Yamaha Battery Carts

[Bay Kid]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 mile run time.

[Topspinmo]

Maybe the others are pulling you’re leg? :D

[Bill14564]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 hour run time.

50 hour run time? I get a 50+ mile range with my EZgo but that's around four hours of run time.

[village dreamer]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 hour run time.

my camry that gets 600 miles per tank wont run more than 12 hours on one tank ??? 50 hours.......

[Keefelane66]

my camry that gets 600 miles per tank wont run more than 12 hours on one tank ??? 50 hours.......
More like 50 miles, but who would want to drive 50 miles in a gas or electric cart?

[biker1]

I assume you are referring to their lithium-ion carts. If so, they do come with a relatively small lithium-ion battery when compared to some other brands. One possible reason is they are primarily marketed to golf courses where you only need enough range for 2 rounds of golf before recharging.

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 hour run time.

[shaw8700@outlook.com]

But the range goes down every time you use it.

[tophcfa]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 hour run time.

Perhaps they are being smart and are letting their competitors hang themselves chasing the electric market and competing amongst themselves while they continue to crank out the best gas carts available?

[MorTech]

You would think Yamaha would offer a 160/210ah battery in their PTV versions. It would probably be extremely profitable like EZGO Elite models.

[Nova Filtration]

Take a look at the Evolution, priced way better with great standard features

[rsmurano]

I agree, let the EV gang hang themselves. I wouldn’t own one nor an EV car. Too expensive, too expensive for the long run (how much to replace the lithium battery in 8 years?), and mileage isn’t all that great in the winter months. I picked up an electric loaner while I needed an oil change, and belt replacement and the charge dial went down over 1/2 just going 16 miles. Newer cart, battery was 3/4 full, and I was worried I wouldn’t make it back to the shop.

[golfing eagles]

More like 50 miles, but who would want to drive 50 miles in a gas or electric cart?

Someone who lives in Moultrie Creek and wants to play Lopez??????

[txfan]

Maybe the others are pulling you’re leg? :D

They are not. Maybe closed-minded people who don't recognize technology advancements think gas-power is the only transportation option for life.

[Dusty_Star]

They are not. Maybe closed-minded people who don't recognize technology advancements think gas-power is the only transportation option for life.

Resorting to ad hominem usually means your logical argument is weak.

[Fastskiguy]

I agree, let the EV gang hang themselves. I wouldn’t own one nor an EV car. Too expensive, too expensive for the long run (how much to replace the lithium battery in 8 years?), and mileage isn’t all that great in the winter months.

It's a free country and you can drive what you want but none of these things are true about EVs. The reality if that you have a full tank every morning with 250+ miles of range. On a trip you bang out 200 miles, take a pit stop, and you're ready for another 3 hours of driving. Mine cost under 35K and the thing drives itself. It's a ridiculous improvement over my 2017 ICE vehicle. But there will be plenty of gas cars to drive for the next several decades, fossil fuels aren't going anywhere. The modern ICE car is a marvel of engineering, no doubt about that. I just wish they could get the efficiency a little higher.

I agree with the OP....if you can buy an EV that goes 250 miles and lasts for hundreds of thousands of miles for $35-40K, why does it cost $20K for an electric golf car? And why doesn't Yamaha make it?

Joe

[biker1]

Do you realize that Yamaha has been making both gas and electric carts for some time now ? What is new is that they now offer lithium-ion batteries in addition to lead-acid batteries in their electric carts. Approximately 80% of the golf cart market is electric.

Perhaps they are being smart and are letting their competitors hang themselves chasing the electric market and competing amongst themselves while they continue to crank out the best gas carts available?

[LeRoySmith]

Take a look at the Evolution, priced way better with great standard features

This ^

I am what I'd call a motorhead and enjoy fast cars and motorcycles, there's nothing like a car running down a 1/4 mile track or a motorcycle (or dinky roadster) carving through the hills or canyons. I've enjoyed many Yamaha motorcycles, ATVs and jet skis, I think Yamaha (and Honda) make the very best small engines in the world.

All that said I recently bought an Evolution d5 golf cart, it will go 75 or 80 miles on a charge and that's more than enough for me in a day. Its fast, quiet doesn't stink and has all the needed options to make it comfortable. It was nearly half the price of a Yamaha or Star cart so if it self destructs in a few miles I wont have lost much, I hope it has a long trouble free life but only time will tell. If it lasts 7 or 8 years and needs a 4k battery I'll still be 6 or 7k ahead of the other brands.

