Executive golf access

[eweissenbach]

As it gets more and more difficult to get tee times on the Executive courses it made me think. Between 466 and 44, if my numbers are correct, there are 22 Executive courses. In the area south of 44 there are currently 5, with 4 more in some stage of development. That is 9 courses in the newer areas serving a population that is approaching, and eventually likely exceeding, the population of the areas between 466 and 44. Do the developers believe that the newer residents are less golf oriented, or do they simply want to retain more land for residential use? Did Harold overbuild Executive golf, or does the current generation have a different planning model? Of course, no matter what the reason, we have no control over the situation, but it does seem that the model has changed. Just curious!

[tophcfa]

As it gets more and more difficult to get tee times on the Executive courses it made me think. Between 466 and 44, if my numbers are correct, there are 22 Executive courses. In the area south of 44 there are currently 5, with 4 more in some stage of development. That is 9 courses in the newer areas serving a population that is approaching, and eventually likely exceeding, the population of the areas between 466 and 44. Do the developers believe that the newer residents are less golf oriented, or do they simply want to retain more land for residential use? Did Harold overbuild Executive golf, or does the current generation have a different planning model? Of course, no matter what the reason, we have no control over the situation, but it does seem that the model has changed. Just curious!
Here is my take on your questions/observations. If your numbers aren’t correct, they are extremely close, and definitely close enough for the sake of this discussion. Harold, and Gary, did not overbuild Executive courses. This statement is backed by the difficulty getting t times for a group larger than a single, unless you’re playing in the early morning dew or trying to finish your round at last light. Do the current generation of developers believe that the newer residents are less golf oriented? I don’t think they really care, they want to maximize profits by selling as many new homes as possible (not that there is anything wrong with that). There is no doubt that the business model has changed. Why not try to maximize profits by building way less Executives per new rooftop if people continue to line up to buy new homes as fast as they can be built. It reduces the cost of building the courses, and as stated, frees up more land to jam a whole bunch of homes onto. I agree with you, we have no control over the situation, it is what it is as long as people continue to buy new homes in an area with much less golf per rooftop. Unfortunately for those not living in the newer areas, the golfing overflow spills out towards the north and effects them.

[kansasr]

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

[Bogie Shooter]

I too was curious.
I looked at open tee time for tomorrow between the times of 7:30AM and 5:00PM. Executive courses only. I stopped counting at 100+ open tee times, for the first 5 executive courses I looked at.
It’s true there are more early and late but there are times available.
To say you cannot get tee times is somewhat misleading………..maybe not in the short window, you might be looking for.

[eweissenbach]

I too was curious.
I looked at open tee time for tomorrow between the times of 7:30AM and 5:00PM. Executive courses only. I stopped counting at 100+ open tee times, for the first 5 executive courses I looked at.
It’s true there are more early and late but there are times available.
To say you cannot get tee times is somewhat misleading………..maybe not in the short window, you might be looking for.

I didn’t say or imply that I couldn’t get tee times. As a single I can always find a time and a course I prefer. If I want to get a tee time at a reasonable time at a course we like for myself and a friend it is increasingly difficult. I was simply making an observation about obvious difference in course penetration in the newer areas compared to the old. If you have something to add to that please do so.

[eweissenbach]

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

Ummmm, ok.

[Bogie Shooter]

I didn’t say or imply that I couldn’t get tee times. As a single I can always find a time and a course I prefer. If I want to get a tee time at a reasonable time at a course we like for myself and a friend it is increasingly difficult. I was simply making an observation about obvious difference in course penetration in the newer areas compared to the old. If you have something to add to that please do so.

“As it gets more and more difficult to get tee times on the Executive courses“. :shrug:

[tophcfa]

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

Delusional

[tophcfa]

I too was curious.
I looked at open tee time for tomorrow between the times of 7:30AM and 5:00PM. Executive courses only. I stopped counting at 100+ open tee times, for the first 5 executive courses I looked at.
It’s true there are more early and late but there are times available.
To say you cannot get tee times is somewhat misleading………..maybe not in the short window, you might be looking for.

