Tipping

[Michael G.]

Do waitresses in restaurant's around TV share their tips?

[retiredguy123]

It depends on the restaurant. Tip pooling is legal, but only among tipped employees. Some people say that tips are shared with the kitchen and bussing staff, but that is illegal according to Federal law.

[Gpsma]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.

[Kenswing]

It never ends. :1rotfl::1rotfl:

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

It depends on the restaurant. Tip pooling is legal, but only among tipped employees. Some people say that tips are shared with the kitchen and bussing staff, but that is illegal according to Federal law.

Just because it's illegal doesn't mean they don't do it. At Gator's Dockside, all tips that are on debit/credit cards get pooled by wait staff, bartenders, hosts, and kitchen staff for the shift.

Give your wait staff their tip in cash, and make sure to hand it to them personally. Otherwise - it'll be pooled.

[Bill1701]

Just because it's illegal doesn't mean they don't do it. At Gator's Dockside, all tips that are on debit/credit cards get pooled by wait staff, bartenders, hosts, and kitchen staff for the shift.

Give your wait staff their tip in cash, and make sure to hand it to them personally. Otherwise - it'll be pooled.

That's nice in theory, but many of us do not use cash anymore.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.

Because if their tips, combined with their wages, equals the state minimum wage, then it's as if they didn't get any tip at all. The most they can get - if you UNDER-tip, is $11/hour. Even if they work their butts off, go beyond the minimum requirements of their job to give you outstanding customer service, and have earned more - they will have nothing to show for that extra work. Tip them substandard, and you should expect substandard service.

Their hourly wage is LESS than minimum wage. Their tips are expected to compensate for that, in this state. In many other states, the tip is intended to show appreciation for doing MORE than the minimum requirement for the job. Some restaurant policies also start their wait staff at minimum or better, with the tips being theirs to keep if they earn them.

It's an incentive for GOOD wait staff to show up and serve you.

[retiredguy123]

That's nice in theory, but many of us do not use cash anymore.
I only use cash in a restaurant. If restaurants want me to use a credit card, they need to provide a card transaction machine at the table and do not charge me an extra fee (one example is Chili's). In that case, I will use a credit card. But, whatever payment method I use, I will not use a different method for the tip. If the restaurant owner is stealing tip income from the server, that is an issue between the server and the owner. I wonder how the restaurant explains their W-2 employee income forms to the IRS, when they are stealing money from tipped employees to pay non-tipped employees.

[kansasr]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.

And then watch people bitch when prices are raised to provide employees with a livable wage!

[retiredguy123]

Because if their tips, combined with their wages, equals the state minimum wage, then it's as if they didn't get any tip at all. The most they can get - if you UNDER-tip, is $11/hour. Even if they work their butts off, go beyond the minimum requirements of their job to give you outstanding customer service, and have earned more - they will have nothing to show for that extra work. Tip them substandard, and you should expect substandard service.

Their hourly wage is LESS than minimum wage. Their tips are expected to compensate for that, in this state. In many other states, the tip is intended to show appreciation for doing MORE than the minimum requirement for the job. Some restaurant policies also start their wait staff at minimum or better, with the tips being theirs to keep if they earn them.

It's an incentive for GOOD wait staff to show up and serve you.
Why should you expect substandard service if you don't tip? It doesn't work that way in other businesses. Everyone should get at least the standard service.

[BrianL99]

Just because it's illegal doesn't mean they don't do it. At Gator's Dockside, all tips that are on debit/credit cards get pooled by wait staff, bartenders, hosts, and kitchen staff for the shift.

Give your wait staff their tip in cash, and make sure to hand it to them personally. Otherwise - it'll be pooled.

In Tip Sharing arrangements, all "Tips" going into the "pool", regardless of if they are paid in cash or as part of a credit card/debit card transaction.

Employees who are not traditionally tipped (dishwashers/cooks/etc are allowed to participate in Tip Pooling arrangements, under some circumstances.

Managers cannot participate in a Tip Pool, but are allowed to keep Tips they receive, provided they are paid for service provided by the manage alone.

Federal Register
::
Tip Regulations Under the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA); Partial Withdrawal (https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/09/24/2021-19795/tip-regulations-under-the-fair-labor-standards-act-flsa-partial-withdrawal)

[retiredguy123]

In Tip Sharing arrangements, all "Tips" going into the "pool", regardless of if they are paid in cash or as part of a credit card/debit card transaction.

Employees who are not traditionally tipped (dishwashers/cooks/etc are allowed to participate in Tip Pooling arrangements, under some circumstances.

Managers cannot participate in a Tip Pool, but are allowed to keep Tips they receive, provided they are paid for service provided by the manage alone.

Federal Register
::
Tip Regulations Under the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA); Partial Withdrawal (https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/09/24/2021-19795/tip-regulations-under-the-fair-labor-standards-act-flsa-partial-withdrawal)
The only circumstance where non-tipped employees can receive tip pool income is the following:

"an employer that pays tipped employees the full minimum wage and does not take a tip credit may require tipped employees to share tips with dishwashers, cooks, or other employees who are not employed in an occupation in which employees customarily and regularly receive tips"

I don't think that applies in most restaurants because typically, they do not pay servers the full minimum wage. But, as a general rule, tips received by a server are the property of the server, not the restaurant.

[Michael G.]

That's nice in theory, but many of us do not use cash anymore.

If their tips are cash, minimum taxes are do and many are reported.
If tips are added to a credit card, all taxes apply.

Also, is it rude to ask your waiter if tips are pooled or not?

[retiredguy123]

If their tips are cash, minimum taxes are do and many are reported.
If tips are added to a credit card, all taxes apply.

Also, is it rude to ask your waiter if tips are pooled or not?
Restaurant servers get special tax treatment from the IRS, called the 8 percent rule. The restaurant is required to calculate 8 percent of the restaurant's gross income, and prorate that amount to each server's W-2 income form as tip income. Then, the server can either report and pay income tax on that amount, or they can report a lesser amount and be subject to an IRS audit. So, even if they make more than 8 percent in tips, they only need to pay tax on the calculated 8 percent, and they will not be audited.

[BrianL99]

If their tips are cash, minimum taxes are do and many are reported.
If tips are added to a credit card, all taxes apply.

Also, is it rude to ask your waiter if tips are pooled or not?

Unless a restaurant is a "one off" (local, family owned), you can usually assume that Tips are shared. It's simply not practical to run a restaurant any other way. Tips are taxed just like any other pay, which is another reason pooling tips are more efficient for owners ... the tips are reported and the owner is off the hook.

[Rainger99]

Even if they work their butts off, go beyond the minimum requirements of their job to give you outstanding customer service, and have earned more - they will have nothing to show for that extra work. Tip them substandard, and you should expect substandard service.

What is the difference between substandard service, the minimum requirements, and outstanding service?

I have never worked in a restaurant but I used to work in a customer service position and I always tried to give outstanding service to everyone that came into the store. I never thought that I should provide substandard service or even just provide the minimum requirements.

[Velvet]

I don’t have a problem with pooled tipping as long as the owner does not take a cut. All the staff has worked for our meals even if we only see the waitress/waiter and they are ALL deserving, in my opinion. But since the owner sets the prices and the wages, they can adjust them therefore, no tip for the owner.

[BrianL99]

I don’t have a problem with pooled tipping as long as the owner does not take a cut. All the staff has worked for our meals even if we only see the waitress/waiter and they are ALL deserving, in my opinion. But since the owner sets the prices and the wages, they can adjust them therefore, no tip for the owner.

Owners & Managers can't participate in Tip Pools. Read the link I provided earlier in the thread. It's against Federal Law.

[Tvflguy]

Oh goodie. A Thread about a topic that has never been broached here.

Sooooo interesting and fresh.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Why should you expect substandard service if you don't tip? It doesn't work that way in other businesses. Everyone should get at least the standard service.

Because other businesses pay the current state minimum wage, which is $11/hour. Restaurant owners are only required to pay their tipped employees $7.98/hour minimum, and the tips are counted toward the $11/hour state minimum. If their tips don't combine with the $7.98 to make that $11/hour, then the restaurant has to kick in the difference - resulting in tipped wait staff earning as little as $11/hour - state minimum - even if they're getting tips from customers.

I would never work for tips as someone's employee, if those tips weren't on TOP of minimum wage. Customers don't owe me my day's wages, that's the restaurant owner's responsibility. If he can't afford to pay a waiter $11/hour, allowing the waiters to not count tips toward their hourly minimum wage, then he can't afford to have waiters.

Even when I was busking in Boston exclusively for tips, I earned more than minimum wage.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Owners & Managers can't participate in Tip Pools. Read the link I provided earlier in the thread. It's against Federal Law.

They might not be ALLOWED - but that doesn't mean they CAN'T. May, shall, must, may not, cannot, must not, will, will not - these all have very specific meanings.

I am not allowed to run a red light. But there's nothing actually stopping me from doing so, if I really wanted to. I CAN run a red light. I am not allowed to, but I most definitely can.

Owners and managers aren't supposed to take the tip money, and kitchen staff and any other staff that works for minimum wage or better, shouldn't be getting a portion of tips from wait staff who earns less than minimum wage without those tips.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I don’t have a problem with pooled tipping as long as the owner does not take a cut. All the staff has worked for our meals even if we only see the waitress/waiter and they are ALL deserving, in my opinion. But since the owner sets the prices and the wages, they can adjust them therefore, no tip for the owner.

Kitchen staff all get minimum wage or better. Wait staff gets LESS than minimum wage, because they are expected to make up the difference with tips.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

What is the difference between substandard service, the minimum requirements, and outstanding service?

I have never worked in a restaurant but I used to work in a customer service position and I always tried to give outstanding service to everyone that came into the store. I never thought that I should provide substandard service or even just provide the minimum requirements.

You really need examples? Maybe you didn't have very good customer service skills, if you don't know the difference. But sure here's some examples:

Substandard customer service for wait staff:
Not coming back a few minutes after serving the meal to make sure they don't need anything - more napkins, top off the water glass, check on the first couple bites of their meal, etc.

Standard customer service for wait staff: making sure the orders are taken correctly, and if there's a delay in serving, then communicating that - along with an apology - to the customer.

Good customer service for wait staff: noticing that a customer at a table NOT assigned to them, just dropped their napkin and immediately replacing it instead of making the customer wait for their own waiter to handle it.

Excellent customer service for wait staff: upon learning from their customer that it's their birthday, bringing the manager over to express a personal "happy birthday" on behalf of the restaurant to the customer. With or without a free dessert.

[retiredguy123]

Personally, I think that if people stopped tipping servers completely, the service in restaurants would get better, not worse. Restaurants would need to hire better employees, pay them more, and they would have more control over their performance. I agree with the poster who said that tipping is nonsense.

[fdpaq0580]

One of the questions that is never truly addressed is this, "what really constitutes complete, proper, good old C grade customer service?" Personally, I expect the staff to be business like but pleasant. Take my food and drink order. Bring the order and verify it is correct before withdrawing. Make at least one check mid-meal to see if we require anything else. Finally, observe when we are finished and bring us the correct bill and follow the restaurants payment protocol. Worse might include rudeness, wrong order, wanting to be overly friendly, or wanting to tell us about their day, and my pet peeve, after ignoring us until we are ready to send out a search party for the server, they show up with fresh drinks that you didn't order just so you will think they were paying attention.
And if they earned a good, solid C, they need do no more. Being mildly attentive (warming your coffee, for example) but not intrusive is good. Too much attention (hovering over you) is intrusive and annoying.
Outstanding customer service? Remember, this is normal average waiter/waitress. Seriously, what is there for them to do in a restaurant? Heinrich maneuver if I start choking, wash my car while I'm eating, or donate a kidney if mine should fail while I'm at their restaurant. Really, "outstanding" service! What can it possibly be in your neighborhood Bob Evans or Chili's?

[Velvet]

One of the questions that is never truly addressed is this, "what really constitutes complete, proper, good old C grade customer service?" Personally, I expect the staff to be business like but pleasant. Take my food and drink order. Bring the order and verify it is correct before withdrawing. Make at least one check mid-meal to see if we require anything else. Finally, observe when we are finished and bring us the correct bill and follow the restaurants payment protocol. Worse might include rudeness, wrong order, wanting to be overly friendly, or wanting to tell us about their day, and my pet peeve, after ignoring us until we are ready to send out a search party for the server, they show up with fresh drinks that you didn't order just so you will think they were paying attention.
And if they earned a good, solid C, they need do no more. Being mildly attentive (warming your coffee, for example) but not intrusive is good. Too much attention (hovering over you) is intrusive and annoying.
Outstanding customer service? Remember, this is normal average waiter/waitress. Seriously, what is there for them to do in a restaurant? Heinrich maneuver if I start choking, wash my car while I'm eating, or donate a kidney if mine should fail while I'm at their restaurant. Really, "outstanding" service! What can it possibly be in your neighborhood Bob Evans or Chili's?

When I am ready and check is nowhere in sight I get up ready to leave walk by the front desk and mention I have to leave now. Lo and behold, the check appears immediately, before I step out the door. Not that I have to do that often, but it works.

[Two Bills]

Many restaurants in UK have stopped taking orders at your table.
On arrival you are seated and given menus, and after making your choice you order at the bar, and pay at same time.
Many establishments also have their own apps, and you can order and pay from cell, without leaving your table.
Less staff needed to bring food to tables.
Tipping is disappearing with this type of system as nearly all meals are paid with contactless payment.

[westernrider75]

Unless a restaurant is a "one off" (local, family owned), you can usually assume that Tips are shared. It's simply not practical to run a restaurant any other way. Tips are taxed just like any other pay, which is another reason pooling tips are more efficient for owners ... the tips are reported and the owner is off the hook.

I would disagree, I have worked in several chain restaurants and never tip pooled. Out of my tips I did have to tip the bartender for service bar and food runners if there was one on schedule that shift, but never pooled tips.

[Topgun 1776]

Once again, a post about tipping. Apparently, from a waiter or waitress. Give great service, you get a tip. Don't and you won't. Next subject, please.

[Andyhope]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.
Sorry to disagree with you. If you only tip 5%, maybe you should just eat at home

[banjobob]

I don’t have answer but I always tip at 20% for good service , more if exceptional service. I give the tip in cash to my server.

[Sandy and Ed]

It never ends. :1rotfl::1rotfl:
Somewhat agree. Personally I don’t agree on a percentage basis for a tip. Took just as much to bring over a $15 plate of liver and onions as a $45 plate of filet mignon. In any case who the heck came up with the idea of putting a recommended tip on the bill?? .

[Kelevision]

It depends on the restaurant. Tip pooling is legal, but only among tipped employees. Some people say that tips are shared with the kitchen and bussing staff, but that is illegal according to Federal law.

Wait staff A.) get taxed on 15% of their sales ( that may have risen to 20, I’m not sure) so if they get less than that, they’re actually paying taxes on money they didn’t make. It’s automatically deducted from their sales at the end of a shift. B.) they have to tip out what’s called tip share which goes to helpers like bartenders and bussers and the kitchen expeditor.

[Sandy and Ed]

I don’t have answer but I always tip at 20% for good service , more if exceptional service. I give the tip in cash to my server.
Great!! Makes up for my max of 15%! Thanks for covering for me

[Sandy and Ed]

Wait staff A.) get taxed on 15% of their sales ( that may have risen to 20, I’m not sure) so if they get less than that, they’re actually paying taxes on money they didn’t make. It’s automatically deducted from their sales at the end of a shift. B.) they have to tip out what’s called tip share which goes to helpers like bartenders and bussers and the kitchen expeditor.
Ok. Two contradicting comments. Which is gospel in Florida?

[Nevinator]

Somewhat agree. Personally I don’t agree on a percentage basis for a tip. Took just as much to bring over a $15 plate of liver and onions as a $45 plate of filet mignon. In any case who the heck came up with the idea of putting a recommended tip on the bill?? .
I generally tip 20%, but the suggested tip amount, usually referenced with several examples at 15, 18, and 20% seem to be calculated differently at various restaurants. Some simply calculate the tip amounts based on the cost of the meal; others calculate the tip based on the “final bill” amount which includes all state/county taxes and sometimes some other fees.

I never include the taxes and other fees as a part of my bill for the purpose of tipping.

[BrianL99]

Wait staff A.) get taxed on 15% of their sales ( that may have risen to 20, I’m not sure) so if they get less than that, they’re actually paying taxes on money they didn’t make. It’s automatically deducted from their sales at the end of a shift. B.) they have to tip out what’s called tip share which goes to helpers like bartenders and bussers and the kitchen expeditor.

Do you know if the moon is still made out of green cheese?

[Bill14564]

Wait staff A.) get taxed on 15% of their sales ( that may have risen to 20, I’m not sure) so if they get less than that, they’re actually paying taxes on money they didn’t make. It’s automatically deducted from their sales at the end of a shift. B.) they have to tip out what’s called tip share which goes to helpers like bartenders and bussers and the kitchen expeditor.

