Some Self-Evident Truths

[ThirdOfFive]

Some things I've been pondering lately regarding TOTV and the issues that seem to tie some TOTV'ers into knots....

1. Out-of-compliance yards and homes. Not so much here but if you read the (other!!) online source you'd think TV is nothing but jalopies up on blocks, white crosses by the millions, weed-infested lawns and lanai screens held together with duct tape. But, driving through neighborhood after neighborhood--almost nothing but clean, well-kept properties where pride of ownership is obviously a big thing.

2. Drunken Villagers careening around the squares in golf carts, being scooped up by the dozen by the local gendarmerie and carted off to the hoosegow. But--the rare instances I've seen are usually carts going too slow, probably lost. Nothing like the discussions would lead one to expect.

3. Heated altercations between Villagers. So far in three years I've seen one: two guys at Red Sauce outside bellowing at each other, two tables between them. That's it.

4. Airb&b tenants raising holy h3ll in this-or-that neighborhood. Not in my neighborhood. Probably not in yours either. But Man! Do people like to complain about it!

5. Inebriated folks at the squares. Maybe a few. But they're usually giddy and silly, not combative or looking for trouble.

6. SMOKERS!! Particularly cigar smokers. I've seen a couple, and they were well away from crowd. Certainly not the cloud of blue haze one might expect from some of the complaints.

7. OUTSIDERS AT THE SQUARES. Some, sure. Nice folks. Spend money. Enjoy music.

8. Dog Poop (Everybody's favorite topic). Once in a great while a dog will dump on my lawn. Owner always picks it up. One didn't: I politely asked him to do so. He apologized and did. No problem.

9. Rude Clerks: Mostly the only ones I've seen is if a customer has been rude to them first.

10. Finally, THE DEVELOPER running amok. This shadowy figure, The Developer, takes heat for just about everything, most recently STRs and Airb&bs. People rattling their sabers, planning legal action. And so on. But...said Developer is a multi-BILLION dollar business, most likely with a bunch of top-flight legal beagles protecting his nether regions. I doubt he worries much about the molehills we turn into mountains. Nor should he, given the (often) vast difference between what we see vs. what we hear.

11. Probably many other things I’ve forgotten.

It ain't so bad here, folks. Maybe instead of gnashing our teeth we should be counting our blessings.

[Bogie Shooter]

:agree::wave:

[margaretmattson]

[/QUOTE] All of those may be good and true depending on where you live in the Villages and the frequency you visit the squares, restaurants, stores and rec centers. And, It also depends on your tolerance level.

Everyone is allowed freedom of speech. And, everyone has the right to bring up issues that bother them. They are allowed to fill out complaints and seek legal action. We live in a free country.

Yes, complaining and griping might be unpleasant. Name-calling and shaming of those who are proactive are also unpleasant. But, do expect everyone to put on a fake smile and pretend we live in the perfectville? Welcome to the Villages and welcome to America! I, for one, never want to lose my freedom of speech or the right of due process. Not, do I want to pretend issues do not exist.

Perhaps the reason you say "It's not that bad" is because there are people who fight to make sure it is. Without people practicing their rights and due process, we would be living in a land of make-believe. We would be forced to remain silent and allow others to step on our rights. Not a world I would want to live in.

And, by the way, people comply because there are deed restrictions and laws. Not on their own free will. Who do you think helped you get this "not so bad" world you are living in? Certainly, not the silent ones.

Did it feel good to have the ability to write this post? Thank someone who gave you that right.

[Gpsma]

Sounds like the OP is the Kool Aid provider for the Villages real estate department.

Wonder what the biggest selling flavor is?

[JMintzer]

We all have "the right" to remain silent...

Unfortunately, some do not possess the ability...


- Ron White

[shut the front door]

Obviously the OP hasn't been here long enough to remember the lawsuit(s) that the developer lost. One, to the tune of $40 million for screwing over the residents in CDD1. And that was when Gary Morse was in charge. His grandchildren probably don't remember either, so don't think it won't happen again.

[margaretmattson]

Obviously the OP hasn't been here long enough to remember the lawsuit(s) that the developer lost. One, to the tune of $40 million for screwing over the residents in CDD1. And that was when Gary Morse was in charge. His grandchildren probably don't remember either, so don't think it won't happen again. Right! I have been here for 20+ years and remember that and other issues. Always a good idea to use your right of due process. Can you imagine living in CDD1 at that time? I remember it well. Hopefully, the STR situation will be handled better.

[Pairadocs]

All of those may be good and true depending on where you live in the Villages and the frequency you visit the squares, restaurants, stores and rec centers. And, It also depends on your tolerance level.

Everyone is allowed freedom of speech. And, everyone has the right to bring up issues that bother them. They are allowed to fill out complaints and seek legal action. We live in a free country.

