Turning left in Florida

[TheDude]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?

[LuvtheVillages]

I was always taught that the left turn yields to everyone.

[Bill14564]

///obe///

[airstreamingypsy]

I read this that you had a left turn arrow and chose to go into the far right lane, to turn into the gas station. At the same time, a car opposite you decided to turn right on red into the same lane you wanted. If I am correct, I agree with you. I never turn right on red, when the lane opposite has a green arrow.

[Bill14564]

///obe///

[TheDude]

Well, I'm confused but I enjoy this lesson. The other driver was at a red light.

Florida Statute 316.123 governs the right of way at intersections, stating that:

When turning right, drivers must yield to other vehicles and pedestrians that are in or approaching the intersection. This law emphasizes that vehicles making a right turn should be cautious and ensure it is safe before proceeding.

[mjr0773]

Since OP said he had a green light and not a green arrow, OP should have yielded right of way to the right turning car. If he did have a green left turn arrow, OP did have right of way and the right turning vehicle should have yielded. Aside from that, when legal and safe to do so, the left turning vehicle could have turned into any lane.

[Bill14564]

Well, I'm confused but I enjoy this lesson. The other driver was at a red light.

Florida Statute 316.123 governs the right of way at intersections, stating that:

When turning right, drivers must yield to other vehicles and pedestrians that are in or approaching the intersection. This law emphasizes that vehicles making a right turn should be cautious and ensure it is safe before proceeding.

If the other driver had a red light then further discussion is unnecessary. A driver turning right on red has no right of way at all. As that was not mentioned in the original post I assumed both directions had green lights.


Note: The right turning vehicle must yield because he had a red light, not because he was turning right.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Well, I'm confused but I enjoy this lesson. The other driver was at a red light.

Florida Statute 316.123 governs the right of way at intersections, stating that:

When turning right, drivers must yield to other vehicles and pedestrians that are in or approaching the intersection. This law emphasizes that vehicles making a right turn should be cautious and ensure it is safe before proceeding.

If your left turn lane had a GREEN left turn light, then you had the right of way.

But if you didn't have a left turn light, OR if your left turn light was not green, then you did NOT have the right of way.

All those other laws posted in this thread only apply to lefts and rights where there is no traffic signal to specify that a person turning left may now go. When there's a traffic signal indicating a left turn, then that left turn has the right of way.

[TheDude]

Green arrow, my bad, words matter.

[JMintzer]

Since OP said he had a green light and not a green arrow, OP should have yielded right of way to the right turning car. If he did have a green left turn arrow, OP did have right of way and the right turning vehicle should have yielded. Aside from that, when legal and safe to do so, the left turning vehicle could have turned into any lane.

The OP stated "As I got the green light to turn"...

To me (and many, if not most others in this thread), that means he had the "Green Left Turn Arrow"...

So no, the car with the green arrow had the right of way...

But it would be nice of the OP clarified their initial post...

Edit to add: The OP DID clarify. They stated "The other driver was at a red light", and that he had the Green arrow...

[mjr0773]

OP clarified he had the green arrow. Case closed. He had the right of way on his turn and could turn into either the right or left lane.
Unfortunately we do all have to drive defensively and look out for the silliness on the road at all times.

[Bilyclub]

Right turns on red should never be made if there are oncoming vehicles, no matter what lane they are in.

[BrianL99]

OP clarified he had the green arrow. Case closed. He had the right of way on his turn and could turn into either the right or left lane.
Unfortunately we do all have to drive defensively and look out for the silliness on the road at all times.

That's how I would read it. Green Arrow means the oncoming traffic should have a Red Light and they can't move out of the spot they're in, until "it's safe to do so".

The "Stop Line" at any signalized intersection, should never have a "drive way cut" within about 100' of it, just to prevent such confusion.

[Topspinmo]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?


Did you have turning arrow? Was traffic across from you stopped at red light? If traffic across for you had green light you have to yield (i don’t trust blinker light) If you had green arrow the traffic across for you has to yield.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Did you have turning arrow? Was traffic across from you stopped at red light? If traffic across for you had green light you have to yield (i don’t trust blinker light) If you had green arrow the traffic across for you has to yield.

He had the green arrow. The oncoming traffic had a red light.

[Sandy and Ed]

Me?? I was taught that when making a left turn onto a roadway with two lanes you first go into the leftmost lane and then move onto the right lane when it is safe. Having said that this was the rule in NY and PA. I guess when in Rome…..

[MandoMan]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?

With a left turn signal, you had the right of way, but you were supposed to turn into the lane closest to you, not the outside lane.

The car turning right at a red light could legally turn, but only into the closest lane and only after yielding the right of way to oncoming traffic or people turning left with a turn signal.

Assuming you used your blinker to signal your lane shift to the right and your left turn, you had the rig(t of way.

The other driver was not using adequate caution to allow for such an event. Had there been an accident, though, a cop might have ticketed both of you. You were both careless. Second option might be ticketing the other driver.

It’s very common though illegal for someone turning left on a signal to turn into the outside land rather than the inside lane. It is also common for someone turning right at a light to do the same. I try to make sure I turn into the correct lane, but I also try to watch for someone turning right from the light, even though I have the right of way. Better to slow or yield than get into an accident.

[kidnerkim]

Right can turn right AFTERstopping. They seem to forget that down here

[CoachKandSportsguy]

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.


Its a third world country down here, proven again

[Bill14564]

With a left turn signal, you had the right of way, but you were supposed to turn into the lane closest to you, not the outside lane.

The car turning right at a red light could legally turn, but only into the closest lane and only after yielding the right of way to oncoming traffic or people turning left with a turn signal.

Assuming you used your blinker to signal your lane shift to the right and your left turn, you had the rig(t of way.

The other driver was not using adequate caution to allow for such an event. Had there been an accident, though, a cop might have ticketed both of you. You were both careless. Second option might be ticketing the other driver.

It’s very common though illegal for someone turning left on a signal to turn into the outside land rather than the inside lane. It is also common for someone turning right at a light to do the same. I try to make sure I turn into the correct lane, but I also try to watch for someone turning right from the light, even though I have the right of way. Better to slow or yield than get into an accident.

Not according to Florida law as stated in the original post. Florida law allows the vehicle turning left to use any "lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered." Both the inside and the outside lanes are lawfully available so both the inside and the outside lanes could be used.

I always understood it to be the other way as well, that vehicles should turn into the closest lane. That seems to be a good practice, but not legally required in FL.

[mntlblok]

With a left turn signal, you had the right of way, but you were supposed to turn into the lane closest to you, not the outside lane.
. . .