Ok. Two contradicting comments. Which is gospel in Florida?

Neither are gospel in Florida. IRS rules are not that simple.

Tipped employees are required to report the amount of tips they receive to their employer. Reported tips are taxed as wages (makes sense).

Most businesses with tipped employees are required to determine if a reasonable amount of tips (8% per IRS 8027) were reported through the year. If not (if it looks like tips were under-reported) then at the end of the year they are required to perform a calculation based on a percentage of sales and "allocate" additional tips to employees on the W-2 form. The employee then can pay taxes on these allocated tips or provide sufficient documentation that they did not actually receive these tips.

"Tipping out" is a policy of an individual business. It is probably common practice for waiters to share tips with bussers and bartenders but I don't believe it is law (or gospel).

[Ski Bum]

For those 0%-15% tippers out there, just be sure to inform your wait staff of that when you sit down. If you are too embarrassed, just stay home.

[Bill14564]

Somewhat agree. Personally I don’t agree on a percentage basis for a tip. Took just as much to bring over a $15 plate of liver and onions as a $45 plate of filet mignon. In any case who the heck came up with the idea of putting a recommended tip on the bill?? .

Someone who saw Americans trying to do math in their heads.

[retiredguy123]

Note that no one is required to pay income tax on tips that they did not earn. The IRS rule for servers is 8 percent of gross restaurant sales. A server can declare a lesser amount when they file their tax return, but they need to be prepared to prove it to the IRS, with contemporaneous records, if they are audited.

[jparsoneau@aol.com]

Leaving a 5% tip should be shameful

[Chamo]

Disgusting to only tip 5%. You should be ashamed of yourself. You should just stay home and cook for yourself and clean up your own mess.

[rickaslin]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.

I hope the local wait staff see your comment on 5% tipping and give you the sevice that you deserve!!

[jimkerr]

I always tip a minimum of 20% for any food establishment. Some restaurants take the 3% credit card fee they get charged out of the wait staffs tips. FMK does this for example. I tried to get an explanation from FMK on their Facebook page, they deleted my comment. :)

[Pennyt]

And then watch people bitch when prices are raised to provide employees with a livable wage!

I think they do more than "just bring a plate over." A 5% tip is way way low considering these people are paid less than minimum wage. 15 - 20% tip would be considered standard.

[Chi-Town]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.

Mr. Pink would be proud of you.

[Pennyt]

5% tip? Way too low for someone who makes less than minimum wage! 15-20% would be considered standard. Unless the service was horrible, I would be embarrassed to leave a tip of 5%.

[Whitley]

Because if their tips, combined with their wages, equals the state minimum wage, then it's as if they didn't get any tip at all. The most they can get - if you UNDER-tip, is $11/hour. Even if they work their butts off, go beyond the minimum requirements of their job to give you outstanding customer service, and have earned more - they will have nothing to show for that extra work. Tip them substandard, and you should expect substandard service.

Their hourly wage is LESS than minimum wage. Their tips are expected to compensate for that, in this state. In many other states, the tip is intended to show appreciation for doing MORE than the minimum requirement for the job. Some restaurant policies also start their wait staff at minimum or better, with the tips being theirs to keep if they earn them.

It's an incentive for GOOD wait staff to show up and serve you.

So then do you not tip at Starbucks, chinese take out, to go orders?

[Gullwing]

Do waitresses in restaurant's around TV share their tips?

A new twist. We were at a restaurant in Fredrick Maryland. When you entered they swiped your credit card and gave you a card to use. There is a wall of taps. You put their card in a spot at the tap you want, your name comes up and you pour what you want. It measures by the tenth of an ounce and displays your price. Very much like a gas pump. The beverages range from beer to cocktails to wine. You go to a small counter to order food. They swipe the card and text you when it’s ready. When done eating you buss your table.
No waitress, buss boys. Just minimum staff. The place was busy.

[Whitley]

Do you know if the moon is still made out of green cheese?

Why would it not be? Do you know something?

[Whitley]

In my life, suggested tip has gone from 10%, to 12%, to 15%, to 20% and now I am seeing "suggested" tips options including 25%.

My wife and I go out each Saturday. The bill averages between 100.00-125.00. For 90 minutes I am tipping 20.00 to 25.00. This is on top of the low wage, but in addition to other tips he/she is working. At the one location I can easily see them pulling in 100.00 plus an hour. At a less expensive restaurant it can cost 30.00 to 45.00. Same work the tip would be 6.00 to 9.00.
I think 20% min is high. I think having a percentage is unfair to people working at lower ticket locations. For a $3.50 coffee I will tip $5.00. It really is a messed up system. We are now seeing, at self check-outs, a tip prompt. You do the work, ring up the charge, and are asked to leave a tip.

[dtennent]

For the waiter/waitress who gives me excellent service, I always leave 20+% tip. At my age, the few extra dollars mean much more to the server than they do to me.

[Velvet]

In my life, suggested tip has gone from 10%, to 12%, to 15%, to 20% and now I am seeing "suggested" tips options including 25%.

My wife and I go out each Saturday. The bill averages between 100.00-125.00. For 90 minutes I am tipping 20.00 to 25.00. This is on top of the low wage, but in addition to other tips he/she is working. At the one location I can easily see them pulling in 100.00 plus an hour. At a less expensive restaurant it can cost 30.00 to 45.00. Same work the tip would be 6.00 to 9.00.
I think 20% min is high. I think having a percentage is unfair to people working at lower ticket locations. For a $3.50 coffee I will tip $5.00. It really is a messed up system. We are now seeing, at self check-outs, a tip prompt. You do the work, ring up the charge, and are asked to leave a tip.

I tip regularly but suggestions for a tip always feel insulting to me. I always pick 0. Then if there is reason I leave cash.

[cjrjck]

I would disagree, I have worked in several chain restaurants and never tip pooled. Out of my tips I did have to tip the bartender for service bar and food runners if there was one on schedule that shift, but never pooled tips.

Same. Servers only tipped bartenders and bussers and it was usually up to the server how much. Never shared tips with kitchen staff. I would imagine that one of the few restaurants where tip sharing with the cooks is required would be those establishments where the food is cooked at the table.

[Lea N]

If their tips are cash, minimum taxes are do and many are reported.
If tips are added to a credit card, all taxes apply.

Also, is it rude to ask your waiter if tips are pooled or not?

No, it isn't rude to ask your waiter if tips are pooled.

[RonGee]

With dinning prices up costing more to eat the same meal this year than in the past we end up tipping based on the price of the meal. Logically the servers are performing the same service they did in the past, so they in reality the servers have raised their income for providing the same service.Just a thought, I still tip 20%.

[bp243]

I don’t have answer but I always tip at 20% for good service , more if exceptional service. I give the tip in cash to my server.

Agree with this sentiment and it sounds like every establishment has a different system for sharing that tip. Tipping is a part of our current way to support those who are working hard to make a decent living. If you’re in a position where your needs are covered and you’re enjoying a meal out, it’s a ‘feel good time’ to compliment someone who services you with their ability to add to your ‘feel good evening’ out while waiting on you with their service. Tip means ‘To Insure Promptness’ so it implies that you are happy with your service. If unhappy, walk away or tip according to your service.

[Vermilion Villager]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.
Hmmmmm.... 15% has been the norm for as long as I can remember. Based on the amount you tip and the justification for that low tip, and then applying your own logic you're placing yourself in the 75% category. :BigApplause:

[Two Bills]

So then do you not tip at Starbucks, chinese take out, to go orders?

Certainly not.
Would tip a delivery driver though.
Tipping is out of hand in US. and I have always been a good tipper for wait staff, but all this talk of 20%-25% on a bill is nuts.
Be tipping every shop assistant in Publix, Walmart etc. soon!

[OhioBuckeye]

If you put tip on credit card they share it with bar tender, cash they can stuff it in their pocket. At least this is what a waitress told me. Whatever you comment back to me I’ll beleive it, no point in arguing about this, I tip & it’s their tip so they can do whatever they want with it!

[conman5652@aol.com]

They do more then bring u a plate. Remember their pay per hour is less then half the current Fl minimum wage. So yes cheap people like u my be keeping good servers from working in the bubble.

[fdpaq0580]

Sorry to disagree with you. If you only tip 5%, maybe you should just eat at home

Disagree! If you tip at all it is a gratuity (gift of appreciation), an unfortunate and demeaning custom that presume "class" difference, But, it is not a requirement or law.

[fdpaq0580]

They do more then bring u a plate. Remember their pay per hour is less then half the current Fl minimum wage. So yes cheap people like u my be keeping good servers from working in the bubble.

That restaurants screw customers by guilt tripping them into paying Their employees wages and took responsibility for their employees, tipping would still
occur, albeit not as often or to such expense.

[fdpaq0580]

5% tip? Way too low for someone who makes less than minimum wage! 15-20% would be considered standard. Unless the service was horrible, I would be embarrassed to leave a tip of 5%.

Your embarrassment is your problem. You have been emotionally blackmailed into believing the restaurants employees wages are your responsibility.

[fdpaq0580]

Do you know if the moon is still made out of green cheese?

It's not the cheese that is green. It's the mold.

[fdpaq0580]

Personally, I think that if people stopped tipping servers completely, the service in restaurants would get better, not worse. Restaurants would need to hire better employees, pay them more, and they would have more control over their performance. I agree with the poster who said that tipping is nonsense.

Agree. If tips were only for truly special, over the top service, and not for standard average, then service would likely get better.

[gmnirr]

Don't dishwashers and cooks get minimum wage of $15, why would they get part of the servers tip ?

[ThirdOfFive]

Just because it's illegal doesn't mean they don't do it. At Gator's Dockside, all tips that are on debit/credit cards get pooled by wait staff, bartenders, hosts, and kitchen staff for the shift.

Give your wait staff their tip in cash, and make sure to hand it to them personally. Otherwise - it'll be pooled.
Bingo.

I tip on the quality of the service: 10% for meeting expectations, 15%, 20% or more for really great service. But always in cash, and I make sure that I give it to the waitperson. What they do with the tip after that is their own affair, but at least they know their work is being rewarded and to what extent.

[Laker14]

the system is what the system is. It certainly isn't the system I would design, but it's unlikely to change much.
Basically, it's simple.
If you don't tip, or you tip 5%, all of your arguments are really just a cover for being a cheap SOB. Period.
Enjoy your meal.
(I have never been a tipped employee)

[Pugchief]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.

If you can't afford to tip 15-20%, don't eat out. Whether you agree with the "system" of gratuities in the US is immaterial; that's the way it is and the servers depend on the tips to make wages.

[Michael G.]

the system is what the system is. It certainly isn't the system I would design, but it's unlikely to change much.


Like removing Daylight Savings Time to one time only.

[Ray Greene]

The difference between intelligent and stupid is intelligence has limits. Where do small tippers fit?

[Gpsma]

This tipping at restaurants is getting absurd. If the owner raises his prices 10% because of inflation…im suppose to tip more to someone that cant get a meaningful job or education?

So do you tip at mcdonalds? Do you tip at anywhere but a sitdown restaurant?

Tipping should be for personal service only…not for a waitstaff hndling multiple tables.

But the FRANK SINATRA tipperas of the villages will always condemn those who reliaze thos tipping system is a joke

[VApeople]

I used to be a terrible tipper but I have changed. Maybe it is because our children are doing very well and they do not depend on us, or maybe because my wife and I are very glad to be alive and in good health, or maybe I have just become more aware of the people around me.

We meet a lot of young people who provide very good services for us, and we always thank them and give them a good (by our standards) tip.

We don't eat at restaurants that are more expensive than the country clubs and we do a lot of carry out. We always pay cash and tip about 25% or more. I guess I would not give a tip if the server or food provider was not nice, but we have never met anyone like that in our 7 years living here. Maybe because we smile and show them respect.

[Vermilion Villager]

this tipping at restaurants is getting absurd. If the owner raises his prices 10% because of inflation…im suppose to tip more to someone that cant get a meaningful job or education?

so do you tip at mcdonalds? Do you tip at anywhere but a sitdown restaurant?

Tipping should be for personal service only…not for a waitstaff hndling multiple tables.

But the frank sinatra tipperas of the villages will always condemn those who reliaze thos tipping system is a joke
wow!!!!!

[Gpsma]

I used to be a terrible tipper but I have changed. Maybe it is because our children are doing very well and they do not depend on us, or maybe because my wife and I are very glad to be alive and in good health, or maybe I have just become more aware of the people around me.

We meet a lot of young people who provide very good services for us, and we always thank them and give them a good (by our standards) tip.

We don't eat at restaurants that are more expensive than the country clubs and we do a lot of carry out. We always pay cash and tip about 25% or more. I guess I would not give a tip if the server or food provider was not nice, but we have never met anyone like that in our 7 years living here. Maybe because we smile and show them respect.

25%…that is ridiculous. For what? Just because they smiled at you?

Do you tip when you carry out?

[Michael 61]

It would be great if a current or former server from one of The Villages restaurants would chime in, and let us know if their tips were pooled or not.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

So then do you not tip at Starbucks, chinese take out, to go orders?

Usually, no I don't. I tip for wait service or bartender service. I often put the change from my order into the tip jar but generally no, because cashiers are already getting $11/hour and they're not clearing my table, filling my water glass, bringing me more napkins or making sure I'm enjoying my meal. They take my money, and hand me a bag. They are being paid to give me good customer service, they don't rely on tips for that. Wait staff generally rely on tips for that.

[fdpaq0580]

If you can't afford to tip 15-20%, don't eat out. Whether you agree with the "system" of gratuities in the US is immaterial; that's the way it is and the servers depend on the tips to make wages.

Are you implying we need to eat out because it is our responsibility to ensure that restaurant staff make a living wage? If restaurants payed their employees properly, tipping would be unnecessary and probably nonexistent. Customers have been conned into this tipping15, 20 and higher % because WE are their welfare subsidies. And the bs crack about "if you can't afford the tip", is just a passive-aggressive insult.

[Worldseries27]

Cheapskate tippers always have reasons. Trouble is they are cheap in everything in their lives. So prattle on , no one's listening, certainly no one cares

[threeonemiles@outlook.com]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.
Good service along with a pleasant demeanor goes a long way towards getting a good tip. Some of the servers believe they are doing us a favor. They are not, it's their job. There are servers who make a lot of money on tips, they treat their customers like they want to be treated and it pays off. What a concept!!!!

[Topgun 1776]

Does anyone wonder why a tipping post keeps resurfacing over and over again? I could care less what anyone else tips. If wait staff gives great service, they get what I believe they should get. If they don't give great service, they won't. It's a pretty simple process.

[retiredguy123]

Does anyone wonder why a tipping post keeps resurfacing over and over again? I could care less what anyone else tips. If wait staff gives great service, they get what I believe they should get. If they don't give great service, they won't. It's a pretty simple process.
It surfaces because of peoples' increasing displeasure over the business community, that has been trying to pressure customers to give higher and higher tips and to tip for services that, in the past, they have never even asked for a tip. Many people do not like being pressured by a business to provide a tip that they don't think is warranted. The tip jars have been replaced by a touch screen that asks the customer for a tip and even suggests the amount of the tip. Some people feel intimidated by this, but others don't. Recently, tipping has been a national news story.

[Suzay]

Depending on the buisness! Cracker Barrel doesn't split their tips .!
I always Hand the waitress cash in their hands

[MidWestIA]

If you can afford to eat out you can afford to tip - they don't get paid what you did up north

[srswans]

A new twist. We were at a restaurant in Fredrick Maryland. When you entered they swiped your credit card and gave you a card to use. There is a wall of taps….The place was busy.

We stopped at a place like that in Chattanooga - very cool (nearly needed a Lyft home).

[Sandy and Ed]

I always tip a minimum of 20% for any food establishment. Some restaurants take the 3% credit card fee they get charged out of the wait staffs tips. FMK does this for example. I tried to get an explanation from FMK on their Facebook page, they deleted my comment. :)
If you mean the 3% they are charged on the amount of the tip only then I see no problem with them doing this. If they are taking the full merchant participation fee for the full amount charged on the bill, then shame on them!

[retiredguy123]

If you mean the 3% they are charged on the amount of the tip only then I see no problem with them doing this. If they are taking the full merchant participation fee for the full amount charged on the bill, then shame on them!
If they are taking the full merchant fee, they are stealing. I don't know why more servers don't hire an employment lawyer and sue the restaurant. I think Dan Newlin or other lawyers would be happy to sue weathy restaurant owners for some of the illegal activities that some posters are describing.

[NoMo50]

We played a late round of golf yesterday, and decided on an easy dinner. I ordered sandwiches from Jersey Mike's via the mobile app, for pickup on our way home. During the checkout phase on the app, a screen pops up asking how much I want to tip. What? For an order placed on an app, that I will pick up...a tip for what? And who exactly would get the tip if I left one? What's next...will Amazon begin soliciting tips for online orders?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

If they are taking the full merchant fee, they are stealing. I don't know why more servers don't hire an employment lawyer and sue the restaurant. I think Dan Newlin or other lawyers would be happy to sue weathy restaurant owners for some of the illegal activities that some posters are describing.