Yes, complaining and griping might be unpleasant. Name-calling and shaming of those who are proactive are also unpleasant. But, do expect everyone to put on a fake smile and pretend we live in the perfectville? Welcome to the Villages and welcome to America! I, for one, never want to lose my freedom of speech or the right of due process. Not, do I want to pretend issues do not exist.

Perhaps the reason you say "It's not that bad" is because there are people who fight to make sure it is. Without people practicing their rights and due process, we would be living in a land of make-believe. We would be forced to remain silent and allow others to step on our rights. Not a world I would want to live in.

And, by the way, people comply because there are deed restrictions and laws. Not on their own free will. Who do you think helped you get this "not so bad" world you are living in? Certainly, not the silent ones.

Did it feel good to have the ability to write this post? Thank someone who gave you that right.[/QUOTE]

Totally AGREE. Promised ourselves we would never become those old, crabby, people who do nothing in retirement but gripe. And, we've tried to stay true to that promise to ourselves, however (and here we go), we also began to take a look at our country in general, the unrest, the (seeming) increase in troubling and violent behavior, looting, homelessness, and so on, and then realized it also does not serve anyone, when we decide to act like ostriches when we see our very community deteriorating, things like (sorry to offend) so much dog poo in trash reciprocals around the pools/postal stations, that the smell is really offensive. Likewise, when the numbers of drunken incidents (once such an incident would have been the talk of the villages for months, but now are pretty much a weekly occurrence, even fatal accidents, people begin to know something is "happening" and it's not a good direction. To waste life looking for mistakes and failures of others, is tragic. But, so is being so uninvolved that you loose your country (Venezuela, Haiti), your city, and your community as a result. On the other side of this, not being able to find any worthwhile pass time except riding around in a golf cart looking for your own friends and neighbors to make a "wrong move", is a sad situation, especially with all the volunteer choices we have here !

[Sabella]

I don’t think freedom of speech and freedom of the press exist anymore but I could be wrong

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Totally AGREE. Promised ourselves we would never become those old, crabby, people who do nothing in retirement but gripe. And, we've tried to stay true to that promise to ourselves, however (and here we go), we also began to take a look at our country in general, the unrest, the (seeming) increase in troubling and violent behavior, looting, homelessness, and so on, and then realized it also does not serve anyone, when we decide to act like ostriches when we see our very community deteriorating, things like (sorry to offend) so much dog poo in trash reciprocals around the pools/postal stations, that the smell is really offensive. Likewise, when the numbers of drunken incidents (once such an incident would have been the talk of the villages for months, but now are pretty much a weekly occurrence, even fatal accidents, people begin to know something is "happening" and it's not a good direction. To waste life looking for mistakes and failures of others, is tragic. But, so is being so uninvolved that you loose your country (Venezuela, Haiti), your city, and your community as a result. On the other side of this, not being able to find any worthwhile pass time except riding around in a golf cart looking for your own friends and neighbors to make a "wrong move", is a sad situation, especially with all the volunteer choices we have here !

:mademyday:
:beer3:

[Bay Kid]

The glass is half empty.

[JGibson]

Just because you don't have an Airbnb problem near you it doesn't mean there isn't an Airbnb problem as I have seen its ramifications firsthand.
Otherwise, stop reading the “other” news and it won't disturb you.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Some things I've been pondering lately regarding TOTV and the issues that seem to tie some TOTV'ers into knots....

1. Out-of-compliance yards and homes. ... driving through neighborhood after neighborhood--almost nothing but clean, well-kept properties where pride of ownership is obviously a big thing.
"Almost nothing but" also in my neighborhood. However, when almost everything looks great, the one that doesn't - stands out like a sore thumb. It becomes the bane of the neighborhood. We don't expect perfection here in the Historic Section. We don't want perfection. But we do want tidiness. Got lawn ornaments? Great. Make sure they're not broken, or tipped over, or covered with weeds. Got a funky colored driveway? Terrific, just try and keep the weeds out of the cracks, and splurge on a re-seal every year or two to protect it and keep it looking colorful.


2. Drunken Villagers careening around the squares in golf carts...
I don't know if they're Villagers. They might not be. I don't know if they're drunk. They might just be visually impaired, or have poor hand-eye coordination and shouldn't be driving at all. But yeah - there are some pretty ridiculous golf cart drivers out there. Not a lot. But enough that they create dangerous situations for everyone else in the area.


3. Heated altercations between Villagers.
Happened once when I worked at Publix. I was the one being yelled at. Sorry you have a miserable life, Madam Customer, but it's above my pay grade. Here's the manager to politely escort you to the exit.


4. Airb&b tenants
I doubt it happens in most neighborhoods. But in the ones it does happen to, it's a valid issue and should be addressed. It's getting more common.