It’s very common though illegal for someone turning left on a signal to turn into the outside lane rather than the inside lane.
This is a version of a situation the wifey and I have discussed, but with a twist - two lanes turning left via green arrow, but onto a three lane road. My logic was that the left turning lane should turn into the "inside" lane and the right turning lane should use the "outside" lane, and that neither should use the center lane, as that lane would have an ambiguous "definition" as related to the turning lanes. The wifey assured me that she had info that the right turning lane *must* turn into that center lane, as the "outside" lane was reserved for the "stop, turn right on redders". I have no idea where she got that info nor whether it was a Florida thing, but I *can* see some logic to it. I now see that you state that it is illegal to turn into that outside lane, adding credibility to her claim.

Like you, I find myself being extremely cautious in this situation if I'm in the "outside" turn lane, and I'm prepared to yield to either a "red right turner" (whilst also monitoring my rearview mirror) *or* to an inside lane turner who either might not "get" the concept *or* who may have failed to notice that there are *two* turn lanes. (I suspect that most of us have had to deal with both). As I now think about it, I believe I'll just go on past and take to making three "rights" at such junctions. :-)

[Teed_Off]

I agree that the OP had the right of way but it’s important to establish eye contact with the other driver and approach the turn cautiously because factors such as sun glare, distractions or just being an unaware driver could lead to a collision.

[Topspinmo]

Right can turn right AFTERstopping. They seem to forget that down here

Only if the lane clean. If somebody in intersection they have to yield. They seem to forget that down here especially in roundabouts and 4 way stops, and any other intersection.

[Nordhagen]

Me?? I was taught that when making a left turn onto a roadway with two lanes you first go into the leftmost lane and then move onto the right lane when it is safe. Having said that this was the rule in NY and PA. I guess when in Rome…..
That’s what I was taught when I first got my drivers license and a practice I always use.

[Topgun 1776]

You DO NOT get to choose multiple lanes to turn into with a green arrow! If you take the right lane you have just changed lanes illegally in the middle of an intersection! If you start in the far left lane you MUST stay in the far left lane through your turn. After your turn, when its safe to do so, you can then proceed into the right lane. Think about it folks, what if there were 3 or 4 lanes you could possibly turn into? Does anyone believe the person turning left with the arrow gets to pick which lane he wants? Of course not. Same rule applies here. Far left turning...far left lane exiting. Simple.

[Bill14564]

You DO NOT get to choose multiple lanes to turn into with a green arrow! If you take the right lane you have just changed lanes illegally in the middle of an intersection! If you start in the far left lane you MUST stay in the far left lane through your turn. After your turn, when its safe to do so, you can then proceed into the right lane. Think about it folks, what if there were 3 or 4 lanes you could possibly turn into? Does anyone believe the person turning left with the arrow gets to pick which lane he wants? Of course not. Same rule applies here. Far left turning...far left lane exiting. Simple.

The State of FL believes this as documented in FL Statute 316.151 referenced in the original post.

If there is a single left turn lane then apparently that lane is free to choose which lane to turn into. I personally always choose the leftmost thru lane (see below) but that appears to be a "good practice" rather than the law.

If there are multiple left turn lanes then I have always seen lane markings through the turn to direct traffic into the appropriate lane.

Turning into the leftmost lane is not always the proper thing to do, particularly when from an exit lane of a highway onto the road crossing under the highway (think 75S exit onto 44E). Turning into the leftmost lane puts you into the left-turn lane to re-enter the highway going the opposite direction.

[Rainger99]

You DO NOT get to choose multiple lanes to turn into with a green arrow! If you take the right lane you have just changed lanes illegally in the middle of an intersection! If you start in the far left lane you MUST stay in the far left lane through your turn. After your turn, when its safe to do so, you can then proceed into the right lane. Think about it folks, what if there were 3 or 4 lanes you could possibly turn into? Does anyone believe the person turning left with the arrow gets to pick which lane he wants? Of course not. Same rule applies here. Far left turning...far left lane exiting. Simple.

You are right for most states. But as far as I can tell, Florida appears to allow you to choose any lane!

I have seen some 4 or 5 lane roads in Orlando and I have always turned into the left most lane and then move over to the right lane. Now I can go directly into the right most lane.

The Florida law should be changed as it increases the chance of an accident. But that is good for lawyers and may be one reason (if many) our insurance is so expensive.

There should be national standards for driving.

[Laker14]

I agree with the OP, and would add, that when turning right on red, watch out for the driver at your 3 O'Clock making a U-turn. And while making a U-turn, watch out for the driver at your 9 O'clock making the right turn on red.

[retiredguy123]

In Saudi Arabia, the driver who honks the horn first has the right of way, regardless of the situation. Traffic lights and stop signs are just for decoration.

[Heytubes]

You must stay in the leftmost lane when turning left, then signal to the right lane when clear. Be safe, rather than think you’re right.

[Davonu]

You must stay in the leftmost lane when turning left, then signal to the right lane when clear...
Nope.

You can safely…and legally…complete your left turn into any available through lane.

[nn0wheremann]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?
Drive defensively.

[Cassieb]

You must remain in the lane you are turning from. From your explanation you nearly hit the other car by crossing lanes. It would have been your fault.

[Topgun 1776]

You must stay in the leftmost lane when turning left, then signal to the right lane when clear. Be safe, rather than think you’re right.
You're spot on! If you are turning from the far left, you must stay in the far left most lane through your turn. Only after that, can you safely change lanes.

[Topgun 1776]

Nope.

You can safely…and legally…complete your left turn into any available through lane.

Nope...if you're turning from the far left lane, you must stay in that lane through your turn. You don't get your choice. If you hit me when I've turned right, you'll be found at fault for illegal lane change in an intersection.

[Topgun 1776]

You must remain in the lane you are turning from. From your explanation you nearly hit the other car by crossing lanes. It would have been your fault.
Absolutely correct!!! Anyone crossing from far left to the right lane has committed an improper lane change and will be held liable if there's an accident. Just because they have the arrow, they don't get to choose which lane they want.

[Bill14564]

Nope...if you're turning from the far left lane, you must stay in that lane through your turn. You don't get your choice. If you hit me when I've turned right, you'll be found at fault for illegal lane change in an intersection.

The above is incorrect according to FL Statute 316.151. Please post a citation that supports your claim that you must stay in the leftmost lane.

If you are turning left on a green arrow then the oncoming traffic has a red light and a right-turning vehicle must yield. If there is a collision then it is the right-turning vehicle that is at fault.

If you are turning left on a green light then the oncoming traffic also has a green light and the left-turning vehicle must yield. If there is a collision in this case then the left-turning vehicle would be at fault.

[Topgun 1776]

Me?? I was taught that when making a left turn onto a roadway with two lanes you first go into the leftmost lane and then move onto the right lane when it is safe. Having said that this was the rule in NY and PA. I guess when in Rome…..
You are correct! If you're turning from the far left turn lane, you don't get your pick of lanes in the middle of a intersection/turn. You must stay in the left lane through the completion of the turn and then, when the right lane is clear, safely change lanes. Left turns with an arrow don't get their choice of lanes.