Because Florida is an "at will" state, without its own labor department, and you'd need to file a lawsuit on a federal level because the state just flat out doesn't care. They don't care about low-wage workers. At all. The lawyers don't care, the judges don't care, the officials - elected and appointed - don't care. This is an anti-union state as well, so you won't even see the Teamsters rallying around to an opportunity to recruit.

You work where you work, you get paid what they pay you. If you don't like it, you leave and try to find something better. If they think you're making waves, they fire you "for cause" and you don't even get to collect unemployment. For part-timers earning $300/week at their job, the most they can get with unemployment is $150/week, for 26 weeks. That's it. That covers the utilities and phone bill. Good luck with your rent.

[Mellow]

That's nice in theory, but many of us do not use cash anymore.
I worked for a restaurant in Sumter Landing Was told our tips had to be put in the jar at the register for sharing. If you put the cash in your pocket you were fired. The managers tallied them up at the end of the day. They were shared with kitchen help, buss people, 2 managers & cash register employee on our shifts & among all the servers. We only ended up with between 8.00 & 18.00 in tips for the day. It’s sad because one of the servers was handed a 20.00 tip from her customer, put it in the jar & at the end of the day only received 20.00 in tips.

[Vermilion Villager]

What most of the cheap substandard tippers may not have taken into consideration that wait staff including the waitresses, bartenders and even the person who is the maître d' do have a memory.... And through the evening they talk to one another, and keep track of these types..
I used to work as a bartender and I clearly remembered who was a decent tipper and who was not. Usually that substandard tipper was a jerk who felt he or she was entitled or better than you. I don't wanna get flagged so I will not rip the actual persons name on this particular thread but you can go back and look at his post and clearly see he is one of the people I am talking about. Yes he will get service… Will he get great service....nope!!! And what does entitled person who thinks I am unemployable and can only get this job doesn't realize is the next time he comes back we all remember who he was.

[Miboater]

What most of the cheap substandard tippers may not have taken into consideration that wait staff including the waitresses, bartenders and even the person who is the maître d' do have a memory.... And through the evening they talk to one another, and keep track of these types..
I used to work as a bartender and I clearly remembered who was a decent tipper and who was not. Usually that substandard tipper was a jerk who felt he or she was entitled or better than you. I don't wanna get flagged so I will not rip the actual persons name on this particular thread but you can go back and look at his post and clearly see he is one of the people I am talking about. Yes he will get service… Will he get great service....nope!!! And what does entitled person who thinks I am unemployable and can only get this job doesn't realize is the next time he comes back we all remember who he was.

And they would be the first person to complain about bad service or if the restaurants raise prices to cover wage increases for the servers.

[ThirdOfFive]

What most of the cheap substandard tippers may not have taken into consideration that wait staff including the waitresses, bartenders and even the person who is the maître d' do have a memory.... And through the evening they talk to one another, and keep track of these types..
I used to work as a bartender and I clearly remembered who was a decent tipper and who was not. Usually that substandard tipper was a jerk who felt he or she was entitled or better than you. I don't wanna get flagged so I will not rip the actual persons name on this particular thread but you can go back and look at his post and clearly see he is one of the people I am talking about. Yes he will get service… Will he get great service....nope!!! And what does entitled person who thinks I am unemployable and can only get this job doesn't realize is the next time he comes back we all remember who he was.
Excellent point. Being remembered positively is certainly a valid reason for tipping. Back in Minnesota we ate often at Asian restaurants. I'd always leave my (generous) tip in $2 bills--I was told by a couple of Asian waitstaff that $2 bills are seen as good luck. After a couple of visits we were immediately recognized and our service was fantastic.

Same thing on cruises. We never buy the drink packages but pay with our room card at the bars. The tips are taken automatically from the card but are split among literally hundreds of people. I've found that tipping the bartender $1 for every drink I order ensures fast service AND generous pours.

[fdpaq0580]

Cheapskate tippers always have reasons. Trouble is they are cheap in everything in their lives. So prattle on , no one's listening, certainly no one cares

BS! Just because someone thinks holding restaurant customers for emotional ransom for what should be a gift is inherently wrong, does not mean they don't tip or are not generous in other areas of their life.

Oh, and if no one is listening, why did you bother to respond.??

[John Mayes]

Because Florida is an "at will" state, without its own labor department, and you'd need to file a lawsuit on a federal level because the state just flat out doesn't care. They don't care about low-wage workers. At all. The lawyers don't care, the judges don't care, the officials - elected and appointed - don't care. This is an anti-union state as well, so you won't even see the Teamsters rallying around to an opportunity to recruit.

You work where you work, you get paid what they pay you. If you don't like it, you leave and try to find something better. If they think you're making waves, they fire you "for cause" and you don't even get to collect unemployment. For part-timers earning $300/week at their job, the most they can get with unemployment is $150/week, for 26 weeks. That's it. That covers the utilities and phone bill. Good luck with your rent.

I think all US states are “at will” with maybe one or two exceptions.

[fdpaq0580]

What most of the cheap substandard tippers may not have taken into consideration that wait staff including the waitresses, bartenders and even the person who is the maître d' do have a memory.... And through the evening they talk to one another, and keep track of these types..
I used to work as a bartender and I clearly remembered who was a decent tipper and who was not. Usually that substandard tipper was a jerk who felt he or she was entitled or better than you. I don't wanna get flagged so I will not rip the actual persons name on this particular thread but you can go back and look at his post and clearly see he is one of the people I am talking about. Yes he will get service… Will he get great service....nope!!! And what does entitled person who thinks I am unemployable and can only get this job doesn't realize is the next time he comes back we all remember who he was.

Interesting! Instead of being thankful for whatever gift (tip/gratuity) you received, you consider the gift beneath your highbrow standards, hold a grudge against that customer and threaten them with substandard service. I think I would avoid that place since their kindness is for sale, like love at a bordello. It is fake!

[Bill14564]

Interesting! Instead of being thankful for whatever gift (tip/gratuity) you received, you consider the gift beneath your highbrow standards, hold a grudge against that customer and threaten them with substandard service. I think I would avoid that place since their kindness is for sale, like love at a bordello. It is fake!

So a win-win situation.

Arguing that tipping shouldn't be a customary practice or shouldn't be used to supplement wages is arguing against reality. You don't have to like it but to deny it makes you appear foolish. Tipping is reality, using tips to supplement wages is reality, that a server notices which customers tip well and which customers tip poorly should not be a surprise.

I bet (and I believe I read an article which supports this) that if a restaurant decided to do away with tips they would lose business. The restaurant would need to raise prices 18% to 20% in order to bring in enough money to pay the full wages of their staff. If their competitors did not do the same, their customers would complain about the increased prices. Ultimately, the customers act against their own best interests. Instead of paying 20% more for their meal with no tipping they would instead go next door where the prices were 20% less and then they would likely leave a larger tip in appreciation of the lower prices.

Sure, tip poorly but don't complain when you get the service you pay for.

Sure, argue that a restaurant should do away with tipping but don't complain when they raise prices to pay the wages without tips.

Or, quit complaining, accept reality, and treat your servers as nicely as you would like them to treat you.

[RCMill531@comcast.net]

I tip at least 20 percent, sometimes more because I have family members who are servers and depend on tips to pay their living expenses. If they don’t have a good attitude, I drop it a little but if they have a good attitude and just are not good as servers, I still tip 20 percent. If you can afford to eat out, you can afford to tip!

[Keefelane66]

We just double the tax comes to 15% that’s it.

[Two Bills]

We just double the tax comes to 15% that’s it.

That would be 40% in UK.:eek:
VAT on a restaurant meal is 20% here!

[Deden]

It's called service. U should be ashamed of Ur self!

[Two Bills]

It's called service. U should be ashamed of Ur self!

I know. Dreadful chap. Heard he beats his wife as well. :icon_wink:

[Cindy619]

I get it... I NEVER use cash. But now I have a separate pile of cash that I use only for... tipping.

[Josephjmarchese]

My dad used to say tip stands for “to insure promptness”, ie: to give the customer the attention to make their visit comfortable.
Tipping has gotten out of hand at some venues. For example you go to a frozen yogurt store, fill your own cup, apply toppings and then go pay and be expected to tip the cashier. For what? Taking your money? I agree big tippers like others say, are showing off and actually diminish services to reasonable tippers. I am a 20% guy, unless the service is terrible I will drop to 5% and percentages in between. I like to support those hard working people who can use extra bucks, but not because they are simply there, but because they are doing their job. One waitress moved us to a better table at Cody’s lake Sumter, she reminded me several times her doing so should be rewarded, which I was originally planning to do. Her insistence and subsequent poor service resulted in two things 1) a 10% tip (should have been 0) and 2) I don’t got to Cody’s LS restaurant and just stay at bar where service is good

[VApeople]

Do you tip when you carry out?

Yes, of course. We have had a Jersey Mike's open up at Lake Deaton Plaza and we go there a lot. We tip 25% when we get a couple of their delicious subs.

25%…that is ridiculous. For what? Just because they smiled at you?

To be honest, I think the reason they smile at us is because we smile at them first.

[VApeople]

One waitress moved us to a better table at Cody’s lake Sumter, she reminded me several times her doing so should be rewarded

We went to Cody's a couple weeks ago but it was too loud inside and our waitress moved us to a nice table outside. She was a very good hard-working server and we gave her a good tip.

We like going to Cody's a lot. We once had a dinner at Red Sauce and my wife threw up that night, so we haven't gone back since.

[Worldseries27]

bs! Just because someone thinks holding restaurant customers for emotional ransom for what should be a gift is inherently wrong, does not mean they don't tip or are not generous in other areas of their life.

Oh, and if no one is listening, why did you bother to respond.??
to call bs . As sheldon says

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Yes, of course. We have had a Jersey Mike's open up at Lake Deaton Plaza and we go there a lot. We tip 25% when we get a couple of their delicious subs.



To be honest, I think the reason they smile at us is because we smile at them first.

Why would you tip someone who makes subs behind a counter? Are they putting the sub on a plate and bringing it to your table? Are they serving you your drink or do you have to use the self-serve? Do they bring you your napkin or do you have to serve that yourself too? Do they bus your table? Do they check on you during your meal to make sure everything tastes good and is satisfactory? Do they do anything that the guy behind the deli counter at Publix doesn't do? Those folks already get paid minimum wage or better. They don't rely on tips at all. There is no need to tip them at all. On the other hand if you toss a dollar, or the change from your total into the tip jar they'll appreciate it because it's a bonus on top of their regular pay.

If folks doing counter work continue to get more and more money from tips, their bosses will start considering them to be tipped employees and not hourly employees which means the boss can pay them LESS than minimum wage, and the employee now has to rely on those tips to equal minimum wage. It ceases to be a bonus.

[retiredguy123]

I tip for restaurant service, based on the quality of the service. Terrible service doesn't deserve any tip at all. I don't tip for counter service or pick up orders. People who say they tip 20 percent automatically, even for terrible service, are not taking advantage of the voluntary tipping system.

[fdpaq0580]

to call bs . As sheldon says

BS= business standard. Your attachment never came up, so I am afraid I missed the point.
Here is a thought that occurred to me while out for lunch at one of our average restaurants. Wife and I ordered mid-priced meals and drinks. Waitress brought 2 drinks and 2 plates. Our "tip" was $10.00. Using us Ave "average" customers, using the small amount of time she spent with us and the 5 tables we observers her serve in the 30 minutes we were there, she could easily have picked up $@50.00 in tips on top of her wage. A hundred dollars an hour for ten tables of two people in tips. 1 +- minute to take and place order. 1 minute to deliver drinks. 1 minute to deliver food. 1> minute to drop check. 1+- minute relieve payment.
Remember, you are not their only customer/tipper. Five, ten, or more dumping lots of tip money every hour. If they have agreed to tip-share with salaried employees, that is on them.
Maybe, just maybe (depending on where they work) they are doing better than we have been led to believe.

[Spike380]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.
Wow 5 percent???? Those waitresses do more than "bring you a plate". Thats what fast food places do. That waitress takes you order, checks on your order, serves you, refreshes your beverage/bread basket--and asks how your food was. IF you treat them nicely, they are just incredible people who work hard for very little. Your tip means a LOT to them-thats how they survive.

[BrianL99]

.. Because Florida is an "at will" state, without its own labor department ...


.. the most they can get with unemployment is $150/week, for 26 weeks. That's it. That covers the utilities and phone bill. Good luck with your rent.

Do you just make up the stuff you post on your own or do you have help?

State Labor Offices | U.S. Department of Labor (https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/contacts#FL) (There's the FL Labor Department.

& here's what you really collect in unemployment in Florida.

[VApeople]

Why would you tip someone who makes subs behind a counter?

Because they work hard and they treat all of the customers very well.

[mtdjed]

They do more then bring u a plate. Remember their pay per hour is less then half the current Fl minimum wage. So yes cheap people like u my be keeping good servers from working in the bubble.

The above comment is definitely not true if you are taking about servers. The current Florida minimum wage for non-tipped employees is $11.00 per hour. That, by the way is in the top third of minimum wages in the US.

There is separate Florida minimum wage for tipped employees. That by itself is $7.98 which by itself is well over half of the minimum wage of non-tipped employees. However, the law basically requires the employer to pay a supplement to the employee if the tips do not reach the same level of pay the non-tipped employee minimum wage provides.

The result is that the tipped employees are insured of getting at least as much as non-tipped employees. Further, the tipped employee can far exceed the $11.00 figure. For example, today my wife and myself went to Mallory and our bill was $29.75 including taxes. We were there about 45 minutes. We tipped $6.00 in cash and paid the bill by credit card ie $29.75. There were at least two other tables of 4 being serviced by this server. Assuming at least a $50 tab per table and 20 % tipping would be another $20 tip, ie $26 of tips in 1 hour.

Cash tipping is not just a nicety. What it does is potentially allow the server to avoid sharing the tip and to potentially reduce income and tax liability. If servers netted less than dishwashers, I'm sure they would not still be servers.

Also, we shouldn't assume all servers are paid Tipped employee minimum wages.

[Rainger99]

Here is a thought that occurred to me while out for lunch at one of our average restaurants. Wife and I ordered mid-priced meals and drinks. Waitress brought 2 drinks and 2 plates. Our "tip" was $10.00. Using us Ave "average" customers, using the small amount of time she spent with us and the 5 tables we observers her serve in the 30 minutes we were there, she could easily have picked up $@50.00 in tips on top of her wage. A hundred dollars an hour for ten tables of two people in tips. 1 +- minute to take and place order. 1 minute to deliver drinks. 1 minute to deliver food. 1> minute to drop check. 1+- minute relieve payment.
Remember, you are not their only customer/tipper. Five, ten, or more dumping lots of tip money every hour. If they have agreed to tip-share with salaried employees, that is on them.

One of my friends owns a bar and restaurant. She said her employees do not want to be paid a living wage. They love tips.

She said on a good night her employees can earn $500 or more in tips and $250 on a slow night. Working just four nights a week with two good nights and two slow nights, a person can make $1500 a week. With four weeks off for vacation, they can make more than $72,000 a year.

Assuming an 8 hour shift and just four tables per waitress and a 2 hour turnover per table, that is 16 tables per shift. (These are conservative numbers.)

According to my calculations, at $100 per table in revenue, that is $1600 per night.

A 15% tip is $240, 18% is $288, 20% is &320, and 25% is $400.

[BrianL99]

One of my friends owns a bar and restaurant. She said her employees do not want to be paid a living wage. They love tips.

She said on a good night her employees can earn $500 or more in tips and $250 on a slow night. Working just four nights a week with two good nights and two slow nights, a person can make $1500 a week. With four weeks off for vacation, they can make more than $72,000 a year.

Assuming an 8 hour shift and just four tables per waitress and a 2 hour turnover per table, that is 16 tables per shift. (These are conservative numbers.)

According to my calculations, at $100 per table in revenue, that is $1600 per night.

A 15% tip is $240, 18% is $288, 20% is &320, and 25% is $400.

If all the Servers in Central Florida who are making $72,000 a year decided to go on a road trip together, during their 4 weeks vacation, they could all fit in a golf cart.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

For part-timers earning $300/week at their job, the most they can get with unemployment is $150/week, for 26 weeks.

Do you just make up the stuff you post on your own or do you have help?

State Labor Offices | U.S. Department of Labor (https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/contacts#FL) (There's the FL Labor Department.

& here's what you really collect in unemployment in Florida.

Context is everything.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Because they work hard and they treat all of the customers very well.

That's why they get an hourly wage instead of sub-minimum relying on tips to equal that hourly wage.

