The Flu Shot is Here

[retiredguy123]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.

[Pugchief]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

[Bill14564]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

Covid vax scandal? If you believe there was a scandal in the face of medical opinion to the contrary then why ask about medical opinion now?

Getting the flu shot is as worthwhile today as it was ten years ago and possibly more so since we are all ten years older.

[asianthree]

Many Healthcare workers didn’t want any vaccines in their bodies. Last flu shot was over 30 years ago..caused severe reaction… the hospital system I worked for had no issues with me not getting the vaccine. Plus being exposed on a daily basis with 150 people a day…lNever had the flu…even a cold is rare for me.

The last year I worked for them the Free Free (no additives and ????) Vaccine came out. The new Chief decided I had to get the vaccine, I said No. He looked at my chart, and stamped Vaccine Not Required.

I have no issues with those who choose to be vaccinated, with whatever the government has this year.

[Altavia]

Covid vax scandal? If you believe there was a scandal in the face of medical opinion to the contrary then why ask about medical opinion now?

Getting the flu shot is as worthwhile today as it was ten years ago and possibly more so since we are all ten years older.

Agree and I'll be adding the RSV vaccine also.

[oldtimes]

Many Healthcare workers didn’t want any vaccines in their bodies. Last flu shot was over 30 years ago..caused severe reaction… the hospital system I worked for had no issues with me not getting the vaccine. Plus being exposed on a daily basis with 150 people a day…lNever had the flu…even a cold is rare for me.

The last year I worked for them the Free Free (no additives and ????) Vaccine came out. The new Chief decided I had to get the vaccine, I said No. He looked at my chart, and stamped Vaccine Not Required.

I have no issues with those who choose to be vaccinated, with whatever the government has this year.

I agree. My spouse and I do not get them (or the Covid boosters) and do not get sick.

[Whitley]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

I "Think" the flu shot is a traditional vaccine. Not sure though.

[Djean1981]

I never had a flu shot or the flu.

[Whitley]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

There are countries that no longer recommend the covid jab. Dr John Campbell has some great videos out on side effects etc.. Regardless of what science comes out, some have invested so much of who they are into supporting it that there will always be a market ready to continue to get the jab (and covid too). It has become another form of divisive politics.

[golfing eagles]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

Covid vax scandal? If you believe there was a scandal in the face of medical opinion to the contrary then why ask about medical opinion now?

Getting the flu shot is as worthwhile today as it was ten years ago and possibly more so since we are all ten years older.

I "Think" the flu shot is a traditional vaccine. Not sure though.

Bill is 100% correct. We got sidetracked with COVID and a new type of vaccine that some considered controversial. But every year 35-70,000 Americans die of the flu. Not during COVID, of course, since it all got coded as COVID for $14,000 extra/patient.

The flu shot is a "traditional" vaccine---and except for some intranasal forms is a dead virus, not a live attenuated one. The most likely "side effect" of a flu shot is a sore arm. Period.

As far as RSV goes, when I was practicing it was a disease of young children, possibly a few immunocompromised folks. I never saw a case in and adult in 30+ years. Now that some company invented a vaccine, we are being told that seniors are at risk and should get the shot. From my perspective, the jury is out on that one.

Bottom line, IF I were to give advice, which I don't do, it would be to unequivocally get your flu shot.

[Pugchief]

Covid vax scandal? If you believe there was a scandal in the face of medical opinion to the contrary then why ask about medical opinion now?


Because I don't believe it was necessarily mainstream doctors pushing repeated vaccines/boosters but the government (CDC, Fauci, etc). In fact, after receiving the first 2 doses, by the time I was "due" for a booster, my internist told me NOT to get get it unless I wanted to, as I was not overweight, diabetic or co-morbid in any other way.

If you look at all the lies we were told...

-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

...it would make any person with the ability to think critically that maybe other virus vaccines that are heavily pushed may also not live up to their hype. You do know that Flu shots are just a guess at what will be the prevalent strain, right? And if they guess wrong, the shot is essentially worthless.

[NotGolfer]

Well. I used to get the flu shot but every year I did that----I got the flu!! One year it was twice!! So then I decided they're not for me! I did NOT get the vaxx that so many thought we "needed". I got the plague---and I'm immunocompromised but it was like the flu or bad cold. I did recover.
They (health-care officials) used it to their advantage and so many bought into the lie. Now, some countries are pulling back. Yes, people died BUT I take issue when the health-care folks, who are supposed to care---marked ALL the deaths due to covid. When "some" health-care people tried to push back---they lost their jobs!! Fear and intimidation is what it all was. Wouldn't let families be with their loved ones and did the tests that would give false positives or negatives.

[Bill14564]

Because I don't believe it was necessarily mainstream doctors pushing repeated vaccines/boosters but the government (CDC, Fauci, etc). In fact, after receiving the first 2 doses, by the time I was "due" for a booster, my internist told me NOT to get get it unless I wanted to, as I was not overweight, diabetic or co-morbid in any other way.

If you look at all the lies we were told...

-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

...it would make any person with the ability to think critically that maybe other virus vaccines that are heavily pushed may also not live up to their hype. You do know that Flu shots are just a guess at what will be the prevalent strain, right? And if they guess wrong, the shot is essentially worthless.

A critical thinker would recognize that no vaccine is 100% effective. A critical thinker might have looked past the marketing and read the results of the vaccine trials. A critical thinker would maybe question whether the CDC represented mainstream doctors but would then consider the possibility that the CDC (and FDA and research labs) are very nearly the definition of mainstream.

I wonder if your internist told you NOT to get the vaccine or agreed with you that you were not one of the high risk individuals who the vaccine was being recommended for. To me, there is a big difference between "don't get the vaccine" and "don't bother getting the vaccine unless you want to."

Out of my area of expertise but I believe that even if they are right (and you might want to investigate who "they" are) the flu shot is still not 100% effective.

I will be waiting for the next version of the Covid vaccine to come out and then getting both the flu and Covid shots. (or October'ish for just the flu, whichever comes first)

[Bill14564]

Well. I used to get the flu shot but every year I did that----I got the flu!! One year it was twice!! So then I decided they're not for me! I did NOT get the vaxx that so many thought we "needed". I got the plague---and I'm immunocompromised but it was like the flu or bad cold. I did recover.
They (health-care officials) used it to their advantage and so many bought into the lie. Now, some countries are pulling back. Yes, people died BUT I take issue when the health-care folks, who are supposed to care---marked ALL the deaths due to covid. When "some" health-care people tried to push back---they lost their jobs!! Fear and intimidation is what it all was. Wouldn't let families be with their loved ones and did the tests that would give false positives or negatives.

Did they? Did they mark ALL the deaths due to covid? If I found a page of statistics for 2020 and 2021 I would find zero deaths from car accidents and zero deaths from shootings and zero deaths from heart disease and zero deaths from influenza and zero deaths from pneumonia because ALL the deaths were marked covid?

[Pugchief]

A critical thinker would recognize that no vaccine is 100% effective. A critical thinker might have looked past the marketing and read the results of the vaccine trials. A critical thinker would maybe question whether the CDC represented mainstream doctors but would then consider the possibility that the CDC (and FDA and research labs) are very nearly the definition of mainstream.

I wonder if your internist told you NOT to get the vaccine or agreed with you that you were not one of the high risk individuals who the vaccine was being recommended for. To me, there is a big difference between "don't get the vaccine" and "don't bother getting the vaccine unless you want to."

Out of my area of expertise but I believe that even if they are right (and you might want to investigate who "they" are) the flu shot is still not 100% effective.

I will be waiting for the next version of the Covid vaccine to come out and then getting both the flu and Covid shots. (or October'ish for just the flu, whichever comes first)

Whether any vax is 100% effective has no bearing on the LIES they pushed to get people on board with the Covid jab. The Covid jab did NOT prevent you from either getting or transmitting Covid.

Whoever told you that Flu vaccines are 100% effective is either lying or clueless.

[Pugchief]

I wonder if your internist told you NOT to get the vaccine or agreed with you that you were not one of the high risk individuals who the vaccine was being recommended for. To me, there is a big difference between "don't get the vaccine" and "don't bother getting the vaccine unless you want to."


It was the latter, i.e., he didn't think the cost/benefit ratio in my particular case necessitated getting a booster, but he had no issues with me getting one.

[golfing eagles]

A critical thinker would recognize that no vaccine is 100% effective.


Whoever told you that Flu vaccines are 100% effective is either lying or clueless.

Reading comprehension---It's not just for breakfast anymore:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[charlie1]

Because I don't believe it was necessarily mainstream doctors pushing repeated vaccines/boosters but the government (CDC, Fauci, etc). In fact, after receiving the first 2 doses, by the time I was "due" for a booster, my internist told me NOT to get get it unless I wanted to, as I was not overweight, diabetic or co-morbid in any other way.