5. Inebriated folks at the squares. There are bars at the squares, therefore there are drunk people. No further explanation or comment necessary.


6. SMOKERS!! Particularly cigar smokers. I'm biased. The smell of cigars nauseates me. Someone smoking one across the street, if the breeze is coming away from them and toward me, will be complaint-worthy. Outdoor cigar smoking should be banned unless you have a 50-yard distance between you and anyone else.

7. OUTSIDERS AT THE SQUARES. Some, sure. Nice folks. Spend money. Enjoy music. Agreed.

8. Dog Poop (Everybody's favorite topic). Agreed, EXCEPT for the ones you don't catch. Several multi-foot patches of our back yard is destroyed because of the neighbor's dog, who they let out to pee there in the early hours of the morning before we wake up. Urine scald is real.

9. Rude Clerks: Mostly the only ones I've seen is if a customer has been rude to them first. Mostly true, though everyone has a bad day once in awhile.

10. Finally, THE DEVELOPER running amok. Thing is - the developer is responsible for "internal" violations of deed restrictions and to date, there is no record of them EVER enforcing those restrictions. There ARE people with minor children living here. There ARE people whose houses have had walls knocked out to convert to illegal bedrooms which they then rent out to transients for less than the cost of a hotel room. There ARE homeowners who have more than the maximum capacity of residents living there. There ARE many people owning, and residing, in homes where no one is 55 or older, in violation of the legal 55+ community designation. The developer receives tax credits for this designation so it's in their best interest to -not- report it, and to -not- do anything about it. They profit more by ignoring it than they do addressing it. That is why they're vilified. They give lip service to the people who are trying to do things the right way, make it LOOK pretty, and then ignore it all once everyone moves in and signs their name to the deed.

[shut the front door]

"Almost nothing but" also in my neighborhood. However, when almost everything looks great, the one that doesn't - stands out like a sore thumb. It becomes the bane of the neighborhood. We don't expect perfection here in the Historic Section. We don't want perfection. But we do want tidiness. Got lawn ornaments? Great. Make sure they're not broken, or tipped over, or covered with weeds. Got a funky colored driveway? Terrific, just try and keep the weeds out of the cracks, and splurge on a re-seal every year or two to protect it and keep it looking colorful.


I don't know if they're Villagers. They might not be. I don't know if they're drunk. They might just be visually impaired, or have poor hand-eye coordination and shouldn't be driving at all. But yeah - there are some pretty ridiculous golf cart drivers out there. Not a lot. But enough that they create dangerous situations for everyone else in the area.


Happened once when I worked at Publix. I was the one being yelled at. Sorry you have a miserable life, Madam Customer, but it's above my pay grade. Here's the manager to politely escort you to the exit.


I doubt it happens in most neighborhoods. But in the ones it does happen to, it's a valid issue and should be addressed. It's getting more common.
There are bars at the squares, therefore there are drunk people. No further explanation or comment necessary.

I'm biased. The smell of cigars nauseates me. Someone smoking one across the street, if the breeze is coming away from them and toward me, will be complaint-worthy. Outdoor cigar smoking should be banned unless you have a 50-yard distance between you and anyone else.
Agreed.
Agreed, EXCEPT for the ones you don't catch. Several multi-foot patches of our back yard is destroyed because of the neighbor's dog, who they let out to pee there in the early hours of the morning before we wake up. Urine scald is real.
Mostly true, though everyone has a bad day once in awhile.
Thing is - the developer is responsible for "internal" violations of deed restrictions and to date, there is no record of them EVER enforcing those restrictions. There ARE people with minor children living here. There ARE people whose houses have had walls knocked out to convert to illegal bedrooms which they then rent out to transients for less than the cost of a hotel room. There ARE homeowners who have more than the maximum capacity of residents living there. There ARE many people owning, and residing, in homes where no one is 55 or older, in violation of the legal 55+ community designation. The developer receives tax credits for this designation so it's in their best interest to -not- report it, and to -not- do anything about it. They profit more by ignoring it than they do addressing it. That is why they're vilified. They give lip service to the people who are trying to do things the right way, make it LOOK pretty, and then ignore it all once everyone moves in and signs their name to the deed.

I can't believe there are people living here for years and don't know that only 80% of homes have to be occupied by someone 55+.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I can't believe there are people living here for years and don't know that only 80% of homes have to be occupied by someone 55+.

I know this. But it -appears- as though there are more than 20% of homes - at least in some areas - that have no one 55% living there. It -appears- as though there is no enforcement of this.