I will continue to enjoy my v8 powered f150 until a 'good' electric vehicle comes along and at that point I'll probably make the change but not just yet.

[Mrmean58]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 mile run time.

Or maybe the salesperson has other brand electric carts on site and wants to close the deal vs ordering you a Yamaha electric and risk you changing your mind.

[RRGuyNJ]

A little off topic but, I just saw a video from a retired car salesman and his son. They claim the EV car market in some cases are losing over 50% depreciation on new cars. The example they used was the cash offer price on a 2023 vehicle with 500 miles. Who knows if any of it's true but something to think about. Not sure if this would play into the golf cart market also.

[tophcfa]

Approximately 80% of the golf cart market is electric.

That statistic might be correct for short distance use like golf course rentals, but certainly not for other applications requiring driving significant distances. Just walk around Lake Sumter Landing any busy Saturday evening and take note of the mix.

[biker1]

The Villages is a unique environment and probably one of the few places where gas carts outnumber electrics, for now. I was responding to your post where you said " letting their competitors hang themselves chasing the electric market and competing amongst themselves". Nobody is "hanging themselves". They are responding to market demand.


That statistic might be correct for short distance use like golf course rentals, but certainly not for other applications requiring driving significant distances. Just walk around Lake Sumter Landing any busy Saturday evening and take note of the mix.

[rsimpson]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 mile run time.

Why make a "good electric cart" when Yamaha make the BEST gas model.
Focus on what you do best.

[biker1]

The comment wasn't about the quality of Yamaha electric carts. I believe you will find the electric carts are of just as good a quality as the gas carts. I believe the poster wants Yamaha to offer a larger battery for additional range. Perhaps they will.

Why make a "good electric cart" when Yamaha make the BEST gas model.
Focus on what you do best.

[villagetinker]

While I understand many of the arguments for and against electric golf carts IMHO it will have very little effect on your smelling exhaust. I have a Yamaha gas cart, and the only time I smell the exhaust from MY cart is when I am backing up.

[Birdrm]

For me the electric golf cart makes a lot of sense since the 50 mile range seems to be more than enough for a day and then just recharge in your garage overnight. The EV autos are a little different if you want to drive long distances with the extra time and limited infrastructure. As technology increases the range and speed to charge will increase and more and more we will switch to owning an EV.

[ElDiabloJoe]

They are not. Maybe closed-minded people who don't recognize technology advancements think gas-power is the only transportation option for life.

Waiiiiit... Mods, an IP check please, this sounds suspiciously like another frequent poster here - I'm suspecting a ghost account to bypass any imposed posting restrictions.

[HORNET]

Went golfing yesterday, drove back home and then went to Spanish Springs for lunch. Then went to Southern Trace for groceries. Then went to Brownwood to the Square and home, without worrying about range. This is what I call living The Villages Lifestyle!

[sowilts]

Someone who lives in Moultrie Creek and wants to play Lopez??????
Reside at Linden, play all of the courses up north without any issues.EZGO Lithium.

[jimjamuser]

Perhaps they are being smart and are letting their competitors hang themselves chasing the electric market and competing amongst themselves while they continue to crank out the best gas carts available?
Maybe Yamaha is content with the 50 miles and uses LIGHTER batteries which jmprove handling, acceleration, and deceleration when compared to the brands that use heavier batteries. Higher weight can be a disadvantage. And Yamaha has a reputation for quality that they want to protect, so I would give them the benefit of any doubt.

[tophcfa]

Maybe Yamaha is content with the 50 miles and uses LIGHTER batteries which jmprove handling, acceleration, and deceleration when compared to the brands that use heavier batteries. Higher weight can be a disadvantage. And Yamaha has a reputation for quality that they want to protect, so I would give them the benefit of any doubt.

Or perhaps Yamaha is targeting golf course rental fleets as their target electric cart market, where the need for range is less important than coming in at a certain price point. That would give them a competitive advantage for electric fleet vehicles while they already are the clear leader in the gas personal transportation vehicle market.

[JMintzer]

Someone who lives in Moultrie Creek and wants to play Lopez??????

Welcome back! I hope your "vacation" was prosperous...

[Dusty_Star]

Welcome back! I hope your "vacation" was prosperous...