[Lanieb]

I read this that you had a left turn arrow and chose to go into the far right lane, to turn into the gas station. At the same time, a car opposite you decided to turn right on red into the same lane you wanted. If I am correct, I agree with you. I never turn right on red, when the lane opposite has a green arrow.
How would you know that the right turning lane has a green arrow it’s back is to you?

[Topgun 1776]

With a left turn signal, you had the right of way, but you were supposed to turn into the lane closest to you, not the outside lane.

The car turning right at a red light could legally turn, but only into the closest lane and only after yielding the right of way to oncoming traffic or people turning left with a turn signal.

Assuming you used your blinker to signal your lane shift to the right and your left turn, you had the rig(t of way.

The other driver was not using adequate caution to allow for such an event. Had there been an accident, though, a cop might have ticketed both of you. You were both careless. Second option might be ticketing the other driver.

It’s very common though illegal for someone turning left on a signal to turn into the outside land rather than the inside lane. It is also common for someone turning right at a light to do the same. I try to make sure I turn into the correct lane, but I also try to watch for someone turning right from the light, even though I have the right of way. Better to slow or yield than get into an accident.
I was a policeman, the person turning left does not get their pick of a lane when entering a roadway with 2 lanes are more. They have started the turn from the far left, therefore they must stay in the far left lane of the roadway they are entering. Only after they've established themselves in the far left lane can they safely change lanes. In the opposite traveling traffic, as long as there is a right on red and the driver turning right has stopped first, he can proceed into the far most right lane. If the driver turning left stays in his legal lane and the driver turning right stays in the far right lane, both can safely proceed without accident.

[HORNET]

Been here 17 years, entitlement of people here has gone overboard, used to be a Friendly place.

[Topgun 1776]

Not according to Florida law as stated in the original post. Florida law allows the vehicle turning left to use any "lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered." Both the inside and the outside lanes are lawfully available so both the inside and the outside lanes could be used.

I always understood it to be the other way as well, that vehicles should turn into the closest lane. That seems to be a good practice, but not legally required in FL.
Incorrect. You get ONE lane to turn from and ONE lane to go into. If there are multiple lanes on the roadway being entered, if you are turning from the far most left lane, you must enter the far most left lane of the roadway you are entering. You don't get your choice of lanes to turn into. Period.

[TheDude]

After reading some of the later posts, I would like to suggest people read the first page of the thread.

It is there that actual law is pointed out.

So, I ask, to all those who give opinions, what about the law? Still not convinced?

'Turning left with a green arrow would mean the other driver would have the red light. With that said, then there is no reason they can't move to any available lane. Also, talking about this specific location, not any other place or any place with special conditions.'

So, I ask, all those who disagree, "what about the law that has be posted?"

[TheDude]

Topgun, show the law starting your point of view, please. I'm learning and if you know something they please share.

I will post this again.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

[Indydealmaker]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?

You can be ticketed for making a turn into any lane different from the one from which your turn started. After you complete the turn, signal to change lanes. Common sense dictates this method reduces accidents.

[Bill14564]

Incorrect. You get ONE lane to turn from and ONE lane to go into. If there are multiple lanes on the roadway being entered, if you are turning from the far most left lane, you must enter the far most left lane of the roadway you are entering. You don't get your choice of lanes to turn into. Period.

From post #38:

The above is incorrect according to FL Statute 316.151. Please post a citation that supports your claim that you must stay in the leftmost lane.

If you are turning left on a green arrow then the oncoming traffic has a red light and a right-turning vehicle must yield. If there is a collision then it is the right-turning vehicle that is at fault.

If you are turning left on a green light then the oncoming traffic also has a green light and the left-turning vehicle must yield. If there is a collision in this case then the left-turning vehicle would be at fault.

You seem pretty convinced that you are correct. Where in the Florida law does it say 316.151 does NOT apply?

[kendi]

You’re putting a lot of energy into this. Getting out and talking to the other driver, posting on social media. Not sure why this is worth ruining your whole day.

[dlspiess]

Unless the person is making a right turn on red. Then they must yield but if they have the green also then the left turn must yield. This is everywhere I believe

[Topspinmo]

Law says right turn on red after yielding. If vehicle coming at you can’t just blunder out into any intersection, you have to yield period. I seen right turners jump out when both lanes are in intersection turning trying to bet them, them they slow down after blocking traffic. Happened hundred time day with .00001% chance of getting ticketed.

[Topspinmo]

You’re putting a lot of energy into this. Getting out and talking to the other driver, posting on social media. Not sure why this is worth ruining your whole day.

Now days it best not to confront people over Pettit crap IMO.

[TheDude]

You can be ticketed for making a turn into any lane different from the one from which your turn started. After you complete the turn, signal to change lanes. Common sense dictates this method reduces accidents.

If you could find the law that states what you believe, I would like to learn.

If I was a judge, what law would you present to me to prove you are right?

[TheDude]

Now days it best not to confront people over Pettit crap IMO.


There was no road rage. Just a friendly disagreement.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You must remain in the lane you are turning from. From your explanation you nearly hit the other car by crossing lanes. It would have been your fault.

When you're taking a left, at a left-turn-arrow signal that is green, from a single lane, into a two-lane strip-mall driveway, AND the right lane of that 2-lane drive has another driveway immediately upon entering that gets you into the parking lot you need to be in...

then you have the absolute right to turn left from that single-lane left turn, to the right lane of the strip-mall driveway, so that you can get to that parking lot.

As long as YOU have the green light, you can do this.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Nope...if you're turning from the far left lane, you must stay in that lane through your turn. You don't get your choice. If you hit me when I've turned right, you'll be found at fault for illegal lane change in an intersection.

If you turned right while you had a red light, and I had a green left-turn arrow, you're the one who would be found at fault for running a red light.

[Deden]

You are correct but, but up north when making a left turn with or without an arrow you turn into the left lane, you're in then you can proceed to change lanes when it is safe. The other driver is wrong. When you have a green arrow that means they have Red. and have to stop and yield when traffic is safe to go on red. I have a driver's license and then went through the 3-day motorcycle school. Where they showed videos of safe driving rules. And that is one of many safeties do's & don't s. Hope this helps and answers your questions. Stay safe out there.

[pauld315]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?

It sounds to me like the guy turning right had a red light while the person turning left had a green arrow. The guy turning right disobeyed the law since he didn't yield to the car that had the legal right to be turning.

[jimhoward]

It’s right on red after stop. If somebody is coming, no matter from what direction, you don’t go.

If the left turner hasn’t started their turn yet, and you are stopped ready to turn right, and the lane is open, then go but make it snappy. You’d be gone before they get there.

The problem here is that the right turner just assumed that the left turner , would go into the left lane so thought he could go. You can’t do that.

[Topgun 1776]

The above is incorrect according to FL Statute 316.151. Please post a citation that supports your claim that you must stay in the leftmost lane.

If you are turning left on a green arrow then the oncoming traffic has a red light and a right-turning vehicle must yield. If there is a collision then it is the right-turning vehicle that is at fault.