If you look at all the lies we were told...

-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

...it would make any person with the ability to think critically that maybe other virus vaccines that are heavily pushed may also not live up to their hype. You do know that Flu shots are just a guess at what will be the prevalent strain, right? And if they guess wrong, the shot is essentially worthless.

I never saw any of these promises
-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

Your internist, I am sure, told you that your chances of getting a severe case with your then current health conditions are small. I doubt he told you NOT to get the booster.

What we were told is that they REDUCE THE CHANCE of getting a severe case and/or die. It was never even touted to be anywhere close to 100% effective.

The only thing that is right with this post is that they do take an educated guess on the Flu virus's that will be prevalent in the next year for the annual flu shot. If their educated guess is wrong and new strains appear, the flu shot would not be effective for these strains.

[Bill14564]

Whether any vax is 100% effective has no bearing on the LIES they pushed to get people on board with the Covid jab. The Covid jab did NOT prevent you from either getting or transmitting Covid.

Whoever told you that Flu vaccines are 100% effective is either lying or clueless.

The manufacturer never said that it did either of those things. The manufacturer said that in trials it was found to reduce serious illness and death by about 95%. (at least for Pfizer. I believe that was also the case for Moderna but I didn't read that study and I never looked for the J&J results) I do not recall any study showing real world experience differed greatly from the study results.

There were, and probably still are, a lot of exaggerations going around. Look past the exaggerations and marketing and understand what you are really buying.

I don't feel lied to or manipulated or misled by the CDC or administration in any way. I understand that neither President was a medical doctor and so I didn't take their statements as medically accurate. I listened to Fauci and understood that he was doing the best he could with a dynamic situation. I tried to follow up on what I heard and find more details and facts but my attitude was more of "trust and verify" than "disbelieve and refute."

[JMintzer]

Did they? Did they mark ALL the deaths due to covid? If I found a page of statistics for 2020 and 2021 I would find zero deaths from car accidents and zero deaths from shootings and zero deaths from heart disease and zero deaths from influenza and zero deaths from pneumonia because ALL the deaths were marked covid?

There were most certainly states that marked ALL deaths with a COVID DIAGNOSIS as a death due to covid. Including traffic fatalities...

I've posted the video of the department of health officials stating exactly that, multiple times.

But thanks for proving that these type of threads are useless.

You only see what you want to see...

Here's a case of a patient with stage 4 colon cancer, in hospice, waiting to die. He happened to contract covid while in hospice. Guess what was put on his death certificate?

Dying with COVID and dying from COVID are same thing in Oregon | kgw.com (https://www.kgw.com/article/news/investigations/questions-over-the-accuracy-of-how-the-state-tracks-covid-deaths/283-0b1b7b6c-695e-4313-92cf-a4cfd7510721)

FOX 35 INVESTIGATES: Medical examiner explains how COVID-19 death is determined (https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/fox-35-investigates-medical-examiner-explains-how-covid-19-death-is-determined)

[Two Bills]

Ye Gods and little fishes.
Hasn't this horse been beaten to death enough already?'
Either get the £$&**% jabs/boosters/shots, whatever, or don't get them..
After 3 years of same old, same old, no one is going to change their opinions now.
Off to get my Lysol booster shot in morning!

[Bill14564]

There were most certainly states that marked ALL deaths with a COVID DIAGNOSIS as a death due to covid. Including traffic fatalities...

I've posted the video of the department of health officials stating exactly that, multiple times.

But thanks for proving that these type of threads are useless.

You only see what you want to see...

Here's a case of a patient with stage 4 colon cancer, in hospice, waiting to die. He happened to contract covid while in hospice. Guess what was put on his death certificate?

Dying with COVID and dying from COVID are same thing in Oregon | kgw.com (https://www.kgw.com/article/news/investigations/questions-over-the-accuracy-of-how-the-state-tracks-covid-deaths/283-0b1b7b6c-695e-4313-92cf-a4cfd7510721)

FOX 35 INVESTIGATES: Medical examiner explains how COVID-19 death is determined (https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/fox-35-investigates-medical-examiner-explains-how-covid-19-death-is-determined)

I see life as a lot more gray with many nuances. If someone says "ALL" then that means absolutely zero of anything else. ALL means ALL. But ALL is not what happened.

Forget even trying to come up with a measure, let's just agree that covid was used to collect extra money where some thought they could get away with it (and were correct in that thinking). For others it might just have been laziness. Whatever the reason, it happened. But not ALL.

It's the primary reason why I stopped focusing on Covid deaths and started looking at excess deaths. At one level, I really don't care why so many hundreds of thousands of excess deaths there were, just acknowledge that there were. Then, once we can agree on a single set of facts, we can start asking WHY those people died. Absent any other reasonable answer, Covid was the likely cause for the majority (not all, but the majority). Doing something to reduce the majority number was good enough for me.

[JMintzer]

I never saw any of these promises
-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc.

Unbelievable...

Thanks for proving my point that one only hears what you want to hear...

Access to this page has been denied (https://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/553773-fauci-vaccinated-people-become-dead-ends-for-the-coronavirus/)

FOX 35 INVESTIGATES: Medical examiner explains how COVID-19 death is determined (https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/fox-35-investigates-medical-examiner-explains-how-covid-19-death-is-determined)

We know all of that is false...

[JMintzer]

Ye Gods and little fishes.
Hasn't this horse been beaten to death enough already?'
Either get the £$&**% jabs/boosters/shots, whatever, or don't get them..
After 3 years of same old, same old, no one is going to change their opinions now.
Off to get my Lysol booster shot in morning!

Hmmm... Why didn't I think of that... :p

[JMintzer]

I see life as a lot more gray with many nuances. If someone says "ALL" then that means absolutely zero of anything else. ALL means ALL. But ALL is not what happened.

Forget even trying to come up with a measure, let's just agree that covid was used to collect extra money where some thought they could get away with it (and were correct in that thinking). For others it might just have been laziness. Whatever the reason, it happened. But not ALL.

It's the primary reason why I stopped focusing on Covid deaths and started looking at excess deaths. At one level, I really don't care why so many hundreds of thousands of excess deaths there were, just acknowledge that there were. Then, once we can agree on a single set of facts, we can start asking WHY those people died. Absent any other reasonable answer, Covid was the likely cause for the majority (not all, but the majority). Doing something to reduce the majority number was good enough for me.

But it IS what happened.

There were certain states, in which when you died, if you tested positive for covid, you were listed as a covid death. They admitted it in public!

Yes, ALL of them... Even traffic fatalities. They used those very words...

[golfing eagles]

Hmmm... Why didn't I think of that... :p

Maybe you were too busy injecting Clorox:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[Keefelane66]

It all started with “operation Warp Speed”

[gatorbill1]

I never saw any of these promises
-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

Your internist, I am sure, told you that your chances of getting a severe case with your then current health conditions are small. I doubt he told you NOT to get the booster.

What we were told is that they REDUCE THE CHANCE of getting a severe case and/or die. It was never even touted to be anywhere close to 100% effective.

The only thing that is right with this post is that they do take an educated guess on the Flu virus's that will be prevalent in the next year for the annual flu shot. If their educated guess is wrong and new strains appear, the flu shot would not be effective for these strains.

Good to see there is still intelligent people out there. You are 100% correct in what you said. I had all the covid shots and got covid, but I did not die even though I a high risk person.

[Pugchief]

Reading comprehension---It's not just for breakfast anymore

Ya, okay, I didn't express my point with the best wording - nothing to do with reading comprehension.

Bill implied that the Flu vax was, while not 100% effective, was close:

...the flu shot is still not 100% effective.

The point I was trying to make was that it is not anywhere close to 100% effective, and that's assuming they even guess right on the strain du jour.

I promise to do better next time. :throwtomatoes:

[blueash]

Many Healthcare workers didn’t want any vaccines in their bodies. Last flu shot was over 30 years ago..caused severe reaction… the hospital system I worked for had no issues with me not getting the vaccine. Plus being exposed on a daily basis with 150 people a day…lNever had the flu…even a cold is rare for me.

The last year I worked for them the Free Free (no additives and ????) Vaccine came out. The new Chief decided I had to get the vaccine, I said No. He looked at my chart, and stamped Vaccine Not Required.

I have no issues with those who choose to be vaccinated, with whatever the government has this year.

Well aren't you special. Your experience is useful to exactly nobody. Yet here you are suggesting that with your super importance and super immunity you should let us all know how super special your exemption is and that you believe you have never gotten influenza even with no vaccine protection.

That's like all the people telling us how they never wear seat belts and yet still survive. All the people who drive drunk and never had an accident. All the people who play golf in during a thunderstorm and never got struck by lightning.