He's back! & He's right! If the electric carts are getting 50+ miles, then the new villages of Moultrie Creek, Shady Brooke, & Water's Edge will spend most of that 50 mile range coming & going with not much left over for a round at Lopez. Actually, they probably could play, but would need charging stations on the way home.

[frayedends]

It's a free country and you can drive what you want but none of these things are true about EVs. The reality if that you have a full tank every morning with 250+ miles of range. On a trip you bang out 200 miles, take a pit stop, and you're ready for another 3 hours of driving. Mine cost under 35K and the thing drives itself. It's a ridiculous improvement over my 2017 ICE vehicle. But there will be plenty of gas cars to drive for the next several decades, fossil fuels aren't going anywhere. The modern ICE car is a marvel of engineering, no doubt about that. I just wish they could get the efficiency a little higher.

I agree with the OP....if you can buy an EV that goes 250 miles and lasts for hundreds of thousands of miles for $35-40K, why does it cost $20K for an electric golf car? And why doesn't Yamaha make it?

Joe

Just a guess, but government subsidies on electric cars may be why the EV is $40K and cart is 20. No subsidies for golf carts.

Anyhow I'm waiting for the hydrogen powered carts. :D

[jimjamuser]

While I understand many of the arguments for and against electric golf carts IMHO it will have very little effect on your smelling exhaust. I have a Yamaha gas cart, and the only time I smell the exhaust from MY cart is when I am backing up.
I ALWAYS smell golf carts when I am working in my front yard and they go by. They have to be about 30ft away before the smell rises above the exhaust pipe level. Newer Yamaha golf carts have little or no smell compared to other models and older Yamaha golf carts.

[jimjamuser]

Do you realize that Yamaha has been making both gas and electric carts for some time now ? What is new is that they now offer lithium-ion batteries in addition to lead-acid batteries in their electric carts. Approximately 80% of the golf cart market is electric.
I believe that the 80% number is for the total USA. For SOME (?) unknown reason The Villages has a greater % of gas golf carts.

[frayedends]

I believe that the 80% number is for the total USA. For SOME (?) unknown reason The Villages has a greater % of gas golf carts.

Probably because most of the country uses them for only golf and we use them for regular transportation.

[biker1]

No mystery at all. When I bought a gas cart 10 years ago, I estimated I would be spending $1000 every 2 -3 years on new batteries for an electric cart based on how many miles I thought we would put on the cart each year. The choice of a gas cart was pretty much a no-brainer. It turns out my estimate of annual miles was a bit low so the decision was better than I originally thought. With the availability of lithium-ion batteries, the equation has changed and electric carts are more attractive to me now. In fact, we own a gas cart and an electric cart. Since electric carts had more than enough range 10 years ago, that was never an issue. Since you don't own a golf cart, I don't really expect that you would have understood this.

I believe that the 80% number is for the total USA. For SOME (?) unknown reason The Villages has a greater % of gas golf carts.

[biker1]

No. Lithium-ion batteries are very light; much lighter than lead-acid batteries. I doubt weight is an issue. It is more likely that Yamaha's primary market for their lithium-ion carts is golf courses where only enough range for 2 rounds of golf is required. They can keep the price lower by right-sizing the battery for the application. Perhaps they will eventually offer higher capacity lithium-ion batteries for other applications where greater range would be attractive.

Maybe Yamaha is content with the 50 miles and uses LIGHTER batteries which jmprove handling, acceleration, and deceleration when compared to the brands that use heavier batteries. Higher weight can be a disadvantage. And Yamaha has a reputation for quality that they want to protect, so I would give them the benefit of any doubt.

[Topspinmo]

They are not. Maybe closed-minded people who don't recognize technology advancements think gas-power is the only transportation option for life.

I see you didn’t take mommy’s advice. :pepper2:

[Topspinmo]

I believe that the 80% number is for the total USA. For SOME (?) unknown reason The Villages has a greater % of gas golf carts.

I find it hard to believe you believe anything? :wave:

[Topspinmo]

I ALWAYS smell golf carts when I am working in my front yard and they go by. They have to be about 30ft away before the smell rises above the exhaust pipe level. Newer Yamaha golf carts have little or no smell compared to other models and older Yamaha golf carts.


Maybe you’re smelling your own gas ? :highfive:

[dhdallas]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 mile run time.