If you are turning left on a green light then the oncoming traffic also has a green light and the left-turning vehicle must yield. If there is a collision in this case then the left-turning vehicle would be at fault.
You.didnt post a citation. You posted your interpretation. My point is ...again..if there is a SINGLE lane the left turning vehicle is going into, yes, he has the right of way. If there a multiple lanes, the driver turning left STAYS in the far most left lane throughout the turn. Once he's safely completed his turn, he may then safely change lanes. He does NOT legally get to swap lanes from the far left into any other available lane during the turn. That's called an improper lane change in any State. Simple stuff a lot of people ignore and develop bad habits because they're convenient

[BumpaOompa]

///obe///

You must be trying to break a record on the most posts!

[Bill14564]

You.didnt post a citation. You posted your interpretation. My point is ...again..if there is a SINGLE lane the left turning vehicle is going into, yes, he has the right of way. If there a multiple lanes, the driver turning left STAYS in the far most left lane throughout the turn. Once he's safely completed his turn, he may then safely change lanes. He does NOT legally get to swap lanes from the far left into any other available lane during the turn. That's called an improper lane change in any State. Simple stuff a lot of people ignore and develop bad habits because they're convenient

Uggh!

How do you quote exactly what I wrote:

The above is incorrect according to FL Statute 316.151. Please post a citation that supports your claim that you must stay in the leftmost lane.


and say I have not provided a citation? "FL Statute 316.151" *IS* the citation! If you want the exact text, you can find that via google, in the original post, and in several posts that quote the original post. If you refuse to look it up yourself, here it is:


...

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.
...


The pertinent wording: "... leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction.." It does not say, "the leftmost lane," or "the lane closest to the center line" Wording similar to that is used in the NYS law where you must turn into the closest lane. The Florida law does not specify which lane to use. The Florida law says, "a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction." The rightmost lane is a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction.

[Bill14564]

You must be trying to break a record on the most posts!

Honestly, no I'm not.

I misunderstood the original post and argued the wrong point. Rather than leaving two bad arguments in place, I deleted them.

I am "triggered" by people using the phrase, "it's the law," when they have absolutely no idea how the law actually reads. I've spent too much time arguing with that in my career and it still bothers me today. If "it's the law" then it should be easy to give a citation of the actual law. The original poster did that, those disagreeing have not.

[Lyarham]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?
I believe since you had the arrow you have the right of way

[Fenster]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?

I disagree. Think it through. And reread the handbook. If you go from the left lane into the right lane, where the opposing car wants to go, you create a dangerous condition. Even if the law is vague, you are encroaching upon the other driver’s lane.

Also, to go from one lane (left) to another (right), you have to signal your lane change. There is a required distance for you to give notice (varies by state).

Depending on the timing, you are probably cutting the other driver off.

My advice: don’t do it. Saying that you’re acting legally (probably not) doesn’t make it safe.

[fdpaq0580]

I disagree. Think it through. And reread the handbook. If you go from the left lane into the right lane, where the opposing car wants to go, you create a dangerous condition. Even if the law is vague, you are encroaching upon the other driver’s lane.

Also, to go from one lane (left) to another (right), you have to signal your lane change. There is a required distance for you to give notice (varies by state).

Depending on the timing, you are probably cutting the other driver off.

My advice: don’t do it. Saying that you’re acting legally (probably not) doesn’t make it safe.

Disagree all you want. The law is not vague, it is quite specific. Turning right on a red light requires that you stop, look and make certain that the intersection is clear of oncoming traffic before proceeding. Many people from other states come here and make this and other mistakes. If an accident had occurred, the right turner would have cited for failure to yield. Remember the old saying, "when in Rome, do as the Romans do". Same principle. When in Florida.....

[Bilyclub]

Here is the link to the handbook: https://www.flhsmv.gov/pdf/handbooks/englishdriverhandbook.pdf


I have found no diagrams or language concerning turns and what lanes to turn into. Even if I did, state law supercedes a DMV handbook.

[TheDude]

Here is the link to the handbook: https://www.flhsmv.gov/pdf/handbooks/englishdriverhandbook.pdf


I have found no diagrams or language concerning turns and what lanes to turn into. Even if I did, state law supercedes a DMV handbook.

Its on page 70, top of page

[Aldeano Feliz]

Florida Laws Regarding Lane Changes
Florida Statute 316.089 codifies the procedures that drivers should employ prior to changing lanes. Specifically, it states that motorists must stay within a single lane of travel on any road that is divided into two or more lanes, and they cannot move into another lane unless they have determined that they can do so safely. It also dictates that drivers must obey any traffic control device that prohibits lane changes on certain sections of the road. Similarly, Florida Statute 316.085 bars drivers from moving into another lane unless a driver is confident that no cars are approaching in either direction and that the move can be safely made without interfering with any other driver. Finally, Florida Statute 316.55 states that a motorist must activate a vehicle’s turn signal for at least 100 feet prior to changing lanes.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Florida Laws Regarding Lane Changes
Florida Statute 316.089 codifies the procedures that drivers should employ prior to changing lanes. Specifically, it states that motorists must stay within a single lane of travel on any road that is divided into two or more lanes, and they cannot move into another lane unless they have determined that they can do so safely. It also dictates that drivers must obey any traffic control device that prohibits lane changes on certain sections of the road. Similarly, Florida Statute 316.085 bars drivers from moving into another lane unless a driver is confident that no cars are approaching in either direction and that the move can be safely made without interfering with any other driver. Finally, Florida Statute 316.55 states that a motorist must activate a vehicle’s turn signal for at least 100 feet prior to changing lanes.

IF you are turning FROM one lane TO two lanes, AND IF you have the right of way, AND IF the oncoming traffic has a red light, THEN you can pick which lane you're turning to.

This is what happened in the OP's case.

They were in a single lane dedicated to people taking a left, from the main road (466A) to a strip-mall driveway (I believe this was Colony Plaza).

They were traveling east on 466A and got into the left turn only lane. People coming west on 466A had a RED light. The person taking a left had a GREEN light. The person taking a left had the right of way.

Immediately after turning into that driveway, there is a gas station on the RIGHT. The only way to get there from 466A, traveling east and taking a left at the light, is to be in the right lane after the turn. You can't turn onto the left lane in that drive, and take a right. THAT would be dangerous, stupid, and not lawful.

[Velvet]

I was always taught that the left turn yields to everyone.

In almost all driving situations, when you're making a left-hand turn, you are expected to yield to other vehicles, including when a driver facing you is turning right. - Google

[retiredguy123]

In almost all driving situations, when you're making a left-hand turn, you are expected to yield to other vehicles, including when a driver facing you is turning right. - Google
Not when you have a green arrow.

[Bilyclub]

Its on page 70, top of page

It says to stay in the proper lane.

According to the turn law it can be either lane. It’s not a lane change because they are no lines thru the intersection designating lanes.