In other words, you got lucky. For those who want to hope to be as lucky as Asianthree, ignore your doctor's advice if they recommend a flu shot or any other shot or any other measure to reduce your health care risks.

I of course am certain that when Asianthree is caring for those 150 patients a day they are all being informed that the nurse [are you a nurse?] is not vaccinated and given the option of asking for a fully vaccinated nurse. I would want to know that my provider was doing as much as possible to not make me sick. You know, like wash their hands and other infectious disease control measures.

[Bill14564]

Ya, okay, I didn't express my point with the best wording - nothing to do with reading comprehension.

Bill implied that the Flu vax was, while not 100% effective, was close:



The point I was trying to make was that it is not anywhere close to 100% effective, and that's assuming they even guess right on the strain du jour.

I promise to do better next time. :throwtomatoes:

That may be what you read but that is not what I meant. I meant exact what I wrote: the flu vaccine is not 100% effective. (It looks like on its best days it is 60% effective but I don’t recall if that was preventing the flu or preventing serious illness)

[Pugchief]

That may be what you read but that is not what I meant. I meant exact what I wrote: the flu vaccine is not 100% effective. (It looks like on its best days it is 60% effective but I don’t recall if that was preventing the flu or preventing serious illness)

Fair enough. I shouldn't be mind reading. Nonetheless, if it is 60% effective at best, wouldn't you agree that's not particularly effective? The MMR vax is supposedly 97% effective after the second dose. That's what I would want from a vaccine. Not <60%, and certainly not whatever the Covid jab gets you.

[blueash]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

I don't know what you mean by worthless propaganda as I am not aware of any reputable doctor promoting anything worthless, although there are some you tube doctors pushing quackery... but I digress

The flu vaccine is of some value (https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/benefit-publications.htm). It is one of the less effective vaccines available but there are lots of things in medicine of some but not great efficacy. It is a very safe vaccine with many decades of use so the risk to benefit ratio in the general population is good.

There are medical conditions where the benefit is greater such as existing lung disease, COPD, asthma etc. Years ago any egg allergy was a reason not to get the shot, but that is no longer a concern. Now only anaphylaxis is a concern (https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/egg-allergies.htm). Just hives? not a problem

Some years there is a lot of circulating influenza, others see much less disease. Obviously in a low risk season, the benefit of the shot is diminished. One other factor in deciding whether to not get vaccinated is unlike many viral illness, there are medications that can be taken to reduce disease severity if begun early in the course of influenza. Now, these medication do have side effects (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8910682/), more than the shot.

To summarize, the chance of you getting sick enough from flu to require a doctor visit is reduced 50% (https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm#:~:text=A%202021%20study%20showe d%20that,with%20those%20who%20were%20unvaccinated. )by getting the shot in a year with a good match of circulating virus to vaccine component

[Bill14564]

Fair enough. I shouldn't be mind reading. Nonetheless, if it is 60% effective at best, wouldn't you agree that's not particularly effective? The MMR vax is supposedly 97% effective after the second dose. That's what I would want from a vaccine. Not <60%, and certainly not whatever the Covid jab gets you.

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Bill is 100% correct. We got sidetracked with COVID and a new type of vaccine that some considered controversial. But every year 35-70,000 Americans die of the flu. Not during COVID, of course, since it all got coded as COVID for $14,000 extra/patient.

The flu shot is a "traditional" vaccine---and except for some intranasal forms is a dead virus, not a live attenuated one. The most likely "side effect" of a flu shot is a sore arm. Period.

As far as RSV goes, when I was practicing it was a disease of young children, possibly a few immunocompromised folks. I never saw a case in and adult in 30+ years. Now that some company invented a vaccine, we are being told that seniors are at risk and should get the shot. From my perspective, the jury is out on that one.

Bottom line, IF I were to give advice, which I don't do, it would be to unequivocally get your flu shot.

When you were practicing, did you not get the memo that virii are able to mutate? I mean, you started 30+ years ago, supposedly. There are all kinds of virus strains now, that didn't exist 30+ years ago, or 20+ years ago, or even 5 years ago. The flu is one of them, and every year, the vaccine is adjusted to cover the newest strains they're able to catch while developing the new vaccine. That's why it isn't a one-and-done vaccine. Because every year, the flu is a little different from the year before.

RSV was only known to affect infants - at first. Now, 30+ years later, it's also known to affect the elderly.

To those who actually don't know, rather than those who insist they do know:

RSV isn't a sickness. It is a virus that CAUSES sickness. You can have RSV and not ever get sick. Or, you can have RSV and die. There's an inbetween as well: you can have RSV and just assume it's a cold, nothing more or less. That is the MOST common experience with RSV no matter what age you are. But some people die. There are more people who die with RSV when they're infants, immuno-compromised people of all ages, and older adults, than any other demographic.

Whether big pharma, the CDC, the American Lung Association, or your local supplement store is telling you this or not, it's just how it is. You don't have to like facts, but them's the facts.

[Pugchief]

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

I never said it didn't, but it certainly doesn't prevent you from getting Covid.

[JMintzer]

Maybe you were too busy injecting Clorox:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

I prefer Heroin, like my Dr "Keef" Richards prescribes... Seems to have worked for him...

[JMintzer]

It all started with “operation Warp Speed”

And then it was bastardized into "mandates"...

[JMintzer]

Good to see there is still intelligent people out there. You are 100% correct in what you said. I had all the covid shots and got covid, but I did not die even though I a high risk person.

Except he's NOT correct. Initially, we were told it PREVENTED the disease and that it PREVENTED TRANSMISSION of the disease.

It wasn't until much later that they changed the narrative...

[Arctic Fox]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.

That's strange?

Reading the above, this thread seems to be about the flu shot.

Yet most of the replies are about the Covid shot.

Why do so many people on TOTV find it so hard to stick to the topic?

If you want to argue the toss on Covid once again, start your own thread on it.

[JMintzer]

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

When that testing was done, the virus had already mutated to a weaker strain (as viruses tend to do)...

Initially, there was minimal testing done before they made their claims...

For example, they initially claimed that the vax stopped transmission by decreasing the viral load in the nasopharynx. Later, they came out and said it did no such thing...

[Michael 61]

What ever happened to civility?

[Bill14564]

When that testing was done, the virus had already mutated to a weaker strain (as viruses tend to do)...

Initially, there was minimal testing done before they made their claims...

For example, they initially claimed that the vax stopped transmission by decreasing the viral load in the nasopharynx. Later, they came out and said it did no such thing...

Who is the "they" that claimed that? I didn't see that in the Pfizer trials report.

[Garywt]

My doctor tells me to get the flu shot so I get the flu shot but he has me wait until November as he says it does no good to get it early. My doctor also told me to get the Covid shots and the first booster so I got them, no questions asked.

[Two Bills]

My doctor tells me to get the flu shot so I get the flu shot but he has me wait until November as he says it does no good to get it early. My doctor also told me to get the Covid shots and the first booster so I got them, no questions asked.

Exactly.
My doctors have got me to my 84th year in reasonable running order.
Why would I, or anyone with a few brain cells still intact, suddenly pass their health care over to a conspiracy faction, or social website?

[La lamy]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.

Not at all too early since it's based on last year's strain!

[golfing eagles]

That may be what you read but that is not what I meant. I meant exact what I wrote: the flu vaccine is not 100% effective. (It looks like on its best days it is 60% effective but I don’t recall if that was preventing the flu or preventing serious illness)

Some years it's 80% effective, one year I remember it was only 15% effective and they had to put out an additional vaccine. Since the strains vary, the effectiveness varies. In addition, it is always somewhat of a guess---teams go to Southeast Asia and China and take samples. The three (sometimes 4 or 5) most common strains are put in the vaccine.

[golfing eagles]

Not at all too early since it's based on last year's strain!

Not quite how it works. Last winter's Asian strains are the ones that hit us this winter. See above post. But to answer the question, it's OK to get a flu shot starting in late August.

[golfing eagles]

When you were practicing, did you not get the memo that virii are able to mutate? I mean, you started 30+ years ago, supposedly. There are all kinds of virus strains now, that didn't exist 30+ years ago, or 20+ years ago, or even 5 years ago. The flu is one of them, and every year, the vaccine is adjusted to cover the newest strains they're able to catch while developing the new vaccine. That's why it isn't a one-and-done vaccine. Because every year, the flu is a little different from the year before.

RSV was only known to affect infants - at first. Now, 30+ years later, it's also known to affect the elderly.

To those who actually don't know, rather than those who insist they do know:

RSV isn't a sickness. It is a virus that CAUSES sickness. You can have RSV and not ever get sick. Or, you can have RSV and die. There's an inbetween as well: you can have RSV and just assume it's a cold, nothing more or less. That is the MOST common experience with RSV no matter what age you are. But some people die. There are more people who die with RSV when they're infants, immuno-compromised people of all ages, and older adults, than any other demographic.