Dealers will lie about electric carts & never go for the hard sell because they make a ton of money in service charges with gas carts. Electric carts are pretty much maintenance free with very few components. Gas carts are a goldmine for the service department due to their complexity and maintenance including oil changes, filter changes, belts, hoses, coolant, injectors, starters, etc. It's the same at car dealers; they want you to buy a gas powered vehicle not an electric one.

[tophcfa]

Dealers will lie about electric carts & never go for the hard sell because they make a ton of money in service charges with gas carts. Electric carts are pretty much maintenance free with very few components. Gas carts are a goldmine for the service department due to their complexity and maintenance including oil changes, filter changes, belts, hoses, coolant, injectors, starters, etc. It's the same at car dealers; they want you to buy a gas powered vehicle not an electric one.

?????? Our three gas carts have been relatively maintenance free for over 8 years. With the exception of a blown leaf spring, nothing but very easy DIY annual tune ups that takes me about 20 minutes per cart. Electric carts also have leaf springs, and they are more likely to blow out with the battery weight.

[Southwest737]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 mile run time.

Buy a quality used one like below then add a couple 100 AH 48 volt Li-ion batteries running in parallel for $2000.
For well under 6 grand you will have a maintenance free cart for the next 10 years with range of 80 miles. And 1 cent per mile for fuel.

Log into Facebook | Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/share/Yb155Dsgi4rXCgoB/?mibextid=79PoIi)

48V 100Ah Lifepo4 Lithium Battery Solar 100A BMS Boat Golf Cart VAN RV Camper | eBay (https://www.ebay.com/itm/374726533731?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=tw-y0u86ssw&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=CzVi0LPbTFC&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY)

[biker1]

Coolant ? There isn't any coolant. They are air cooled. Regarding the rest of the stuff, my Yamaha has been very reliable with minimal maintenance - about 1 hour per year by myself. "Complexity" is not a word I would associate with gas golf carts.

Dealers will lie about electric carts & never go for the hard sell because they make a ton of money in service charges with gas carts. Electric carts are pretty much maintenance free with very few components. Gas carts are a goldmine for the service department due to their complexity and maintenance including oil changes, filter changes, belts, hoses, coolant, injectors, starters, etc. It's the same at car dealers; they want you to buy a gas powered vehicle not an electric one.

[Normal]

The electric carts they sell now are junk. They need serious upgrades in technology before I would buy one. A one way trip from Moultrie Creek to Lopez isn’t that desirable. I’ll wait till a cart can make it both ways 100% of the time.

[PoolBrews]

I agree, let the EV gang hang themselves. I wouldn’t own one nor an EV car. Too expensive, too expensive for the long run (how much to replace the lithium battery in 8 years?), and mileage isn’t all that great in the winter months. I picked up an electric loaner while I needed an oil change, and belt replacement and the charge dial went down over 1/2 just going 16 miles. Newer cart, battery was 3/4 full, and I was worried I wouldn’t make it back to the shop.

The new lithium batteries are fantastic. They come with a 5 year warranty, and are designed to last 3000 cycles. (Lithium batteries are rated based on cycles, not years).

On my Evolution D5 Ranger with a 205ah battery, I can go 65 miles on a cycle, so that equates to a designed life of 195,000 miles. Even if I drive 5,000 miles per year that equates to 39 years! I'll be ready for a new cart before I ever have to replace the battery based on life expectancy.

Even if I had an early failure, say at 10 years, a new battery is currently $3K and the price is dropping every year. I'm pretty sure I'll save $3K in gas, oil changes, and clutch replacements over that 10 years.

The Evolution is $10K less than a comparable Star EV or Club Car and is loaded with features. Also $5K-$7K less than a Yamaha Drive 2 (my last cart), so there's enough savings to already purchase a new battery before I even drive it.

[Footer]

A public course near my house in Wisconsin uses Yamaha electric carts with lead acid batteries. They are awesome. Almost completely silent, much quieter than my EZGO electric carts. Good suspension. Yamaha offers an electric cart with the same 105AH RoyPow battery I used to retrofit my 2011 EZGO. They have a 38 mile range. I get 60 miles. Obviously a difference in the drive train. They need to improve before it's practical for The Villages.

[TJandDee]

I bought a Yamaha Battery cart from Villages Discount Golf Carts back in January and I have the large lithium battery and it get 80+ miles on a full charge. We went from above 466 down to Saw Grass and back around 3 hrs. and still had 46% left on the charge.