[Bill14564]

...
Thing is - the developer is responsible for "internal" violations of deed restrictions and to date, there is no record of them EVER enforcing those restrictions. There ARE people with minor children living here. There ARE people whose houses have had walls knocked out to convert to illegal bedrooms which they then rent out to transients for less than the cost of a hotel room. There ARE homeowners who have more than the maximum capacity of residents living there. There ARE many people owning, and residing, in homes where no one is 55 or older, in violation of the legal 55+ community designation. The developer receives tax credits for this designation so it's in their best interest to -not- report it, and to -not- do anything about it. They profit more by ignoring it than they do addressing it. That is why they're vilified. They give lip service to the people who are trying to do things the right way, make it LOOK pretty, and then ignore it all once everyone moves in and signs their name to the deed.

- In my deed restrictions there is no mention of the internal design of my house - no mention of not remodeling to add or remove walls. Can you provide an example of the language in your restrictions that prohibit that?

- In my deed restrictions there is no mention of a maximum capacity of residents. Can you provide an example of the language in your restrictions that states a maximum capacity?

- The "legal 55+ community designation" does NOT require that every occupied home has a resident 55 or over. Who would even provide that designation anyway?

- My deed restrictions specifically state that NOT every occupied home must have a resident 55 or over. "...even though there is not a permanent resident in the Home who is fifty-five (55) years of age or over..." and "...it being the intent that at least 80% of the units shall at all times have at least one resident fifty-five (55) years of age or older."

- What tax credits does the developer receive for a 55+ designation? In another thread a poster contacted HUD and learned that this developer does not receive any tax credits.

Perhaps part of the problem is the lack of understanding of the law and the restrictions.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

We are seeing more people who are under 55, moving in - whether buying or renting - than previously. Is it more than 80%? I don't know. The Developer doesn't know either, because the Developer doesn't keep track of short-term tenants, UNLESS those tenants are getting guest/residence passes. If they're not getting passes, then the Developer has no way of knowing that they're there at all.

So sure - it's possible that no more than 20% of all homes are occupied by people who are under 55 (with no one 55 or over in those 20% properties), it's also possible that 30% are, at least some of the time. It's even possible that 40% are, at least some of the time. It's also possible that only 10% are. The law requires a 55+ Community to be consistent. At least 80% of all homes must be occupied by at least 1 person age 55 or older. The deed restriction (which is not the law) further requires that NO one under age 19 be allowed to live in the home.

We had one family up the street, elderly sisters we think - who had a grandson of one of them living with them. They didn't move in and then "get stuck" with the kid - I would totally understand that, even though it breaks the rule. They moved in, already having custody of that grandson. The grandson was grade-school age, most likely between 9-11 years old. They should not have been permitted to move in with that circumstance. But they lived there for a year. Whether they owned or rented, we never found out. The house was sold around the time they moved in so either could be true.

That is an "internal" deed restriction. It's something that never should have been allowed to happen in the first place. Clearly the Developer either a) has no control over these things or b) doesn't care and chooses not to enforce their own rules. If they had, it wouldn't have happened.

These kinds of things are happening more and more. Snowbird season, off-season, there are more minor children of all ages living in the Villages. Are they tenants or kids of homeowner-residents? No idea. All I know is - they're not supposed to be there for more than 30 days per YEAR and they are absolutely there longer than that.

[Dond1959]

We are seeing more people who are under 55, moving in - whether buying or renting - than previously. Is it more than 80%? I don't know. The Developer doesn't know either, because the Developer doesn't keep track of short-term tenants, UNLESS those tenants are getting guest/residence passes. If they're not getting passes, then the Developer has no way of knowing that they're there at all.

So sure - it's possible that no more than 20% of all homes are occupied by people who are under 55 (with no one 55 or over in those 20% properties), it's also possible that 30% are, at least some of the time. It's even possible that 40% are, at least some of the time. It's also possible that only 10% are. The law requires a 55+ Community to be consistent. At least 80% of all homes must be occupied by at least 1 person age 55 or older. The deed restriction (which is not the law) further requires that NO one under age 19 be allowed to live in the home.

We had one family up the street, elderly sisters we think - who had a grandson of one of them living with them. They didn't move in and then "get stuck" with the kid - I would totally understand that, even though it breaks the rule. They moved in, already having custody of that grandson. The grandson was grade-school age, most likely between 9-11 years old. They should not have been permitted to move in with that circumstance. But they lived there for a year. Whether they owned or rented, we never found out. The house was sold around the time they moved in so either could be true.

That is an "internal" deed restriction. It's something that never should have been allowed to happen in the first place. Clearly the Developer either a) has no control over these things or b) doesn't care and chooses not to enforce their own rules. If they had, it wouldn't have happened.

These kinds of things are happening more and more. Snowbird season, off-season, there are more minor children of all ages living in the Villages. Are they tenants or kids of homeowner-residents? No idea. All I know is - they're not supposed to be there for more than 30 days per YEAR and they are absolutely there longer than that.