Whether big pharma, the CDC, the American Lung Association, or your local supplement store is telling you this or not, it's just how it is. You don't have to like facts, but them's the facts.

I'm not quite sure how to take the tone of that post. Are you asking me or telling me about virology? If you're asking, it's quite a long reply. If you think you are telling me, well.......Res ipsa loquitur. And some of those "facts" are accurate, some aren't.

[GizmoWhiskers]

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?
Well there is this from the horses mouth relative to flu shots.

mRNA Flu Vaccine Possibilities | Pfizer (https://www.pfizer.com/news/articles/what_does_mrna_mean_for_the_flu_vaccine)

Not that they would tell the average person it is in the flu shot.

My mom had a very bad reaction to her last one for the first time ever (84 yrs young and double jabbed). Last year she ended up in the hospital because of the flu shot - heart related on a person with zero heart conditions. She saw her "new" cardiologist for a few visits post hospital. Had tests done and now a year later the cardiologist released her from his care, thank goodness. She will not be getting a flu shot anymore.

No thank you from one Villager to another. Soylent Green comes to mind.

[HospitalCoder]

Bill is 100% correct. We got sidetracked with COVID and a new type of vaccine that some considered controversial. But every year 35-70,000 Americans die of the flu. Not during COVID, of course, since it all got coded as COVID for $14,000 extra/patient.

The flu shot is a "traditional" vaccine---and except for some intranasal forms is a dead virus, not a live attenuated one. The most likely "side effect" of a flu shot is a sore arm. Period.

As far as RSV goes, when I was practicing it was a disease of young children, possibly a few immunocompromised folks. I never saw a case in and adult in 30+ years. Now that some company invented a vaccine, we are being told that seniors are at risk and should get the shot. From my perspective, the jury is out on that one.

Bottom line, IF I were to give advice, which I don't do, it would be to unequivocally get your flu shot.

Speaking as a hospital coder, I guarantee that Covid coding was not falsified at my hospital in IL and any hospital who did try to cheat would very likely be caught and fined. Hospital coding goes through rigorous audits.

[Mrmean58]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.
Haven't gotten a flu shot since I was 10 YO. Haven't had but one mild case of the flu when I was in college but it also could have been a case of food poisoning. Not planning on giving in now. Strong believer in eating healthy and regular exercise to build a strong immune system. It's worked so far

[westernrider75]

Whether any vax is 100% effective has no bearing on the LIES they pushed to get people on board with the Covid jab. The Covid jab did NOT prevent you from either getting or transmitting Covid.

Whoever told you that Flu vaccines are 100% effective is either lying or clueless.

That is definitely your opinion, not fact. As a former health care worker I was second in line in my town to get the Moderna Covid vaccine when it came out and have received all the boosters. Even though I was a front line worker I never got Covid and attribute it directly to receiving the vaccine.

No vaccine is is 100% effective but I will take my chances and get the flu vaccine and any other vaccines that I feel will keep me safe and living my best life in my retirement years. I didn’t work all those years to die from the flu when a vaccine may have prevented it.

[deborahcme]

Percentages are interesting ducks. If we were told that we'd have a 95% chance of say winning the lottery, my guess is there'd be way more ticket buying! Even at lower percentages, we'd feel pretty good about the buy, while at the same time acknowledging that chance is always going to be a factor. As I always say when the lottery chance is predicted (e.g. a billion to one)---So! There IS a chance! hee hee. On vaccines I'm sure most people follow the advice of their own docs, and base decisions on their own health conditions and not on this or that article or social media posts, or various percentage reports.

[golfing eagles]

Speaking as a hospital coder, I guarantee that Covid coding was not falsified at my hospital in IL and any hospital who did try to cheat would very likely be caught and fined. Hospital coding goes through rigorous audits.

Whoa, whoa, whoa

Nobody was talking about falsified coding---ie: coding a COVID negative patient as if he/she had COVID

As a coder, you could only go by the diagnoses on the attestation signed by the physician. If the patient tested positive for COVID, that was listed as a diagnosis.

I'm sure, even at your hospital, the coding department encouraged all physicians to list every diagnosis on a given patient, and then your department put them in the most financially beneficial order. Some hospitals changed the primary diagnosis, apparently not yours, but frequently the order of listing is subjective.

But thank you for being honest and trying not to rip the taxpayer off.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I had the flu half a dozen years ago. The following year, I started getting a yearly flu shot. If the shot does ANY of the following:
prevent me from getting the flu, reduce the risk of me getting it, reduce the symptoms when I do get it - then I'm fine with getting the shot. Sore arm for 24 hours beats sore lungs for a week, hands down.

I'm a test subject for the RSV shot, I've had two doses of whatever it was (either placebo or the actual shot). Pretty sure mine was the placebo since I didn't even have a sore arm after getting it. But we are well-informed about the shot, about RSV, and about how our participation helps. This is the GSK shot that I believe is already out and being administered now, unless GSK is working on more than one.

My cousin is also a test subject, but because she has certain medical conditions, she's not in the double-blind trial like I am. She knows that she received the actual drug. She's doing fine, and did get the sore arm that night when she got her first (and so far only) dose. She's in a 2-year trial, I'm in a 3-year trial.

[NoMo50]

Exactly.
My doctors have got me to my 84th year in reasonable running order.
Why would I, or anyone with a few brain cells still intact, suddenly pass their health care over to a conspiracy faction, or social website?

Spot on.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Exactly.
My doctors have got me to my 84th year in reasonable running order.
Why would I, or anyone with a few brain cells still intact, suddenly pass their health care over to a conspiracy faction, or social website?

It might have something to do with her e-mails. Or maybe a laptop. Possibly the basement of a pizza parlor.

[golfing eagles]

I had the flu half a dozen years ago. The following year, I started getting a yearly flu shot. If the shot does ANY of the following:
prevent me from getting the flu, reduce the risk of me getting it, reduce the symptoms when I do get it - then I'm fine with getting the shot. Sore arm for 24 hours beats sore lungs for a week, hands down.

I'm a test subject for the RSV shot, I've had two doses of whatever it was (either placebo or the actual shot). Pretty sure mine was the placebo since I didn't even have a sore arm after getting it. But we are well-informed about the shot, about RSV, and about how our participation helps. This is the GSK shot that I believe is already out and being administered now, unless GSK is working on more than one.

My cousin is also a test subject, but because she has certain medical conditions, she's not in the double-blind trial like I am. She knows that she received the actual drug. She's doing fine, and did get the sore arm that night when she got her first (and so far only) dose. She's in a 2-year trial, I'm in a 3-year trial.

Absolutely!!!!

And everyone should thank you for being a test subject---that action may very well end up saving lives

[NoMo50]

My wife and I have taken the flu shot every year for as long as I can remember, and in that time, neither one of us has gotten the flu. Lucky? Maybe. Then again, during that same time span, neither of us has been bitten by a wolverine. Maybe the shot is good for that, too.

[golfing eagles]

My wife and I have taken the flu shot every year for as long as I can remember, and in that time, neither one of us has gotten the flu. Lucky? Maybe. Then again, during that same time span, neither of us has been bitten by a wolverine. Maybe the shot is good for that, too.

Not “lucky”. The flu shot DOES NOT CAUSE the flu. PERIOD

[Rzepecki]

A critical thinker would recognize that no vaccine is 100% effective. A critical thinker might have looked past the marketing and read the results of the vaccine trials. A critical thinker would maybe question whether the CDC represented mainstream doctors but would then consider the possibility that the CDC (and FDA and research labs) are very nearly the definition of mainstream.

I wonder if your internist told you NOT to get the vaccine or agreed with you that you were not one of the high risk individuals who the vaccine was being recommended for. To me, there is a big difference between "don't get the vaccine" and "don't bother getting the vaccine unless you want to."

Out of my area of expertise but I believe that even if they are right (and you might want to investigate who "they" are) the flu shot is still not 100% effective.

I will be waiting for the next version of the Covid vaccine to come out and then getting both the flu and Covid shots. (or October'ish for just the flu, whichever comes first)

My thoughts exactly. Thank you.

[Altavia]

I'm not quite sure how to take the tone of that post. Are you asking me or telling me about virology? If you're asking, it's quite a long reply. If you think you are telling me, well.......Res ipsa loquitur. And some of those "facts" are accurate, some aren't.

Have you had a chance to look into the RSV vaccine?

Been in the CT for 18 mo but they are aren't unblinding us. Haven't had a chance to discuss with the investigator yet but want to discuss getting the released vaccination or not.

Motivation is more minimizing catching what my pre-school grandchildren bring home in their runny nose :-)

[threeonemiles@outlook.com]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.
Think carefully about putting this shot in your system. Don't trust the government or pharma to tell you the truth.