[JMintzer]

I believe that the 80% number is for the total USA. For SOME (?) unknown reason The Villages has a greater % of gas golf carts.

As it's been explained, multiple times, it's because golf course buy carts that will be used for a round of golf, and on rare occasions, two rounds. TV buys carts that will be used for PTVs. Completely different uses with completely different millage requirements...

But please, feel free to ignore that information, once again...

[jimjamuser]

Probably because most of the country uses them for only golf and we use them for regular transportation.
OK, so then WE (The Villagers) are MISUSING the golf cart for regular transportation. Which is probably why so many golf cart owners have jacked up the accelerator to give a top speed of over 20 MPH, which the engine and suspensions are NOT designed for. Maybe THAT and driver drinking are the reason for so many golf cart accidents. Also, the GAS engine carts have a high center of gravity (for the golf course) which leads to rollovers and poor cornering.
........Maybe some cart manufacturer should provide a model with a low center of gravity (E-cart) that is specifically designed for regular transportation that still has some golf course use capability. It might have a low range and a high range gearing.

[PoolBrews]

The electric carts they sell now are junk. They need serious upgrades in technology before I would buy one. A one way trip from Moultrie Creek to Lopez isn’t that desirable. I’ll wait till a cart can make it both ways 100% of the time.

Have you even looked at the latest carts? I had a Yamaha Drive 2 for a number years with upgraded seats and all the goodies. I now have the Evolution D5 Ranger with the upgraded 205ah battery. The seats are more comfortable than my Yamaha El Tigre seats, the ride is better, I have self canceling turn signals, high and low beams, an included soundbar with great sound, 4 forward facing seats (and the cart is only about 13" longer than a standard cart), an adjustable steering column, and display that looks like what you get on a car. All for $11K brand new (the cart is $9.5K with the smaller standard battery).

I live as far north as you can get in The Villages - just off hwy 42 near the VA. I have driven all the way to Southern Oaks (~23 miles), played 18, went home and had 25% battery remaining.

This cart is superior in every way to my Yamaha Drive 2. Ride, quality, features, and quietness.

[MorTech]

Look at an Atlas cart...210ah(90 miles) for $15K. Far better value than a Yamaha. A few dealers in the area.

Current Golf Cart Models | Atlas Carts (https://www.atlascarts.com/models/)

[MrChip72]

More like 50 miles, but who would want to drive 50 miles in a gas or electric cart?

Had relatives visiting last week. We went to LSL from my village south of the turnpike. Leisurely 15 mile drive in our gas Yamaha golf cart each way plus we made a couple of side trips there and back. Not that hard to start racking up miles in the cart when you're showing people around.

[LeRoySmith]

Look at an Atlas cart...210ah(90 miles) for $15K. Far better value than a Yamaha. A few dealers in the area.

Current Golf Cart Models | Atlas Carts (https://www.atlascarts.com/models/)

4 forward facing seats is what changed me from atlas to evolution. If I only needed 2 seats I'd be driving an atlas. Both carts are similarly equipped, evolution a little cheaper and 4 forward, atlas a little prettier.

[ElDiabloJoe]

OK, so then WE (The Villagers) are MISUSING the golf cart for regular transportation. Which is probably why so many golf cart owners have jacked up the accelerator to give a top speed of over 20 MPH, which the engine and suspensions are NOT designed for. Maybe THAT and driver drinking are the reason for so many golf cart accidents. Also, the GAS engine carts have a high center of gravity (for the golf course) which leads to rollovers and poor cornering.
........Maybe some cart manufacturer should provide a model with a low center of gravity (E-cart) that is specifically designed for regular transportation that still has some golf course use capability. It might have a low range and a high range gearing.
You know what I like about your posts? You always have all the answers.

True Wonkism at work here. You're a miracle worker. I can't believe the whole world doesn't just shut up and do exactly everything you do or think is best because clearly that is the right way to do any and everything. The rest of us mere mortals are simply inexperienced and uneducated non-Mensa-member fools with zero common sense or understanding of world and human behaviors.

I'm especially impressed because, as you have claimed, you don't have a golf car, haven't had one in many years, and a couple years ago you went for a ride on a friend's golf car. How you have such a complete and sophisticated knowledge on such a varied use topic without any first hand experience is truly remarkable and highly impressive.

I appreciate you are here and am thankful that you are willing to impart your vast knowledge to the plebeian masses. Thank you.