The above is just complete speculation. How do you know? Did you go house to house and inspect drivers license of everyone living there? The developer turns the neighborhoods over to the CDDs who are responsible for any enforcement of deed restrictions. You have lived here how long and don’t know that?

[Bogie Shooter]

The above is just complete speculation. How do you know? Did you go house to house and inspect drivers license of everyone living there? The developer turns the neighborhoods over to the CDDs who are responsible for any enforcement of deed restrictions. You have lived here how long and don’t know that?

Not “any”.
Look it up!

[golfing eagles]

The above is just complete speculation. How do you know? Did you go house to house and inspect drivers license of everyone living there? The developer turns the neighborhoods over to the CDDs who are responsible for any enforcement of deed restrictions. You have lived here how long and don’t know that?

Check the driver's license of a 9 year old?????? You should read OBB's post again.

[shut the front door]

Check the driver's license of a 9 year old?????? You should read OBB's post again.

He's referring to the assertion that more than 20% of homes are occupied by people under 55. Somehow, OBB thinks the authorities should go door to door and check ages of people. :ohdear:

[margaretmattson]

We are seeing more people who are under 55, moving in - whether buying or renting - than previously. Is it more than 80%? I don't know. The Developer doesn't know either, because the Developer doesn't keep track of short-term tenants, UNLESS those tenants are getting guest/residence passes. If they're not getting passes, then the Developer has no way of knowing that they're there at all.

So sure - it's possible that no more than 20% of all homes are occupied by people who are under 55 (with no one 55 or over in those 20% properties), it's also possible that 30% are, at least some of the time. It's even possible that 40% are, at least some of the time. It's also possible that only 10% are. The law requires a 55+ Community to be consistent. At least 80% of all homes must be occupied by at least 1 person age 55 or older. The deed restriction (which is not the law) further requires that NO one under age 19 be allowed to live in the home.

We had one family up the street, elderly sisters we think - who had a grandson of one of them living with them. They didn't move in and then "get stuck" with the kid - I would totally understand that, even though it breaks the rule. They moved in, already having custody of that grandson. The grandson was grade-school age, most likely between 9-11 years old. They should not have been permitted to move in with that circumstance. But they lived there for a year. Whether they owned or rented, we never found out. The house was sold around the time they moved in so either could be true.

That is an "internal" deed restriction. It's something that never should have been allowed to happen in the first place. Clearly the Developer either a) has no control over these things or b) doesn't care and chooses not to enforce their own rules. If they had, it wouldn't have happened.

These kinds of things are happening more and more. Snowbird season, off-season, there are more minor children of all ages living in the Villages. Are they tenants or kids of homeowner-residents? No idea. All I know is - they're not supposed to be there for more than 30 days per YEAR and they are absolutely there longer than that.
Under Florida Law, It is the developers responsibility to make certain that the 80/20 rule is maintained at ALL TIMES. Great post! Residents should start demanding to see the periodic counts that are required by Florida Law. Why just sit back and believe them?

Not certain how they are counting investor properties they do not even know about. But, it ABSOLUTELY is their responsibility to supply ACCURATE counts. No just looking at the age of the owners on the deeds.

If homes are rented out, the 80/20 is in question. The rule states 80% of homes must be OCCUPIED by someone over 55+. Homes that are sitting UNOCCUPIED waiting to rent go against this law and should be counted in the 20%.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Here's the actual text of the law, from the government's own website:
Federal Register 24 CFR Part 100; section 760.24-760.37 (4a), Florida Statutes

For a community to be considered "housing for older persons" as a 55+ community, the housing must be intended and operated for occupancy by persons 55 years of age or older and meet the following requirements:

At least 80% of the occupied units are occupied by at least one person 55 years of age or older.

The facility or community publishes and adheres to policies and procedures that demonstrate its intent to in fact be a provider of housing for older persons.

The facility or community complies with rules established by the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) for verification of occupancy.

So Margaret is incorrect. The unoccupied units don't count in regards to the 80/20 restriction.

80% of OCCUPIED units - have to be occupied by at least 1 person 55 or older.

Until and unless the Developer - who is responsible for enforcing that restriction, chooses to maintain data and report it on a regular basis, no one will know whether it is being enforced or not.

[margaretmattson]

Here's the actual text of the law, from the government's own website:


So Margaret is incorrect. The unoccupied units don't count in regards to the 80/20 restriction.

80% of OCCUPIED units - have to be occupied by at least 1 person 55 or older.