Were you looking for open t times for more than a single golfer at courses below 466a, or are you talking about single openings up near Lopez? Big difference indeed.

[biker1]

Yes, there are a number of tee times available starting at 4:00PM and the first two tee time in the morning. Outside of those windows, not so much.

I too was curious.
I looked at open tee time for tomorrow between the times of 7:30AM and 5:00PM. Executive courses only. I stopped counting at 100+ open tee times, for the first 5 executive courses I looked at.
It’s true there are more early and late but there are times available.
To say you cannot get tee times is somewhat misleading………..maybe not in the short window, you might be looking for.

[eweissenbach]

“As it gets more and more difficult to get tee times on the Executive courses“. :shrug:

Again bogie, that sentence does not equate to being UNABLE to get tee times. Anyone who plays regularly knows that it has become harder to get the tee times you want over the last few years.

[cjrjck]

I have no problem driving to a golf course that isn't close to the house. Either by cart, or if needed, by car. I walk the executive courses often but you can rent a cart at some or at a nearby championship course. So, in that respect, to me at least, it really doesn't matter much where they build them or how many. I am just glad they are building more. If it meant that much to me to be really close to a large number of executive courses, I would live in an area that offered that option.

[phylt]

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

--------------------

I don't offend easily. But your term of "YOU PEOPLE" hits it for me. One huge issue in the USA is pitting one group against another. Your comment exemplifies that.

And to compound it, your grammar is incorrect.. It's "the real problem IS..... not are.

Oh BTW We ARE of of those "You People".

Double whammy.

[Papa_lecki]

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

The roads (i.e. 466A and 44) are arbitrary barriers. You can live south of 466a, but get to say Turtle Mound or Sandhill (which are north of 466a) in 2 minutes.

[ThirdOfFive]

As it gets more and more difficult to get tee times on the Executive courses it made me think. Between 466 and 44, if my numbers are correct, there are 22 Executive courses. In the area south of 44 there are currently 5, with 4 more in some stage of development. That is 9 courses in the newer areas serving a population that is approaching, and eventually likely exceeding, the population of the areas between 466 and 44. Do the developers believe that the newer residents are less golf oriented, or do they simply want to retain more land for residential use? Did Harold overbuild Executive golf, or does the current generation have a different planning model? Of course, no matter what the reason, we have no control over the situation, but it does seem that the model has changed. Just curious!
I guess it is all in what you are comparing it to. Depending on the course it is indeed more difficult now to get tee times than, say, on a July afternoon when you can pretty much go to any Executive course without reserving a time and get on, but it isn't overwhelmingly difficult now. Same day is pretty much out of the question (unless you call a specific course and ask about cancellations, which means we can get on maybe one call in five) but going on the system and reserving a time one day ahead isn't out of the question, and two or more days in advance is usually pretty easy. As another poster mentioned it depends on the number of folks in the group. Reserving for a foursome is hard unless you're OK with very early morning or just before dusk, but my wife and always look for two openings, and that isn't too bad. Besides we get to meet some pretty interesting folks when we're willing to join two people who have already reserved.

One thing I've wondered: are specific courses reserved for people here on the lifestyle program? We've tried to get on Briarwood a few times since Dec. 1 and found it to be impossible: all booked up. In fairness it has only been a few times and maybe it was just the time we were looking, but Briarwood is reputed to be in gorgeous condition after it's months-long makeover this summer and fall. It would make sense from the Developer's point of view, I suppose. If you're trying to sell the lifestyle to people here on the program, which is what the Lifestyle is all about, really, it makes a lot more sense to give them priority access to Briarwood than, say, to El Diablo, which we played twice last week and found it to be in absolutely atrocious condition.

[cjrjck]

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

I am totally confused. Is TV divided into sections where certain facilities and amenities belong only to those living in that section? If so, I want a partial refund on my Monthly Amenity Fee. As far as I was told, they cover the entire Villages and not a certain region or section.