[fdpaq0580]

If all the Servers in Central Florida who are making $72,000 a year decided to go on a road trip together, during their 4 weeks vacation, they could all fit in a golf cart.

You might be very surprised at how really good tips can be.

[Velvet]

Because they work hard and they treat all of the customers very well.

Excuse me but doesn’t one need to do that to get a job in the first place? Or perhaps I’m just old fashioned.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You might be very surprised at how really good tips can be.

Fun with mathematics:
The shift has 4 waitresses, 1 bartender.
Also 1 grill cook, 1 "other" kitchen worker who puts together salads and such, 1 hostess, 1 busboy.

Only the waitresses and bartender get tips, but the tips are pooled and divided among all non-management employees.

One waitress hustles like crazy and serves 20 parties during her shift, 10 of which are parties of 4, 6 are parties of 2, and 4 parties of 6. Her total tips for the night is $500.

Two waitresses do a pretty good job, not as good as the one above, and they earn $300 each that night, for a total of $600 between the two.

The fourth one is having a bad night, dropped someone's water glass, and had one party of 2 stiff her for a tip completely. She only took in $100 that night.

The bartender took in $1000 in tips, because bartenders can actually do that sometimes.

Total tips that night are $2200. Now divide that by the 9 employees who each get a cut of the tips. That rounds up to $244 per person in tips. Even though only 3 employees actually EARNED more than $100 in tips. Why should the bartender only get $244 when she busted her butt to earn $1000? Why should the chick who had a lousy night and broke a water glass get more than the $100 she earned? Why should the guy who makes salads get the same amount as the waitress who earned $300, and why should she get less than the $300 she earned? Why should the hostess, whose only job is to grab menus and bring customers to tables, get any tip at all?

Answer: they shouldn't be getting these amounts. They absolutely should not. You earn it, you can keep it or pool it. The only people who MIGHT be earning less than minimum wage are the waitresses and the bartender. They are the only people who are entitled to any tips at all. But when you pool tips, the one who does a lousy job gets the same amount as the person who busted their butt.

That is unfair, and wrong, and doesn't give anyone an incentive to do a good job. Why should I do a good job, if I can do a lousy job and get the same tip money that the chick who does a good job gets? Why should I do a good job, if the best I can hope for is whatever the lousy chick gets?

[VApeople]

Excuse me but doesn’t one need to do that to get a job in the first place? Or perhaps I’m just old fashioned.

When I meet any service worker who is pleasant and trying to do a good job, it makes me happy, and I want to show my appreciation.

[Eg_cruz]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.
Because most restaurants have to pay taxes on sales. Back in my days 35 years ago, we had to pay taxes on 10% of our sales. So if you tip 5% you are hurting the server.
If you or a regular anywhere I sure the servers know you and give you what you pay for.
Here’s what tipping right gets you. I walk in to my favorite place before I even sit the servers have my club soda in hand, they care how am doing, and the smiles never stop. They are very kind to me and my family because they know I appreciate that they are taking care of us. Tipping right is a big win win for everyone.

[Eg_cruz]

Fun with mathematics:
The shift has 4 waitresses, 1 bartender.
Also 1 grill cook, 1 "other" kitchen worker who puts together salads and such, 1 hostess, 1 busboy.

Only the waitresses and bartender get tips, but the tips are pooled and divided among all non-management employees.

One waitress hustles like crazy and serves 20 parties during her shift, 10 of which are parties of 4, 6 are parties of 2, and 4 parties of 6. Her total tips for the night is $500.

Two waitresses do a pretty good job, not as good as the one above, and they earn $300 each that night, for a total of $600 between the two.

The fourth one is having a bad night, dropped someone's water glass, and had one party of 2 stiff her for a tip completely. She only took in $100 that night.

The bartender took in $1000 in tips, because bartenders can actually do that sometimes.

Total tips that night are $2200. Now divide that by the 9 employees who each get a cut of the tips. That rounds up to $244 per person in tips. Even though only 3 employees actually EARNED more than $100 in tips. Why should the bartender only get $244 when she busted her butt to earn $1000? Why should the chick who had a lousy night and broke a water glass get more than the $100 she earned? Why should the guy who makes salads get the same amount as the waitress who earned $300, and why should she get less than the $300 she earned? Why should the hostess, whose only job is to grab menus and bring customers to tables, get any tip at all?

Answer: they shouldn't be getting these amounts. They absolutely should not. You earn it, you can keep it or pool it. The only people who MIGHT be earning less than minimum wage are the waitresses and the bartender. They are the only people who are entitled to any tips at all. But when you pool tips, the one who does a lousy job gets the same amount as the person who busted their butt.

That is unfair, and wrong, and doesn't give anyone an incentive to do a good job. Why should I do a good job, if I can do a lousy job and get the same tip money that the chick who does a good job gets? Why should I do a good job, if the best I can hope for is whatever the lousy chick gets?
Wow in my day, we didn’t pool but we had to tip out to the bartender, bus boy and host and then we kept the rest.
I would not work in a place if I had to share my tips with other servers……period

[Eg_cruz]

25%…that is ridiculous. For what? Just because they smiled at you?

Do you tip when you carry out?
Yes I tip when I order curbside 5-10%.

[Rainger99]

Fun with mathematics:
The shift has 4 waitresses, 1 bartender.
Also 1 grill cook, 1 "other" kitchen worker who puts together salads and such, 1 hostess, 1 busboy.

Only the waitresses and bartender get tips, but the tips are pooled and divided among all non-management employees.

One waitress hustles like crazy and serves 20 parties during her shift, 10 of which are parties of 4, 6 are parties of 2, and 4 parties of 6. Her total tips for the night is $500.

Two waitresses do a pretty good job, not as good as the one above, and they earn $300 each that night, for a total of $600 between the two.

The fourth one is having a bad night, dropped someone's water glass, and had one party of 2 stiff her for a tip completely. She only took in $100 that night.

The bartender took in $1000 in tips, because bartenders can actually do that sometimes.

Total tips that night are $2200. Now divide that by the 9 employees who each get a cut of the tips. That rounds up to $244 per person in tips. Even though only 3 employees actually EARNED more than $100 in tips. Why should the bartender only get $244 when she busted her butt to earn $1000? Why should the chick who had a lousy night and broke a water glass get more than the $100 she earned? Why should the guy who makes salads get the same amount as the waitress who earned $300, and why should she get less than the $300 she earned? Why should the hostess, whose only job is to grab menus and bring customers to tables, get any tip at all?

Answer: they shouldn't be getting these amounts. They absolutely should not. You earn it, you can keep it or pool it. The only people who MIGHT be earning less than minimum wage are the waitresses and the bartender. They are the only people who are entitled to any tips at all. But when you pool tips, the one who does a lousy job gets the same amount as the person who busted their butt.

That is unfair, and wrong, and doesn't give anyone an incentive to do a good job. Why should I do a good job, if I can do a lousy job and get the same tip money that the chick who does a good job gets? Why should I do a good job, if the best I can hope for is whatever the lousy chick gets?

You can do whatever you want with mathematics. Is this what happens in real life? How many places pool tips? 10%, 50%, 100%? I am sure that if this actually happens, the bartender and good waitress would be gone after two weeks.

Even under this example, even the lousy waitress working 5 nights a week for 48 weeks, would make over $58,000. And I have heard some people don’t report all of their income on their taxes.

Looks like you are going to need a bigger golf cart.

If anyone has worked as a waitress or bartender, please provide your input.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Wow in my day, we didn’t pool but we had to tip out to the bartender, bus boy and host and then we kept the rest.
I would not work in a place if I had to share my tips with other servers……period

When I worked for a resort one summer, our tips were pooled. It was horrible. I did a pretty good job most of the time - had a bad day here, a bad shift there, but mostly positive. We weren't even allowed to see how much tips we were getting, the meals were billed to the customer's room and they paid tips when it was time to settle at the end of their stay.

The first week, I got less than $20 in tips. That was for two tables of 12 people, mixed guests from different rooms, for breakfast and dinner, for 7 days. No explanation of why it was so low but I didn't care, I left that job.

I've worked in small restaurants as well, where I might get $50 in tips for a shift. I bartended in a place where I got around $80 in tips for early afternoon/suppertime on a Friday, and maybe $10 on a Monday lunch (never bartend on mondays - it's the worst tipping day ever). This was when the normal minimum wage was $6-something, and tipped servers got $4-something. So $80 was definitely a good day, then.

We weren't required to tip out the busboy but everyone did. Usually 10% of whatever our tips were. The busboy got normal minimum wage, but he worked almost as hard as the waitstaff did. He'd usually end up between $30-50 in his pocket on a good night on top of his wages.

Because the bartender had his own customers, and was the only waitstaff that got normal minimum wage, we didn't kick in anything to him. He took in more than we did.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You can do whatever you want with mathematics. Is this what happens in real life? How many places pool tips? 10%, 50%, 100%? I am sure that if this actually happens, the bartender and good waitress would be gone after two weeks.

Even under this example, even the lousy waitress working 5 nights a week for 48 weeks, would make over $58,000. And I have heard some people don’t report all of their income on their taxes.

Looks like you are going to need a bigger golf cart.

If anyone has worked as a waitress or bartender, please provide your input.

Most waitresses don't get 5-night shifts. Any waitress who works on a monday afternoon can tell you - you won't be making bubkes that day. If the managers doesn't like them, OR if they're a new employee, they will generally not be scheduled for Thursday-Sunday dinner shifts, because those are for more seasoned (or more liked) employees. Those are the money-making shifts.

Happy hour shifts are the worst. People are looking for a bargain. You tip 25% of the bill - but it was a BOGO happy hour and you actually received 4 drinks and only tipped for two of them because the other two were free and 25% of 0 is 0.

If you had tipped 15% of the total before discounts, they'd be ahead of the game. But that'd mess up your "get stuff cheap" strategy for happy hour.

But yes tips can be pooled 100% - unless they're cash tips. And then, that's only because smart, but disobedient wait staff pocket that cash tip and don't report it to the manager. The only tips that are guaranteed to be spread among the staff are credit card tips, because the manager sees those automatically.

The tipping pools differ from one place to the next. In some, bartenders get to keep 100% of their own tips, and only the waiter tips are spread. In some, the kitchen staff doesn't get any tipped funds, only the busboy gets a piece of that. In some, the hostess gets something, others, they don't. But whenever there is pooling, you know for absolute sure, that the person who EARNED the most of the money that gets pooled, will not get that much. And the person who EARNED the least, will get more than they earned.

Also yes, turnover is horrendous in many restaurants because the servers learn after they're hired that their earned money doesn't necessarily all go to them. That's one of the reasons some restaurants are so short-handed, why customer service in them is so horrible, why it looks like some of the servers are always annoyed, or make so many mistakes. Managers will hire almost anyone, just to fill the position. And then they either quit or get fired within a few weeks and they have to start over again.

[fdpaq0580]

That is unfair, and wrong, and doesn't give anyone an incentive to do a good job. Why should I do a good job, if I can do a lousy job and get the same tip money that the chick who does a good job gets? Why should I do a good job, if the best I can hope for is whatever the lousy chick gets?[/QUOTE]

I agree! Tip pooling needs to be done away with. A gift to one person becomes the property of that one person, imHo, and what they agree to do or chose to do with their gift is up to them. Forcing the "gifted" to share their gift is robbery. Forcing them to share their gift under threat of losing their job is extortion But, that is not my responsibility. I walked in for a hamburger and a Coke.
This whole issue wouldn't exist if wait staff were paid a
full wage and tipping didn't exist.

[BrianL99]

That is unfair, and wrong, and doesn't give anyone an incentive to do a good job. Why should I do a good job, if I can do a lousy job and get the same tip money that the chick who does a good job gets? Why should I do a good job, if the best I can hope for is whatever the lousy chick gets?

A gift to one person becomes the property of that one person, imHo, and what they agree to do or chose to do with their gift is up to them. Forcing the "gifted" to share their gift is robbery. Forcing them to share their gift under threat of losing their job is extortion
[/QUOTE]

A "Tip" is not a "gift", it is a voluntary payment for services and it is NOT rendered to a "person", but to a company that person works for. If a server in a "shared tip" environment chooses to keep a cash tip to herself/himself, they are thieves.

Simply to prove the lack of logic to your position: If you pay in cash for an item with a $50 bill and when you get home, you found you were only given change for a $20 bill ... who do you call and who do you hold responsible? If you hand cash to a person who is working at a business, that cash is the property of the business.

[retiredguy123]

///

[retiredguy123]

A gift to one person becomes the property of that one person, imHo, and what they agree to do or chose to do with their gift is up to them. Forcing the "gifted" to share their gift is robbery. Forcing them to share their gift under threat of losing their job is extortion


A "Tip" is not a "gift", it is a voluntary payment for services and it is NOT rendered to a "person", but to a company that person works for. If a server in a "shared tip" environment chooses to keep a cash tip to herself/himself, they are thieves.

Simply to prove the lack of logic to your position: If you pay in cash for an item with a $50 bill and when you get home, you found you were only given change for a $20 bill ... who do you call and who do you hold responsible? If you hand cash to a person who is working at a business, that cash is the property of the business.[/QUOTE]


I would point out that both Federal law and the courts have determined that, when a customer gives a tip to a restaurant server, the tip is the property of the server, not the restaurant. There are a few exceptions where tip pooling is allowed, but they would be exceptions to the general rule.

[Velvet]

In the past before I knew about pooling I strictly tipped the server. If I knew that “the company” was taking it, there would have been no tip at all.They can raise the prices if they need it so much and pay proper wages. The servers are not working on commissions.

[JSR22]

In the past before I knew about pooling I strictly tipped the server. If I knew that “the company” was taking it, there would have been no tip at all.They can raise the prices if they need it so much and pay proper wages. The servers are not working on commissions.

What company is taking tips? I doubt that it is true.

[Velvet]

What company is taking tips? I doubt that it is true.

That is how I read the above post. Perhaps I misunderstood. My impression of tipping was a thank you for the service the individual has provided for you.

Sometimes I consider their situation. I had an incident where an older handyman came to fix my fridge drawer for me. He couldn’t but I tipped him for coming out, his gas and trying although he, himself, charged nothing. Then I fixed the drawer myself. I believe he was working for himself so no wages from a different source.

I have a question: do the “suggested” tips on machines etc include the tax when a percentage is taken? Am I tipping the IRS as well?

[JGibson]

So glad I rarely eat out.

I don't have any of these restaurant complaints that so many on TV have.

[fdpaq0580]

A "Tip" is not a "gift", it is a voluntary payment for services and it is NOT rendered to a "person", but to a company that person works for. If a server in a "shared tip" environment chooses to keep a cash tip to herself/himself, they are thieves.


WRONG! Big time!!
The "tip" or, more properly, gratuity is a gift of appreciation to the server, and no one else, for their attention and service. Maybe, to circumvent your larcenous suggestions, customers should tip via check, in a sealed envelope with written instructions to open at a later time in the presence of their attorney.

[Michael G.]

So glad I rarely eat out.

I don't have any of these restaurant complaints that so many on TV have.

I was told that the average villager eats out 4X a week, on average.

[fdpaq0580]

[QUOTE=BrianL99;22 If you pay in cash for an item with a $50 bill and when you get home, you found you were only given change for a $20 bill ... who do you call and who do you hold responsible? If you hand cash to a person who is working at a business, that cash is the property of the business.[/QUOTE]

If I pay in cash for an item, I count my change before putting it in my pocket. But, if I didn't, for some strange reason, and when I got home and found an error, I might call the establishment where I purchased the item, but ultimately, the responsibility is mine for failing to check my change. The payment is for the item, remember?
If, however, after paying for the item, I choose to give the server a gift/tip/gratuity for their personal service, that gift is for them and not for would be thieves to take it from them.

[Bill14564]

...

I have a question: do the “suggested” tips on machines etc include the tax when a percentage is taken? Am I tipping the IRS as well?

That depends on how the machines were programmed; I have seen the calculation done both before and after tax.

By the way, this has nothing to do with the IRS - sales tax is collected by the State.

[fdpaq0580]

That is how I read the above post. Perhaps I misunderstood. My impression of tipping was a thank you for the service the individual has provided for you.

Sometimes I consider their situation. I had an incident where an older handyman came to fix my fridge drawer for me. He couldn’t but I tipped him for coming out, his gas and trying although he, himself, charged nothing. Then I fixed the drawer myself. I believe he was working for himself so no wages from a different source.

I have a question: do the “suggested” tips on machines etc include the tax when a percentage is taken? Am I tipping the IRS as well?

Don't go by suggested tips on machines and verify that the tip hasn't already been added. You may be tipping on the added tip. Make sure your bill is correct and then tip what YOU feel is appropriate. Don't be embarrassed or emotionally blackmailed into tipping what someone else wants you too.

[retiredguy123]

That depends on how the machines were programmed; I have seen the calculation done both before and after tax.