Until and unless the Developer - who is responsible for enforcing that restriction, chooses to maintain data and report it on a regular basis, no one will know whether it is being enforced or not. I believe that is what I said. The unoccupied units DO NOT count. I said they should be counted in the 20% not the 80%. Either way, we are saying the exact same thing. Data needs to be ACCURATELY recorded on a regular basis and IT IS REQUIRED BY FLORIDA LAW. I am consulting a lawyer about this. I would rather KNOW my rights than guess. You are on the right track. Start questioning the actual numbers. A community can not call themselves a 55+ community without adhering CONSTANTLY to the 80/20 rule. That is just simple common sense. If it smells fishy, it probably is!

I believe anyone who posts the contrary is probably an investor. What resident wouldn't want to see an accurate count that is required by Florida Law? Scary for an investor though.

[margaretmattson]

The above is just complete speculation. How do you know? Did you go house to house and inspect drivers license of everyone living there? The developer turns the neighborhoods over to the CDDs who are responsible for any enforcement of deed restrictions. You have lived here how long and don’t know that? It is simple common sense that a 55+ community must constantly adhere to the 80/20 rule. If there is even a slight variable, it cannot be called a 55+ community. 79/21? Even for one month? No good!

We as homeowners can speculate as much as we want on the numbers. It is the responsibility of the CDD and/or the developer to keep accurate counts and to find fixes when the 80/20 numbers are off. They are the ones who can not speculate. Which is the point of OBB post.

[TillyBear]

Subscribe




Edit/Delete



Reply





Quick Reply










Reply
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2


Tags

squares, neighborhood, folks, developer, villagers


Quick Reply

Message:


















Options
Quote message in reply?





«
Previous Thread
|
Next Thread
»



You are viewing a new design of the TOTV site. Click here to revert to the old version.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:10 AM.

Footer



Your complete guide to The Villages Florida including real estate, relocation guides, golf courses, town squares and everything about life in The Villages Florida.















© Talk Of The Villages, Copyright 2020. All rights reserved. Content, Design and Layout may not be reproduced
This site is owned and operated by TalkofTheVillages.com and is not affliated with the The Villages or The Villages development company.
Home


Forums


Classifieds


Advertise


Contact Us


Privacy Policy


Website Rules






Search Engine Optimisation provided by
DragonByte SEO v2.0.32 (Pro) -
vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

[margaretmattson]

///

[margaretmattson]

/////

[margaretmattson]

It is simple common sense that a 55+ community must constantly adhere to the 80/20 rule. If there is even a slight variable, it cannot be called a 55+ community. 79/21? Even for one month? No good!

We as homeowners can speculate as much as we want on the numbers. It is the responsibility of the CDD and/or the developer to keep accurate counts and to find fixes when the 80/20 numbers are off. They are the ones who can not speculate. Which is the point of OBB post. ///

[MidWestIA]

There is NOWHERE with so may activities and peers to do them with

[Laker14]

My initial reaction to the OP was that it was a post complaining about complainers, and then I realized that my post could be interpreted as a post complaining about a post complaining about complainers.

So I decided not to post. Which I'm not. Please disregard this post.

[John Mayes]

Here's the actual text of the law, from the government's own website:


So Margaret is incorrect. The unoccupied units don't count in regards to the 80/20 restriction.

80% of OCCUPIED units - have to be occupied by at least 1 person 55 or older.

Until and unless the Developer - who is responsible for enforcing that restriction, chooses to maintain data and report it on a regular basis, no one will know whether it is being enforced or not.

I would be willing to bet that federal and state monitoring and reporting requirements are strictly adhered to by TV’s. Just because TV’s doesn’t report the data to you or any other individual doesn’t mean that it isn’t happening.

[banjobob]

Thirdoffive. Reading this gossip sheet daily will lead you believe all the things you note is the “norm” . Sure the lowest hanging fruit are guilty of those unsavory behavior but the vast majority are really good people living and enjoying this wonderful place.

[Carlsondm]

I agree. We also like the clean, air conditioned Rec centers The Villages provides. Also clean, refreshing pools, and ice water in coolers provided near MMPs and outdoor sports. The little touches matter.

[ThirdOfFive]

Thirdoffive. Reading this gossip sheet daily will lead you believe all the things you note is the “norm” . Sure the lowest hanging fruit are guilty of those unsavory behavior but the vast majority are really good people living and enjoying this wonderful place.
Indeed! Which was the whole point of the OP. What we read, hear and see about TV in various media in the great majority of instances is as far removed from reality as night is from day.

We could just chalk it up to idle bellyaching but unfortunately what we read here (and in other places) seems to be symptomatic of the real sickness infecting society today. Us against them! Home run or no count! Win at all costs! Wave our flags and sabers to the extent that the Great Unwashed are whipped into a frenzy regardless of the realities of the situation!

In other words, the win has become more important than the solution.