[LeRoySmith]

You know what I like about your posts? You always have all the answers.

True Wonkism at work here. You're a miracle worker. I can't believe the whole world doesn't just shut up and do exactly everything you do or think is best because clearly that is the right way to do any and everything. The rest of us mere mortals are simply inexperienced and uneducated non-Mensa-member fools with zero common sense or understanding of world and human behaviors.

I'm especially impressed because, as you have claimed, you don't have a golf car, haven't had one in many years, and a couple years ago you went for a ride on a friend's golf car. How you have such a complete and sophisticated knowledge on such a varied use topic without any first hand experience is truly remarkable and highly impressive.

I appreciate you are here and am thankful that you are willing to impart your vast knowledge to the plebeian masses. Thank you.
:beer3:

[Topspinmo]

The new lithium batteries are fantastic. They come with a 5 year warranty, and are designed to last 3000 cycles. (Lithium batteries are rated based on cycles, not years).

On my Evolution D5 Ranger with a 205ah battery, I can go 65 miles on a cycle, so that equates to a designed life of 195,000 miles. Even if I drive 5,000 miles per year that equates to 39 years! I'll be ready for a new cart before I ever have to replace the battery based on life expectancy.

Even if I had an early failure, say at 10 years, a new battery is currently $3K and the price is dropping every year. I'm pretty sure I'll save $3K in gas, oil changes, and clutch replacements over that 10 years.

The Evolution is $10K less than a comparable Star EV or Club Car and is loaded with features. Also $5K-$7K less than a Yamaha Drive 2 (my last cart), so there's enough savings to already purchase a new battery before I even drive it.

Price on anything will NOT drop in 10 years. Name one thing has has dropped from 10 years ago? I be waiting for answer.

[LeRoySmith]

Price on anything will NOT drop in 10 years. Name one thing has has dropped from 10 years ago? I be waiting for answer.

TVs and computers have dropped drastically over time. I think you can buy a public official for less now too....

[biker1]

The price drop on lithium-ion batteries is dramatic; about 5x in 10 years. See link below. Many areas of technology have experienced huge drops in price or the price has stayed about the same but the capability has increased. Computer are a prime example. Internet access is another. For example, I paid $45 per month for 1.2 megabits per second of internet access in 1998. In todays dollars that would be around $90. Today I pay $30 per month for 200 megabits per second. A 500x improve in price/performance in 25 years. Google is your friend.

Lithium-Ion Battery Pack Prices Hit Record Low of $139/kWh | BloombergNEF (https://about.bnef.com/blog/lithium-ion-battery-pack-prices-hit-record-low-of-139-kwh/)

Price on anything will NOT drop in 10 years. Name one thing has has dropped from 10 years ago? I be waiting for answer.

[MorTech]

Lithium batteries have a calendar life of maybe 15 years usually because of electrolyte and lattice breakdown...They won't last 39 years, yet.

Driving 5000 miles a year on a cart with ~80 mile range (210ah Star Sirius/Atlas): After 15 years and 75,000 miles you will use about 1000 charge cycles. The degradation on a LFP battery might be 10% after 1000 cycles so you will only be getting 72 miles per charge.

75,000 miles / 15 years on a gas cart would be 60 oil changes at $60 dollars or $3600. Just that one expense pays for a replacement lithium battery. Lithium carts cost one cent per mile in fuel - gas cart 10 cents per mile in fuel - $750 electric - $7500 gas. $6,750 saved.

Are you starting to see the value?

No gas cart ruckus, smell, and laughably awful throttle response. No gas cart maintenance and refueling inconvenience/expense.

The replacement battery 15 years from now will probably be Sodium Ion and cost $1500 in todays dollars.

To fill your automobile with gas might cost $50...Your electric golf cart charging will cost $50 per YEAR :)

[biker1]

The price of oil changes depends on whether you do it yourself. In which case, the cost is about $4 per oil change for my gas cart. Regarding the cost of "electric" fuel, my lithium-ion electric cart costs, at the electrical outlet during recharging, about 5 miles per kWh or about 2.5 cents per mile. My gas cart get 50 miles per gallon or about 7 cents per mile. Gas carts do have some additional "maintenance" items such as a new battery about every 5 years and maybe some belt replacements but these, along with the oil changes, are only about 10% of the fuel charges over 75,000 miles. I put the operating cost of my electric cart at about 1/3 of the operating cost of my gas cart or a 75,000 miles savings of about $4000. We will probably replace the 10 year old gas cart with another electric cart within the next couple of years.