By the way, this has nothing to do with the IRS - sales tax is collected by the State.
I agree, but do the math. If a restaurant has $1,000,000 in gross sales and receives 15 percent of it in tips, that is $150,000. So, if they program their receipt machine to incorrectly collect a 7 percent sales tax on the tip income, they will be overpaying their sales tax bill to the state by $10,500. I cannot imagine that many restaurants would be foolish enough to do that.

[Pugchief]

If you can't afford to tip 15-20%, don't eat out. Whether you agree with the "system" of gratuities in the US is immaterial; that's the way it is and the servers depend on the tips to make wages.

Are you implying we need to eat out because it is our responsibility to ensure that restaurant staff make a living wage? If restaurants payed their employees properly, tipping would be unnecessary and probably nonexistent. Customers have been conned into this tipping15, 20 and higher % because WE are their welfare subsidies. And the bs crack about "if you can't afford the tip", is just a passive-aggressive insult.

You clearly don't understand how small businesses function. In order to make a profit and thus stay in business, you have to charge, in aggregate, more than the total cost of your expenses. Those expenses include wages. So let's hypothetically say that tipping was not customary (Japan is like that, you are expected NOT to tip). So instead of gratuities, the restaurant owner pays the waitstaff 20% more than they currently do. What do you think happens as a result? They raise the price of EVERY ITEM on the menu in order to still make the same profit. So does every other sit down restaurant. So you end up paying that "tip" either way. If you understood that, you wouldn't consider my "BS crack" to be passive aggressive, but rather, common sense.

You're welcome, and yes, I am a former small business (not restaurant) owner.

[Bill14564]

I agree, but do the math. If a restaurant has $1,000,000 in gross sales and receives 15 percent of it in tips, that is $150,000. So, if they program their receipt machine to incorrectly collect a 7 percent sales tax on the tip income, they will be overpaying their sales tax bill to the state by $10,500. I cannot imagine that many restaurants would be foolish enough to do that.

I thought the question was about how the suggested tip was calculated.

If my purchases total $100 I would be charged $7 in tax for a total of $107. Is the suggested 20% tip calculated to be:
- $20 because it is based on the pre-tax amount?
- $21.40 because it is based on the post-tax amount?
I have seen both.

Note: Neither of those affect the amount of tax paid to the State (and County). That amount is calculated on the $100 sales total regardless of how the machine calculates the suggested tip.

[retiredguy123]

I thought the question was about how the suggested tip was calculated.

If my purchases total $100 I would be charged $7 in tax for a total of $107. Is the suggested 20% tip calculated to be:
- $20 because it is based on the pre-tax amount?
- $21.40 because it is based on the post-tax amount?
I have seen both.

Note: Neither of those affect the amount of tax paid to the State (and County). That amount is calculated on the $100 sales total regardless of how the machine calculates the suggested tip.
Not the way I read the post. I think the poster wanted to know if they were being charged sales tax on the tip amount, and, thereby, giving money to the Government that was not owed.

Sales tax does not apply to tip income as long as the tip is completely voluntary. If the tip is mandatory, then sales tax does apply.

[Velvet]

You clearly don't understand how small businesses function. In order to make a profit and thus stay in business, you have to charge, in aggregate, more than the total cost of your expenses. Those expenses include wages. So let's hypothetically say that tipping was not customary (Japan is like that, you are expected NOT to tip). So instead of gratuities, the restaurant owner pays the waitstaff 20% more than they currently do. What do you think happens as a result? They raise the price of EVERY ITEM on the menu in order to still make the same profit. So does every other sit down restaurant. So you end up paying that "tip" either way. If you understood that, you wouldn't consider my "BS crack" to be passive aggressive, but rather, common sense.

You're welcome, and yes, I am a former small business (not restaurant) owner.

Yes, if they raised the prices, that would be honest and transparent. I’m good with that.

[Velvet]

Not the way I read the post. I think the poster wanted to know if they were being charged sales tax on the tip amount, and, thereby, giving money to the Government that was not owed.

Sales tax does not apply to tip income as long as the tip is completely voluntary. If the tip is mandatory, then sales tax does apply.

Thank you, you clarified what I was struggling to say.

[Gpsma]

So, lets say, i go to a restaurant and order a burger and a coke. Someone next to me orders a filet mignon with a coke. So the smiley waitress delivers our orders.
The wonderful smiley waitress did nothing more in service to either of us. So we are both to tip her or him 20% of the check?

[fdpaq0580]

So, lets say, i go to a restaurant and order a burger and a coke. Someone next to me orders a filet mignon with a coke. So the smiley waitress delivers our orders.
The wonderful smiley waitress did nothing more in service to either of us. So we are both to tip her or him 20% of the check?

I know? Foolish isn't it? Probably twice as much for 1 plate brought to the table. The % deal is a scam. Equal pay (read "tip") for equal work!

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

So, lets say, i go to a restaurant and order a burger and a coke. Someone next to me orders a filet mignon with a coke. So the smiley waitress delivers our orders.
The wonderful smiley waitress did nothing more in service to either of us. So we are both to tip her or him 20% of the check?

No, you'd tip possibly just 15%, if that was the minimum expected customer service provided. If the expected customer service should have been more than that, and the smiley waitress failed to provide that minimum customer service, I personally suggest tipping nothing, and asking to speak with the manager, to the side, not in front of other customers or wait staff. The waitress might need some course correction, or she might've just had an off day. Or she might be just really bad at her job.

Personally, I expect more from a server than simply delivering food and smiling at me. That would be worthy of a 0 tip and a complaint to the manager.

[Bill14564]

So, lets say, i go to a restaurant and order a burger and a coke. Someone next to me orders a filet mignon with a coke. So the smiley waitress delivers our orders.
The wonderful smiley waitress did nothing more in service to either of us. So we are both to tip her or him 20% of the check?

Simple answer: Yes

Longer answer: Yes, because whether you know it or not, you want it that way. You want the smiley waiter who delivers the quality of service deserving of the 20% tip on the filet. If more customers chose not to tip then that smiley waitress that provided the good service might find somewhere else to work.

Still longer answer: Yes, because you really don't want to lose the service and whether you know it or not, you really don't want to pay the price that would come with a non-tipping restaurant. While you ordered only a burger and a coke, you ordered that from a restaurant that also serves filet mignon. It is likely that such a restaurant has a "filet mignon" quality of service, something better than you might find at a fast food restaurant. You like that quality of service and that's why you ordered a burger there rather than somewhere else. If you want that quality of service you have to have a level of compensation that attracts servers able and willing to provide it. If the restaurant chooses to go to non-tipping they will need to raise prices in order to continue to pay their servers. The price of the filet may go up 20% but that would make a very expensive steak outrageously expensive. Another alternative would be to raise the price of the filet a little less than 20% while raising the lower-priced items more than 20%. The good servers would continue to get the pay they deserve but the money would come from the price of the meals rather than tips. Every customer would pay more, probably about 22% more (the increased cost would come with increased sales tax) but your burger would likely increase even more than that.

[Laker14]

So, lets say, i go to a restaurant and order a burger and a coke. Someone next to me orders a filet mignon with a coke. So the smiley waitress delivers our orders.
The wonderful smiley waitress did nothing more in service to either of us. So we are both to tip her or him 20% of the check?

Now you finally got it.

congratulations.
If you can afford the filet, you can afford the tip.

[fdpaq0580]

Now you finally got it.

congratulations.
If you can afford the filet, you can afford the tip.

Equal pay for equal work! Deliver one plate of food, hamburger or filet should be equal. What I can afford shouldn't enter in to it. What if you can afford the filet, but want a burger. Your logic would have you paying the cost of filet for the burger because you can afford to. That is just stupid. How about a car wash that provides the same service for all cars but expects payment based on your car's value. Cadillac price for the Chevy service, just because " you can afford it". Idiocy, imHo.

[Laker14]

Equal pay for equal work! Deliver one plate of food, hamburger or filet should be equal. What I can afford shouldn't enter in to it. What if you can afford the filet, but want a burger. Your logic would have you paying the cost of filet for the burger because you can afford to. That is just stupid. How about a car wash that provides the same service for all cars but expects payment based on your car's value. Cadillac price for the Chevy service, just because " you can afford it". Idiocy, imHo.

Whatever makes you feel better about being a skinflint apparently works for you, so go with it.

[Kelevision]

If their tips are cash, minimum taxes are do and many are reported.
If tips are added to a credit card, all taxes apply.

Also, is it rude to ask your waiter if tips are pooled or not?

They are taxed 15% on their total sales. If they get less than 15% tip, they still get taxed 15%.

[retiredguy123]

They are taxed 15% on their total sales. If they get less than 15% tip, they still get taxed 15%.
The restaurant reports 8 percent of gross sales as tip income and reports it on the server's W-2, in Box 8, "allocated tips". The server only needs to pay income tax on that amount. It doesn't matter whether or not the tips were paid in cash or credit card, it is based on the restaurant's total gross sales that they report as income to the IRS. That is the IRS rule.

[BrianL99]

They are taxed 15% on their total sales. If they get less than 15% tip, they still get taxed 15%.

You really should check your "facts" before presenting them as facts.

[Rainger99]

You really should check your "facts" before presenting them as facts.

If that were a requirement to post on TOTV, there would be far fewer posts!!

[Michael 61]

Interesting read so far - Many people very passionate about this subject on both sides - Some posters have stooped to name-calling and being snarky, which is sad to see - Interesting, people feel the need to defend their tipping position here with such intense vigor, as if they can somehow convince others to sway to their way of thinking - No one is going to change their outlook on tipping based on any arguments here, though I do find the information about how tips are pooled interesting.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Interesting read so far - Many people very passionate about this subject on both sides - Some posters have stooped to name-calling and being snarky, which is sad to see - Interesting, people feel the need to defend their tipping position here with such intense vigor, as if they can somehow convince others to sway to their way of thinking - No one is going to change their outlook on tipping based on any arguments here, though I do find the information about how tips are pooled interesting.

My opinion is based on a variety of things:
1. Being a waitress in a few different restaurants throughout my life, and one posh summer resort.
2. Being a bartender at a bowling alley for a couple of years, and a bartender at a dive bar in my home state for a few months (til I found out they were using the bar as a front for drug trade - I quit a week before they were raided and shut down).
3. Working full time for a non-prof (American Cancer Society) in downtown Boston and living on a budget there.
4. Learning that being a street musician in Boston was lucrative, and supplementing my budget with that, having a LOT of easy cash at my disposal, and able to pay good tips at the Ritz-Carlton restaurant.
5. Enjoying the dining-out experience at least monthly for most of my life, and learning from the other side of the bar tab what it's like to be a tipped server - and from the diner's side, what it's like to be a "regular customer" who relies on my server being glad I'm there.

[Velvet]

Interesting read so far - Many people very passionate about this subject on both sides - Some posters have stooped to name-calling and being snarky, which is sad to see - Interesting, people feel the need to defend their tipping position here with such intense vigor, as if they can somehow convince others to sway to their way of thinking - No one is going to change their outlook on tipping based on any arguments here, though I do find the information about how tips are pooled interesting.

Well, that’s the problem with tipping. It’s personal. There is no right or wrong way to do it. Some people prefer one way, others differently - that is why there should not be such a system. It’s like going into a store to buy bananas - for whatever price you want to pay. Then if someone doesn’t pay enough in someone’s opinion, people call them names… lol.

As far as service is concerned, workers should be paid a proper wage in the first place. I don’t go to a place to eat to make friends with the staff, they don’t make my day. I would just like courteous service - which should be part of the job definition.

[fdpaq0580]

If that were a requirement to post on TOTV, there would be far fewer posts!!

That is probably true, but then think of all the fun we would miss out on!

[fdpaq0580]

- and from the diner's side, what it's like to be a "regular customer" who relies on my server being glad I'm there.

In what way do you "relies on my server"? Other than the normal job functions they are employed to provide, what? Extra napkins for the chili nachos? Re-fill your coffee, or catsup for your fries? Are they the only person that has a matching blood type for transfusions, or something like that?

[fdpaq0580]

well, that’s the problem with tipping. It’s personal. There is no right or wrong way to do it. Some people prefer one way, others differently - that is why there should not be such a system. It’s like going into a store to buy bananas - for whatever price you want to pay. Then if someone doesn’t pay enough in someone’s opinion, people call them names… lol.

As far as service is concerned, workers should be paid a proper wage in the first place. I don’t go to a place to eat to make friends with the staff, they don’t make my day. I would just like courteous service - which should be part of the job definition.

correct!

[fdpaq0580]

Whatever makes you feel better about being a skinflint apparently works for you, so go with it.

Oh dearie me! Cut to the quick! I suffer under the weight of harsh words by one who knows me not.

[fdpaq0580]

No, you'd tip possibly just 15%, if that was the minimum expected customer service provided. If the expected customer service should have been more than that, and the smiley waitress failed to provide that minimum customer service, I personally suggest tipping nothing, and asking to speak with the manager, to the side, not in front of other customers or wait staff. The waitress might need some course correction, or she might've just had an off day. Or she might be just really bad at her job.

Personally, I expect more from a server than simply delivering food and smiling at me. That would be worthy of a 0 tip and a complaint to the manager.

In light of the experience you have shared, I have a question, not to be mean, but I want an honest opinion and I think you will tell me.
If there was no tipping, do you think that wait staff would be paid the same minimum wage as other restaurant employees? I believe they would. And, that is good reason for them to love tipping, for one average tip from one average table and they easily exceed minimum wage.

[Whitley]

Personally, I expect more from a server than simply delivering food and smiling at me. That would be worthy of a 0 tip and a complaint to the manager.

When you are speaking with the manager about the above waitress who smiled, took your order and correctly and promptly delivered your food, and he asks what did she do wrong, you would say...?

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

In light of the experience you have shared, I have a question, not to be mean, but I want an honest opinion and I think you will tell me.
If there was no tipping, do you think that wait staff would be paid the same minimum wage as other restaurant employees? I believe they would. And, that is good reason for them to love tipping, for one average tip from one average table and they easily exceed minimum wage.

I made average tips as a restaurant server - nothing over the top, but enough to go beyond the minimum wage in the state for non-tipped workers. Once, someone gave me a $20 bill after eating a $10 meal. And a few times, I was stiffed for a tip entirely.

I would've been fine with a living wage instead of tipping. But a living wage was not the same as minimum wage. I didn't rely on this one part-time job to pay my bills. If I was a single mother who couldn't afford child care and could only work 3-4 part-time shifts per week, I would probably hope that tipping was allowed, so that I had a chance of earning more than whatever my employer was paying me.

I wasn't in that situation though. During the years I worked in restaurants, I often worked multiple jobs. Sometimes part-time office work plus restaurants, sometimes more than one restaurant, sometimes bartending in addition - and when I lived in Boston, being a street musician was always my primary source of income.

If restaurant work paid $15/hour with no tipping allowed, I probably would've tried to get a job here in the Villages when I moved down, instead of working at Publix.

[BobnBev]

I once gave my server a $50 cash tip, on a $200 bill. She remembers me to this day. The service and food was well worth it. It was 25%. My wife was in favor of it.

[Gpsma]

So Mr Sinatra…tell us where u ate that a waitress deserved $50. Please be specific of what she did for u

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

So the smiley waitress delivers our orders.
The wonderful smiley waitress did nothing more in service to either of us. So we are both to tip her or him 20% of the check?



Personally, I expect more from a server than simply delivering food and smiling at me. That would be worthy of a 0 tip and a complaint to the manager.

When you are speaking with the manager about the above waitress who smiled, took your order and correctly and promptly delivered your food, and he asks what did she do wrong, you would say...?

Once again, context is everything. Note the bolded. I don't need a waiter to just deliver food and smile. Counter clerks can do that.

Minimum service for a tip: offer us water and/or other beverage before we even order food. Bring it, if we ask for it. Ensure that our table is clean and has all the cutlery necessary for a guest to eat at their restaurant. Take the order efficiently. Ensure that our food is delivered efficiently and correctly. Pause to make sure everyone got what they ordered and that it at least -looks- right, before walking away. Return after a few minutes to see if everyone's food is prepared properly and tastes satisfactorily to the guest. Ask if they want anything - condiments, more lemon for their tea, a refill on the water, another beer, another basket of bread, etc. etc. Make eye contact every time you pass the table, in case the guest wants to flag you down for something new. Assist them promptly, or apologize for any delay, if applicable. Around 20 minutes after their food was placed on their table, return again to see if they're finished, or almost finished. If so, ask if they want dessert and/or another drink. Make sure the busboy has taken the empty plates off the table (or do it yourself if there's no available busboy). Present the check. Smile with each step of this process.

That is the MINIMUM required, to get any tip at all. If they fail to do these things, then it's worthy of a complaint. This is the minimum I was trained to deliver, to ensure that I still had a job the following week. And this is the minimum I expect from my server as well.