[Whitley]

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

Is there a study that shows that 95% figure. I am confused as to how they can say1) the jab will prevent you from getting and spreading covid to 2) The jab prevents you from getting hospitalized. With the differing strains of covid, it seems like a hail Mary plan, let's throw it out there and see what happens, to say "Sure you still caught covid, but had you not gotten the jab and subsequent boosters you really would have gotten it worse. I seem to have had covid and did not even know it. Right away I hear, "well thank God you were jabbed or you could have gotten really ill". What proof it there of that. Are they comparing the new vewrsions of covid against the original hospitalization rates?

[Susan1717]

I have never gotten a flu vax and have not had the flu or a cold in at least 20 years. I passed on the covid vax as well. I did get the omicron strain but since early on, found a doctor to prescribe ivermectin. Never got that sick, only tired. Was fully recovered in 5 days. There’s no one fits all tho. I have had my antibodies recently tested again, and still have them.

[DonnaNi4os]

The ideal time to get the flu vaccine is early to mid October. Getting it too early risks lower immune response if the flu hits in January or after. We all do what is best for ourselves. I’ve given hundreds of the vaccines and that is the advice we always gave our patients.

[kendi]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.

Just be careful cause it will start to wear off before the flu season is over.

[DonnaNi4os]

Well. I used to get the flu shot but every year I did that----I got the flu!! One year it was twice!! So then I decided they're not for me! I did NOT get the vaxx that so many thought we "needed". I got the plague---and I'm immunocompromised but it was like the flu or bad cold. I did recover.
They (health-care officials) used it to their advantage and so many bought into the lie. Now, some countries are pulling back. Yes, people died BUT I take issue when the health-care folks, who are supposed to care---marked ALL the deaths due to covid. When "some" health-care people tried to push back---they lost their jobs!! Fear and intimidation is what it all was. Wouldn't let families be with their loved ones and did the tests that would give false positives or negatives.

Many people believe that they got the flu after getting the vaccine. Since the flu vaccine is not a live vaccine it is impossible for it to have caused the flu. That’s not my opinion, that is a fact. You may have been exposed to the flu prior to getting the vaccine and didn’t have any symptoms yet. In that case the flu vaccine didn’t have time to build your immunity to fight it off. But getting the flu from the vaccine is a myth. Only live vaccines can cause disease and the flu vaccine is NOT a live vaccine.

[Bill14564]

Is there a study that shows that 95% figure. I am confused as to how they can say1) the jab will prevent you from getting and spreading covid to 2) The jab prevents you from getting hospitalized. With the differing strains of covid, it seems like a hail Mary plan, let's throw it out there and see what happens, to say "Sure you still caught covid, but had you not gotten the jab and subsequent boosters you really would have gotten it worse. I seem to have had covid and did not even know it. Right away I hear, "well thank God you were jabbed or you could have gotten really ill". What proof it there of that. Are they comparing the new vewrsions of covid against the original hospitalization rates?

A lot of questions. The answers are out there if you care to find them.

Yes, there is a study. It was the report of the trial of the Pfizer vaccine.

The manufacturer did not say the jab will prevent you from getting or spreading covid. (but you already knew that since you quoted the post I used when someone else made the same assertion.)

I believe the manufacturer can say that the jab will keep some from being hospitalized because they performed trials with the vaccine that showed that to be the case. I believe they can continue to say that because tens of millions of people have taken the vaccine and hospitalizations and deaths have fallen dramatically.

What proof is there that it was the vaccine that kept one individual from getting more sick? In the case of a virus that is not 100% deadly there is absolutely no proof for that one individual. However, the vaccine trials enrolled more than one individual and if you read the report you will see how the conclusion was derived. Also, as I noted above, tens of millions have now received the vaccine and hospitalizations and deaths have dropped dramatically. Does that 100% prove the vaccine worked? No, but if the choice is between the vaccine, chemtrails, space aliens, or sunspots causing the drop, I'll put my money on the vaccine.

Look, we've had nearly three years of debate about the vaccine. I choose to believe the studies and the data and the real world observations. Others choose to believe the conspiracies and deny what to me seems obvious. It is unlikely that there are any arguments that have not been made and it is foolish to believe anyone is going to change their mind now.

[graciegirl]

A lot of questions. The answers are out there if you care to find them.

Yes, there is a study. It was the report of the trial of the Pfizer vaccine.

The manufacturer did not say the jab will prevent you from getting or spreading covid. (but you already knew that since you quoted the post I used when someone else made the same assertion.)

I believe the manufacturer can say that the jab will keep some from being hospitalized because they performed trials with the vaccine that showed that to be the case. I believe they can continue to say that because tens of millions of people have taken the vaccine and hospitalizations and deaths have fallen dramatically.

What proof is there that it was the vaccine that kept one individual from getting more sick? In the case of a virus that is not 100% deadly there is absolutely no proof for that one individual. However, the vaccine trials enrolled more than one individual and if you read the report you will see how the conclusion was derived. Also, as I noted above, tens of millions have now received the vaccine and hospitalizations and deaths have dropped dramatically. Does that 100% prove the vaccine worked? No, but if the choice is between the vaccine, chemtrails, space aliens, or sunspots causing the drop, I'll put my money on the vaccine.

Look, we've had three nearly three years of debate about the vaccine. I choose to believe the studies and the data and the real world observations. Others choose to believe the conspiracies and deny what to me seems obvious. It is unlikely that there are any arguments that have not been made and it is foolish to believe anyone is going to change their mind now.

And I choose to agree with you as I usually do. So grateful for your intelligent and sane approach to things. So enjoy your posts.

[OhioBuckeye]

Did you get the new experimental shot that out that I saw? The reason I ask was I just don’t think I want to be in a experimental subject. Do you know or didn’t they say?

[SusanStCatherine]

From CDC website:

"Flu Vaccination Timing

The recommended timing of flu vaccination has not changed. September and October are the best times for most people to get vaccinated. Flu vaccination in July and August is not recommended for most people, but there are several considerations regarding vaccination in July and August for specific groups of people:

For adults (especially those 65 years old and older) and pregnant people in the first and second trimester, vaccination in July and August should be avoided unless it won’t be possible to vaccinate in September or October."

[gatorbill1]

I never saw any of these promises
-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

Your internist, I am sure, told you that your chances of getting a severe case with your then current health conditions are small. I doubt he told you NOT to get the booster.

What we were told is that they REDUCE THE CHANCE of getting a severe case and/or die. It was never even touted to be anywhere close to 100% effective.

The only thing that is right with this post is that they do take an educated guess on the Flu virus's that will be prevalent in the next year for the annual flu shot. If their educated guess is wrong and new strains appear, the flu shot would not be effective for these strains.

Except he's NOT correct. Initially, we were told it PREVENTED the disease and that it PREVENTED TRANSMISSION of the disease.

It wasn't until much later that they changed the narrative...

You listened to the wrong people or wrong TV station - I listened to them all.

[tophcfa]

I’ll gladly roll up my sleeve, any risk involved in a vaccine is nonexistent compared to the risk of winding up in the Villages ER. Bring it on!

[MrFlorida]

Never had a flu shot, and never got the flu.

[sloanst]

Then why are healthy teenaged athletes dying of heart attacks on the field.? My daughter lost her ability to walk and short term memory just after her first booster? Why are doctors NOW allowed to prescribe Ivermectin as a therapeutic for Covid?
No scandal my left eyeball.

[SusanStCatherine]

I never saw any of these promises
-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

Your internist, I am sure, told you that your chances of getting a severe case with your then current health conditions are small. I doubt he told you NOT to get the booster.

What we were told is that they REDUCE THE CHANCE of getting a severe case and/or die. It was never even touted to be anywhere close to 100% effective.

The only thing that is right with this post is that they do take an educated guess on the Flu virus's that will be prevalent in the next year for the annual flu shot. If their educated guess is wrong and new strains appear, the flu shot would not be effective for these strains.

From the Snopes website:

"During an unscripted CNN town hall on July 21, Biden falsely stated that those who had been vaccinated would not get COVID, be hospitalized, or end up in an ICU and die."

There are video clips of this as well.

It's frustrating to have people generalize or support a "does not exist" statement. My university class in Logics taught me this.

I know this is off topic from original post, but wanted to show this did happen.

These days, skepticism with mainstream media and social media is warrantied. Seek the truth from multiple sources and good luck!

[John Mayes]

Ye Gods and little fishes.
Hasn't this horse been beaten to death enough already?'
Either get the £$&**% jabs/boosters/shots, whatever, or don't get them..
After 3 years of same old, same old, no one is going to change their opinions now.
Off to get my Lysol booster shot in morning!

LOL! Truer words never spoken.