Lithium batteries have a calendar life of maybe 15 years usually because of electrolyte and lattice breakdown...They won't last 39 years, yet.

Driving 5000 miles a year on a cart with ~80 mile range (210ah Star Sirius/Atlas): After 15 years and 75,000 miles you will use about 1000 charge cycles. The degradation on a LFP battery might be 10% after 1000 cycles so you will only be getting 72 miles per charge.

75,000 miles / 15 years on a gas cart would be 60 oil changes at $60 dollars or $3600. Just that one expense pays for a replacement lithium battery. Lithium carts cost one cent per mile in fuel - gas cart 10 cents per mile in fuel - $750 electric - $7500 gas. $6,750 saved.

Are you starting to see the value?

No gas cart ruckus, smell, and laughably awful throttle response. No gas cart maintenance and refueling inconvenience/expense.

The replacement battery 15 years from now will probably be Sodium Ion and cost $1500 in todays dollars.

To fill your automobile with gas might cost $50...Your electric golf cart charging will cost $50 per YEAR :)

[raggedy-andy]

The price of oil changes depends on whether you do it yourself. In which case, the cost is about $4 per oil change for my gas cart. Regarding the cost of "electric" fuel, my lithium-ion electric cart costs, at the electrical outlet during recharging, about 5 miles per kWh or about 2.5 cents per mile. My gas cart get 50 miles per gallon or about 7 cents per mile. Gas carts do have some additional "maintenance" items such as a new battery about every 5 years and maybe some belt replacements but these, along with the oil changes, are only about 10% of the fuel charges over 75,000 miles. I put the operating cost of my electric cart at about 1/3 of the operating cost of my gas cart or a 75,000 miles savings of about $4000. We will probably replace the 10 year old gas cart with another electric cart within the next couple of years.

I lease an electric vehicle. The range for it is about 230 miles with average mixed driving. Around town it's better, on interstates it drops. The same model car would get around 25 mpg average on premium unleaded at around $4/gallon at the moment. That equals $0.16/mile. Even at $0.14/kWh and 3.4 miles per kWh, that's a bit over $0.04/mile. Biker1 is right in that the maintenance on an EV is less than a gas engine, and the operating cost much less.

The rub is the lack of range and the time to recharge making a gas vehicle more desirable, plus the lack of ability to recharge away from home. You can find a gas station every 2 miles or so in this country. In a nutshell, this is why that EV for us is basically an around-town car.

[MorTech]

2.5 cents per mile? My lead-acid cart did better than that!

The EZGO RXV Elite lithium does about one cent per mile.

Even using 5X instead of 10X it would be $3375

[biker1]

Doubtful. I put a watt meter on the cart while charging (you do realize the chargers are not 100% efficient? ) and measured about 200 watt-hours per mile to recharge. That is about 2.5 cents per mile at the current SECO total rate per kWh. The battery pack is 170 amp-hours and 60V and is good for about 60 miles. The battery pack is therefore 10,200 watt-hours or about 170 watt-hours per mile. This is consistent with the 200 watt-hours per mile to recharge when factoring in the less than 100% efficiency of the charger. If you were realizing 1 cent per mile then you cart would have a range approaching 200 miles (which it doesn’t even assuming a large battery pack of 210 amp-hours and 48V).


2.5 cents per mile? My lead-acid cart did better than that!

The EZGO RXV Elite lithium does about one cent per mile.

Even using 5X instead of 10X it would be $3375

[MorTech]

Pulling from SECO using a Kill-A-Watt.
EZGO Elite has regenerative braking.

Even the Aptera does 100wh / mile if driven gently.
Aptera Motors (https://aptera.us/)
Great vehicle for some in TV.

[Two Bills]

Why make a "good electric cart" when Yamaha make the BEST gas model.
Focus on what you do best.

Polaroid did that as well.:icon_wink:

[rhood]

Why can't Yamaha make a good battery cart? I asked the salesman about their carts and he said that Yamaha doesn't make a good battery cart for distance. Why? Other cart brands get + 50 mile run time.

From the Yamaha catalog

104015

[Bay Kid]

From the Yamaha catalog

104015

That is pitiful. So at 15 miles you start to worry.