[fdpaq0580]

I made average tips as a restaurant server - nothing over the top, but enough to go beyond the minimum wage in the state for non-tipped workers. Once, someone gave me a $20 bill after eating a $10 meal. And a few times, I was stiffed for a tip entirely.

I would've been fine with a living wage instead of tipping. But a living wage was not the same as minimum wage. I didn't rely on this one part-time job to pay my bills. If I was a single mother who couldn't afford child care and could only work 3-4 part-time shifts per week, I would probably hope that tipping was allowed, so that I had a chance of earning more than whatever my employer was paying me.

I wasn't in that situation though. During the years I worked in restaurants, I often worked multiple jobs. Sometimes part-time office work plus restaurants, sometimes more than one restaurant, sometimes bartending in addition - and when I lived in Boston, being a street musician was always my primary source of income.

If restaurant work paid $15/hour with no tipping allowed, I probably would've tried to get a job here in the Villages when I moved down, instead of working at Publix.

Thank you. I still don't like the concept ot tipping as an expectation. I don't like that the business shifts a part of their financial obligation to the employee onto the customer. It is unfair to both customer and employee. Employees don't have a steady paycheck they can count on and the customers pay more out the door for food+ 20÷ than the relatively smaller increase in cost to cover the expected rise to full service wage.

[MX rider]

Bottom line is, if you get a really good server a 20% tip is whats considered appropraite. Sometimes I'll do a bit more. If they don't do a good job, I adjust the tip accordingly.

The concept of servers making little per hour and more on tips is basically incentive pay.

In theory they'll work harder to make your visit enjoyable. But as we all know it's not a perfect world, and it doesn't always work out that way.

But if you don't like that concept, that's a you problem.

I work for the biggest food dist in the world as a sales rep. I sell to independent reaturants, so I see it all. The good, the bad and the ugly.

But any of the rockstar servers will tell you they would much rather work for tips because they know they can make really good money, and many do. It's the American way, reward hard work.

[Laker14]

I am not a big an of the system, primarily because it makes providing a decent wage to the waitstaff a voluntary payment. We all know that if the waitstaff were paid a decent wage, and tipping became passe, the menu price would reflect the extra cost of that wage.

What the low-ball tippers don't want to recognize is that in the restaurant business there are plenty of down times when the place is empty. These times are not always predictable. Waitstaff has to be on hand to serve, and that is a cost borne by the restaurant even when nobody is dining. The low-wage + tip system mitigates that risk to the business somewhat.
Unfortunately for the waitstaff, they sit there with nothing to do, making less than minimum wage, and earning no tips because they are not serving any customers.
Then when things get busy, everyone is hustling like crazy trying to take care of their diners, and every diner there expects to treated as if they were the only table in the place.

The dead times and the rush times get rolled up into one big ball. When you dine, and you tip, you are participating in the system as it exists, not as you think it should be. When you tip, you are pulling your weight, recognizing that your tip helps smooth out the up and down times. When you don't tip, or you find some reason why you shouldn't tip to the customary %, you are letting someone else pay your bill for you.

[fdpaq0580]

I am not a big an of the system, primarily because it makes providing a decent wage to the waitstaff a voluntary payment. We all know that if the waitstaff were paid a decent wage, and tipping became passe, the menu price would reflect the extra cost of that wage.

What the low-ball tippers don't want to recognize is that in the restaurant business there are plenty of down times when the place is empty. These times are not always predictable. Waitstaff has to be on hand to serve, and that is a cost borne by the restaurant even when nobody is dining. The low-wage + tip system mitigates that risk to the business somewhat.
Unfortunately for the waitstaff, they sit there with nothing to do, making less than minimum wage, and earning no tips because they are not serving any customers.
Then when things get busy, everyone is hustling like crazy trying to take care of their diners, and every diner there expects to treated as if they were the only table in the place.

The dead times and the rush times get rolled up into one big ball. When you dine, and you tip, you are participating in the system as it exists, not as you think it should be. When you tip, you are pulling your weight, recognizing that your tip helps smooth out the up and down times. When you don't tip, or you find some reason why you shouldn't tip to the customary %, you are letting someone else pay your bill for you.

Even if I didn't tip ( give a monetary gift to my server) I would still pay my bill from the restaurant and thereby fulfill my obligation to the restaurant. Tipping is voluntary and, though somewhat customary here, it is not required. Saying that if you don't tip you are not pulling your weight is flawed perspective, insulting emotional blackmail. Not pulling your weight is not giving waitstaff full minimum wages and guilt tripping customers into picking up part of their financial obligation.

[Laker14]

Even if I didn't tip ( give a monetary gift to my server) I would still pay my bill from the restaurant and thereby fulfill my obligation to the restaurant. Tipping is voluntary and, though somewhat customary here, it is not required. Saying that if you don't tip you are not pulling your weight is flawed perspective, insulting emotional blackmail. Not pulling your weight is not giving waitstaff full minimum wages and guilt tripping customers into picking up part of their financial obligation.

And your perspective is flawed because it pretends the world is as you would design it, instead of acknowledging that the world is as it is.

[Rainger99]

Once again, context is everything. Note the bolded. I don't need a waiter to just deliver food and smile. Counter clerks can do that.

Minimum service for a tip: offer us water and/or other beverage before we even order food. Bring it, if we ask for it. Ensure that our table is clean and has all the cutlery necessary for a guest to eat at their restaurant. Take the order efficiently. Ensure that our food is delivered efficiently and correctly. Pause to make sure everyone got what they ordered and that it at least -looks- right, before walking away. Return after a few minutes to see if everyone's food is prepared properly and tastes satisfactorily to the guest. Ask if they want anything - condiments, more lemon for their tea, a refill on the water, another beer, another basket of bread, etc. etc. Make eye contact every time you pass the table, in case the guest wants to flag you down for something new. Assist them promptly, or apologize for any delay, if applicable. Around 20 minutes after their food was placed on their table, return again to see if they're finished, or almost finished. If so, ask if they want dessert and/or another drink. Make sure the busboy has taken the empty plates off the table (or do it yourself if there's no available busboy). Present the check. Smile with each step of this process.

That is the MINIMUM required, to get any tip at all. If they fail to do these things, then it's worthy of a complaint. This is the minimum I was trained to deliver, to ensure that I still had a job the following week. And this is the minimum I expect from my server as well.

If that is the MINIMUM to get any tip, is that a 10%, 15%, or 20% tip?

If they don’t smile, do you not tip?

[fdpaq0580]

And your perspective is flawed because it pretends the world is as you would design it, instead of acknowledging that the world is as it is.

Oh, I do tip. Not because it's the way it should be, but because that is the custom of our time. A custom that hail back to a time when lords and ladies might reward with a gift, some servant that pleased them. Having to rely on the generosity of strangers for gifts reinforces old class distinctions.
My argument is simply philosophical. Expecting the employer to pay their employee for what they do for the business seems appropriate. After all, when a server at the jewelry counter at a department store brings you the watch you buy, do you tip them or do they get paid buy the store?

[Laker14]

Oh, I do tip. Not because it's the way it should be, but because that is the custom of our time. A custom that hail back to a time when lords and ladies might reward with a gift, some servant that pleased them. Having to rely on the generosity of strangers for gifts reinforces old class distinctions.
My argument is simply philosophical. Expecting the employer to pay their employee for what they do for the business seems appropriate. After all, when a server at the jewelry counter at a department store brings you the watch you buy, do you tip them or do they get paid buy the store?

In that case, as it turns out, we are in agreement.

[Rainger99]

This is an article on tipping in Los Angeles. Strong views - just like on TOTV!

'Deceiving and disgusting': Readers react to the rise of restaurant service fees (https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/deceiving-disgusting-readers-react-rise-212607952.html)

[ThirdOfFive]

Bottom line is, if you get a really good server a 20% tip is whats considered appropraite. Sometimes I'll do a bit more. If they don't do a good job, I adjust the tip accordingly.

The concept of servers making little per hour and more on tips is basically incentive pay.

In theory they'll work harder to make your visit enjoyable. But as we all know it's not a perfect world, and it doesn't always work out that way.

But if you don't like that concept, that's a you problem.

I work for the biggest food dist in the world as a sales rep. I sell to independent reaturants, so I see it all. The good, the bad and the ugly.

But any of the rockstar servers will tell you they would much rather work for tips because they know they can make really good money, and many do. It's the American way, reward hard work.
Bingo.

I knew a fellow back home who was a morning waiter at a local Perkin's Restaurant. Perkins is about as middle-of-the-road as you can get and breakfast tabs aren't usually all that much. But this guy had worked that shift at that restaurant for years and really knew his stuff--and his customers. A lot of the customers were regulars: he'd learn their names and their preferences after a few visits hot coffee, water with no lime, a large orange juice, or whatever they routinely ordered would show up at their table unordered. He never went anywhere empty-handed--a sure sign, according to my wife, of exceptional wait staff. He also knew the menu inside out and was never shy about sharing his opinions. He obviously loved his job and his tip income was as much or more--often a lot more--as he'd earn in wages on a shift.

In my opinion the go-getters prefer the tip system. The ones who move a bit more slowly--well--

[retiredguy123]

This is an article on tipping in Los Angeles. Strong views - just like on TOTV!

'Deceiving and disgusting': Readers react to the rise of restaurant service fees (https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/deceiving-disgusting-readers-react-rise-212607952.html)
Note that the receipt in the article shows a 15 percent mandatory service fee. That is not a tip.

[Velvet]

Bingo.

I knew a fellow back home who was a morning waiter at a local Perkin's Restaurant. Perkins is about as middle-of-the-road as you can get and breakfast tabs aren't usually all that much. But this guy had worked that shift at that restaurant for years and really knew his stuff--and his customers. A lot of the customers were regulars: he'd learn their names and their preferences after a few visits hot coffee, water with no lime, a large orange juice, or whatever they routinely ordered would show up at their table unordered. He never went anywhere empty-handed--a sure sign, according to my wife, of exceptional wait staff. He also knew the menu inside out and was never shy about sharing his opinions. He obviously loved his job and his tip income was as much or more--often a lot more--as he'd earn in wages on a shift.

In my opinion the go-getters prefer the tip system. The ones who move a bit more slowly--well--

Again, you are confusing a server with a friend. They don’t have to remember your name, in fact to me that can be yucky. They don’t have to remember how you like your water, you can tell them. And they certainly don’t have to share their opinions unless asked. There maybe some lonely individuals that need this kind of ego boost from a stranger but to assume everybody does?

[Bill14564]

Note that the receipt in the article shows a 15 percent mandatory service fee. That is not a tip.

Possibly not but there needs to be an explanation for what it is.

I see a line for Corazon Iced Tea so I assume the diner received Corazon Iced Tea and the charge is for the Corazon Iced Tea. I see a line for Almond Butter Toast so similarly I assume that charge is for the Almond Butter Toast the diner received. When I see a charge for Service I assume that is for the Service I received.

The Service Charge may not be a voluntary tip (the word "mandatory" seems to take voluntary out of the equation) but if it is 15% added to the bill to cover service then it is performing the function of the tip I would have left so I will adjust any additional tip accordingly.

I would prefer to do away with the US custom of tipping but I recognize that it is here today. But the owners should not add fees and charges to the bill to mislead the customers about the true price of the meal and confuse them into tipping more (or less) than they would otherwise choose to.

[Bill14564]

Again, you are confusing a server with a friend. They don’t have to remember your name, in fact to me that can be yucky. They don’t have to remember how you like your water, you can tell them. And they certainly don’t have to share their opinions unless asked. There maybe some lonely individuals that need this kind of ego boost from a stranger but to assume everybody does?

I didn't read it that way at all.

The server at the Perkins could have done a perfectly acceptable job of bringing coffee, asking for orders, and handing out the food. That's all servers are really required to do. This Perkins server went above and beyond that and provided extra service deserving of extra recognition (tip).

If a server goes out of their way to try to make my experience better I will thank them for that. I won't call it "yucky" or tell them to keep their meal suggestions to themselves.

[Rainger99]

Note that the receipt in the article shows a 15 percent mandatory service fee. That is not a tip.

For a party of 6 or more with a mandatory service fee of 18%, are you supposed to tip on top of that? And do you tip on the 18%?

So for a $500 bill plus a $90 service fee, should you tip $75 (15% of $500) or $88.50 (15% of $590)?

And if the restaurant called it an 18% gratuity fee instead of a service fee, would that make a difference?

[retiredguy123]

Possibly not but there needs to be an explanation for what it is.

I see a line for Corazon Iced Tea so I assume the diner received Corazon Iced Tea and the charge is for the Corazon Iced Tea. I see a line for Almond Butter Toast so similarly I assume that charge is for the Almond Butter Toast the diner received. When I see a charge for Service I assume that is for the Service I received.

The Service Charge may not be a voluntary tip (the word "mandatory" seems to take voluntary out of the equation) but if it is 15% added to the bill to cover service then it is performing the function of the tip I would have left so I will adjust any additional tip accordingly.

I would prefer to do away with the US custom of tipping but I recognize that it is here today. But the owners should not add fees and charges to the bill to mislead the customers about the true price of the meal and confuse them into tipping more (or less) than they would otherwise choose to.
I would just add that the IRS does not consider any mandatory payments for service to be "tip" income that would qualify for the special tax treatment rules that they use. For example, the restaurant could not include mandatory service charges on their W-2 forms as an "allocated tip". And the restaurant could not use mandatory service charges as a credit towards their minimum wage calculation, if they are paying servers less than the minimum wage.

[retiredguy123]

For a party of 6 or more with a mandatory service fee of 18%, are you supposed to tip on top of that? And do you tip on the 18%?

So for a $500 bill plus a $90 service fee, should you tip $75 (15% of $500) or $88.50 (15% of $590)?

And if the restaurant called it an 18% gratuity fee instead of a service fee, would that make a difference?
As I understand it, mandatory charges are not considered tip income for tax purposes, regardless of what you call them.

[Bill14564]

For a party of 6 or more with a mandatory service fee of 18%, are you supposed to tip on top of that? And do you tip on the 18%?

So for a $500 bill plus a $90 service fee, should you tip $75 (15% of $500) or $88.50 (15% of $590)?

And if the restaurant called it an 18% gratuity fee instead of a service fee, would that make a difference?

For me, almost always, if the restaurant chooses to add a gratuity, whether due to the size of the party or just their policy, I am not likely to leave anything more. This often works out in my favor since I would typically leave more than 18%.

That may be tough on the server but I see it like this:
- If the restaurant has a policy of only cooking steak well done and that cuts down on the number of customers and therefore reduces the tips the server would have otherwise received, the server has the choice to move to a restaurant without such a policy.
- Likewise, if the restaurant has a policy of adding a service charge and it reduces the tips the server would have otherwise received, the server has the choice to move to a restaurant without such a policy.
- I am not obligated to continue to eat at the restaurant that overcooks my steak and I don't feel obligated to tip above what the restaurant feels is appropriate to automatically add to my bill

[Bill14564]

I would just add that the IRS does not consider any mandatory payments for service to be "tip" income that would qualify for the special tax treatment rules that they use. For example, the restaurant could not include mandatory service charges on their W-2 forms as an "allocated tip". And the restaurant could not use mandatory service charges as a credit towards their minimum wage calculation, if they are paying servers less than the minimum wage.

I understand it that way too which is why I dislike the practice so much. I believe the restaurant is allowed to use any or all of the mandatory service charge as part of the tipped-minimum wage that they are required to pay the servers. Essentially, the mandatory *service* charge becomes a "because we don't want to raise our prices" charge. To me that is dishonest and deceiving and I would have a very hard time going back to that restaurant.

But if the restaurant is going to list it as a "service charge" and is over and above the price for the meal then I am going to treat it just that way: as a charge for the service I received which is over and above the labor amount included in the price of the meal. That may not work out well for the server which ultimately may not work out well for the restaurant.

[retiredguy123]

I understand it that way too which is why I dislike the practice so much. I believe the restaurant is allowed to use any or all of the mandatory service charge as part of the tipped-minimum wage that they are required to pay the servers. Essentially, the mandatory *service* charge becomes a "because we don't want to raise our prices" charge. To me that is dishonest and deceiving and I would have a very hard time going back to that restaurant.
I don't think the IRS would agree with you. I will need to look up the IRS rules, but I am pretty sure that they consider a tip to be a voluntary payment to a "tipped" employee from a customer. That is why they give special tax treatment to tipped employees.

[Bill14564]

I don't think the IRS would agree with you. I will need to look up the IRS rules, but I am pretty sure that they consider a tip to be a voluntary payment to a "tipped" employee from a customer. That is why they give special tax treatment to tipped employees.

I believe we see things the same way.

The IRS doesn't treat the mandatory service charge as a tip. It doesn't belong to the employee and it is not used as a credit to bring the tipped-minimum wage up to the minimum wage. The mandatory service charge belongs to the employer just as the money collected for the Corazon Iced Tea belongs to the employer.