[John Mayes]

When you were practicing, did you not get the memo that virii are able to mutate? I mean, you started 30+ years ago, supposedly. There are all kinds of virus strains now, that didn't exist 30+ years ago, or 20+ years ago, or even 5 years ago. The flu is one of them, and every year, the vaccine is adjusted to cover the newest strains they're able to catch while developing the new vaccine. That's why it isn't a one-and-done vaccine. Because every year, the flu is a little different from the year before.

RSV was only known to affect infants - at first. Now, 30+ years later, it's also known to affect the elderly.

To those who actually don't know, rather than those who insist they do know:

RSV isn't a sickness. It is a virus that CAUSES sickness. You can have RSV and not ever get sick. Or, you can have RSV and die. There's an inbetween as well: you can have RSV and just assume it's a cold, nothing more or less. That is the MOST common experience with RSV no matter what age you are. But some people die. There are more people who die with RSV when they're infants, immuno-compromised people of all ages, and older adults, than any other demographic.

Whether big pharma, the CDC, the American Lung Association, or your local supplement store is telling you this or not, it's just how it is. You don't have to like facts, but them's the facts.

And from where did you get your medical degree?

[mntlblok]

Never understood using "virii" as a plural of "virus. Figured "viri" made some sense, but guess that would actually mean "men". Only just now got around to googling it. Not what I expected to find. Don't recall such a thing as a "neuter noun" - at least not one that ended in "us".

From What Is the Plural of Virus? (https://www.thoughtco.com/what-is-the-plural-of-virus-112199#:~:text=The%20plural%20of%20%22virus%22%20i s,a%20neuter%20noun%20in%20Latin).

It is common knowledge that the plurals of many words from Latin end in "-a" or "-i." Data, for instance, is the plural of datum and alumni is the plural of an alumnus. Is the plural of virus viri and if not, why?

Neuter and Masculine Nouns
​Latin neuters end in "-a" in the plural for the nominative and accusative cases:

Datum > data
Singular > plural
The plural of "virus" is "viruses" in English. Virus is a neuter noun in Latin. That means its plural, if there were an attested ancient usage of virus in the plural, would have ended in an "-a," because neuter nouns in (ancient Greek and) Latin end in an "-a" in the plural nominative and accusative cases. The example of the plural of datum is a case in point. Since datum is a neuter singular, its plural is data.

Since virus is neuter, vira is a possibility for the nominative/accusative plural. It could not be viri. Second declension masculine nouns end in "-i" in the nominative plural:

Alumnus > alumni
Singular > plural
Viri is the plural of the masculine second declension noun vir, which means "man." Vir is a masculine noun and the "-i" ending is appropriate for the plural nominative of masculine second declension nouns.

"Virus," by the way, can refer either an "infectious agent" or a computer program that "is usually disguised as an innocuous program or file," which inserts a copy of itself into another program "that when run usually performs a malicious action," Merriam-Webster notes.

[John Mayes]

Well aren't you special. Your experience is useful to exactly nobody. Yet here you are suggesting that with your super importance and super immunity you should let us all know how super special your exemption is and that you believe you have never gotten influenza even with no vaccine protection.

That's like all the people telling us how they never wear seat belts and yet still survive. All the people who drive drunk and never had an accident. All the people who play golf in during a thunderstorm and never got struck by lightning.

In other words, you got lucky. For those who want to hope to be as lucky as Asianthree, ignore your doctor's advice if they recommend a flu shot or any other shot or any other measure to reduce your health care risks.

I of course am certain that when Asianthree is caring for those 150 patients a day they are all being informed that the nurse [are you a nurse?] is not vaccinated and given the option of asking for a fully vaccinated nurse. I would want to know that my provider was doing as much as possible to not make me sick. You know, like wash their hands and other infectious disease control measures.

Wow! I see you’re not a fan of Dale Carnegie.

[Escape Artist]

Agree and I'll be adding the RSV vaccine also.

You might want to rethink the RSV vaccine which was rushed through clinical trials and had serious problems with it. Of course, they rolled it out anyway.

[Escape Artist]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.

Yes, you got it way too early. Any medical professional will tell you it’s only good for about six months whereas the flu season lasts until late spring.

[tophcfa]

Flues like cold dry weather, so all things being equal, the flu season is longer in the northern states. That being said, Florida is such a huge travel destination between late fall and early spring that Floridians are being bombarded with the flu throughout that window by people traveling there from cooler climates.

[Karmanng]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.


GOOD Luck I stopepd getting the flu shot as it caused to many reactions......never again

[Karmanng]

I'm not quite sure how to take the tone of that post. Are you asking me or telling me about virology? If you're asking, it's quite a long reply. If you think you are telling me, well.......Res ipsa loquitur. And some of those "facts" are accurate, some aren't.

When I worked in the ER back in 2009 for 2 years it is only a infant virus I dont buy into that it also is for adults its another scam to put crap in your body

[Karmanng]

You might want to rethink the RSV vaccine which was rushed through clinical trials and had serious problems with it. Of course, they rolled it out anyway.

Probably as bad as the covid jab which i never got the shot nor did i get covid cornovirus is cold people WAKE up to your lying government they want you all dead asap

[Karmanng]

Well there is this from the horses mouth relative to flu shots.

mRNA Flu Vaccine Possibilities | Pfizer (https://www.pfizer.com/news/articles/what_does_mrna_mean_for_the_flu_vaccine)

Not that they would tell the average person it is in the flu shot.

My mom had a very bad reaction to her last one for the first time ever (84 yrs young and double jabbed). Last year she ended up in the hospital because of the flu shot - heart related on a person with zero heart conditions. She saw her "new" cardiologist for a few visists post hospital. Had tests done and now a year later the cardiologist released her from his care, thank goodness. She will not be getting a flu shot anymore.

No thank you from one Villager to another. Soylent Green comes to mind.

Ya its whats in these jabs that they wont tell you NO shots for me ever anymore I quit the flu one after I got sick form it within a few hours

[Two Bills]

You might want to rethink the RSV vaccine which was rushed through clinical trials and had serious problems with it. Of course, they rolled it out anyway.

I had no idea what RSV vaccines were, so I had to look up what it was for, and about the research.
Seems the major problems were way back in the 60's with early trials.
Those, and later problems are said to have been resolved, and latest trials seem to have a clean bill of health.
Does not appear to be some vaccine rushed out at all.

[MEbner2805]

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.
If you get the vaccines too early, they won’t last through the highest part of flu season! End of Oct is best.

[HJBeck]

Seriously???

[golfing eagles]

Probably as bad as the covid jab which i never got the shot nor did i get covid cornovirus is cold people WAKE up to your lying government they want you all dead asap

WOW!!! I guess that post explains why you were never elected president of the National Optimists Club:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[Altavia]

You might want to rethink the RSV vaccine which was rushed through clinical trials and had serious problems with it. Of course, they rolled it out anyway.

Really?

I've been in the clinical trial for close to two years, didn't seem rushed to me?

All you obtuse contrarian thinking deniers need to thank those who were vaccinated and are protecting you...

[Cybersprings]

Really?

I've been in the clinical trial for close to two years, didn't seem rushed to me?

All you obtuse contrarian thinking deniers need to thank those who were vaccinated and are protecting you...

I'm not sure if I am covered by your blanket statement above, but OK. Thanks for protecting me. I guess now I do not need the vaccine.

[jimjamuser]

Bill is 100% correct. We got sidetracked with COVID and a new type of vaccine that some considered controversial. But every year 35-70,000 Americans die of the flu. Not during COVID, of course, since it all got coded as COVID for $14,000 extra/patient.

The flu shot is a "traditional" vaccine---and except for some intranasal forms is a dead virus, not a live attenuated one. The most likely "side effect" of a flu shot is a sore arm. Period.

As far as RSV goes, when I was practicing it was a disease of young children, possibly a few immunocompromised folks. I never saw a case in and adult in 30+ years. Now that some company invented a vaccine, we are being told that seniors are at risk and should get the shot. From my perspective, the jury is out on that one.

Bottom line, IF I were to give advice, which I don't do, it would be to unequivocally get your flu shot.
We agree on getting the flu shot. I love it when agreement is possible!

[golfing eagles]

We agree on getting the flu shot. I love it when agreement is possible!

To quote Dr. McCoy to Mr. Spock in "Star Trek 4": "Don't agree with me, it makes me very nervous" :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[jimjamuser]

There are countries that no longer recommend the covid jab. Dr John Campbell has some great videos out on side effects etc.. Regardless of what science comes out, some have invested so much of who they are into supporting it that there will always be a market ready to continue to get the jab (and covid too). It has become another form of divisive politics.
I love how when the word "JAB" is used with COVID, it becomes this SUPREME attempt at a linguistic PUTDOWN. If it is a medical immunization that is agreed with, it is a shot. But, if it is an immunization that for SOME reason is considered a "NO - NO", then it is called the universe-destroying........."JAB".