What many people don't seem to realize is that there IS another way, a way that leaves a minimum of bruised feelings, for many of the items in the OP list but especially the last one; the perceived problem of Airb&bs and STRs--something that many if not most of us do not even perceive as a problem but are seeing emotional diatribes concerning it on a daily basis nevertheless. What does even the threat of legal action against this shadowy "Developer" accomplish? In a word, nothing. It is the epitome of us against them, and in this case "them" has all the money and the big guns. Regardless of how it ends, there are going to be bruised feelings causing malaise far into the future.

There is a better way, one that has been under our noses the whole time but either ignored or unseen. No court action is going to force folks currently owning and renting out either STRs or Airb&bs to stop: the threat of retaliatory legal action on their part is just too great, with the ONLY guarantee is one of animosity lasting far into the future. Why not direct efforts to getting the powers-that-be to enforce the rules that they themselves created? If a rental or airb&b is causing problems that violate the various restrictions in place--then we as homeowners should have, and should insist upon, the right that was in effect guaranteed when we moved here: the right to quiet enjoyment of our properties. Report the violation and have the guarantee of prompt action on the part of the powers-that-be in cleaning it up. Seems to me that even if push comes to shove on that, the fact that those rules have already been written down would be far better ammunition in a real or threatened court action than what is currently being bandied about now: which in effect is proposing to burn down 40 acres of forest because of a few infected trees.

We seem to have lost the ability to compromise. It is imperative that we find it again.

[dnobles]

Some things I've been pondering lately regarding TOTV and the issues that seem to tie some TOTV'ers into knots....

1. Out-of-compliance yards and homes. Not so much here but if you read the (other!!) online source you'd think TV is nothing but jalopies up on blocks, white crosses by the millions, weed-infested lawns and lanai screens held together with duct tape. But, driving through neighborhood after neighborhood--almost nothing but clean, well-kept properties where pride of ownership is obviously a big thing.

2. Drunken Villagers careening around the squares in golf carts, being scooped up by the dozen by the local gendarmerie and carted off to the hoosegow. But--the rare instances I've seen are usually carts going too slow, probably lost. Nothing like the discussions would lead one to expect.

3. Heated altercations between Villagers. So far in three years I've seen one: two guys at Red Sauce outside bellowing at each other, two tables between them. That's it.

4. Airb&b tenants raising holy h3ll in this-or-that neighborhood. Not in my neighborhood. Probably not in yours either. But Man! Do people like to complain about it!

5. Inebriated folks at the squares. Maybe a few. But they're usually giddy and silly, not combative or looking for trouble.

6. SMOKERS!! Particularly cigar smokers. I've seen a couple, and they were well away from crowd. Certainly not the cloud of blue haze one might expect from some of the complaints.

7. OUTSIDERS AT THE SQUARES. Some, sure. Nice folks. Spend money. Enjoy music.

8. Dog Poop (Everybody's favorite topic). Once in a great while a dog will dump on my lawn. Owner always picks it up. One didn't: I politely asked him to do so. He apologized and did. No problem.

9. Rude Clerks: Mostly the only ones I've seen is if a customer has been rude to them first.

10. Finally, THE DEVELOPER running amok. This shadowy figure, The Developer, takes heat for just about everything, most recently STRs and Airb&bs. People rattling their sabers, planning legal action. And so on. But...said Developer is a multi-BILLION dollar business, most likely with a bunch of top-flight legal beagles protecting his nether regions. I doubt he worries much about the molehills we turn into mountains. Nor should he, given the (often) vast difference between what we see vs. what we hear.

11. Probably many other things I’ve forgotten.

It ain't so bad here, folks. Maybe instead of gnashing our teeth we should be counting our blessings.
Great post

[talonip]

Awesome post. Right on.

[Nevinator]

Right! I have been here for 20+ years and remember that and other issues. Always a good idea to use your right of due process. Can you imagine living in CDD1 at that time? I remember it well. Hopefully, the STR situation will be handled better.
What is the STR situation?

[Bilyclub]

I agree. We also like the clean, air conditioned Rec centers The Villages provides. Also clean, refreshing pools, and ice water in coolers provided near MMPs and outdoor sports. The little touches matter.

The ice water depends on who is working inside. This summer only seen them come out less than half the days to check the water.

[maistocars]

Very well said!

[kendi]

All of those may be good and true depending on where you live in the Villages and the frequency you visit the squares, restaurants, stores and rec centers. And, It also depends on your tolerance level.

Everyone is allowed freedom of speech. And, everyone has the right to bring up issues that bother them. They are allowed to fill out complaints and seek legal action. We live in a free country.

Yes, complaining and griping might be unpleasant. Name-calling and shaming of those who are proactive are also unpleasant. But, do expect everyone to put on a fake smile and pretend we live in the perfectville? Welcome to the Villages and welcome to America! I, for one, never want to lose my freedom of speech or the right of due process. Not, do I want to pretend issues do not exist.