The IRS sees it that way, the employer may use it that way, but that doesn't mean I have to like it or that I have to return to the restaurant that chooses to add it to my bill.

[Laker14]

I would consider the mandatory service charge a tip. If the restaurant does not share that with the server, then that is between the server and the restaurant.
If, as has been explained, the MSC is a way to offset the rising cost of menu items, then why charge it only to large groups? That makes no sense to me.
I have also read that the MSC reflects an effort of the restaurant to provide a reasonable wage for the waitstaff, which again would indicate that tip would be unnecessary, and also leaves the question of why only large parties get to participate in this largesse.

I always thought it was to make sure the server(s) did not get stiffed by a large group. Serving a large group may require enough effort and time to constitute a very large portion of the server's hours, and getting stiffed would be more impactful by the large group than a table for two. For example, if Mr. "I never tip more than 5%" were in charge of the bill, the server would have a bad night indeed.

But I wouldn't be surprised if it was also a way for the restaurant to get a hand on some of that tip money.

[Velvet]

I didn't read it that way at all.

The server at the Perkins could have done a perfectly acceptable job of bringing coffee, asking for orders, and handing out the food. That's all servers are really required to do. This Perkins server went above and beyond that and provided extra service deserving of extra recognition (tip).

If a server goes out of their way to try to make my experience better I will thank them for that. I won't call it "yucky" or tell them to keep their meal suggestions to themselves.

What is yucky is asking you for your name AND then remembering it. That is not necessary, in my opinion. They are not going to call on you for service.

[Pugchief]

X % added to parties of 8 or more IS the tip, that policy is to prevent the server from getting stiffed or undertipped. But MSC and other nonsense fees do not go to the server; as noted they are so the restaurant can avoid a price increase and having to reprint menus.

Of note is that if the policy of some MSC is not clearly posted either on the menu, the entry door or some other obvious location, you can ask to have it removed, and I would. A place back home started adding 4% MSC to checks during covid to make up for reduced traffic. I sympathized with their plight and always happily paid it. But once covid ended and volume was back to normal, they continued to place the charge bc they realized most people don't scrutinize the check and will just pay it. I always ask for it to be removed, and they always comply without argument. If they refused to remove it, I would stop patronizing their establishment. Vote with your feet.

[Two Bills]

I remember sitting with my wife in the old Sonrise Cafe and listening to a group of about 6-8 lady golfers actually arguing whether to leave .50 cents or a Dollar each as a tip.
It was quite revealing.

[Gpsma]

Ive learned a lot from this thread. I know now to tip differently.
I see that waitstaff can be paid around $7 per hour but min wage is around $12

So from now on I will keep track of the time we spend at the table. One hour…tip will be $5 to bring them up to minimum wage.

And that may be too generous for unmotivated people who wont go out to get an education or trade.

[Laker14]

Ive learned a lot from this thread. I know now to tip differently.
I see that waitstaff can be paid around $7 per hour but min wage is around $12

So from now on I will keep track of the time we spend at the table. One hour…tip will be $5 to bring them up to minimum wage.

And that may be too generous for unmotivated people who wont go out to get an education or trade.

You will, with that logic, be tipping more generously for slower service.

[Whitley]

You may write off the tip on a business meal. There is no IRS section for tipping, so add it to your bill. The entire expense is then a business expense. As 95% of the people at TV are retired, this is a very unhelpful tip. See what I did there, a tip on a tip. And they say financial folks are dull and boring.

[Rainger99]

And they say financial folks are dull and boring.

And now we know why!

[fdpaq0580]

For a party of 6 or more with a mandatory service fee of 18%, are you supposed to tip on top of that? And do you tip on the 18%?

So for a $500 bill plus a $90 service fee, should you tip $75 (15% of $500) or $88.50 (15% of $590)?

And if the restaurant called it an 18% gratuity fee instead of a service fee, would that make a difference?

Absolutely! The service charge is what the restaurant demand to "cover", or make up for the tip you no longer have to leave. They have taken the option away. Still, some are so conditioned they still feel the "need" to tip on top of the mandatory tip. Since the service charge is mandatory, management claims it as revenue. Improves their numbers and (big plus for them) they get to administer the additional $ and share in it.

[Whitley]

And now we know why!

Yes, I guess I agree.

[MX rider]

Again, you are confusing a server with a friend. They don’t have to remember your name, in fact to me that can be yucky. They don’t have to remember how you like your water, you can tell them. And they certainly don’t have to share their opinions unless asked. There maybe some lonely individuals that need this kind of ego boost from a stranger but to assume everybody does?

You're very much the exception, not the rule.
Part of my job as a sales rep is to do server training. Most people want a friendly, engaging and honest server.

Part of the training we do encourages servers to smile, introduce themselves and engage with their customers, as well as offer honest advice when asked. Also, to learn their names if they're regulars. People in general like being greeted by their name. It makes them feel appreciated.

We also tell them to read the customer and be flexible. Some like yourself, don't want anything but service.

The server training we do has been proven to improve the customer experience and in turn increase tips.

The really good servers truly enjoy what they do, and the higher tips they make are a direct result of that.

I see it every day.

[fdpaq0580]

You will, with that logic, be tipping more generously for slower service.

Hey! That $5 +$5 from 4 more tables + @ $8 wage and server is near $30 ph. Not bad for wait job at Denny's. And she never had to even look at me or smile.

[MX rider]

Hey! That $5 +$5 from 4 more tables + @ $8 wage and server is near $30 ph. Not bad for wait job at Denny's. And she never had to even look at me or smile.

It's not that simple. They usually have to share part of the tips with the bussers and kitchen.

Plus they won't make good tips for 8 straight hours. Only during the busy time.

[fdpaq0580]

You're very much the exception, not the rule.
Part of my job as a sales rep is to do server training. Most people want a friendly, engaging and honest server.

Part of the training we do encourages servers to smile, introduce themselves and engage with their customers, as well as offer honest advice when asked. Also, to learn their names if they're regulars. People in general like being greeted by their name. It makes them feel appreciated.

We also tell them to read the customer and be flexible. Some like yourself, don't want anything but service.

The server training we do has been proven to improve the customer experience and in turn increase tips.

The really good servers truly enjoy what they do, and the higher tips they make are a direct result of that.

I see it every day.

Guess I'm another exceptional individual. Be polite. Be quietly efficient. Serve the meal with the least amount of interrupting as possible. (This is a date and you weren't invited to join us Becky). If you are going to refill our coffee or drinks we shouldn't even know you were here. They should appear as if by magic.
To me, once the order has been taken, the less I actually have to speak with the server about needing/wanting this or that, the better. The meal should flow as if from a wellspring, without hiccups or sputtering. A meal catered by a genie. That, to me is exceptional service. Do NOT call me Hon.

[fdpaq0580]

It's not that simple. They usually have to share part of the tips with the bussers and kitchen.

Plus they won't make good tips for 8 straight hours. Only during the busy time.

But, they may do way better. And, I would think handling only 5 tables in an hour is pretty slow. As far as tip sharing or pooling, there are other establishments and jobs, so they can choose. Plus, remember all the Other tipped employees who also put money in the pool. There could be some big winners in there to claim a share of. Things may not be all gloom and doom for waitstaff like we've been lead to believe. I remember one waiter in a more upscale restaurant. I noticed his gold Rolex President and remarked on it. He grinned and assured me it was real. He told me he loved his job. Lots of big business folk, each trying to order the most expensive stuff and trying to be the biggest tipper.

[Rainger99]

But, they may do way better. And, I would think handling only 5 tables in an hour is pretty slow. As far as tip sharing or pooling, there are other establishments and jobs, so they can choose. Plus, remember all the Other tipped employees who also put money in the pool. There could be some big winners in there to claim a share of. Things may not be all gloom.

If you can make $25 an hour, you are looking at $50,000 a year. Not bad for a job with no educational requirements.

Do people tip clerks in a clothing store or at Home Depot or the grocery store? I think most of those jobs start around minimum wage!

Florida minimum wage is $11 an hour or $440 a week or $22,880 a year.

[VApeople]

I remember sitting with my wife in the old Sonrise Cafe

Yeah, we loved the Sonrise Cafe but, to be honest, we love Darrell's even more.

We stopped there today for a delicious breakfast. It was $23 and we gave her $35 to include a tip. Then we went to a few stores, finished off at Fresh Market, and drove back home. Life is good.

[retiredguy123]

For a party of 6 or more with a mandatory service fee of 18%, are you supposed to tip on top of that? And do you tip on the 18%?

So for a $500 bill plus a $90 service fee, should you tip $75 (15% of $500) or $88.50 (15% of $590)?

And if the restaurant called it an 18% gratuity fee instead of a service fee, would that make a difference?
To further clarify large group mandatory charges, this is a quote directly from the IRS.gov website:

"Charges added to a customer's check, such as for large parties, by your employer and distributed to you should not be added to your daily tip record. These additional charges your employer adds to a customer's bill do not constitute tips as they are service charges. These service charges are non-tip wages and are subject to social security tax, Medicare tax, and federal income tax withholding."

[Rainger99]

To further clarify large group mandatory charges, this is a quote directly from the IRS.gov website:
"Charges added to a customer's check and distributed to you should not be added to your daily tip record. These service charges are non-tip wages and are subject to social security tax, Medicare tax, and federal income tax withholding."

If the waiter gets the service charge, why would you also tip them? Seems like a way to pay them twice.

[retiredguy123]

If the waiter gets the service charge, why would you also tip them? Seems like a way to pay them twice.
Agree. I wouldn't tip them. Also, I avoid restaurants that charge a mandatory "gratuity" for large groups. To me, it's insulting. At least the IRS recognizes that a mandatory gratuity is not a tip.

[ThirdOfFive]

Guess I'm another exceptional individual. Be polite. Be quietly efficient. Serve the meal with the least amount of interrupting as possible. (This is a date and you weren't invited to join us Becky). If you are going to refill our coffee or drinks we shouldn't even know you were here. They should appear as if by magic.
To me, once the order has been taken, the less I actually have to speak with the server about needing/wanting this or that, the better. The meal should flow as if from a wellspring, without hiccups or sputtering. A meal catered by a genie. That, to me is exceptional service. Do NOT call me Hon.
How much of the difference in how tipping (and service) is seen can be attributed to cultural differences based on where people in TV come from? It is a melting pot after all.

I recall my first experience here with that cultural difference. My wife and I stopped at Cracker Barrel for lunch. Quite a few people hanging around the reception area. I asked the hostess how long the wait was going to be. Her response (as she put an arm around me): "why it's not gonna be that long at all, honey!" Never see that in Minnesota. It caught me off guard but at the same time brought a big smile to my face. What a uniquely southern way of putting people at ease!

Same with some of the other examples mentioned here. Southern Minnesota, where I lived and worked, is a primarily rural setting. Numerous small towns divided by large stretches of corn and beans: 200 mile days visiting clients were not unusual. You got to know the waitstaff in the eateries you frequented and they got to know you. Just the way things are done there; anyone who would rebuff a friendly greeting or inquiry would be seen in a not-too-favorable light. The other side of that particular coin is that, in my experience, there are parts of this country where the locals are not so laid-back; larger cities and parts of the eastern U.S. where people are a lot more private and closed-off and where any unsolicited expression of familiarity is viewed with suspicion.

There are no absolutes regarding this particular topic. What is acceptable to someone is NOT acceptable to someone else. Simple as that.

[fdpaq0580]

There are no absolutes regarding this particular topic. What is acceptable to someone is NOT acceptable to someone else. Simple as that.

Truth!

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Agree. I wouldn't tip them. Also, I avoid restaurants that charge a mandatory "gratuity" for large groups. To me, it's insulting. At least the IRS recognizes that a mandatory gratuity is not a tip.

I'm okay with a restaurant adding 15% to the bill for large parties. This is why: there are times, when a large party will have a dedicated server. That server doesn't serve any other table while that party is there, because the server already has 20 customers and really just shouldn't be expected to manage more if there are other servers on the shift.

If that table's host says "please give me the bill, I'm taking care of it" and he stiffs the server, then that server has just spent the last hour-plus working his butt off for less than minimum wage, and ZERO opportunity to earn a dime from any other customer for that hour.

My grandparents always undertipped - they put $1 on the table, no matter how large or small the bill. They decided that $1 was quite enough, the server should "just get a better job" if they want to earn more than that. Because they assumed that it was -that- easy for everyone to "just get a better job." So my sister and I always snuck a few bucks extra to the server after the grands went toward the exit of the restaurant. We estimated, since the grands wouldn't let us see the bill. Often there were 14 people: grands, my parents, my mom's two sisters and their spouses, and all the grandkids. I was the oldest grandkid and since I was working, it was no big deal to me to toss in a five or a ten a few times a year to ensure that the server wouldn't be utterly miserable after dealing with our family drama for an hour (just somewhat miserable, but hey - that's the customer service business for ya).

This kind of thing does happen. Not often, but often enough to cause a server to walk out on the job. Employers who understand this, will make sure that the larger parties are guaranteed to kick in at least the minimum gratuity. Customers can always top it off if the service was remarkably awesome, but generally no more than 5% of the pre-gratuity, pre-tax bill.

[mraines]

Do waitresses in restaurant's around TV share their tips?

I need to do more research on this, but I have been asking around as it differs in different establishments. I have found that some do, some don't. I have also found that if you put the tip on a credit card, it goes on their paycheck and therefore is taxed. I need more clarification. I don't know if dishwashers and cooks make minimum wage, but they should. They all should make minimum wage and not have to rely on tips. There does not seem to be a uniform way of distributing tips.

[Michael 61]

This thread has made me think about how I tip - I’m now considering to start tipping in cash and handing it directly to the waiter/waitress.

[retiredguy123]

I need to do more research on this, but I have been asking around as it differs in different establishments. I have found that some do, some don't. I have also found that if you put the tip on a credit card, it goes on their paycheck and therefore is taxed. I need more clarification. I don't know if dishwashers and cooks make minimum wage, but they should. They all should make minimum wage and not have to rely on tips. There does not seem to be a uniform way of distributing tips.
If it is done correctly, a tip placed on a credit card should not go into the server's paycheck. It should be paid directly to the server and not taxed. The server only pays tax on their tips based on the "allocated" tip amount that appears in Box 8 of their W-2 form.

[BobnBev]

This thread has made me think about how I tip - I’m now considering to start tipping in cash and handing it directly to the waiter/waitress.

That's what I do. They appreciate it.

[Bill14564]

If it is done correctly, a tip placed on a credit card should not go into the server's paycheck. It should be paid directly to the server and not taxed. The server only pays tax on their tips based on the "allocated" tip amount that appears in Box 8 of their W-2 form.

Not exactly.

All tips received by the server should be reported by the server to the employer, taxed as wages, and included on the W-2. It might be that tips on credit cards are automatically considered to be reported without any other action of the employee but I haven't looked into that. All tips *should* be reported and taxed but that doesn't always happen.

Allocated tips on the W-2 are something different. Allocated tips are based on 8% (usually) of a restaurant's gross receipts. The total amount is allocated to each tipped employee based on an IRS formula. The allocated amount on the W-2 is the difference between their reported amount and their portion of the 8%. The employee has the choice to pay taxes on their allocated amount or to provide evidence that they did not receive that amount.

IRS: Tip Recordkeeping & Reporting (https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/tip-recordkeeping-and-reporting)

[Keefelane66]

Tips are calculated and taxed as SSI, Medicare, and unemployment calculations.
Imagine work g your whole life as a server and one reaches retirement-age calculations based on wages without significant savings 401k, Keogh possible retirement benefits. SSI payment for 2023 is the same nationwide. It is: —$914 for one person.
Unemployment in Florida To calculate your weekly benefit amount, use the quarter in the base period with your highest earnings and divide the earnings by 26. This number is your weekly benefit amount. The minimum weekly benefit amount is $32 and the maximum weekly benefit amount is $275.so it is important to account for all wages. You can receive benefits for anywhere between 12 and 23 weeks depending on Florida's current unemployment rate. Benefits will vary for each claimant and will be based on earnings from your base period. Your base period is based on the first four completed quarters within the past 18 months. No one is getting rich from not working.

[retiredguy123]

Not exactly.

All tips received by the server should be reported by the server to the employer, taxed as wages, and included on the W-2. It might be that tips on credit cards are automatically considered to be reported without any other action of the employee but I haven't looked into that. All tips *should* be reported and taxed but that doesn't always happen.

Allocated tips on the W-2 are something different. Allocated tips are based on 8% (usually) of a restaurant's gross receipts. The total amount is allocated to each tipped employee based on an IRS formula. The allocated amount on the W-2 is the difference between their reported amount and their portion of the 8%. The employee has the choice to pay taxes on their allocated amount or to provide evidence that they did not receive that amount.