[golfing eagles]

I love how when the word "JAB" is used with COVID, it becomes this SUPREME attempt at a linguistic PUTDOWN. If it is a medical immunization that is agreed with, it is a shot. But, if it is an immunization that for SOME reason is considered a "NO - NO", then it is called the universe-destroying........."JAB".

This is scary, but I'm forced to agree with that. How about the term "vaccination"?

[jimjamuser]

Because I don't believe it was necessarily mainstream doctors pushing repeated vaccines/boosters but the government (CDC, Fauci, etc). In fact, after receiving the first 2 doses, by the time I was "due" for a booster, my internist told me NOT to get get it unless I wanted to, as I was not overweight, diabetic or co-morbid in any other way.

If you look at all the lies we were told...

-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

...it would make any person with the ability to think critically that maybe other virus vaccines that are heavily pushed may also not live up to their hype. You do know that Flu shots are just a guess at what will be the prevalent strain, right? And if they guess wrong, the shot is essentially worthless.
The "JAB" will make you grow horns and lower your IQ by 20 points. You will become allergic to AIR.

[jimjamuser]

Ye Gods and little fishes.
Hasn't this horse been beaten to death enough already?'
Either get the £$&**% jabs/boosters/shots, whatever, or don't get them..
After 3 years of same old, same old, no one is going to change their opinions now.
Off to get my Lysol booster shot in morning!
I'm getting my booster against "JABS"!

[jimjamuser]

Well aren't you special. Your experience is useful to exactly nobody. Yet here you are suggesting that with your super importance and super immunity you should let us all know how super special your exemption is and that you believe you have never gotten influenza even with no vaccine protection.

That's like all the people telling us how they never wear seat belts and yet still survive. All the people who drive drunk and never had an accident. All the people who play golf in during a thunderstorm and never got struck by lightning.

In other words, you got lucky. For those who want to hope to be as lucky as Asianthree, ignore your doctor's advice if they recommend a flu shot or any other shot or any other measure to reduce your health care risks.

I of course am certain that when Asianthree is caring for those 150 patients a day they are all being informed that the nurse [are you a nurse?] is not vaccinated and given the option of asking for a fully vaccinated nurse. I would want to know that my provider was doing as much as possible to not make me sick. You know, like wash their hands and other infectious disease control measures.
If only I could make posts as wonderful and informative as this one. Triple kudos!

[jimjamuser]

Speaking as a hospital coder, I guarantee that Covid coding was not falsified at my hospital in IL and any hospital who did try to cheat would very likely be caught and fined. Hospital coding goes through rigorous audits.
The idea of falsified COVID coding was likely spread by some disinformation organizations such as the Russian troll farms. My opinion is that many people died (maybe millions) IN THE US because of disinformation like the magnified FEAR of the COVID shot. Also, historically, the US was slow to recognize the potentially deadly nature of the disease. Today, there still lingers a fear about ANY shot - even one like the flu shot, which has been proven, for years, to be effective.

[JMintzer]

Who is the "they" that claimed that? I didn't see that in the Pfizer trials report.

Fauci, The POTUS, Maddow on MSNBC, multiple talking heads on CNN, The woman who was running the CDC...

And you're right... NOBODY saw the Pfizer trials report...

[Bill14564]

Fauci, The POTUS, Maddow on MSNBC, multiple talking heads on CNN, The woman who was running the CDC...

And you're right... NOBODY saw the Pfizer trials report...

Are you calling me names or saying I didn't read what I thought I read? (and it figures that wasn't one of the documents I saved)

[JMintzer]

My doctor tells me to get the flu shot so I get the flu shot but he has me wait until November as he says it does no good to get it early. My doctor also told me to get the Covid shots and the first booster so I got them, no questions asked.

I'll always ask questions. I had already had and recovered from Covid before the vaccine was released...I discussed whether or not to get the vaccine with my internist.

I got the two dose Moderna and one booster.

My wife also caught covid (a week after me... Yeah, I'm still paying for that! :D). She also got the shot plus one booster. A month later, she caught covid a 2nd time...

We've decided we're done...

I'll be getting the flu shot later in the Fall. I'm still seeing patients and I'm more susceptible to catching the flu than the average bear...

But remember, the flu shot is a completely different type of vaccine. One that has been around for decades. It has a definite track record...

Luckily, I've not had the flu (just a mild winter 2 day bug) in forever...

[JMintzer]

Not at all too early since it's based on last year's strain!

Actually, it's based on the "prediction" of this year's strain...

"How is the flu vaccine determined each year?

The flu viruses in seasonal flu vaccines are selected each year based on a variety of data, including the following: Epidemiologic data: Global flu surveillance is conducted year-round by GISRS to determine which flu viruses are circulating in different areas of the world at different times."

[JMintzer]

Is there a study that shows that 95% figure. I am confused as to how they can say1) the jab will prevent you from getting and spreading covid to 2) The jab prevents you from getting hospitalized. With the differing strains of covid, it seems like a hail Mary plan, let's throw it out there and see what happens, to say "Sure you still caught covid, but had you not gotten the jab and subsequent boosters you really would have gotten it worse. I seem to have had covid and did not even know it. Right away I hear, "well thank God you were jabbed or you could have gotten really ill". What proof it there of that. Are they comparing the new vewrsions of covid against the original hospitalization rates?

True...

I had covid 10 months before any vaccine was available. I had a cough, some chills and body aches and a low grade temp (99.7°) for 36 hrs... Then, I was tired for 2-3 days...

My wife caught it from me and was flat on her back, wiped out, for a week...

[JMintzer]

I have never gotten a flu vax and have not had the flu or a cold in at least 20 years. I passed on the covid vax as well. I did get the omicron strain but since early on, found a doctor to prescribe ivermectin. Never got that sick, only tired. Was fully recovered in 5 days. There’s no one fits all tho. I have had my antibodies recently tested again, and still have them.

The last time I had my regular blood testing done, I also had my antibodies checked. Still there more than 2 years after catching covid...

[JMintzer]

Many people believe that they got the flu after getting the vaccine. Since the flu vaccine is not a live vaccine it is impossible for it to have caused the flu. That’s not my opinion, that is a fact. You may have been exposed to the flu prior to getting the vaccine and didn’t have any symptoms yet. In that case the flu vaccine didn’t have time to build your immunity to fight it off. But getting the flu from the vaccine is a myth. Only live vaccines can cause disease and the flu vaccine is NOT a live vaccine.

The nasal vaccine is a LIVE, ATTENUATED (weakened) virus...

That said, it is extremely unlikely that it will give you the flu...

[JMintzer]

A lot of questions. The answers are out there if you care to find them.

Yes, there is a study. It was the report of the trial of the Pfizer vaccine.

The manufacturer did not say the jab will prevent you from getting or spreading covid. (but you already knew that since you quoted the post I used when someone else made the same assertion.)

I believe the manufacturer can say that the jab will keep some from being hospitalized because they performed trials with the vaccine that showed that to be the case. I believe they can continue to say that because tens of millions of people have taken the vaccine and hospitalizations and deaths have fallen dramatically.

What proof is there that it was the vaccine that kept one individual from getting more sick? In the case of a virus that is not 100% deadly there is absolutely no proof for that one individual. However, the vaccine trials enrolled more than one individual and if you read the report you will see how the conclusion was derived. Also, as I noted above, tens of millions have now received the vaccine and hospitalizations and deaths have dropped dramatically. Does that 100% prove the vaccine worked? No, but if the choice is between the vaccine, chemtrails, space aliens, or sunspots causing the drop, I'll put my money on the vaccine.

Look, we've had nearly three years of debate about the vaccine. I choose to believe the studies and the data and the real world observations. Others choose to believe the conspiracies and deny what to me seems obvious. It is unlikely that there are any arguments that have not been made and it is foolish to believe anyone is going to change their mind now.

It would help if you would cite the study, or at least WHEN it was released...

Timing matters...

[Bogie Shooter]

True...

I had covid 10 months before any vaccine was available. I had a cough, some chills and body aches and a low grade temp (99.7°) for 36 hrs... Then, I was tired for 2-3 days...

My wife caught it from me and was flat on her back, wiped out, for a week...

Glad that’s all you experienced….others were not so lucky.

[JMintzer]

You listened to the wrong people or wrong TV station - I listened to them all.

Not sure to whom your reply is for...

[JMintzer]

From the Snopes website:

"During an unscripted CNN town hall on July 21, Biden falsely stated that those who had been vaccinated would not get COVID, be hospitalized, or end up in an ICU and die."

There are video clips of this as well.

It's frustrating to have people generalize or support a "does not exist" statement. My university class in Logics taught me this.

I know this is off topic from original post, but wanted to show this did happen.