[Rainger99]

. We've tried to get on Briarwood a few times since Dec. 1 and found it to be impossible: all booked up. In fairness it has only been a few times and maybe it was just the time we were looking, but Briarwood is reputed to be in gorgeous condition after it's months-long makeover this summer and fall.

Briarwood has not reopened.

The ribbon-cutting is set for 9 a.m. Jan. 16 for the Briarwood Executive Golf Course. The meeting place will be 8501 SE 172nd Legacy Lane.

[biker1]

That is true only if you count the "pitch and putt" courses.

I would say the real problem are you people between 466A and 44! You have fewer executive holes of golf than we have south of 44 yet almost an equal number of homes! And with the announced new executive courses west of the turnpike, we're going to have to build a wall along 44 to keep the hoards of golfers from coming south.

[kansasr]

That is true only if you count the "pitch and putt" courses.

GolfTheVillages calls them Executive courses! So there are currently 99 executive holes of golf south of 44 and 63 between 466A and 44.

And with the 72 championship holes and addition 36 executive holes that have been announced for west of the turnpike, I'd say we're in pretty good shape down here.

[biker1]

There are 36 Executives (not pitch and putt courses) north of 44. 20 of them are within a 20 minute golf cart ride of my house. 6 of the Championship courses are also within a 20 minute golf cart ride of my house. I do play the 5 Executive courses (not pitch and putt courses) south of 44 but they are always at the bottom of my tee time request list. In the time it takes to get to Gray Fox and Red Fox south of 44, I can get to another 12 Executive courses north of 44. The remaining 4 Executives north of 44 are far enough away that I would typically drive my car to them instead of taking the golf cart. In summary, I can conveniently get to 32 Executive courses north of 44 and 5 Executive courses south of 44. Contrary to what you suggested in your earlier post, I have convenient access to much more golf north of 44 than south of 44 and it will remain that way for the foreseeable future. Also, you can try to call the 3 pitch and putt courses south of 44 "executives" but I believe anyone with a modicum of skill wouldn't. I suspect a lot of the play on the pitch and putt "courses" is from people who have had their tee time request denied and practicing 50 yard shots is better than nothing.



GolfTheVillages calls them Executive courses! So there are currently 99 executive holes of golf south of 44 and 63 between 466A and 44.

And with the 72 championship holes and addition 36 executive holes that have been announced for west of the turnpike, I'd say we're in pretty good shape down here.

[Rainger99]

GolfTheVillages calls them Executive courses! So there are currently 99 executive holes of golf south of 44 and 63 between 466A and 44.

And with the 72 championship holes and addition 36 executive holes that have been announced for west of the turnpike, I'd say we're in pretty good shape down here.

If GolfThe villages started calling executive courses championship courses, would that make them championship courses? And if they started calling the putting courses executive courses, would that make them executives?

And you forgot to mention the fifth executive on the west side of the turnpike - the new 18 hole pitch and putt.

Once these are built, it should ease the demand for golf north of 44. However, if you live in Lake Denham or Dabney, it will be a long ways by golf cart to these courses. Hopefully they will build some executives east of the turnpike and south of 470 for people living there.

And we aren’t in good shape until the new courses are built and open.

[kkingston57]

As it gets more and more difficult to get tee times on the Executive courses it made me think. Between 466 and 44, if my numbers are correct, there are 22 Executive courses. In the area south of 44 there are currently 5, with 4 more in some stage of development. That is 9 courses in the newer areas serving a population that is approaching, and eventually likely exceeding, the population of the areas between 466 and 44. Do the developers believe that the newer residents are less golf oriented, or do they simply want to retain more land for residential use? Did Harold overbuild Executive golf, or does the current generation have a different planning model? Of course, no matter what the reason, we have no control over the situation, but it does seem that the model has changed. Just curious!

Another way to create more demand for the regular golf courses which are in the control of the developer.

[Normal]

Heck, are they even permitted to water the courses they have now?