IRS: Tip Recordkeeping & Reporting (https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/tip-recordkeeping-and-reporting)
While technically correct, I suspect that there is a lot of underreporting of tips to the employers, and the employers rely mostly on the allocated tip calculation to report tip income. Note that the allocated tip amount on the W-2 is added to the total wages and is therefore taxed for the FICA taxes.

[Bill14564]

While technically correct, I suspect that there is a lot of underreporting of tips to the employers, and the employers rely mostly on the allocated tip calculation to report tip income. Note that the allocated tip amount on the W-2 is added to the total wages and is therefore taxed for the FICA taxes.

Am I misreading the document I linked?

If your employer allocated tips to you, then the allocated tips are shown separately in Box 8 of your Form W-2, Wage and Tax Statement. They are not included in Box 1 (Wages, tips, other compensation), Box 5 (Medicare wages and tips), or Box 7 (Social security tips) of your Form W-2.

Generally, you must report the tips allocated to you by your employer on your income tax return. Attach Form 4137, Social Security and Medicare Tax on Unreported Tip Income, to Form 1040, U.S. Individual Income Tax Return, or Form 1040-SR, U.S. Tax Return for Seniors, to report tips allocated by your employer (in Box 8 of Form W-2). (emphasis added)

[retiredguy123]

Am I misreading the document I linked?

If your employer allocated tips to you, then the allocated tips are shown separately in Box 8 of your Form W-2, Wage and Tax Statement. They are not included in Box 1 (Wages, tips, other compensation), Box 5 (Medicare wages and tips), or Box 7 (Social security tips) of your Form W-2.

Generally, you must report the tips allocated to you by your employer on your income tax return. Attach Form 4137, Social Security and Medicare Tax on Unreported Tip Income, to Form 1040, U.S. Individual Income Tax Return, or Form 1040-SR, U.S. Tax Return for Seniors, to report tips allocated by your employer (in Box 8 of Form W-2). (emphasis added)
As I understand it, the amount in Box 8 of your W-2 is transferred to Form 4137, where you are supposed to add any other unreported tips, and pay FICA tax on the total. But, I think that most servers will not add any unreported tips to the Form 4137. So, the only unreported tips on Form 4137 would be the allocated tips in Box 8.

[fdpaq0580]

As I understand it, the amount in Box 8 of your W-2 is transferred to Form 4137, where you are supposed to add any other unreported tips, and pay FICA tax on the total. But, I think that most servers will not add any unreported tips to the Form 4137. So, the only unreported tips on Form 4137 would be the allocated tips in Box 8.

The unfairness of "pooling". Management involvement in what should be a private expression of appreciation between customer and server. And, the spaghetti snarl of tax regs. Another reason to pay servers a regular wage and drop the antiquated "tip" scam.

[Bill14564]

As I understand it, the amount in Box 8 of your W-2 is transferred to Form 4137, where you are supposed to add any other unreported tips, and pay FICA tax on the total. But, I think that most servers will not add any unreported tips to the Form 4137. So, the only unreported tips on Form 4137 would be the allocated tips in Box 8.

I agree. If the server already chose to under-report tips such that they received an amount in box 8 then it is highly unlikely that they would choose to report more.

It's possible that there are reasons other than lack of reporting that result in a number in box 8 but in general I have no sympathy for anyone who intentionally under-reports in order to avoid paying taxes.

[mraines]

Good question. But this is the Villages…many cheap tippers here. My guess..75% tip almost nothing or substandard tips. 20% tip the recommended amount. 5% tip too much and love to brag on totv that they are as generous as Frank Sinatra in his heyday.

Personally…i tip no more than 5%. Why tip to just bring a plate over.

Time to stop this tipping nonsence. Wait…next year it will be suggested u tip 25%.
5% is nothing. These people rely on tips. I just had a waitress tell me someone tipped her less than $3 and she had to share with the hostess so she got virtually nothing. I agree with you that it is nonsense but until someone changes these laws, they need tips to survive.

[fdpaq0580]

5% is nothing. These people rely on tips. I just had a waitress tell me someone tipped her less than $3 and she had to share with the hostess so she got virtually nothing. I agree with you that it is nonsense but until someone changes these laws, they need tips to survive.

While I sympathize with " these people rely on tips", whose fault is that? Not yours and not mine. Why does the freaking hostess, get a cut? Don't they make minimum for walking me to an open table, which I could do if the "Please seat yourself" sign was set out. Doesn't the busperson make minimum? Nobody in the kitchen should rely on tips, surely! And who is this mysterious "runner" that shows up with what is supposed to be my order, makes a guess at what it is then asks "who gets the steak?" Where is my waitperson, you know the one who is supposed to wait on me?

[fdpaq0580]

5% is nothing. These people rely on tips. I just had a waitress tell me someone tipped her less than $3 and she had to share with the hostess so she got virtually nothing. I agree with you that it is nonsense but until someone changes these laws, they need tips to survive.

I hate your waitress. She told you that "oh pity me" tale to make you feel sorry for her and guilt trip you into giving her a bigger tip to make up for the (probably fictional) cheapskate. She sure enhanced your dining experience, didn't she. She had no business discussing any of her personal woes with any customer. Very, very unprofessional. Keep it professional.

[Laker14]

I hate your waitress. She told you that "oh pity me" tale to make you feel sorry for her and guilt trip you into giving her a bigger tip to make up for the (probably fictional) cheapskate. She sure enhanced your dining experience, didn't she. She had no business discussing any of her personal woes with any customer. Very, very unprofessional. Keep it professional.

I agree.

I guess everyone has a different mindset when dining out. I don't really want my server to get too chatty, or too friendly. I'm not looking for another dinner guest. Cheerful, polite, and efficient works best for me.

[ThirdOfFive]

I hate your waitress. She told you that "oh pity me" tale to make you feel sorry for her and guilt trip you into giving her a bigger tip to make up for the (probably fictional) cheapskate. She sure enhanced your dining experience, didn't she. She had no business discussing any of her personal woes with any customer. Very, very unprofessional. Keep it professional.
Nothing wrong with professional. But servers are people too and waitstaff are apt to be young. As in teens-or-early-20s young. Not all, of course, but quite a few it seems.

But tips can be used for more than showing appreciation (or not) for the quality of service. A couple of years back my wife and I were dining at Cody's in LSL, and our waitress was obviously NOT having a good day. I overheard her talking to a co-worker, saying that she had been called in to work ON HER DAY OFF because the place was short-staffed. The coffee she brought was barely warm so I asked her if she could bring me another cup, which she seemed to think was an imposition by the way she exhaled exasperatedly and headed for the kitchen. The hot cup never came, so about 10 minutes later I asked another server passing by if she could get the coffee for me, which she did. Our waitress saw that and said that the reason she was slow was that she was helping out in another section in addition as well as waiting on us. All in all, not a good experience.

Came time to pay the bill (about $25, as I recall). I made it a point to tip the waitress in person ($10) and told her that I hoped that her day would get better. I recall she had a shocked look on her face, followed by a BIG smile.

Made both of us feel good.

[fdpaq0580]

Nothing wrong with professional. But servers are people too and waitstaff are apt to be young. As in teens-or-early-20s young. Not all, of course, but quite a few it seems.

But tips can be used for more than showing appreciation (or not) for the quality of service. A couple of years back my wife and I were dining at Cody's in LSL, and our waitress was obviously NOT having a good day. I overheard her talking to a co-worker, saying that she had been called in to work ON HER DAY OFF because the place was short-staffed. The coffee she brought was barely warm so I asked her if she could bring me another cup, which she seemed to think was an imposition by the way she exhaled exasperatedly and headed for the kitchen. The hot cup never came, so about 10 minutes later I asked another server passing by if she could get the coffee for me, which she did. Our waitress saw that and said that the reason she was slow was that she was helping out in another section in addition as well as waiting on us. All in all, not a good experience.

Came time to pay the bill (about $25, as I recall). I made it a point to tip the waitress in person ($10) and told her that I hoped that her day would get better. I recall she had a shocked look on her face, followed by a BIG smile.

Made both of us feel good.

Good for you! You did something nice. You were generous without the expectation of generosity being forced on you. Giving anything that is not expected is a blessing to both the giver and the gifted! When gratuities are expected/demanded then the blessing becomes a curse and the joy is eliminated.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I hate your waitress. She told you that "oh pity me" tale to make you feel sorry for her and guilt trip you into giving her a bigger tip to make up for the (probably fictional) cheapskate. She sure enhanced your dining experience, didn't she. She had no business discussing any of her personal woes with any customer. Very, very unprofessional. Keep it professional.

Agree, she shouldn't have dumped the guilt trip on the customer.

HOWEVER - the situation she described - really does happen. Even when the tip is a GOOD tip - I mean if the person only ordered a cup of coffee and a slice of cake for $8 total, if they give a $3 tip - that really does get shared with the host and the other wait staff in many places. If it's not cash, it gets pooled. And the waiter who earned that $3 tip might not even see a full dollar of it, once it's been split.

[OpusX1]

We don’t eat out often but when we do we tip minimum $50. Checks over $100 we give 50 percent. We do this because we can and we know about struggling and we like to make someone’s day. Waite staff remember us.

[fdpaq0580]

Agree, she shouldn't have dumped the guilt trip on the customer.

HOWEVER - the situation she described - really does happen. Even when the tip is a GOOD tip - I mean if the person only ordered a cup of coffee and a slice of cake for $8 total, if they give a $3 tip - that really does get shared with the host and the other wait staff in many places (but not all). If it's not cash, it gets pooled. And the waiter who earned that $3 tip might not even see a full dollar of it, once it's been split.

True, but they DO get a share of everyone else's tips. It's sometimes called spreading the wealth or leveling the playing field.

$8 meal. $3 tip. 37.5% is very generous. Maybe, just maybe the cake and coffee is all they could afford for their 90th birthday party of one. Old and alone and poor. And you worry about the waitress and look down on a very generous 37.5%.
If you don't know the circumstances of the customer, you have no right to judge. In my scenario the customer was very generous, and if the tip is pooled that is the waitstaff problem, not the customers. Even though the tip was generous by % standards if the actual cash figure recieved is not appreciated by the recipient, then they don't deserve any tip.

[fdpaq0580]

We don’t eat out often but when we do we tip minimum $50. Checks over $100 we give 50 percent. We do this because we can and we know about struggling and we like to make someone’s day. Waite staff remember us.

And here I thought the Rat Pack was all dead.
Good on you, mate. It's your money (I assume), spend it as you please.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

True, but they DO get a share of everyone else's tips. It's sometimes called spreading the wealth or leveling the playing field.

$8 meal. $3 tip. 37.5% is very generous. Maybe, just maybe the cake and coffee is all they could afford for their 90th birthday party of one. Old and alone and poor. And you worry about the waitress and look down on a very generous 37.5%.
If you don't know the circumstances of the customer, you have no right to judge. In my scenario the customer was very generous, and if the tip is pooled that is the waitstaff problem, not the customers. Even though the tip was generous by % standards if the actual cash figure recieved is not appreciated by the recipient, then they don't deserve any tip.

They get a share of everyone else's tips, minus the tips of the hostess and busboy, who don't get their own tips at all. But the hostess and busboy get a share of everyone else's tips. Even if the hostess was busy with some other party of 3 and the waitress sat her own table's party - even if the busboy was busy with a different table when the waitress served the water and took the plates away from her own assigned table - it doesn't matter. The busboy and hostess will get some of that waitress's earned money. And she has no say-so in the matter. UNLESS it's a cash tip, because she can pocket it.

[tuccillo]

You don't know that. The policy can vary and may require that all tips be shared. I worked as a bartender when I was younger and the policy was that all tips were shared. Pocketing a tip would have had unpleasant consequences.

They get a share of everyone else's tips, minus the tips of the hostess and busboy, who don't get their own tips at all. But the hostess and busboy get a share of everyone else's tips. Even if the hostess was busy with some other party of 3 and the waitress sat her own table's party - even if the busboy was busy with a different table when the waitress served the water and took the plates away from her own assigned table - it doesn't matter. The busboy and hostess will get some of that waitress's earned money. And she has no say-so in the matter. UNLESS it's a cash tip, because she can pocket it.

[fdpaq0580]

You don't know that. The policy can vary and may require that all tips be shared. I worked as a bartender when I was younger and the policy was that all tips were shared. Pocketing a tip would have had unpleasant consequences.

Truth!
Hostess, more often than notin my experience, is nothing more than a greeter who hands the waitperson some menus. The waiter/waitress guides on to our table, explains any specials, gets our drinks then takes our order. The waitstaff does something that impacts the customer. The host/hostess? No sweat, or effort that I can see. Full pay Plus a slice of the gratuity given to the one that put forth some effort on your behalf? Bet I can guess who came up with that scam/scheme

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You don't know that. The policy can vary and may require that all tips be shared. I worked as a bartender when I was younger and the policy was that all tips were shared. Pocketing a tip would have had unpleasant consequences.

I absolutely do know that. I've been a waitress. We were SUPPOSED to pool our tips. But if we were tipped cash, the boss had no way to know how much cash our customers gave us in tips. He wasn't allowed to reach into our pockets, or check our purses in the office. When we tipped out at the end of the night, I might've tossed in a fair chunk to the busboy and the cook. But if the cook screwed up several of my customers' orders, resulting in a lower tip than I could've expected, I might shave extra for myself and tossed less into the share pool.

The only people who knew how much cash I was tipped, were the customers who gave me cash.

[Rainger99]

Speaking of tips, did anyone tip their movers?

I paid about $8,000 for the move which I thought should cover everything.

When the movers arrived (3 movers and the driver/supervisor), the supervisor told me that they expected tips of about 10% - or $800 total for four movers. Tipping $200 for 6 hours of work is $33 an hour on top of what they were being paid by their employer.

I was in a real bind. In about six hours, they were going to be driving off with almost everything I owned. If I didn’t tip them, I had no idea if items might get broken or might be “lost” in the move. I ended up tipping $400 and some items were broken and they also lost several boxes.

Did this happen to anyone else? How much did they demand?

[tuccillo]

You just admitted you stole from your co-workers. I got it.

I absolutely do know that. I've been a waitress. We were SUPPOSED to pool our tips. But if we were tipped cash, the boss had no way to know how much cash our customers gave us in tips. He wasn't allowed to reach into our pockets, or check our purses in the office. When we tipped out at the end of the night, I might've tossed in a fair chunk to the busboy and the cook. But if the cook screwed up several of my customers' orders, resulting in a lower tip than I could've expected, I might shave extra for myself and tossed less into the share pool.

The only people who knew how much cash I was tipped, were the customers who gave me cash.

[starflyte1]

That's nice in theory, but many of us do not use cash anymore.

I always carry ones and fives so I always tip in cash.

[retiredguy123]

I always carry ones and fives so I always tip in cash.
I use 2-dollar bills that I order from the bank, 100 at a time.

[Bill14564]

Speaking of tips, did anyone tip their movers?

I paid about $8,000 for the move which I thought should cover everything.

When the movers arrived (3 movers and the driver/supervisor), the supervisor told me that they expected tips of about 10% - or $800 total for four movers. Tipping $200 for 6 hours of work is $33 an hour on top of what they were being paid by their employer.

I was in a real bind. In about six hours, they were going to be driving off with almost everything I owned. If I didn’t tip them, I had no idea if items might get broken or might be “lost” in the move. I ended up tipping $400 and some items were broken and they also lost several boxes.

Did this happen to anyone else? How much did they demand?

I haven't experienced this in my three moves with moving companies. I do tip on both ends but after the work is done, not before. Clearly, that is a company to avoid in the future.

I vaguely remember seeing something in the contract about the driver asking for more money. Perhaps it happens often enough that there is standard language about it. Still, when you are faced with hard dates for closing, traveling, and basically getting out of the house and when you know that they will be driving away with nearly everything you own then you are not in a very good position to argue or cancel.

[Velvet]

Speaking of tips, did anyone tip their movers?

I paid about $8,000 for the move which I thought should cover everything.

When the movers arrived (3 movers and the driver/supervisor), the supervisor told me that they expected tips of about 10% - or $800 total for four movers. Tipping $200 for 6 hours of work is $33 an hour on top of what they were being paid by their employer.

I was in a real bind. In about six hours, they were going to be driving off with almost everything I owned. If I didn’t tip them, I had no idea if items might get broken or might be “lost” in the move. I ended up tipping $400 and some items were broken and they also lost several boxes.

Did this happen to anyone else? How much did they demand?

Now, I would write up a review in every media I could think of (naming and posting their company) documenting and photographing what happened. Until they begged you to take it down. What you are describing is extortion! If broken stuff was valuable, sue them. I know people who would be picketing outside their office with signs. Don’t, let them get away with it!

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You just admitted you stole from your co-workers. I got it.

No, I admitted that my co-workers stole from me, and I chose not to reward them for it.

[tuccillo]

It is amazing how people attempt to justify their bad behavior. Nice try.

No, I admitted that my co-workers stole from me, and I chose not to reward them for it.