These days, skepticism with mainstream media and social media is warrantied. Seek the truth from multiple sources and good luck!

Thank you for the assist!

[JMintzer]

And from where did you get your medical degree?

Not directed at you...

https://wholelifedirectprimarycare.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/google-search.jpg

[JMintzer]

Never understood using "virii" as a plural of "virus. Figured "viri" made some sense, but guess that would actually mean "men". Only just now got around to googling it. Not what I expected to find. Don't recall such a thing as a "neuter noun" - at least not one that ended in "us".

From What Is the Plural of Virus? (https://www.thoughtco.com/what-is-the-plural-of-virus-112199#:~:text=The%20plural%20of%20%22virus%22%20i s,a%20neuter%20noun%20in%20Latin).

It is common knowledge that the plurals of many words from Latin end in "-a" or "-i." Data, for instance, is the plural of datum and alumni is the plural of an alumnus. Is the plural of virus viri and if not, why?

Neuter and Masculine Nouns
​Latin neuters end in "-a" in the plural for the nominative and accusative cases:

Datum > data
Singular > plural
The plural of "virus" is "viruses" in English. Virus is a neuter noun in Latin. That means its plural, if there were an attested ancient usage of virus in the plural, would have ended in an "-a," because neuter nouns in (ancient Greek and) Latin end in an "-a" in the plural nominative and accusative cases. The example of the plural of datum is a case in point. Since datum is a neuter singular, its plural is data.

Since virus is neuter, vira is a possibility for the nominative/accusative plural. It could not be viri. Second declension masculine nouns end in "-i" in the nominative plural:

Alumnus > alumni
Singular > plural
Viri is the plural of the masculine second declension noun vir, which means "man." Vir is a masculine noun and the "-i" ending is appropriate for the plural nominative of masculine second declension nouns.

"Virus," by the way, can refer either an "infectious agent" or a computer program that "is usually disguised as an innocuous program or file," which inserts a copy of itself into another program "that when run usually performs a malicious action," Merriam-Webster notes.

It's an attempt to appear intelligent...

[JMintzer]

The idea of falsified COVID coding was likely spread by some disinformation organizations such as the Russian troll farms. My opinion is that many people died (maybe millions) IN THE US because of disinformation like the magnified FEAR of the COVID shot. Also, historically, the US was slow to recognize the potentially deadly nature of the disease. Today, there still lingers a fear about ANY shot - even one like the flu shot, which has been proven, for years, to be effective.

"Russia, Russia, Russia!"

[JMintzer]

Are you calling me names or saying I didn't read what I thought I read? (and it figures that wasn't one of the documents I saved)

Settle down, Beavis...

I'm talking about back then... Not now...

There were no reports available when the people I mentioned were making their claims...

[JMintzer]

Glad that’s all you experienced….others were not so lucky.

And sadly, most of them had other medical issues that compromised their ability to fight off covid. The regular flu could have gotten them, as well...

[jimjamuser]

To quote Dr. McCoy to Mr. Spock in "Star Trek 4": "Don't agree with me, it makes me very nervous" :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:
That WAS a good quote. Be nervous, be very nervous.

[John Mayes]

Not directed at you...

https://wholelifedirectprimarycare.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/google-search.jpg

Lol!

[Bill14564]

It would help if you would cite the study, or at least WHEN it was released...

Timing matters...

I believe it was this paper (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577) from December 2020 but 30 months later I'm not sure.

[JMintzer]

I believe it was this paper (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577) from December 2020 but 30 months later I'm not sure.

Sadly, that study proved to be incorrect...

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You might want to rethink the RSV vaccine which was rushed through clinical trials and had serious problems with it. Of course, they rolled it out anyway.

Rushed? RSV vaccines have been in process since the 1960's. The earlier versions were disastrous, and those were scrapped and they re-designed the project from scratch. There were promising results in 2011, and in 2013, the first clinical trials of what is NOW - 10 years later - a successful approved vaccine, were conducted. I've been a test subject for the Galaxo-Smith-Kline double-blind peer-reviewed trials for over two years, but the trial started before I volunteered for it. I was in one of the later batches.

There is nothing rushed about the RSV vaccine.

[GizmoWhiskers]

GOOD Luck I stopepd getting the flu shot as it caused to many reactions......never again
I had the pneumonia vax once and ended up with a 102 temp for 4 days. Never again.

[Ray Greene]

Why did you do, drink the kool aid, to get so gullible!

[MrChip72]

I'm sure, even at your hospital, the coding department encouraged all physicians to list every diagnosis on a given patient, and then your department put them in the most financially beneficial order. Some hospitals changed the primary diagnosis, apparently not yours, but frequently the order of listing is subjective.


Any proof, or just another conspiracy of yours? Believe it or not, most people with real jobs are already too busy to get their job done and have no time to start falsifying stuff for some secret agenda.

[Two Bills]

I had the pneumonia vax once and ended up with a 102 temp for 4 days. Never again.

I drank a whole bottle of Rum one Christmas Eve, and was pi$$ed for next two days.
Never again!

[golfing eagles]

Any proof, or just another conspiracy of yours? Believe it or not, most people with real jobs are already too busy to get their job done and have no time to start falsifying stuff for some secret agenda.

You are joking, right????

You doubt that my post is a factual statement of coding department policies at US hospitals and physician attestations??????

Now, let's see: I was chief of staff at a 350 bed hospital and you were...? Yeah, I thought so. Please don't make any more of a fool of yourself as you just did. Maybe there is a subject you know something about, but clearly this is not it.

[Two Bills]

One of the best bits of advice I received was:
Never argue with doctors or surgeons.
"One writes your prescriptions, the other is holding the knife!" ;)

[golfing eagles]

One of the best bits of advice I received was:
Never argue with doctors or surgeons.
"One writes your prescriptions, the other is holding the knife!" ;)

Just typical for TOTV ---He's a clueless person arguing with an expert about something they know nothing about. Debating opinions or topics where the facts are questionable is one thing, his post was just stupid.

[OhioBuckeye]

It’s big bucks in the medical fields pocket!

[Flyers999]

My dad passed away from the flu so I get the shot every year. But I get jabbed in November because it only last for six months. I contacted the flu in March and one time in April, so I want it to be effective during those months when I travel more. My primary care didn't object to my regimen.

[Chi-Town]

Getting the flu shot. Had the flu two years in a row and down for the count both times. Been getting the shot religiously since then.

[CoachKandSportsguy]

My dad passed away from the flu so I get the shot every year. But I get jabbed in November because it only last for six months. I contacted the flu in March and one time in April, so I want it to be effective during those months when I travel more. My primary care didn't object to my regimen.

smart, timing is everything
and better lucky than good

[CoachKandSportsguy]

My dad passed away from the flu so I get the shot every year. But I get jabbed in November because it only last for six months. I contacted the flu in March and one time in April, so I want it to be effective during those months when I travel more. My primary care didn't object to my regimen.

my mom, the nurse 24x7, and got her degree right after world war 2, says the same about the timing. She is now 96 with dementia, but has had the flu shot every year and has seldom been sick . . even as a nurse at a high school with all the kids.

I get it every year as well, and there must be a small amount of residual immunity from 30 years or so of flu shots, so rock on!

And for those that felt uncomfortable after a shot, its a small price to pay for immunity and protection. Just before leaving to go overseas on merchant ships while at the us merchant marine academy, you stepped through a door and an air gun hit each arm with all kinds of overseas immunity shots. . yeah, one year i was fine, another year i was slowed down for a couple of days. .

be thankful you live in modern times with modern medicine. . the last world wide flu victims were not so lucky

[Stu from NYC]

October for us at next DR appt. The older you get the more chance it will do serious harm or even kill you

[jimbomaybe]

I never saw any of these promises
-you won't get Covid if you take the jab
-you won't spread covid if you take the jab
-etc

Your internist, I am sure, told you that your chances of getting a severe case with your then current health conditions are small. I doubt he told you NOT to get the booster.

What we were told is that they REDUCE THE CHANCE of getting a severe case and/or die. It was never even touted to be anywhere close to 100% effective.

The only thing that is right with this post is that they do take an educated guess on the Flu virus's that will be prevalent in the next year for the annual flu shot. If their educated guess is wrong and new strains appear, the flu shot would not be effective for these strains.
Try explaining to the conspiracy inclined that its a PUBLIC health issue, a percentage who are vaccinated will have reactions from not noticeable to severe even fatal, every year some die from infections due to minor surgical procedures , some will get sick even having been vaccinated, for most it will lower their risk, a less severe case if infected, they will less likely to transmit the virus making for better "herd immunity", people will read into statistics what they want to see, massage facts to fit . Flu shot is a best guess ? , perhaps but still a good idea for most

[Byte1]

And from where did you get your medical degree?

Publix Pharmacy?