Perhaps the reason you say "It's not that bad" is because there are people who fight to make sure it is. Without people practicing their rights and due process, we would be living in a land of make-believe. We would be forced to remain silent and allow others to step on our rights. Not a world I would want to live in.

And, by the way, people comply because there are deed restrictions and laws. Not on their own free will. Who do you think helped you get this "not so bad" world you are living in? Certainly, not the silent ones.

Did it feel good to have the ability to write this post? Thank someone who gave you that right.[/QUOTE]

Oh my. Didn’t expect the OP’s post as one to spur such emotion.

[ehonour]

...And, It also depends on your tolerance level. ...

Bingo. Life for me is filled with peace because I practice a fairly high tolerance level.

[Txcottage]

Margaret, you seem unhappy here.

[BaylorBear]

Some things I've been pondering lately regarding TOTV and the issues that seem to tie some TOTV'ers into knots....

1. Out-of-compliance yards and homes. Not so much here but if you read the (other!!) online source you'd think TV is nothing but jalopies up on blocks, white crosses by the millions, weed-infested lawns and lanai screens held together with duct tape. But, driving through neighborhood after neighborhood--almost nothing but clean, well-kept properties where pride of ownership is obviously a big thing.

2. Drunken Villagers careening around the squares in golf carts, being scooped up by the dozen by the local gendarmerie and carted off to the hoosegow. But--the rare instances I've seen are usually carts going too slow, probably lost. Nothing like the discussions would lead one to expect.

3. Heated altercations between Villagers. So far in three years I've seen one: two guys at Red Sauce outside bellowing at each other, two tables between them. That's it.

4. Airb&b tenants raising holy h3ll in this-or-that neighborhood. Not in my neighborhood. Probably not in yours either. But Man! Do people like to complain about it!

5. Inebriated folks at the squares. Maybe a few. But they're usually giddy and silly, not combative or looking for trouble.

6. SMOKERS!! Particularly cigar smokers. I've seen a couple, and they were well away from crowd. Certainly not the cloud of blue haze one might expect from some of the complaints.

7. OUTSIDERS AT THE SQUARES. Some, sure. Nice folks. Spend money. Enjoy music.

8. Dog Poop (Everybody's favorite topic). Once in a great while a dog will dump on my lawn. Owner always picks it up. One didn't: I politely asked him to do so. He apologized and did. No problem.

9. Rude Clerks: Mostly the only ones I've seen is if a customer has been rude to them first.

10. Finally, THE DEVELOPER running amok. This shadowy figure, The Developer, takes heat for just about everything, most recently STRs and Airb&bs. People rattling their sabers, planning legal action. And so on. But...said Developer is a multi-BILLION dollar business, most likely with a bunch of top-flight legal beagles protecting his nether regions. I doubt he worries much about the molehills we turn into mountains. Nor should he, given the (often) vast difference between what we see vs. what we hear.

11. Probably many other things I’ve forgotten.

It ain't so bad here, folks. Maybe instead of gnashing our teeth we should be counting our blessings.

Well said, my friend, well said!!:agree:

[RUCdaze]

ThirdOfFive, the original poster, had me right up until he defended the developer. That blew all his credibility. The Morse family is too far removed from the common Villager, and too isolated, to understand how we feel on many major issues.

[Bogie Shooter]

Margaret, you seem unhappy here.

:1rotfl:

[golfing eagles]

Margaret, you seem unhappy here.

What could ever give you that idea?😂😂😂

[Bogie Shooter]

What could ever give you that idea?😂😂😂

- she posts on every thread.
- just as before?

[Jerseybob]

I agree with the OP. I might also add this set of words that a learned from a smart friend.

Most of the things in our world can be viewed from a 100% perspective. Things we do, things we buy, places we visit, places we live and have lived...etc.

When a person believes that 95% of the time with that, things, place, event...etc.. is good for them overall, they are usually content. When a person focuses for a long period focused on the negative 5% that is not good overall for them, it is probably time for that person to make a change of whatever is so negative to a better personal choice.

[Bilyclub]

- she posts on every thread.
- just as before?

Hasn't posted in a couple of days, must be honoring the writer's strike.

[golfing eagles]

Hasn't posted in a couple of days, must be honoring the writer's strike.

Or possibly on "vacation" for posting some nasty personal attacks.

[JMintzer]

Or possibly on "vacation" for posting some nasty personal attacks.

That would be my guess...

Not that I'd know about being "on vacation" or anything... :boxing2:

[Cococat]

My initial reaction to the OP was that it was a post complaining about complainers, and then I realized that my post could be interpreted as a post complaining about a post complaining about complainers.

So I decided not to post. Which I'm not. Please disregard this post.
Hilarious