[djlnc]

If you are approaching a four lane road and making a left turn, and there is an oncoming car that is going to make a right turn, you should stay in the left lane and the oncoming car should stay in the right lane. No chance of a collision. Is it too late to make this an amendment for the Nov. 5th vote?

[Velvet]

Not when you have a green arrow.

A green means you have the right of way. But a smart person will still not plow into the idiot who doesn’t recognize it.

[TheDude]

Here is exact location

[Danube]

You must stay in the leftmost lane when turning left, then signal to the right lane when clear. Be safe, rather than think you’re right.

No. Left turn can turn to any lane. OP had a green left arrow which means the opposing vehicle making a right had a red light. The vehicle at the red light must yield in all circumstances.

[Danube]

You must remain in the lane you are turning from. From your explanation you nearly hit the other car by crossing lanes. It would have been your fault.

No. Left turns can go to any lane.

Right turns can only go to the right lane.

OP had a green arrow = turn into any lane while opposinf vehicle must wait at his red light.

Not complicated and it's in the rule book.

[Danube]

You must remain in the lane you are turning from. From your explanation you nearly hit the other car by crossing lanes. It would have been your fault.

Wrong.

[Danube]

You are correct! If you're turning from the far left turn lane, you don't get your pick of lanes in the middle of a intersection/turn. You must stay in the left lane through the completion of the turn and then, when the right lane is clear, safely change lanes. Left turns with an arrow don't get their choice of lanes.

Wrong.

See page 1:
"Florida DMV handbook (which outranks cops) clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook."

[Danube]

I disagree. Think it through. And reread the handbook. If you go from the left lane into the right lane, where the opposing car wants to go, you create a dangerous condition. Even if the law is vague, you are encroaching upon the other driver’s lane.

Also, to go from one lane (left) to another (right), you have to signal your lane change. There is a required distance for you to give notice (varies by state).

Depending on the timing, you are probably cutting the other driver off.

My advice: don’t do it. Saying that you’re acting legally (probably not) doesn’t make it safe.

Nope.
The car turning right had a red light since the OP (turning left) had a green arrow.

Really, this isn't complicated.

[BrianL99]

The number of completely erroneous and dangerous interpretations and opinions on this thread is mind boggling. Where did you folks learn how to drive? It's the same in EVERY state in the USA.

A vehicle turning right at a stop light or sign, never, ever, under any circumstances, has the Right of Way. They are at the mercy of any other traffic in the vicinity. Always.

If the OP had a Green Arrow, vehicles coming in the opposite direction at that intersection have a RED light. They can't move from a stopped position, until it's "safe to do so". Every other vehicle in the area, not subject to a red light, takes precedent.

Turning with a Green arrow allows you to enter into any available lane, unless it's a "double turning lane" you're in.

Driving 101.

[Danube]

IF you are turning FROM one lane TO two lanes, AND IF you have the right of way, AND IF the oncoming traffic has a red light, THEN you can pick which lane you're turning to.

This is what happened in the OP's case.

They were in a single lane dedicated to people taking a left, from the main road (466A) to a strip-mall driveway (I believe this was Colony Plaza).

They were traveling east on 466A and got into the left turn only lane. People coming west on 466A had a RED light. The person taking a left had a GREEN light. The person taking a left had the right of way.

Immediately after turning into that driveway, there is a gas station on the RIGHT. The only way to get there from 466A, traveling east and taking a left at the light, is to be in the right lane after the turn. You can't turn onto the left lane in that drive, and take a right. THAT would be dangerous, stupid, and not lawful.

Well said, and correct.

[DAVES]

I was always taught that the left turn yields to everyone.

The books says the car on the right has the right of way. The reality it is a bit of a reach assuming those around you know the law and a bigger reach that they know the law and will follow it. Defensive driving means be sure you have a way out if they..........

[VApeople]

The OP needs to learn how to drive in The Villages.

You can't expect old codgers to follow every rule perfectly. At every intersection or roundabout, I always have one hand on the horn so I can blast my horn at anyone who, in my opinion, does something wrong while driving.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

The number of completely erroneous and dangerous interpretations and opinions on this thread is mind boggling. Where did you folks learn how to drive? It's the same in EVERY state in the USA.

A vehicle turning right at a stop light or sign, never, ever, under any circumstances, has the Right of Way. They are at the mercy of any other traffic in the vicinity. Always.


Driving 101.

Never under any circumstances - is 100% incorrect.

If I show up at a stop sign and I'm taking a right, and someone else comes to their stop sign opposite me, and they want to take a left (in the same direction I'm heading) - I have the right of way if we arrived at the same time, OR if I arrived first. If THEY arrived first, then they have the right and I have to wait. But we both have to stop, because we each have a stop sign.

If I'm taking a right, and someone is coming across the road from my left, and we both have a stop sign, and we both arrived at the same time, then I have the right of way. If they arrived first, then they have the right of way.

So no - not "never under any circumstances." There are LOTS of circumstances when the person taking a right has the right of way.

[JustSomeGuy]

The statue starts with right turns and what is legal. That was left out.

If my understanding is correct, the other car was in front of you as you were turning left. If that is the case and he was making a right turn on red into the right lane, then that lane was no longer available for you to "lawfully enter" since he was entitled to use that lane to complete his turn. You could have slowed down and entered behind him safely. Any other interpretation would cause the driver legally entitled to the right lane to wait for all left turning drivers before he turns.... that defeats the reason for permitting right turns on red on to a roadway with two or more lanes.

You were turning into a lane he was already legally occupying. That lane was no longer legally available to you due to his right turn on red starting before your left turn.


316.151 Required position and method of turning at intersections.—
(1)(a) Right turn.—The driver of a vehicle intending to turn right at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must:
1. Make both the approach for a right turn and a right turn as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway.
2. When overtaking and passing a bicycle proceeding in the same direction, give an appropriate signal as provided for in s. 316.156 and make the right turn only if the bicycle is at least 20 feet from the intersection, and is of such a distance that the driver of a vehicle may safely turn.
(b) Left turn.—
1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

[JustSomeGuy]

The oadway being entered.

[Topgun 1776]

Wrong.

See page 1:
"Florida DMV handbook (which outranks cops) clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook."
When you get in an accident and get a ticket for doing so, please show the officer this quote from the DMV handbook. He'll laugh at you all the way to his patrol car!!!!

[fdpaq0580]

When you get in an accident and get a ticket for doing so, please show the officer this quote from the DMV handbook. He'll laugh at you all the way to his patrol car!!!!

Hopefully an accident won't be necessary to test the theory. And cops already laughed at me. Come to think of it, most folks laugh at me.

[Jercop]

This post reminds me of my youth and my Driver Education course. The instructor stated "don't always expect you or the other driver to be right or wrong. Reason being even if you follow the rules of the road and you feel what you want to do is correct or right, you could be right DEAD RIGHT." Always drive defensively and arrive home alive.

