq0580]

So I am guessing you have little knowledge of professional performers. Our Granddaughter, while performing solo point, with an audience of 500, during a 5’ high leap broke her point shoe at landing. Did she break an ankle no, but continued to finish her performance with a broken shoe. If someone is performing Swan, a light crash down on the stage , and they would still continue, just avoid the mess:clap2: Have seen that happen couple times.

A visitor has a better percentage of falling from a child, or trip walking up the stairs, or catch their foot on a chair, than Mark, or a screaming child causing them to fall. And one would not have to be “New” to do so.

You guess wrong. But, that is beside the point.
Not every performer, of any kind, appreciates distractions during a performance. Depending on the difficulty or level of concentration required distractions can cause mistakes or failures regardless of whether it is intentional or not. There is nothing wrong with not liking to be surprised or startled or shocked. It's part of our instinct for self preservation. Not liking the act has nothing to do with having empathy for the actor. One can still love thy neighbor even though his unconscious whistling causes your ears to bleed.

[fdpaq0580]

That's very judgmental of you...

Actually, we are all judging all the time. Is it safe, dangerous, hot, cold, light, dark, fast, slow. Is it sweet, sour, bad, good, tall, short, etc.
We judge everything all the time. It is one of the aspects of our instinct for self preservation. Like, can I make it to that tree before that lion gets me?