[fdpaq0580]

This post reminds me of my youth and my Driver Education course. The instructor stated "don't always expect you or the other driver to be right or wrong. Reason being even if you follow the rules of the road and you feel what you want to do is correct or right, you could be right DEAD RIGHT." Always drive defensively and arrive home alive.

Good advice!

[JRcorvette]

Today, I was turning left from 466A into the Publix/gas station entrance.

As I got the green light to turn, there was a car on the other side of the road turning right. I was aiming for the right lane so I could turn into the gas station, while he was turning right from the other side.

We didn’t come close to an accident, but we both ended up pulling into the gas station parking lot to talk about it.

What frustrates me is that people who move to Florida don’t seem to understand Florida’s driving laws.

He didn't believe me because a 'cop' friend told him he had right of way and I wasn't supposed to turn into right lane.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.

--

I will not get into 'feelings', it's the law. Also, the right always yields. So, if the law was different, the right still yields.

Wonder what others have thought on this topic. How many of you knew this?

I believe that when making a Left your are to stay in the far Left lane on the road that you are entering. Many people end up in the right lane and yes there could be an accident with people making a Right onto the same street. That said the people making a Right should always yield to those making a Left… ok got that?

[MollyJo]

I was always taught that the left turn yields to everyone.
Unless you are turning left on a green arrow. The opposing traffic should have a red light & yield for a right turn.

[Bilyclub]

I will add to go straight or right at the next intersection on Trailwinds Blvd. you have to be in the right lane. If you look closely you can see where the solid white line starts about 30 feet from the crosswalk.

I can’t fathom that so many posters believe they can pull into approaching traffic to make a right turn on red.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

The statue starts with right turns and what is legal. That was left out.

If my understanding is correct, the other car was in front of you as you were turning left. If that is the case and he was making a right turn on red into the right lane, then that lane was no longer available for you to "lawfully enter" since he was entitled to use that lane to complete his turn. You could have slowed down and entered behind him safely. Any other interpretation would cause the driver legally entitled to the right lane to wait for all left turning drivers before he turns.... that defeats the reason for permitting right turns on red on to a roadway with two or more lanes.

You were turning into a lane he was already legally occupying. That lane was no longer legally available to you due to his right turn on red starting before your left turn.


316.151 Required position and method of turning at intersections.—
(1)(a) Right turn.—The driver of a vehicle intending to turn right at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must:
1. Make both the approach for a right turn and a right turn as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway.
2. When overtaking and passing a bicycle proceeding in the same direction, give an appropriate signal as provided for in s. 316.156 and make the right turn only if the bicycle is at least 20 feet from the intersection, and is of such a distance that the driver of a vehicle may safely turn.
(b) Left turn.—
1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

The above ONLY applies if the person taking a left does NOT have a traffic light directing him to proceed.

If the person taking a left has a traffic light directing him to proceed (a green arrow pointing left) then he has the right of way. Everyone else needs to wait. Except for pedestrians who are already in the crosswalk. They can continue across.

[fdpaq0580]

I can’t fathom that so many posters believe they can pull into approaching traffic to make a right turn on red.

Impatience, entitlement, ignorance, just naturally "pushy", are a few reasons. Death Wish? Naw, thats going too far.

[Topspinmo]

All I can say is better be careful when driving in villages cause I amazed how many have no clue what red stop light means or how to enter intersection making right turn on red. I tend to agree actual driving test should be required for any out state new drivers. All Written test means you can read and comprehend enough to pass written test, but might have no clue how to drive.

[Velvet]

I will add to go straight or right at the next intersection on Trailwinds Blvd. you have to be in the right lane. If you look closely you can see where the solid white line starts about 30 feet from the crosswalk.

I can’t fathom that so many posters believe they can pull into approaching traffic to make a right turn on red.

This diagram would indicate that the red car is turning right but then if it wants to turn left next it needs to enter the middle lane. If this is the case then it is bad traffic design. Unless I am misunderstanding it. In most places the red car turning right must turn into the rightmost lane first, and then change lanes, when it is safe to do so, into a left turning lane.

[Danube]

The above ONLY applies if the person taking a left does NOT have a traffic light directing him to proceed.

If the person taking a left has a traffic light directing him to proceed (a green arrow pointing left) then he has the right of way. Everyone else needs to wait. Except for pedestrians who are already in the crosswalk. They can continue across.

You are right again. And you're backed-up by Statute (like the driver's handbook clearly states).

But I now see it's hopeless trying to convince some people, even with written evidence. Even former law enforcement is mistaken, think about that.

[Danube]

When you get in an accident and get a ticket for doing so, please show the officer this quote from the DMV handbook. He'll laugh at you all the way to his patrol car!!!!

Then a judge and/or attorney would explain to the cop what State law clearly states. And how the cop is subservient to the law (which is enacted by the people via the elected legislature).

Hopefully the judge would then send the cop to traffic school.

[Sandy and Ed]

You must remain in the lane you are turning from. From your explanation you nearly hit the other car by crossing lanes. It would have been your fault.
That is the most concise, simple and logical way to explain it. Thank you.

[Danube]

That is the most concise, simple and logical way to explain it. Thank you.

Wrong. Left turns can go to any available lane. Here's the Statute, which is unambiguous.

The 2024 Florida Statutes
Title XXIII MOTOR VEHICLES
Chapter 316 STATE UNIFORM TRAFFIC CONTROL

316.151
Required position and method of turning at intersections.—
(1)((b) Left turn.—
1.The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway...must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

-------------------------------------------

This is unlike a right turn, where you must end up in the right lane:

(1)(a) Right turn.—The driver of a vehicle intending to turn right at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must:
1. Make both the approach for a right turn and a right turn as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway.

Case closed.

Link Statutes & Constitution
:View Statutes
:

Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0300-0399/0316/Sections/0316.151.html)

[djlnc]

It's good that they specify the right turner is supposed to stay in the right lane. Now if they would only correct it so the left turner has to stay in the left lane all would be hunky dory.

[JMintzer]

I was a policeman, the person turning left does not get their pick of a lane when entering a roadway with 2 lanes are more. They have started the turn from the far left, therefore they must stay in the far left lane of the roadway they are entering. Only after they've established themselves in the far left lane can they safely change lanes. In the opposite traveling traffic, as long as there is a right on red and the driver turning right has stopped first, he can proceed into the far most right lane. If the driver turning left stays in his legal lane and the driver turning right stays in the far right lane, both can safely proceed without accident.

Were you a cop in FL? Traffic laws differ by state...

[JMintzer]

Been here 17 years, entitlement of people here has gone overboard, used to be a Friendly place.

Exactly where is "entitlement" being displayed in this thread?

[JMintzer]

Incorrect. You get ONE lane to turn from and ONE lane to go into. If there are multiple lanes on the roadway being entered, if you are turning from the far most left lane, you must enter the far most left lane of the roadway you are entering. You don't get your choice of lanes to turn into. Period.

Incorrect. Period.

[JMintzer]

You can be ticketed for making a turn into any lane different from the one from which your turn started. After you complete the turn, signal to change lanes. Common sense dictates this method reduces accidents.

Incorrect. Read the FL law posted earlier in the thread...

[JMintzer]

Unless the person is making a right turn on red. Then they must yield but if they have the green also then the left turn must yield. This is everywhere I believe

The entire point of this thread is that the OP was making a left turn with a GREEN ARROW. This means the other driver WAS making a RIGHT TURN ON RED...

[Topspinmo]

It's good that they specify the right turner is supposed to stay in the right lane. Now if they would only correct it so the left turner has to stay in the left lane all would be hunky dory.


right turners on red HAVE to yield, that means don’t pull out in front of traffic. Why is it so hard people don’t know what yield means.

[JMintzer]

Nope.
The car turning right had a red light since the OP (turning left) had a green arrow.

Really, this isn't complicated.

Unfortunately, more than a few posters are making this complicated. They wand to be "right" rather than be correct...

[JMintzer]

The statue starts with right turns and what is legal. That was left out.

If my understanding is correct, the other car was in front of you as you were turning left. If that is the case and he was making a right turn on red into the right lane, then that lane was no longer available for you to "lawfully enter" since he was entitled to use that lane to complete his turn. You could have slowed down and entered behind him safely. Any other interpretation would cause the driver legally entitled to the right lane to wait for all left turning drivers before he turns.... that defeats the reason for permitting right turns on red on to a roadway with two or more lanes.

You were turning into a lane he was already legally occupying. That lane was no longer legally available to you due to his right turn on red starting before your left turn.


316.151 Required position and method of turning at intersections.—
(1)(a) Right turn.—The driver of a vehicle intending to turn right at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must:
1. Make both the approach for a right turn and a right turn as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway.
2. When overtaking and passing a bicycle proceeding in the same direction, give an appropriate signal as provided for in s. 316.156 and make the right turn only if the bicycle is at least 20 feet from the intersection, and is of such a distance that the driver of a vehicle may safely turn.
(b) Left turn.—
1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

Your understanding is wrong.

[JMintzer]

I believe that when making a Left your are to stay in the far Left lane on the road that you are entering. Many people end up in the right lane and yes there could be an accident with people making a Right onto the same street. That said the people making a Right should always yield to those making a Left… ok got that?

Read the entire thread. It explains why you are incorrect...

[JMintzer]

You are right again. And you're backed-up by Statute (like the driver's handbook clearly states).

But I now see it's hopeless trying to convince some people, even with written evidence. Even former law enforcement is mistaken, think about that.

Bizarre, innit?

[JMintzer]

It's good that they specify the right turner is supposed to stay in the right lane. Now if they would only correct it so the left turner has to stay in the left lane all would be hunky dory.

No, the car making the "right in red" still has to yield to the legal left turn on a green arrow...

[mtdjed]

If your left turn lane had a GREEN left turn light, then you had the right of way.

But if you didn't have a left turn light, OR if your left turn light was not green, then you did NOT have the right of way.

All those other laws posted in this thread only apply to lefts and rights where there is no traffic signal to specify that a person turning left may now go. When there's a traffic signal indicating a left turn, then that left turn has the right of way.

Whomever has the right of way does not mitigate the requirement to use judgement and care. Also, timing could affect the result. The car turning right does not have a view of the arrow for the car turning left. Mr. Right Turn, stops, sees no impediment, and executes his start of right turn. Mr. Left Turn's light changes and he starts his turn simultaneously. Mr Left Turn now has the best visibility and should yield to the car ahead.

Timing and speed affect the outcome. Fortunately, no harm was done. If an accident did occur, both parties would have their story, but I would think the judgement would more likely put the blame on the car that was behind or made a sudden change into the lane closest to the gas station entrance.
If I was Mr. Left Turn, in this situation, I would have chosen to avoid the quick double lane switch to get into the Gas station. Right or wrong is not worth the trouble to get it resolved and get the vehicle repaired. Remember the advice, Drive Defensively.

[CODYCAT]

The most obnoxious driver has the right of way.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Whomever has the right of way does not mitigate the requirement to use judgement and care. Also, timing could affect the result. The car turning right does not have a view of the arrow for the car turning left. Mr. Right Turn, stops, sees no impediment, and executes his start of right turn. Mr. Left Turn's light changes and he starts his turn simultaneously. Mr Left Turn now has the best visibility and should yield to the car ahead.

Timing and speed affect the outcome. Fortunately, no harm was done. If an accident did occur, both parties would have their story, but I would think the judgement would more likely put the blame on the car that was behind or made a sudden change into the lane closest to the gas station entrance.
If I was Mr. Left Turn, in this situation, I would have chosen to avoid the quick double lane switch to get into the Gas station. Right or wrong is not worth the trouble to get it resolved and get the vehicle repaired. Remember the advice, Drive Defensively.

The OP was going to the gas station. He was in the correct lane to turn into the drive where the gas station driveway was located. He had the green arrow. The other car had a red light. The OP did everything correctly. The guy at the red light was wrong. This isn't even a Florida thing. It's a thing pretty much everywhere. Green light = go. Red light = stop.

[fdpaq0580]

It's good that they specify the right turner is supposed to stay in the right lane. Now if they would only correct it so the left turner has to stay in the left lane all would be hunky dory.

Sounds reasonable, BUT, this is Florida and things in Florida are not always the way some think they should be. Goes for some of the folks here as well. Take your time. Be patient. Stay safe.

[fdpaq0580]

The most obnoxious driver has the right of way.

You scare me! 😮😯😲😖

[retiredguy123]

The original post is flawed. It does not clarify if the OP had a green light or a green arrow. This fact makes all the difference in who had the right-of-way.

[Bilyclub]

The original post is flawed. It does not clarify if the OP had a green light or a green arrow. This fact makes all the difference in who had the right-of-way.

The OP stated he had the green arrow a few posts down for the original.

[Bill14564]

The OP stated he had the green arrow a few posts down for the original.

Yes, and the conversation changed at that point. As stated, the original post was flawed.

[Topspinmo]

With a left turn signal, you had the right of way, but you were supposed to turn into the lane closest to you, not the outside lane.

The car turning right at a red light could legally turn, but only into the closest lane and only after yielding the right of way to oncoming traffic or people turning left with a turn signal.

Assuming you used your blinker to signal your lane shift to the right and your left turn, you had the rig(t of way.

The other driver was not using adequate caution to allow for such an event. Had there been an accident, though, a cop might have ticketed both of you. You were both careless. Second option might be ticketing the other driver.

It’s very common though illegal for someone turning left on a signal to turn into the outside land rather than the inside lane. It is also common for someone turning right at a light to do the same. I try to make sure I turn into the correct lane, but I also try to watch for someone turning right from the light, even though I have the right of way. Better to slow or yield than get into an accident.

If only single one lane turning left on green arrow they can go to any lane they want the right turner HAS to yield to traffic period. Now if there are two turning lanes then yes driver has to say in their lanes till safely to change lanes. Under NO circumstances can right turner on red blunder out into on coming traffic turning.

[JMintzer]

Whomever has the right of way does not mitigate the requirement to use judgement and care. Also, timing could affect the result. The car turning right does not have a view of the arrow for the car turning left. Mr. Right Turn, stops, sees no impediment, and executes his start of right turn. Mr. Left Turn's light changes and he starts his turn simultaneously. Mr Left Turn now has the best visibility and should yield to the car ahead.

Timing and speed affect the outcome. Fortunately, no harm was done. If an accident did occur, both parties would have their story, but I would think the judgement would more likely put the blame on the car that was behind or made a sudden change into the lane closest to the gas station entrance.
If I was Mr. Left Turn, in this situation, I would have chosen to avoid the quick double lane switch to get into the Gas station. Right or wrong is not worth the trouble to get it resolved and get the vehicle repaired. Remember the advice, Drive Defensively.

Making up "what ifs" is pointless...

Reality is what matters. The left turn vehicle had a green arrow. The right turn vehicle had a red light. The fact that he /she could not see the left turn arrow is irrelevant. If that driver turns right and is involved in an accident, he/she is at fault. PERIOD. Case closed.

[JMintzer]

The original post is flawed. It does not clarify if the OP had a green light or a green arrow. This fact makes all the difference in who had the right-of-way.

Post #10 clarified the confusion.

That is why it is important to read (at least some of) the thread BEFORE responding...

[JMintzer]

Yes, and the conversation changed at that point. As stated, the original post was flawed.

Which, at this point, is irrelevant to the conversation at hand...

[JMintzer]

Making up "what ifs" is pointless...

Reality is what matters. The left turn vehicle had a green arrow. The right turn vehicle had a red light. The fact that he /she could not see the left turn arrow is irrelevant. If that driver turns right and is involved in an accident, he/she is at fault. PERIOD. Case closed.

Correct. Yet, there are STILL people trying to justify the person turning right on red....

[Bill14564]

Correct. Yet, there are STILL people trying to justify the person turning right on red....

??? You are now commenting on your own posts to agree with yourself?

(Would have been much more fun if you disagreed :laugh: )

[BrianL99]

If only single one lane turning left on green arrow they can go to any lane they want the right turner HAS to yield to traffic period. Now if there are two turning lanes then yes driver has to say in their lanes till safely to change lanes. Under NO circumstances can right turner on red blunder out into on coming traffic turning.

That's the 100% correct answer and it's been posted at least 20 times ... yet people continue to look for holes or argue the point.

As you correctly point out, a "turn on red" driver is at the mercy of everyone else on the road. The right-on-red turner has absolutely no rights whatsoever, other than to turn if he's not bothering anyone.

I wonder where people learned to drive? Bangladesh? Buenos Aires? There's some crazy driving in this world, but by the time one moves to The Villages, they should have it figured out by now.

[JMintzer]

??? You are now commenting on your own posts to agree with yourself?

(Would have been much more fun if you disagreed :laugh: )

I clicked on the wrong post to quote... I'm so ashamed...

But leave it to you to point it out... :rolleyes:

[Grinchie]

Topgun, show the law starting your point of view, please. I'm learning and if you know something they please share.

I will post this again.

Chapter 316 of the Florid Statute is vague and doesn't answer:

1. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left at an intersection onto a highway, public or private roadway, or driveway must approach the intersection in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle and must make the left turn so as to leave the intersection in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in such direction upon the roadway being entered.

BUT:
Florida DMV handbook clarifies it.

A left turn may be completed into any lane lawfully available or safe for the desired direction of travel. Diagrams addressing the different turning situations are in the Florida drivers handbook.
Right of Way
In most states where I’ve driven, whenever two cars can simultaneously utilize the road, the dominant car has a green light and the other has a yellow light to signify ‘go only when it’s safe’. I seem to run into situations pulling out of shopping centers where both oncoming traffic from across the street going straight in have a green light & I also have a green light to turn left. I just watch the opposing traffic & let them go. Many of us from elsewhere just accelerate when the light turns green; we need yellow lights for the one who only has permission when the route is clear & should be liable for damages. (Also turning in other places, both oncoming & left turns have green lights. I get honked at for not turning in quicky gaps; I’d rather wait for my real green light.

[djlnc]

Out of 131 posts, yours gets my vote for the most confusing.

[Topspinmo]

Post #10 clarified the confusion.

That is why it is important to read (at least some of) the thread BEFORE responding...

Some of us read when it wasn’t corrected then posted.

[Topspinmo]

Out of 131 posts, yours gets my vote for the most confusing.

I don’t understand what’s confusing about right turn on red, have to yield period.

[fdpaq0580]

I don’t understand what’s confusing about right turn on red, have to yield period.

Agree! But, you are dealing with folks who want things their own way, no matter what. Those people can be dangerous, so, always be careful. Good luck and drive safely.

[Danube]

Whomever has the right of way does not mitigate the requirement to use judgement and care. Also, timing could affect the result. The car turning right does not have a view of the arrow for the car turning left. Mr. Right Turn, stops, sees no impediment, and executes his start of right turn. Mr. Left Turn's light changes and he starts his turn simultaneously. Mr Left Turn now has the best visibility and should yield to the car ahead.

Timing and speed affect the outcome. Fortunately, no harm was done. If an accident did occur, both parties would have their story, but I would think the judgement would more likely put the blame on the car that was behind or made a sudden change into the lane closest to the gas station entrance.
If I was Mr. Left Turn, in this situation, I would have chosen to avoid the quick double lane switch to get into the Gas station. Right or wrong is not worth the trouble to get it resolved and get the vehicle repaired. Remember the advice, Drive Defensively.

The cope is strong!

Give it up.

[Danube]

The original post is flawed. It does not clarify if the OP had a green light or a green arrow. This fact makes all the difference in who had the right-of-way.

The cope is strong!

He cleared that up. He had a green arrow.

Give it up.

[Danube]

Making up "what ifs" is pointless...

Reality is what matters. The left turn vehicle had a green arrow. The right turn vehicle had a red light. The fact that he /she could not see the left turn arrow is irrelevant. If that driver turns right and is involved in an accident, he/she is at fault. PERIOD. Case closed.

Hard hitting facts. Some people hate that, prefering feelings, wishes, woulda-coulda...

[JMintzer]

Some of us read when it wasn’t corrected then posted.

Your reply was made well after the initial post was clarified...

[Topspinmo]

[QUOTE=JMintzer;2381015]Your reply was made well after the initial post was clarified...[/QUOTE

So you stocking me :popcorn: notice I said some of us didn’t say I was one of them.